@@peter2kx I don't think this would have helped the Lightfall campaign. Lightfall campaign was basically Infinity War but only Thanos involved parts. Season of Defiance was Infinity War, but only the Guardians of the Galaxy parts. This season feels very Thor's arc in the movie.
@@MrTytyjohn64 This view that Lightfall was/is poor being down to it's narrative, is not entirely accurate. Lightfall was the only campaign that didn't end with "answers"...... which for me is fine, as long as the remainder of the expansion (remaining seasons) fleshes it out enough with detail that it leads to the next expansion smoothly. Could Lightfall have included the Final Shape and led to a suitable conclusion after 4 seasons? Sure.... but there's a good chance that it would have felt rushed and that we'd have been complaining about that instead of this. They obviously saw that fact and I guess with the financial incentive, ran it out. We get more content, we get drip fed the closing arc..... which to be quite frank.... has been an addiction personally for me that has cured my Netflix problem. I think we only get to be mad if they butcher the end of Final Shape....... their ball to drop.
@@KCM25NJL that’s the worst thing bungie is doing to “fix” the narrative. Instead of us understanding why we should care about the veil, we’re forced to do it anyways, and only after failing we find out why we should care. Whether you consider it fixing the narrative or not. Not being able to unravel a mystery before the first half of a climax is really unsatisfying. It’s like if thanos had been collecting the stones, snapped his fingers and then it skips to him in a farm when we’re all wondering what he was doing. we just know he’s a bad guy who might do a bad thing. It makes it all the less impactful when we lose. Because we don’t know why we were even fighting in the first place. If it was to make the reveal more terrifying. Make it so we know that the veil is a key to access a different reality no one has seen before, make it vague that it’s something potentially horrifying that the witness could have access to. Then we could finally reveal that it’s the source of the darkness, boom. Infinitely more compelling. I would rather know vaguely that it might be something a threat if he wins. Because for all we knew, the veil was just a way for the witness to get high. Yes, the season will give us answers but we have to pay 1200 silver just to have a story reveal that will get vaulted when the final shape comes out :/
Ok, so let me see if I got this correctly, 1.) The Witness isn't some elder god from the beginning of the universe, it was once an entire race of aliens and is the first race to find the traveler and be uplifted by it. 2.) This race worshipped the traveler as a god; however, despite the traveler granting this race gifts of power and knowledge, they craved to understand their purpose in the universe, so they set out in their pyramid ships to find the answer. 3.) The race found The Veil, which is the Darkness’ version of the traveler, a “dark mirror,” as Xur put it. After studying the veil, the race learned that the traveler, and by extension, the light, is a form of chaos and change, which can provide life and cause death and destruction. 4.) The race saw this power or change as a curse that only leads to suffering, so they decided to use what they had learned by studying the veil to steal the traveler’s power, or its “pale heart,” to reshape the universe so there would be no life or death, no suffering or change, just complete nothingness. 5.) Obviously, the traveler fled from them. So in order to be powerful enough to pursue the traveler and defeat it, this race sacrificed themselves on mass and combined their essence into a singular being, The Witness. 6.) So the traveler keeps hopping from planet to planet, hoping to find a race that can defeat the witness once and for all Edit: Damn! well thanks for all the likes guys, I’ll see you stateside!
@dontmasktruth-92 It didn't, cutscene showed them finding it after struggling to survive. The reflection in their eyes was them finding "The Traveler" buried while wandering, which they named "The Gardener" ; then it shows them excavating it and building around it over time. They didn't create it just named it, like humanity named it "The Traveler". Then when they went all nuts, it left them.
This at least explains why the Pyramids are empty, which has been my biggest complaint with the Pyramids was the lack of some other race that was not the ones we’ve known. Essentially the lost 5th race is literally the witness, except it’s just bonded into one being. 😅
it explains The Witnesses pursuit of the Traveler and the Veil, neither is the source of the Light or the Darkness but merely conduits for these powers and why the final shape can only be attained with the powers of both.
Wow. The fact that this cutscene is able to explain in less than 4 minutes what Lightfall wasn't able to convey in its entirety, is absolutely astonishing. There is an astronomical mismanagement of writers/writing within Bungie.
It only reflects how this company is willing to chop up or come up with crazy story arcs in the name of dragging it out and just make money off of it knowing the players will pay just to know what the hell is going on. This cutscene really should open people's eyes to how greedy this company is.
Lightfall...reeks of shoehorning by woke developers who, thankfully, didn't irreparably damage the entire narrative. It WASENT meant to be...but perhapse the devs. Founds WITHOUT an in-between, the abrupt arrival to the last chapter would be worse. So they made a poor deal to avoid a disasterous outcome. NOW the bigger plot, at last, HAS a nutshell version we can explain: the witness is the travelers first ever blessed race, coalesced into a singular being, and it's pursuit is the cause of returning everything to perfect nothingness, an end to life and death, of fates, of chaos itself. To them: chaos is the antithesis of purpose, and they view chaos as their Harbinger of suffering, which must be stopped at ANY cost
Finally the Statues found in the Pyramid ships have been explained. They are the symbol of the Final Shape. A Veiled (Darkness) Female (Gardener/Light) - literally what the Witness wants SIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIMP
So it’s not Pyramid Ship versus Big Ball-it’s half ball versus big ball. It’s crazy that the pyramid fleet is more of a token to what the traveler was rather than an anthesis.
The Fleet are just the ships of this civilization. But the fact that they (The Witness) did all this warring and genocide because they want to be connected to a god because it didn't give them direction is the most narcissistic thing I have ever imagined.
It sorta is still Pyramid vs Big Ball. The traveler is connected to the Veil, kind of like two ends of a phone call. But its the Witness wanting to conjoin the two that makes the traveler flee
Classic example of biting the hand that feeds you. The traveler saved that civilization from ruin only for them to start acting like they owned the traveler🙃
This fully explains how the Witness is so powerful, too. If the Darkness is found in consciousness, then melding an ENTIRE RACE into one being would definitely do wonders for enhancing that power.
I had heard that Bungie is slapping community members UA-cam channels that have re-posts of the cut scenes...THANK YOU for posting this as I don't have time anymore to no-life the game and this is the only way I can see what's going on!!!
Probably more like quintillion years old given all that shit happened thousands or millions or billions of years before the Hive. And the Hive were millions to billions of years older than Earth even forming.
This really makes the Witness more terrifying. This race was so down bad to, from what I understand, try to bring balance to the universe that they all gave up their lives into one being. The Witness being an amalgamation makes sense and is... creepy.
Knew it was, but thought it was time doing its thing. Nope, it was a planet in one body. Also explains how it was able to slice my ship before I knew it
It also explains the rage it has. Chasing the traveler for years just to see it helped another race. And sending several disciples just to get beat enrage it even more so now it’s just pure hatred at this point.
Nah, makes it less terrifying. Previously we thought the Greater powers may be at play Primordial entities which don't even want to kill us, they just argue with each other. So was that you can't just kill them, can walk to them. Can't do anything because you are a chess piece to them - no matter the how much "strong" and "exotic" moves you get, you still a piece of wood on the board and they are humans. But now, and for a long time its know - The Witness is just another guy, that wants our stuff. Sure, their origin is "special" but it doesn't matter. It is animal. Alien just like any other. Another Oryx, another Ghaul, another Crota. A god only in name, no more than you or me while being high. All the lore, accumulated over the years from it and Darkness? Lies. Literally you can throw everything about the Darkness into a trash can because it was madness of some guy with too much ego. And they exist specifically so we can kill it in Final Shape. That's all. A body to murder. A boring "relatable villain" brought to you by Bungie because we can't have complicated story with base rooted in mythology and philosophy - no, we need and ending where we kill bad guy and everyone happy.
So basically the witness’s civilization wants structure and meaning in a chaotic and cruel universe but could never do so because they needed to open the door inside the traveler? So I wonder if the final shape is just a reality with purpose instead of a wild DESTINY/fate that anybody can obtain. However if the witness never opened the door the first time before the traveler fled its home world , does that mean they(the witness) don’t even know wat they’re doing inside? Or even navigating wherever they are? Honestly I’m really excited on how bungie writes the final chapters of this saga.
Actually the "pale heart" is the final shape. They need it to shape the reality into nothingness. And this "nothingness" is a reality that converge all the multiverses and realities in one. Remember that Traveler's prime objective are life and harmony above all things. Sorry for my bad english
The veil was connected to traveler, they brought it to Traveler and it worked. The witness civilization had what they wanted for a while. Then the Traveler left to stop that.
I think when the Witness says "No more Life" it mainly means "no more consciousness". Consciousness opposes it, it has its own desires and needs and wants. It ties into what it said at the end of The Witch Queen; "No more death". That's easy enough to figure out. It wants to end death with the gardener's power, thus everyone in the universe can no longer die of hunger (like the Drifter used to) but also can no longer FEEL hunger either (you have to be conscious on some level to do so). If you didn't need to sleep, eat, excrete waste, reproduce or anything else you could devote yourself to a singular purpose, and especially without consciousness to distract you. Look at the soldiers the witness uses. -the taken (whittled down to one future, where they serve the witness) -the wrathborn (consumed by singular rage) -the shadow legion (blank, utterly obedient empty soldiers)
The Witness' race wanted to solve for an equation where they were not given the solution. The Gardener's purpose wasn't to give life purpose in the Universe. I think the fault in the Witness' race was expecting to have their hands held by their "god" only to be disappointed. Similar to how Zavala despairs after Holliday's death at the silence of the Traveler. The Final Shape now appears to be the Witness' attempt to solve for that equation by merging the Veil and Traveler to enter some paracausal rip in the Universe from where they might have the ability to shape the universe into their twisted/corrupted view of what existence should be.
This is giving me Mass Effect vibes where all the civilizations in the galaxy that were harvested had their own Reaper. I wonder if Final Shape will involve something wild like our guardian becoming the complete embodiment of the light, absorbing all of the light bearers into ourselves to become an entity just like the Witness...and then the two of us start the game all over again.
Love destiny but this story is so generic...things get ruin if are explain too much. Is just an engry guy after a ball who make plants...a comic book regular super villan. no cosmic or elder gods, not even the darkness...i known you all like this story, but for my is just lame, is like mass effect but with only one reaper on the harvest.
I believe some of you may be confused. The civilization of The Witness did not create Darkness itself, they just embraced the power that The Veil had to offer.
nah. the traveler is the gardener. the veil is the winnower. one creates uncontrolled, the other tempers it through culling. light and dark. the first group of people that worshipped the traveler/gardener found out that uncontrolled creation can be bad/chaotic. they found the veil, and learned the darkness/power of reason/sword logic. they went back to the traveler to show it how they can now shape the life/creation it makes with reason. then it got mad and left. the society then used the sword/reason/darkness to shape themselves into the witness. and then chased the traveler down. they want to basically be like the logos/reason/god head and shape reality/creation into what they think is best.
@@hapythotsyeah and it’s stupid. They are destroying the cosmos over a ‘could be abused’. As if Darkness couldn’t be abused as well? Or any normal weapon or technology. Just bad writing
@@TheLasombra077 not exactly. its not that it "could" be abused, its that constant creation without restraint WILL destroy things. thats why they showed volcanoes and stuff. at that point creation becomes like a cancer to the other living things. the traveler doesnt stop or think about what it does, it just keeps creating. the winnower and i guess now the witness see this, and try to temper/winnow the life that gets made. but to different degrees? the witness definitely wants to "Shape" life into what it thinks is best. which might not actually be best. it also brings up the question, who gets to decide which life is "worthy" of living, and has the right to cull the others. no one knows the potential that life could reach. but at the same time, that life may in fact destroy a lot of other things just by existing.
At the simplest sense, it just means they want to "cover the light" with the veil, or rather, contain/control it? Like, if you think about it, its pretty simple - using a veil to cover the light :S funny how it's been staring us in the face all along 😅
@@TheLasombra077 They wanted meaning in their lives. Structure. Not one time in this video did anyone mention the potential for abuse of the Gardener's power. They were fine with abusing that power, they built a whole civilization on abusing/exploiting that power. The video doesn't mention any moral concerns over the fact that the Gardener could end entire species on a whim. The implication is that their concern was for the fact that it could end THEM, and they wanted to make sure that didn't happen. Just bad comprehension.
@@golodniyhistoryck171 Hope. They literally hoped a being into existence. Or they called it to them with their hope. Because it looks like it came out of the planet they are on.
we don't know tho, in fact before this cutscene we had a pretty good idea, but this now wipes the slate clean and we are back to square 1 with no clue what the traveller actually is. We do know what the witness is now tho
This gives me a lot of Gurren Lagann Spiral vs. Anti-Spiral. Basically a race of beings on the side of good Spiral/Light was so scared how if left alone could lead to devastation that they devoted themselves to bringing order and restrictions Anti-Spiral/Darkness
honestly, if this cutscene was displayed near the start of the lightfall campaign, almost the entire DLC's story would've been saved, it provides motive to the witness, tells us the mcguffin (the veil) and explains why the hell we are on neomuna at all
What an extremely good cutscene, The Traveler basically creates the evil against it and The Witness is the entire first race that the Traveler looked over, fascinating
Yea, but this still doesn't tell us what the veil is. The only detail is that the witness learned its power and that it's another entity alongside the traveller with different powers. Now im more interested in the story of the traveller and the veil. Lets hope it gets answered in lightfall
It’s not made of dead bodies, rather it is gestalt conciseness of entire race. All the souls put into one body. A mind hive one body, one voice, many souls.
"Thus began the Witness' pursuit. It's campaign to impose meaning on a meaningless universe." The Witness did all this for an edgey philosophy question. 😂
@@rithvikmuthyalapati9754 Funnily enough, lore context of the Nightmares raid means it's more likely that Nezarec was interrogating Calus, hazing him basically while taking the form of the Witness.
Don’t underestimate the relevancy of questions like this after you reach a state of having literally everything you can desire The question for meaning will literally rip you apart
But what is the Winnower exists? That would explain the Traveler being basically digged into that planet. That also explains the flower game and how the Traveler was weak from the begining.
No it's both, at first they said they needed a winnower so they searched for one; leading them to the veil And using the darkness they discovered within the veil, they became the winnower
The witness people called it “the gardener” just like how we called it “the traveler” or how the Eliksni called it “the great machine”, its not unprecedented for the witness to lie for its own gain This cutscene reframes the story of the gardener and the winnower from a “documentation from beginning of the universe” to a tool for propaganda
One very important thing to note is that in the beginning who im assuming is Ahsa from the new seasonal stuff, tells us the story of “The witnesses first victims” and midway through the viewpoint switches from 3rd to 1st person saying that all those victims became the witness and started his pursuit. So does this mean that witness did all this to himself.
So now we finally got the answers we needed from Lightfall. Cant wait for new lights who join be completely confused cause the seasons and cut scene is gone.
Rewatching this cutscene again kinda explains why “bravery, devotion, sacrifice” is needed for the traveler to “bless” you, because the Witness & their people were narcissistic and greedy, the traveler helped their kind only for it to turn on it at the end. I see why the Traveler picks and chooses
Yeah this cutscene honestly made me not really like the Witness as a villain. Idk they’re just a spoiled group of people that took they’re come up for granted. They’re not even The Darkness so it’s like.. hmm I’m more interested in stopping what they communed with dealing with the Veil.
@@bearitin7563 Nah you’re wrong. The Veil is as much as the darkness as The Traveler is the light. The Witness is just a merged group of people because of what they communed with in or near the Veil. Xur even said the Veil is like a mirror of the Traveler. The Witness is a spoiled collective who wants they’re own way. It simply was blessed by the light and now wears the Darkness as a cloak. Witness is more like the Speaker if he dabbled in Darkness. My thing is.. we probably will end up finding out that the Darkness is the grim reaper force which keeps balance. The Witness has just been using it completely wrong so we have to take him/she/they/it down lol. Part of what I’m thinking is that The Traveler & Veil are basically a type of Heaven & Hell, both hold 2 completely different things. That’s why Ghost told us not to fall in. But it’s just what I’m thinking I’m probably wrongg but we’ll see.
THIS is what we should've had in Lightfall. We should've been shown this cutscene in Lightfall and probably the biggest complaint of the campaign would've been negated.
Why does everyone have to revert back to hating on Lightfall can't we all just watch a cutscene and say "damn that was fucking cool" instead of finding ways to shit on everything at every chance we get?
@@curtiscrosley2574 It's more like we think this is so good, that we got no clue why they didn't just put it at the end of the story, because it would've made this cutscene and the story an even better experience.
This one scene could have literally changed the way the community felt about Lightfall entirely but instead they just were like “nah, I want to be abused a little”
This in no way ruins the game for me. It actually gets me more excited to see what’s next. Whoever leaked it thank you because I was losing hope with this game lol
@@FunkyTurkeyRabbit6135 i know it's a pvp game, that doesn't take away from the fact that the people who actually know how to work on a game and keep monkeys interested for a whole year on destiny left to work on Marathon. Lightfall is a terrible expansion compared what we got last year
I knew it. When Savathun said “a being with a thousand names and answers to only one” she was speaking literally. Because it speaks as if 1000 voices spoke and is filled with so much rage as if it’s 1000 beings rage and pain.
Honestly this is kinda scary the voice talking in the cutscene and uhh is the witness made of millions of dead bodies/people and that’s why he looks the way he does and with the heads coming out of the smoke on his head
not to be one of those people but it’s safe to say They/Them when referring to the Witness, not because I’m some fanatic LGBTQIAFGLKOIDNDLAKSCNC+ activist, but because it gives the Witness more character, and uniqueness. It quite literally is a bunch of souls conjoined in one.
Extremely interesting. So the Witness took some artistic liberty when they wrote that story with the flower game. They are not a primordial force shaping reality with the Gardener , but an entity trying to achieve godhood and recreate reality in their own image. Maybe the flower game takes place inside the Traveller? Like a forge for the universe. When they first tried to create their ideal universe the Gardener/Traveller rejected them and fled. Maybe the Witness fabricated this story to seem more formidable or inevitable and maybe even noble. As they seem to have no problems lying and manipulating to achieve their goals. And now the Witness is in the process of rewriting the universe…
This isn’t the witness speaking, this is Ahsa the leviathan on titan, who is an enemy of the witness and would more than likely have no reason to lie to us if the witness is fully evil
I believe the Winnower isn't the Witness, Because else the Traveler wouldn't yet be so weak. The Winnower is something else, the thing that made the Traveler into this dormant state
@@elbrachoxddd5883 The Winnower doesnt exist. The Witness's people wanted someone to give them purpose and make sense of the senseless Universe for them, but when they were denied it by the Traveler they decided they would become it instead. The Witness is trying to BECOME the Winnower. Thats the Final Shape.
@@elbrachoxddd5883 I think it’s there just because it is. Like I think the question itself of “what is the traveler? Why is the traveler” is the same exact question the witnesses species had. truth is there is no good answer. It’s just a god like being and another strange aspect of a strange universe it resides in. And that question with no answer drove the species to madness and left to cope and create a false narrative. Tbh I don’t know if it’s intentional or not but it’s a good reflection of the player base always asking what the traveler is. That’s atleast my interpretation
Damn what makes this even scarier, is it validates the Witness belief. He was born of an entire civilization killing themselves in order to make one perfect being. The Witness... Damn.
This is the best take I've heard yet! Considering their species gave rise to the worm gods means they've been around a VERY long time so she's probably seen some things.
@@12undeadleader Yeah after playing the missions, I realize that Ahsa is speaking through Sloane through psychic connection strengthened by Egregoric corals and golden age tech
It answers what the veil is! Basically the traveller is the only god in the universe. The darkness was born from the veil. The veil when connected to the traveler opens a portal to a reality full of darkness. They then took this power from that reality and brought it back which is the darkness. The traveller then fled their civilisation when it realised they were abusing its power of light. The witness is called the witness because it witnessed the reality of darkness and they want to go back there
@@McSpicyYT Well I mean we don’t really know what the Traveler is either, how it came to be, if light and dark existed before space and time itself, does that mean the Traveler is the light and the Veil the Darkness? Or is the Traveler just still the embodiment of it and not the light itself.
No darkness always existed. But the witness like you said witness darkness and light together. The witness didn’t create to worms of fundament. It didn’t create strand, it all existee
Wtf???? It doesn't answer what the veil is at all. Where do you get that? All it says is the veil, the traveler and the darkness are all connected and like yeah no shit. This story just adds a shit load of plot holes to the already existing one and I'm sorta done with destiny lore. It's nonsensical and that's coming from someone who ENJOYS Warhammer 40k lore.
We are the witness. Well close to it. We developed TOO FAST and now we seek meaning. Some find meaning in wealth, some in pleasure and joy, some in vengeange. Whatever the case we are completely willing to destroy everything for that meaning.
Yes and we will be the Withness! As the traveler(gardener) will leave again, our guardian's souls are going to build the Withness! So this is just a " History repeats itself" game , our destiny! :)
@@phoenix9531 He's Seth Dickinson. He wrote most of the best lore. The Books of Sorrow, Unveiling, Marasenna. And he layed the foundations for what the Darkness would be in Destiny. Even though he was such a great writer Bungie never hired him for some reason so he only worked contracts and eventually got hired by the Subnautica team. So his absence has been pretty apparent in the last few years because the writers are going in a completely different direction than what Seth had built up.
To theorise then, i would suppose the 'final shape' is in essence the witness trying to bond with, and assume control over, the travellers functions of the physical realm. If the witness desires nothingness, then it likely seeks to use the travellers power to create life to effectively undo everything, destroy the fabric of reality by erasing gracity, life, etc, the domains controlled by the gardener.
The Idea that somehow the Traveler was in the Witness' planet, seemingly buried in there, somewhat explains what Nezarec said before, specifically the one about "its oldest victims". Maybe the Witness's species was the first to ever be gifted the light by the Traveler. Which then brings up the next question, does that mean the Traveler was formed in their planet or was the gardener just happened to be dormant in their planet?
They predicted the Traveller would cause ruin. But they just became the ruin that was predicted. Self fulfilling prophecy i guess? I don't know. Just seems like a really big smooth brain moment on their end.
What is interesting from this cutscene is that the Travel is portrayed as a careless builder. All the civilizations it uplifted ended in ruin. The connection they sought is quite literal given the fact that they wanted to go inside the traveler.
Awesome cutscene.... I'm guessing we get this from the end of the veil related missions they were talking about. The only way hearing this voice makes sense is having us go back to the veil to interact with it? Initially thought this would be coming from the last week or two of this season from the being on Titan, but they seem more focused on Xivu. Either way though, I think this is all we are getting until Final Shape
The voice is the leviathan ahsa so yes it will be on titan in the seasonal story, either at the end of it or in the middle when we can hear it’s thoughts clearly
So basically they are another species who got butt hurt by the traveler when he left because they didnt just accept the gifts and tried to make the traveler do their bidding.
This as a lore buff might be the most important cutscene in recent memory, the fact that the Witness is a whole race who did a fusion dance makes it more terrifying than what i originally thought, more information about the Veil is good seeming as the Lightfall campaign told us nothing, the fact that the name the gardener was used by this race and they created the pyramid ships and in turn all of the resonant energy is super interesting. I'm so ready to learn more about this supposed name of this race. Because apart from them basically becoming the witness they never state a name for it. Not to mention the fact that the Witnesses theme used here sounds more and more idk how to describe it, triumphant ig is very cool
I wonder if after defeating it, the Witness will break into many many shadowy entities and this will be a new enemy race. Like you know, those things from the old concept art.
I have a strong feeling we won't even win 😐😐 So far we have been struggling to stand a chance against the witness's power, one flick of his hand destroyed a fleet... Even with cayde's return and most likely every other guardian that lost their life in battle that has been living inside the traveler! Since we have been the heroes of our people all along... And we barely managed to stand against the fleet! Yes we will run through every force the witness will throw at us, question is... Will we manage to go through it?
Absolutely no reason Bungie couldn't have just put this in Lightfall. When your ghost got linked to the Witness it's memories could have leaked into our own which gave us the revelation as to why the Veil is so important, and therefore give us motivation to find as many allies as possible to confront the Witness
Despite all the discussion about the Traveler, The Witness, The Veil and The Final Shape, and we still don't know anything about the Traveler itself or its true name/origin.
In comparison, humanities golden age only lasted for 200 years...if you think about it, since the travelers appearance extended the span of human life, there where humans who saw the three cosmonauts land on mars, lived through the golden age and probably saw the collapse happen
It’s not how this story goes. Lightfall was supposed to be mysterious. Lightfall was a race, we had to get to The Veil before Calus could, we don’t know why The Witness wants it, just that it does, and that’s enough for us to try to stop it. Yet, The Witness fooled us and achieved it goal, now we lost and are in the calm before the storm. We’re now plotting out next move, so now we’re learning more about The Veil in hopes we’ll learn something that gives us an edge. The Destiny Seasonal stories always had set up for the bigger expansions. Lightfall and Final Shape are practically a two-parter, Lightfall was the opener, the Lightfall Seasons provide more info and set up more story, and Final Shape is the grande finale of all Destiny. I feel sorry that you can’t comprehend how the story is being told. I also don’t know where it was said that Lightfall would answer long awaited Destiny questions.
@@captainblorgus2515 I think it's the expectation but people in general don't understand how storytelling works, this is why you have people that expect things as "ohh next season is going to be Siva" like they think seasons are like their own separate stories that aren't connected in any way with the main lore. I would agree that the campaign felt lacking in terms of that it felt more like Strand tutorial more than anything but it's obvious that there is a reason why they aren't delving too much into Veil stuff cuz it was probably something for a future season (this season) so talking about it would've been massive spoilers. Same thing with the Nine, there is a reason it's being kept in the shadows, they're mentioned every now and then but so far they have remained behind the curtain for years. Even on this season Zavala is like asking The Drifter "dude wtf is going on with the Nine? whats the whole point of Gambit and stuff?" and he's like "the Nine work in mysterious ways brother". Now that it's revealed most of what The Witness is, what it wants, for example now we know that what it said in the "Unveiling" lore book, it's not the story of how the Universe began objectively, it's a myth from his people, it's The Witness' race "creation myth" basically, it's a story. So I was thinking, what if the Nine are the equivalent to the Witness but in the Human race? What if after what happened during the collapse, they got trapped into a Darkness dimension and they're just trying to escape or manipulate things from their Darkness "universe" in a way? Remember that the "Prophecy" dungeon is supposed to be the "answer" of the Nine to the question: "what is the darkness" or "what is the nature of darkness?", why would the Nine know what the Darkness is? There is a reason they got teased today during the starting quest of Season of the Deep. What if the Nine are like Darkness entities similar to how the Traveler is to the Light? With this cinematic it's obvious that the Witness isn't some kind of Darkness god, it's not the equivalent of the Traveler at all, so what if the Nine are?
@@captainblorgus2515 the issue was that other people knew what the Veil was but didn’t tell us. It would even make sense to hear it in the convos between Witness and Calus.
This reminds of an anime I’ve seen before where the main villain race discovers a great power then realizes said power could end all existence, then wipes off any known races that have been using said power. As well as a whole plant fusing consciousness into one being… gurren lagann is the anime I’m speaking about ^^
Honestly, this would be us too if we were ever to encounter a being that uplifted all of humanity collectively. Like people already have a penchant for trying to find meaning in the day to day, imagine you’re now able to live indefinitely to the point where you’ve probably exhausted all pleasures and venues of interest, mix that with religious zealotry, and you’ve got the recipe for some intergalactic Jonestown singularity of an organism called The Witness.
So we're back to where we should have been the entire time. The witness is not the Darkness, never has been, and the Gardener and Winnower are still inviolate as to the beginning of the universe.
The Witness is a manifest of all that a people are and the wish/mission, its salvation. It is an ascended being, a collective of conscious. None of them, yet all of them at the same time. From a civilization that's older than Earth or Sol itself to a single personification of desire and purpose. The evolution of commitment itself.
It’s not really a personification of these things/ideas, it’s just beings that chose to express those things as a hive mind, the will didn’t come before the race of beings but the other way around
I thought the Pyramids were the blades created by the Winnower when he fought the Gardener during their flower game. This whole Veil/Witness thing feels like it's shoehorned in.
@@CJWII Inspiral implied the Flower Game never actually happened, and reveals that the darkness isn’t sentient. All of that was made up by the Witness. I am disappointed too.
For me, this also finally makes the design of The Witness make SENSE. I could never put my figure out why I didn't like the look of the Witness, but I think it was due to it feeling so out of place as a character in the Destiny universe. Why we didn't get any of this in Lightfall is beyond me, but at least we have it now I guess.
Talk about the more you'd screw around the more you're gonna find out. The Witness is just a collaboration of people who wanted to find out, so they just... made a body out of bodies apparently
Pretty sure this fully solidifies that The Traveler is The Gardener itself. Granted gifts but no guidance, power to break the laws of reality but no instructions on how to do so. Ran as soon as they tried to control it and kept running, growing the garden while The Winnower/Witness cut it down behind it.
Love how people care about story all of a sudden when Destiny 1 had almost nothing but grimoire lore that required the website to even see. My Name Is Byf literally made a living off that. Be grateful.
What disappoints me the most is how the darkness has been downgraded. It used to be a dark part of the objective and primal laws of reality, the truth, that existence means the fight for existence and that means survival of the fittest. In a way, it was a realization that can be applied to real life just the same, and I was intrigued what kind of philosophical answer they would give to combat this. Whatever light makes, ontologically, necessarily fights against each other. Like Toland revealed in ghost fragment darkness 3. Then the winnover seemed to be a godly personification of that fact, importantly one prior to existence and the universe itself. Now darkness is some force within the universe and the witness is just a being within the universe. The light, just like real life, isn't purely good and although they acknowledge this, they've added the darkness-force as a counterpart that really isn't different at all. They're both energies instead of the darkness being nothingness, and its whole aspect of psychology and memory opens a different philosophical problem entirely about the nature of consciousness. If the witness as what it is, is defeated after final shape, the cruel reality of life will still exist. This cutscene seems to imply the moral of the story will be to accept "meaninglessness" in life and shape your own destiny. But the cruel survival of the strongest truth isnt adressed. I loved the original destiny lore because it seemed to be a story questioning the limits of reality and existence themselves, instead of taking it for granted and just asking questions within that structure.
yep seems like this is the case. Although you could make the argument that the Traveler is the being of Light, as it exercises some form of consciousness and emotion.
The Traveler would be considered a being of light. But "The Dark" is just the knowledge they gained from studying The Veil. And it looks like The Veil is just another concentration of paracausel energy with ties to The Traveler.
The lore video seems to imply that the Traveller was manifested by this races collective hope. It seems to even rise out of the ground as if being born of the planet, as opposed to coming from the stars like it would every other race who’s planet it inhabited.
@Manerum "I want to be spoon fed the story so that I know everything in the universe while playing a character that could quite literally have been born yesterday"
I'm just happy to see that there were so many people that were as confused as I was. I started playing again right after Light fall was released and I was LOST. This video cleared it all up.
@@stelonous It shifts the dynamics of who the bad guy is. The majority of the time, the antagonist of the game was "The Darkness", but over recent patches and expansions, this role was shifted to the Witness and the darkness is not this amoral thing. It feels like the game changed who the bad guys were and tries to contextualize past events by introducing new lore.
![The Final Shape [NEW LEAKS] (Cayde-6, Oryx, and more!) | Destiny 2](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/6MRVyx10hUU/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks!
You donated? 🤡🤡🤡🤡
@@Pizzazoomman what's wrong with that lmao
So basically the traveler traveled and the witness witnessed.
I guess
Lmao
🤯🤯🤯
bro my favorite part in destiny 2 was when the guardians guarded and the traveler traveled
@CyberPup 22 😂😂😂
But has the witness ever been faced with a 4th times target lock retrofit + witherhoard
retrofit has been shit since the nerf
@@StarlyteGaming wrong
@@SavvyMon4 i have it
Thundercrash + TTF with catalyst + Riptide
@@StarlyteGaming so do I and I can easily put in major damage with it. Just say you’re bad with it lmao.
this cutscene was way better then all of lightfall campaign story
Yes, because it deserved to be in lightfall and probably was suppose to be. Bungie gutted that expansion lol
@@peter2kx I don't think this would have helped the Lightfall campaign. Lightfall campaign was basically Infinity War but only Thanos involved parts. Season of Defiance was Infinity War, but only the Guardians of the Galaxy parts. This season feels very Thor's arc in the movie.
@@MrTytyjohn64 This view that Lightfall was/is poor being down to it's narrative, is not entirely accurate. Lightfall was the only campaign that didn't end with "answers"...... which for me is fine, as long as the remainder of the expansion (remaining seasons) fleshes it out enough with detail that it leads to the next expansion smoothly. Could Lightfall have included the Final Shape and led to a suitable conclusion after 4 seasons? Sure.... but there's a good chance that it would have felt rushed and that we'd have been complaining about that instead of this. They obviously saw that fact and I guess with the financial incentive, ran it out. We get more content, we get drip fed the closing arc..... which to be quite frank.... has been an addiction personally for me that has cured my Netflix problem. I think we only get to be mad if they butcher the end of Final Shape....... their ball to drop.
-this is where I saw my father die, Nimbus
-cowaboonga!
@@KCM25NJL that’s the worst thing bungie is doing to “fix” the narrative. Instead of us understanding why we should care about the veil, we’re forced to do it anyways, and only after failing we find out why we should care.
Whether you consider it fixing the narrative or not. Not being able to unravel a mystery before the first half of a climax is really unsatisfying. It’s like if thanos had been collecting the stones, snapped his fingers and then it skips to him in a farm when we’re all wondering what he was doing. we just know he’s a bad guy who might do a bad thing. It makes it all the less impactful when we lose. Because we don’t know why we were even fighting in the first place.
If it was to make the reveal more terrifying. Make it so we know that the veil is a key to access a different reality no one has seen before, make it vague that it’s something potentially horrifying that the witness could have access to. Then we could finally reveal that it’s the source of the darkness, boom. Infinitely more compelling. I would rather know vaguely that it might be something a threat if he wins. Because for all we knew, the veil was just a way for the witness to get high.
Yes, the season will give us answers but we have to pay 1200 silver just to have a story reveal that will get vaulted when the final shape comes out :/
Ok, so let me see if I got this correctly,
1.) The Witness isn't some elder god from the beginning of the universe, it was once an entire race of aliens and is the first race to find the traveler and be uplifted by it.
2.) This race worshipped the traveler as a god; however, despite the traveler granting this race gifts of power and knowledge, they craved to understand their purpose in the universe, so they set out in their pyramid ships to find the answer.
3.) The race found The Veil, which is the Darkness’ version of the traveler, a “dark mirror,” as Xur put it. After studying the veil, the race learned that the traveler, and by extension, the light, is a form of chaos and change, which can provide life and cause death and destruction.
4.) The race saw this power or change as a curse that only leads to suffering, so they decided to use what they had learned by studying the veil to steal the traveler’s power, or its “pale heart,” to reshape the universe so there would be no life or death, no suffering or change, just complete nothingness.
5.) Obviously, the traveler fled from them. So in order to be powerful enough to pursue the traveler and defeat it, this race sacrificed themselves on mass and combined their essence into a singular being, The Witness.
6.) So the traveler keeps hopping from planet to planet, hoping to find a race that can defeat the witness once and for all
Edit: Damn! well thanks for all the likes guys, I’ll see you stateside!
You got it chief. Perfect explanation!
@dontmasktruth-92 It didn't, cutscene showed them finding it after struggling to survive.
The reflection in their eyes was them finding "The Traveler" buried while wandering, which they named "The Gardener" ; then it shows them excavating it and building around it over time.
They didn't create it just named it, like humanity named it "The Traveler". Then when they went all nuts, it left them.
@@The_Grim_Rabbit so the real question is what made the traveler
@TheGamingGeek Destiny 3 purpose leaked 😂😂😂😂
Someone pin this comment!!!!!!!
Can't believe a seasonal cutscene explained The Veil and everything else more than an entire DLC.
Not even an entire DLC, an entire goddamn *Expansion* . They have zero excuse.
Finally. Yall figured it out
Bungie are literally making the story up as they go along.
Bungie shouldn’t do story anymore, just release a crucible gameplay game
@@acrnm funniest thing I've seen all year, thanks for this! Holy shit...
This at least explains why the Pyramids are empty, which has been my biggest complaint with the Pyramids was the lack of some other race that was not the ones we’ve known. Essentially the lost 5th race is literally the witness, except it’s just bonded into one being. 😅
@@JizzSock_ what
Amalgamation
Also those weird crystal statues are the beings that merged.
@@JizzSock_ um...how?
@@colvamoon6962 5th race used the power of the veil/darkness to marge their consciousness into the witness
Xur has been telling us since D1 that the traveler has a dark mirror. This is the veil.
Neither Evil nor Good. Just is
@@lumberluc just is
it explains The Witnesses pursuit of the Traveler and the Veil, neither is the source of the Light or the Darkness but merely conduits for these powers and why the final shape can only be attained with the powers of both.
He's been telling us... And we didn't listen.
Xur does bear resemblance to the Witness's species...
Normally I avoid leaked stuff like this but considering how astronomically hard Bungie dropped the ball with Lightfall’s story I was done waiting.
Same
Bro is speaking my words right here
Exact same here.
PREACH BROTHA I AM DUN WAITIN
Agreed this helped explain so much more and what should have been in lightfall
Wow. The fact that this cutscene is able to explain in less than 4 minutes what Lightfall wasn't able to convey in its entirety, is absolutely astonishing. There is an astronomical mismanagement of writers/writing within Bungie.
I think it more so confirms that Lightfall never really was part of the plan for the story.
It only reflects how this company is willing to chop up or come up with crazy story arcs in the name of dragging it out and just make money off of it knowing the players will pay just to know what the hell is going on. This cutscene really should open people's eyes to how greedy this company is.
Lightfall...reeks of shoehorning by woke developers who, thankfully, didn't irreparably damage the entire narrative.
It WASENT meant to be...but perhapse the devs. Founds WITHOUT an in-between, the abrupt arrival to the last chapter would be worse.
So they made a poor deal to avoid a disasterous outcome. NOW the bigger plot, at last, HAS a nutshell version we can explain: the witness is the travelers first ever blessed race, coalesced into a singular being, and it's pursuit is the cause of returning everything to perfect nothingness, an end to life and death, of fates, of chaos itself. To them: chaos is the antithesis of purpose, and they view chaos as their Harbinger of suffering, which must be stopped at ANY cost
@@galetheimpaler7077 You clearly haven't been around long enough to remember when Bungie was beholden to Activision since you want to bring up greed.
The point of destiny lore is to be confused the whole fucking time for years.
Finally the Statues found in the Pyramid ships have been explained. They are the symbol of the Final Shape. A Veiled (Darkness) Female (Gardener/Light) - literally what the Witness wants
SIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIMP
bingoo
So the witness wants women
@@glitchmob1497 This is confirmation that The Witness gets no bi-
@@jayfernotrash the witness IS bitches
@@glitchmob1497 it's a simp and I'm gonna make fun of it as it wipes my team several times in the raid.
So it’s not Pyramid Ship versus Big Ball-it’s half ball versus big ball. It’s crazy that the pyramid fleet is more of a token to what the traveler was rather than an anthesis.
Half ball vs big ball XD
The Fleet are just the ships of this civilization. But the fact that they (The Witness) did all this warring and genocide because they want to be connected to a god because it didn't give them direction is the most narcissistic thing I have ever imagined.
It sorta is still Pyramid vs Big Ball. The traveler is connected to the Veil, kind of like two ends of a phone call. But its the Witness wanting to conjoin the two that makes the traveler flee
I honestly don’t think so. It doesn’t really seem like the Traveler and Veil are at odds.
Tbf the sharp angular nature of the ‘mids is also present in our ghost. Straight lines vs curves was never the endgame apparently!
So... The Witness is basically the Antispiral. Alright, I see you Bungie, I know what's up
The witness wants to return to the primordial goo like NERV. They all want to be one. Everything leads back to gurren lagann and evangelion
Can't wait for the Destiny x Gurren Laggan collab
Gurren Lagan is still goated.
Alright. That's it. When the final battle begins I'm blasting GLs theme song during damage phase
@@VRGUILE ROW ROW FIGHTTHE POWER!!!
Classic example of biting the hand that feeds you. The traveler saved that civilization from ruin only for them to start acting like they owned the traveler🙃
Idk maybe that would happen with every civilization which makes it the traveler's fault.
Very human like
You forget about the destruction the light was shown to cause, and from their perspective it was without meaning
@@jibbily27 Yep
The traveller showed them no guidance so they didn’t know what to do with all that power or how to use it properly so it’s the travellers fault.
This fully explains how the Witness is so powerful, too. If the Darkness is found in consciousness, then melding an ENTIRE RACE into one being would definitely do wonders for enhancing that power.
It may enhance it greatly but this shows the witness tho extremely strong is mortal and not a god meaning it can be killed
I had heard that Bungie is slapping community members UA-cam channels that have re-posts of the cut scenes...THANK YOU for posting this as I don't have time anymore to no-life the game and this is the only way I can see what's going on!!!
This civilization..is billions of years old..
And so is this witness.
Wait so are the witnesses older or are the Vex older?
@@lucaricci1987 the vex aren’t old they’re just time traveling
The Vex canonically existed before time itself and are thus the oldest race we have fought in the game.
Probably more like quintillion years old given all that shit happened thousands or millions or billions of years before the Hive. And the Hive were millions to billions of years older than Earth even forming.
This really makes the Witness more terrifying. This race was so down bad to, from what I understand, try to bring balance to the universe that they all gave up their lives into one being. The Witness being an amalgamation makes sense and is... creepy.
We kinda already knew it was an amalgamation. It speaks saying "We."
Knew it was, but thought it was time doing its thing.
Nope, it was a planet in one body. Also explains how it was able to slice my ship before I knew it
It also explains the rage it has. Chasing the traveler for years just to see it helped another race. And sending several disciples just to get beat enrage it even more so now it’s just pure hatred at this point.
@@kennya8609 Time to destroy the Witness by dividing it up to individuals again and slaughter them all.
Nah, makes it less terrifying. Previously we thought the Greater powers may be at play Primordial entities which don't even want to kill us, they just argue with each other. So was that you can't just kill them, can walk to them. Can't do anything because you are a chess piece to them - no matter the how much "strong" and "exotic" moves you get, you still a piece of wood on the board and they are humans.
But now, and for a long time its know - The Witness is just another guy, that wants our stuff. Sure, their origin is "special" but it doesn't matter. It is animal. Alien just like any other. Another Oryx, another Ghaul, another Crota.
A god only in name, no more than you or me while being high.
All the lore, accumulated over the years from it and Darkness? Lies. Literally you can throw everything about the Darkness into a trash can because it was madness of some guy with too much ego.
And they exist specifically so we can kill it in Final Shape.
That's all. A body to murder. A boring "relatable villain" brought to you by Bungie because we can't have complicated story with base rooted in mythology and philosophy - no, we need and ending where we kill bad guy and everyone happy.
So basically the witness’s civilization wants structure and meaning in a chaotic and cruel universe but could never do so because they needed to open the door inside the traveler? So I wonder if the final shape is just a reality with purpose instead of a wild DESTINY/fate that anybody can obtain. However if the witness never opened the door the first time before the traveler fled its home world , does that mean they(the witness) don’t even know wat they’re doing inside? Or even navigating wherever they are? Honestly I’m really excited on how bungie writes the final chapters of this saga.
Actually the "pale heart" is the final shape. They need it to shape the reality into nothingness. And this "nothingness" is a reality that converge all the multiverses and realities in one. Remember that Traveler's prime objective are life and harmony above all things. Sorry for my bad english
The veil was connected to traveler, they brought it to Traveler and it worked. The witness civilization had what they wanted for a while. Then the Traveler left to stop that.
I think when the Witness says "No more Life" it mainly means "no more consciousness". Consciousness opposes it, it has its own desires and needs and wants. It ties into what it said at the end of The Witch Queen; "No more death". That's easy enough to figure out.
It wants to end death with the gardener's power, thus everyone in the universe can no longer die of hunger (like the Drifter used to) but also can no longer FEEL hunger either (you have to be conscious on some level to do so). If you didn't need to sleep, eat, excrete waste, reproduce or anything else you could devote yourself to a singular purpose, and especially without consciousness to distract you.
Look at the soldiers the witness uses.
-the taken (whittled down to one future, where they serve the witness)
-the wrathborn (consumed by singular rage)
-the shadow legion (blank, utterly obedient empty soldiers)
The Witness' race wanted to solve for an equation where they were not given the solution. The Gardener's purpose wasn't to give life purpose in the Universe. I think the fault in the Witness' race was expecting to have their hands held by their "god" only to be disappointed. Similar to how Zavala despairs after Holliday's death at the silence of the Traveler. The Final Shape now appears to be the Witness' attempt to solve for that equation by merging the Veil and Traveler to enter some paracausal rip in the Universe from where they might have the ability to shape the universe into their twisted/corrupted view of what existence should be.
Maybe the real final shape was the friends we made along the way
This is giving me Mass Effect vibes where all the civilizations in the galaxy that were harvested had their own Reaper. I wonder if Final Shape will involve something wild like our guardian becoming the complete embodiment of the light, absorbing all of the light bearers into ourselves to become an entity just like the Witness...and then the two of us start the game all over again.
I am all the jedi?
@@Hyperion9997 yes!
Or get a temporary power up from the traveler itself
Love destiny but this story is so generic...things get ruin if are explain too much. Is just an engry guy after a ball who make plants...a comic book regular super villan. no cosmic or elder gods, not even the darkness...i known you all like this story, but for my is just lame, is like mass effect but with only one reaper on the harvest.
I believe some of you may be confused. The civilization of The Witness did not create Darkness itself, they just embraced the power that The Veil had to offer.
nah. the traveler is the gardener. the veil is the winnower. one creates uncontrolled, the other tempers it through culling. light and dark. the first group of people that worshipped the traveler/gardener found out that uncontrolled creation can be bad/chaotic. they found the veil, and learned the darkness/power of reason/sword logic. they went back to the traveler to show it how they can now shape the life/creation it makes with reason. then it got mad and left. the society then used the sword/reason/darkness to shape themselves into the witness. and then chased the traveler down. they want to basically be like the logos/reason/god head and shape reality/creation into what they think is best.
@@hapythotsyeah and it’s stupid. They are destroying the cosmos over a ‘could be abused’. As if Darkness couldn’t be abused as well? Or any normal weapon or technology.
Just bad writing
@@TheLasombra077 not exactly. its not that it "could" be abused, its that constant creation without restraint WILL destroy things. thats why they showed volcanoes and stuff. at that point creation becomes like a cancer to the other living things. the traveler doesnt stop or think about what it does, it just keeps creating. the winnower and i guess now the witness see this, and try to temper/winnow the life that gets made. but to different degrees? the witness definitely wants to "Shape" life into what it thinks is best. which might not actually be best. it also brings up the question, who gets to decide which life is "worthy" of living, and has the right to cull the others. no one knows the potential that life could reach. but at the same time, that life may in fact destroy a lot of other things just by existing.
At the simplest sense, it just means they want to "cover the light" with the veil, or rather, contain/control it? Like, if you think about it, its pretty simple - using a veil to cover the light :S funny how it's been staring us in the face all along 😅
@@TheLasombra077 They wanted meaning in their lives. Structure. Not one time in this video did anyone mention the potential for abuse of the Gardener's power. They were fine with abusing that power, they built a whole civilization on abusing/exploiting that power. The video doesn't mention any moral concerns over the fact that the Gardener could end entire species on a whim. The implication is that their concern was for the fact that it could end THEM, and they wanted to make sure that didn't happen.
Just bad comprehension.
Its happened. We finally know what the traveler is. Turns out we knew for quite some time time now
So... what is the traveler ?
@@golodniyhistoryck171 Well isn't it obvious?
@@KCM25NJL maybe? depends on what you mean
@@golodniyhistoryck171 Hope. They literally hoped a being into existence. Or they called it to them with their hope. Because it looks like it came out of the planet they are on.
we don't know tho, in fact before this cutscene we had a pretty good idea, but this now wipes the slate clean and we are back to square 1 with no clue what the traveller actually is. We do know what the witness is now tho
This gives me a lot of Gurren Lagann Spiral vs. Anti-Spiral.
Basically a race of beings on the side of good Spiral/Light was so scared how if left alone could lead to devastation that they devoted themselves to bringing order and restrictions Anti-Spiral/Darkness
Even down to the whole species joining into one aspect too
I wonder if they were a bit inspired by GL 😮
still my favourite anime ❤
Theres a lot of similarities with gurren lagann in destiny 2.
The moon hiding something
Cayde is kamina to us
Crow is like viral
@@Coffeecrayon76 i didnt even realise those other connections
@@BlueBerrySherry it’s my all time favorite as well
honestly, if this cutscene was displayed near the start of the lightfall campaign, almost the entire DLC's story would've been saved, it provides motive to the witness, tells us the mcguffin (the veil) and explains why the hell we are on neomuna at all
These cutscenes art styles are so brilliantly done!!!!
What an extremely good cutscene, The Traveler basically creates the evil against it and The Witness is the entire first race that the Traveler looked over, fascinating
but the Queen said that there wasn't only one traveler. How does that play with this?
@@stelonous You're taking Savathun's words for granted.
That's foolish.
@@stelonous Savathun is the queen of lies so never take what she says seriously
dude you remember too many details, switch to indica
Yea, but this still doesn't tell us what the veil is. The only detail is that the witness learned its power and that it's another entity alongside the traveller with different powers. Now im more interested in the story of the traveller and the veil. Lets hope it gets answered in lightfall
The fact that The Witness is made from dead bodies says a lot about him. This explains the face-shaped smoke from his head.
It’s not made of dead bodies, rather it is gestalt conciseness of entire race. All the souls put into one body. A mind hive one body, one voice, many souls.
@@DestinedDeath703 not necessarily one voice, as Mara I believe said
And the many voices it has... Pretty creepy ngl
They are not smoke but souls who suffered for billions of years its the last 5th race that that existed 9 years ago
The witness is not a him lol it’s a collective being
"Thus began the Witness' pursuit. It's campaign to impose meaning on a meaningless universe."
The Witness did all this for an edgey philosophy question. 😂
The witness attended one lecture about existentialism and they made it their whole personality.
Calus did mock the Witness about this. Let's just say it ended with Calus giving "infinite apologies"
@@rithvikmuthyalapati9754 Funnily enough, lore context of the Nightmares raid means it's more likely that Nezarec was interrogating Calus, hazing him basically while taking the form of the Witness.
Don’t underestimate the relevancy of questions like this after you reach a state of having literally everything you can desire
The question for meaning will literally rip you apart
@@thisisabackupemail2264 Why do people keep thinking that Nez was using the form of the Witness? What part of the raid lore says this?
So this basically confirms the the winnower is not an entity merely an ideology
Well basically they became the Winnower themselves, since they saw the lack of one, since they considered the Traveler as a Gardener.
But what is the Winnower exists? That would explain the Traveler being basically digged into that planet. That also explains the flower game and how the Traveler was weak from the begining.
No it's both, at first they said they needed a winnower so they searched for one; leading them to the veil
And using the darkness they discovered within the veil, they became the winnower
The witness people called it “the gardener” just like how we called it “the traveler” or how the Eliksni called it “the great machine”, its not unprecedented for the witness to lie for its own gain
This cutscene reframes the story of the gardener and the winnower from a “documentation from beginning of the universe” to a tool for propaganda
One very important thing to note is that in the beginning who im assuming is Ahsa from the new seasonal stuff, tells us the story of “The witnesses first victims” and midway through the viewpoint switches from 3rd to 1st person saying that all those victims became the witness and started his pursuit. So does this mean that witness did all this to himself.
I assume the Witness' first victims were the ones who had the Veil
@@Spider-Cop99 the ones who had the veil turned into the witness
It almost sounds like savathun too tbh. But I assume this is end of season lore. Or mid season like with Rasputin and the abhorrent imperative.
So now we finally got the answers we needed from Lightfall. Cant wait for new lights who join be completely confused cause the seasons and cut scene is gone.
2:49 me trying to fall asleep on top of my blankets when the room is too hot:
Rewatching this cutscene again kinda explains why “bravery, devotion, sacrifice” is needed for the traveler to “bless” you, because the Witness & their people were narcissistic and greedy, the traveler helped their kind only for it to turn on it at the end. I see why the Traveler picks and chooses
Yeah this cutscene honestly made me not really like the Witness as a villain. Idk they’re just a spoiled group of people that took they’re come up for granted. They’re not even The Darkness so it’s like.. hmm I’m more interested in stopping what they communed with dealing with the Veil.
@@wholelotta2804dog the witness is as much the dark as the traveller is the light
@@bearitin7563 Nah you’re wrong. The Veil is as much as the darkness as The Traveler is the light. The Witness is just a merged group of people because of what they communed with in or near the Veil. Xur even said the Veil is like a mirror of the Traveler. The Witness is a spoiled collective who wants they’re own way. It simply was blessed by the light and now wears the Darkness as a cloak. Witness is more like the Speaker if he dabbled in Darkness. My thing is.. we probably will end up finding out that the Darkness is the grim reaper force which keeps balance. The Witness has just been using it completely wrong so we have to take him/she/they/it down lol. Part of what I’m thinking is that The Traveler & Veil are basically a type of Heaven & Hell, both hold 2 completely different things. That’s why Ghost told us not to fall in. But it’s just what I’m thinking I’m probably wrongg but we’ll see.
God damn we needed this cutscene during Lightfall campaign so badly
THIS is what we should've had in Lightfall. We should've been shown this cutscene in Lightfall and probably the biggest complaint of the campaign would've been negated.
Why does everyone have to revert back to hating on Lightfall can't we all just watch a cutscene and say "damn that was fucking cool" instead of finding ways to shit on everything at every chance we get?
@@curtiscrosley2574 It's more like we think this is so good, that we got no clue why they didn't just put it at the end of the story, because it
would've made this cutscene and the story an even better experience.
@@curtiscrosley2574 because the dlc was hot ass through and through. They literally chopped up the dlc and spread across the 3 seasons.
I wonder if this cutscene is going to stay after The FInal Shape drops or it will be gone with other seasonal content?
@@curtiscrosley2574 holding a dev accountable for withholding content from us is too important to stay quiet
This one scene could have literally changed the way the community felt about Lightfall entirely but instead they just were like “nah, I want to be abused a little”
So the pyramid ship and the witness is from an extremely advanced civilization hmmm
@@zenavor explains why my bro is over 6ft
And all of them fueled by pure hatred against the traveler
@@jaredf.6532 the witness is more like 600 ft, have you *seen* the concept art of calus next to it?
@@Ahnock let me repeat what I said "explains why my bro is over 6ft"
@@zenavor damn witness might be able to do my homework
I feel like this is so different thematically than what the original lore about the darkness was...
This in no way ruins the game for me. It actually gets me more excited to see what’s next. Whoever leaked it thank you because I was losing hope with this game lol
Agreed. This gives me a tiny glimmer (heh) of hope for 2024's "The Final Shape" if Bungie can clean up their act.
@@allthenamesiwantedweretaken doubtful, all the good people left to work on Marathon
@@NoraInu__u do realize marathon is not a story game. It's just pvp they don't need story people for a pvp game
@@FunkyTurkeyRabbit6135 i know it's a pvp game, that doesn't take away from the fact that the people who actually know how to work on a game and keep monkeys interested for a whole year on destiny left to work on Marathon. Lightfall is a terrible expansion compared what we got last year
@@allthenamesiwantedweretaken Bro is setting himself up for another disappointment of a sub par 4 hour long campaign and endless grind
I knew it. When Savathun said “a being with a thousand names and answers to only one” she was speaking literally. Because it speaks as if 1000 voices spoke and is filled with so much rage as if it’s 1000 beings rage and pain.
Honestly this is kinda scary the voice talking in the cutscene and uhh is the witness made of millions of dead bodies/people and that’s why he looks the way he does and with the heads coming out of the smoke on his head
That voice is the Leviathan
not to be one of those people but it’s safe to say They/Them when referring to the Witness, not because I’m some fanatic LGBTQIAFGLKOIDNDLAKSCNC+ activist, but because it gives the Witness more character, and uniqueness. It quite literally is a bunch of souls conjoined in one.
@@hahaxdd313 your right. The Witness is just a conjoinment of their whole population.
@hahaxdd313 "not to be that person"
*is that person*
@Soviet Punk lmao “I don’t wanna accidentally come across like a good person, but“ 😂
So the witness is basically destiny’s answer to the emperor of mankind
Extremely interesting. So the Witness took some artistic liberty when they wrote that story with the flower game. They are not a primordial force shaping reality with the Gardener , but an entity trying to achieve godhood and recreate reality in their own image. Maybe the flower game takes place inside the Traveller? Like a forge for the universe. When they first tried to create their ideal universe the Gardener/Traveller rejected them and fled.
Maybe the Witness fabricated this story to seem more formidable or inevitable and maybe even noble. As they seem to have no problems lying and manipulating to achieve their goals. And now the Witness is in the process of rewriting the universe…
This isn’t the witness speaking, this is Ahsa the leviathan on titan, who is an enemy of the witness and would more than likely have no reason to lie to us if the witness is fully evil
I believe the Winnower isn't the Witness, Because else the Traveler wouldn't yet be so weak. The Winnower is something else, the thing that made the Traveler into this dormant state
@@elbrachoxddd5883 The Winnower doesnt exist. The Witness's people wanted someone to give them purpose and make sense of the senseless Universe for them, but when they were denied it by the Traveler they decided they would become it instead.
The Witness is trying to BECOME the Winnower. Thats the Final Shape.
@@eduardojuliolasso9344 But then why IS the Traveler there, and what do the flower game cards mean?
@@elbrachoxddd5883 I think it’s there just because it is. Like I think the question itself of “what is the traveler? Why is the traveler” is the same exact question the witnesses species had. truth is there is no good answer. It’s just a god like being and another strange aspect of a strange universe it resides in. And that question with no answer drove the species to madness and left to cope and create a false narrative. Tbh I don’t know if it’s intentional or not but it’s a good reflection of the player base always asking what the traveler is. That’s atleast my interpretation
Damn what makes this even scarier, is it validates the Witness belief. He was born of an entire civilization killing themselves in order to make one perfect being. The Witness... Damn.
I believe this cutscene will play when we are finally able to communicate with Ahsa and this is Ahsa narrating the cutscene
This is the best take I've heard yet! Considering their species gave rise to the worm gods means they've been around a VERY long time so she's probably seen some things.
... okay, that actually makes insane amounts of sense.
This sounds like Sloane. I don't think Ahsa will actually speak, just use Sloane as a puppet. Although worms can speak..
@@12undeadleader Yeah after playing the missions, I realize that Ahsa is speaking through Sloane through psychic connection strengthened by Egregoric corals and golden age tech
Well, you were correct haha
It answers what the veil is! Basically the traveller is the only god in the universe. The darkness was born from the veil. The veil when connected to the traveler opens a portal to a reality full of darkness. They then took this power from that reality and brought it back which is the darkness. The traveller then fled their civilisation when it realised they were abusing its power of light. The witness is called the witness because it witnessed the reality of darkness and they want to go back there
@@McSpicyYT Well I mean we don’t really know what the Traveler is either, how it came to be, if light and dark existed before space and time itself, does that mean the Traveler is the light and the Veil the Darkness? Or is the Traveler just still the embodiment of it and not the light itself.
No darkness always existed. But the witness like you said witness darkness and light together. The witness didn’t create to worms of fundament. It didn’t create strand, it all existee
No it doesn't answer what the veil is at all
Wtf???? It doesn't answer what the veil is at all. Where do you get that? All it says is the veil, the traveler and the darkness are all connected and like yeah no shit. This story just adds a shit load of plot holes to the already existing one and I'm sorta done with destiny lore. It's nonsensical and that's coming from someone who ENJOYS Warhammer 40k lore.
bro watched a different video
We are the witness. Well close to it. We developed TOO FAST and now we seek meaning.
Some find meaning in wealth, some in pleasure and joy, some in vengeange. Whatever the case we are completely willing to destroy everything for that meaning.
Destroy anything and everything for that meaning, even ourselves. Thus, the creation of The Witness.
Outstanding observation.
@@allthenamesiwantedweretaken Thanks bro i don't get many compliments.
Yes and we will be the Withness! As the traveler(gardener) will leave again, our guardian's souls are going to build the Withness! So this is just a " History repeats itself" game , our destiny! :)
yeah goddamn i didnt put that together but it makes me enjoy the witness a little more
I respect the witness, the man is just trying to solve the riddle of the universe. His answer was triangles.
Man this really just became a huge plot twist or something like holy shit im shocked and view things differently now
I love that years of lore is getting undone because Bungie's writers have no idea what to do without Seth😃
Who's Seth?
@@phoenix9531 He's Seth Dickinson. He wrote most of the best lore. The Books of Sorrow, Unveiling, Marasenna. And he layed the foundations for what the Darkness would be in Destiny. Even though he was such a great writer Bungie never hired him for some reason so he only worked contracts and eventually got hired by the Subnautica team. So his absence has been pretty apparent in the last few years because the writers are going in a completely different direction than what Seth had built up.
@@OhYeah_No wonder I liked subnatica
The parallels between Destiny lore, universal laws, the Kybalion, & Religious texts are fascinating
This is the Anti-Spiral. Literally everything about this is just the Anti-Spiral.
The witness: I am the strongest being in the universe
My 50cal anti-tank sniper rifle:
To theorise then, i would suppose the 'final shape' is in essence the witness trying to bond with, and assume control over, the travellers functions of the physical realm. If the witness desires nothingness, then it likely seeks to use the travellers power to create life to effectively undo everything, destroy the fabric of reality by erasing gracity, life, etc, the domains controlled by the gardener.
This reads like 9yo nonsense lol
@@Scrungge Well I'm not trying to convince anyone :)
THIS IS FANTASTIC I LOVE THE PHILOSOPHY BEHIND THIS
So the witness is the amalgamation of it's entire origin species? That is actually pretty damn metal!
And if you think about it... the faces in the smoke coming out from The Witness's head is every soul that was merged into The Witness.
The voice sounds like Asha speaking through Sloane. I think this a cut scene we’re getting this season
The Idea that somehow the Traveler was in the Witness' planet, seemingly buried in there, somewhat explains what Nezarec said before, specifically the one about "its oldest victims". Maybe the Witness's species was the first to ever be gifted the light by the Traveler. Which then brings up the next question, does that mean the Traveler was formed in their planet or was the gardener just happened to be dormant in their planet?
They predicted the Traveller would cause ruin. But they just became the ruin that was predicted. Self fulfilling prophecy i guess? I don't know. Just seems like a really big smooth brain moment on their end.
Exactly, dumba$$ Witness
But it was their hopes and wishes that created the Traveller/Gardener. I would argue the witness believes they own the Traveller.
What is interesting from this cutscene is that the Travel is portrayed as a careless builder. All the civilizations it uplifted ended in ruin. The connection they sought is quite literal given the fact that they wanted to go inside the traveler.
Awesome cutscene.... I'm guessing we get this from the end of the veil related missions they were talking about. The only way hearing this voice makes sense is having us go back to the veil to interact with it? Initially thought this would be coming from the last week or two of this season from the being on Titan, but they seem more focused on Xivu. Either way though, I think this is all we are getting until Final Shape
The voice is the leviathan ahsa so yes it will be on titan in the seasonal story, either at the end of it or in the middle when we can hear it’s thoughts clearly
There is one more season before final shape
@@MICROKNIGHT3000 2 more.
So basically they are another species who got butt hurt by the traveler when he left because they didnt just accept the gifts and tried to make the traveler do their bidding.
This as a lore buff might be the most important cutscene in recent memory, the fact that the Witness is a whole race who did a fusion dance makes it more terrifying than what i originally thought, more information about the Veil is good seeming as the Lightfall campaign told us nothing, the fact that the name the gardener was used by this race and they created the pyramid ships and in turn all of the resonant energy is super interesting. I'm so ready to learn more about this supposed name of this race. Because apart from them basically becoming the witness they never state a name for it. Not to mention the fact that the Witnesses theme used here sounds more and more idk how to describe it, triumphant ig is very cool
I wonder if after defeating it, the Witness will break into many many shadowy entities and this will be a new enemy race. Like you know, those things from the old concept art.
I have a strong feeling we won't even win 😐😐
So far we have been struggling to stand a chance against the witness's power, one flick of his hand destroyed a fleet... Even with cayde's return and most likely every other guardian that lost their life in battle that has been living inside the traveler! Since we have been the heroes of our people all along... And we barely managed to stand against the fleet!
Yes we will run through every force the witness will throw at us, question is... Will we manage to go through it?
this explains why the witness always says "we" instead of "I"
Absolutely no reason Bungie couldn't have just put this in Lightfall.
When your ghost got linked to the Witness it's memories could have leaked into our own which gave us the revelation as to why the Veil is so important, and therefore give us motivation to find as many allies as possible to confront the Witness
Despite all the discussion about the Traveler, The Witness, The Veil and The Final Shape, and we still don't know anything about the Traveler itself or its true name/origin.
A leaked cutscene explained more about the veil than Lightfall ever did.
So...the Witness is the anti spirals from Gurren Lagann combined with the Reapers from Mass Effect.
Yes
So by what I saw the witness is essentially the embodiment of everyone from the first civilization that worshipped the traveler
Yep. And since noone hunted the Traveller yet, their Golden Age lasted a *lot* longer than for other species
In comparison, humanities golden age only lasted for 200 years...if you think about it, since the travelers appearance extended the span of human life, there where humans who saw the three cosmonauts land on mars, lived through the golden age and probably saw the collapse happen
so you're telling me this super advanced civilization had the veil for billions of years, but then savathun yoinked it from them and dipped
What ?
The Witness must've been PISSED that same evening.
Well she pretended to be on their side so it makes sense
@@Langrange- holy shit yeah the witness must have been fucking *SEETHING* lmao
I guess when you've had it for billions of years you get kinda complacent.
Traveler Traveled. The Witness witnessed it. The Guardians now Guard it. The veil is as obsuce as ever.
Truly sophisticated writing and plot
Thank you Witness, I understand your intent now.
But have you considered 20 Gjallarhorns to the face?
Well this explains all those heads coming out of that white stream from the witnesses head
This extremely ancient civilization merge into one being and became a collective consciousness of knowledge with a single purpose....😮
There was more story in that cutscene than the entire Lightfall expansion.
20 bucks says Destiny ends like Game of Thrones. I've paid my ticket and I've abandoned the ride, I hope you find what your looking for.
Wow super cool story, would be cool if it was included in the DLC that was supposed to answer questions we've been asking ever since D1.
100%. Instead we got they them cringe surfer
It’s not how this story goes. Lightfall was supposed to be mysterious. Lightfall was a race, we had to get to The Veil before Calus could, we don’t know why The Witness wants it, just that it does, and that’s enough for us to try to stop it. Yet, The Witness fooled us and achieved it goal, now we lost and are in the calm before the storm. We’re now plotting out next move, so now we’re learning more about The Veil in hopes we’ll learn something that gives us an edge. The Destiny Seasonal stories always had set up for the bigger expansions. Lightfall and Final Shape are practically a two-parter, Lightfall was the opener, the Lightfall Seasons provide more info and set up more story, and Final Shape is the grande finale of all Destiny. I feel sorry that you can’t comprehend how the story is being told. I also don’t know where it was said that Lightfall would answer long awaited Destiny questions.
@@captainblorgus2515 agreed. but the campaign itself was kinda boring ngl think its what killed most of the hype.
@@captainblorgus2515 I think it's the expectation but people in general don't understand how storytelling works, this is why you have people that expect things as "ohh next season is going to be Siva" like they think seasons are like their own separate stories that aren't connected in any way with the main lore. I would agree that the campaign felt lacking in terms of that it felt more like Strand tutorial more than anything but it's obvious that there is a reason why they aren't delving too much into Veil stuff cuz it was probably something for a future season (this season) so talking about it would've been massive spoilers. Same thing with the Nine, there is a reason it's being kept in the shadows, they're mentioned every now and then but so far they have remained behind the curtain for years. Even on this season Zavala is like asking The Drifter "dude wtf is going on with the Nine? whats the whole point of Gambit and stuff?" and he's like "the Nine work in mysterious ways brother". Now that it's revealed most of what The Witness is, what it wants, for example now we know that what it said in the "Unveiling" lore book, it's not the story of how the Universe began objectively, it's a myth from his people, it's The Witness' race "creation myth" basically, it's a story. So I was thinking, what if the Nine are the equivalent to the Witness but in the Human race? What if after what happened during the collapse, they got trapped into a Darkness dimension and they're just trying to escape or manipulate things from their Darkness "universe" in a way? Remember that the "Prophecy" dungeon is supposed to be the "answer" of the Nine to the question: "what is the darkness" or "what is the nature of darkness?", why would the Nine know what the Darkness is? There is a reason they got teased today during the starting quest of Season of the Deep. What if the Nine are like Darkness entities similar to how the Traveler is to the Light? With this cinematic it's obvious that the Witness isn't some kind of Darkness god, it's not the equivalent of the Traveler at all, so what if the Nine are?
@@captainblorgus2515 the issue was that other people knew what the Veil was but didn’t tell us. It would even make sense to hear it in the convos between Witness and Calus.
Thumbnail needed a double take, I kept seeing Peter Griffin's death pose
This reminds of an anime I’ve seen before where the main villain race discovers a great power then realizes said power could end all existence, then wipes off any known races that have been using said power.
As well as a whole plant fusing consciousness into one being…
gurren lagann is the anime I’m speaking about ^^
Honestly, this would be us too if we were ever to encounter a being that uplifted all of humanity collectively. Like people already have a penchant for trying to find meaning in the day to day, imagine you’re now able to live indefinitely to the point where you’ve probably exhausted all pleasures and venues of interest, mix that with religious zealotry, and you’ve got the recipe for some intergalactic Jonestown singularity of an organism called The Witness.
So we're back to where we should have been the entire time. The witness is not the Darkness, never has been, and the Gardener and Winnower are still inviolate as to the beginning of the universe.
Exactly which kinda makes the Witness a good filler but filler indeed.
This just in: Bungie explains the entire franchise in under 4 minutes
Have they ever wondered why the big floating ball was staying away from "the veil" for eons?
The Witness is a manifest of all that a people are and the wish/mission, its salvation. It is an ascended being, a collective of conscious. None of them, yet all of them at the same time. From a civilization that's older than Earth or Sol itself to a single personification of desire and purpose. The evolution of commitment itself.
It’s not really a personification of these things/ideas, it’s just beings that chose to express those things as a hive mind, the will didn’t come before the race of beings but the other way around
This one cutscene further proves that the worst thing to happen to destiny is the seasonal model.
I thought the Pyramids were the blades created by the Winnower when he fought the Gardener during their flower game. This whole Veil/Witness thing feels like it's shoehorned in.
Yup they ruined the lore. The winnower and the flower game. Gone and/or retconned.
@@CJWII Inspiral implied the Flower Game never actually happened, and reveals that the darkness isn’t sentient. All of that was made up by the Witness.
I am disappointed too.
wh6y is this story in one single cutscene thats wild
Anyone else notice this is just the story of the anti spiral from gurren lagann
For me, this also finally makes the design of The Witness make SENSE. I could never put my figure out why I didn't like the look of the Witness, but I think it was due to it feeling so out of place as a character in the Destiny universe. Why we didn't get any of this in Lightfall is beyond me, but at least we have it now I guess.
"we have god emperor of dune at home"
😂😂
Talk about the more you'd screw around the more you're gonna find out. The Witness is just a collaboration of people who wanted to find out, so they just... made a body out of bodies apparently
Pretty sure this fully solidifies that The Traveler is The Gardener itself. Granted gifts but no guidance, power to break the laws of reality but no instructions on how to do so. Ran as soon as they tried to control it and kept running, growing the garden while The Winnower/Witness cut it down behind it.
Love how people care about story all of a sudden when Destiny 1 had almost nothing but grimoire lore that required the website to even see. My Name Is Byf literally made a living off that.
Be grateful.
What disappoints me the most is how the darkness has been downgraded. It used to be a dark part of the objective and primal laws of reality, the truth, that existence means the fight for existence and that means survival of the fittest. In a way, it was a realization that can be applied to real life just the same, and I was intrigued what kind of philosophical answer they would give to combat this. Whatever light makes, ontologically, necessarily fights against each other. Like Toland revealed in ghost fragment darkness 3. Then the winnover seemed to be a godly personification of that fact, importantly one prior to existence and the universe itself. Now darkness is some force within the universe and the witness is just a being within the universe. The light, just like real life, isn't purely good and although they acknowledge this, they've added the darkness-force as a counterpart that really isn't different at all. They're both energies instead of the darkness being nothingness, and its whole aspect of psychology and memory opens a different philosophical problem entirely about the nature of consciousness. If the witness as what it is, is defeated after final shape, the cruel reality of life will still exist. This cutscene seems to imply the moral of the story will be to accept "meaninglessness" in life and shape your own destiny. But the cruel survival of the strongest truth isnt adressed. I loved the original destiny lore because it seemed to be a story questioning the limits of reality and existence themselves, instead of taking it for granted and just asking questions within that structure.
So The Witness is like the Anti-Spiral? Or am I remembering this wrong?
We need a bigger drill.
Nope, your on point
so there is no being of light or dark. im guessing the vail and the traveler are just physical manifestation's of light and dark.
yep seems like this is the case. Although you could make the argument that the Traveler is the being of Light, as it exercises some form of consciousness and emotion.
The Traveler would be considered a being of light. But "The Dark" is just the knowledge they gained from studying The Veil. And it looks like The Veil is just another concentration of paracausel energy with ties to The Traveler.
@@McSpicyYT We don’t even know why the traveler exists either or how it came to be, since it’s always been considered a machine too.
The lore video seems to imply that the Traveller was manifested by this races collective hope. It seems to even rise out of the ground as if being born of the planet, as opposed to coming from the stars like it would every other race who’s planet it inhabited.
@Manerum "I want to be spoon fed the story so that I know everything in the universe while playing a character that could quite literally have been born yesterday"
Bungie has watched gurren laggan too many times
I'm just happy to see that there were so many people that were as confused as I was. I started playing again right after Light fall was released and I was LOST. This video cleared it all up.
I really can’t help but feel that this muddies existing lore considerably.
how so?
I'm here to find out what shark fact means
@@stelonous
It shifts the dynamics of who the bad guy is. The majority of the time, the antagonist of the game was "The Darkness", but over recent patches and expansions, this role was shifted to the Witness and the darkness is not this amoral thing. It feels like the game changed who the bad guys were and tries to contextualize past events by introducing new lore.