D2R - Were Terror Zones A Good Idea? (2 Years Later)
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- Опубліковано 12 чер 2024
- Hello Guys and Gals Today we ask the question, Were Terror Zones A Good Idea? (2 Years Later)
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I like them. Makes getting to 99 feasible, sent us to different zones since they won't give us content. It's a nice, simple touch
TZs were a great addition, 100%.
I'm old...I played D2 when it first came out. I don't have endless time or space in my life for online play anymore, and play D2R offline only, so I appreciate anything that enriches the experience and makes it realistic to actually find loot. I agree that the cap on TZs should be raised.
At this point, my only remaining wishlist items are:
1) Stackable gems and runes in shared stash, FFS
2) Elite versions of shields/weapons with more sockets, to take advantage of the nice visual models... I AM SO SICK OF MONARCH on many builds, just to get Spirit, Phoenix, etc. Yes, I can edit in Hero Editor for offline solo play, but still... Druids look weird with metal shields from the 100 Years War.
3) Act V mercs that can use axes/maces...I think we already have visual models for this from Act V NPC mercs, so make it happen, damnit.
4) Fine tune Act III mercs to have more use cases...they've already made a lot of progress... just a bit further, and I'll be happy.
5) Phase blades that look like something that should be called a "phase blade"...ok, now this one I know involves more serious development, graphics, rebalancing, etc. I realize they're pushing D4 (I played beta, got early access, and honestly haven't bothered to go back...not interested), and this likely won't happen. Still, phase blades as currently implemented irritate me personally. Unlike any other item base in the game that I can think of, they have a SHARP discontinuity in their characteristics when going from Normal->Nightmare->Hell. Consider that other weapons merely have appropriate jumps in damage, and incremental (at most) changes in speed, reach and - possibly - sockets. Contrast that to PBs, which unlike their normal/nightmare analogs are both indestructible AND the fastest weapons in-game. ON TOP OF THAT, Grief RW is super-dominant, attack speed is core to most melee builds, AND the rate of durability loss in fast-attacking weapons so high, that most other weapons are nonviable. I'm sick of being pressured into the ONLY indestructible, -30 speed weapon, which just so happens to look like a goofy "crystal sword". Make badass blades (and axes, maces, etc) competitive. If phase blades are still OP, then at least make a Lightsabre that looks like, well...a lightsaber and not a crystal sword...that's something that even D3 got right. Azurewrath should have a super cool unique model. Right now, we just have a huge missed opportunity to use all the great visual models that D2R gave us, so I wish they'd make other weapons more viable AND make phase blades less goofy.
6) Finally, and my biggest ask... rebalance uniques, at least the high-TC ones. "Make Uniques Great Again". Runewords have just power-crept too far, and Uniques have unique models, and I like using them. Obviously some are BIS, but there are so many that are just outclassed. I'd like to get to a place where elite/hell-level uniques are much more often side-grades rather than clear downgrades. Tyrael's might should be....mighty!
I would think #1, 2 & 3 would be doable for the currently-scoped dev team. 4, 5 & 6 would be stretch goals, but ones for which I would be willing to pay for new DLC.
My 2 cents from a crusty old dad, who happens to still love D2.
Good vid as always.
It was more like 2000 cents man....
I love your intro music.
The sound is from StarCraft 2 when Protos mothership spawns
Interesting 🤔
TZ's added so much variety to the game that you can't really complain.
a crap TZ spawns? oh well you still have pindle, shenk, eldritch and all area 85's you farmed before.
TZs were a good addition to the game imo. People had long complained that their build (cough cold sorcs) was constrained to one area that they had to spam over and over and TZs fixed that. Even without the introduction to Sunders it radically increased the number of farming spots for most builds and in some ways increased the viability of non-meta builds (ie Fire) in the same way as the expansion of the aLVL 85 areas prior. additionally the TZ exp formula changed the way that players interacted with levels 91+ and helped smooth out the leveling difficulty in that section of the game. Never before TZs did we see as many seasonal 99s.
That being said I think there were several problems with the system:
First and foremost the pool is too dilute, IE at present the TZ is picked randomly from a list of 36 options on an even distribution. that means that if your build excels at one area lets say cows, at most you are going to hit a cow TZ once ever 36h. Realistically speaking however this would often happen when you were offline (work, school, sleep) and you practically would play for days without ever seeing your top TZ. Blizzard acknowledged this shortcoming with the Winter Terror event and changed the TZs on offer to the more productive zones, however failed to change the base list. Personally I would like to see the total number of options reduced to 24 (once per day) or less, or alternatively to have a weighted distribution where the "S tier" zones have a higher probability of rolling each time the TZs switch. Alternatively or perhaps in addition to this change the monster density in several zones (ie crypt and maus) could be adjusted even if its just for TZs. as stated in the video people just don't want to go because the spawn rate is so low.
Secondarily, and perhaps related, no concern was given to logical progression of player pathing trough the zones to do each TZ. like you said at 15:20 on the video there is literally 0 reason that Stony Field, Tristram and Cows shouldn't be one TZ as each cow run requires the player to be in all 3. the same is true for Black Marsh into Tower, Cold Plains into Crypy/Mauz, Tamoe into Pit etc and that is only Act 1. It wasn't until TZ version 2 that we got the different "hole" mini-dungeons added to the TZ and imo that level of area-grouping could really fix several of the sub-par TZs, and open up farming options within each TZ for different build types. Likewise by combining some of the areas that make up different TZs we would move towards the goal of making the TZ pool less dilute fixing the first problem.
Lastly I'm not sold on the idea of picking 2 TC87s at clvl 91+ but it did push more TC87 gear (notably DF, DW, Grifs) into circulation reducing the cost of some builds; I would call this a neutral point. Personally I would rather have a slightly higher pick-rate of the "Good TC" (IE make every mob drop runes more like Cows do) as most of the endgame is tied up in High Runes not high TC gear.
I think they were a great addition. Since the removal of the high experience cow level, it was getting extremely tedious to level up past the mid-90S level.
TZ's helped save D2 for me. so so tired of running cows or just bosses. plus terrorized Cathedrals and some others are so much fun.
Terror zones really save the day for casuals. Getting a Bul-Kathos from nightmare Andariel and other gear that helped ease the way into hell difficulty made it so there was clear way to progress in the game.
Heh, just did a nightmare terror zone in ancient's way and got a Shako. First ever!
I love the TZ's. The first character I made in D2R is over 60% of the way through lvl 98 and slowly making her way to 99 in single player mode. She's found some very rare uniques, but aside from Windforce they haven't been helpful lol. The Griffon's I found was ethereal too : /
Going through and killing stuff even on players 8 when a place isn't terrorized at level 98 is kind of a shock tbh, and I don't know how people didn't say the heck with it after taking so long to get so little even at max efficiency.
But even terror zones aren't going to get me to go to the great marsh unless it's to open a chest or hit a well/shrine just outside of the Flayer TZ I'm farming. That place might as well be telling me to go do something else for a while.
Nevermind all that, 3seasons no update :)
I really like getting my merc higher level in Nightmare before jumping into Hell. I found that until the merc gets decent resistances, he'll get one shot by anything in Hell.
I liked every change until mosaic showed up. It screwed up all the work devs made on balancing the game.
True mosaic ist garbage. Males any otjer claw useless. They should have just boost the abilitys..
Why though ? Elemental martial arts wasn't super played aside from Phoenix strike, which I guess is what they were for, but it's true that you can get a super high 3 charge Tiger Strike then spam double claws or something. I tested it with the attack speed calculator : the max attack speed for claws is 3.33 attacks per second and the best you can go is 4 attacks per second unarmed. Charges were a bit bogus from the start because the skill damage really means X damage per over a second (for full charge) which means the dps isn't as great as it looks. (except tiger strike, that skill is broken)
I guess it breaks the assassin's design more than the game itself
@@NoName-md6fd yes it breaks an assasin and it breaks the game. You want to be efficient in ladder? You are FORCED to play this build.
It overpoweres every other build massively.
Funniest thing. I never played it. Yesterday I started martial arts assasin on hardcore. It was crushing through act 1 normal. Lets see what will be further but I started thinking that this character doesnt even need mosaic to be good.
@@catthebutcher9438 Gonna take your word for it, I don't play ladder, I play solo self found in a relaxing fashion now.
But you know, to put it into perspective. What claws runeword did sin had previously ? Fury and Chaos ? Who would do wind anyway ? Meanwhile the pally gets 4 socket shields before anybody else, grief and exile. Shouldn't we rejoice that sin finally got a broken runeword ? I kind of see it that way.
@@NoName-md6fd grief isnt that broken. Other weapons are weak.
I didnt say that im ok with pally shiels either. It is also too strong. But mosaic goes 10 times over the limit it is absurd
2 years?? It feels like d2r has only been around for a year or so lol. Time goes by too fast
Ive personally popped a Sur in lvl 71 nm den of evil. Nm tz is very nice on hc
I don't think I'd still be jumping in to play the game every now and then if they weren't a thing. There's only so many times I can run Pit or Ancient Tunnels until I'm completely bored. Would love to see some further updates to them, or just newer end game things in general, but who knows if that'll ever happen at this point.
Where can I find more up to date info on TZs effects on boss drops? Just coming back to D2R since season 1.
Getting to 99 solo in a reasonable amount of time is now possible with Tz's .. big win
Agree with all your points, I have level 97 tesladin non ladder, he is my highest.
Single player HC here. TZ is 100% worth it! Now I can farm in a lot more zones and get high level items and experience at the same time. Have never been a fan of rushing to 99 lv. In HC if you rush you probably will die. Even with TZ the time to raise a new char to a high level is still quite a bit. The last time I was calculating that if I do only good exp TZ zones at P8 like chaos sanctuary it will take me 30 hours to get from 98 to 99. That is still a lot of time but if I fight P8 non TZ chaos sanctuary that would have taken more then 240 hours.... If you are playing HC it is probably not a good idea to start farming TZ before you get really well equipped not only because the monsters are stronger but also enemy auras like conviction/might/fanatism can really hurt as they are buffed as well.
Tz are great. Just a good example of fresh ideas and love for the game. I wish they still had this instead of all hands on deck for d4.
I think they were a good addition. I've found some items I was starting to believe didn't even exist. I still don't see a lot of them, so they're not dropping all the time. And I've been surprised and gotten my butt handed to me when I didn't expect them to be so strong.
I play them all the time and think they are an excellent addition to the game except for one thing: Gheed's charm seems to never drop, probably they made it that way to have Sunder charms be the focus on the terrorized activity.
Its been a great addition to the game gives u different areas to farm that u wouldnt ever go before. It does have its cons tho bots benefit greatly from the zones for the loot
I wish TZs were more available, like 1 per act, that way I could stay in game longer
i dont think its the levelling process that ppl are adressing, its the sundering charms removing the need for a mercenary. my barb doesnt even have to think twice before spinning through any kind of elite monster pack.. because he's sundering their physical immunity and gaining life from the dmg dealt.. only reason he's not max level is because im practically only using him for travincal.. sorcs are even worse because of the nova ES build removing the need for resistances and sundering lightning immunity with no repercussions.. granted it does take a little grinding to get to that point but its not really a big deal.. i feel like they also increased drop rates for runes across the board, even outside of terrorzones..
They definitely need to be higher lv like you said. They need to create another tz like mechanic that exists alongside tzs, that turns a cluster of zones into p8 highest lv. So we dont need to raid peoples baal run games anymore
Man how many Doom Knights have I killed...
lol sad, sad realization huh
@@GGMentor When you mentioned it, I realized I never had any insane drops from them... also interesting how Elites and Champion packs of Doom Knights typically spawn as Oblivion Knights instead. It kind of makes sense based on how easy Doom Knights are to kill compared to other A4 monsters... they just walk at you slowly and then die usually.
I would still like to see more new stuff or fix some of the old bad runewords and unique. Although mosaic us busted. It's not necessary to play with it. And it can still be patched to cap maybe 3 skills.
As a consistent player since launch of D2 vanilla in 2000, these are the few changes that I'd like to see:
1. Re-design the useless uniques and sets stats to better reflect their degree of rarity
2. Remove the excessive dependency on Enigma by introducing more options to get +1 to Teleport (e.g. Tyrael's Might and Class specific sets complete bonus)
3. Re-work underused skills to unlock more viable build options, for example:
* Barbarian Leap Attack AoE damage based on weapon dmg and Leap increases physical damage taken by monsters in the radius, and the two skills synergize each other
* Add AoE damage to Paladin Vengeance similar to Assassin elemental finishing moves
* Paladin Conversion lasts indefinitely like summon skills and converted monsters gain damage bonus (this would let you make a viable summon Paladin build)
* Buff Javazon poison skills
* Buff Necro Bone magic skills to compete with Poison or Summon builds
* Buff Druid summon skills
* Buff Druid's Arctic Blast and Sorceress Inferno skills to be viable
* Introduce more cleave/AoE damage mechanics to melee builds overall, as they are severely outclassed by casters in terms of clearing speed
4. Buff Act 1 and 3 mercenaries:
* Act 1 mercenaries should have improved DPS output overall
* Act 3 mercenaries should have passive Light/Cold/Fire Mastery skills
5. More sockets available on various elite item bases:
* 4 sockets available on all elite polearms to allow variation of Insight/Infinity bases
* 4 sockets available on more shields to be used as Spirit bases
6. Add new Uniques and Sets:
* There are still many elite items with no unique versions of it (e.g. Hydraskull, Giant Conch, Wyrmhide, Scarab Husk, Great Hauberk, Loricated Mail, Diamond Mail, Archon Plate, Hellforge Plate, Lacquered Plate, Heater, Hyperion, Bramble Mitts, Crusader Gauntlets, Wyrmhide Boots, Mirrored Boots, Troll Belt, Colossus Girdle, Small Crescent, Feral Axe, Spider Bow, Blade Bow, Shadow Bow, Great Bow, Diamond Bow, Pellet Bow, Gorgon Crossbow... the list goes on... Imagine the potentials)
7. Strength Requirements of some items:
* Some items have unrealistically high strength requirements (Elite shields or heavy armors) and will never be used as runeword bases. To counter this, they should buff the benefits from adding points to strength, to allow melee builds to have a reason to lean towards heavier armor for runeword bases, as opposed to casters using light armor bases with less strength requirement
I generally agree with most of this and could even add a few balancing things i think they could add as well like skeletal mages need a a significant buff if there is every going to be a viable summon necro build with skeletal mages. This is a personal thing with skeletal mages but i think it would be cool if you only summoned 1 of each element of skeletal mage but as you investigated more points into skeletal mages they upgrades the spell they cast. For Example: the fire skeletal mage would go from casting fire bolt to fire ball and maybe even hydra or meteor with enough skill points invested.
Whirlwind honestly needs to be buffed/fixed as well.
Druids should be able to cast abilities while shapeshifted which would open up a bunch of new builds for them.
Abilities like thunderstorm and frost nova on sorc could definitely use a buff. I also think a minor damage buff to frozen orb wouldn't be terrible, just something to edge it a little bit closer to blizzard in performance since blizzard out performs it pretty drastically right now.
Adjustments need to be made to mosaic and martial arts sin as well so martial arts sins can feel playable without needing to rely on a single rune word to make and entire spec function properly. Personally the way i think they should do this is by separating out the functionality of not consuming charges with the functionality of refreshing charges. I think the functionality of not consuming charges should be either tied directly to claw mastery at 5% per hard point, or tied directly to the martial art skill like Phoenix strike has a 5% chance to not consume its charges per hard point invested into the skill. They can leave the refreshing charges functionality on mosaic rune word but this also opens up not needing double mosaic for martial arts builds and allows you to use 1 mosaic claw with another claw. Also for the whole debate around if mosaic sin is too strong that can be remedied by limiting the amount of charges a martial arts sin can have active at one point in time. Just don't allow them to have all charges active all the time, this actually creates more build diversity with martial arts sins as they would need focus on 1 or two skills in the tree instead of just grabbing them all and doing all damage types all the time.
I also absolutely agree with the idea of introducing cleave/aoe damage to a bunch of the melee builds. I feel like a lot of them would be way more fun if you were not limited to killing 1 mob at a time. Talking about general melee mechanics i also think adjusting around attack rating in general would be helpful for a lot of melee builds and remove the reliance on ignore target defense/minus target defense to get hit capped. Also remove the arbitrary 95% hit cap, just allow melee builds to get to 100% hit chance.
As for mercs i think it would be interesting to open up the gear slots available to them, let them equip gloves, belts, and boots for example. It would make more gear have value in the game and it would help with their survivability without needing absolutely gg gear on them which is my biggest issue with mercs especially before late game.
Another thought i had for helping with the enigma problem is to create a low/mid range staff rune word that gives +1 to teleport but not much else, maybe a little bit of FHR and FCR. This would be a great budget option to get teleport on builds while also having significant opportunity cost as it would compete with other buffing items like CTA that are used on weapon swap and it still leaves the progression path of working towards getting an enigma so you can free up your weapon swap.
Definitely made more off meta builds viable with sunder charms. I love em personally
TZs have been a welcome addition to the game. Even the RNG nature of them make playing online "fresh." I like that you can see the next TZ on sites, because that helps you plan, and what I've found is that people will all hop on when there are good TZs. It makes meeting up pretty good. Hop on for an hour or two. Fun times.
Just alright maybe. Visual update still awesome so good on those folks/artists
YES.
Terror zones, to me, recreate the leveling experience. So I’m not just doing Baal runs and chaos runs all time
For a game they want to keep original as possible, terror zones is a baby step towards additional things to do after you beat the game. I think most people like them cause the games been the same for the passed decade.
My only complaint about TZ is about lobby games. Usually, game creator takes the TZ and asks to be left alone, forcing everyone else to go MFing in lvl 85 areas, and that kills the multiplayer aspect of the game (not that D2 ever had too much of it). I think party exp should get a small boost on TZ to motivate group playing in those (I think party in D2 currently decreases the total exp, and that is for outside of TZ as well).
Wait so is it only the doom knights that are lower level or is it the oblivion knights as well? Especially when it comes to champion Obv. Knights surrounded by Dooms?
Only the doom knights the largest quantity
@GGMentor Thanks for the reply and the clarification, bud. Didn't even know about the Doom Knight thing. Great info, as always.
Pretty sure 2022 was like 6 months ago.
You would think blood raven was an easy and quick clear. At least if you have teleport.
I don’t think it’s bad, it helps I guess 😂
can we theorycraft a pally build with Tyraels might, Hoz , Seraphims, crown of ages, Hand of Blessed Light, Tearhaunch. Lol unique based pally
I love TZs. Makes the lvl 99 grind so much more enjoyable than farming Diablo, Baal and Nithalak all the time.
How this work on offline playing, you still have TZ there ? Or this is only on Onlinne ?
Offline was given TZ's on a set schedule
tz's make some zones playable. u will never actually farm like stony field if its not tz
So question are TZ only online or they single player was wondering solo play
yes they are offline as well
I'm pro-Terror Zones 100%
Perfect for leveling and solo MF.
I do find the group lobby TZ runs a little silly because they're done so quick. Unless it's CS or WSK I usually don't join these
Both good and bad. I may want to level up a new toon, but a great tz is coming up so i want to do that on my high level.
I'm a big fan. More variety
Wild they released a tweak to the content for humor sake ONCE in 2 years....
Hey ginger dude, sweet build! Cool video
My opinion on tz is that it's a good change overall. The only thing I have a problem with is that I have limited time to play these days. When I log in and it's a bad tz, feels bad... I play HCL and some tzs are too miserable (I never really do a3 ones, too scared to die lol)
Side note: People using loaders, and especially mosaic sin make the "race" to 99 a joke. Gonna get obliterated by a mosaic sin using loaders and to a degree jsp and people trading for them.
Season 7 SCL had a sin 99 in less than 0r about 48 hours lmao. I couldn't level to 99 that fast if I was on singleplayer cherry picking best TZ with clock manipulation
I have no doubt that terror zones are a great add to the game... But it still need some adjustment.
Small terror zones suck - like Tristam - not enough monsters ...
good for farming sunders early on in ladder though, High Champ/unique monster density. Just low overal monsters. Take a horker with you and get some early sunders.
Act 3 farming is my least favorite, anything before Lower Kruast I don't touch.
Flayer is actually surprisingly good on some characters
I would say TZ make the game quicker not easier which I would say is a good for new if you're new you can level up quicker because not everybody's fan of the super grind and for the older players let's be honest there's a lot of people who probably quit Diablo 2 on the road to 99
100% TZ are good and more funny than running 24 7 bosses or 85 dungons. You see each act and a lot of zones.
Theres more cons. I host hell baal runs so people can level their new chars. But i turned tz off once because nobody was in throne. Even though the game title said baal runs. And a few people lost it and have been pk'ing and denying exp in my baal runs ever since.
They need to add a feature to block certain players from joining games. Only toggleable in lobby of course.
Terror zoners also have the "ironman" personality, from runescape. They feel entitled and wronged when you dont go out of your way to get them their exp. And that they deserve it more than you. Its so toxic.
You get more exp not less for being solo on a ball run.
If your saying the moochers can't mooch because no one is carrying them lol then oh well?
@@GGMentor i know theres an increase in exp but only if youre in the same area. The reason I dont click tz anymore is because i can solo baal and his minions, whereas before I needed help. And with 8 players its tough to get through 2nd wave as hdin if 6 of them are in tombs running tz.
They are still toxic to me and grief even though i dont host tz anymore.
My point is there is a few more cons, thats it.
Edit: sorry i thought you were telling me what tz does. I know i would get more exp to myself, the problem was i couldnt beat wave 2 with even a few people not helping out.
i am bored with same music and same fiery shade overlay in every tz ...
u can have tz in hell even at lvl 1. u can complete baal quest hell on lvl 1. im surprised u not do this.
That requires you to be Grushed, by someone else who has already completed hell.
@@GGMentor yep absolutely u need friend and fing someone in open game who need rush. In beggining of season not possible first day at least. Anyway i not doing this anymore. doing this back in the days only because of lazurk quest
They just need to make PD2 with D2R graphics.
the hacker stuff in alpha made that impossible. Won't ever happen honestly.
@@GGMentor But honestly you would be satisfied to introduce the changes that are in Pd2?stack gems, loot filter, maps honestly it suits me but it seems that some skills and uniques are much too modified looking like OP and that extremely high density in maps is very similar to PoE not at all withD2lod
As for Tz, it was very good for me to be able to farm in almost all areas
What do you mean great marsh tz isn't your favorite...🤮👎
After level 95 you can play casually for like 1h a day and after 1 month you will have 5-10% of your exp bar. Claiming that's "easy" is just absurd.
Yeah dude that's real hard
Easy is a relative term. It's undeniably like 10x less time now that it took before. A lot of people would call that easier except dumbasses like you.
Easier, not easy. Before it was impossible for a casual.
Impossible -> Possible is a big change.
Heres a downside to TZs. As soomeone who only has time to play casually, logging on and seeing an awful TZ is demotivating. Like I have 45 minutes to play, and my options are my millionth pindle run/meph or run great marsh TZ. It just makes me log right back off, ngl.
Mosaic ruined D2R for everyone. As soon as they crap enters a cow game or a level walk it ruins the game
I love to listen your videos.
Yes
Just so you know you're my go-to guy for everything Diablo 2
WELL WELL TIME FOR SHENANIGANS!!! 😈
@@GGMentor I play offline want to find everything in the game personally I don't want to purchase anything or anybody give me anything. . you by far provide more information to the average player than anybody else out there
Absolutely agree. Ggm is the GOAT!