Gloomhaven 2nd Edition Is Coming...What It Does & Do We Need It?
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- Опубліковано 3 лип 2024
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Cephlofar Announcement Video - • Gloomhaven Launch Part...
Gloomhaven 2.0 has officially been announced…some will love it and some will hate it. This video is to go over everything we know that has been announced by Cephlofair Games and some of our thoughts.
TimeStamps:
0:00:00 - Overview
Changes
0:05:16 - Flip Book or Tiles?
0:05:40 - Upgrade Kit?
0:06:04 - New Art
0:06:35 - Changes to Classes
0:07:37 - Adjusted Story
0:08:00 - Language Updates
0:08:19 - Rules Changes
0:09:07 - New Reputation Tracks
Discussion
0:10:31 - Is There A Need For Gloomhaven 2nd Edition?
0:17:35 - Do We Like The New Art?
0:19:51 - Thoughts On Class Changes
0:22:57 - Why Not Improve A Passion Project With More Resources?
0:28:16 - We Still Have Questions
0:29:58 - Wrapping Up
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I love how Alex is right into the mindset of "$150" and Meg is like *dumbfounded look* "I dunno, 40 bucks?". Mainly because that's what I charged for a painting I made in high school. It took me multiple class sessions to make it. Truly, artists are horrible at pricing their work, never let an artist or crafter price their own work unless they also happen to have a mind for business (rare) or a business-minded friend (less rare).
Lol yep :) I was shocked when she said 6 hours for that :)
Wow, i caught you early! Really excited for this, as i don't own the first, so can't wait. Got a feeling this isn't going to be cheap though.
12:45: Meg is mistaken on saying that GH2 will not be compatible with the previous products. GH2 will be MORE compatible with Frosthaven than GH1 because it will have similar card iconography, balance, events, storytelling, masteries, perks, miniature quality, etc. Part of Isaac's desire to make GH2 is that when they finished Frosthaven he wanted all their games moving forward to have a similar presentation, quality, etc.
Apologies! I should have caught that, I knew they were all compatible and I missed it.
Meg!! You were about to sell your work at $6.60 an hour?? 150 - 200 for 6 hours sounds more fair to me!
I know right!!!
I am new to the board game community and have been looking for a copy of Gloomhaven. When I saw the 2nd edition of this game announced I danced a little jig I was so happy. I am planning to get both Gloomhaven and Frosthaven as I've seen them on the top of many people's must play list. I can't wait!
I've seen a few of your reviews and have never seen Professor Meg. Your two have some great chemistry and bounce off each other very well. I would like to see more videos with you two discussing games and stuff. Thanks for the great content.
Start with jaws of the lion 1st. It's alot price friendlier. It's a game that very likely played thru once.
@johntan4997 I just got a sweet deal on it! It looks flippin sweet too. I like your corgi picture! Looks just like my dog!
Meg does not seem to have a good grasp on what these fancy crafts are worth... I'd think an Etsy shop would charge between 80-150 for a single potion
Yes thank you!
Agreed
This was gold!
Meg, you are solidly in my camp...I'm a 3.5 D&D player (having grown up with no edition) and Arkham Horror 2nd Ed.
20:00: Meg just so you know we did a playtester poll at the end of testing GH2 about which class is the strongest now and while they are much closer and more balanced than GH1 by a wide margin, Lightning Bolt got the most votes. :)
On June 4th, they posted this update regarding an upgrade pack:
Will there be an upgrade pack?
We are listening to the outpour of feedback about an upgrade pack and want to do right by this wonderful community. The first thing to make clear is that the overwhelming majority of the game has been reworked with new content and graphics. Only a small handful of components from the original box would even carry over to this new edition, so an “upgrade pack” would essentially be the full game. Internally, this is where the conversation stopped until yesterday - an upgrade pack simply doesn’t make sense. However, after listening to the community yesterday, it became clear that there may be enough interest in just the character boxes to support the printing of those as a separate upgrade product.
So in the end, we are happy to give the community what they want, and we will introduce a Mercenary Upgrade Pack to the upcoming BackerKit campaign.
This will be an add-on for backers, which will be able to be added to any pledge level, including the $1 level.
The Mercenary Upgrade Pack will include the following for all 18 characters:
Ability cards
Attack modifier cards
Character mats
Punchboard sheet(s)
Additionally, it will include one punchboard sheet with new condition tokens.
Ironically i think it's probably a mistake...but good on them :)
@@BoardGameCo you may very well be right, but pandering to the noisiest element has become a thing. ;)
I just want the classes remade to fit more in with frosthaven
I playtested GH2.0 and the classes have Frosthaven balance and similar perks, masteries, etc. It will be completely compatible!
There is going to be a map book as in Jaws of the Lion, for both Gloomhaven 2 and Frosthaven.
Yes! I saw this announcted.
That alone will make me wait.
I am looking forward to the minis.
I want to see them...but can't imagine I get them
I saw a few of the new minis on their official Twitter post, and they are so bad that I'm no longer interested in the campaign. It's rather disappointing
Heard 2e flipbook is coming. Frosthaven flipbook is there.
they did a flipbook for frosthaven :,)
Yes!
Do you have any news on when it will be released to stores?
Thank you Alex for mentioning the people who got Gloomhaven with their Frosthaven pledge. Your take or opinion is so much more valuable to me after knowing you have considered both sides of an argument.
I think another good point to make is that in other markets, say i-phone or video games, products get heavier discounts the longer they stay on the shelf or the product release schedule is somewhat predictable. In Gloomhaven's case, some people got blindsided and paid full price for something that will get updated within 3 months of getting the game.
Yep, 100% a reasonable segment of the population to be frustrated.
It won't be out until well into 2024 so it won't quite be that fast a turnaround.
@@peterkay3686Sure but honestly it's more about just knowing you paid full price for a sub par version.
@@vincentbrancato5146 I get the sentiment, but it's a "sub par version" that was the #1 highest game rated on Boardgamegeek for multiple years
I don't own gloomhaven but in my eyes frosthaven is the second edition, it feel a bir weird to "relelease a patch" that big for this tipe of game.
Awaken realms did a similar thing with tainted grail (wich i own) but for wat I understand is a smaller change respect to gloomhaven.
My prospective is more on the side of "if you are going to change that much why not going to prepare a new somethinhaven?
Ty for this video!
Yep, I totally get that while also understanding why they viewed it differently.
Summons definitely needed a rework. They were the most underwhelming things to use. I hope they don't change Craigheart much - he's my fav!
Completely agree!
Crag is probably the least changed character. Summons themselves are fine (they provide tons of value IF they stay alive, which is part of the puzzle) but now there are more tools to work with them, via cards, items, and perks.
Have you seen the spell weaver overview that they have published?
Not yet
@@BoardGameCo I can forward it to you. What is the email address?
@BoardGameCo did you get them?
29:14, bit of sound artifact or is it automatic censoring? :D
A mistaken bleep
26:14 "all dogs go to haven" why didn't this get a "nice" 😆
Eh. I'm in the camp of "I wanted to like Gloomhaven, but didn't," and I think it's because the characters we selected were not great compliments (Mindtheif and Tinkerer). Seeing Gloomhaven 2.0, with the redone characters, I wonder if it would actually change my mind about the game. However, I'm not sure if it's my bitterness toward my lackluster campaign that's coloring my impression of 2.0 (it probably is) or the fact that'll probably never play it again and that the box is taking an enmourmouse amount of space (also probably), but I'm not willing to re-up. I think I've convinced myself that it's just not for me and that they are other dungeon crawlers out there. I shouldn't be envious of people having fun; I just need to walk away (and figure what to do with this ginormous box that's recently and greatly depreciated in value).
I've always been a big fan of walking away from spending money on games. When you don't feel the need. There will always be games that you have a hard time walking away from.. May as well take the easy wins
New versions of games are not automatically better; in fact, I often prefer older editions before they get refined and lose some of their charm. There's an appealing idea that original releases are their own, original thing that most closely match the creators vision, where new editions are iterating on something in response to outside influences and in some way isn't what the original designer wanted to make. One doesn't invalidate the other, and iterating can be nice, but originals are also nice items to have and play.
Also 1st edition Arkham Horror is a fun time, and maaaybe my ideal way to play the game? The simplicity is nice vs. the excess added in 2nd and 3rd edition.
I played mindthief, the quatermaster and nightshroud and they all felt broken. New card layout and clearer art and improved summons I'd love to see. Getting the new version somewhere down the line with a new group since i've passed on my old copy sounds like an option now. Should feel new enough! Frosthaven doesnt speak to me, glad to have the option though!
Also anything that makes the game more accessible i welcome whole heartedly and thats what i think is escentialy the goal here
Wait, you like Gloomhaven, but not Frosthaven? How does that happen?
Flip book or digital? Off course if the new tiles are goood looking it might be more interesting but the flip book really makes the table version of the game better.
It does suck for people who own the original, which now greatly drops in value but also for people like me who had issues with the original that these might help with and I would want to play, I'd have to buy it from scratch. Oh well it is what it is.
Only got a copy of Gloomhaven after new year and started playing it. I hope the FOMO doesn’t catch me. lol
Good luck :)
I guess problem for me is. Why am I not better off getting frosthaven comparing to gloomhaven 2.0. Clearly frosthaven is like an advanced version of the game, if you like any of the previous stuff then I suppose you should just move on.
I currently only play jaws of the lion as that’s the streamlined solution but still I lean more directly towards frosthaven than this gloomhaven 2.0
Gloomhaven's events are chronologically between JotL and Frosthaven. Gloomhaven also has less complexity compared to Frosthaven.
There are two issues when pricing crafts. The first addresses whether it makes sense for the crafter, which goes to the price per hour. The second is whether it makes sense for the buyer, which goes to perceived value. Sometimes those two cannot be made to meet.
Would I spend six hours making something for $40? Oh heck no. My time, especially the time that I'm not selling to my employer, is worth far more than that. (I probably wouldn't be willing to spend 6 hours for $150 either, FWIW.)
Would I spend $150 for a potion bottle, even a handcrafted potion bottle that's nice? Almost certainly not. There are many other things that I'd rather spend that kind of money on (say the Gloomhaven miniatures pledge, however much that ends up costing.)
In that situation, either you have to find the small market of people willing to pay a very high price or you have to figure out a way to make the product more efficiently so that it makes sense for you. (Outsourcing the production to China seems a popular method. 8-) ) Or there's no way to make a sensible deal. Sometimes there's no way to make a sensible deal.
I totally agree :) Like a million times over :) I think here, when there's no actual seeking of a business model to sell these and it's a complete on video whim...I don't mind finding that niche audience. For a sustainable business you are a million times on the money.
I wouldn't say Gloomhaven and Frosthaven are truly compatible. The balance is off, and things like events and such are weird and you have to homebrew stuff no?
These new classes are balanced the same way FH was, so it will be much better after 2.0 release. As of now they are definitely not balanced.
What you are ignoring is if they will maintain compatibility with 1.0 moving forward, or will we be brickwalled eventually into upgrading... and if so, is that intentional? For instance, does this intentionally make Crimson Scales unusable moving forward?
This has nothing to do with CS. Isaac wants to update GH to make it on par with Frosthaven design wise and for all games to be similarly constructed moving forward.
Even if it is intentional or not, Crimson scales is not their game. It is also still compatible with 1.0 as intended. You will never be forced to upgrade if you own 1.0 and are happy with that rendition
Just give us another jaws of the lion
I assume they will at some point
Gloomhaven is excellent ! save for maybe 3 broken characters and an item. Why didn't they just make frosthaven more compatible with the gloomhaven that exists ??
☠️❤☠️❤
:)
Coming in 2025: Sparklehaven and AllDogsGoToHaven!
Not being critical! I want to watch your channel.
The guy talks so fast it’s hard to keep up.
I think I’m going to buy 2nd edition even though I never finished first edition!
Hope they keep making smaller games like Jaws of the Lion.
GH is amazing but FOR ME its just too big and expensive.
My perfect version would be a jaws size game but with expansions for classes and more scenario story atuff.
I only have 1 friend that is into big games and even so we want to be able to play a variety. Kinda sucks because we are having a blast with Jaws right now.
Why no flip book 😭😭
I know :(
Wanted to update here; I asked on backerkit if they planned on doing a map play book and they said there will be one, but not available during the campaign!
Labor + material + 33% = msrp, I'd expect with low supply, demand would be a bigger factor. Could always do a Delphine and sell bath water.
Are you talking about Gloomhaven or about the potions?
I'm worried they're going to balance all the fun out of the classes, like they did with Frosthaven. Everyone just felt...weak. With the exception of the Blinkblade and Coral, which were a *bit* above the curve. But only a bit.
This, Frosthaven is way too over tuned and it's not nearly as enjoyable as Gloomhaven. After seeing the cards they've released for the starting classes those have been over tuned just like Frosthaven.
I strongly disagree with this but from playtesting I would say the classes feel stronger and easier to maximize than Frosthaven, which no doubt has some tricky classes. It also doesn't help that FH scenarios are much more demanding and place a lot of pressure on the players in ways that GH1 just rarely did. GH2 scenarios are much closer to GH1 than FH.
I'm starting a new job next week (*Looks around and smiles).
Good luck!
This has very little to do with this video but I just wanted to express my absolute FRUSTRATION that Akrham Horror 3rd Edition is pretty much a totally different game and isn't a real 3rd edition at all!! And now folx can't get the 2nd edition which is so freaking different! Grrrrr sighhh ok rant over 😇
Also, Meg I would have been in the same boat with an "Errr. idk like 20 bucks?" lol
I think I'll be giving this a miss, no issue with 1.0
I think that's absolutely a fair stance.
I'm here for bear facts like Alex said but I am not seeing them...
Wait what bear facts?
@@BoardGameCo 1:40
I love gloomhaven. My only two issues are I don't want to go through the same story with tweaks. I'd love to have a new story with rebalanced classes and new rep. The next issue is that by default, my game loses value. If it was a new story, my game would still have value. If this blows it away, it's going to be a tough sell... I dont need two copies of the same game.
Overall, I'm happy. I'll just enjoy it less because it's not a new story, and my old game will sit right beside this one. And never be played.
"I'd love to have a new story" = Frosthaven.
Your copy will lose sell value. Did you buy it to sell it or to play it? The play value is the same as before.
And if you already played it you already got plenty of value out of it.
My unplayed, apart from mission 1, due to covid restraints, Gloomhaven 2nd ed is now totally de valued, maybe rethink to buy or not to buy e.g. keep value unless manufacturer produces a 2.0.
I do not need this. I also do not need the 40 lbs of minis (where the heck am I gonna store them?) or the RPG!
Acrylic standees? Maybe I'd bite on that.
I am sure the campaign will be a huge success though. Isaac's fan base is huge an loyal. I'm sure they'll love the game when it finally delivers in 2027...
There are people who do want it so good that it exists right? The bigger the board game space gets the better the games will become for us to have fun with
I dont want them I think they just add to existing fiddlyness but I'm happy it exists
The miniatures are a good deal for how many you get. I'm not really a fan of 2.0, feels like it's half preying on FOMO and half trying to fix something that isn't broke. As stated in the video, Gloomhaven is one of the most popular games in the community, why even attempt to 'fix' it? I'd have much preferred a new small box game, something a little bigger than JotL that has all these 'fixes' but still offers something brand new. Gloomhaven RPG seems silly, everyone and their dog is doing a TTRPG these days, there's no reason to hop on another one...
Plenty of evergreens get reprinted editions. 7 WOnders, twilight imperium and many more. I think great games deserve the occasional tweaking. As far as the RPG...popular franchises generally get RPG's
@@BoardGameCo Fair enough...
After playing Frosthaven and seeing the preview of Gloomhaven 2.0 I'm a hard pass.
The classes are really fun, and the game and classes are all less complex than FH. The scenarios are especially less complex.
In what sense?
A criticism from the community has been Frosthaven levels being too complicated, or too many of them having huge purple rules boxes and endlessly spawning enemies. There is less of that in GH2, and more levels that are three rooms, some monsters, and maybe a small twist on the rules.
If an upgrade pack is not possible still think he should offer the game at cost to original backers.
Looks like they will be offering something in the end.
You are totally able to go work for free if you want but you don’t have any right to demand other people do that.
@@Twineandribbon considering they would have no game without the backers… also no one demanded they create a 2nd Ed.
@@anddav40 you wouldn’t have a job if people didn’t need you to do that job. Doesn’t mean you should do it for free.
Not a fan of the new artwork. Looks like a cheap children's book illustration imo.
I liked it! I was a fan of both.
Wow Gloomhaven 2nd edition is not even compatible with frosthaven, which is not even available yet. This spoiled faster than milk under direct summer sunlight. What a joke.
So Gloomhaven, Frosthaven and crimson scales is the full set forever? After that no more content?
This is horrible for new players. Now we have this stupid discussion at the table, are we playing first or second edition? Who has what? Oh you bought second edition, tough luck, you have to learn first edition now.
I am very interested to know how many new players are unaware of the fact that the new game is not compatible with anything on the market, not even the digital game.
If this would come at least 3 years after the last first edition mainline product it would be fine. It is just horribly placed on the market and has only the incentive to FOMO old players and trick new players. It is quite literally a trap.
If I am overlooking something, please correct me. What am I missing?
Sorry for so much text, but why would you ever recommend second edition to a new player right now? Here in germany I can get Jaws of the lion for roughly 50euro - this is a great entry product and incompatible to second edition. Why would you recommend a likely 200+ priced second edition to a new player over this. Gloomhaven is so popular because it is so easy to enter this awesome universe. Other big rpg systems are much much more expensive and difficult or offer a worse experience. Second edition is incompatible with the mainline new player path.
Frosthaven has been delivered to all backers, and GH2 will be compatible with it from the standpoint of similar balance for classes and whatnot, so not sure what you mean?
@@peterkay3686 Frosthaven has not hit retail mass market yet - atleast not in germany. I would guess, that most copies of the game will be sold on the retail market. It was said in the video, that Frosthaven is compatible with first and not with second edition. First and second edition being incompatible means that second edition is isolated from any other gloomhaven product available.
@@joopiegoldberg5091 Frosthaven will be MORE compatible with GH2 than GH1 in terms of card iconography, balance, and design. It's one of the reasons why they're even doing a GH2.
They messed up their fans. They should had a new GH . Now they need to buy the old new game
People can decide if they want it or not based on the information they get about what's new, etc. It's really fun, BTW.