I"m a little bit distrustful of trying to pick a middle gray from a contrasty scene. Not everyone has a good feeling for what a middle gray is. I like to use the memory function of a meter to sample a highlight and a shadow where I want to retain detail. Then I can see the range of tones in the image and choose an exposure that fits the full range. It might be helpful to explain that if you place a shadow on zone III that your camera exposure will be set at zone V, two stops brighter.
The timing of this video is so coincidental for me! I switched to film two months ago and have struggled with exposure. Everyone else's videos are just "I use the internal light meter and overexpose 1-3 stops." This just wasn't concrete enough for me. Then I found the zone system and my faith in film photography was restored. Having a solid set of rules that allow you to creatively control exposure is so much better than "overexpose 1-3 stops." I greatly appreciate your contributions to the film community. If you ever struggle for video ideas I would watch a million of you doing this exact same thing.
Very clear explanation and good practical examples. So many others breeze over this with blah blah blah portra 1/2 box speed and meter for the shadows with no regard for the scene, placement of the tones or actual metering technique.
I don’t often comment on videos but this is one of the most useful I’ve seen in a long time. I’ve just purchased a film camera and I’m itching to get started but wanted to wait until I was sure I had a good understanding of correct metering since with film you are working blind in a way without the instant feedback you get with a digital camera. I’ve picked up an EOS 3 which has multi spot metering with averaging and live metering updates just like your dedicated spot meter. I now have a good understanding of how this should be used. Thanks Kyle!
Kyle, I noticed your Lightroom settings on the photo with the old broken down chair. That would be a great image to show how quality scans of modern negative films can be used almost like raw files, much like they do with scans of cinematic film. That exposure range you had in front of you there was so wide yet it's all captured in the image, ready to expand for viewing. Amazing.
Great to see that you’re back! Found you a few months ago. Your channel is definitely one of too favorites for photography. I appreciate the difficult work out in for the detail study and the production quality is pretty amazing right from the first vid. Kudos, man. Looking forward to more. And thanks for finally laying out spot light meter usage. No one really has on UA-cam. Off to buy a copy of the zone system....
USING A SPOT METER (SEKONIC L-758dr) FOR THE ZONE SYSTEM Interesting demonstration for spot metering for the Zone System. It is not always easy to find a middle gray in a colour scene. Here is my method to take readings with de Seconic for film photography. 1- I take a reading of the part of the subject I want to be on zone III. 2- I hold MID.TONE and with the jog wheel move the indicator to -2 on the scale. This will be the exposure. 3- I store the result in memory 0, press MODE AND MID.TONE. 4- I take a second reading for the high light, store this new reading in memory. From this reading I determine the processing time, N -N or +N. 5- To recall the exposure stored in Memory 0, I press memory recall, MODE AND MID.TONE. In memory recall M and memory number flash, upper left on the meter. For slide film, I base the exposure zone VIII. For digital, I base the exposure to high light based on the Seconic meter calibration for the camera. The result is for RAW files.
Hey Kyle, welcome back. I use both a Sekonic 758 and an older Pentax digital spot meter (reads in Ev). Of the two, I find myself gravitating more towards the Pentax...I like the simplicity. Excellent information.
Thank you so much! It was very helpful to see how you would meter low and high contrasts scenes. Also, I loved the tip on how to use the "average" feature on my Sekonic light meter. This will save me so much time and frustration trying to figure out the best exposure.
Real cool and clear explanation. I'm using the L-858D-U and that has a cool memory feature where you can take a reading from a few points and it'll average it out.
I appreciate this video. I absolutely learned about metering, thoroughly. I would graciously ask though, it would be extremely helpful if you and other youtubers with a presence online would make a video like this that includes discussion about landscape photography but ALSO portrait photography. I'd even greatly appreciate a short one about food photography just to gain the knowledge. Thank you for your hard work, Kyle.
Actually, I do not agree. The Zone system was developed for black and white and it works ok with colour negative film. This is because these films have excellent exposure latitude. The weakness of this video is that there was no mention that it was dependent on the exposure latitude of the film. If you use transparency colour film, then you will have to adjust your methods to cope with using transparency film. Also, in a number of scenes, quite frankly he would have been better off using incident light metering, easier, quicker and in low contrast situations more reliable. The video was ok as far as it went, and I really did like the photo in the abandoned building and yes, in that situation the spot meter was the perfect tool. Just think you have overrated it. I did enjoy the video, just wish he had been more technical in his explanation of the Zone system.
Good to see you back! You should give your metering technique ago with transparency film. Or if you want to get some numbers going around in your head Start using polarizing filters neutral density filters. Start to crank out those bellows on the RZll. It will be good exercise for it. Looking forward to your next video!
A good description of spot metering technique. I also much prefer spot metering over incident for most situations, and use the same metering process as you do. As you say, it gets much easier/rapid with experience. Something I would stress (which you didn't really touch on) is the absolute necessity of spot metering when it comes to shooting E6 (at least in my opinion). When you only have 5-7 stops to play with, an error of even +/- 1/3rd of a stop can make a big difference. Also it pays not to get too cavalier with negative films either when it comes to overexposure, as some do not have huge latitudes. There are some B&W emulsions with very steep characteristic curves (for e.g. Retro 80S, or document films) which demand they be shot more like slides. Some C41 films too, even if they have an overall wide latitude, can produce quite strong colour casts if you deviate too far from the "correct" exposure; Ektar is particularly fussy with this, as its blue and red response saturates much sooner than the green, hence why blue skies very easily turn cyan with too much overexposure. Long story short: it pays to meter as accurately as possible, whatever film stock you are shooting, and a spot meter is indeed key to that goal IMO.
Great video. Thank you. Been making images for many years using film and home processing. Your video is informative and I don't see why these principles would not work with a digital camera on manual mode. These techniques and principles will be valuable to people who want to "really" learn photography. 👍 👍
Incredibly helpful, Kyle! I'd watched this (and others of your medium format film specific) videos for a couple years now and am back here now after returning to film in the last month or so, first with the Contax G2 and then adding a Mamiya 6 with the 50 and 75 lenses. Decided before I bust off a single frame of Porta 400 with the Mamiya that I was going to dig through your archive and I'm glad I did. Definitely going to snag a good light meter and use that to evaluate the scenes I shoot with the Mamiya! My Hassy X2D, though I love it dearly, is taking a back seat for a bit, at least, so it's X100VI for my digital and the G2 and/or Mamiya 6 for film.
Great video. I'm just starting out using film cameras. I don't have spot meter but you have made me want to get one. You have also taught me a lot about understanding middle gray and the stops in the chart. Great video which I've gained more knowledge. I absolutely love learning so big shout for the video. Chers Kyle
So glad to see you making videos again Kyle! A couple of months ago when I first started shooting film I would pour over your videos over and over again and still find myself revisiting them. Can't wait to see what's coming up
Excellent explanation.Though i would go for 1 stop brighter in the second sample cause you had leverage of 2 stop over the brightest point and, as you explained, film has less problem with overexposure so you get a bit more details in the dark spots. But then within the boundaries of what the film can handle it is also a personal choice. I use the 308 for digital shooting cause that helps me mainly with manual flash. Good basis for everybody to understand. Thanks for sharing.
It is interesting to see the book chart and to use this when looking at a hybrid system like scanning film. I shot 261 rolls of film this last fiscal year, and I developed them all myself. When shooting I use the Zone System; I then scan them with my Nikon D750 using a macro lens and import into Lightroom 6. There I flip the image into a positive and edit using a continuation of the Zone System and the Lightroom system that lists the values of your image on a scale from 0 to 100. I like to place my caucasian skin around 65-70 and my sky highlights around 90-95. For my shadows I tend to not go below 5 to 8. An enjoyable video that shows light meters still have a role in modern photography, film or digital.
Much prefer my old Soligor spot meter, with the zone’s taped around the lens :) So easy to use, all the info you need is layer out and easy to read, without all the fluff that comes with modern meters.
Kyle gotta love the Ansel Adams laptop lift..... I know, I know it was just the right height...lol. I do Love all your channel, its a class act, I've even tuned into the Podcasts too. Great work.
Thanks, the zone system isn't something I was familiar with and you've explained it really well, especially how the meter wants to make what you're aiming at medium grey.
Nice video, first one I've seen that goes beyond just setting ASA numbers on your meter and where to point it. But this is only part of the story; you might also want to add info about Dmax and Dmin, the toe and shoulders of each film's curve, and manipulation through processing, as well as color shift for color films, transparency films particularly. Also you might mention the use EV numbers to help determine brightness range of any scene. Lastly, though spot meters are particularly precise way to measure a scene's brightness, recognizing the quality, direction, and quantity of light (for example, point source v. soft box) as well as the shape of objects in the scene and their reaction to light. In addition, reflected and incident light meters can be used successfully as well as long the photogs know their film, recognize the brightness range of the scene, consider the relative rendition of different colors (for b&w), and keep in mind the quality, direction, and size of the light and light source.
Thank you for this educational video, Kyle! - One question came up in my mind while watching and I hope I can express is clearly without sounding to obscure (as a non native english speaker): Is there a noticeable difference between the pictures, the actual results of a specific exposure, you use to explain how to meter and the scene when you were on location? Since every picture, every video necessarily is a result of an exposure informed by (manual or automatic or lack of) metering and has rendered what was in front of the photographers eyes and the lens in a specific way. So every explanation that is mediated through pictures and video unavoidably lacks the immediacy when you are on location, see it with your own eyes and need to decide how and what to meter. In my experience this needs a kind of "photographic" sight that is special and needs to be trained since the human eye (and mind) is much more adaptive and has a very different dynamic rage than a camera has. So learning to "see" how a negativ film will "see" a scene is a skill one should not underestimate. What's your experience on that?
Spot meter could be built-in in a camera. Even old Canon T90 has multi-spot metering. You can store up to 8 readings and then average them, quite convenient feature to have. Anyway, the spot light meter reads reflective light, you always have to keep in mind you have in regards to middle gray.
Kyle, Thanks for taking the time to do all these videos they are fantastic! Question for ya. In this vid you talk about setting you light meter at 250 to ensure you don't underexpose too much. I'm other videos you say you set your camera at 200(when using potra 400). When taking the images in this video did you have your meter @ 250 and your camera @200(assuming you were shooting with p400?
This is such a thoughtful, concise description of spot metering for beginner film photographers!! Thank you so much. Quite comparable to the videos all these hype kids are making out there indulging on their own film photos.
Absolutely great video, Kyle. To echo a previous comment, this is a very clear and practical explanation of both spot metering and the zone system. Thank you :)
When you get into this subject, you have to start somewhere, but No, this is not a clear or practical guide to use and application of the "zone system". If it were a discussion of the zone system, he would have shown how you use the meter to measure any density of tone in any the subject and then translate that reading into a working exposure. He skips the issue of what do you do if you have no "middle grey" tone to measure. Nevertheless, this is subject where you have to start somewhere, and you can only cover so much before the eyeballs roll back into the head.
Great video Kyle!! Thanks for taking the time to start tackling such an important subject. This is one of best videos I've found on how to meter for print film. If I may make a suggestion for future metering videos (if you were to make them), Could you show some examples of photos where maybe the contrast was too high for Portra 400 to capture everything? It would be really nice for us to see at what point highlights get blown on a photo (+4? +5?, +6?, ect..) and what that begins to look like. That way when come across a high contrast scene and meter it we can have an idea if its a scene Portra 400 has the capability to capture completely, or if we have to make a decision on preserving the shadows or highlights. I know the zone system suggests that at +3 we are going to start getting highlights that have very little detail, but that is more a recommendation for black and white film. It would be interesting to see how/if it differs for print film. Specifically Portra 400. Thanks again for such a great video! Also, the interior chair shot was truly spectacular. Nice work!!
Thanks, Ryan. Yes, great idea for a future video. If you haven't checked out my Portra Exposure video, that's a good place to start to see how Portra deals with extreme exposure adjustments. Cheers!
Great video, just beginning to learn this. I understand metering of middle grey and getting you setting, where I am confused is when you meter on the shadows and highlights do you then change your settings from what the middle grey settings said?
When you meter the shadow and highlights, you're able to see how much they differ from your middle grey reading. This gives you an idea if they will be captured properly if you stick with the middle grey reading. If, for example, the difference is drastic (ie. shadows four stops under middle grey), then you can adjust your exposure to make sure they will be captured. It's a big balancing act, basically.
Love the desert! Very handy explanation. Whats your opinion on the usefulness of something like a voigtlander vc ii , or maybe a reveni for similar photography as yours.
Are you a professional educator? That would be my guess. This video is informative about the zone system and the meter. Thank you. My Sekonic L358 is going to be replaced soon. I was looking at the L-478, but being able to see the tonality difference while moving the meter has me thinking of the L858. When I looked at it the L858 is also capable of metering HSS flash. Oh....my poor budget!
Hey Kyle! Great video! Thanks. About the first exterior shot, wouldn't be more accurate metering with the incident light method? (supposing everything is receveing sun light only)
Excellent explanation. I use my meter the exact same way. I always wondered if I was doing it incorrectly-albeit my exposures do come out totally fine. But workflow wise ,I wondered how others used their meters. 😄
There are a few iPhone apps that give you a live scene while adjusting exposure levels. I own a Sekonic L858d and now only use it for checking flash duration on commercial jobs shooting athletes.
Really good explanation. I was wondering, instead of referring to the zone system, could you make the same exposure evaluation by referring to the dynamic range of negative film?
Question Kyle, for the example in the room with high contrast, do you expose middle grey with film stock speed since you mentioned to not go below 2 stops below middle grey? For example, 400H exposed at 200 which is what I would rate this film with my spot meter, from one of your previous videos, give only a stop below that is usable since from speed stock speed is actually -2 stops. Or in your example, you would expose at 400 to give -2 stops for dark tones and +3 or +4 high tones? Hope this makes sense lol...
For me understanding that my spot meter was giving me a reading that brings everything to sixteen percent grey really helped. Meter snow it will be 16% grey so over expose. Shooting shadows it will be 16% grey so under exposed from the reading. Made it easy for me to think of it that way. Now I am practicing exposing for the shadow at 16 % but then adjusting in the development cutting time in the developer.
Hello @kyle, how does this compare with Iphone light meter App ? What are your thoughts on purchasing Sekonic Speedmaster L-858D VS purchasing one of this used ?
No comparison with a light meter app. A spot meter like this has a very narrow angle, whereas a phone is just taking an average reading of a scene. Two very different tools. I’m not too familiar with the 858, but both models will do the job!
Say for example, with the abandoned house shot, you wanted to expose the shadows to be in zone 3, that would mean you'd have to make the exposure longer therefore pushing the highlights into zone 9 and possibly blowing them out right? so is there anyway you could keep the shadows in zone 3 without over exposing the highlights? Forgive me if what i've just said doesn't make any sense, this is the first time i've heard of the zone system
Are these 'stops' over middle grey the same as when we usually use the term, for example '3 stops' over middle grey means that this area of the picture is getting 3 times as much light as the middle grey area (as in EV stops)? Or are the stops in the 'zone' tone grading system unrelated to EV stops?
Great video on spot metering! In your last example, if you had turned towards the sun and took an incident reading do you think it would have given you the same tonality? Or do you think the shadows in the weeds would have fallen too dark with less detail?
Thanks for another great video Kyle. Why wouldn't you just take the average readings? Is it less consistent or accurate than metering via the memory button and then looking through the viewfinder of the lightmeter? Also, when you utilizing that memory and average technique, whats your final reading that you're camera setting is (ie; are you metering for that bright spot or the middle grey spot)?
Thanks, Han. This is just one way of working that I've found is good for me. You could take a number of readings around the scene and then average them to get your exposure, that works as well. For me, I always meter middle grey, and then lock it in memory, and then meter other tones just to make sure they're going to be within the limits of the film. If they are, I stick with the first middle grey reading as my final setting. If not, I adjust accordingly based on if I want to expose more for the shadows or highlights.
Sure but a somewhat glossed-over attempt to explain the matter. Suggest a Adams-Archer's Zone System for which zone to place your exposure in etc. Nice clip aesthetically and a neat Mac background tho. Thanks. BW
Hi Kyle! Great video. How have you found your Sekonic in terms of durability? have you upgraded? I'm looking to get a used 558 or 758, or perhaps just spend a bit more and get a new 858. Cheers from Spain :)
This is probably the most concise and practical explanation of spot metering and the zone system I’ve ever seen. Great video man.
Thanks, man!
Next step is to understand how the zone system interacts with developing film - n and n+1... all that jazz.
Well said 👍
It won a sub from me
You haven't watched enough videos... This one was terrible like so many others.
I"m a little bit distrustful of trying to pick a middle gray from a contrasty scene. Not everyone has a good feeling for what a middle gray is. I like to use the memory function of a meter to sample a highlight and a shadow where I want to retain detail. Then I can see the range of tones in the image and choose an exposure that fits the full range. It might be helpful to explain that if you place a shadow on zone III that your camera exposure will be set at zone V, two stops brighter.
I agree with your method
The timing of this video is so coincidental for me! I switched to film two months ago and have struggled with exposure. Everyone else's videos are just "I use the internal light meter and overexpose 1-3 stops." This just wasn't concrete enough for me. Then I found the zone system and my faith in film photography was restored. Having a solid set of rules that allow you to creatively control exposure is so much better than "overexpose 1-3 stops." I greatly appreciate your contributions to the film community. If you ever struggle for video ideas I would watch a million of you doing this exact same thing.
Thank you, Dustin!
Very clear explanation and good practical examples. So many others breeze over this with blah blah blah portra 1/2 box speed and meter for the shadows with no regard for the scene, placement of the tones or actual metering technique.
No joke ive watched endless videos on this topic and this is the best one!
Cheers, Alex. Glad you found it helpful.
Probably the best spot metering explanation I’ve seen on YT.
Clear and concise tutorial that I have referred to on a few occasions to refresh my knowledge of metering and zone system.
Brilliantly intelligent explanation of spot metering and the zone system. Thank you for helping us all out so clearly and concisely.
I don’t often comment on videos but this is one of the most useful I’ve seen in a long time. I’ve just purchased a film camera and I’m itching to get started but wanted to wait until I was sure I had a good understanding of correct metering since with film you are working blind in a way without the instant feedback you get with a digital camera. I’ve picked up an EOS 3 which has multi spot metering with averaging and live metering updates just like your dedicated spot meter. I now have a good understanding of how this should be used. Thanks Kyle!
Glad you found it helpful!
I’m two years late watching but worth the wait! Thank you for explaining this concept so succinctly. Bravo!
Glad you found it helpful, Joseph.
Great video. I love my Sekonic meter. Fabulous consistent results.
RS. Canada
One of the best explanations of the zone system and overview of how to use a spot meter correctly. Great stuff!
Thank you!
Not (currently) a film shooter, but this intro to light meter usage is the best I've found online so far. Thanks!
Glad you found it helpful!
Two upload within the week praise the film gods
This is the best video I've seen on metering for a scene.
Kyle, I noticed your Lightroom settings on the photo with the old broken down chair. That would be a great image to show how quality scans of modern negative films can be used almost like raw files, much like they do with scans of cinematic film. That exposure range you had in front of you there was so wide yet it's all captured in the image, ready to expand for viewing. Amazing.
Great to see that you’re back! Found you a few months ago. Your channel is definitely one of too favorites for photography. I appreciate the difficult work out in for the detail study and the production quality is pretty amazing right from the first vid. Kudos, man. Looking forward to more. And thanks for finally laying out spot light meter usage. No one really has on UA-cam. Off to buy a copy of the zone system....
Thank you!
This is still my Favourite light meter video. Well done.
Mike
Thanks for making this video, I switched to a Pentax Zone VI spot meter and really saw a difference with my images and negative densities
Am i dreaming? another upload... dude, you're spoiling us
USING A SPOT METER (SEKONIC L-758dr) FOR THE ZONE SYSTEM
Interesting demonstration for spot metering for the Zone System.
It is not always easy to find a middle gray in a colour scene.
Here is my method to take readings with de Seconic for film photography.
1- I take a reading of the part of the subject I want to be on zone III.
2- I hold MID.TONE and with the jog wheel move the indicator to -2 on the scale. This will be the exposure.
3- I store the result in memory 0, press MODE AND MID.TONE.
4- I take a second reading for the high light, store this new reading in memory. From this reading I determine the processing time, N -N or +N.
5- To recall the exposure stored in Memory 0, I press memory recall, MODE AND MID.TONE. In memory recall M and memory number flash, upper left on the meter.
For slide film, I base the exposure zone VIII.
For digital, I base the exposure to high light based on the Seconic meter calibration for the camera. The result is for RAW files.
thank you, really useful
I can't believe that you came back for real. Much excited!
So happy that you are back doing videos. Great info as always.
Hey Kyle, welcome back. I use both a Sekonic 758 and an older Pentax digital spot meter (reads in Ev). Of the two, I find myself gravitating more towards the Pentax...I like the simplicity. Excellent information.
Thank you so much! It was very helpful to see how you would meter low and high contrasts scenes. Also, I loved the tip on how to use the "average" feature on my Sekonic light meter. This will save me so much time and frustration trying to figure out the best exposure.
Just brilliant. I can't believe your timing. Am currently floundering with the spot meter in a new film slr. This makes so much sense thank you 😁
Real cool and clear explanation. I'm using the L-858D-U and that has a cool memory feature where you can take a reading from a few points and it'll average it out.
One of the best tutorials around. Thanks much for very clear lesson on using a spot meter.
Glad you enjoyed. :)
I appreciate this video. I absolutely learned about metering, thoroughly. I would graciously ask though, it would be extremely helpful if you and other youtubers with a presence online would make a video like this that includes discussion about landscape photography but ALSO portrait photography. I'd even greatly appreciate a short one about food photography just to gain the knowledge. Thank you for your hard work, Kyle.
Thank you. I don't do much portrait photography at the moment, but I'll keep it in mind for the future.
Actually, I do not agree. The Zone system was developed for black and white and it works ok with colour negative film. This is because these films have excellent exposure latitude. The weakness of this video is that there was no mention that it was dependent on the exposure latitude of the film. If you use transparency colour film, then you will have to adjust your methods to cope with using transparency film. Also, in a number of scenes, quite frankly he would have been better off using incident light metering, easier, quicker and in low contrast situations more reliable. The video was ok as far as it went, and I really did like the photo in the abandoned building and yes, in that situation the spot meter was the perfect tool. Just think you have overrated it. I did enjoy the video, just wish he had been more technical in his explanation of the Zone system.
Good to see you back! You should give your metering technique ago with transparency film. Or if you want to get some numbers going around in your head Start using polarizing filters neutral density filters. Start to crank out those bellows on the RZll. It will be good exercise for it. Looking forward to your next video!
A good description of spot metering technique. I also much prefer spot metering over incident for most situations, and use the same metering process as you do. As you say, it gets much easier/rapid with experience.
Something I would stress (which you didn't really touch on) is the absolute necessity of spot metering when it comes to shooting E6 (at least in my opinion). When you only have 5-7 stops to play with, an error of even +/- 1/3rd of a stop can make a big difference. Also it pays not to get too cavalier with negative films either when it comes to overexposure, as some do not have huge latitudes. There are some B&W emulsions with very steep characteristic curves (for e.g. Retro 80S, or document films) which demand they be shot more like slides. Some C41 films too, even if they have an overall wide latitude, can produce quite strong colour casts if you deviate too far from the "correct" exposure; Ektar is particularly fussy with this, as its blue and red response saturates much sooner than the green, hence why blue skies very easily turn cyan with too much overexposure.
Long story short: it pays to meter as accurately as possible, whatever film stock you are shooting, and a spot meter is indeed key to that goal IMO.
Good advice. And yes, E6 you really need to nail exposure.
Great video. Thank you. Been making images for many years using film and home processing. Your video is informative and I don't see why these principles would not work with a digital camera on manual mode. These techniques and principles will be valuable to people who want to "really" learn photography. 👍 👍
Thanks!
Incredibly helpful, Kyle! I'd watched this (and others of your medium format film specific) videos for a couple years now and am back here now after returning to film in the last month or so, first with the Contax G2 and then adding a Mamiya 6 with the 50 and 75 lenses. Decided before I bust off a single frame of Porta 400 with the Mamiya that I was going to dig through your archive and I'm glad I did. Definitely going to snag a good light meter and use that to evaluate the scenes I shoot with the Mamiya! My Hassy X2D, though I love it dearly, is taking a back seat for a bit, at least, so it's X100VI for my digital and the G2 and/or Mamiya 6 for film.
So helpful. Just got into film this year and have watched your videos. They’ve provided great guidance. Thank you!
Great video. I'm just starting out using film cameras. I don't have spot meter but you have made me want to get one. You have also taught me a lot about understanding middle gray and the stops in the chart. Great video which I've gained more knowledge. I absolutely love learning so big shout for the video. Chers Kyle
Stoked to hear this helped you, Justin!
So glad to see you making videos again Kyle! A couple of months ago when I first started shooting film I would pour over your videos over and over again and still find myself revisiting them. Can't wait to see what's coming up
Thank you!
Excellent explanation.Though i would go for 1 stop brighter in the second sample cause you had leverage of 2 stop over the brightest point and, as you explained, film has less problem with overexposure so you get a bit more details in the dark spots. But then within the boundaries of what the film can handle it is also a personal choice.
I use the 308 for digital shooting cause that helps me mainly with manual flash.
Good basis for everybody to understand.
Thanks for sharing.
Really nice job explaining this spot on subject.
😄
It is interesting to see the book chart and to use this when looking at a hybrid system like scanning film. I shot 261 rolls of film this last fiscal year, and I developed them all myself. When shooting I use the Zone System; I then scan them with my Nikon D750 using a macro lens and import into Lightroom 6. There I flip the image into a positive and edit using a continuation of the Zone System and the Lightroom system that lists the values of your image on a scale from 0 to 100. I like to place my caucasian skin around 65-70 and my sky highlights around 90-95. For my shadows I tend to not go below 5 to 8.
An enjoyable video that shows light meters still have a role in modern photography, film or digital.
Kyle, in the color spectar, from yellow to violet, the middle of the scale are green and red, you can use the grass also to meter middle grey.
Good to know. Thank you.
Much prefer my old Soligor spot meter, with the zone’s taped around the lens :) So easy to use, all the info you need is layer out and easy to read, without all the fluff that comes with modern meters.
Oh man, another new vid! You're really spoiling us.
Kyle gotta love the Ansel Adams laptop lift..... I know, I know it was just the right height...lol. I do Love all your channel, its a class act, I've even tuned into the Podcasts too. Great work.
thanks a lot man! I don't usually comment too much but your video deserves it. I appreciate it!
Thanks, the zone system isn't something I was familiar with and you've explained it really well, especially how the meter wants to make what you're aiming at medium grey.
Glad this helped!
Most informative photography video I've seen in a long time. Thank you for this.
great explanation, so clear and easy to understand. Have just bought a Minolta spot meter and this will help me a lot. Thanks
Glad it was helpful!
Nice video, first one I've seen that goes beyond just setting ASA numbers on your meter and where to point it. But this is only part of the story; you might also want to add info about Dmax and Dmin, the toe and shoulders of each film's curve, and manipulation through processing, as well as color shift for color films, transparency films particularly. Also you might mention the use EV numbers to help determine brightness range of any scene. Lastly, though spot meters are particularly precise way to measure a scene's brightness, recognizing the quality, direction, and quantity of light (for example, point source v. soft box) as well as the shape of objects in the scene and their reaction to light. In addition, reflected and incident light meters can be used successfully as well as long the photogs know their film, recognize the brightness range of the scene, consider the relative rendition of different colors (for b&w), and keep in mind the quality, direction, and size of the light and light source.
Simply explained, easy to understand. I watched quite a few videos of yours. Thanks for doing this. Cheers
Thank you.
Same here: Best explanaition (for free) I have seen. Tx very much!!!
This explanation was spot on, thanks!
Shawn Brezny pun intended?
travis shannon Double Entendre for sure!
Thank you for this educational video, Kyle! - One question came up in my mind while watching and I hope I can express is clearly without sounding to obscure (as a non native english speaker): Is there a noticeable difference between the pictures, the actual results of a specific exposure, you use to explain how to meter and the scene when you were on location? Since every picture, every video necessarily is a result of an exposure informed by (manual or automatic or lack of) metering and has rendered what was in front of the photographers eyes and the lens in a specific way. So every explanation that is mediated through pictures and video unavoidably lacks the immediacy when you are on location, see it with your own eyes and need to decide how and what to meter. In my experience this needs a kind of "photographic" sight that is special and needs to be trained since the human eye (and mind) is much more adaptive and has a very different dynamic rage than a camera has. So learning to "see" how a negativ film will "see" a scene is a skill one should not underestimate. What's your experience on that?
Only just found your channel but loving the content. Really appreciated how well you explain your process, extremely helpful! Thanks!
Thanks, Christian. Glad you're enjoying the content!
Best metering video out there! That helps a lot! Thanks and all the best from Austria
Thanks, Fabian. Glad you found it helpful.
really appreciated . excellent video, full of information yet easy to understand. Thanks very much !!!
Thanks. Glad you enjoyed.
Thanks for coming back :)
Spot meter could be built-in in a camera. Even old Canon T90 has multi-spot metering. You can store up to 8 readings and then average them, quite convenient feature to have. Anyway, the spot light meter reads reflective light, you always have to keep in mind you have in regards to middle gray.
Amazing video. It’s clear and straight to the point. Couldn’t understand better after watching
Nicely done, what took me years to understand you've managed to convey in minutes.
Glad it helped!
Kyle,
Thanks for taking the time to do all these videos they are fantastic!
Question for ya. In this vid you talk about setting you light meter at 250 to ensure you don't underexpose too much. I'm other videos you say you set your camera at 200(when using potra 400). When taking the images in this video did you have your meter @ 250 and your camera @200(assuming you were shooting with p400?
A lot of very interesting and useful info here. Thanks Kyle.
Glad you enjoyed, Ray. Thanks.
Good points on why you should use one.
Brilliant video Kyle so informative
Glad you found it helpful, Ed.
Nice video Kyle. My Pentax Digital Spot Meter is probably.. if not the most important bit of gear in my bag.
Thanks, man!
This is such a thoughtful, concise description of spot metering for beginner film photographers!! Thank you so much. Quite comparable to the videos all these hype kids are making out there indulging on their own film photos.
Absolutely great video, Kyle. To echo a previous comment, this is a very clear and practical explanation of both spot metering and the zone system. Thank you :)
Thank you, Michael!
When you get into this subject, you have to start somewhere, but No, this is not a clear or practical guide to use and application of the "zone system". If it were a discussion of the zone system, he would have shown how you use the meter to measure any density of tone in any the subject and then translate that reading into a working exposure. He skips the issue of what do you do if you have no "middle grey" tone to measure. Nevertheless, this is subject where you have to start somewhere, and you can only cover so much before the eyeballs roll back into the head.
thank you for this video and explanation helped a lot!!!
Great video Kyle!! Thanks for taking the time to start tackling such an important subject. This is one of best videos I've found on how to meter for print film. If I may make a suggestion for future metering videos (if you were to make them), Could you show some examples of photos where maybe the contrast was too high for Portra 400 to capture everything? It would be really nice for us to see at what point highlights get blown on a photo (+4? +5?, +6?, ect..) and what that begins to look like. That way when come across a high contrast scene and meter it we can have an idea if its a scene Portra 400 has the capability to capture completely, or if we have to make a decision on preserving the shadows or highlights. I know the zone system suggests that at +3 we are going to start getting highlights that have very little detail, but that is more a recommendation for black and white film. It would be interesting to see how/if it differs for print film. Specifically Portra 400. Thanks again for such a great video! Also, the interior chair shot was truly spectacular. Nice work!!
Thanks, Ryan. Yes, great idea for a future video. If you haven't checked out my Portra Exposure video, that's a good place to start to see how Portra deals with extreme exposure adjustments. Cheers!
Extremely helpful video. Thanks a ton. Keep making these beautiful videos brother.
Is there going to be a Vol.2 to this?
Thank you! And yes, I'll be doing another one in the future.
Great video, just beginning to learn this. I understand metering of middle grey and getting you setting, where I am confused is when you meter on the shadows and highlights do you then change your settings from what the middle grey settings said?
When you meter the shadow and highlights, you're able to see how much they differ from your middle grey reading. This gives you an idea if they will be captured properly if you stick with the middle grey reading. If, for example, the difference is drastic (ie. shadows four stops under middle grey), then you can adjust your exposure to make sure they will be captured. It's a big balancing act, basically.
Love the desert!
Very handy explanation.
Whats your opinion on the usefulness of something like a voigtlander vc ii , or maybe a reveni for similar photography as yours.
Are you a professional educator? That would be my guess. This video is informative about the zone system and the meter. Thank you. My Sekonic L358 is going to be replaced soon. I was looking at the L-478, but being able to see the tonality difference while moving the meter has me thinking of the L858. When I looked at it the L858 is also capable of metering HSS flash. Oh....my poor budget!
Hey Kyle! Great video! Thanks. About the first exterior shot, wouldn't be more accurate metering with the incident light method? (supposing everything is receveing sun light only)
Excellent explanation. I use my meter the exact same way. I always wondered if I was doing it incorrectly-albeit my exposures do come out totally fine. But workflow wise ,I wondered how others used their meters. 😄
There are a few iPhone apps that give you a live scene while adjusting exposure levels. I own a Sekonic L858d and now only use it for checking flash duration on commercial jobs shooting athletes.
Glad you're back
Very informative post giving a very clear, simple and concise explaination of the zone system. Nice job 👍
Thanks!
great video. I think your Sekinic is in incident mode as the white bubble us not retracted.
Really good explanation. I was wondering, instead of referring to the zone system, could you make the same exposure evaluation by referring to the dynamic range of negative film?
Question Kyle, for the example in the room with high contrast, do you expose middle grey with film stock speed since you mentioned to not go below 2 stops below middle grey? For example, 400H exposed at 200 which is what I would rate this film with my spot meter, from one of your previous videos, give only a stop below that is usable since from speed stock speed is actually -2 stops. Or in your example, you would expose at 400 to give -2 stops for dark tones and +3 or +4 high tones? Hope this makes sense lol...
Great video on spot metering. I never really understood it until right now. Cheers
very helpful. just have to stick to a light meter app in my phone for now as even used spot meters are really expensive!
For me understanding that my spot meter was giving me a reading that brings everything to sixteen percent grey really helped. Meter snow it will be 16% grey so over expose. Shooting shadows it will be 16% grey so under exposed from the reading. Made it easy for me to think of it that way. Now I am practicing exposing for the shadow at 16 % but then adjusting in the development cutting time in the developer.
18% surely? or am I forgetting my numbers
David Richards 18% it is this was just a test and you passed 🤪
Great video. I appreciate your existence.
super useful video, thanks!
Hello @kyle, how does this compare with Iphone light meter App ?
What are your thoughts on purchasing Sekonic Speedmaster L-858D VS purchasing one of this used ?
No comparison with a light meter app. A spot meter like this has a very narrow angle, whereas a phone is just taking an average reading of a scene. Two very different tools. I’m not too familiar with the 858, but both models will do the job!
Say for example, with the abandoned house shot, you wanted to expose the shadows to be in zone 3, that would mean you'd have to make the exposure longer therefore pushing the highlights into zone 9 and possibly blowing them out right? so is there anyway you could keep the shadows in zone 3 without over exposing the highlights? Forgive me if what i've just said doesn't make any sense, this is the first time i've heard of the zone system
This was great, thank you 😊
Very good breakdown. Would you look for middle grey also even when shooting slide film?
I would, yes. But you'd need to be extra careful with where you place your shadows and highlights as slide has less latitude.
Are these 'stops' over middle grey the same as when we usually use the term, for example '3 stops' over middle grey means that this area of the picture is getting 3 times as much light as the middle grey area (as in EV stops)? Or are the stops in the 'zone' tone grading system unrelated to EV stops?
great video, man. super informative. I loved the broken chair photo. I'd totally hang it on my wall
Thank you!
Great video on spot metering! In your last example, if you had turned towards the sun and took an incident reading do you think it would have given you the same tonality? Or do you think the shadows in the weeds would have fallen too dark with less detail?
Thanks for another great video Kyle. Why wouldn't you just take the average readings? Is it less consistent or accurate than metering via the memory button and then looking through the viewfinder of the lightmeter? Also, when you utilizing that memory and average technique, whats your final reading that you're camera setting is (ie; are you metering for that bright spot or the middle grey spot)?
Thanks, Han. This is just one way of working that I've found is good for me. You could take a number of readings around the scene and then average them to get your exposure, that works as well. For me, I always meter middle grey, and then lock it in memory, and then meter other tones just to make sure they're going to be within the limits of the film. If they are, I stick with the first middle grey reading as my final setting. If not, I adjust accordingly based on if I want to expose more for the shadows or highlights.
@@KyleMcDougall thanks for the clarification!
Amazing video, informative AF. Thank you so much. I understand the zone system and looking for tones in a scene far better after seeing this.
Sure but a somewhat glossed-over attempt to explain the matter. Suggest a Adams-Archer's Zone System for which zone to place your exposure in etc. Nice clip aesthetically and a neat Mac background tho. Thanks. BW
Hi Kyle! Great video. How have you found your Sekonic in terms of durability? have you upgraded? I'm looking to get a used 558 or 758, or perhaps just spend a bit more and get a new 858.
Cheers from Spain :)
I bought it used back in 2017 and it's still going strong. No issues!
thank you!! @@KyleMcDougall
please do a video on getting sharper photos, I feel I just need more work but advice is always knowledge I can soak in.
Brilliant video Kyle, so informative.
Thanks, Ed.
So much good info in here! Loving all your videos. Thanks Kyle
Why is the incident dome recessed? Are there specific situations for using a fully extended and a retracted dome?