Bummer. I'm sure it's frustrating to deal with a board that has so much unrealized potential. However, I appreciate the fact that you are willing to do the testing to save the rest of us the headaches. Thank you.
i'm pretty sure this SBC ua-cam.com/video/lsfE83wIjko/v-deo.html VIM4 is the only one SBC that can play UA-cam in browser without frame drops (even, as it was shown on video, via XWayland), without HW decoding/rendering but still.
I saw an article on the Quartz64 A last week. It started with a headline about the board being in stock & available. Nothing was mentioned about the lack of mature software! Thanks, Chris, for saving me from spending $100+ & hours of frustration. Your SBC reviews are an oasis of useful information in the ocean of vapid commercial hype.
Thanks Marcus. One of the things I've learnt in the past few years is that many articles in the computing press are minor re-writes of press releases. Even some "reviews" repeat that the manufactuter says in their literature . . .
@@ExplainingComputers Very true! That's why thorough reviews like this have become a "must have" step in my pre-purchase research. I've been burned too often by enthusiastic writeups & UA-cam shills.
To say that this was a generous review is an understatement Chris. I'm not so sure the rest of us would be as kind over a year on from such a purchase and it is still not fully functional. Keep up the great work.
This had so much potential but has been IMO neglected by the programmers at Pine, to not have a fully working desktop over a year after launch is unheard of, maybe they should relaunch it as The Lemon Pi!
They intentionally release boards with immaturely supported (relatively new or obscure) chipsets, so as open-source enthusiasts can tinker with them and hopefully add mainline kernel supports to them in a relatively early time. Pine64 themselves don't really provide any software support to the devices (maybe a basic BSP boot image or two, and that's about it). While it is a bit doubious business model, they are welcomed by open-source communities because some boards are better than no board. So, you really should not buy random boards from them unless you are okay with that. Some old boards (based on Allwinner A64, RK3399, etc) are pretty well-supported, but new board, not necessarily.
@@countorlock3148 Me too! I originally intalled a Red Hat version that came on a magazine CD ROM although I had dual boot as Red Hat was used as a learning tool only, luckily I leared CLI on my Amiga in the late'80s and the transition from Amiga CLI to Linux was easier because of this, Im no expert far from it but I do try to do things from CLI, its so fast! and the OS is lightening fast, back in my Amiga days we used to call Windows Windoze as 3.1 was so so slow LOL
The appeal of the sata port had me excited, but what good is it if you can't use it (at least easily). Thank you for testing out this board, saves many of us the expense and headaches.
Looks like the Quartz64 Model A is a SBC with potential, but lacks software support even one year after release. Thanks for another high quality review.
I was thinking the same thing. Seems they released a whole lot of hardware features just for the sake of saying “We have this”. I know SBCs are for tinkering, but kinda useless to have hardware available that isn’t actually usable - like having 4 different video outputs on a device who’s own webpage says the software doesn’t support video output.
@Tony Yeah, this isn’t likely for the average user. I just find it odd that even a year later, the official software is still in “beta” (basically) and lacks video support on a device that has 4 dedicated video outputs. But I do agree that for someone who has the knowledge and time to spend developing for the hardware, this isn’t likely as big of an issue.
What good is an SBC without working software? Honestly at this point I'd struggle to justify any ARM SBC not called Raspberry Pi if the maker's idea of software support is 'let the community do it for us'. Thanks for showing us all these SBCs 🙂
This attitude is becoming endemic to manufacturers in China, eg. Creality the 3D printer company does this with their Marlin firmware although you do get a printer that can only just produce a print but forget about the bed probing working correctly or any Marlin features after 2017
Thanks for saving me the effort of writing exactly your comment. There appear to be very, very few, if any, SBCs with decent software support that aren't a Raspberry Pi.
I mean, on some level that's actually the point of Pine64, they work to get open hardware out there and support the community building on it. Stuff like this can be really good for folks working on Linux development, prototyping for custom development, etc. Not all these boards have the same target market.
No smooth DE = no software You are right in expecting a full experience after such a long time, but I think its excusable since its basically a community project. Buy the older module if you want a change, or a Raspberry pi if its that what yoy expect in the end of the day.
Authentic review. You put a lot of effort into making such videos. Pine64 has potential when used as a NAS or a personal GIT server by using GTEA or maybe it can also be utilised to host a personal website. But using it as a daily driver, that too, by hooking up so many wires will be a real challenge. It's not easy for someone like me. Pressed the Liked button as usual.
Thank you for the video, Christopher. You have been kind to the manufacturer of this SBC. Your production quality and presentation skills are top notch!
One thing about boards that have certain issues is having fun trying to tackle the issues and even writing program code that can bypass the issue at hand temporarily while the company sorts out the official launch of the kernal or program for full compatibility.
and again a very good, very interesting video with lots of authentic information. I have to be careful not to immediately order the new, great SBC, which I actually don't need at all. The same procedure as last time ...
A very interesting board, thanks for testing it out! That keyboard - I bet it's older than a lot of your viewers 🙂 (AKHTER are still in business I believe which is cool)
Veddy interesting, especially as I have a Pinephone that's more or less the same base unit. (I don't use it as a phone, but as a micro-portable, with the excellent Pine keyboard.) It runs Manjaro/KDE, and while programs are slow to load, once they get going performance is smooth enough. Will be pleased to see future developments for these Pine64 units.
You had the board for 1 year and the software is still in development, in the computing world 1 year is a life time and things move very fast. This board should never have been released.
@@ExplainingComputers Raspberry PI because of its excellent software support is first choice for mission critical applications where reliability and free of software bugs are very important. Who would buy Pine if after 1 year its hardware is still not supported?
Similar to other boards, a SBC like this shows a tremendous potential to be unlocked over time with software updates, something not recommended for more mainstream products. This is the reason why it has a spotlight on this channel. Thanks Mr C.B.!
Thanks Chris. Interesting SBC with lots of potential Off topic. I understand that the UK is having a heat wave. Hope it’s cooler in your new studio. Stay safe! See you next Sunday!
You know that somebody loves his keyboard and that it is durable when the originally white keycaps got yellow. I love it, Christopher. Nice keyboard for typing.
Another great video waited one week for this, I will be waiting patiently for the next one always enjoy EC video I look forward to each and every one. Glad Peter is teaching all new and exciting new things and taking his time. He is so kind to do so. I can't thank you enough.
I’m hoping to use this board as a server. The extra Ram and the SATA slot make it a good contender as long as the headless software performs properly with good stability.
Thank you for another interesting session & for testing this interesting looking SBC, before we wasted any money on it. I do hope this will improve in time & will be watching your channel for updates. Like you & others, I like the idea of this SBC, but it does look like we are a way off having a good working one! Keep up the good work Chris. Thx
The PCIe connection, despite what the physical connector might look like, is a PCIe 2.0x1, as is the only available PCIe provided by this chip. There's another chip from this family, the RK3568 that adds an additional 3.0x2 conection to the SoC.
Mainline kernel support is going well on the quartz64, and they do have the advantage of being an open hardware design as well (you can download the schematics for the board). Personally I use the pgwipeout kernel with Debian bookworm on mine and it's rock solid stable. The only thing that I can't get working at the moment is the mipi-dsi LCD panel but I'm sure eventually it will work. If you buy one be sure to get a woodpecker serial adapter for console at the same time.
Thanks for a review of this board. Sad that the Pine64 group can't get it together. To quote the late great coach Chris Schocor, "Potential is what you lose with."
First and foremost, just wanted to give again my thanks for your hard work as always. I don't really have access to these things, so I experience the world of sbc's vicariously through you as proxy and value it greatly. I think on the side it'd be rather fun to be an sbc collector - though I would not let any of them idle :) would put them to work Videos like this are gold to me, because we are basically rife with choice when it comes to sbc, so when it comes to pitfalls, information like this are important factors. I await a "next gen" sbc to pop up by one of these many companies, so many possibilities in design and hardware, I'm sure the "bestest sbc's" are still a ways to come.
I eyed this board, but ended up pre-ordering a Rock5 Model B. I'll need a m.2 breakout board to use a PCIe card, but the other hardware specs and AI processor in the Rock5 seem to be seriously upping the SBC game. It's exciting to imagine something using the NPU for a smart PiHole and enhanced ad-blocking, or building a firewall that uses the NPU for modifying rules on the fly.
@@rpavlik1 no, there is nobody working on this as far as I'm aware, and being involved in RK3588 mainlining myself, I'm pretty well aware. Besides, the RK3566 on the Quartz64 would use the same driver.
I think the one of the real reasons why Raspberry Pi is successful is that they not only ship the finished hardware, but also finished software to the end user. And now I can see why it took years to ship an full 64-bit OS to Pis: They really cared about the software, and wanted to ensure that it works flawlessly.
As someone that was born in 1981 and watched computers come out that were large and heavy and seeing SBCs in 2022. I wish I was rich, I'd buy every one of them just to have them. Tiny computers are the best!
I genuinely thought that Pine might have come up with, if not a serious challenger to the Raspberry Pi, but rather had carved a niche of its own with the connectivity options. It is such a shame that this hardware lacks the software support it so obviously needs. A very diplomatic summary there Chris, but thanks for your insights.
Not even a good doctor like yourself can save this patient . . . It has lots of showroom appeal, but let's face it, it's a flop in the cold light of day . . . Won't be rushing out and buying one of these!
As always, an excellent script for the video. Clearly not just "winging" it, or if you are it's impossible to tell the difference... Overall, the software is still in the bleeding edge alpha category which is good to know before spending any money with higher expectations.
Me too, I really liked the look of the original board so was excited to see this one. For me the interesting bit was gigabit LAN and PCIe with potential for a private router type arrangement. I was disappointed to hear you have had the board so long now Chris and bits like the SATA ports still are not supported in the recommended distro. Bonus marks for perseverance 😃
I love the SBC reviews... the bread and butter of this channel! This SBC looks like it could have had potential, but seems a bit half-baked. And SBC makers should have learned from the Raspberry Pi Foundation that top-notch software support is far more important to market share than fancy hardware.
I don't know why Pine released the board without the needed hardware support, in particular for key features like sata and PCIe, which are supposed to be features the rest of the SBCs lack.Thank you for your honest and clear review Professor, as usual.
At 6:39 Request going forward.... While going through the ribbon cable connectors I realized that it would have been better if you had used a pointer of some type. My original thought was something like a crayon like shape made out of plastic, (so it doesn't get wax on the parts and the plastic won't damage the delicate electronics). This may be something to look into for future videos. Will there be a"Mr. Pointer" in the future??
I So Look Forward To Your Videos Every Sunday & This Time I Tend To Agree With The Commenter Below With The Wild Font. This SBC Is Just Lacking. I'm A Fan Of M.2 & SODIMMS But No SATA & USB 3 At The Same Time!?! I'm Like You Though, I Like The Name But The Proof Is In The Pudding. Isn't That What You Guys Call Kidney Pie? Have A Good Week! 8-)
All of these sorts of boards are ALWAYS so tempting, especially with how hard it is to get Pis right now. And then you find out the state of the supporting software and I just say 'no'. It's not worth farting around with what might be great hardware if the software is a trash heap. Thanks very much for reviewing this board. Maybe in 5 years it'll be worth looking at.
Truly it is a fascinating SBC. I would be interested in a follow up video, once the software is "all" working properly. Definitely this SBC shows the possible future of SBC hardware. Looking forward to you next video!
Good luck with that. The PinePhone has been out over two years and still no stable OS for it. Also, their original Pine64 SBC, most of the distro developers for it dropped support for it quite fast,
The thing is Pine64 gave out 10s of thousands of dollars in donations to about five different Linux OS projects who are making a mobile OS for the PinePhone, and still no stable OS for PinePhone? What did they do with all that money? I hear ya. I am very hesitant to buy anything more from them until something gets done. I have delayed buying their PinePhonePro ($400 is a bit much for the specs), and their SOEdge because both of them are lacking in software support. They released the SOEdge, and no a peep from them about it since it was released some time ago.
I think you should look at the Rock5 model B with the RK3588 processor. It is much faster than the quartz series and is up to 16Gb. It also has an M.2 slot for storage and will support 2 8k displays. According to the company they will be providing Android 12 as well as Debian Linux for the board.
16:29 Do IT! And while you're at it, recompile the kernel, and write a program for more connectivity! Make a whole dev series on this board. Have you seen Jeff Gerling's series on trying to get a GPU running on a raspberry pi? While I don't have the technical skill to do so, I would find it utterly fascinating to see someone who does work on this SBC. Also, I would love to see any of the SBCs you own to get heavy modifications to the board itself, it seems to me there is a lot of experimentation going on in SBC land much like PCs in the early 80s.
I think it is a waste of time. Jeff is working on we'll known, community supporting board with good initial software support by manufacturer and extended by wide community. The same applies to GPU on ARM in general. On this board we have promising hardware with no support and a wish from manufacturer to write the software for them. I'm not sure this is the way to go.
It seems like when they ordered the board they had someone ordering decent number of those from them for some purpose (probably hardware controller) and the deal was so good they agreed to try to sell the rest as general purpose sbc, hence its weird design. Thanks for good review
An interesting SBC video on a Sunday afternoon @ E.C. It's a shame the software support isn't in place especially after having the board for a year. I've often wondered about the durability/longevity of SBC's with components soldered directly to the board, what's your thoughts on this? Looking forward to the next instalment :)
This is a nice board, but the lack of a second HDMI port means this could not replace my Raspberry Pi 4B as a desktop solution. That, and the lack of software development. It really looks like the stuttering seen is a lack of optimisation of the hardware. I am sure this will be wonderful for a lot of people, mind. Thanks for this video!
hi chris. ive bought some glasses so i can watch my computer screen comfortably. all you do is measure from nose to screen, and see a optician, they work
It sounds like the Pine64 people are missing the boat. With the Raspberry Pi in such short supply, the Pine64 people could pick up some market share if they got the software up and running.
After all this time, I have only just noticed the "custard pi" in the opening credits. An interesting excursion ensued to a very interesting "cooking channel".
Thanks for the interesting episode. For what its worth, please keep us appraised of the state of SBC's. I liked that you give a fair, neutral perspective, which seems pretty scarce on UA-cam. Part of that is leaving off cheap shots. That's the job of commenters.(ahem) So, I went to try to purchase this board, the link in your description is down. Also, I notice other sellers asking $80-100. I was hoping I could actually buy a SBC at suggested retail
Thanks for this. I've just tested the link from the description -- www.pine64.org/quartz64a/ -- and it worked for me, but inevitably when a video goes up it generates traffic! :) As I type this, the board still lists in stock at $59.99: pine64.com/product/quartz64-model-a-4gb-single-board-computer/
If they can get the software up to scratch, they could have a winner on their hands. With the availability and cost of Raspberry Pis right now, they could position themselves well.
I find the software support by Manjaro to be odd because at least on the pinebook pro is very nice when you make animations instant. I practically daily drove that arm device for in person classes
Oh man that (lack of) support sucks. It will be interesting to see what their as yet unnamed [1] RISC-V board with "same form factor, similar price and performance" will be like in a few months. They haven't announced it, but it's almost certainly using the StarFive JH7110 SoC, the "mass production" version (with twice the cores and with a PowerVR GPU) of the JH7100 which was supposed to be released in the BeagleV "Starlight" 10 months ago. The JH7100 has been available in the BeagleV beta board (300 boards distributed free in April 2021) and in the VisionFive v1 and is at this point quite well supported. Hopefully the JH7110 will be able to use all that work and be good out of the box. [1] they know the name, but are holding a competition to guess it
About £73 to the UK with cheapest shipping and VAT (excluding possible courier fee). Probably preferable to the Firefly ROC 3566. Prefer the Model B myself but having different models for differing uses is still useful.
Thanks for the review. It is clear the performance is still potential. It does make me wonder about the model B -> does the M2 work and at what performance level? I am still looking for the perfect home server SBC. The pcie slot is exciting with it’s potential for a broad range of high speed functionality, but my opinion is that connectivity will be a long hard fight to realize.
There are quite many similar SBC with similar naming made me confused ! and I like the model B more as I don't need so many I/O and expansion, but one better than the Pi in the same form factor. Onboard storage, wifi, BT, Lan, USB and 8G or more are all I wanted.
Is there an SBC that has an open BIOS? It'd be neat to have a completely open tablet that ran an open source OS. Although, it'd be interesting to see someone attach an e-ink display to this and make it into an e-reader, fully open or not. I like your method of using the sheet plastic and gluing it together to make an enclosure, much faster than 3D printing and it still looks good. As for fixing the software, maybe a collab between you and Jeff Geerling. He could recompile the kernel and fix some things.
I Am planning on getting this board as use as a home Git/Media server as software wise is is mature enough for use however on the hardware acceleration side not so much
Obviously, there's more work to be done on the board/OS combination, which will attract rhose who like that sort of thing. Assuming that they can get ir to a reasonable approximation of "working", where would the sterngths and weaknesses of the Quartz put it in the market?
I wonder if a 36 watt supply is enough to also power a PCIe card. Some cards draw more than others. It could affect the board's ability to stay stable or even boot
Even the Raspberry Pi still can have a lot of trouble with a "mainline" kernel, rather than their own patched one. And that's after years of integrating patches. I'm surprised you didn't even want to give the quartz64 kernel a try which seems to specifically state it solves most of your issues. It's pretty easy on arch-based systems. It's actually slightly surprising Pine64 don't ship with that one by default.
Bummer. I'm sure it's frustrating to deal with a board that has so much unrealized potential. However, I appreciate the fact that you are willing to do the testing to save the rest of us the headaches. Thank you.
This. Very much. I'm so glad he makes it so easy to figure out what SBCs are available and get a good handle on capabilities.
i'm pretty sure this SBC ua-cam.com/video/lsfE83wIjko/v-deo.html VIM4 is the only one SBC that can play UA-cam in browser without frame drops (even, as it was shown on video, via XWayland), without HW decoding/rendering but still.
Get Geoff Gearling to recompile the kernel.
I saw an article on the Quartz64 A last week. It started with a headline about the board being in stock & available. Nothing was mentioned about the lack of mature software!
Thanks, Chris, for saving me from spending $100+ & hours of frustration. Your SBC reviews are an oasis of useful information in the ocean of vapid commercial hype.
Thanks Marcus. One of the things I've learnt in the past few years is that many articles in the computing press are minor re-writes of press releases. Even some "reviews" repeat that the manufactuter says in their literature . . .
@@ExplainingComputers Very true! That's why thorough reviews like this have become a "must have" step in my pre-purchase research. I've been burned too often by enthusiastic writeups & UA-cam shills.
Makes me appreciate even more the work and support from the Rpi foundation.
As a couple of people mentioned on Channel Update July 2022, It is enjoyable to watch your videos on Sunday morning.
A new video? "... Let me go take A CLOSER LOOK"
This! 😂
:)
New? Old too! Let me goa closer look entire channel
To say that this was a generous review is an understatement Chris. I'm not so sure the rest of us would be as kind over a year on from such a purchase and it is still not fully functional. Keep up the great work.
This had so much potential but has been IMO neglected by the programmers at Pine, to not have a fully working desktop over a year after launch is unheard of, maybe they should relaunch it as The Lemon Pi!
That's the secret sauce of Raspberry Pi-- software and long-term support.
They intentionally release boards with immaturely supported (relatively new or obscure) chipsets, so as open-source enthusiasts can tinker with them and hopefully add mainline kernel supports to them in a relatively early time. Pine64 themselves don't really provide any software support to the devices (maybe a basic BSP boot image or two, and that's about it). While it is a bit doubious business model, they are welcomed by open-source communities because some boards are better than no board.
So, you really should not buy random boards from them unless you are okay with that. Some old boards (based on Allwinner A64, RK3399, etc) are pretty well-supported, but new board, not necessarily.
@Peter Kropotkin Gatekeepers are in every community. Use a computer however you want, that's kinda what Linux is about, right?
@@countorlock3148 Me too! I originally intalled a Red Hat version that came on a magazine CD ROM although I had dual boot as Red Hat was used as a learning tool only, luckily I leared CLI on my Amiga in the late'80s and the transition from Amiga CLI to Linux was easier because of this, Im no expert far from it but I do try to do things from CLI, its so fast! and the OS is lightening fast, back in my Amiga days we used to call Windows Windoze as 3.1 was so so slow LOL
@Peter Kropotkin I wouldnt call my self a scrub but im neither an expert, i can acheive what I set out to do.
The appeal of the sata port had me excited, but what good is it if you can't use it (at least easily). Thank you for testing out this board, saves many of us the expense and headaches.
Why can't there be sub $50 sbc with a Sata port that works? It would make some serious money.
@@setgeeks agreed, I think there are many of us that would like to use an SBC as a lan connected fileserver.
@@setgeeks It's called a thin client like fujitsu futro, HP Txxx or Dell WYSE
@@setgeeks They have been around for a long time: take a look at the "Banana Pi"
It's easy, simply write your own driver and do you own reverse engineering ; )
Looks like the Quartz64 Model A is a SBC with potential, but lacks software support even one year after release. Thanks for another high quality review.
I was thinking the same thing. Seems they released a whole lot of hardware features just for the sake of saying “We have this”. I know SBCs are for tinkering, but kinda useless to have hardware available that isn’t actually usable - like having 4 different video outputs on a device who’s own webpage says the software doesn’t support video output.
aggree like another pine64 board less software support
@Tony Yeah, this isn’t likely for the average user. I just find it odd that even a year later, the official software is still in “beta” (basically) and lacks video support on a device that has 4 dedicated video outputs. But I do agree that for someone who has the knowledge and time to spend developing for the hardware, this isn’t likely as big of an issue.
Thanks for giving it your best shot and showing the good, the bad, the ugly... The raw data
What good is an SBC without working software? Honestly at this point I'd struggle to justify any ARM SBC not called Raspberry Pi if the maker's idea of software support is 'let the community do it for us'.
Thanks for showing us all these SBCs 🙂
This attitude is becoming endemic to manufacturers in China, eg. Creality the 3D printer company does this with their Marlin firmware although you do get a printer that can only just produce a print but forget about the bed probing working correctly or any Marlin features after 2017
Thanks for saving me the effort of writing exactly your comment. There appear to be very, very few, if any, SBCs with decent software support that aren't a Raspberry Pi.
I mean, on some level that's actually the point of Pine64, they work to get open hardware out there and support the community building on it. Stuff like this can be really good for folks working on Linux development, prototyping for custom development, etc. Not all these boards have the same target market.
@@SeverityOne Very few? Are there any? Hell, I'd be happy with software that AT LEAST supports the features the board has!??!
No smooth DE = no software
You are right in expecting a full experience after such a long time, but I think its excusable since its basically a community project.
Buy the older module if you want a change, or a Raspberry pi if its that what yoy expect in the end of the day.
Authentic review. You put a lot of effort into making such videos. Pine64 has potential when used as a NAS or a personal GIT server by using GTEA or maybe it can also be utilised to host a personal website. But using it as a daily driver, that too, by hooking up so many wires will be a real challenge. It's not easy for someone like me. Pressed the Liked button as usual.
I am getting addicted to the knowledge I recieve from your videos keep it up
Thanks for watching. :)
@@ExplainingComputers EC will make sure you stay addicted!
Thank you for the video, Christopher. You have been kind to the manufacturer of this SBC. Your production quality and presentation skills are top notch!
One thing about boards that have certain issues is having fun trying to tackle the issues and even writing program code that can bypass the issue at hand temporarily while the company sorts out the official launch of the kernal or program for full compatibility.
and again a very good, very interesting video with lots of authentic information.
I have to be careful not to immediately order the new, great SBC, which I actually don't need at all.
The same procedure as last time ...
A very interesting board, thanks for testing it out!
That keyboard - I bet it's older than a lot of your viewers 🙂 (AKHTER are still in business I believe which is cool)
Veddy interesting, especially as I have a Pinephone that's more or less the same base unit. (I don't use it as a phone, but as a micro-portable, with the excellent Pine keyboard.) It runs Manjaro/KDE, and while programs are slow to load, once they get going performance is smooth enough. Will be pleased to see future developments for these Pine64 units.
You had the board for 1 year and the software is still in development, in the computing world 1 year is a life time and things move very fast. This board should never have been released.
Your point is well made.
@@ExplainingComputers Raspberry PI because of its excellent software support is first choice for mission critical applications where reliability and free of software bugs are very important. Who would buy Pine if after 1 year its hardware is still not supported?
Yes, I was very excited and now a little...
Thanks Chris, for showing us a status report on its development.
Similar to other boards, a SBC like this shows a tremendous potential to be unlocked over time with software updates, something not recommended for more mainstream products. This is the reason why it has a spotlight on this channel. Thanks Mr C.B.!
Thanks Chris. Interesting SBC with lots of potential
Off topic. I understand that the UK is having a heat wave. Hope it’s cooler in your new studio. Stay safe! See you next Sunday!
Greetings! We indeed about to have to very hot days (maybe 40C). The studio space was OK this afternoon. Maybe not tomorrow . . .
I like retro bits too, but I seriously like following SBC boards and development. Thanks Chris!
A year is more than enough time to get things ironed out. You were very generous.
You know that somebody loves his keyboard and that it is durable when the originally white keycaps got yellow. I love it, Christopher. Nice keyboard for typing.
starting my lazy sunday off with a great video from christopher. gonna be a good day!
Have a good day. :)
Another great video waited one week for this, I will be waiting patiently for the next one always enjoy EC video I look forward to each and every one. Glad Peter is teaching all new and exciting new things and taking his time. He is so kind to do so. I can't thank you enough.
Very esoteric. Thank you for sharing this. I hope that Pine finds money in their budgets, to continue software development to match the hardware.
Sweet SBC! I wish I could get my PinePhone to work as a reliable full-fledged SmartPhone. Thanks for being awesome! I'm sure it enjoyed the pep-talk.
I’m hoping to use this board as a server. The extra Ram and the SATA slot make it a good contender as long as the headless software performs properly with good stability.
Thank you for another interesting session & for testing this interesting looking SBC, before we wasted any money on it. I do hope this will improve in time & will be watching your channel for updates. Like you & others, I like the idea of this SBC, but it does look like we are a way off having a good working one! Keep up the good work Chris. Thx
Nice just what I needed for my Sunday a new video from you Christopher have a nice week
Greetings! :)
Been wondering about this board for quite a while. Thank you! And, at the risk of being pedantic, you spin 180 to get to the other end. 😉
So true! I got my angles wrong there. I'm so used to spinning 90.
@@ExplainingComputers I just assumed you were spinning it 90 deg twice...
@@largepimping :)
03:24 I like the "SanDish" eMMC 🙂
The PCIe connection, despite what the physical connector might look like, is a PCIe 2.0x1, as is the only available PCIe provided by this chip. There's another chip from this family, the RK3568 that adds an additional 3.0x2 conection to the SoC.
The PCIe generation is indeed 2.0. But the physical slot type is x4. :)
Mainline kernel support is going well on the quartz64, and they do have the advantage of being an open hardware design as well (you can download the schematics for the board). Personally I use the pgwipeout kernel with Debian bookworm on mine and it's rock solid stable. The only thing that I can't get working at the moment is the mipi-dsi LCD panel but I'm sure eventually it will work. If you buy one be sure to get a woodpecker serial adapter for console at the same time.
Thanks for a review of this board. Sad that the Pine64 group can't get it together. To quote the late great coach Chris Schocor, "Potential is what you lose with."
Nice quote.
First and foremost, just wanted to give again my thanks for your hard work as always. I don't really have access to these things, so I experience the world of sbc's vicariously through you as proxy and value it greatly.
I think on the side it'd be rather fun to be an sbc collector - though I would not let any of them idle :) would put them to work
Videos like this are gold to me, because we are basically rife with choice when it comes to sbc, so when it comes to pitfalls, information like this are important factors. I await a "next gen" sbc to pop up by one of these many companies, so many possibilities in design and hardware, I'm sure the "bestest sbc's" are still a ways to come.
I eyed this board, but ended up pre-ordering a Rock5 Model B. I'll need a m.2 breakout board to use a PCIe card, but the other hardware specs and AI processor in the Rock5 seem to be seriously upping the SBC game. It's exciting to imagine something using the NPU for a smart PiHole and enhanced ad-blocking, or building a firewall that uses the NPU for modifying rules on the fly.
The Rock 5B will I think be an excellent board.
have fun not getting any of the NPU to work, since that relies on BSP linux with a proprietay userspace stack that needs a very specific userland
I thought there was some progress on getting open drivers for the npu on rockchip...
@@rpavlik1 no, there is nobody working on this as far as I'm aware, and being involved in RK3588 mainlining myself, I'm pretty well aware. Besides, the RK3566 on the Quartz64 would use the same driver.
I think the one of the real reasons why Raspberry Pi is successful is that they not only ship the finished hardware, but also finished software to the end user. And now I can see why it took years to ship an full 64-bit OS to Pis: They really cared about the software, and wanted to ensure that it works flawlessly.
you nailed it
As someone that was born in 1981 and watched computers come out that were large and heavy and seeing SBCs in 2022. I wish I was rich, I'd buy every one of them just to have them. Tiny computers are the best!
Always loved these kinds of videos on a Sunday evening! Awesome video by the way.
Mr.Chris.
You rock as always.
ThanX for posting this!!!
Enjoy your day!!!
Thanks, you too!
I genuinely thought that Pine might have come up with, if not a serious challenger to the Raspberry Pi, but rather had carved a niche of its own with the connectivity options. It is such a shame that this hardware lacks the software support it so obviously needs.
A very diplomatic summary there Chris, but thanks for your insights.
Not even a good doctor like yourself can save this patient . . . It has lots of showroom appeal, but let's face it, it's a flop in the cold light of day . . . Won't be rushing out and buying one of these!
As always, an excellent script for the video. Clearly not just "winging" it, or if you are it's impossible to tell the difference... Overall, the software is still in the bleeding edge alpha category which is good to know before spending any money with higher expectations.
0:53 I Do Love The "Open Sesame" Written On The Box Right Stanley
He say Yes Chris.... Good Boy :)
Me too, I really liked the look of the original board so was excited to see this one. For me the interesting bit was gigabit LAN and PCIe with potential for a private router type arrangement. I was disappointed to hear you have had the board so long now Chris and bits like the SATA ports still are not supported in the recommended distro. Bonus marks for perseverance 😃
I love the SBC reviews... the bread and butter of this channel!
This SBC looks like it could have had potential, but seems a bit half-baked. And SBC makers should have learned from the Raspberry Pi Foundation that top-notch software support is far more important to market share than fancy hardware.
I don't know why Pine released the board without the needed hardware support, in particular for key features like sata and PCIe, which are supposed to be features the rest of the SBCs lack.Thank you for your honest and clear review Professor, as usual.
You mean software support? For the past couple of years they have been steadily releasing hardware without much of any software support.
@@knerduno5942 yes, the video shows a really poor performance at least in the desktop environment
@@alerey4363 Because nobody is working on video drivers. Heck seems to be no drivers for the SATA port. Really sad.
Thanks!
Greetings James! Hope all is well with you. Thanks for your support. :)
Thank you for another excellent SBC video and thanks for saving me the money for NOT buying another POS Pine board!
Well done video as usual, with a very interesting sbc.
Can you show the model B next? The documentation says there’s an m.2 slot but I don’t see where it is in the stock photos.
At 6:39
Request going forward....
While going through the ribbon cable connectors I realized that it would have been better if you had used a pointer of some type. My original thought was something like a crayon like shape made out of plastic, (so it doesn't get wax on the parts and the plastic won't damage the delicate electronics).
This may be something to look into for future videos.
Will there be a"Mr. Pointer" in the future??
Great video loved it. Thank you. Happy Sunday
Happy Sunday! :)
I So Look Forward To Your Videos Every Sunday & This Time I Tend To Agree With The Commenter Below With The Wild Font. This SBC Is Just Lacking. I'm A Fan Of M.2 & SODIMMS But No SATA & USB 3 At The Same Time!?! I'm Like You Though, I Like The Name But The Proof Is In The Pudding. Isn't That What You Guys Call Kidney Pie? Have A Good Week! 8-)
All of these sorts of boards are ALWAYS so tempting, especially with how hard it is to get Pis right now. And then you find out the state of the supporting software and I just say 'no'. It's not worth farting around with what might be great hardware if the software is a trash heap. Thanks very much for reviewing this board. Maybe in 5 years it'll be worth looking at.
Truly it is a fascinating SBC. I would be interested in a follow up video, once the software is "all" working properly. Definitely this SBC shows the possible future of SBC hardware. Looking forward to you next video!
Good luck with that. The PinePhone has been out over two years and still no stable OS for it. Also, their original Pine64 SBC, most of the distro developers for it dropped support for it quite fast,
@@knerduno5942 …and that is why I’m not abandoning my Raspberry Pi anytime soon. LOL.
The thing is Pine64 gave out 10s of thousands of dollars in donations to about five different Linux OS projects who are making a mobile OS for the PinePhone, and still no stable OS for PinePhone? What did they do with all that money? I hear ya. I am very hesitant to buy anything more from them until something gets done. I have delayed buying their PinePhonePro ($400 is a bit much for the specs), and their SOEdge because both of them are lacking in software support. They released the SOEdge, and no a peep from them about it since it was released some time ago.
@@knerduno5942 Yup, hardware without decent software support is like having water at the kitchen table without a glass.
@@knerduno5942 _ 10s of thousands of dollars_ sounds like a lot, but it is a drop on a hot plate
The other thought that crossed my mind besides not being supported by the OS is power issue.
Still interesting concept to include those in an SBC.
I'm not going to buy another sbc, I'm not going to buy another sbc. Ooooo a new explaining computer vid time to buy
:)
I'm fairly sure Chris could use his collection for decorative wall tiles.
Covering his entire wall.
:D
I think you should look at the Rock5 model B with the RK3588 processor. It is much faster than the quartz series and is up to 16Gb. It also has an M.2 slot for storage and will support 2 8k displays. According to the company they will be providing Android 12 as well as Debian Linux for the board.
That's a very new processor but it should be pretty powerful once the BSP/distributions are ready.
16:29 Do IT! And while you're at it, recompile the kernel, and write a program for more connectivity! Make a whole dev series on this board. Have you seen Jeff Gerling's series on trying to get a GPU running on a raspberry pi? While I don't have the technical skill to do so, I would find it utterly fascinating to see someone who does work on this SBC. Also, I would love to see any of the SBCs you own to get heavy modifications to the board itself, it seems to me there is a lot of experimentation going on in SBC land much like PCs in the early 80s.
I think it is a waste of time. Jeff is working on we'll known, community supporting board with good initial software support by manufacturer and extended by wide community. The same applies to GPU on ARM in general.
On this board we have promising hardware with no support and a wish from manufacturer to write the software for them. I'm not sure this is the way to go.
Have a good weekend Christopher. As Always, Be Smart and Stay Safe.
Thanks, you too!
@@ExplainingComputers Your Welcome, Christopher
It seems like when they ordered the board they had someone ordering decent number of those from them for some purpose (probably hardware controller) and the deal was so good they agreed to try to sell the rest as general purpose sbc, hence its weird design. Thanks for good review
Love the blue-tac SSD 'cradle' Christopher.
:)
An interesting SBC video on a Sunday afternoon @ E.C. It's a shame the software support isn't in place especially after having the board for a year. I've often wondered about the durability/longevity of SBC's with components soldered directly to the board, what's your thoughts on this? Looking forward to the next instalment :)
Thanks for the info. I've always liked learning things on your channel.
Gotta love SBCs. One of these days...
Don't be afraid to tweak the kernal. There's a conflict to squash!
:)
This is a nice board, but the lack of a second HDMI port means this could not replace my Raspberry Pi 4B as a desktop solution.
That, and the lack of software development. It really looks like the stuttering seen is a lack of optimisation of the hardware.
I am sure this will be wonderful for a lot of people, mind.
Thanks for this video!
Radxa Zero gives you much more for the same price level... Thanks for making this video. Greetings from Ottawa.
Nice video, thank you, Christopher.
hi chris. ive bought some glasses so i can watch my computer screen comfortably. all you do is measure from nose to screen, and see a optician, they work
Excellent! Glasses for computer/desk use do indeed make a lot of difference when you pass a certain age! I've worn them for about 10 years now.
It sounds like the Pine64 people are missing the boat. With the Raspberry Pi in such short supply, the Pine64 people could pick up some market share if they got the software up and running.
100% *AGREEMENT*
There are a slew of OS variants available for the PinePhone (mine runs Manjaro/KDE). I wonder if any of them would work on the Quartz64.
@@Reziac it would be interesting to see.
@@Reziac No. The PinePhone is based on the original Pine A64
@@knerduno5942 Thanks. I haven't kept track.
At 0:08
New graphics for the intro?? They look good!!
After all this time, I have only just noticed the "custard pi" in the opening credits. An interesting excursion ensued to a very interesting "cooking channel".
Thanks for the interesting episode. For what its worth, please keep us appraised of the state of SBC's. I liked that you give a fair, neutral perspective, which seems pretty scarce on UA-cam. Part of that is leaving off cheap shots. That's the job of commenters.(ahem) So, I went to try to purchase this board, the link in your description is down. Also, I notice other sellers asking $80-100. I was hoping I could actually buy a SBC at suggested retail
Thanks for this. I've just tested the link from the description -- www.pine64.org/quartz64a/ -- and it worked for me, but inevitably when a video goes up it generates traffic! :) As I type this, the board still lists in stock at $59.99: pine64.com/product/quartz64-model-a-4gb-single-board-computer/
Another interesting video. Thanks Prof Barnatt!!!
Glad to see Mr Scissors making his contribution! :)
The PCIe slot is a 2.0 x1, according to their sales page.
Thanks. So a x4 physical slot, PCIe 2.0 x1.
If they can get the software up to scratch, they could have a winner on their hands. With the availability and cost of Raspberry Pis right now, they could position themselves well.
Chris, I am in quarantine in Shanghai :/ Thanks for the video!
Sorry to hear that. I hope that the situation improves.
I find the software support by Manjaro to be odd because at least on the pinebook pro is very nice when you make animations instant. I practically daily drove that arm device for in person classes
Thanks for the video Chris. Your hard work is appreciated.
Thanks Brian. :)
Oh man that (lack of) support sucks. It will be interesting to see what their as yet unnamed [1] RISC-V board with "same form factor, similar price and performance" will be like in a few months. They haven't announced it, but it's almost certainly using the StarFive JH7110 SoC, the "mass production" version (with twice the cores and with a PowerVR GPU) of the JH7100 which was supposed to be released in the BeagleV "Starlight" 10 months ago. The JH7100 has been available in the BeagleV beta board (300 boards distributed free in April 2021) and in the VisionFive v1 and is at this point quite well supported. Hopefully the JH7110 will be able to use all that work and be good out of the box.
[1] they know the name, but are holding a competition to guess it
Agreed. I suspect that we will see a board from StarFive first.
Awesome, been looking forward to this one.
Greetings Paul.
@@ExplainingComputers good day Chris.
Nice, it support a e-ink display. Low power information board. Should be good a nas. Hope the software could be improve. Thanks for your hard work.
About £73 to the UK with cheapest shipping and VAT (excluding possible courier fee).
Probably preferable to the Firefly ROC 3566.
Prefer the Model B myself but having different models for differing uses is still useful.
At 5:50 can the sata power connector be used to power a 12VDC 0.40A case fan?
Thanks for the review. It is clear the performance is still potential. It does make me wonder about the model B -> does the M2 work and at what performance level? I am still looking for the perfect home server SBC.
The pcie slot is exciting with it’s potential for a broad range of high speed functionality, but my opinion is that connectivity will be a long hard fight to realize.
that keyboard needs a visit to the 8-bit guy for a retrobright :)
There are quite many similar SBC with similar naming made me confused ! and I like the model B more as I don't need so many I/O and expansion, but one better than the Pi in the same form factor. Onboard storage, wifi, BT, Lan, USB and 8G or more are all I wanted.
Nice review there Sir, Thank you.
No problem 👍
Not bad... not sure if I'd buy just yet... but definitely promising.
Is there an SBC that has an open BIOS? It'd be neat to have a completely open tablet that ran an open source OS. Although, it'd be interesting to see someone attach an e-ink display to this and make it into an e-reader, fully open or not. I like your method of using the sheet plastic and gluing it together to make an enclosure, much faster than 3D printing and it still looks good. As for fixing the software, maybe a collab between you and Jeff Geerling. He could recompile the kernel and fix some things.
I Am planning on getting this board as use as a home Git/Media server as software wise is is mature enough for use however on the hardware acceleration side not so much
Obviously, there's more work to be done on the board/OS combination, which will attract rhose who like that sort of thing. Assuming that they can get ir to a reasonable approximation of "working", where would the sterngths and weaknesses of the Quartz put it in the market?
I wonder if a 36 watt supply is enough to also power a PCIe card. Some cards draw more than others. It could affect the board's ability to stay stable or even boot
Sorry, missed this until today. :( Agreed, the PSU may be a constraint.
Glorious unboxing. Thank you.
Would have loved to install Ubuntu with the newer 5.18 kernel to see if that helped any.
Looks like a cool little SBC. 👍
Even the Raspberry Pi still can have a lot of trouble with a "mainline" kernel, rather than their own patched one. And that's after years of integrating patches. I'm surprised you didn't even want to give the quartz64 kernel a try which seems to specifically state it solves most of your issues. It's pretty easy on arch-based systems. It's actually slightly surprising Pine64 don't ship with that one by default.