Restricted Hydraulic Flow! Deere 3R, 4R, 5E Flow Test!
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- Interesting results from testing the flow on Kenton's Deere 4052R, Ken's 3720R and the Tractor Time with Tim Deere 5075E.
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What a great time I had with you and Ken as we put my 4052R thru its hydraulic paces! What an education on “going with the flow” against the “pressure” of resistance. I was pleasantly surprised to see just what the actual specs are, and how they affect operating attachments. I was especially curious about the third function performance since it did operate the Limbsaw effortlessly. Ken’s explanation of the restriction for the 3rd function makes sense. And, as he pointed out, if you do need additional flow for a third function attachment, you can use 1/2 inch hoses from the quick attach couplers going to the loader. It was my pleasure to see you folks, and thanks to Christy for putting up with us, and come back anytime! Blessings to all.
It was great meeting and dining with you!
This has been a great series of videos! THANKS KENNY and TIM for getting together!
You mean 5/16 inside diameter not 7/16 if outside diameter is 3/8. Another informative video.
Got my ditch bank flail and have considered putting a restriction on the tilt function to slow its movement because I can only imagine 700# swings done fast or abruptly are going to be abusive over time. As a result, I am currently looking for a safe way to restrict that line while being sure I don't come up with a solution that is going to be hard on the pump over time.
No worries on the pump using a restrictor in a line like this.
Interesting to see the pressure and flow tests on the various machines and compared to the manufacturer's specs.
this has been one of the best series of all times! I really enjoyed it. seeing the parasitic pressures and flow rates are very telling. it confirms that larger fittings and hoses are a best option. then merely install restrictors on the implements "where and as" needed to control speed. also larger flow rate control devices are likely a better option where needed. very interesting and I really appreciate the great job you and Ken did on this.
Glad you enjoyed it, Dave!
Thanks Dave, it was fun!
Tim Ken this is very interesting give us what is really going on in HYD systems
God Bless All
PaK
Hose sizes and connection restrictions make sense to me. The same thing happens in water flow. Most garden hoses sold is 5/8’s inch diameter. The better way to run a power washer is with 3/4 inch hoses. They cost more money but more water can flow thru them. Pressure washers specs shows pressure and flow (GPM). The higher pressure at the head also increases danger levels at the work end too. Proper PPE comes into effect with any of these tools that work with liquids under pressure. You talked about proper gloves in an earlier episode. Thanks for the lessons.
Good video guys and gal. Tim, I see you lost your seat by Martha. Lol
Ken truly is 'The Man'!
LOL thanks Adam!
You can get more than 11gpm thru a standard pioneer coupler with the 6 and 7000 series I have seen as much as 25gpm thru a single remote. The 8R now have a giant size pioneer coupler available and those things can flow like 50gpm, blow a hose and you can pump a barrel of oil on the ground in under a minute! lol
Good video. Helps me understand my tractor better.
You guys did an awesome job. That was a lot of work. We thank you guys for the excellent information. Larry
Great video Tim and Ken. Glad you pointed out the flow rate of 1/4" to 1/2" couplers are different and that they can be the restriction/limitation of a system.
Thanks for another great series! Very interesting and informative! Like others said, this gives me insight into the operation and expectations of my tractor. I didn't expect backpressure from undersized couplers.
Thanks for doing this series. Very interesting and good knowledge
Man what an informative video! Answers a ton of my questions from one tractor I had against the new one I have now. Bigger tractor but less power at the grapple. Inform dealer of my questions and they were perplexed. Now I know why from you guys what to do. Thank you very much!
Cool! Remember, flow only affects speed. Pressure controls ‘power’.
@Tractor Time with Tim good point
Great series guys..Brought a lot of insight to the operation and expected performance of our rigs. Thank you for sharing!
Very nice series. Great job!!
Awesome video!! My 2009 4720 has the same third function setup with the small steel lines but my couplers are 1/2 at the end out at grapple, I thought same thing when I installed my kit for my grapple, those small steel lines will cause restriction and pressure but figured like you guys confirmed if it was at 12 GPM you couldn’t control the small cylinders on the back, grapple so it’s a give snd take, nice to have both options , you confirmed my thoughts !! 👍
Great job.
Interesting, thanks
5 series have expensive valve options. So there may be a flow restriction vale, not an orfice a valve. If the coupler has a small dial that will adjust max flow (option). Great for a guy that wants 5gpm to a hyd motor. Not a 5 series owner, but have been lusting over the brochures for the 5 series.
5e does not have built in flow control.
Good video, interesting.
Be interesting to have a flow meter inline with the limb saw. Maybe 7gpm is not what it actually takes to run it?
Sounds like that was just answered.
We wanted/intended to do this, but time and an incoming storm got it in the way. Hopefully we can do it sometime in the future. Look at the sky on the right at the beginning of the video!
@@boltonhooks2149 you pretty much answered my question after I posted it. TY
Some 5 series have deluxe hyds. With flow control on 1 scv.
Very informative. Thx for your time.
Had my 4044M at the dealer for barking in the hydraulic system and jerky loader operation. They had it 2 weeks and never tested flow or pressure, and wanted to charge me $580.
A 2012 with 280 hours on it.... Dang, poor thing is never used
It's my "forklift" and snow removal machine, so yeah it live a good life.
The available flow on the 5075e is 11.5 gpm to the remotes the other is for the power steering I believe. The 5090E and above has more available flow to the remotes and so does the 5075M series.
No, steering is a separate pump. The 17+ gpm is all available to implements.
@@TractorTimewithTim maybe he meant the other listed rating?
@@TractorTimewithTim you are correct about steering being a separate pump, and I do see on John deere's website where you got your specs, However The specs I am showing is 11.4gpm main hydraulic pump for implements and 6.8gpm for steering equals 18.2 total combined. I think the steering flow should only be around 6gpm for a total system flow of 17.5ish but specs can vary a small amount... This is generally how all the utility tractors 5 series and above are rated. If you look at any brand tractor in the 60- 75hp range 11 ish gallons per minute for implements is pretty standard... when you jump frame size to the 90hp and above then 16-17gpm is common for implements. Just google search 5075E hydraulic flow and you will see some different specs... Also you can look at tractor data...I have owned a few tractors in this size and it is common to list them this way, I think because it sounds better than it actually is... I'm not as familiar with how the compact tractors are rated but the bigger tractors usually list total flow and then when you dig deeper into the specs you find that part of that is dedicated to the steering only via a separate pump. I'm not trying to say you are wrong, I'm just trying to say dig a little deeper because the way deere list it on their specs isn't clear... I believe If you test a 5090E or 5075M series or above you will get the flow numbers you are looking for out of a single scv. If you weren't so far away I could probably get you a few different tractors to test, but I'm in Louisiana... I Have a friend that has a 6135E, a 5100e and and a 5410, I have a 8560 Mahindra and my brother n law has a 5075M. I have videos on my channel of all above tractors except the 5075M, He hasn't had it long... Any way enjoyed the video, Hope to see you test a little larger tractor in any brand... 85-90hp and above should give you 16gpm plus out of a single scv...
Pretty sure we are accurate. Specs say 17+ total implement flow, but 11.5gpm flow at a single scv.
The 11 ish gpm is common across all brands of tractors of that size. To get 17 gpm out of a single scv you have to get a larger frame size. A 5075e is built on a 5045e frame size. If you look up on deere's website it says a 5090e has 22.5gpm total flow and that a 6135e has only 20gpm total flow. This is incorrect... I have ran both tractors and the 6135e has more hydraulic flow, but looking at the way deere list the specs it doesn't show that. If you dig deeper you find that the 6135e will put out 20gpm at a single scv, while a 5090e will only put out 15.9 at a single scv. So that tells me that deere is including steering output in flow rates on 5 series tractors and not on 6 series tractors...
Great video Tim 🚜🇺🇲 I really enjoyed this video 🇺🇲
There may be actual flow restrictors hiding behind some of the loader couplers too. I discovered one while installing the single point connector on my 1025r.
Well, there is one on the return loader coupler. This lessens chance of orings being blown out by sudden down force.
Right, as Tim wrote it's on the "lower" hose, but that is out of the system since we tested directly at the coupler on the tractor side.
I thought the 5e would’ve had more flow. Interesting.
I think it DOES have more flow...overall...just not through one outlet.
Yeah, and I got that from y’all in the video. I guess it’s my incorrect thinking that these bigger machines should be able to run hydraulic equipment like skid steers and other machinery. They are just not built to do that type of work.
So on a 4044r if you go right to the 1/2 outlet could you run a post hole auger that’s rated for 6-15gpm? Has anyone ?
How’s ken like those siped R4 tires?
Ken (me) LOVES them! I have and entire article on this subject at GTT.
@@boltonhooks2149 great to hear! I’ll have to give a shot!
Really amazing just how much parasitic lose yall had. The best one was the 4 series except on the front hard lines. It's crazy how that works.Amazing
You need to check some older tractor like my jd 4200
We'd love to as time/opportunity comes along. Maybe we can have a "drive-thru" testing weekend...like they did you Covid LOL
A 4020 with the 3" pump will make about 16gpm at the rear couplers. If you put a 4" pump on you can get 20gpm. Beyond that the 3/4" line to the rear from the front pump becomes a restriction.
I’ve looked all over and can’t find someone to explain continuous flow for my jd 4052m heavy duty. How much flow does it have and when would I use it? My jd dealership hasn’t been great with help on this and the internet hasn’t helped either. Thank you
Continuous flow should have full implement flow from the specs..so 10-12pm if I remember correctly.
You would use for hydraulic motors.
Tim RK has new tractor Rk25
Yep. Heard about it.
Up to what temp is safe for the hydraulic system (e.g. hoses, seals, oil, etc)? 180? 200?
Yeah hoses and o rings can melt above 200 and the fluid boils at 210.
I think it's around 100 over ambient.
It is for our bigger stuff anyways, like a Mx285
Not all 5E tractors have a diverter. My 2021 5075E has a W.R. Long 3rd function kit that is a true 3rd function.
The Deere offering is diverter only. Of course 3rd parties can offer a different approach.
Would it be possible to compile and share all the pressure and flow results somewhere? Just to be able to refer to some real numbers besides whats provided in the manual
Good idea.
Another great video on hydraulics with Ken. Very interesting. Has Ken moved in with you guys for the summer.
I think we shot either 6 or 7 episodes in 2-3 days! We had a great time together!
@@TractorTimewithTim We could tell you and Ken were having a great time together. I'm sure we'll see Ken again.
@@philsmock4943 Absolutely!
Just a few days LOL. We had a great time and Tim and Christy are wonderful and gracious host's.
Alot of coupler talk, for good reason. I'd like to see if the flow increases using flat face skid steer style couplers. I think they are a higher flow.
The "cheaper" flat faced couplers are hard to hook up with residual pressure. End up opening a fitting. "Cheaper" is 85$ a pair. A mistake because I could not find ORB ag disconnects easily. They flow great though!
That would be cool to test, but good FF couplers are to darn expensive.
Are these tractors closed centers? Would open center systems have different response?
All open center.
You can get more flow out of a closed center system without having the heat issues. Almost if not all of your smaller tractors are open center.
I hope you know that the more pressure you put on there tractors you are going to be blowing up expensive stuff like pumps,and lines. Do you know what hot hydraulic fluid can do to you when it hits your skin. If you are lucky you will not have to put any oil on your salad. The worst thing is you will be visiting your local burm center. The bill to pay for that will be a lot more than getting the max output of your tractor.
We did not demonstrate, discuss or promote changing the relief pressure on these machines.
@@TractorTimewithTim It just kinda looks like you are trying to make the tractor's do something like you would have to get a bigger tractor to do. That's what I am looking at. If you look at the attachments that are made for compact utility. They go in horsepower rate. Not how much hydraulic power you have. To do better, and better things you have to get a bigger tractor. Not adding a after market thing to it. Also remember that if you add anything else that the manufacture didn't have on it. You void your warranties . Something happens like a pump blows . The dealer sees this after market thing on your tractor. You are going to be getting a big chunk of change takes out of your pockets.
Bill, we tested the flow rate of the hydraulic system in this episode…to see if it meets specs. Have no idea what video YOU watched.
@@TractorTimewithTim I have seen in other videos that you have been operating the backhoe, and I have heard you say if you get more flow you can get it to dig faster. It is a little machine not a huge earth more. Then all of a sudden you have a booster thing . Maybe I am thinking like AZ dad. His idea is to make a fun time running around with your tractor. Not how fast you have to get it done kind of a thing. I don't think that you are making a fortune in doing these things. It is very interesting to watch, and see what is out there for different attachment and tractors. There is a lot of different colors in the paint job. The most important thing is to make a fun thing out of it. Not how much, and how fast it can be done.
Almost all hydro hoses and o-rings are rated/tested/stamped for the same pressure and above what a small tractor puts out. A bigger tractor gives you mainly more flow, and if pressure use bigger hoses. The relief system on all hydro systems protect this.