Arrangement Mistake That KILLS Your Music
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- Опубліковано 8 гру 2022
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In high school, I made a song that repeated only the element of expectation, and the element of disappointment. You expect something interesting to happen, energy to come, and nothing happens... But nothing was repeating. People were so confused by it that they liked it :D
Sounds like the second studio album by Glitch Mob, haha.
i kinda wanna hear it
literally lmao
'the element of disappointment'
🤣
This video woke me up. I struggle with arrangement and will LITERALLY copy and paste my drops 😭 It made me realize how boring and predictable my tracks are. I’m going to take this advice and practice as hard as I can to change that and break out of my typical workflow. Thanks! Also, I agree with how lazy it is to copy and paste things without making any changes. It’s technically not thoroughly producing the track. I’m cheating myself and not improving by doing what I do!
That acoustic guitar example you played really helped me understand this. Thanks!
💯 This! In cinematic and stage music, I've heard several composers talk about the music and lyrics should tell a story-if it doesn't move the story forward, then cut it. Personally, editing is the hardest thing I had to learn...and usually I had to come back with fresh ears and time to emotionally distance myself from the fun of jamming. In Pop, it seems composers tend to go for a vibe instead progressing the story in each verse-but personally I think the best pop songs do more than create a vibe, they take you on a journey from point A to point B. When I think of Ed Sheeran or Adele, their songs don't simply repeat the same words and melody over an over again. Even their choruses which do repeat a hook build to an emotional resolution.
Very wise advice and solid examples of your thinking. You're very gifted and generous. All the best to you young spartan..
the string section in the bridge sound amazing !
A very, very, very useful piece of knowledge. Respect!
A song where this is done really well is 'erase me' by Lizzy McAlpine. It starts with an acoustic guitar and by the second chorus it's a total turnaround. But the transitions are so smooth and organic that if you don't pay attention to the changes, you never realise the journey the producer took you on.
Lizzy is a master at making sparse arrangements feel fresh with each repetition, particularly lyrically.
Her song Nothing/Sad N’ Stuff on her previous album does this SO WELL!
Absolutely the best video for music producers!
this is amazing advice. I hope just one future producer gets this!
Definitely on the money. Thanks. Will be focusing on this on my next song🙏🎶
I like it!! and thanks for the lesson
Great advice, I make the exact mistake. Thanks for the reminder.
I love your arrangement videos
THANK YOU SO MUCH 💛
The Kinks are a good example of what he’s talking about. The production values are really hit and miss, but their arrangements are so catchy and interesting. Listen to Lola, probably the best example.
Awesome 🎹
The only problem that this video doesn't talk about is that changes should be natural. Don't change, add or remove things every 4 bars just for the sake of it. The process should come naturally, you should feel when it's sounding boring or too simple and change it. Do not take it as rule that you have to do something new every 20-30 seconds
There are tons of great songs with simple arrangments.
I do talk about gluing things together and not throwing random things - but I couldve made that point more clear. Thanks!
@@NathanJamesLarsen I mean you did a great job but I believe because you're making this video mostly for beginner producers, giving them a little more insight would have been more helpful.
I do make make ton of changes throughout the arrangement but it comes naturally and I do (any experienced producer) know when I'm doing too much or when the song doesn't need it.
That's something that comes with experience and doing mistakes and learning from them
@@RaviRomana do you have an example of a song you're thinking about?
This is common problem for new music maker like me...Thank you....
I just signed up your course. I am newbie and I can’t wait where I can reach to.
Awesome! Stoked to have ya! Make sure to just let me know in the community if you need anything at all!
I think it can be hard for beginners to know what elements to change and what to keep the same. Depends on the style of music also, but overall the vocal melody and lyrics in pop/rock music stay the same in the chorus, except variations and add libs in the final chorus. (To give it an extra boost.) Generally, the vocal melody in verses tends to be the same, and it's important to be nitpicky and get the same amount of syllables in corresponding lines in each verse and stick to the chosen rhyme pattern etc. The changes you make in verses and choruses should be in the arrangements that surround the vocal melodies. You can a few change notes in the vocal melody of a second verses, but you have to be sparse, not making it a completely different melody compared to the first verse etc.
Agree - this is less about the actual songwriting and more about what is happening with the songwriting - arrangement. The example I gave in my own song is extreme - and I used an extreme example on purpose to show how far you can push it.
But yes - the rhythm or melody can be the same while still be unique with a great arrangement.
Can you make a video on about very different ways of harmonizing a track based specifically on a melody. Like using orchestral piece or struming or spliting harmony different directions in various instruments instead of using heavy chords that give no space for any more arrangement..,
God has gifted you brother. I really like how you arrange. God bless!
Amen
or he gifted his own-ass self w hard work, ese
Your explanations are really enlightening and I totally agree with your perspective. Speaking of repetitive music, have you ever considered the impact of a song like Daft Punk's "Get Lucky"? Despite topping the charts and winning numerous awards, the song is very repetitive, and this, in its time, has been a topic of discussion. I recently heard a band that has become one of my favorites, it's called: Cannons. This band is characterized by creating songs with simple melodies and rhythms, a few of their songs are quite repetitive, however, like me, there are many others who find them extremely enjoyable and somehow have found very good results following that structure. There are many examples of hits songs that are like that. I guess that some times people get good results by breaking the rules. IDK...
Good music that is repetitive usually still has lots of variations but they're subtle. Daft Punk's Get Lucky has one chord progression all the way through but it still has completely different vocal melodies for the verse and the chorus, a different outro melody, lots of tiny variations in the bassline, a vocoder vocal part that stands out from the other vocals, new drum layers that get introduced as the song goes on, etc. So it's actually very far from just looping the same four bars of audio for 4 minutes
Hello my friend I think you are a great producer hope you can make One More video About This little bit more indept
This is an excellent video. Thank you. I wonder what your views are about foreshadowing. It can be used with the ideas you discuss in ways that invite the listener to experience the music repeatedly?
Yeah I like foreshadowing - give a taste of something and then flesh it out over time. Big fan - can be a powerful tool to unveil more over time!
I got the opposite problem, I got such bad ADD that it doesnt sound concise.
Honestly, judging from soundcloud, I think most people have this same issue... when I'm asked to listen to or critique an artist I find my most common piece of advise is that they sound good, interesting, dynamic etc, BUT there material just isnt focused enough.. they are all over the place trying cover way too much in such a short span of time, and because of this, whatever emotional impact that can be taken from tgeir work is hugely diminished. When your art is difficult to consume I think it can turn a lot of people off. Dont get me wrong tho, there is def a time and place for songs that have that depth, but it has to be balanced and mitigated by something familiar and easy to absorb... wherher it be a catchy melody/hook or a gratifying cadence or relatable lyric. The difficult parts are the smoke and mirrors... the curveball that brings strike two... but at some point you gotta give them real story... your real style or message. If you can delay that gratification just right, in that moment the lightbulb will flicker and turn on and it will be an epiphanous moment for them where they will think "aha! THATS what this song is about". Emotionally, it can hit them like a brick wall and it will become an unforgettable moment. That moment then becomes "the song". This requires FOCUS, and intent. Most of which artists tend to forget about bc they just love the art of the groove or even the experience of writing, but I'm a firm believer that you should have a goal and reason for writing that doesnt just serve your own satisfaction. Take a stand or tell a story. Say something controversial in a relatable way. Its the artists that dont have the focus necessary to do this that bore me the most. Just my take.
Great information as always mate. I see on some of your previous videos, you have the “Komplete Kontrol s series 88” 49 Keybed is enough for me….I’m torn between the Arturia keylab 49mk2 or the Native instruments. Both great controllers, but which one?
Thanks! I'm a bit biased - I'm a huge NI fan but I have not used the Arturia keyboards so I just can't really give a good assessment of which you should go with... if you use a lot of NI Libraries like me then I think getting an NI keyboard makes sense because of Komplete Kontrol.
it dont matter... but Komplete Kontrol S series is probably better... but is you use arturia vst is better arturia etc..
great video as always. better thumbnails as well.
I used GarageBand but sometimes I used the different chords
I don't know how to make my songs Different You Are crackely size on the point
I like this
Pretty bridge
Can i ask how you made this on 5:44 ? is this like a hammer from pianos or? or is that some kind of a library? Because im looking for that kind of sound soo long! I've tried to replicate it using guitars long time a go and it didnt sound right, i mostly play piano so thats why im intrigued with it! so can you please help me with this one?
other than thati really love your content! been watching it since last year! keep it up!! :D
It's from the Hammers+Waves Libraries by SkyBox audio. Probably my all time favorite set of libraries right now. Insanely creative and wildly controllable/manipulable.
This is where you can find it: www.skyboxaudio.com/?ref=qSSIvOwBtR0XXt
That particular sound is from their Muted Relic library
@@NathanJamesLarsen thank you sooo much!!
Finally! Someone says it!
How can you run so many VSTis (or what ever file you're using plugin instruments) without your computer crashing?
Little late to respond but it mainly comes down to the CPU and the amount of RAM you have.
*me skipping at different timecodes in the video*
yep, sounds pretty much the same to me
❤🔥❤🔥
Nathan, while I enjoy your video and thankful for that, I want to know did you yourself produce any hits?
I think if you are starting from a place of "did you make hits" is realllllly missing that there are literally millions of producers who have never made a hit who have a great career - I am one of these.
I have specifically chosen NOT to work with record labels - which is realistically the only way you are gonna get hits made unless you get extremely lucky finding top tier unsigned talent.
I've worked with top tier talent (Forest Whitehead - 2x grammy nominated songwriter) and Andrea von Kampen (she's now a major artist in the folk world) but my interest is just not working with artists anymore - truth is - it takes a very special producer to specifically produce artists (it's not what it's made out to be).
My focus has been film, television, and my own music and I did produce artists for a while but pretty much entirely focus on my own music that is either for licensing, television (like commercials), or my own releases which I have started this year.
So if we want to talk about "how many people have heard my music" then I guess you could say - sure, I've made music that tens of millions of people have heard. But if you are asking "have you been on top 40" then no - and again that's because I literally don't care about that.
My encouragement to ANY producer is to find what you actually want to do - I thought I wanted to produce artists... so I worked at a studio and then started taking my own clients - and when the rubber meets the road - I didn't like it. That could be a whole video explaining that.
Don't chase "making hits" as your end game - focus on doing what actually makes you excited.
I love writing for commercials - it's extremely hard but I've got music on television and that is sick.
@@NathanJamesLarsen Nathan, thanks for a detailed answer. It is a good answer and I'd think it will be even more helpful for your channel to have your bio with the works you described to be included in the description. It doesn't have to be top 40 hits, but the TV, OST and commercials work you mentioned with the credentials sound really good too (no pun intended)! Indeed, I am paying for courses in chess, which are taught by gross meister and international master, both on YT; they don't have to be champions but their credentials are good enough. Similarly, the credentials of the work you've done in the content industry, also would add so much more weight to things you are talking about on YT videos.
Through composed gang rise up
Isn’t Scruffy but wildly interesting the definition of LoFi music? “Your Woman” by Whitetown comes to mind.
Agree and disagree… we don’t copy paste personally…. But…. Every hit pop song is copy paste… you can literally turn off 3 minutes of Miley Cyrus Flowers, turn it back on and be right where you left off. 😂
🎹🎸👍💪🏼🌞
Great video. You're taking on the incredibly difficult task of showing people the necessity of applying taste to their work. One thing to do is listen to all kinds of different music. Make that a task everyday to hear something you've never heard before and don't let some silly prejudice make you reject something. Listen to everything you can get your hands on.
Perzische wat ik doe meer op computer schrem laten zien
Have you actually released any music?
Hey Nathan, I like many of your videos and have already been able to take away valuable mindset tips. But here I have to disagree with you. Of course you have to bring in some variation, the chorus and the buildup as well as the breakdown should of course contain different sounds and patterns. But which big artist changes a chorus in a big way? Listen to "Miss You" by Oliver Tree. The second hook is just completely copied and that's how almost everyone does it. Even David Guetta does it that way. You can repeat the chorus 1:1. But you can add a hihat or white noise as an accompaniment in the second part to create minimal variety. But in your example in the video, everything gets completely out of joint. That has nothing to do with variation anymore. I just say, listen to all the hits in history. We don't do psytrance here lol.
Wat zegt
Bro think he NF
So many jump cuts within each sentence! I found it distracting. Good advice though.
Nathan is the best producer/mix tipper on you tube, i have used all his tips to mix my new album, and btw if it bombs its your fault nath 😉
It's edited very well for the flow of sentences but unfortunately that results in visual jump cuts. I tend to listen to him more than watch so it doesn't bother me. Not everyone can do flawless one takes like Tom Scott though so I think it's a necessary evil.