Is Technology the Answer to Accurate Line Calls? | Pickleball Connection
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- Опубліковано 27 чер 2024
- In this episode of The Pickleball Connection podcast, Barrett and Danea talk about the recent controversy over line calls in professional pickleball tournaments, and if there should be better consistency or technology for accurate calls. They also discuss the pickleball etiquette rule of paddle tapping at the end of a game, and if it's bad sportsmanship to leave without it. Plus, what is rally scoring and should it replace side out scoring in professional and rec pickleball? 💭
Timestamps:
0:00 - The Pickleball Connection Podcast Episode 7 Introduction 🎬
1:10 - Line Calls ☝️
13:15 - Paddle Tapping 🏓
20:20 - Rally Scoring V.S. Traditional Scoring 🏁
28:00 - Responding to comments 🙋♂️
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You mentioned how there were no questions in the last video so here's one that is related to a complaint from an episode or 2 ago:
A guy said how he hates playing co-ed doubles because they always target his female partner. So why don't pros do this? Much more money is on the line and it's their career, is it more out of good sportsmanship? If winning was truly the goal, I would think I'd see men hit drives and speedups ONLY at the females. Not to say women aren't excellent at returning, but out of 10 fast hand battles, a top pro guy would beat a top pro girl in at least 6 of the 10, that's a winning strategy(albeit cheap and not fun to watch).
I know that Ben(and other men) can sometimes take up 80% of the court with dinking/poaching/etc, but they can't save the day if the female is being heavily targeted
huge NO to rally scoring. Pickleball lets you win if you're the better team. If you go down 0-5 or 0-7 early because of a string of bad bounces, but you're actually the better team, you can easily crawl back and win, but if the other team is still getting points on every rally that they win during your comeback, their lead is nearly impossible to overcome.
Rally scoring basically just makes it easier to win if you get an early lead and harder to come back from a deficit. But the 3rd shot is so important in PB that a team shouldn't lose a game from a missed 3rd shot drop. You'd end up having 3rd shot drives any time a point is important, which would turn out to be almost every time
These two people are amazing! And they are incredible pickleballers as well
You’re the best AJ 🥹
Paddle Tap - I can see the argument for waiting until match is over in a best of format. I think it’s different when you play just 1-game and switch sides mid-game. On the side change if I cross paths w/ an opposing player then I either tap or at least say, “Good playing” to them. If we go in the opposite direction then we usually don’t do anything unless we’re in close proximity. Sometimes an opponent goes out of their way on a side change to tap. If that happens, totally unsporting to not tap. We’ve all prob been beaten badly and to still meet at the net keeps you a gracious winner and loser.
We have to play rally scoring at the pB club I belong to. I think I would prefer traditional but it might slow down the game too much for lower skilled players😜. For MLP I like the rally format but would prefer they go back to win on your own serve.
the #1 thing I hate most is a team arguing a back line call. It is SO hard(near impossible) for them to see it if it hits the line or slightly behind, no player should ever argue that, you just can't possibly know.
edit: this literally happened tonight. The game winner was the other team hitting the ball just out on our back line, the guy argued it but I clearly saw it out. Made things awkward when he could have easily just accepted it and been done
It can be just as bad(though not financially) in rec play because when one side feels like they got a bad call, you KNOW there's a retaliation bad call that's going to happen. I think a call on the left line should be an agreement between both players on the left(same for right side). Yes, that would also have bias, but ANY call will have bias so at least with close calls from the sides you can have an agreement and if no agree then re-do. There can be no perfect solution without cameras, that's the best there can be
As for the pros, 6 cheap dedicated line cameras(for all the corners and angles of the court) can't possibly be that expensive or hard to maintain, no excuse for that. It baffles me that it seems like all PPA replay shots are at some high and tilted angle and not aligned with the line to get the best possible look
Totally agree. Anyone who says they can accurately call a ball from the other side of the court is fooling themselves.
Before the match, you could ask your opponent if they are okay with only paddle tapping at the end of the match in more of a "would you be offended if" vibe.
Thank you two! I haven't played rally scoring yet, but I will try it.
With courts in some areas being at a premium Rally scoring helps keep courts changing over quicker. It does force you to make safer shots and specially in “rec ball” and I think teaches players to be smarter and when playing traditional scoring helps your game be more consistent. I agree though watching the pro’s I like traditional scoring.
I have asked a couple questions in the comments of some previous videos, maybe I missed the answers but I'll post them again here in hopes of hearing the responses in the next video: From the Pickleball Pet Peeves video: "Would you be peeved if you were playing with a lefty guy that assumed to stack in rec play?" - From the Line Calls in or out video: "As far as the line calls in rec play, what if it is a challenge court and its the difference between sitting down or staying on during a busy night? Money might not be on the line but time is. Does that make it different?"
best solution for line calls is just an electronic line. if ball hits the line... a GREEN line will light up, if it misses the line, it's either way in or it's out. Would solve all cheating on line calls.
Take a look at how tennis has delt with line calls, they now have amazing technology that get it right every time
PB needs that technology.
I like rally scoring in singles (both playing and refereeing them) but traditional side out scoring in doubles. We need to stop comparing Pickleball to other sports, Pickleball is it's own sport. The paddle tap is part of Pickleball and needs to stay. While we don't always feel like tapping after game 1 when we lose, it's still good to acknowledge the game with a paddle tap and move on to the next one. There are more of us for the tradition of paddle tapping than against it, at least I hope there are.
I was watching a video Graham DAmico posted on Instagram and it shows a PB sitting close to line. He took the video at 360 degrees view. Down the line and outside the court the ball looked like it was on the line. From the court view (receiving player view) the ball was clearly out. There needs to be the technology to capture the accurate spot the ball landed if in fact close calls look different depending on the view. Not a big deal in rec play but I can certainly see why it is needed when $$$ on the line.
Pickleball is meant to be an honorable game. I like this aspect but I have played with players who, because they can't reach a shot, they call it out. For example, I served the ball intentionally to my opponents backhand when she was in the right side. My ball clearly hit part of her service court and a little bit on the ceter line. She called wrong court. I had a clear view down that line.
In another case, I was out, waiting my turn to play. This same player was playing. A ball was hit to her, which she couldn't reach. It landed in the court about 4 inches, not even close to the end line. She called it out.
I don't play with her any more
I've had cataract surgery on both eyes. I see bad calls all the time. Because I have played and watched sports all my life, (72) I learn the game from all the angles. Calling the line is the hardest thing for people with glasses, who don't know sports and haven't put the effort in to learn the sport. I learned the line by putting a ball down, where it is out and in. I don't look to see the color where the ball landed, but where it landed on the line. Once you have figured out where the is in / out in relation to that line, you can be pretty accurate in your calls. Obviously you can't be 100% depending on where you are on the court, so you don't fight when you don't know.
People with glasses are the worst, because they are wearing glasses for a reason. I see so well that I can make calls 2 courts away.
In tournaments, you have to have refs on the lines. Only college tennis players are allowed to call their own lines. If your going to play for money, do it right.
Gene 2 courts away. You must be superman. I wear glasses and see perfectly well. I make good line calls. Go pat yourself on the back.
So I think the point that is being missed is in pickleball there is a very small point of contact with the ground (different than a tennis ball) which leaves a large contact point. So in on some video replays it is impossible to accurately determine whether it was in or out. So when calling it live by the human eye it is very challenging and you always have to play it unless you see it definitely out so there will always be missed calls. It would be nice to have an automatic calling system in place for the Pros to make the calls for them like in some of the Tennis grand slams but I'm sure that would be very costly.. Calls in Pickleball will always be a lot of questions at the amateur and pro levels
Paddle tap in the middle of a match is what makes Pickleball so unique. No other sports in the world does that. So why take that cool feature away? It also help build good sportsmanship and humility. Whenever I see players go out of their way not to tap paddles it just makes them look bad. I'm sure Sponsors don't like to have players representing their products with that kind of attitude. The way you carry yourself and create your Brand determines what Sponsors will pick you up. Love your channel... Keep up the good work!
Lea is the antagonist and the sport needs bad guys and drama. Lets put Riley and Lea together for mixed doubles.
I like the drama! In the pros, tap or not whatever...rec level, tap every game.
Rally scoring seems to exploit Serving team weaknesses. If you can't effectively apply your 3rd (5th,..) shot, you are penalized. .So, serving team is further disadvantaged,. Rally scoring forces serving team to play more conservative then traditional scoring since you will be penalized for making bad decisions. Whereas in traditional scoring points to other team are not at risk, as well as 2 chances to serve before side out, so you can be far more aggressive, and take risks.
“You will be penalized for making bad decisions “ NO + you are penalized for making BAD SHOTS!!
Paddle tap should be just at the end of the match, just like in tennis you shake your opponent hand at the end of the match.
I handle tap at the end of a game.
Have a DUPR rating for out calls and who is highest gets shamed and ban for a year! 😂
Only paddle tap at end of match
I do have the solution...just need to apply patent for it before I declare it publicly.
Lea showed how bad her own calls are, so she is no better then anyone else
The AV team needs a major upgrade
I have actually had people avoid paddle tapping me simply because they were sorry losers. It comes down to intent.
pleasse, noooooo rally scoring... years ago it was implemented in volleyball tournaments to shorten the time games were taking.. sides outs like in pickleball can go on for ever. and TV hated it as well as the folks we rented the space from... it is not better at all. it encourages and promotes lucky play in my book.. so it is not the skilled and trained who wins it is the luckiest....
The cost for cameras or judges is ultimately going to come out of the pockets of the top pro players. Might as well let them have the most say. It’s truly hard to call lines.
Also the whole “is pickleball a real sport” argument is just butt hurt tennis players who are mad that their unused courts get converted to pickleball courts. I went through this whole thing with snowboarding vs skiing, and it eventually stops. I found it was fun to tell skiers that I wasn’t a snob about them using skis at all. 😂🤣😂
So many of these controversies surround Leah. Is it possible that she is the problem?
I’m in camp -wait til end of match to paddle tap for pros. Not the end of the world but I would think it’s awkward when they are tapping paddles and the winner eager to put paddle out while loser is not feeling it.
Refs are not supposed to be watching lines
Lea is a bad sport. She would complain even if the PPA had the best video replay.
It will not be a real sport until players are not calling lines. It’s a joke. The camera angle & quality is terrible !
Lea is a bad sport. She would complain even if the PPA had the best video replay.