oh oh oh ....37 years after i startet measuring with any light meter including the selen cell type ones , it was you mr. o´nions, who explained it the right way. thank you so much. i finally got the difference between positive and negative film concerning meetering....now, that i am aware of this - i will try my best to make better positives. i wish you all the best and thank you again for " ...you have to get rid of the highlights..." stay healthy and please continue with these fabulous foto hiking tours.....greeting fron a typical german wandersman...andy
You are by far my favorite youtube channel on the matter of film photography, as a beginner it is a pleasure to learn from you experience and expertise. And I am always blown away by the quality both of your photographs and your videos. I don't often comment but I really wanted to thank you for your work.
Those recommendations are extremely good ideas ! I use a separate light meter also because I use several different film cameras. One meter seems best. Thank you. RS. Canada
My first "spotmeter" was an attachment that went on my Gossen Luna Pro that gave me a choice of a 15 or 30 degree spot. My next meter was a Sekonic L-488 digital spot meter and life got better. A very good video and I am glad that you covered the differences between metering for slide and for print film. For many years, my favorite color film was Kodachrome 25 and it was not forgiving.
Richard took the words right out of my mind. Steve is top shelf among the photo guys. Both talented artist and able teacher. Thanks and greetings from Germany.
Another brilliant tutorial, the best that I have come across for metering and the zone system. I went looking for a spot meter after seeing your video and discovered that I'd have to sell all my film cameras to buy one!
I have been on a massive binge watching your channel as I just discovered it. This has to be the best explanation of metering and the zone system I have seen on UA-cam. It answered all of the questions I had as I am about to jump into the film world for the first time soon. Your channel is amazing, and thank you for putting out helpful, insightful, and interesting content.
Steve, Great job. After following the late Richard White and others I was getting fairly competent with the zone system. I followed your strategy and nailed it. You made what I once thought complicated and confusing simply and straight forward. I follow your channel and have gained great knowledge from your work.. Thank you.
The master at work. Brilliant educational and instructive video put over clearly and slowly, even I understood. Thank you Steve. Love to have a longer video on this subject.
I still use a Pentax spot meter I bought in 1972. It works like a charm, except for the complete lack of memory and calculating devices found in more modern digital models . My own memory is 73 years old and a digital assist would be nice. Thanks Steve, you do good work. By the way, I think I learned almost everything I know about b&w film photography from Ansel Adams' The Negative. It is old but for me it has been a bible.
Thank you for this video - it is the singular clearest explanation of how to meter for shadows and get what you want. I have been worried I have been under-exposing my images and, looking at this, I am! I look forward to getting out and tring to be a bit braver with shadows!
Glad you found it useful Chris. I always remember the quote from Ansel Adams that went was I believe ‘when I got a spot meter my typical exposures went up by one stop’.
This is such an incredibly educational video for a beginner such as myself. Your use of example photos and elaboration on the metering process in the moment was really illuminating (pun slightly intended). Thanks, Steve!
I absolutely love your videos. So enjoyable to watch and equally informative. It’s really helping me get back into film photography after a long hiatus.
I have just bought myself a spotmeter a couple of days ago. This video has certainly improved my knowledge to use it even better now. looking forward to learn more about specific filmstocks from you!
Your explanation has been so helpful. I agree more videos on these with the color film would be awesome too. Thank you for your content. It's very inspirational.
Excellent spotmeter discussion with examples; really enjoyed the color positive aspect because I do not us; still clinging to my Pentax Spotmeter V (analog) w/ Zone VI studio scale for the last 35 years... as always great job Steve!!
Awesome vid! I just recently got back into film, I grew up in photography in the 70s. I have a Nikon F4, Olympus OM-2SP, and a Minolta XD-11 ( was my first film camera in the 70s). I just won on eBay a Minolta Autocord. I need to get back to metering and your video has helped my bunches!
Love your channel Steve. Your videos are very informative and very well delivered. This particular video clear demonstrated the use and value of the spot meter for creating the correct exposure. Thanks
Thanks for the comprehensive, yet brief run through your process for metering Steve. I have pulled my fathers old 35 mm film camera out of the closet and am thinking of giving it a go with either HP5 + or Kodak Tri-X 400 film.
Very useful info. Thanks! I will try to think in terms of zones. Now, some people I think have a different philosophy on the slide film part. Sometimes shadows can be nearly black and it's fine, but I often feel that blown highlights ruin the image more often than too dark shadows. Maybe this is from my frustration early on with getting images back from the lab that were washed out, or maybe I just like mysterious darks. There are always exceptions of course.
This is superb information Steve, thank you. I'll probably watch this a couple of times and make notes to carry with me. I've not yet attempted to shoot slide film but it's on the list.
Hi Steve - excellent explanation as always. I've used my Pentax Spotmeter for years with B&W negatives of all formats from 35mm to 4x5". For slides (Provia) I always use 35mm in my F4S and am happy with the exposures I get from the TTL set to "partial spot".
I'm trying the zonal system when I go out to shoot portraits on Provia 100F later this month. I don't have a handheld light meter so I will use the spot meter on my Nikon Z6 (I'm shooting digital that day as well as slide film) in aperture priority with the ISO fixed at 100. I get the feeling the bright skin tones I'll need to place somewhere from zone 6-7 (I've learned that the exposure ceiling of Provia is around +2EV). I may bracket +1, +1.5 and +2EV and hopefully learn where this magic EV number is (although I expect this will change in different weather conditions - maybe zone 6 in overcast/flat conditions and closer to 7 in bright conditions). Wish me luck
To make things even 'easier' use Ralph Lambrechts exposure 'wheel'. Page 258-259 in his collaboration book with Chris Woodhouse "Way Beyond Monochrome". I have been using this for about 20 years (my book copy is c2003). I have not had a missed exposure since. What I really love from this post is the differences between negs and slides and metering as such. Steve, you are an inspiration. Brett Weston Q "Photography is 90% sheer, brutal drudgery. The other 10% is inspiration" ..
When I learned that my spot meter was giving me a reading that turned everything a medium grey. It made getting a good exposure really very simple. For example meter snow and the meter will give you a reading that will turn it medium grey . So open up a couple stops maybe more and get the white you know the snow actually is. Same with shadow areas except you will stop down from the reading to get the deep shadows captured the way they are. I also have a 18% grey card with me when i am shooting close subjects such as fern or flowers etc. Set the card near the subject take a spot reading off the card and this time you do use the reading as is for a perfect exposure.
Why would you leave the metered reading alone? If you were in close photographing a white flower wouldn’t leaving the actual reading as your exposure give you a gray flower?
@@NarcissismSurvivor Not when metering off the grey card. Put the Card in the same light as the flower and meter off it for the correct exposure. No adjustment needed.
Appreciate this tutorial, Steve. Been out shooting with my 4x5 Rangefinder (it's a converted Polaroid 110) and used the two-stops faster method here with my FP4 and HP5. Works out pretty well so far. Will definitely come in handy when I shoot some Rollei RPX 25 with a camera on sticks. Cheers.
Just had a little go in the garden with my meter. Not enough dark stuff round the house really, but even so it worked and is very useful........Now to find the dynamic range of my digital camera.
Very interesting and helpful Steve! I’m still getting my head around the Zone System, and have only recently started to use a Pentax V spotmeter. You’ve given me a better understanding, for which I’m grateful. Incidentally, I’ve also recently shot my first-ever roll of slide film (Kodak Ektachrome), using my recently-acquired Nikon FA, and only one of the 36 shots was poorly exposed. I really like the look of this film, and the FA’s matrix meter seems to be very effective.
Thanks Neil. I think the FA was the first camera to have matrix metering and it improved on Nikon's already effective centre weighted mode. I should try Ektachrome, I have a liking for neutral films and it might fit the bill.
Exposure spot on with spot meter. The neg for shade and pos for highlights approach is fine. My Sekonic 758 can be used to calibrate a film or a camera. This makes dynamic range explicitly visible in the user interface (an app is used as tool). Finding the darkest point in your image, then the brightest, places both measurements on the display and suggests the optimal exposure. Here the photographer decides what to do when subject dynamic range is larger than film/camera dynamic range: all highlights, all lowlights or a piece of both. So, we can simplify and focus our metering as explained, or work with dynamic ranges. We ought not call this light metering, though, as we meter the subject ... Personally, I still use (incident) light metering most. That is, now my new digital camera can meter for the highlights and I love this a lot, so the meter is using batteries for standby ... Or flash metering in the studio. Be aware that a discrete meter does not know your lens's T stop and you have to compensate differently for each lens, potentially. In pos film you may underexpose a bit and not notice you lost something. In neg film, you lose critical shadow details. With cameras metering through the lens (TTL) the T stop got forgotten, but with the discrete meter we need the awareness. And when you develop/process your own film, make this part of your meter/film calibration runs. By the way, with leaf shutters in exchangeable lenses, run a calibration of the shutters, say once a year (test shots of gray scales in controlled light). After all, you got here because you want perfect exposure and maximum utilization of dynamic range. When you digitally scan your work, you can benefit from image processing software that can make the shoulders of the film's density as function of log I*t curve suitable for use, which they weren't in the old days. And check out the effects of opening as 32-bits to high and low details.
As I predominantly shoot negative materials and err on the side of extra exposure I can largely ignore the variations of shutter and aperture that can indeed ruin a slide image. Processing is very important for B&W but I chose not to include it here as it's a whole set of videos in its own right!
Great video as always! Learnt a lot. Would love to see a video about using slide film + spot metering + grad filters to control a scene with big dr. I've found it challenging to accurately place grads using the waist level finder on my medium format camera. Would be curious to learn from your process!
Thank you Steve for this blog. Brings back memories of when I used to shoot film. Nowadays, I simply use ETTR to make sure highlights are retained and manipulate the image in post for the shadows. Digital sensors are so.much better in dynamic range that we have all forgotten about the need to carefully consider exposure settings.
Nicely done Steve, thanks for sharing. Get it right 'in camera" is my motto, less to fix (if at all) later in post. Although I must admit there is a certain lazy joy in occasionally using digital where you can chimp like crazy to get the exposure right!
Recently bought the same model - couldn't afford the digital model. Also useful with an 18% gray card for incident light on the subject. The rotary scale is perfect for converting the EV value to a camera setting.
Hi Steve. Would you say a spot meter is useful if using a DSLR, I enjoy using manual settings, and thought it would be a worthy addition. To use on those tricky situations, where I feel my in camera metering just won't do. Any thoughts?
Back in those days, about 40 years ago, I shoot mostly slides with my OM-2 for private use. Mostly with Kodachrome 25 and Velvia 50. Can't remember once that I missed the metering. Now I have even better metering system, in my "new" OM-3Ti. But I'm agree that I need a good spotmeter for my MF and LF camera. Thank's for explaining. By the way, I had a very good color meter, what I sold for a good penny.
I also got pretty good at metering with my Nikon’s but the lack of a decent (or any) medium/large format inbuilt metering makes a separate one invaluable.
I use the same Sekonic 508 and really like it, but I must say: If the scene is not very constrasty, I use it in ambient light meter mode and usually have no bad results. If the scene is contrasty though, the spotmeter is the best method of metering. For small format I use an Olympus OM-4 quite often and when I use this camera, I do not take an external meter, since this funny little thing has an inbuilt spotmeter. Not the tightest 1° spot, but the split screen in the center is the measuring spot, so it is TTL and tight enough. The best reason to love the little thing. With slide - difficult. I love Provia 100 (Velvia is a bit too much color for my liking). But I only use it with my 6x6 SLR and quite often I use neutral grad filters. In gerneral I think I will stop shooting slide once the current stock in the freezer is gone and use Ektar 100 and Portra 160 exclusively in the future.
Spot metering is probably overkill for low contrast scenes shot with negative film, it’s hard to get the reading wrong! I’ve sometimes used the incident meter for colour slide and it works very well. I’ve never used the spot meter in my later film cameras, I prefer the matrix options.
Very nice and clear explanation, just the way I was thought how light metering works. I only shoot digital but that doesn’t make any difference in the way you meter (only more dr than slide film) I have exactly the same Sekonic meter, works a charm.
Hi Steve, thanks for such an instructive and useful video on spotmetering so helpful especially concerning the latitude of different film stock (I learned a lot). I have a Minolta Spotmeter F and love it as I try to apply the zone system - as you say it enables metering from such small area of the scene that you cannot get close to. Quick question how do you factor in for filters do you just add the necessary number of stops to the shutter duration (I was wondering why you don't use the exposure compensation dial) thanks Tony
Good question Tony. I work out the exposure without the filter then add that in, effectively lengthening the shutter speed. I the. Apply any other factors such as reciprocity failure or bellows extension for large format.
Ugh! It’s maddening. Just when I think that I’ve got it down it escapes me. Please let me ask a question… When you metered off of the tree shadow how did you know that the spot was was a zone 3? Just practice? Thank you!
That’s the main problem, what is a zone III? It’s largely subjective but I’ve settled on picking a fairly deep shadow where I still want to see plenty of detail and base my exposure on that. Others may call that a Zone II or Zone IV. When in doubt I always add at least one more stop of exposure if I’m shooting with a negative film.
what an informative video. on both spot metering and the zone system. thank you! i have a sekonic 308 meter, which is not a spot meter. Can you recommend a "budget friendly" spot meter? thank you!
Thanks for this very helpful lecture. While saving for an adequate spot meter, I’m going to try utilizing my z6 which has a 1 degree spot metering feature. Not sure how precise this may be but with reading the results instantaneously on the digital camera you may be able to finagle a decent reading. ONE question if I may... what’s the purpose of using slide film if the dynamic range is so limited? Is it the color rendition? Your image with the slide film is just lovely. Thanks again!
Slide film is more vibrant and can expand the range of tones in a low contrast scene. If there are less than 5 stops of range then slide film will produce a very pleasing result, negative material on the other hand can look quite muddy.
I keep rewatching the bit at 6:18 but I don't understand it... You said that you meter the shadow areas that you wish to get in the final image to appear as they are "zone 3". Now, when you meter something, the exposure meter tells you what exposure time you need to have that part of the image appear as "zone 5". Hence, you underexpose 2 stops on that reading to get them to "zone 3". Isn't that how it is? If so, why are you showing the arrow going from zone 3 to zone 5? Isn't it viceversa? I'm sorry if what I'm saying is confusing
@@SteveONions Thank you :) I think it's quite challenging to show it visually as you did. Perhaps a better way would be to have another zone system scale on top which is offset so that the "V" is on top of the "III" when you meter. When you say "I underexpose by 2 stops", that could be shown as a movement of the upper scale to the right, so that the two scales overlap. I found it a little confusing with the arrows because you show the arrow moving from zone III to zone V, when saying that you underexpose, which made me think like "a zone III will appear as a zone V if you underexpose", which is the opposite of what actually happens! Sorry for splitting hairs, the entire video was amazing
I was really happy to find your site. I have a question about metering. When you get a fractional stop such as f 22.8 and you can't actually set that on your camera do you round up to the next stop or back down to f 22.
Good question Graham. If I’m shouting negative film I always allow any extra exposure by using the larger fstop. So if it reads 1/15@f/11.6 I’d go for f/11. With slide film I’d avoid the overexposure so probably go the other way but it does depend on where you choose to meter so it’s never going to be exact.
*Good video:* One exception I can think of is snow scenes, where the right exposure may be two or three stops above the average value over the whole view. Thus, you need to expose for the objects of interest, and disregard the snow itself, most of which will be grossly overexposed, and totally white. Nobody likes grey snow! :-) I hope we can see a video on this channel about how, when, and why to an incident light meter.
Great video Steve. Could you comment on when and whether you rate your negative films at (typically) lower E.I.'s. As you know, part of the Zone system involves testing for film speed based on your personal equipment and developing methods. I always ended up with half box speed after testing several films. By the way, Bruce Barnbaum recommends placing shadows on ZIV for better separation of values. Have you given that a go? 📷
I tend to agree Gregory, half box speed is about right especially for the larger formats where overexposure never gives me a problem. It also depends on lighting of course and in flat conditions I prefer box speed or higher to expand the range somewhat. The post production also makes a difference, I like a thin negative for scanning but a thicker one for the darkroom.
Thank you this is the first time on 45 years of photography I had the zone system explained in a way I understand. This will help a lot.
Glad you liked it Richard.
most methodic person I ever seen, at least in the photographic comunity, love this guy
🙂
oh oh oh ....37 years after i startet measuring with any light meter including the selen cell type ones , it was you mr. o´nions, who explained it the right way. thank you so much. i finally got the difference between positive and negative film concerning meetering....now, that i am aware of this - i will try my best to make better positives. i wish you all the best and thank you again for " ...you have to get rid of the highlights..." stay healthy and please continue with these fabulous foto hiking tours.....greeting fron a typical german wandersman...andy
Thanks Andreas.
You are by far my favorite youtube channel on the matter of film photography, as a beginner it is a pleasure to learn from you experience and expertise. And I am always blown away by the quality both of your photographs and your videos. I don't often comment but I really wanted to thank you for your work.
Thanks Gauthier, that’s very kind of you to say.
This is fantastically helpful. Thank you.
Glad it was helpful!
Those recommendations are extremely good ideas ! I use a separate light meter also because I use several different film cameras. One meter seems best. Thank you. RS. Canada
Thanks Richard. Using a single light meter does ensure consistency and promotes good technique.
My first "spotmeter" was an attachment that went on my Gossen Luna Pro that gave me a choice of a 15 or 30 degree spot. My next meter was a Sekonic L-488 digital spot meter and life got better. A very good video and I am glad that you covered the differences between metering for slide and for print film. For many years, my favorite color film was Kodachrome 25 and it was not forgiving.
Thank you.
Best explanation of using the Zone system and its relationship to the camera setting.
Thanks Steve for making the video no one else would. It answered quite a few questions.
I’m glad you liked it Joseph.
Richard took the words right out of my mind. Steve is top shelf among the photo guys. Both talented artist and able teacher. Thanks and greetings from Germany.
Thank you Jan, that’s very kind 😊
Another brilliant tutorial, the best that I have come across for metering and the zone system. I went looking for a spot meter after seeing your video and discovered that I'd have to sell all my film cameras to buy one!
Thanks Sameer, spotmeters have never been cheap sadly.
This is such a helpful video. I love every video Mr. O'nions puts out. his work has been extremely helpful as I learn film photography.
Thank you Zakary.
I have been on a massive binge watching your channel as I just discovered it. This has to be the best explanation of metering and the zone system I have seen on UA-cam. It answered all of the questions I had as I am about to jump into the film world for the first time soon. Your channel is amazing, and thank you for putting out helpful, insightful, and interesting content.
Thanks John, really glad you found the video useful.
Excellent video. Great pacing, great examples and great length
Thank you 😊
Excellent Video
Thanks, great video. Now everything became clear to me.
Glad it helped!
Thank you for this video. I found it quite helpful.
Glad to be of help Alan.
Steve,
Great job. After following the late Richard White and others I was getting fairly competent with the zone system. I followed your strategy and nailed it. You made what I once thought complicated and confusing simply and straight forward. I follow your channel and have gained great knowledge from your work.. Thank you.
Glad you found it useful Michael, it’s a lot easier to do than describe 🙂
Thanks Steve! Even though I regularly use a spotmeter and shoot slide, I still feel like I learned something just by hearing how you do it. Very nice!
Thanks Arild.
Steve nice work. God to see you are bringing back that film art style we left a few years back. Keep save !
Thanks Stafford.
Thanks for sharing that with us!
You’re welcome 😊
Excellent video, Steve. Love the technical information 🙏🏽
You’re welcome 😊
Nicely done, as usual. Thanks for delivering on the promise! Can't wait for the in-depth version.
The master at work. Brilliant educational and instructive video put over clearly and slowly, even I understood. Thank you Steve. Love to have a longer video on this subject.
Glad it was helpful!
Steve, you go into a lot of detail; but it is very helpful for anyone who has a desire to know what is happening. Thank you!
Thanks Michael 🙂
An excellent description of a complex subject, brief and concise. Well done Steve and keep safe.
Cheers Phillip.
I still use a Pentax spot meter I bought in 1972. It works like a charm, except for the complete lack of memory and calculating devices found in more modern digital models . My own memory is 73 years old and a digital assist would be nice. Thanks Steve, you do good work. By the way, I think I learned almost everything I know about b&w film photography from Ansel Adams' The Negative. It is old but for me it has been a bible.
Thanks Michael, you’ve have more than a fair return on your investment I think 👍
If you have a smartphone, there are pretty good exposure metering apps available.
@@valueforvalue76 Alas I don't use a smartphone, I'm a true Luddite I guess. Thank you for you for suggestion though.
@@michaelbailey1578 Nothing wrong with that, I'm sure we'd all get more accomplished if we did not carry smartphones.
Thank you for yet again another video on the finer details of film photography.
You’re welcome George.
Thanks a lot for this video. Very simple explanation that anyone can understand. Keep up with the good work you do.
Great explanation! took me a long time to find a comprehensive one here
Glad you liked it Julián.
Excellent! So clear and concise.
Cheers Bob.
Excellent explanation on spot metering! Super clear and concise.
Thanks Dave.
Thank you for this video - it is the singular clearest explanation of how to meter for shadows and get what you want. I have been worried I have been under-exposing my images and, looking at this, I am! I look forward to getting out and tring to be a bit braver with shadows!
Glad you found it useful Chris. I always remember the quote from Ansel Adams that went was I believe ‘when I got a spot meter my typical exposures went up by one stop’.
Thank you so much for taking the time to explain
You’re welcome Claudio.
This is such an incredibly educational video for a beginner such as myself. Your use of example photos and elaboration on the metering process in the moment was really illuminating (pun slightly intended). Thanks, Steve!
Glad you liked it 🙂
I absolutely love your videos. So enjoyable to watch and equally informative. It’s really helping me get back into film photography after a long hiatus.
Great to hear that Nicholas 🙂
I have just bought myself a spotmeter a couple of days ago.
This video has certainly improved my knowledge to use it even better now.
looking forward to learn more about specific filmstocks from you!
Good timing Faber, you will soon get used to using the meter an wonder how you managed without it.
Your explanation has been so helpful. I agree more videos on these with the color film would be awesome too. Thank you for your content. It's very inspirational.
Thank you! Will do!
Another great video!
Excellent spotmeter discussion with examples; really enjoyed the color positive aspect because I do not us; still clinging to my Pentax Spotmeter V (analog) w/ Zone VI studio scale for the last 35 years... as always great job Steve!!
Thanks Randy, those original Pentax models have given so much service over the years.
Thank you! This was extremely educational for me and I have been shooting for some time now. Professionally explained! :D
Thanks Manca.
I've just bought exactly the same meter for use with my Mamiya C330. Thanks for the helpful tutorial!
Glad it was useful Rupert.
OK! You've convinced me! Now the challenge -- an affordable one!!!!! :-) Thanks Steve!
Good luck !!
Excellent post! Thanks, Steve. Some of this information needs to be known more widely to avoid the disappointments that may go with film photography.
Thanks Walter.
Awesome vid! I just recently got back into film, I grew up in photography in the 70s. I have a Nikon F4, Olympus OM-2SP, and a Minolta XD-11 ( was my first film camera in the 70s). I just won on eBay a Minolta Autocord. I need to get back to metering and your video has helped my bunches!
Sounds great!
Wow 😲😲 Four (4) cameras, how many rolls of film do you have? Sorry, but I couldn't help it😉😉.
Very well explained!!
Light meters are wonderful. I use them as I use various cameras
Love your channel Steve. Your videos are very informative and very well delivered. This particular video clear demonstrated the use and value of the spot meter for creating the correct exposure. Thanks
I’m glad you found it useful Patricia.
This is great Steve, thanks. I am always questioning my spot metering techniques...this really helps.
Glad you liked it Bill.
Thanks for the comprehensive, yet brief run through your process for metering Steve. I have pulled my fathers old 35 mm film camera out of the closet and am thinking of giving it a go with either HP5 + or Kodak Tri-X 400 film.
Thanks Larry and I hope you manage to get out with the camera soon.
Brilliant, really super helpful and I have watched and read so much on spot metering. Thank you!
Glad you liked it Martin.
Brilliant video which really helped me understand zone metering. Cheers!
Glad it helped Jacob.
Very useful info. Thanks! I will try to think in terms of zones. Now, some people I think have a different philosophy on the slide film part. Sometimes shadows can be nearly black and it's fine, but I often feel that blown highlights ruin the image more often than too dark shadows. Maybe this is from my frustration early on with getting images back from the lab that were washed out, or maybe I just like mysterious darks. There are always exceptions of course.
I’m the same. I can live with a solid shadow area but and substantial area of pure white kills an image for me.
This is superb information Steve, thank you. I'll probably watch this a couple of times and make notes to carry with me. I've not yet attempted to shoot slide film but it's on the list.
Glad it was useful Glenn.
Hi Steve - excellent explanation as always. I've used my Pentax Spotmeter for years with B&W negatives of all formats from 35mm to 4x5". For slides (Provia) I always use 35mm in my F4S and am happy with the exposures I get from the TTL set to "partial spot".
Thanks Ray. I’ve also had very good slides from my Nikon’s using their inbuilt meters. The F80 is nearly always spot on.
Very solid and good elaboration, appreciate it Steve, keep on with the good effort of your videos
Thanks Patrick 👍
Great video, well done explanation,many thanks!
Thanks Nat.
@@SteveONions have a great Sunday,stay safe!
Nice one Steve, Just got my minolta spotmeter F still works after many years.
Another fine piece of equipment John 👍
Excellent presentation and explanation Steve. Well done!!
Thanks Christos.
Many thanks, excellent video and helpful!!!
Thank you 😊
I'm trying the zonal system when I go out to shoot portraits on Provia 100F later this month. I don't have a handheld light meter so I will use the spot meter on my Nikon Z6 (I'm shooting digital that day as well as slide film) in aperture priority with the ISO fixed at 100. I get the feeling the bright skin tones I'll need to place somewhere from zone 6-7 (I've learned that the exposure ceiling of Provia is around +2EV). I may bracket +1, +1.5 and +2EV and hopefully learn where this magic EV number is (although I expect this will change in different weather conditions - maybe zone 6 in overcast/flat conditions and closer to 7 in bright conditions). Wish me luck
Hope it goes well Dave, Provia is more forgiving than a lot of other slide films.
To make things even 'easier' use Ralph Lambrechts exposure 'wheel'. Page 258-259 in his collaboration book with Chris Woodhouse "Way Beyond Monochrome". I have been using this for about 20 years (my book copy is c2003). I have not had a missed exposure since. What I really love from this post is the differences between negs and slides and metering as such. Steve, you are an inspiration.
Brett Weston Q "Photography is 90% sheer, brutal drudgery. The other 10% is inspiration" ..
When I learned that my spot meter was giving me a reading that turned everything a medium grey. It made getting a good exposure really very simple. For example meter snow and the meter will give you a reading that will turn it medium grey . So open up a couple stops maybe more and get the white you know the snow actually is. Same with shadow areas except you will stop down from the reading to get the deep shadows captured the way they are. I also have a 18% grey card with me when i am shooting close subjects such as fern or flowers etc. Set the card near the subject take a spot reading off the card and this time you do use the reading as is for a perfect exposure.
I should also carry an 18% grey card Terry as sometimes it would simplify the process.
Why would you leave the metered reading alone? If you were in close photographing a white flower wouldn’t leaving the actual reading as your exposure give you a gray flower?
@@NarcissismSurvivor Not when metering off the grey card. Put the Card in the same light as the flower and meter off it for the correct exposure. No adjustment needed.
@@NarcissismSurvivor You can meter the part of the flower that renders as mid grey
Fantastic explanation. Thank you so much
Appreciate this tutorial, Steve. Been out shooting with my 4x5 Rangefinder (it's a converted Polaroid 110) and used the two-stops faster method here with my FP4 and HP5. Works out pretty well so far. Will definitely come in handy when I shoot some Rollei RPX 25 with a camera on sticks. Cheers.
Thanks Bill, glad your exposures are coming out just fine 👍
Just had a little go in the garden with my meter. Not enough dark stuff round the house really, but even so it worked and is very useful........Now to find the dynamic range of my digital camera.
You'll probably have a lot of lot of range with a modern camera John, you can treat the shadows with impunity and still get plenty of detail in there.
An excellent lesson, thanks for doing it.
Thank Alan.
Great video look forward to the in depth video on a particular film stock. Thanks
Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience with us once again. Really high quality content.
Looking forward for the follow-up video!
Thanks Abel.
Very interesting and helpful Steve! I’m still getting my head around the Zone System, and have only recently started to use a Pentax V spotmeter. You’ve given me a better understanding, for which I’m grateful. Incidentally, I’ve also recently shot my first-ever roll of slide film (Kodak Ektachrome), using my recently-acquired Nikon FA, and only one of the 36 shots was poorly exposed. I really like the look of this film, and the FA’s matrix meter seems to be very effective.
Thanks Neil. I think the FA was the first camera to have matrix metering and it improved on Nikon's already effective centre weighted mode. I should try Ektachrome, I have a liking for neutral films and it might fit the bill.
Steve O'Nions It’s also 3/4 the price of Velvia. If you want to see some of the test shots I took, my Instagram ID is shortstroke596.
Am gonna have to re-watch this a few times. Never found it easy. Knowing the 9 stop gradient seems to be key. I think!
It took me some time too, easier to do than explain 🙂
Hey Steve, great as always! Just wished to have a little bit of information on the using the dome on the Sekonic for measuring.
I’ll do an incident metering video one day Martin.
Exposure spot on with spot meter. The neg for shade and pos for highlights approach is fine. My Sekonic 758 can be used to calibrate a film or a camera. This makes dynamic range explicitly visible in the user interface (an app is used as tool).
Finding the darkest point in your image, then the brightest, places both measurements on the display and suggests the optimal exposure. Here the photographer decides what to do when subject dynamic range is larger than film/camera dynamic range: all highlights, all lowlights or a piece of both.
So, we can simplify and focus our metering as explained, or work with dynamic ranges.
We ought not call this light metering, though, as we meter the subject ...
Personally, I still use (incident) light metering most. That is, now my new digital camera can meter for the highlights and I love this a lot, so the meter is using batteries for standby ... Or flash metering in the studio.
Be aware that a discrete meter does not know your lens's T stop and you have to compensate differently for each lens, potentially. In pos film you may underexpose a bit and not notice you lost something. In neg film, you lose critical shadow details. With cameras metering through the lens (TTL) the T stop got forgotten, but with the discrete meter we need the awareness.
And when you develop/process your own film, make this part of your meter/film calibration runs. By the way, with leaf shutters in exchangeable lenses, run a calibration of the shutters, say once a year (test shots of gray scales in controlled light). After all, you got here because you want perfect exposure and maximum utilization of dynamic range.
When you digitally scan your work, you can benefit from image processing software that can make the shoulders of the film's density as function of log I*t curve suitable for use, which they weren't in the old days. And check out the effects of opening as 32-bits to high and low details.
As I predominantly shoot negative materials and err on the side of extra exposure I can largely ignore the variations of shutter and aperture that can indeed ruin a slide image. Processing is very important for B&W but I chose not to include it here as it's a whole set of videos in its own right!
A very interesting and informative presentation!
Thanks Andrew.
Great video as always! Learnt a lot. Would love to see a video about using slide film + spot metering + grad filters to control a scene with big dr. I've found it challenging to accurately place grads using the waist level finder on my medium format camera. Would be curious to learn from your process!
Great suggestion for a future video David.
Very helpful!!!
Glad it was useful Laura.
Thank you Steve for this blog. Brings back memories of when I used to shoot film. Nowadays, I simply use ETTR to make sure highlights are retained and manipulate the image in post for the shadows. Digital sensors are so.much better in dynamic range that we have all forgotten about the need to carefully consider exposure settings.
I also use ETTR with digital cameras and have no problem with shadow detail, works very well indeed.
You haven't tried Portra 400 then!
Nicely done Steve, thanks for sharing. Get it right 'in camera" is my motto, less to fix (if at all) later in post. Although I must admit there is a certain lazy joy in occasionally using digital where you can chimp like crazy to get the exposure right!
Thanks Marc 🙂
As usual Steve,...very much enjoyed!..take care.
Thanks Christopher.
My Pentax Spotmeter V has a genial scale that works perfectly with two-spot metering. Never missed a slide.
Recently bought the same model - couldn't afford the digital model. Also useful with an 18% gray card for incident light on the subject. The rotary scale is perfect for converting the EV value to a camera setting.
Earned a sub from me for explaining this so well!
really helpful , thank you for this video
Hi Steve. Would you say a spot meter is useful if using a DSLR, I enjoy using manual settings, and thought it would be a worthy addition. To use on those tricky situations, where I feel my in camera metering just won't do. Any thoughts?
Digital cameras can work very well Richard but I suppose I’ve got used to spot metering and find it all part of the film shooting process now.
Back in those days, about 40 years ago, I shoot mostly slides with my OM-2 for private use. Mostly with Kodachrome 25 and Velvia 50. Can't remember once that I missed the metering. Now I have even better metering system, in my "new" OM-3Ti. But I'm agree that I need a good spotmeter for my MF and LF camera. Thank's for explaining. By the way, I had a very good color meter, what I sold for a good penny.
I also got pretty good at metering with my Nikon’s but the lack of a decent (or any) medium/large format inbuilt metering makes a separate one invaluable.
In addition to my digital Sekonic color meter, I still have my old Gossen Sixticolor color meter. 😊
Thank you, explained very well
Thank Brian.
great informative video thank you
I use the same Sekonic 508 and really like it, but I must say: If the scene is not very constrasty, I use it in ambient light meter mode and usually have no bad results.
If the scene is contrasty though, the spotmeter is the best method of metering. For small format I use an Olympus OM-4 quite often and when I use this camera, I do not take an external meter, since this funny little thing has an inbuilt spotmeter. Not the tightest 1° spot, but the split screen in the center is the measuring spot, so it is TTL and tight enough. The best reason to love the little thing.
With slide - difficult. I love Provia 100 (Velvia is a bit too much color for my liking). But I only use it with my 6x6 SLR and quite often I use neutral grad filters. In gerneral I think I will stop shooting slide once the current stock in the freezer is gone and use Ektar 100 and Portra 160 exclusively in the future.
Spot metering is probably overkill for low contrast scenes shot with negative film, it’s hard to get the reading wrong! I’ve sometimes used the incident meter for colour slide and it works very well.
I’ve never used the spot meter in my later film cameras, I prefer the matrix options.
Very nice and clear explanation, just the way I was thought how light metering works. I only shoot digital but that doesn’t make any difference in the way you meter (only more dr than slide film) I have exactly the same Sekonic meter, works a charm.
Hi Steve, thanks for such an instructive and useful video on spotmetering so helpful especially concerning the latitude of different film stock (I learned a lot). I have a Minolta Spotmeter F and love it as I try to apply the zone system - as you say it enables metering from such small area of the scene that you cannot get close to. Quick question how do you factor in for filters do you just add the necessary number of stops to the shutter duration (I was wondering why you don't use the exposure compensation dial) thanks Tony
Good question Tony. I work out the exposure without the filter then add that in, effectively lengthening the shutter speed. I the. Apply any other factors such as reciprocity failure or bellows extension for large format.
Nice one Steve.
Cheers James.
Hi Steve, great video. You don’t talk about using incident light measurements. You don’t use that at all with spot measurements ? Thanks
I never use the Incident feature on my Sekonic Zenon although it is very good for slide metering.
nice vid... actually velvia has a DR of around 6-7 stops with drum scanning :)
Oh yes, not so easy to get into the shadows with conventional scanners 🙂
Ugh! It’s maddening. Just when I think that I’ve got it down it escapes me. Please let me ask a question… When you metered off of the tree shadow how did you know that the spot was was a zone 3? Just practice? Thank you!
That’s the main problem, what is a zone III? It’s largely subjective but I’ve settled on picking a fairly deep shadow where I still want to see plenty of detail and base my exposure on that. Others may call that a Zone II or Zone IV. When in doubt I always add at least one more stop of exposure if I’m shooting with a negative film.
Thanks for this
You’re welcome Graham.
what an informative video. on both spot metering and the zone system. thank you! i have a sekonic 308 meter, which is not a spot meter. Can you recommend a "budget friendly" spot meter? thank you!
There’s not really a cheap option these days Nate, my Seconic L-508 is definitely one of the most affordable.
Thanks for this very helpful lecture. While saving for an adequate spot meter, I’m going to try utilizing my z6 which has a 1 degree spot metering feature. Not sure how precise this may be but with reading the results instantaneously on the digital camera you may be able to finagle a decent reading. ONE question if I may... what’s the purpose of using slide film if the dynamic range is so limited? Is it the color rendition? Your image with the slide film is just lovely. Thanks again!
Slide film is more vibrant and can expand the range of tones in a low contrast scene. If there are less than 5 stops of range then slide film will produce a very pleasing result, negative material on the other hand can look quite muddy.
Steve O'Nions Thank You. for this very informative response!
I keep rewatching the bit at 6:18 but I don't understand it... You said that you meter the shadow areas that you wish to get in the final image to appear as they are "zone 3". Now, when you meter something, the exposure meter tells you what exposure time you need to have that part of the image appear as "zone 5". Hence, you underexpose 2 stops on that reading to get them to "zone 3". Isn't that how it is? If so, why are you showing the arrow going from zone 3 to zone 5? Isn't it viceversa? I'm sorry if what I'm saying is confusing
That is correct, as I hope the video shows. Measuring a zone III and underexposing by two stops will give sufficient shadow detail for the print 🙂
@@SteveONions Thank you :) I think it's quite challenging to show it visually as you did. Perhaps a better way would be to have another zone system scale on top which is offset so that the "V" is on top of the "III" when you meter. When you say "I underexpose by 2 stops", that could be shown as a movement of the upper scale to the right, so that the two scales overlap. I found it a little confusing with the arrows because you show the arrow moving from zone III to zone V, when saying that you underexpose, which made me think like "a zone III will appear as a zone V if you underexpose", which is the opposite of what actually happens! Sorry for splitting hairs, the entire video was amazing
I was really happy to find your site. I have a question about metering. When you get a fractional stop such as f 22.8 and you can't actually set that on your camera do you round up to the next stop or back down to f 22.
Good question Graham. If I’m shouting negative film I always allow any extra exposure by using the larger fstop. So if it reads 1/15@f/11.6 I’d go for f/11. With slide film I’d avoid the overexposure so probably go the other way but it does depend on where you choose to meter so it’s never going to be exact.
*Good video:* One exception I can think of is snow scenes, where the right exposure may be two or three stops above the average value over the whole view. Thus, you need to expose for the objects of interest, and disregard the snow itself, most of which will be grossly overexposed, and totally white. Nobody likes grey snow! :-)
I hope we can see a video on this channel about how, when, and why to an incident light meter.
Good point about the snow 👍. I’ll do an incident video one day. 🙂
Great video Steve. Could you comment on when and whether you rate your negative films at (typically) lower E.I.'s. As you know, part of the Zone system involves testing for film speed based on your personal equipment and developing methods. I always ended up with half box speed after testing several films. By the way, Bruce Barnbaum recommends placing shadows on ZIV for better separation of values. Have you given that a go? 📷
I tend to agree Gregory, half box speed is about right especially for the larger formats where overexposure never gives me a problem. It also depends on lighting of course and in flat conditions I prefer box speed or higher to expand the range somewhat. The post production also makes a difference, I like a thin negative for scanning but a thicker one for the darkroom.
@@SteveONions Thank you Steve!