Four streams of blood pouring out of a beating heart, one darker than the other. My dear Liszt, if you had written only this melody, you would be immortal.....
When played this magnificently this piece almost seems to be greater than the great Sonata in B minor. Certainly, it seems more personal, more philosophically searching.
I know! Me too! It's addictive, totally unique, and sort of trans-musical. I find myself returning to it quite frequently since I discovered it a couple years back. It is the ultimate in piano sound.
There are moments of sublime terror in the music ... like a thunderstorm rolling down the Alps ... or a man gazing into the abyss, and seeing the abyss gaze back into him.
Extraordinary. Truly out of this world. The wrong notes are almost insignificant in that the overall arch and passion for the music is so overwhelming. I do adore this pianist. What a wild man!
Harold C. Schonberg, the renowned music critic of the New York Times, was stunned when he heard Nyiregyhazi: “I never dreamed I would hear a true 19th-century pianist living in the 20th century.”
I was there in San Francisco when he was 'rediscovered'. He played at a church at the behest of a friend. That appearance started something big. There is no one like Nyiregyhazi, will not be.
I wish I had been there. Coincidentally, I read the book about his childhood at the same time he was "re-discovered" in 1972. After I finished the book, I said to myself: "Gee, I wonder what happened to him."
I wish there were more recordings from the time when he could actually play. The make believe role playing about his phenomenal playing in old age is bizarre
@@davidemarchi6366 Yes there is. Claudio Arrau took a similar approach to most of the works that Nyiregyházi recorded, but he had a flawless technique and a much larger and broader repertoire. Nyiregyházi wasn't highly regarded as an interpreter of Chopin nor Beethoven, Arrau was. Arrau had a repertoire of +/- 80 concertos alone. Compare any work they both recorded. Nyiregyházi was an incredible virtuoso in his early career but his technique later in life was flawed due to years of not being able to maintain a structured practice owing to not having a piano at home (or a home at all) for extended amounts of time. Nyiregyházi took his approach to playing to the very extreme to the point when momentum is lost due to slow tempi (especially in slower passages and/or movements). This works great in his rendition of the Brahms opus 5 sonata, but becomes problematic in Vallée d'Obermann and especially in his Rach 2 adagio. If you think that his approach works then try Wolfgang Weller's recordings. Again, one can use the Brahms opus 5 sonata as a comparison.
I've now listened to this version at least one hundred times, very likely upwards of two hundred. I lost count. It remains the most earth-shaking expression of the human spirit ever put down on record.
One of the greatest solo piano recordings of all time.... up there with Hofmann's Chopin Ballade 4, Rachmaninov's Chopin Second Sonata, Busoni's C major WTC 1, Cortot's 1933 Chopin preludes, Horowitz's Dance Macabre from the 1940s, Feinberg's Scriabin Fourth sonata, and some others Nyiregyhazi is an absolute genius!!
Truly one of the greatest moments in all recordings of the European pianistic art form. It is primordial, barely in the realm of sound, pure emotional truth.
vurria123 I couldn't agree more. I think we are hearing more than just thrilling virtuosity here, or grasp of architecture, or profound tone. We are hearing an identification with the music so complete and sincere it is as if the performer composed the music at that moment to the dictates of their feelings and their Will. Not a million miles from the feeling of seeing a great actor perform a role with total identification with the part, to the point where role and actor become one. I have never heard this quality at this level of intensity in music before, a quality which sounds like that reported of Liszt or Anton Rubinstein. It is the most precious and rare quality in music (and all art) and in listening to this recording I feel like I have at last heard some fragment of Liszt's own performance. Something I never dreamt I would hear. And honestly I don't hear it at this level in many other of Nyiregyhazi's recordings ... this piece seems to have elicited a superhuman response from him.
@@iianneill6013 What virtuosity? Maybe he missed the virtuosity in the ~5,000 notes he missed, or maybe in his indiscriminate banging he technically hit all the right notes, but also all the wrong notes.
The effects of mass that he achieves with piano tone is astonishing. At times it is spiritually crushing -- from 6:10 to 7:05 -- at other times it is Michelangesque in force -- 11:35 to 13:05. But even in these moments of superhuman strain the tone is never harsh or ugly. Indeed there is a beautiful singing tone throughout, and some passages of exquisite luminous delicacy in the treble, such as 15:50 to 16:52 ...
I disagree. I find the tone to be quite ugly and harsh in these passages. There is some really excruciatingly bad pedaling in this performance as well. In addition, I feel that this piece is an example of Liszt being a highly important composer, but not a great one. I'm just not moved by Liszt in this work. But I guess it is all a matter of personal taste.
@@j.d.miller4203 I get the sense that you are more of a pianist than I am -- I am just a listener -- so you no doubt have a better ear for such defects than I do. I confess that these do not trouble me: the power of his interpretation, his musical conception, and his extraordinary tone is what moves me. As for the piece itself ... for me Nyiregyhazi explores the depths and summits of it in a way like no other pianist has that I have heard yet. I respect, of course, that you have different preferences and opinions, and I appreciate the thoughtfulness of your response.
what i perceived here and it's effect on me days later....is a type of brilliance. my teacher anthony casario, the actual pianistic protege of leo ornstein TOLD me about nyireghazi in my youth, and ranked him with horowitz and others. WHAT i heard in this interpretation was that he took the lead melody line ....a cello perhaps. and HELD it to such a tension, and HELD the tempo in such an extreme manner ....that a whole OTHER d'obermann came out of it.....if liszt intended that or NOT. i believe he would have said bravo......forget adjectives and all these quibbles......to DO ...WHAT he did with it. few pianists would have the discipline or technical equipment to actually do. with wasn't BANGED, thumped or any of that.....it was done with another KIND of approach. ...u can't do that to every piece. but whoever he was.... we was a genius......
I could not agree with you more ... except the melodic line reminded me more of a powerful baritone than a cello ... but you have put into words exactly what I feel about this masterpiece.
There is not only a grasp of the architecture here -- which other great pianists have achieved -- there is absolute sincerity of emotion, and an audacious ability to 'distort' the form to the will of the performer. This was a characteristic of Franz Liszt, the greatest piano interpreter of all time (according to friendly and hostile witnesses), who was said to almost 'recompose' the music as he played. In artistic terms, I think of this as a supreme exercise of the 'plastic imagination' (the shaping will), the point where form and expression fuse in the imagination of the performer or artist.
@@Fritz_Maisenbacher Fritz you did not respond to my comment on your post with the apparent Horowitz live recording of the Sonata...just to recap what I said: I utterly can not believe that was actually Horowitz. I am convinced that was Nyiregyhazi. I have never ever heard Horowitz play like that and it does not sound like him!! I am in denial.
Wow...so incredibly emotive and keeps you captive to every note. Thank you for uploading and thank you Ervin for being alive and playing music for the sake of music.
An astonishingly idiosyncratic interpretation. In parts agonizingly brooding - bordering on plodding -, in others hysterical. It brings out the neurotic side of Senancour's 1804 novel. What a contrast with Arrau's magisterially paced, controlled performance !!
Reading all the previous comments it is very clear that you either expect total fidelity to the score with little personal injection, a playing of the score in a purely intellectual manner or you are prepared to throw expectations out of the window and listen to a technical giant (listen to his Mazeppa roll) whose technique is put in service to the emotional requirements of the music. OK perhaps many of his mannerisms can take you out of your comfort zone but add all the bits up and the whole is truly unsettling in the best sense of the word, suddenly you are asking yourself questions about life itself. I have played this piece for very many years and many people say I am the only one who gets the beginning right, all the other pianists throw it away as insignificant, Richter doesn't (but Horowitz does) but then ruins the piece by going all "virtuoso" and this is the danger in this piece. The Vallee explores the very depths of a mans soul and the quotation that Liszt prefaces the score with tells you how deep you must go and Nyiregyhazi does that. The 13-20 minutes it takes to play it require so much mental energy and if you listen to N with his crescendo of emotion time stands still. The slips and technical problems can all be explained by his not practising and his years away from the piano, this recording was probably the first time he had played the piece in 50 years, and his technical problems...so what I couldn't care less about them. I will still continue to play it my way but must incorporate more of the agony from N's playing to really reach the depths of this extraordinary and masterful piece. thanks for uploading it, a wonderful document of the style of piano playing 100 years ago.
Utterly awe-inspiring. I had never heard Vallee d'Obermann before this, and after hearing this performance the first time I then listened to it straight through again three more times. I then went and looked up Horowitz's performances, expecting that perhaps Nyiregyhazi's would look mannered or sentimental in comparison ... instead, although Horowitz was technically fearless his interpretation lacked the spiritual abysses of this masterpiece. I now love this piece -- specifically, this recording of it -- as much as the B Minor Sonata, to which this seems the natural companion. Thank you so much for sharing this tremendous relic!
That B minor Sonata is the reason pieces like this are so little played. That B minor Sonata deserves a rest... a LONG rest. It should be banned from competitions, and allowed but once every three years in any given concert hall. It has been banged through so many times by so many mediocre pianists - Lang Lang are you reading this? - that there are circus parrots that give this piece a better "rendition" than some recordings! This is but one of too many Liszt pieces that deserve a wider audience. Much wider.
As highly as many people think of Horowitz, this does seem to be a better interpretation. Mr. N's performance was out of this world. About 8 minutes longer than H's interpretation. That very last note, even though it is just one note, is so masterfully played. It is a perfect foil for everything that came before it.
Ervin Nyiregyhazi may be too controversial of a pianist for modern ears. His loud banging certainly doesn’t help matters. But, if you’re willing to look at the things he does RIGHT, rather than WRONG - you will find he has a much more exquisite, expansive tempo, appropriate for the likes of this kind of piece. I remember hearing somewhere that Liszt himself hated hearing this piece in his masterclasses because it was supposedly a depiction of loneliness - his cosmic loneliness. I prefer this tempo to even the “slow by modern standards” ones of Arrau and Richter. Remember this - Ervin Nyiregyhazi is a grandpupil of Liszt himself. He studied with Frederic Lamond, one of Liszt’s last students. Lamond must have taught Nyiregyhazi much of Liszt’s own manner, so in some ways this must be more authentic than we can handle. One could only wish we could hear Beethoven from Nyiregyhazi, for his teacher Lamond was intimately acquainted with Beethoven’s music.
I just listened to the "Panorama" from T's Sleeping Beauty here on YT. Great composers could make unforgettable beauties out of just the first few notes of a descending scale.
In a parallel universe, Ervin delivered this performance at an international piano competition in Shangai. At the 10 minute mark he was forcibly removed from the stage by 5 competition staff. Then he forced his way back on stage and finished it. He left the stage again to silence. He then quickly returned to pick up the half bottle of Palinka he left under the piano.
A temperamental predominance. Sounds like a little bit confusingly at first because this pianist didn’t play like the academism which each piano student has to follow about piano performance disciplines. However, you will feel more confident, comfortable that this pianist was a historical legendary after hearing the whole recording. 🎉🎉🎉
If you can find the book I recommend it. Incredible work, which really does not deserve the obscurity it has been condemned to. I do not know if it has been translated into any other languages than the original French.
Has anyone read it and is able to summarize it? I did find the free ebook on gutenberg linked below but am not much of a book reader, more of informative/science only guy www.gutenberg.org/files/32808/32808-h/32808-h.htm
According to 'Lost Genius' by Kevin Bazzana, Nyiregyhazi recorded Vallee d'Obermann on January 8, 1978 on an old Baldwin piano at the Scottish Rite Temple on Nineteenth Avenue at Sloat Boulevard. The piano was in wretched condition and would not stay in tune (the soundboard had lost its 'crown'). Nyiregyhazi told Kapp that, “It is not the piano that makes the sound. It is I who make the sound.”
There is a spirit here unlike anything else I've encountered .But the piano tone is rendered unnuanced by the bad recording. The playing really sounds like a different generation. So odd everyone wants to play stylistically correct for the period but when they get to romantic period music they forget that the performer really shares the spotlight. Listen to Joseph Joachim's recs and you'll see what I'm talking about.The training is better today than it ever was in the past -this is obvious from most of the old recordings not made by the really extraordinary ones. I love Vallee D'oberman as much as the b minor sonata . It is such a vision.
If we didn’t have this bad recording, we wouldn’t be able to hear it at all. If I remember correctly this was recorded with a portable cassette recorder.
Those who listened the sound are critical....Those who listened with the heart extatic....This is no more sound and more than perfect music....This is not a first of his class" perfect pianist"...This is a god .... Any other version, even the perfect one, sound boring after that....Do you find volcanic eruption boring or distateful? Only Liszt or Scriabin ask to be played like that...This music is not written to be "tasted" but to change the world itself....
About once a year for the last couple I have returned back to hear Ervin. Initially I was not particularly liking what I was hearing, you could say I was moreso jarred by an abnormal listening experience than actually not liking it. Well, now fast forward, this past October 30th I had my gargantuan juried graduation concert for the pinnicle of my Bachelors of music in performance of piano, and I ended the whole thing with Polnisch thanks to the upload on here of Ervin introducing me to the absolutely sublime work! Now returning back to him once again many months later, I feel completely torn on the inside and convicted, I am going to get to the very bottom of this situation why Ervin played the way that he did... I want as much as it will cost my time and hard efforts, I want to achieve this level of depthness in my approach of the instrument. Anyone, with their knowledge, please quote me anything or show me anything pertaining to the research and ideologies of this mans approach! I have also been trying to search in the depths pertaining to Busoni! An absolutely radical giant.
CziffraTheThird, have you read Kevin Bazzana's biography on Nyiregyhazi? It is essential for understanding the life, aesthetic, and technique of the man. I bought an ebook version through Google Books.
This reminds me of Mahler 8th "Symphony for A Thousand" ,,,,,, BUT ITS A PIANO. Making it sing. And how he places bass chords. I dream to play like this.
Some seem to feel this is a rough amateurish performance. I don’t agree. It is played the way it was meant to be played. Rough and powerfully. It isn’t a minuet. It is played with passion by someone who had already lived his life. Perfection isn’t artistry.
Some people would stand in front of Michelangelo's Last Judgement and pan it for not being realistic enough, badly drawn, anatomically exaggerated, out of perspective. And some would listen to this recording and hear the greatest spiritual struggle ever put down on tape.
I have been lucky enough to perform this piece publicly...but I was nothing like the GREAT Nyireghazi...he makes Horowitz sound like an amateur... what incredible Liszt-Like playing....aren't we lucky to hear this? I was fortunate to meet Ervin in his fleabag hotel in the Tenderloin of SF in the 70's....but that tale is for another time...all said...I suspect this Vallee was very very close to the playing of Liszt himself...shockingly good...yes...I suppose there are a few wrong notes...but NO great pianist played live w/o many wrong notes...THEY (the "wrong" notes) mean NOTHING...except taking chances...which, unfortunately, today's crop does not take chances...hence, extraordinarily ordinary playing is now the norm...
The secret of Nyiregyhazi is his "time machine". He plays the sounds imagined by Liszt before fixing them in tiny dots on sheets of paper. If you play Liszt based on "the holy score" many passages, runs, scales etc. sound trivial and shallow. Surprise : they aren't. Most certainly he would be shocked listening to contemporary performances ( "This is horrifying, horrifying!" ) His interest was the "effect", not blind demodulation of black dots.
Your word choice cannot be admitted, Horowitz doesn't sound like an "amateur". He just gives a "light" version of the piece, the feelings of Nyiregyhazi nobody had, and never will.
My father had Nyiregyhazi at his house where he did a concert and also made recordings on his concert grand. My dad, Ron Antonioli, was involved in helping him during his Tenderloin years. I also visited him at this tenement apartment as a teenager.
Yeah, I tried to see him at his hotel in Sep. '78 too......but he was not disposed to see me. I wrote an account in response to Michael Brown at N's performance of the Mephisto Waltz. At 15:46 I was listening to this with another pianophile, and said that's miles above Horowitz ,pre- echoing another commentator here. I've read that in a master class, Liszt refused to hear this piece, it brought back too many strong memories for him. What else can be said........behind the stumblings and wrong notes there moved a power of expression that the musical world sees perhaps only once each century.
Six years ago, now, one respondent a Fritz Maisenbacher, posted thus "17:18 .. .. . . aaarrgghhh ...." I supposed and suppose it to have been with reference to some event that occurred during the play of Mr. Nyiregyházi's at that timing. Whatever the case-actual, it lead to an ever-welling gigantic Tsunami of mostly invective, as it was to turn into, this between fans of Mr. N's, and his powerful detractors. What follows was/is my attempt to lend to the disputation some calm by insertion of reason, example and appeal, here as presented unburied from that impressive pile of rancorous verbiage . . . To all here who seem so disparaging of Mr. Nyiregyházi, please try to understand, if you will, that the gentleman had endured most of his life by the time of this recording and, it was one that had featured within it many 'rough spots,' to put it very leastwise? The Fates, apparently tho granting unto him many technical, re-creative and expressive powers, as well had seriously shorted him on ones-of-life. Noted now-deceased author, scholar, and collector of pianists' records, Harry L. Anderson formerly of San Diego, remarked once to myself with others present, and sans equivocation, that Ervin Nyiregyházi had "played like a house 'afire!" and, that it was note-perfect always. Now, of course he could not have come to know this as knowledge gained from sound recordings, as there were none! No. He had HEARD him while living in New York in Nyiregyházi's first days there, on a number of occasions and then later, in Southern California after both had removed to there. (Hofmann and many others too, this same.) This constitutes professional eye-witness testimony that, if called upon to, would have earned him court accreditation as an expert witness to it. Also, Mr. Anderson, beginning in the early Thirties, had been a columnist for various of scholarly musical journals. (His writings are more than worth-while for any seeking-out. I recommend this.) So, as newly armed with all that and keeping mind as well that he possessed then the vigor of youth, I respectfully call upon all who would dismiss cruelly (yes, that) what is heard here as has been done generally, to imagine that all that we hear now, to be technically WITHOUT FLAW! Any change of opinionation? If actually achieved by any loyal doubtful auditors -- then what so-infuses to the souls of we admirers of Erwin Nyiregyházi, will become finally of the comprehensible, if not actually shared. Fair enough? Speaking now of sound recordings from Nyiregyházi's first early period -- loyal and good honest detractors -- please do seek-out that bit of Liszt's Liebestraum and Hungarian Rhapsody, to be heard in the early sound film "The Lost Zeppelin." ua-cam.com/video/bNTU6Ogoudw/v-deo.html There one will be treated to precious filmed moments of the nearly-helpless genius-youth himself, acquitting himself near-miraculously, in supremely fine phrasing and perfection of play. (All goes well 'till that vase crashes!! Then, no more strapping youth Ervin!) The movie is SO silly but, is some late-Twenties fun alright and, does carry this tiny bit, at least, of evidence oh-so-essential. Ha! If ONLY we had that full hour-and-a-half of his pianism solely, sans all the Romance and like- silly bits! Think of how that would have cinched things up firmly and forever, and for all. : | :
Yes, dear James, at this 17:18 , this night, I was HIT. This was not something "good" or "bad" on my side, this was just a sudden encountering with a Titan. I was knocked out after only some bars in this Finale of the Vallée d'Obermann. Only days after this event, I was able to recover and feel what I have heard. This never occured to me. And now, I consider Ervin Nyiregyhazy as one of the greatest pianists of all times, equal with Lipatti, Feinberg or Barere. In music, they are some very seldom interprets who are able to GIVE you something, changing your perception of the world. The greatest chance you can have is to be allowed to listen to it. Ervin is one of these.
I just read the exchange to which you refer here. I was in high school when the recordings of the St. Francis Legends came out, and knew, in spite of the controversy, that this was anything but a joke, and that something of great artistic importance was, thank heavens, preserved. And a very short time after that, the other commercially produced recordings appeared. I felt then, and still do now that something life changing happened to me and that Nyiregyhazi revealed something essential about Liszt: these recordings, particularly of the St.Francis Legends, the B minor Ballade, The Evening Bells, the Third Hungarian Rhapsody, and several others have haunted me ever since. I do not believe that Liszt himself played the way Nyiregyhazy does here, at least not within earshot of anyone else, and I do not believe that it is fair to compare Nyiregyhazy with any of the other "greats." He was in a class by himself, and must be considered on his own terms. For all his slow tempi, technical sloppiness, creative use of crashing sonorities, added notes, hands playing out of sync, etc.(and most of this is quite consciously, deliberately employed by Nyiregyhazy to realize his visionary aims, by the way), there is nevertheless a vivid, powerful, and essential fidelity to the meaning and the spirit of the music. And when he was at his best, he cannot be surpassed.
When was this recorded, I asked and skimmed the comments: Orioninthepolder writes among other things, quote: The slips and technical problems can all be explained by his not practising and his years away from the piano, this recording was probably the first time he had played the piece in 50 years, and his technical problems...so what I couldn't care less about them. //endquote// It can be seen that Orioninthepolder also has played this piece.
According to 'Lost Genius' by Kevin Bazzana, Nyiregyhazi recorded Vallee d'Obermann on January 8, 1978 on an old Baldwin piano at the Scottish Rite Temple on Nineteenth Avenue at Sloat Boulevard. The piano was in wretched condition and would not stay in tune (the soundboard had lost its 'crown'). Nyiregyhazi told Kapp that, “It is not the piano that makes the sound. It is I who make the sound.”
Nyiregyházi can't be judge in human modern terms....he belongs to eternity, to the Hell and to Heaven....he is between humanity and universe and goes to madness and return from it.....
Chances are that this is the loudest and slowest version of this piece currently available. I agree that Nyiregyházi creates a very special atmosphere here, not by adding anything to score, but simply by playing the exact notes, going for the slow and loud. The pianist is obviously struggling in the more technically taxing sections, which makes me wonder if he makes a virtue of necessity. Compared to Horowitz, this is crude pianism, indeed not without interest, but very limited in terms of conveying the subtle shades that makes the most convincing musical performances unforgettable.
E.N.-планета ,движущаяся по своим ,непонятным нам смертным ,своим законам.Простые правила rubato,формы ,стерильность употребления педали не для неё .Музыканта равного Nyiregynazi я припомнить не могу.
I don’t understand why people like this recording. Generally octaves should sound like octaves and not minor 9ths. The last 4 minutes of this interpretation is just incredibly sloppy and it’s annoying that people describe it as soulful. You can be soulful and play octaves at the same time. When you are first taught an instrument, pretty early on you will hear the advice that playing faster and louder doesn’t make you sound better. That is exactly what this performer did here.
Except he did not play faster… he played indeed much slower than most. Horowitz and Volodos finish this piece in 12 minutes, Richter in 14, Arrau in 15, and Nyiregyhazi at a whopping 20. I do agree he was quite loud, much unnecessarily. But the tempo I find much more appropriate and in line with Liszt than modern performers - and that’s not a coincidence. Nyiregyhazi’s teacher was Liszt’s student Frederic Lamond.
@@farazhaiderpiano I suspect a lot of the booming comes from the recording ... other recordings of the Nyiregyhazi fortississimo capture the dynamics better.
We work so hard to control the sound and this pianist has zero control and is just doing whatever he feels. Yes anyone playing these notes it’s going to have some soul to it even if they’re bad, that’s Liszt coming through inspite of the horrible sound quality.
I counsel the player to read about this composition and meditate a better way to play it.No hesitations,please .Liszt have deep thoughts but great actions.
Sorry, but I just do not care for this performance. Many people say this is so much better than Vladimir Horowitz’ performance of the same piece… I don’t see it, at all. To me, this performance is full of so many heavy-handed and outdated pianistic mannerisms. But, each to their own.
Doesn't matter the playing itself but the effect of it.....of course there is distortion and brutal playing, but there is more beyond that, and that is why is so interesting and scary to listen to him....
This is nightmarish , nightmarish ... beyond any experience of myself ... I would prefer never have been listening to that ... but I am completely sellotaped to every phrase , every note . And my memory will conserve all the stuff . O Weh , O Weh ! Why am I listening to this.... ?? I should skip or going anywhere else .... why am I staying here ....?
Just terrible. Does had really think his bog tempos add profundity to these wonderful pieces? Although he does have a good sound in some parts-his thumping fffs are unbearable. A pianist of poor judgement.
To agree with you would be pissing off everyone here who raves about N. But is this the proverbial story about the Emperor's new Clothes? In any case the eccentricities here make Glenn Gould sound like the ultimate conservatory student.
I've heard some bad musical recordings in my years of classical education, but this is singly-handedly one of the most atrocious musical performances I've heard in my life.
@@jameshall401 All I would encourage is listening to the spirit of the recording, the vast expansion of the musical ideas. There is nothing wrong with realism in art or music (i.e., skillful technique and judicious interpretation), but I don't think that's a helpful criterion to apply here.
@@iianneill6013That's a fair point actually. One thing I will certainly commend Nyiregyhazi for is his passion in the performance (there were several passages in it that were in my opinion beautifully executed), but it really seemed he sacrificed most subtlety, musicality, and phrasing for the sake of being "loud", "bombastic", and "grand". Also to clarify, I don't think he's a bad pianist (there are some records that I think are incredible), but this was not it imo. The massive unalignment between lots of notes, the hyper-slow pace of the E Minor passage rather ruined the sense of direction and melody, and the notes in the latter half of the E Major part felt super hammered. There are other things that strongly bother me about this performance, but I just noticed how long my reply is getting lmao Anyway, this is just my opinion and it's totally ok that you like it! Just personally not a recording I like.
No, this is old technology you are hearing, if you are able to listen through the harshnesh of the louder parts the touche is awesome ... but that requires a bit of experience to learn to discern. But trust me, this is pretty amazing ... it is such a different piece in performance than most modern versions and I tell you, this has much more emotion that those of late.
Basically you are hearing the mic's cut off sound that is above its threshold in both EQ range for its pickup (membrame) as well as the loudness of the signal.
Four streams of blood pouring out of a beating heart, one darker than the other. My dear Liszt, if you had written only this melody, you would be immortal.....
When played this magnificently this piece almost seems to be greater than the great Sonata in B minor. Certainly, it seems more personal, more philosophically searching.
I'm here to listen to this again. I can't get out of my head since I heard his sound.
sometimes it hurts bc his voice contains too much sorrow 😢
I know! Me too! It's addictive, totally unique, and sort of trans-musical. I find myself returning to it quite frequently since I discovered it a couple years back. It is the ultimate in piano sound.
There are moments of sublime terror in the music ... like a thunderstorm rolling down the Alps ... or a man gazing into the abyss, and seeing the abyss gaze back into him.
Pro tip: you can watch series at Kaldrostream. Been using it for watching loads of movies lately.
@Roman Duncan Definitely, been watching on kaldrostream for years myself =)
Extraordinary. Truly out of this world. The wrong notes are almost insignificant in that the overall arch and passion for the music is so overwhelming. I do adore this pianist. What a wild man!
@ 14:16 heart dropped. Ever y note is so emotive.
Harold C. Schonberg, the renowned music critic of the New York Times, was stunned when he heard Nyiregyhazi: “I never dreamed I would hear a true 19th-century pianist living in the 20th century.”
But later on at a concert in Japan by EN he walked out early as he thought it was awful.
@@kbrod1 That is true. But he sadly missed out on EN's moving performance of his solo transcription of the middle movement of the Rach 2
I was there in San Francisco when he was 'rediscovered'. He played at a church at the behest of a friend. That appearance started something big. There is no one like Nyiregyhazi, will not be.
Wow.....!
I wish I had been there. Coincidentally, I read the book about his childhood at the same time he was "re-discovered" in 1972. After I finished the book, I said to myself: "Gee, I wonder what happened to him."
For our luck, there is not another like him!
I wish there were more recordings from the time when he could actually play. The make believe role playing about his phenomenal playing in old age is bizarre
@@davidemarchi6366 Yes there is. Claudio Arrau took a similar approach to most of the works that Nyiregyházi recorded, but he had a flawless technique and a much larger and broader repertoire. Nyiregyházi wasn't highly regarded as an interpreter of Chopin nor Beethoven, Arrau was. Arrau had a repertoire of +/- 80 concertos alone. Compare any work they both recorded. Nyiregyházi was an incredible virtuoso in his early career but his technique later in life was flawed due to years of not being able to maintain a structured practice owing to not having a piano at home (or a home at all) for extended amounts of time.
Nyiregyházi took his approach to playing to the very extreme to the point when momentum is lost due to slow tempi (especially in slower passages and/or movements). This works great in his rendition of the Brahms opus 5 sonata, but becomes problematic in Vallée d'Obermann and especially in his Rach 2 adagio.
If you think that his approach works then try Wolfgang Weller's recordings. Again, one can use the Brahms opus 5 sonata as a comparison.
One of a kind..
BRAVO!!!
Agreed, truly a unique performance!
majesty, transcendence, sublime, humanity it is all here
yes.....yes..... true.. most unique interpret on this piece..
wow
One of the greatest things ever.
thank you for introducing me to this🙏🙏🙏 ive watched this several times since your 13 levels of piano performance video
@@cschlums2235 it's an honour that I could be the one to help you discover this :))
I've now listened to this version at least one hundred times, very likely upwards of two hundred. I lost count. It remains the most earth-shaking expression of the human spirit ever put down on record.
I feel like I'm in love with the piano again after listening to this...
One of the greatest solo piano recordings of all time.... up there with Hofmann's Chopin Ballade 4, Rachmaninov's Chopin Second Sonata, Busoni's C major WTC 1, Cortot's 1933 Chopin preludes, Horowitz's Dance Macabre from the 1940s, Feinberg's Scriabin Fourth sonata, and some others
Nyiregyhazi is an absolute genius!!
Truly one of the greatest moments in all recordings of the European pianistic art form. It is primordial, barely in the realm of sound, pure emotional truth.
You understand.
vurria123 I couldn't agree more. I think we are hearing more than just thrilling virtuosity here, or grasp of architecture, or profound tone. We are hearing an identification with the music so complete and sincere it is as if the performer composed the music at that moment to the dictates of their feelings and their Will. Not a million miles from the feeling of seeing a great actor perform a role with total identification with the part, to the point where role and actor become one. I have never heard this quality at this level of intensity in music before, a quality which sounds like that reported of Liszt or Anton Rubinstein. It is the most precious and rare quality in music (and all art) and in listening to this recording I feel like I have at last heard some fragment of Liszt's own performance. Something I never dreamt I would hear. And honestly I don't hear it at this level in many other of Nyiregyhazi's recordings ... this piece seems to have elicited a superhuman response from him.
In a world of falseness, 5 letters make the difference : T R U T H
@@iianneill6013 What virtuosity? Maybe he missed the virtuosity in the ~5,000 notes he missed, or maybe in his indiscriminate banging he technically hit all the right notes, but also all the wrong notes.
@@luxio7916 "Other pianists play the right notes the wrong way. I play the wrong notes the right way." - Erwin Nyiregyhazi
Thank you for sharing this extremely rare and such a great artistic event from this truly great artist from a world ormai scomparso.
I'm speechless as well. Thank you so much for bringing this to the public.
The effects of mass that he achieves with piano tone is astonishing. At times it is spiritually crushing -- from 6:10 to 7:05 -- at other times it is Michelangesque in force -- 11:35 to 13:05. But even in these moments of superhuman strain the tone is never harsh or ugly. Indeed there is a beautiful singing tone throughout, and some passages of exquisite luminous delicacy in the treble, such as 15:50 to 16:52 ...
I disagree. I find the tone to be quite ugly and harsh in these passages. There is some really excruciatingly bad pedaling in this performance as well. In addition, I feel that this piece is an example of Liszt being a highly important composer, but not a great one. I'm just not moved by Liszt in this work. But I guess it is all a matter of personal taste.
@@j.d.miller4203 I get the sense that you are more of a pianist than I am -- I am just a listener -- so you no doubt have a better ear for such defects than I do. I confess that these do not trouble me: the power of his interpretation, his musical conception, and his extraordinary tone is what moves me. As for the piece itself ... for me Nyiregyhazi explores the depths and summits of it in a way like no other pianist has that I have heard yet. I respect, of course, that you have different preferences and opinions, and I appreciate the thoughtfulness of your response.
what i perceived here and it's effect on me days later....is a type of brilliance. my teacher anthony casario, the actual pianistic protege of leo ornstein TOLD me about nyireghazi in my youth, and ranked him with horowitz and others. WHAT i heard in this interpretation was that he took the lead melody line ....a cello perhaps. and HELD it to such a tension, and HELD the tempo in such an extreme manner ....that a whole OTHER d'obermann came out of it.....if liszt intended that or NOT. i believe he would have said bravo......forget adjectives and all these quibbles......to DO ...WHAT he did with it. few pianists would have the discipline or technical equipment to actually do. with wasn't BANGED, thumped or any of that.....it was done with another KIND of approach. ...u can't do that to every piece. but whoever he was.... we was a genius......
I could not agree with you more ... except the melodic line reminded me more of a powerful baritone than a cello ... but you have put into words exactly what I feel about this masterpiece.
There is not only a grasp of the architecture here -- which other great pianists have achieved -- there is absolute sincerity of emotion, and an audacious ability to 'distort' the form to the will of the performer. This was a characteristic of Franz Liszt, the greatest piano interpreter of all time (according to friendly and hostile witnesses), who was said to almost 'recompose' the music as he played. In artistic terms, I think of this as a supreme exercise of the 'plastic imagination' (the shaping will), the point where form and expression fuse in the imagination of the performer or artist.
Well put .
6:10-7:05 - The most soul-crushing descent into despondency I've ever heard from a pianist.
Iian Neill
Very good .
And are you hurt ?
@@Fritz_Maisenbacher Fritz you did not respond to my comment on your post with the apparent Horowitz live recording of the Sonata...just to recap what I said: I utterly can not believe that was actually Horowitz. I am convinced that was Nyiregyhazi. I have never ever heard Horowitz play like that and it does not sound like him!! I am in denial.
@@CziffraTheThird
Excuse me ... of which Horowitz live recording are you talking about ?
This is not romanticism, it is expressionism.
true
Wow...so incredibly emotive and keeps you captive to every note. Thank you for uploading and thank you Ervin for being alive and playing music for the sake of music.
An astonishingly idiosyncratic interpretation. In parts agonizingly brooding - bordering on plodding -, in others hysterical. It brings out the neurotic side of Senancour's 1804 novel. What a contrast with Arrau's magisterially paced, controlled performance !!
Hauntingly beautiful
Hahaha Nyireghyázi should have recordings on a Bösendorfer imperial!!! It really suits his pianistic style :)
I like the Nyiregyházi fortissimo at the end
Thanks for sharing this!
the last notes hit just right
He has a clear philosophy in his playing.
But when I heard of this , I tore my clothes and rushed out into the garden, and I wanted to shouting, it gave me such a deep experience
Bare in mind that one person as insignificant as anyone else who walked the earth is making every sound you hear in this video.
to the limit and beyond
You know ... you see.
Reading all the previous comments it is very clear that you either expect total fidelity to the score with little personal injection, a playing of the score in a purely intellectual manner or you are prepared to throw expectations out of the window and listen to a technical giant (listen to his Mazeppa roll) whose technique is put in service to the emotional requirements of the music. OK perhaps many of his mannerisms can take you out of your comfort zone but add all the bits up and the whole is truly unsettling in the best sense of the word, suddenly you are asking yourself questions about life itself.
I have played this piece for very many years and many people say I am the only one who gets the beginning right, all the other pianists throw it away as insignificant, Richter doesn't (but Horowitz does) but then ruins the piece by going all "virtuoso" and this is the danger in this piece. The Vallee explores the very depths of a mans soul and the quotation that Liszt prefaces the score with tells you how deep you must go and Nyiregyhazi does that.
The 13-20 minutes it takes to play it require so much mental energy and if you listen to N with his crescendo of emotion time stands still. The slips and technical problems can all be explained by his not practising and his years away from the piano, this recording was probably the first time he had played the piece in 50 years, and his technical problems...so what I couldn't care less about them.
I will still continue to play it my way but must incorporate more of the agony from N's playing to really reach the depths of this extraordinary and masterful piece. thanks for uploading it, a wonderful document of the style of piano playing 100 years ago.
This says it all. Bravo!
Aprecciated
BRAVO!!!
🥹🥹🥹🥹
Utterly awe-inspiring. I had never heard Vallee d'Obermann before this, and after hearing this performance the first time I then listened to it straight through again three more times. I then went and looked up Horowitz's performances, expecting that perhaps Nyiregyhazi's would look mannered or sentimental in comparison ... instead, although Horowitz was technically fearless his interpretation lacked the spiritual abysses of this masterpiece. I now love this piece -- specifically, this recording of it -- as much as the B Minor Sonata, to which this seems the natural companion. Thank you so much for sharing this tremendous relic!
That B minor Sonata is the reason pieces like this are so little played. That B minor Sonata deserves a rest... a LONG rest. It should be banned from competitions, and allowed but once every three years in any given concert hall. It has been banged through so many times by so many mediocre pianists - Lang Lang are you reading this? - that there are circus parrots that give this piece a better "rendition" than some recordings!
This is but one of too many Liszt pieces that deserve a wider audience. Much wider.
The entire stretch to 2:15 is one gigantic phrase, given practically in one breath ...
Wow!
As highly as many people think of Horowitz, this does seem to be a better interpretation. Mr. N's performance was out of this world. About 8 minutes longer than H's interpretation. That very last note, even though it is just one note, is so masterfully played. It is a perfect foil for everything that came before it.
Ervin Nyiregyhazi may be too controversial of a pianist for modern ears. His loud banging certainly doesn’t help matters.
But, if you’re willing to look at the things he does RIGHT, rather than WRONG - you will find he has a much more exquisite, expansive tempo, appropriate for the likes of this kind of piece. I remember hearing somewhere that Liszt himself hated hearing this piece in his masterclasses because it was supposedly a depiction of loneliness - his cosmic loneliness. I prefer this tempo to even the “slow by modern standards” ones of Arrau and Richter.
Remember this - Ervin Nyiregyhazi is a grandpupil of Liszt himself. He studied with Frederic Lamond, one of Liszt’s last students. Lamond must have taught Nyiregyhazi much of Liszt’s own manner, so in some ways this must be more authentic than we can handle.
One could only wish we could hear Beethoven from Nyiregyhazi, for his teacher Lamond was intimately acquainted with Beethoven’s music.
Nyiregyhazi once said "if you think my Liszt is revolutionary, you should hear my Mozart."
@@kpokpojijihe planned recording mozart in the 80s but nothing came of it
This pianist really understands what my great great great grandfather composed. The sound and touch is so Ferenzji.
I've been meaning to ask you if there any family anecdotes about Liszt that have reached you through your relatives?
Are you related to Cosima Liszt-Wagner or Blandine Liszt-Olivier?
Did Vallée d'Obermann influence 'Pas De Deux' from The Nutcracker?
I just listened to the "Panorama" from T's Sleeping Beauty here on YT. Great composers could make unforgettable beauties out of just the first few notes of a descending scale.
In a parallel universe, Ervin delivered this performance at an international piano competition in Shangai. At the 10 minute mark he was forcibly removed from the stage by 5 competition staff. Then he forced his way back on stage and finished it.
He left the stage again to silence. He then quickly returned to pick up the half bottle of Palinka he left under the piano.
Really?
@@rohanmac2139 no
And in a parallel universe his genious is highly recognized and his memory truly cherished
He is crazy. Maybe the best Olbermann
A temperamental predominance. Sounds like a little bit confusingly at first because this pianist didn’t play like the academism which each piano student has to follow about piano performance disciplines. However, you will feel more confident, comfortable that this pianist was a historical legendary after hearing the whole recording. 🎉🎉🎉
If ever there was an equivalent for terribilita (sublime terror) in music, it begins at 11:45 ...
It is ferocious, and I can't see how it could ever be excelled.
I didn't know my first tortures would be so enjoyable
... ... ... THIS ... ... ...
Whispers of the heart
Rest in peace
Amazing insights. Terrifying in places - perhaps this is more in tune with the book on which the piece is based?
If you can find the book I recommend it. Incredible work, which really does not deserve the obscurity it has been condemned to. I do not know if it has been translated into any other languages than the original French.
You can find English translations in Amazon, for example.
Has anyone read it and is able to summarize it? I did find the free ebook on gutenberg linked below but am not much of a book reader, more of informative/science only guy
www.gutenberg.org/files/32808/32808-h/32808-h.htm
❤
Was this and the second Legend he did live both from the 73 concert in San Fransisco?
I think this is an unreleased studio recording from 1978, but I will check my copy of Bazzana to confirm shortly.
According to 'Lost Genius' by Kevin Bazzana, Nyiregyhazi recorded Vallee d'Obermann on January 8, 1978 on an old Baldwin piano at the Scottish Rite Temple on Nineteenth Avenue at Sloat Boulevard. The piano was in wretched condition and would not stay in tune (the soundboard had lost its 'crown'). Nyiregyhazi told Kapp that, “It is not the piano that makes the sound. It is I who make the sound.”
@@iianneill6013 I feel I am inclined to believe this was at the same public concert!
From 17:40-17:50 and 19:17 to 19:23. Wow.
supercalifragilisticexpialidocious !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
There is a spirit here unlike anything else I've encountered .But the piano tone is rendered unnuanced by the bad recording. The playing really sounds like a different generation. So odd everyone wants to play stylistically correct for the period but when they get to romantic period music they forget that the performer really shares the spotlight. Listen to Joseph Joachim's recs and you'll see what I'm talking about.The training is better today than it ever was in the past -this is obvious from most of the old recordings not made by the really extraordinary ones. I love Vallee D'oberman as much as the b minor sonata . It is such a vision.
If we didn’t have this bad recording, we wouldn’t be able to hear it at all. If I remember correctly this was recorded with a portable cassette recorder.
Intense Sound World created…..
Those who listened the sound are critical....Those who listened with the heart extatic....This is no more sound and more than perfect music....This is not a first of his class" perfect pianist"...This is a god .... Any other version, even the perfect one, sound boring after that....Do you find volcanic eruption boring or distateful? Only Liszt or Scriabin ask to be played like that...This music is not written to be "tasted" but to change the world itself....
this is an original interpretation. i wonder if this is how the great virtuosos of the 19th century sounded.
I can imagine Anton Rubinstein sounding like this in the throes of passion.
About once a year for the last couple I have returned back to hear Ervin. Initially I was not particularly liking what I was hearing, you could say I was moreso jarred by an abnormal listening experience than actually not liking it. Well, now fast forward, this past October 30th I had my gargantuan juried graduation concert for the pinnicle of my Bachelors of music in performance of piano, and I ended the whole thing with Polnisch thanks to the upload on here of Ervin introducing me to the absolutely sublime work! Now returning back to him once again many months later, I feel completely torn on the inside and convicted, I am going to get to the very bottom of this situation why Ervin played the way that he did... I want as much as it will cost my time and hard efforts, I want to achieve this level of depthness in my approach of the instrument. Anyone, with their knowledge, please quote me anything or show me anything pertaining to the research and ideologies of this mans approach! I have also been trying to search in the depths pertaining to Busoni! An absolutely radical giant.
CziffraTheThird, have you read Kevin Bazzana's biography on Nyiregyhazi? It is essential for understanding the life, aesthetic, and technique of the man. I bought an ebook version through Google Books.
@@iianneill6013 Hm!!...no I have not! But a thousand thanks for this, I honestly just saw your comment! I will absolutely check it out!
OMG ! OMG!
This reminds me of Mahler 8th "Symphony for A Thousand" ,,,,,,
BUT ITS A PIANO.
Making it sing.
And how he places bass chords.
I dream to play like this.
Wow
Stark raving mad...
Just the right amount of madness. All other performances are, by comparison, tediously sane.
Some seem to feel this is a rough amateurish performance. I don’t agree. It is played the way it was meant to be played. Rough and powerfully. It isn’t a minuet. It is played with passion by someone who had already lived his life. Perfection isn’t artistry.
Some people would stand in front of Michelangelo's Last Judgement and pan it for not being realistic enough, badly drawn, anatomically exaggerated, out of perspective.
And some would listen to this recording and hear the greatest spiritual struggle ever put down on tape.
I have been lucky enough to perform this piece publicly...but I was nothing like the GREAT Nyireghazi...he makes Horowitz sound like an amateur... what incredible Liszt-Like playing....aren't we lucky to hear this? I was fortunate to meet Ervin in his fleabag hotel in the Tenderloin of SF in the 70's....but that tale is for another time...all said...I suspect this Vallee was very very close to the playing of Liszt himself...shockingly good...yes...I suppose there are a few wrong notes...but NO great pianist played live w/o many wrong notes...THEY (the "wrong" notes) mean NOTHING...except taking chances...which, unfortunately, today's crop does not take chances...hence, extraordinarily ordinary playing is now the norm...
Have you told your story of meeting EN?
The secret of Nyiregyhazi is his "time machine". He plays the sounds imagined by Liszt before fixing them in tiny dots on sheets of paper. If you play Liszt based on "the holy score" many passages, runs, scales etc. sound trivial and shallow. Surprise : they aren't. Most certainly he would be shocked listening to contemporary performances ( "This is horrifying, horrifying!" )
His interest was the "effect", not blind demodulation of black dots.
Your word choice cannot be admitted, Horowitz doesn't sound like an "amateur".
He just gives a "light" version of the piece, the feelings of Nyiregyhazi nobody had, and never will.
My father had Nyiregyhazi at his house where he did a concert and also made recordings on his concert grand. My dad, Ron Antonioli, was involved in helping him during his Tenderloin years. I also visited him at this tenement apartment as a teenager.
Yeah, I tried to see him at his hotel in Sep. '78 too......but he was not disposed to see me. I wrote an account in response to Michael Brown at N's performance of the Mephisto Waltz. At 15:46 I was listening to this with another pianophile, and said that's miles above Horowitz ,pre- echoing another commentator here. I've read that in a master class, Liszt refused to hear this piece, it brought back too many strong memories for him. What else can be said........behind the stumblings and wrong notes there moved a power of expression that the musical world sees perhaps only once each century.
Six years ago, now, one respondent a Fritz Maisenbacher, posted thus
"17:18 .. .. . . aaarrgghhh ...."
I supposed and suppose it to have been with reference to some event that occurred during the play of Mr. Nyiregyházi's at that timing.
Whatever the case-actual, it lead to an ever-welling gigantic Tsunami of mostly invective, as it was to turn into, this between fans of Mr. N's, and his powerful detractors.
What follows was/is my attempt to lend to the disputation some calm by insertion of reason, example and appeal, here as presented unburied from that impressive pile of rancorous verbiage . . .
To all here who seem so disparaging of Mr. Nyiregyházi, please try to understand, if you will, that the gentleman had endured most of his life by the time of this recording and, it was one that had featured within it many 'rough spots,' to put it very leastwise?
The Fates, apparently tho granting unto him many technical, re-creative and expressive powers, as well had seriously shorted him on ones-of-life.
Noted now-deceased author, scholar, and collector of pianists' records, Harry L. Anderson formerly of San Diego, remarked once to myself with others present, and sans equivocation, that Ervin Nyiregyházi had "played like a house 'afire!" and, that it was note-perfect always.
Now, of course he could not have come to know this as knowledge gained from sound recordings, as there were none!
No. He had HEARD him while living in New York in Nyiregyházi's first days there, on a number of occasions and then later, in Southern California after both had removed to there. (Hofmann and many others too, this same.)
This constitutes professional eye-witness testimony that, if called upon to, would have earned him court accreditation as an expert witness to it. Also, Mr. Anderson, beginning in the early Thirties, had been a columnist for various of scholarly musical journals. (His writings are more than worth-while for any seeking-out. I recommend this.)
So, as newly armed with all that and keeping mind as well that he possessed then the vigor of youth, I respectfully call upon all who would dismiss cruelly (yes, that) what is heard here as has been done generally, to imagine that all that we hear now, to be technically WITHOUT FLAW!
Any change of opinionation?
If actually achieved by any loyal doubtful auditors -- then what so-infuses to the souls of we admirers of Erwin Nyiregyházi, will become finally of the comprehensible, if not actually shared.
Fair enough?
Speaking now of sound recordings from Nyiregyházi's first early period -- loyal and good honest detractors -- please do seek-out that bit of Liszt's Liebestraum and Hungarian Rhapsody, to be heard in the early sound film "The Lost Zeppelin."
ua-cam.com/video/bNTU6Ogoudw/v-deo.html
There one will be treated to precious filmed moments of the nearly-helpless genius-youth himself, acquitting himself near-miraculously, in supremely fine phrasing and perfection of play. (All goes well 'till that vase crashes!! Then, no more strapping youth Ervin!)
The movie is SO silly but, is some late-Twenties fun alright and, does carry this tiny bit, at least, of evidence oh-so-essential.
Ha! If ONLY we had that full hour-and-a-half of his pianism solely, sans all the Romance and like- silly bits! Think of how that would have cinched things up firmly and forever, and for all.
: | :
Yes, dear James, at this 17:18 , this night, I was HIT.
This was not something "good" or "bad" on my side, this was just a sudden encountering with a Titan.
I was knocked out after only some bars in this Finale of the Vallée d'Obermann.
Only days after this event, I was able to recover and feel what I have heard.
This never occured to me.
And now, I consider Ervin Nyiregyhazy as one of the greatest pianists of all times, equal with Lipatti, Feinberg or Barere.
In music, they are some very seldom interprets who are able to GIVE you something, changing your perception of the world. The greatest chance you can have is to be allowed to listen to it.
Ervin is one of these.
I just read the exchange to which you refer here.
I was in high school when the recordings of the St. Francis Legends came out, and knew, in spite of the controversy, that this was anything but a joke, and that something of great artistic importance was, thank heavens, preserved. And a very short time after that, the other commercially produced recordings appeared. I felt then, and still do now that something life changing happened to me and that Nyiregyhazi revealed something essential about Liszt: these recordings, particularly of the St.Francis Legends, the B minor Ballade, The Evening Bells, the Third Hungarian Rhapsody, and several others have haunted me ever since.
I do not believe that Liszt himself played the way Nyiregyhazy does here, at least not within earshot of anyone else, and I do not believe that it is fair to compare Nyiregyhazy with any of the other "greats." He was in a class by himself, and must be considered on his own terms. For all his slow tempi, technical sloppiness, creative use of crashing sonorities, added notes, hands playing out of sync, etc.(and most of this is quite consciously, deliberately employed by Nyiregyhazy to realize his visionary aims, by the way), there is nevertheless a vivid, powerful, and essential fidelity to the meaning and the spirit of the music. And when he was at his best, he cannot be surpassed.
divine madness
the best
When was this recorded, I asked and skimmed the comments:
Orioninthepolder writes among other things, quote:
The slips and technical problems can all be explained by his not practising and his years away from the piano, this recording was probably the first time he had played the piece in 50 years, and his technical problems...so what I couldn't care less about them.
//endquote// It can be seen that Orioninthepolder also has played this piece.
@op 106 if I may know, what year was this recorded?
According to 'Lost Genius' by Kevin Bazzana, Nyiregyhazi recorded Vallee d'Obermann on January 8, 1978 on an old Baldwin piano at the Scottish Rite Temple on Nineteenth Avenue at Sloat Boulevard. The piano was in wretched condition and would not stay in tune (the soundboard had lost its 'crown'). Nyiregyhazi told Kapp that, “It is not the piano that makes the sound. It is I who make the sound.”
@@iianneill6013 Thank you man, I'll probably look more into that book
14:13
Astonishing
17:43
💿💿💿💿
Secret Fire
17:43 man
A colossus!
woman
@@toucc9638enby
Fantastic interpretation--thanks for posting. Too bad that the piano seems to have been a problem. And sometimes the pedal seems to be stuck.
я не могу понять, нравится ли мне это исполнение или нет
I appreciate the open-mindedness of a comment like this.
Sounds like an old man but good enough for this difficult piece
Nyiregyházi can't be judge in human modern terms....he belongs to eternity, to the Hell and to Heaven....he is between humanity and universe and goes to madness and return from it.....
Chances are that this is the loudest and slowest version of this piece currently available. I agree that Nyiregyházi creates a very special atmosphere here, not by adding anything to score, but simply by playing the exact notes, going for the slow and loud. The pianist is obviously struggling in the more technically taxing sections, which makes me wonder if he makes a virtue of necessity. Compared to Horowitz, this is crude pianism, indeed not without interest, but very limited in terms of conveying the subtle shades that makes the most convincing musical performances unforgettable.
Le pusieron su santuario. Así era el.
Ah jeez
E.N.-планета ,движущаяся по своим ,непонятным нам смертным ,своим законам.Простые правила rubato,формы ,стерильность употребления педали не для неё .Музыканта равного Nyiregynazi я припомнить не могу.
I don’t understand why people like this recording. Generally octaves should sound like octaves and not minor 9ths. The last 4 minutes of this interpretation is just incredibly sloppy and it’s annoying that people describe it as soulful. You can be soulful and play octaves at the same time. When you are first taught an instrument, pretty early on you will hear the advice that playing faster and louder doesn’t make you sound better. That is exactly what this performer did here.
Except he did not play faster… he played indeed much slower than most. Horowitz and Volodos finish this piece in 12 minutes, Richter in 14, Arrau in 15, and Nyiregyhazi at a whopping 20.
I do agree he was quite loud, much unnecessarily. But the tempo I find much more appropriate and in line with Liszt than modern performers - and that’s not a coincidence. Nyiregyhazi’s teacher was Liszt’s student Frederic Lamond.
@@farazhaiderpiano I suspect a lot of the booming comes from the recording ... other recordings of the Nyiregyhazi fortississimo capture the dynamics better.
17:18 .. .. . . aaarrgghhh ....
Dearest God what did anyone do to have listen to this rubbish?
The funny thing in the story is that YOU are the rubbish .
No I meant his playing is rubbish because he just bangs the piano whenever he cannot play fast enough, it hurts my ears.
Dear Matthew , listen to the soul of this interpretation . Not if it hurts you or not .
Music is not comfort . This hurts my ears too , so what ?
We work so hard to control the sound and this pianist has zero control and is just doing whatever he feels. Yes anyone playing these notes it’s going to have some soul to it even if they’re bad, that’s Liszt coming through inspite of the horrible sound quality.
14:13…
did a five year old play this?
Yes, Adam. Clearly a five year old played Liszt's "Vallée d'Obermann". Of course.
Tromolos @10:10 are electrifying. And his interp of the sliding descending thirds @11:40 is pure genius
Electrifying and terrifying ... rumblings from the foundations of the Earth ...
I counsel the player to read about this composition and meditate a better way to play it.No hesitations,please .Liszt have deep thoughts but great actions.
You cannot get a more profound interpretation than this, in my opinion.
Capolavoro
Divertido.Pero deberían darle crédito al manicomio donde se grabó.
Si esto es una locura, envíame cien de esos locos.
Ninguna obra me es extrña ni rara. Ni. viaje ni habían grabaciones. 🤣
and y'all thought Horowitz was good.
Nyiregyhazi rules
@@thelostgenius1212 Rules ... where Erwin went there are no rules. 😎
Good first two notes and LH figure at 11:39… certainly an interesting rendition
Sorry, but I just do not care for this performance. Many people say this is so much better than Vladimir Horowitz’ performance of the same piece… I don’t see it, at all. To me, this performance is full of so many heavy-handed and outdated pianistic mannerisms. But, each to their own.
Doesn't matter the playing itself but the effect of it.....of course there is distortion and brutal playing, but there is more beyond that, and that is why is so interesting and scary to listen to him....
@@kaleidoscopio5 I agree with both of you!!! (I mean RogerMoenBreck and You)
This is nightmarish , nightmarish ... beyond any experience of myself ... I would prefer never have been listening to that ... but I am completely sellotaped to every phrase , every note . And my memory will conserve all the stuff . O Weh , O Weh ! Why am I listening to this.... ?? I should skip or going anywhere else .... why am I staying here ....?
That sounds like a poor man's version of "Que veux-je? Que suis-je? Que demander à la nature?" :)
@@MartinVanBoven oh fuck off , please , with such silly comments ....
Love how all comments are 2 years apart :D adding my two cents here, waiting for your answer in two years
@@sv0010
Don't wait two years more, my friend, many of us would be dead ....
His worst flaw is playing out of tune...
Just terrible. Does had really think his bog tempos add profundity to these wonderful pieces? Although he does have a good sound in some parts-his thumping fffs are unbearable. A pianist of poor judgement.
To agree with you would be pissing off everyone here who raves about N. But is this the proverbial story about the Emperor's new Clothes? In any case the eccentricities here make Glenn Gould sound like the ultimate conservatory student.
I've heard some bad musical recordings in my years of classical education, but this is singly-handedly one of the most atrocious musical performances I've heard in my life.
It's like standing in front of Michelangelo's Last Judgement and declaring - not photo-realistic enough.
@@iianneill6013 Not sure how that analogy can compare to this but alright
@@jameshall401 All I would encourage is listening to the spirit of the recording, the vast expansion of the musical ideas. There is nothing wrong with realism in art or music (i.e., skillful technique and judicious interpretation), but I don't think that's a helpful criterion to apply here.
@@iianneill6013That's a fair point actually. One thing I will certainly commend Nyiregyhazi for is his passion in the performance (there were several passages in it that were in my opinion beautifully executed), but it really seemed he sacrificed most subtlety, musicality, and phrasing for the sake of being "loud", "bombastic", and "grand".
Also to clarify, I don't think he's a bad pianist (there are some records that I think are incredible), but this was not it imo. The massive unalignment between lots of notes, the hyper-slow pace of the E Minor passage rather ruined the sense of direction and melody, and the notes in the latter half of the E Major part felt super hammered.
There are other things that strongly bother me about this performance, but I just noticed how long my reply is getting lmao
Anyway, this is just my opinion and it's totally ok that you like it! Just personally not a recording I like.
@@jameshall401 James, thank you for a very interesting discussion!
This is just loud and extremely crude playing.
You might as well say that Michelangelo is crude compared to Botticelli.
No, this is old technology you are hearing, if you are able to listen through the harshnesh of the louder parts the touche is awesome ... but that requires a bit of experience to learn to discern. But trust me, this is pretty amazing ... it is such a different piece in performance than most modern versions and I tell you, this has much more emotion that those of late.
Basically you are hearing the mic's cut off sound that is above its threshold in both EQ range for its pickup (membrame) as well as the loudness of the signal.
Fine comeback, compadre. @@iianneill6013 👏
Unbearable embarrasing distortion of Liszt.
Poor instrument. Please don’t glorify performances like this.