My ranking for every game in this video (Best to worst): 1. Sonic Adventure 2 2. Sonic Adventure 3. Sonic Generations 4. Sonic Colors 5. Sonic Unleashed 6. Sonic Heroes 7. Sonic Frontiers 8. Sonic Forces 9. Sonic Lost World 10. Sonic the Hedgehog (2006)
Idk why people say Sonic games are linear like it’s a bad thing. SA2 is actually less linar than SA1. Emerald Coast, Windy Valley, Ice Cap, etc are linear stages. Only open stages are Red Mountain and Beta Windy Valley. And people hate on the boost games for being linear and being “boost to win” and both of those arguments are not true. Unless you’re playing Forces of course.
Well, it depends on how the linearity is done. Is it like SATBK and SATSR where there is literally only one way to play the level and you're on rails most of the time? Or is it like SA2 where there are at least a few different ways to traverse the level without being too on rails?
Thanks for the upload, Spontman! After listening to your critique, here’s how I’d rank Sonic’s 3D titles: 1. Frontiers 2. Generations 3. Unleashed 4. Colors 5. Adventure 2 6. Adventure 7. Lost World 8. Heroes 9. Forces 10. ‘06
Come on just 14K this deserves way way WAY more bro.. but don't get mad or disappointed your work is good this one right here is a gem! do more like this.. subscribed🔥🙌 Well deserved man❤
I think we've been saying that for too many sonic games by this point. It's easy to have a tolerance for the game when you take away the fact that it's billionth 3D Sonic game that overhauled it's gameplay to a half step degree. Again
@miadatenshi9903 I mean it's open area is cool but got repetitive by the 2nd Zone and is still unpolished. Which Is the opposite of the adventure games. The game is lucky that Sonic's movekit carries the majority
Always remember when people criticize the presentation of SA1, it came out the same year as Metal Gear Solid 1. A game that, by the way, was ahead of its time in actually having a good English cast to the scope of cutscenes that it and SA1 were going for, but also had character models that looked like a cross of Lego and Robot Chicken. It is nowhere near a fair comparison to say Sonic Adventure looks or sounds bad if we’re giving other games from that period a pass. Megaman X4 with its infamous vocals was one year before it. Also I feel like about 90% of SA1’s cast sound pretty good in their roles anyway, but still.
They definitely had voice direction in Frontiers. Hence Sonic’s ugly deeper voice even Roger was confused by. So… really it works against your argument that it isn’t because of voice direction. lol
I'm assuming you're referring to when I said "and they decided to just... not give any voice direction at all?", which was a joke, but either way I think you missed my point. People were blaming the voice direction for Roger not sounding good as Sonic LONG before Frontiers was even revealed. My argument is that it was always a casting issue, not a direction issue. Frontiers just adds bad voice direction on top of that. Of course, my argument is based on the subjective matter of whether one thinks Roger was a good casting choice in the first place. In my case, I don't, but plenty of people do and that's fine.
@@spontman Oh. I can’t really tell that it’s a joke but I’ll take your word for it. Wait. I know your point is that it’s a casting issue. But is that the point you thought I missed? Or is there a different point? I was saying that I disagreed with the casting being the issue and using the Frontiers thing as an example of the voice direction being the issue. It’s a different situation than previous games, but it still goes to stand that so far the general voice direction is more of an issue than the casting considering nearly if not the entire cast sounds recognizable as who they’re voicing just by listening to them talk. Additionally, I’m saying it is a casting issue at the very least in a PERSONAL level. We all have different opinions. Maybe you, personally, just don’t like Roger as Sonic. And others agree. I don’t. Went through the same thing with the 4kids cast and at the end people ended up liking them. Now that they’re gone and especially now that years have past, people are demanding the previously infamous Jason Griffith to voice Shadow in the upcoming movie. Not whoever voices Shadow currently. Not the guy who actually voices the character in SA2 (the game the movie is most taking inspiration from) who has the most emotional range and unique voice and voices his debut and essentially created the English voice for Shadow that everyone else’s voice is ultimately based on. So yeah, there’s a little bit of personal preference in there, sure. But I think it’s a voice direction issue most of all. The casting seems fine.
Good video, man. Your perspective of Sonic Games is very interesting. I gotta say that Sonic Unleashed is my favorite game of all, and every aspect of the Day Stages you don't like are the best and most fun for me. What impresses me the most is the fact that, besides all I said before about you almost hating Day Stages, you DO like the Night Stages, something that is not heard very often because most of the criticisms of this game are based on the Werehog.
Insane that i watched all 4 hours of this lol. Great video and editing nonetheless, and great insight into the games' design and mechanics, as well as the research.
iirc, Ian Flynn didn't actually write the story of Frontiers. The story was done in house, then given to Ian to flesh out. This can best be seen when you compare the JP and EN scripts. Also, fun fact, Tails, Knuckles and Amy being playable was NEVER in the original plan documents for Frontiers. They decided to add them based on fan feedback. This also explains an inconsistency with the ending. Originally, the ending we got was the ending. Hence the "secret post-credits scene" giving them a way to bring Sage back. But after hearing the feedback, they wrote a new ending in which Sage doesn't need to sacrifice herself. This completely retcons the post-credits scene, making its existence irrelevant. I would assume the original ending was similar to SA2, Sage was meant to be a one off character like Shadow. They still left the door open on a potential return, but they weren't sure how fan feedback would be so didn't want to make anything concrete. But the fans loved her so much that they decided to make her a mainstay of the series.
Well actually Sonic Superstars lets you play the credits. 🤓☝️ Also Metal Sonic in Gens kets you hit him as many times as possible if you know when you can hit him. And Frontiers has the spindash which is very useful. Which also completes the gameplay scale.
my rankings for these games. 10. Sonic Forces 9. Sonic Lost World 8. Sonic 06 7 Sonic Fronteirs 6 Sonic Advenuture 2 5. Sonic Colors 4. Sonic Heroes 3. Sonic Adventure 2. Sonic Unleashed 1 Sonic Generations
I love the titans more than the guardians, so much that I was sad Sega never made a Titan Rush. Also, why you never said you thought of Roger’s new Sonic voice (Frontiers)?
I get this a lot when I use the word "sequel", so replace it with "followup" or "next entry" if you want. My point isn't to criticize it for not being Adventure 3, my point is to criticize it for not improving/evolving the core mechanical identity of the Sonic series.
@@spontmansa2 didn't "evolve" the core gameplay alot it actually trimmed down the speed gameplay and made more mech and hunting stages which never came back again, heroes was always going to be a one off they were never gonna go back to that gameplay style anyway and to say it didn't evolve the game play is just silly, it evolved the combat and platforming by alo the game gave you multiple ways to cross gaps and kill enemies, before every enemy died the same way, heroes actually makes you think and strategize how to defeat certain enemy types. heroes gave you the most versatile moveset by far of any sonic game when it released. you can not like the game but to say it didn't evolve from a sa2 is just incorrect
My ranking is: 1. Adventure 2 2. Heroes (this was my first ever Sonic game I got at just 5 years old and I replay it every now and then, just holds a special place in my heart) 3. Frontiers 4. Adventure 5. Generations 6. Colors 7. Forces 8. Unleashed 9. 06 10. Lost world
The Adventure games along with Frontiers are my favorites of the 3D Sonic games, I still have a Dreamcast console that works and both of those games, so I can play them. I agree that the second one is a great sequel that has some improvements, some flaws, and that both of them have an enjoyable song playing during the final boss battles. ( I think that "Live and learn" is the best one of those songs.) You can thank the rock band Crush 40 for that because they are the musical duo who wrote and performed both of them. True that how emotionally well written Shadow was in that sequel game was mostly why he became the second most popular character in the Sonic franchise. It's stupid that he got misunderstood and has been shown as an annoying edgeloard character for years instead of him continuing to have the kind of personality that he was shown with from SA2 to Sonic 06. It's pretty much a miracle that lately he seems to be shown with that better quality personality in Sonic Prime. I've only played some of the other games that are in this video, not all of them.
Given that all the footage you've apologized on looks great, I see no reason to say sorry to begin with. I get it that 4k and beyond is available these days, but I really feel like everything HD and above is insignificantly different. I see the difference. But for a youtube video, it's such a small difference that I really can't be bothered.
You're right, it's not a huge deal. I just like my footage to be consistent between videos and to match the aspect ratio, resolution, framerate, etc. of the video itself if possible.
@@spontman I mean yeah it’s great you have those standards for yourself. But if anyone else has an issue with you just doing your best? Pssh. Not worth the time. I should be thanking you for choosing to give me content to pass the time. Especially about a series I’m passionate about.
Adventure 2 is so overrated. Just like Adventure 1 its a mishmash of different playstyles and most of them are just not good and not fun to replay. It's pretty clear fans love the Sonic stages most so its baffling to me that they couldn't just replicate what they did back with Sonic 3 and Knuckles and just make all the characters play like Sonic but with minor differences.
I got to the sonic unleashed weresonic part....it's Ristar...but in 3d. How he grab's objects,pulls himself and swings from poles. Boy I'd love for a new Ristar title ;/
2:48:24 this section here is not actually for the laser wisp you just ran up the wall, do a left dash then the game plays itself an uses the spring to switch walls instead of making you engage with the mechanics. I’m not defending lost world, I’m just saying what seemed obvious to me
idk when you said "Can you imagine Roger's voice coming out of this guy (classic Sonic)?" When Sonic started talking, I thought it was the inserted clip and thought it did actually fit classic Sonic cuz it had an almost Jaleel White feel to it. Then I realized it was actually Modern Sonic talking only for you to insert the pizza hut voice clip over Classic Sonic (which sounds more like how Roger voiced Sonic in Frontiers). That said, it just shows how much more Sonic-y Roger sounded in Generations which is my favorite example of Roger voicing Sonic. It just fits so well. I know that completely disagrees with the point you were trying to make for both Classic and even Modern Sonic voiced by Roger Craig Smith but I see him as fitting just as well as any other guy. Now Roger's Frontiers Sonic voice... that does not fit at all and I don't know what's wrong with them or why they made Roger do something so ridiculous in the name of "seriousness". Deeper voice =/= more serious. lol
@@spontman I mean what the hell was that even? There’s literally a cutscene that played while my wife was playing her copy of the game, it was of Sonic and Knuckles. I happened to not be looking. At some point I thought Knuckles was talking til I heard Knuckles respond to the voice. lol People have joked about that before. But this time it was for real. When Knuckles responded I was so peeved about how similar they sounded. lol Imagine if Ryan Drummond had done his Knuckles voice for Sonic this whole time. lol
My ranking 1. Sonic unleashed 2. Sonic adventure 2 3. Sonic unwiished 4. Sonic generations 5. Sonic frontiers 6. Sonic colours 7. Sonic and the secret rings 8. Shadow the hedgehog 9. Sonic heroes 10. Sonic adventure 11. Sonic and the black knight 12. Sonic lost world 13. Sonic forces 14. Sonic 3d blast 15. Sonic 06 (Havent played lost world 3ds or dream team)
Any chance you'd be covering P-06 after the 'bosses + end of the world' release. I know fan games aren't part of the 3D retrospective but fr P-06 is borderline the peak of the franchise from a gameplay perspective
I played Sonic 06 on PS3 too and with all the problems it had, at least I got to the end without skipping cutscenes and whatnot. Sonic Colors Ultimate… I skipped most cutscenes and I had to force myself to finish the story mode, to justify the purchase.
Question, are you going to do a retrospect to Secert Rings and Black Knight? I wonder because I thought they'll be part of it as they're somewhat 3D Sonic games
I don't really agree Frontiers wasn't good. Yeah, you can ignore the progression oop, but nothing forces you to, either. I know you addressed that, but you addressed it in a way that honestly doesn't feel like you actually addressed it aside from what feels like deciding all the players will just be lazy. I think it's like Sonic Adventure and the very first Sonic game: It's going to be rough and experimental, not sure what works, but the next game is usually what sticks the landing and shows the formula works. Ian Flynn's probably the best writer Sonic's had in a long time. He's proven himself in the comics and some episodes of Boom and consulting on other Sonic media. He probably had to write some specific ways on a mandate from Sega, but on top of that: He has to undo a *lot* of damage from Pontac and Graff, especially to Tails. Trust me: If Sega brings him in again and gives him more freedom for story, we'll probably be able to see ambitious SA-style storylines... IF Sega doesn't tie him down. He does wonderful things with their mandate on the comic. As to what Sonic Team should do: Despite the flaws, I think this game does at least show Sonic in an open world works. I want to see another open world Sonic game with an ambitious story. I agree Sonic Team needs to put more effort into the variety and originality. I also think that aside from a minority: Pretty much everyone in the Sonic fandom has been dying for Sega to make at least the core cast playable again in their mainline titles. Nostalgia is not the only reason why people liked Sonic Mania and Superstars so much. This is probably what got a lot of people excited by the Final Horizons update: Playing someone other than Sonic or a Sonic clone in a mainline Sonic game is one thing, but playing Tails, Knuckles, and Amy again? The story seems to hint maybe Sega's swinging for some spinoff titles, which I hope is the case.
For a long time (at least here in the spanish-speaking Sonic community) it was common to see everyone praise Sonic Heroes, almost as much as SA2, and I did too even though I'd never played it. It wasn't until recently that I had the chance to finally try out the emulated PS2 PAL version of Heroes for PS3, and I ended up hating it with every fiber in my body. It could be that that port just happens to suck, so I'm still open to try it again and it winning me over. Nothing excuses that fucking pinball section though, I'm 100% sure that part sucks regardless of version.
My rankings: 1) frontiers - with huge impact of the game franchise, especially final horizon 2) generations - huge nostalgia and great level design even for classic sonic 3) sonic unleashed - even with the night time stages being so boring to me the pros outweighs the cons 4) sonic colours - 2D is ok to me, but the wisp to go to different pathways is amazing just for you to replay with levels 5) lost world - I think is good at max, level design is alright, my favourite sky road 1 6) forces - is very explanatory but my goes OverClocked is so good I haven’t play sonic hero, sonic 06 and both adventures games
Bro you sound like that voice actor of Bob's Burger/Archer. That coach dude from Home Movies. But younger. It's funny cuz another youtuber who talks about Sonic sounds kinda like Rob Paulsen but as picky nerd stereotype (never said that on his videos because it sounds insulting and isn't meant to be. lol) Just weird because JonTron sounds like the voice actor of Timon (from Timon and Puumba... Yeah I don't want to spend the time to look up the actors' names or how it's spelled if I can't remember. I'm sorry. lol) And ManlyBadassHero sounds like Itachi from Naruto..... voiced by Crispin Freeman. (Yeah I just remembered that one.) Okay fine. Harry Jon Benjamin is the guy you sounded like to me. Nathan Lane is the guy JonTron sounds like. lol I hope you can use that for a future gag or something idk. As for the video, I don't 100% agree with everything you said so far (I'm in your SA2 review at the time of writing this) but that's to be expected. But I find it's quite reasonable and it's a good listen while I'm working on an animation. :)
My ranking 1. Sonic Adventure 2. Sonic colors 3. Sonic generations 4. Sonic adventure 2 5. Sonic unleashed 6. Sonic frontiers 7. Sonic 06 8. Sonic heroes 9. Sonic lost world 10.Sonic forces
Who is drooling over the virtual pet mini game and ignoring the rest of the game? I’m aching for the chaos garden to return. I’m a big fan myself. But I never really played the game for the chao garden.
weird decision to exclude 3 mainline games shadow, secret rings and black knight are mainline sonic games this isn't up for debate, secret rings and black knight are 3d sonic game where you platform homing attack and collect rings they are sonic games, and shadow is a direct sequal to sa2 story wise
My ranking is from best to worst 1. Sonic Adventure 2. Sonic Unleashed 3. Sonic Adventure 2 4. Sonic Frontiers 5. Sonic Heroes 6. Sonic Generation’s 7. Sonic 06 8. Sonic Lost World 9. Sonic Colors Don’t know if I missed one not counting non Sonic focused games like shadow, colors is by far the worst Sonic game definitely one of the worst games I ever played actually, colors killed Sonic
@@Benjawin6671 colors was absolutely trash I thought that in 2010 and it’s gotten worse as the years go by. It was the game that completely destroyed Sonic’s character, since colors he’s just been a joke character with cringe worthy jokes meant for five year olds, I’m a classic and Dreamcast era fan Ryan Drummond and Jason Griffith were my Sonic’s! The game Sonic had the perfect character was unleashed, getting rid of Jason Griffith was Sega’s worst mistake for the Sonic series, Jason will always be Sonic to me, since colors no one takes the series seriously and it’s sad, unleashed was the last good 3D Sonic game and that was 2008, it’s 2024 currently
@@Benjawin6671 you want to hear about the game ok the story was just terrible it felt like you were watching a cartoon on Nick Jr. the gameplay sucked it calls itself a 3D Sonic game but it’s a 2D one, the controls were awful in both 2D and 3D both gameplay styles were stiff and awkward. Nothing against the voice actors but there all terrible for those roles no one fits for the characters except Mike pollock and maybe tails, the graphics were crap and before someone says “it was on Wii” I’ve seen way better Wii games, example Twilight Princess, Mario Galaxy, Sonic and the Black Knight even looked better. And let’s not forget the level designs were so terrible! Look it’s my opinion you don’t have to agree but to me colors is a stain on the Sonic franchise it’s the game that made Sonic look like a complete joke still to this day the series hasn’t recovered fully.
Mine would be close: 1. Sonic Adventure 2. Sonic Generations 3. Sonic Unleashed 4. Sonic Adventure 2 5. Sonic Heroes 6. Sonic Frontiers 7. Sonic Colors 8. Sonic Lost World 9. Sonic 06
Imagine being so much of a zoner that you claim Unleashed or any 3D banger cannot be a good game due to it ''not following the ''iconic'' 2D formula'' when both this and the other 3D bangers new and old (Or good or bad) proved how overated and overused that classic formula that you simp for and think that every game in the future should follow for some buffiling reason. Take a while guess why that happened. The 3D formula, espacially the boost (As much as your nostlagia doesn't let you believe it) is the perfect way to move Sonic forward and not adapting classic Sonic traits is a good thing as the only thing it would actually do is drag down the gameplay, the endless possibilities and potential the forumla holds that Classic Sonic isn't capable off. Classic fanboy much lol?
the 2d formula was done to death already s3&k took it far as it could go, we still had advance and rush any way so i never understood the lack of 2d games complaint
@@Mostillistit was more some classic fans being greedy fucks and wanted less of the “complicated” stuff but this isn’t 2009 anymore this is 2024 so honestly those fans need to get over themselves
... what are you yapping about??? Just say that you hate 2d sonic, lol. Anyways, sonic was eventually gonna transition to 3d, and that's ultimately a good thing. But that doesnt mean that the 2d sonic games are bad. Its just that not all of the 3d games are great, imo. Overall, the 3d games have more flaws than the 2d ones
But the overall problem with these new 3D titles is because of one word- rushing. SEGA's main census is to rush these games without any perfecting because that takes time.
Dude, there was a 5 Year Gap between Forces and Frontiers, they learnt to stop rushing after how terribly Forces was recieved. This isn't a issue anymore. And the last time it applied to a new game was Forces (They did rush remasters though in between), so you can't really call a game that came out in 2017 ir earlier new in 2024.
@@_-Lx-_No, Sega wanted to release that game in 2021 before it was ready. The only reason they didn't is because the team for Frontiers literally had to beg them not to. They've learned nothing.
@@spritvio639 If that's the case, they eventually listened to the team, They never did that prior, You think 06's dev team were happy with being sliced in half with a impossible deadline of crunch without complaint?
![ALL CANCELED SONIC PROJECTS ( Directors Cut ) [ full deep dive ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/FBhFSXx1MPE/mqdefault.jpg)
My ranking for every game in this video (Best to worst):
1. Sonic Adventure 2
2. Sonic Adventure
3. Sonic Generations
4. Sonic Colors
5. Sonic Unleashed
6. Sonic Heroes
7. Sonic Frontiers
8. Sonic Forces
9. Sonic Lost World
10. Sonic the Hedgehog (2006)
Very good, accurate ranking.
Good ranking.
1. Amazing video. 2. Good ranking. 3. Sure, I'm saying this late,but happy 2024 may it be an excellent year.
frontiers that low with forces is disappointing but, fair enough
Good ranking my least fav 3d mainline sonic game is forces but from a technical point 06 is worse
Idk why people say Sonic games are linear like it’s a bad thing. SA2 is actually less linar than SA1. Emerald Coast, Windy Valley, Ice Cap, etc are linear stages. Only open stages are Red Mountain and Beta Windy Valley. And people hate on the boost games for being linear and being “boost to win” and both of those arguments are not true. Unless you’re playing Forces of course.
Well, it depends on how the linearity is done.
Is it like SATBK and SATSR where there is literally only one way to play the level and you're on rails most of the time?
Or is it like SA2 where there are at least a few different ways to traverse the level without being too on rails?
As soon as I get my Dreamcast fixed, I'll be able to replay the Adventure games.
My discs are messed up but they surprisingly can still play them only SA2 doesn’t work work past the 4th level I’m mad at my 7 year old self for that
“If Sega had held off on taking Sonic in a new direction…”
*Goes from chuckling to quietly weeping.*
Thanks for the upload, Spontman! After listening to your critique, here’s how I’d rank Sonic’s 3D titles:
1. Frontiers
2. Generations
3. Unleashed
4. Colors
5. Adventure 2
6. Adventure
7. Lost World
8. Heroes
9. Forces
10. ‘06
Colors over the Adventure games is crazy work but Frontiers #1 is peak
Come on just 14K
this deserves way way WAY more bro..
but don't get mad or disappointed
your work is good
this one right here is a gem!
do more like this..
subscribed🔥🙌
Well deserved man❤
I agreed that frontiers has is flaws but l think that is a very solid entry for the franchise
To each their own. Sonic Is truly the Mc Donald’s of Sega.
I think we've been saying that for too many sonic games by this point. It's easy to have a tolerance for the game when you take away the fact that it's billionth 3D Sonic game that overhauled it's gameplay to a half step degree. Again
@@TheAnimatedGameryeah, it's definitely like a B or C rank for quality of the game. But I still think it's a decent game. Could be so much better tho
@@TheAnimatedGamer Colors didn't. Lost World didn't. Forces didn't
What are you on, Frontiers really isn't that far up from Adventure 2
@miadatenshi9903 I mean it's open area is cool but got repetitive by the 2nd Zone and is still unpolished. Which Is the opposite of the adventure games. The game is lucky that Sonic's movekit carries the majority
Always remember when people criticize the presentation of SA1, it came out the same year as Metal Gear Solid 1. A game that, by the way, was ahead of its time in actually having a good English cast to the scope of cutscenes that it and SA1 were going for, but also had character models that looked like a cross of Lego and Robot Chicken. It is nowhere near a fair comparison to say Sonic Adventure looks or sounds bad if we’re giving other games from that period a pass. Megaman X4 with its infamous vocals was one year before it. Also I feel like about 90% of SA1’s cast sound pretty good in their roles anyway, but still.
Love the KingK vibes I'm getting from this!
Keep at it my guy!
They definitely had voice direction in Frontiers. Hence Sonic’s ugly deeper voice even Roger was confused by.
So… really it works against your argument that it isn’t because of voice direction. lol
I'm assuming you're referring to when I said "and they decided to just... not give any voice direction at all?", which was a joke, but either way I think you missed my point.
People were blaming the voice direction for Roger not sounding good as Sonic LONG before Frontiers was even revealed. My argument is that it was always a casting issue, not a direction issue. Frontiers just adds bad voice direction on top of that. Of course, my argument is based on the subjective matter of whether one thinks Roger was a good casting choice in the first place. In my case, I don't, but plenty of people do and that's fine.
@@spontman Oh. I can’t really tell that it’s a joke but I’ll take your word for it.
Wait. I know your point is that it’s a casting issue. But is that the point you thought I missed? Or is there a different point? I was saying that I disagreed with the casting being the issue and using the Frontiers thing as an example of the voice direction being the issue. It’s a different situation than previous games, but it still goes to stand that so far the general voice direction is more of an issue than the casting considering nearly if not the entire cast sounds recognizable as who they’re voicing just by listening to them talk. Additionally, I’m saying it is a casting issue at the very least in a PERSONAL level. We all have different opinions. Maybe you, personally, just don’t like Roger as Sonic. And others agree. I don’t. Went through the same thing with the 4kids cast and at the end people ended up liking them. Now that they’re gone and especially now that years have past, people are demanding the previously infamous Jason Griffith to voice Shadow in the upcoming movie. Not whoever voices Shadow currently. Not the guy who actually voices the character in SA2 (the game the movie is most taking inspiration from) who has the most emotional range and unique voice and voices his debut and essentially created the English voice for Shadow that everyone else’s voice is ultimately based on. So yeah, there’s a little bit of personal preference in there, sure.
But I think it’s a voice direction issue most of all. The casting seems fine.
Great vid man, I can tell you put a lot of effort into it. Hope your channel continues to grow! 👍
Good video, man. Your perspective of Sonic Games is very interesting. I gotta say that Sonic Unleashed is my favorite game of all, and every aspect of the Day Stages you don't like are the best and most fun for me. What impresses me the most is the fact that, besides all I said before about you almost hating Day Stages, you DO like the Night Stages, something that is not heard very often because most of the criticisms of this game are based on the Werehog.
Insane that i watched all 4 hours of this lol. Great video and editing nonetheless, and great insight into the games' design and mechanics, as well as the research.
iirc, Ian Flynn didn't actually write the story of Frontiers. The story was done in house, then given to Ian to flesh out. This can best be seen when you compare the JP and EN scripts.
Also, fun fact, Tails, Knuckles and Amy being playable was NEVER in the original plan documents for Frontiers. They decided to add them based on fan feedback. This also explains an inconsistency with the ending.
Originally, the ending we got was the ending. Hence the "secret post-credits scene" giving them a way to bring Sage back.
But after hearing the feedback, they wrote a new ending in which Sage doesn't need to sacrifice herself. This completely retcons the post-credits scene, making its existence irrelevant. I would assume the original ending was similar to SA2, Sage was meant to be a one off character like Shadow. They still left the door open on a potential return, but they weren't sure how fan feedback would be so didn't want to make anything concrete. But the fans loved her so much that they decided to make her a mainstay of the series.
Well actually Sonic Superstars lets you play the credits. 🤓☝️
Also Metal Sonic in Gens kets you hit him as many times as possible if you know when you can hit him.
And Frontiers has the spindash which is very useful. Which also completes the gameplay scale.
my rankings for these games. 10. Sonic Forces 9. Sonic Lost World 8. Sonic 06 7 Sonic Fronteirs 6 Sonic Advenuture 2 5. Sonic Colors 4. Sonic Heroes
3. Sonic Adventure 2. Sonic Unleashed 1 Sonic Generations
I love the titans more than the guardians, so much that I was sad Sega never made a Titan Rush.
Also, why you never said you thought of Roger’s new Sonic voice (Frontiers)?
I think it’s unfair that you say sonic heroes is a bad sequel when if it was a sequel they would have just called it sonic adventure 3
I get this a lot when I use the word "sequel", so replace it with "followup" or "next entry" if you want. My point isn't to criticize it for not being Adventure 3, my point is to criticize it for not improving/evolving the core mechanical identity of the Sonic series.
@@spontman ok cool
@@spontmansa2 didn't "evolve" the core gameplay alot it actually trimmed down the speed gameplay and made more mech and hunting stages which never came back again, heroes was always going to be a one off they were never gonna go back to that gameplay style anyway and to say it didn't evolve the game play is just silly, it evolved the combat and platforming by alo the game gave you multiple ways to cross gaps and kill enemies, before every enemy died the same way, heroes actually makes you think and strategize how to defeat certain enemy types. heroes gave you the most versatile moveset by far of any sonic game when it released. you can not like the game but to say it didn't evolve from a sa2 is just incorrect
My Ranking
1.Sonic Adventure 2
2.Sonic Adventure
3.Sonic Frontiers
4.Sonic Unleashed
5.Sonic Heroes
6.Sonic Colors
7.Sonic Lost World
8.Sonic Forces
*Sonic* *the* *Hedgehog* *(2006)* *has* *left* *the* *chat*
Ngl, Sonic Colors is the best 3d Sonic game I’ve ever played, especially Ultimate.
How many have you played?! 3?!?!💀
@@malharezyoutube nah more than 3
I think that generations and colors are the best 3d sonic games
@@malharezyoutube I played 9 of them 🤔🤔🤔
My ranking is:
1. Adventure 2
2. Heroes (this was my first ever Sonic game I got at just 5 years old and I replay it every now and then, just holds a special place in my heart)
3. Frontiers
4. Adventure
5. Generations
6. Colors
7. Forces
8. Unleashed
9. 06
10. Lost world
Second time watching this. Again, great video. Hopefully youtube's algorithm pushes this out to more sonic fans.
The Adventure games along with Frontiers are my favorites of the 3D Sonic games, I still have a Dreamcast console that works and both of those games, so I can play them. I agree that the second one is a great sequel that has some improvements, some flaws, and that both of them have an enjoyable song playing during the final boss battles. ( I think that "Live and learn" is the best one of those songs.) You can thank the rock band Crush 40 for that because they are the musical duo who wrote and performed both of them. True that how emotionally well written Shadow was in that sequel game was mostly why he became the second most popular character in the Sonic franchise. It's stupid that he got misunderstood and has been shown as an annoying edgeloard character for years instead of him continuing to have the kind of personality that he was shown with from SA2 to Sonic 06. It's pretty much a miracle that lately he seems to be shown with that better quality personality in Sonic Prime.
I've only played some of the other games that are in this video, not all of them.
Given that all the footage you've apologized on looks great, I see no reason to say sorry to begin with. I get it that 4k and beyond is available these days, but I really feel like everything HD and above is insignificantly different. I see the difference. But for a youtube video, it's such a small difference that I really can't be bothered.
You're right, it's not a huge deal. I just like my footage to be consistent between videos and to match the aspect ratio, resolution, framerate, etc. of the video itself if possible.
@@spontman I mean yeah it’s great you have those standards for yourself. But if anyone else has an issue with you just doing your best? Pssh. Not worth the time.
I should be thanking you for choosing to give me content to pass the time. Especially about a series I’m passionate about.
Adventure 2 is so overrated. Just like Adventure 1 its a mishmash of different playstyles and most of them are just not good and not fun to replay. It's pretty clear fans love the Sonic stages most so its baffling to me that they couldn't just replicate what they did back with Sonic 3 and Knuckles and just make all the characters play like Sonic but with minor differences.
@@dancingvalkyrie based
I got to the sonic unleashed weresonic part....it's Ristar...but in 3d. How he grab's objects,pulls himself and swings from poles. Boy I'd love for a new Ristar title ;/
2:48:24 this section here is not actually for the laser wisp you just ran up the wall, do a left dash then the game plays itself an uses the spring to switch walls instead of making you engage with the mechanics. I’m not defending lost world, I’m just saying what seemed obvious to me
idk when you said "Can you imagine Roger's voice coming out of this guy (classic Sonic)?"
When Sonic started talking, I thought it was the inserted clip and thought it did actually fit classic Sonic cuz it had an almost Jaleel White feel to it. Then I realized it was actually Modern Sonic talking only for you to insert the pizza hut voice clip over Classic Sonic (which sounds more like how Roger voiced Sonic in Frontiers).
That said, it just shows how much more Sonic-y Roger sounded in Generations which is my favorite example of Roger voicing Sonic. It just fits so well. I know that completely disagrees with the point you were trying to make for both Classic and even Modern Sonic voiced by Roger Craig Smith but I see him as fitting just as well as any other guy. Now Roger's Frontiers Sonic voice... that does not fit at all and I don't know what's wrong with them or why they made Roger do something so ridiculous in the name of "seriousness". Deeper voice =/= more serious. lol
Glad we can at least agree on his voice in Frontiers haha
@@spontman I mean what the hell was that even? There’s literally a cutscene that played while my wife was playing her copy of the game, it was of Sonic and Knuckles. I happened to not be looking. At some point I thought Knuckles was talking til I heard Knuckles respond to the voice. lol
People have joked about that before. But this time it was for real. When Knuckles responded I was so peeved about how similar they sounded. lol Imagine if Ryan Drummond had done his Knuckles voice for Sonic this whole time. lol
My ranking
1. Sonic unleashed
2. Sonic adventure 2
3. Sonic unwiished
4. Sonic generations
5. Sonic frontiers
6. Sonic colours
7. Sonic and the secret rings
8. Shadow the hedgehog
9. Sonic heroes
10. Sonic adventure
11. Sonic and the black knight
12. Sonic lost world
13. Sonic forces
14. Sonic 3d blast
15. Sonic 06
(Havent played lost world 3ds or dream team)
Imagine enjoying secret rings over heroes let alone adventure 1
Any chance you'd be covering P-06 after the 'bosses + end of the world' release. I know fan games aren't part of the 3D retrospective but fr P-06 is borderline the peak of the franchise from a gameplay perspective
Yeah when it's considered finished I definitely want to cover it at some point
I played Sonic 06 on PS3 too and with all the problems it had, at least I got to the end without skipping cutscenes and whatnot. Sonic Colors Ultimate… I skipped most cutscenes and I had to force myself to finish the story mode, to justify the purchase.
Question, are you going to do a retrospect to Secert Rings and Black Knight? I wonder because I thought they'll be part of it as they're somewhat 3D Sonic games
Stay tuned
The question I was looking for
Sonic has a rough fanbase
I don't really agree Frontiers wasn't good. Yeah, you can ignore the progression oop, but nothing forces you to, either. I know you addressed that, but you addressed it in a way that honestly doesn't feel like you actually addressed it aside from what feels like deciding all the players will just be lazy.
I think it's like Sonic Adventure and the very first Sonic game: It's going to be rough and experimental, not sure what works, but the next game is usually what sticks the landing and shows the formula works.
Ian Flynn's probably the best writer Sonic's had in a long time. He's proven himself in the comics and some episodes of Boom and consulting on other Sonic media. He probably had to write some specific ways on a mandate from Sega, but on top of that: He has to undo a *lot* of damage from Pontac and Graff, especially to Tails. Trust me: If Sega brings him in again and gives him more freedom for story, we'll probably be able to see ambitious SA-style storylines... IF Sega doesn't tie him down. He does wonderful things with their mandate on the comic.
As to what Sonic Team should do:
Despite the flaws, I think this game does at least show Sonic in an open world works. I want to see another open world Sonic game with an ambitious story. I agree Sonic Team needs to put more effort into the variety and originality.
I also think that aside from a minority: Pretty much everyone in the Sonic fandom has been dying for Sega to make at least the core cast playable again in their mainline titles. Nostalgia is not the only reason why people liked Sonic Mania and Superstars so much.
This is probably what got a lot of people excited by the Final Horizons update: Playing someone other than Sonic or a Sonic clone in a mainline Sonic game is one thing, but playing Tails, Knuckles, and Amy again?
The story seems to hint maybe Sega's swinging for some spinoff titles, which I hope is the case.
👍
Just 👍
No words, simply 👍
Hating on the wave ocean ost is crazy I get the game is bad but the soundtrack bangs track for track quit hating.
I never said I hated it lmao
Tails use ProcCopter
Tails: Are you a f...
finish that sentence and I'll become a one time polcher🤬
Eggman: 😂No orbs😂
For a long time (at least here in the spanish-speaking Sonic community) it was common to see everyone praise Sonic Heroes, almost as much as SA2, and I did too even though I'd never played it. It wasn't until recently that I had the chance to finally try out the emulated PS2 PAL version of Heroes for PS3, and I ended up hating it with every fiber in my body. It could be that that port just happens to suck, so I'm still open to try it again and it winning me over. Nothing excuses that fucking pinball section though, I'm 100% sure that part sucks regardless of version.
My rankings:
1) frontiers - with huge impact of the game franchise, especially final horizon
2) generations - huge nostalgia and great level design even for classic sonic
3) sonic unleashed - even with the night time stages being so boring to me the pros outweighs the cons
4) sonic colours - 2D is ok to me, but the wisp to go to different pathways is amazing just for you to replay with levels
5) lost world - I think is good at max, level design is alright, my favourite sky road 1
6) forces - is very explanatory but my goes OverClocked is so good
I haven’t play sonic hero, sonic 06 and both adventures games
ur a very normal sonic fan thanks for doin that
1:09:50 now that's what I called A HOT TAKE 🔥
Bro you sound like that voice actor of Bob's Burger/Archer. That coach dude from Home Movies. But younger.
It's funny cuz another youtuber who talks about Sonic sounds kinda like Rob Paulsen but as picky nerd stereotype (never said that on his videos because it sounds insulting and isn't meant to be. lol)
Just weird because JonTron sounds like the voice actor of Timon (from Timon and Puumba... Yeah I don't want to spend the time to look up the actors' names or how it's spelled if I can't remember. I'm sorry. lol)
And ManlyBadassHero sounds like Itachi from Naruto..... voiced by Crispin Freeman. (Yeah I just remembered that one.)
Okay fine.
Harry Jon Benjamin is the guy you sounded like to me.
Nathan Lane is the guy JonTron sounds like.
lol I hope you can use that for a future gag or something idk.
As for the video, I don't 100% agree with everything you said so far (I'm in your SA2 review at the time of writing this) but that's to be expected. But I find it's quite reasonable and it's a good listen while I'm working on an animation. :)
Yo forces had a dope commercial, that's it you can continue scrolling now
hiiii, me again, what the FUCK WAS THAT SA2 AD
My ranking
1. Sonic Adventure
2. Sonic colors
3. Sonic generations
4. Sonic adventure 2
5. Sonic unleashed
6. Sonic frontiers
7. Sonic 06
8. Sonic heroes
9. Sonic lost world
10.Sonic forces
Wow… I need more time… save…. The resident evil comparison was cringe worthy
Nah it's pretty accurate
I have to disagree on adventure 2, it is not as good as adventure 1
Agree, it's definitely worse than sa1
True. It's better
That’s like saying Ocarina of Time is better then Majora’s Mask.
@@traviscunningham7062 it is :P
@@Hyp3rSonicno
3:28:51 😮
4:08:02 😮
Who is drooling over the virtual pet mini game and ignoring the rest of the game? I’m aching for the chaos garden to return. I’m a big fan myself. But I never really played the game for the chao garden.
weird decision to exclude 3 mainline games shadow, secret rings and black knight are mainline sonic games this isn't up for debate, secret rings and black knight are 3d sonic game where you platform homing attack and collect rings they are sonic games, and shadow is a direct sequal to sa2 story wise
My ranking is from best to worst
1. Sonic Adventure
2. Sonic Unleashed
3. Sonic Adventure 2
4. Sonic Frontiers
5. Sonic Heroes
6. Sonic Generation’s
7. Sonic 06
8. Sonic Lost World
9. Sonic Colors
Don’t know if I missed one not counting non Sonic focused games like shadow, colors is by far the worst Sonic game definitely one of the worst games I ever played actually, colors killed Sonic
But colors was actually good.
@@Benjawin6671 colors was absolutely trash I thought that in 2010 and it’s gotten worse as the years go by. It was the game that completely destroyed Sonic’s character, since colors he’s just been a joke character with cringe worthy jokes meant for five year olds, I’m a classic and Dreamcast era fan Ryan Drummond and Jason Griffith were my Sonic’s! The game Sonic had the perfect character was unleashed, getting rid of Jason Griffith was Sega’s worst mistake for the Sonic series, Jason will always be Sonic to me, since colors no one takes the series seriously and it’s sad, unleashed was the last good 3D Sonic game and that was 2008, it’s 2024 currently
@@Gamingwithahandicap none of these say anything about the actual game lmao.
@@Benjawin6671 you want to hear about the game ok the story was just terrible it felt like you were watching a cartoon on Nick Jr. the gameplay sucked it calls itself a 3D Sonic game but it’s a 2D one, the controls were awful in both 2D and 3D both gameplay styles were stiff and awkward. Nothing against the voice actors but there all terrible for those roles no one fits for the characters except Mike pollock and maybe tails, the graphics were crap and before someone says “it was on Wii” I’ve seen way better Wii games, example Twilight Princess, Mario Galaxy, Sonic and the Black Knight even looked better. And let’s not forget the level designs were so terrible! Look it’s my opinion you don’t have to agree but to me colors is a stain on the Sonic franchise it’s the game that made Sonic look like a complete joke still to this day the series hasn’t recovered fully.
Mine would be close:
1. Sonic Adventure
2. Sonic Generations
3. Sonic Unleashed
4. Sonic Adventure 2
5. Sonic Heroes
6. Sonic Frontiers
7. Sonic Colors
8. Sonic Lost World
9. Sonic 06
Imagine being so much of a zoner that you claim Unleashed or any 3D banger cannot be a good game due to it ''not following the ''iconic'' 2D formula'' when both this and the other 3D bangers new and old (Or good or bad) proved how overated and overused that classic formula that you simp for and think that every game in the future should follow for some buffiling reason. Take a while guess why that happened. The 3D formula, espacially the boost (As much as your nostlagia doesn't let you believe it) is the perfect way to move Sonic forward and not adapting classic Sonic traits is a good thing as the only thing it would actually do is drag down the gameplay, the endless possibilities and potential the forumla holds that Classic Sonic isn't capable off. Classic fanboy much lol?
the 2d formula was done to death already s3&k took it far as it could go, we still had advance and rush any way so i never understood the lack of 2d games complaint
@@Mostillistit was more some classic fans being greedy fucks and wanted less of the “complicated” stuff but this isn’t 2009 anymore this is 2024 so honestly those fans need to get over themselves
... what are you yapping about??? Just say that you hate 2d sonic, lol. Anyways, sonic was eventually gonna transition to 3d, and that's ultimately a good thing. But that doesnt mean that the 2d sonic games are bad. Its just that not all of the 3d games are great, imo. Overall, the 3d games have more flaws than the 2d ones
But the overall problem with these new 3D titles is because of one word- rushing.
SEGA's main census is to rush these games without any perfecting because that takes time.
Dude, there was a 5 Year Gap between Forces and Frontiers, they learnt to stop rushing after how terribly Forces was recieved.
This isn't a issue anymore.
And the last time it applied to a new game was Forces (They did rush remasters though in between), so you can't really call a game that came out in 2017 ir earlier new in 2024.
@@_-Lx-_No, Sega wanted to release that game in 2021 before it was ready. The only reason they didn't is because the team for Frontiers literally had to beg them not to. They've learned nothing.
@@spritvio639
If that's the case, they eventually listened to the team,
They never did that prior,
You think 06's dev team were happy with being sliced in half with a impossible deadline of crunch without complaint?
All you did for 4 hours is complain