Thank you Emma! Keep putting the welfare of horses out to the universe. You are making a difference. Thank you. I have two Haflinger mares that have been with me since being weaned and are now going to be 32 years old. They have lived their entire lives in a big field with a run-in shed. They are always curious, open, and content. I also have three Miniature geldings that live in the field too and are so energetic, playful, and, dare I say, funny. It has been a joy to live with my horses in this way. Even when the weather is poor, I can look out any window of my home and see my horses making choices to play, graze, sleep, wander, mutually groom one another, and loaf about . . . together.
Really enjoyed this update and thank you for dealing with horse welfare issues so openly and honestly. Hopefully the industry can drive for change for the better with horse welfare to the forefront of policy.
Thank you, Emma, for your wise and profound words about horses' needs and the rampant anthropomorphisation which afflicts not only horses but lots of pets all over the world who are kept by people knowing or caring literally nothing about the animals' nature and needs. You are a genuine bright spot, so lovable, clever, and fun, keep up the good work! Love from Germany.
It's hurtful to realize how harsh horses are treated in this world, by the old "masculine" paradigme of force and punishment and absence of emotional sensitivity, and with no understanding of horses refined and spiritual nature. We are in fact all a part of this paradigme, to greater of lesser extent. But some of us wake up and others haven't yet. I pray that a powerful revolution will happen where we as human race will no longer tolerate this treatment of horses and animals, the tipping point of heart centered consciousness, and rules and regulations put in place to protect horses. Certainly you Emma contribute with this in the most beautiful way. Thank you for that, it warms my soul ❤
I love the funny videos, but why I watch you is because you are so smart with horse psychology and the way you keep the horses. I wish you would do more about how you train and manage your horses in their social groups and manage fat ponies. You’re amazing.
It’s difficult to teach on you tube as there are so many things and actually training horses involves no drama so might be quite boring for you tube! 😂 I’ll try a couple and see, you’ll have to let me know what you think! 🤔 Emx
Hy Emma, I love to watch your video and listen to your working experience, following you since the very beginning. Can we hear the see in the background of this video? What a wonderfull place to live. Best wishes from Germany
Horses are herd animals, plan and simple. Your suggestion for having rescue ponies and other horses being paired or donated to live with horse athletes is spot on!
Thank you Emma for sharing your prospective … always an inspiration that we can do better by our friends the animals by putting ourselves in their hooves/paws and seeing each day from their point of view. This emphasizes the concept we are guardians rather than owners for all creatures we choose to share our lives with.
Revisited your Q&A to catch up on the "nose count.". Condolences 😢on your bff puppy. But always good news to return to your childhood home. Blessings, Emma, to you ang Jeremy this holiday🎉 season❤
Thank you Emma! I am glad you mentioned Inca, i have missed him and hoped he was well. One of my wire haired dachshunds has just passed from congestive heart failure, it hard losing them. Inca looked the same as mine, adorable! Veterinary in Canada is very expensive also, we have spent thousands of dollars to fix injuries or declining health. Selling your horses to support Inca is admirable, you are a good person.❤️❤️
One thing I will be forever grateful for my first riding school is ingraining in us that the welfare of the horse was top priority. The owner of the barn had standards of excellence in all aspects of her students, but especially in the care of our horses. The property was over a hundred acres. All the horses had plenty of turnout and friends. She made sure every horse in the barm, from the schoolies to the boarders, was treated with detailed care and love
Thank you for such a wonderful video. It was great to hear your love for your animals along with acknowledging the responsibility if both the individual and the industry for their care. Your animals are lucky to live such a good life with you.
Your videos never fail to educate, entertain and prod new perspectives. I, too, am addicted to the orthographic view, but I find those ‘flying lawnmowers’ really intrusive as they put-put over my 40 ac farm. I do get it that the aerial view often ‘edits out’ the ugly details of humanity/development. My connections on firm ground ultimately override small craft flying…unless it were to become my central passion (?). Thank you for sharing your adventures, large & small on YT. Your menagerie, and their relationships always bring a smile here. Safe travels.
First of all thank you for explaining your views 2ndly I’m glad to hear your mini boys are well , apart from tooth problems . 3rdly I agree , yes horse need horsey company ! They are herd animals and need company . Horses itch each other and groom their friend it’s a natural thing that should be allowed . Mentally it helps them ! I’d l😮Ike to see a person who separates a herd animal actually be put in a room themselves in isolation for a long time , then we will see how they are mentally ! Great video Emma ❤ Look forward to your up coming outings ❤❤ Ps please think very very hard about the microlight flying !!! You’re near the coast and winds can change in a drop of a hat ! 🫶💐💐💐
Hi Emma, thank you so much for this amazing interview with you, I hope Inca made it ? Sorry I didn’t get if the treatment worked, but you are right veterinary expenses are horrible meanwhile, I always have Ex Racing Greyhounds from the Rescue and I am glad I still have them insured for the bills…sad Mulie had to leave.. Glad you took over the Family Farm, it makes sense to sell the other place then, I am glad nothing bad happened and you weren’t forced to get rid of the Farm and most of the Horses…looking forward to more Horsey Adventures…❤
Watching your most recent vodeos, i was just thinking about some questions that i had. For example what happened to mulie. And you answered them all with this video, so thank you. Loved hearing your perspective on the horseworld and 100% agree with you on horse wellfare!❤
Thankyou for answering my question, it really means a lot! I've followed you for years now and you've always really inspired me, I think what you do is amazing and would love to be like you one day . This year my dream finally came true of having my own three ponies, two of which are rescued, so thank you for doing what you do and inspiring so many others to follow their dreams! ❤
Emma, regarding geese imprinting, many years ago a friend of my parents had a clutch of geese imprint on her. Once they were mature and were flying, every time she left in her vehicle to go somewhere,they would take off and follow her. if she went further than a certain distance, they would turn around and go back home. I only say this because you can get joy at a much lower altitude that doesn’t necessarily increase or decrease your life expectancy. Just saying.
I really love the way you work with horses, and they are apparently so comfortable with you that they do tell you if they don't 'feel like it' 😁 Whereas most horses don't say no until things are really bad, because they are used to not being asked.
Great vlog Emma. Absolutely agree with your views on horse welfare, The 3 Fs…… Freedom, friends and forage. In the racing world, more NH horses get field-time with their mates, these days, but still a no-no for young flat horses. Understand why, but it’s not right. Incidentally, Carl Hester must be one of the few dressage people who does turnout his horses a lot, with companions.
Thanks for your comment! Hoping the horse world will do more…as we shouldn’t really be able to name a dressage rider who turns horses out should we really, they all should no matter! 🙈 Emx
Thank you for answering these questions, especially about horse welfare. But what do you think about my horse, he's an old competition carage horse and alone in our field. This summer we had another horse for some time, but he was not interested. I wanted company for him, but that is difficult. Horses are very expensive in Holland, old or handicapt horses also. So I dont know what to do
I loved this, it felt like sitting down with a friend and having a thoughtful chat. I agree with you wholeheartedly when it comes to animal welfare being paramount for all animals that we take into our care, end of the day its our choice to bring them home and so its up to us to give them what they deserve. I don't have horses, but I do have dogs and I have been involved in the dog showing world and its very similar there with attitudes about pointing out certain people and their behaviour while other people do similar or worse and people turn a blind eye as long as they get a rossette. I did wonder where some if your other horses had gone, but it makes so much sense now that you mentioned fighting lymphoma with Inca, my Lakeland Terrier Ivy has been going through surgeries and we have to delay certain jobs or buying furniture to make it work, you do what you must for those you love. Can't wait to see your content again, dogs and horses are always such fun to watch and enjoying life alongside them makes our lives a hell of a lot better. 😊
Thank you Emma, so interesting. I could listen to you all day. Your animals are very fortunate to live in such a wonderful caring environment. I must admit I have a big soft spot for Shetlands. I would love to hear more of your experiences and opinions on other parts of the horse world such as racing and eventing. 💕💕
Microlights are very sketchy. I knew of a US air force pilot who flew fighter planes in Vietnam and took up flying microlights. He got into some wind shear and got smashed into the ground dying instantly. Maybe try sailing? Everything can be dangerous but flying tiny aircraft is more dangerous than most pursuits. Be careful out there!
I fully agree with you regarding training horses in a similar way we train dogs. What I will add to that is I think horses should be trained in the way we train service dogs, with recognition that not all of them are able to be ridden. Many service dogs fail out of the program due to the high expectations of a service dog. I trained my service dog myself and she loves working. I ask her if she wants to go to work and she gets so damn excited happy and jumping and ready to go out the door. I did this because I gamified her training. I made it exciting. Training for her meant learning new things, bonding, cookies. But, most of all I based her training in cooperation. We are partners, and I respect her as she deserves. The riding world doesn't really have considerations like this; it is the insistence that if a horse is not doing a behaviour they are automatically classified as rude. I'm not saying there are no problems in the dog training world. But on this particular principle, I think a shift in mindset is necessary. I have worked with both horses and dogs and see the positive difference that animal rights & welfare considerations produce in both species.
Your animal friends are ends in themselves, not a means to an end (as Immanuel Kant might put it.) You view them as being like your children and not as a way to aggrandize yourself. And bless you for it! I would so much rather watch your channel.
I loved this video Thankyou. I wish we could have more of how you get such an amazing bond with your animals. We love and admire your training … but I would love to have more of behind the scenes and to be able to put your knowledge and advice into action with my own animals. I am not wanting to do the training that you do (I’m a granny) but I love to be able to provide an ever improving relationship with my 2 rescue ponies and my dog. The more I can understand their needs and how they think, then the better life they and I will have👍 You have been a total inspiration for me. I come from a competitive horse background… and wish I knew what I know now. I would have done things sooo differently. Thankyou for helping us all see how what we used to think was ok… really wasn’t. Xx
That's for answering my question. I love your vids and seeing the dogs as much as the horses. Everything you said about the horse world and the people who get seen not necessarily being the ones who should be followed can also be said about the dog world too. Reward based training using science and understanding isn't seen as entertaining or provides as dramatic and instant results. Also majority of the mostly seen trainers are also men. Hate the laughing at stress behaviours videos. 😔Some of the dog ones are out rightly dangerous and if copied could end badly for both human and dog. Hopefully the tides will change at some point. 🤞You are certianly helping with that. 💪
My old dad used to say that 90% of any job is preparation. If you have to resort to beating a horse into doing anything then you have not done the preparation correctly, when it comes to training skipping corners is not an option ❤
Thank you for the horse welfare issue. I agree, the horse world is very elitist. But people are starting to be more educated on horse behavior and their needs.
Love the video can’t wait for a new home Tour .what happened to the Warmblood that you were hoping to keep as a stallion but you had to have him gelded a year or two ago ?
thanks for your perspective re welfare, horse rights. You can find a right balance between what we want from horses vs what they actually need. Nobody wants to see a horse get whacked. But I see a horse who is 'loved' by it's owner, never does any work and lives without any horse (or grazing animal) for companionship and that upsets me as much or more because that is the reality she lives 24/ 7.
Lately i struggle with dressage, are they really happy walking their round and move o so relaxed in difficult circles or is it just cruel to make them so submissive every day, they cant think for their own and have to do as they are told and it makes me so sad every day that i only want to ride my young horse out hacking and doing fun stuff amd walking with her . Sorry English is not my first language.
Thank you Emma! Keep putting the welfare of horses out to the universe. You are making a difference. Thank you. I have two Haflinger mares that have been with me since being weaned and are now going to be 32 years old. They have lived their entire lives in a big field with a run-in shed. They are always curious, open, and content. I also have three Miniature geldings that live in the field too and are so energetic, playful, and, dare I say, funny. It has been a joy to live with my horses in this way. Even when the weather is poor, I can look out any window of my home and see my horses making choices to play, graze, sleep, wander, mutually groom one another, and loaf about . . . together.
Really enjoyed this update and thank you for dealing with horse welfare issues so openly and honestly. Hopefully the industry can drive for change for the better with horse welfare to the forefront of policy.
Let’s hope for a good step forward for all horses! 🤞 thanks for watching 😊
Thank you, Emma, for your wise and profound words about horses' needs and the rampant anthropomorphisation which afflicts not only horses but lots of pets all over the world who are kept by people knowing or caring literally nothing about the animals' nature and needs. You are a genuine bright spot, so lovable, clever, and fun, keep up the good work! Love from Germany.
It's hurtful to realize how harsh horses are treated in this world, by the old "masculine" paradigme of force and punishment and absence of emotional sensitivity, and with no understanding of horses refined and spiritual nature. We are in fact all a part of this paradigme, to greater of lesser extent. But some of us wake up and others haven't yet. I pray that a powerful revolution will happen where we as human race will no longer tolerate this treatment of horses and animals, the tipping point of heart centered consciousness, and rules and regulations put in place to protect horses. Certainly you Emma contribute with this in the most beautiful way. Thank you for that, it warms my soul ❤
Brilliant and informative. Thank you Emma for your passion with horse welfare.
Thank you Emma for this honest update. Love having you back on You Tube. ❤❤❤❤
I love the funny videos, but why I watch you is because you are so smart with horse psychology and the way you keep the horses. I wish you would do more about how you train and manage your horses in their social groups and manage fat ponies. You’re amazing.
It’s difficult to teach on you tube as there are so many things and actually training horses involves no drama so might be quite boring for you tube! 😂 I’ll try a couple and see, you’ll have to let me know what you think! 🤔 Emx
I remember you teaching us to let a horse sit down, it seemed quite possible, Maybe when my mare is a bit older 😂@@Emmassingale
This video was very interesting and entertaining! Thanks for sharing your furry family members with us! ❤
Glad you enjoyed it!
lovely update,thanks for your honesty.😍
Thank you! ☺️
Hy Emma, I love to watch your video and listen to your working experience, following you since the very beginning. Can we hear the see in the background of this video? What a wonderfull place to live. Best wishes from Germany
Horses are herd animals, plan and simple. Your suggestion for having rescue ponies and other horses being paired or donated to live with horse athletes is spot on!
Thank you Emma for sharing your prospective … always an inspiration that we can do better by our friends the animals by putting ourselves in their hooves/paws and seeing each day from their point of view. This emphasizes the concept we are guardians rather than owners for all creatures we choose to share our lives with.
Always loved your liberty team of Connemaras🎉YAY! Emma
Revisited your Q&A to catch up on the "nose count.". Condolences 😢on your bff puppy. But always good news to return to your childhood home. Blessings, Emma, to you ang Jeremy this holiday🎉 season❤
Thank you Emma! I am glad you mentioned Inca, i have missed him and hoped he was well. One of my wire haired dachshunds has just passed from congestive heart failure, it hard losing them. Inca looked the same as mine, adorable! Veterinary in Canada is very expensive also, we have spent thousands of dollars to fix injuries or declining health. Selling your horses to support Inca is admirable, you are a good person.❤️❤️
One thing I will be forever grateful for my first riding school is ingraining in us that the welfare of the horse was top priority. The owner of the barn had standards of excellence in all aspects of her students, but especially in the care of our horses. The property was over a hundred acres. All the horses had plenty of turnout and friends. She made sure every horse in the barm, from the schoolies to the boarders, was treated with detailed care and love
Thank you for such a wonderful video. It was great to hear your love for your animals along with acknowledging the responsibility if both the individual and the industry for their care. Your animals are lucky to live such a good life with you.
Your videos never fail to educate, entertain and prod new perspectives.
I, too, am addicted to the orthographic view, but I find those ‘flying lawnmowers’ really intrusive as they put-put over my 40 ac farm. I do get it that the aerial view often ‘edits out’ the ugly details of humanity/development. My connections on firm ground ultimately override small craft flying…unless it were to become my central passion (?).
Thank you for sharing your adventures, large & small on YT. Your menagerie, and their relationships always bring a smile here.
Safe travels.
Thankyou Emma for a fascinating update. Your commitment and passion shines out ❤❤❤
This is brilliant Emma! So interesting hearing about all your gang! Loved seeing some snippets of your eventing! Would love to see more!xx😊
Just ❤love watching you with any and all your animals ❤️. Yoi amaze me with the things you do & what the animals do.
You are a pure joy!!! Love your attitude and way of treating your animals.❤❤❤❤
You are an expert in playing ❤ i love it!!
First of all thank you for explaining your views 2ndly I’m glad to hear your mini boys are well , apart from tooth problems .
3rdly I agree , yes horse need horsey company ! They are herd animals and need company .
Horses itch each other and groom their friend it’s a natural thing that should be allowed .
Mentally it helps them !
I’d l😮Ike to see a person who separates a herd animal actually be put in a room themselves in isolation
for a long time , then we will see how they are mentally ! Great video Emma ❤
Look forward to your up coming outings ❤❤
Ps please think very very hard about the microlight flying !!!
You’re near the coast and winds can change in a drop of a hat !
🫶💐💐💐
Hi Emma, thank you so much for this amazing interview with you, I hope Inca made it ? Sorry I didn’t get if the treatment worked, but you are right veterinary expenses are horrible meanwhile, I always have Ex Racing Greyhounds from the Rescue and I am glad I still have them insured for the bills…sad Mulie had to leave..
Glad you took over the Family Farm, it makes sense to sell the other place then, I am glad nothing bad happened and you weren’t forced to get rid of the Farm and most of the Horses…looking forward to more Horsey Adventures…❤
Totally agree about the welfare issue ! Xxxxxxx
Watching your most recent vodeos, i was just thinking about some questions that i had. For example what happened to mulie. And you answered them all with this video, so thank you. Loved hearing your perspective on the horseworld and 100% agree with you on horse wellfare!❤
Thankyou for answering my question, it really means a lot! I've followed you for years now and you've always really inspired me, I think what you do is amazing and would love to be like you one day . This year my dream finally came true of having my own three ponies, two of which are rescued, so thank you for doing what you do and inspiring so many others to follow their dreams! ❤
Emma, regarding geese imprinting, many years ago a friend of my parents had a clutch of geese imprint on her. Once they were mature and were flying, every time she left in her vehicle to go somewhere,they would take off and follow her. if she went further than a certain distance, they would turn around and go back home. I only say this because you can get joy at a much lower altitude that doesn’t necessarily increase or decrease your life expectancy. Just saying.
Fantastic video! Thank you for sharing. I wish my ponies could come to you for training!!
I really love the way you work with horses, and they are apparently so comfortable with you that they do tell you if they don't 'feel like it' 😁 Whereas most horses don't say no until things are really bad, because they are used to not being asked.
Thanks Emma well said ❤
Great vlog Emma.
Absolutely agree with your views on horse welfare,
The 3 Fs…… Freedom, friends and forage.
In the racing world, more NH horses get field-time with their mates, these days, but still a no-no for young flat horses.
Understand why, but it’s not right.
Incidentally, Carl Hester must be one of the few dressage people who does turnout his horses a lot, with companions.
Thanks for your comment! Hoping the horse world will do more…as we shouldn’t really be able to name a dressage rider who turns horses out should we really, they all should no matter! 🙈 Emx
So interesting to hear your thoughts thankyou!
Thank you for answering these questions, especially about horse welfare. But what do you think about my horse, he's an old competition carage horse and alone in our field. This summer we had another horse for some time, but he was not interested. I wanted company for him, but that is difficult. Horses are very expensive in Holland, old or handicapt horses also. So I dont know what to do
I loved this, it felt like sitting down with a friend and having a thoughtful chat. I agree with you wholeheartedly when it comes to animal welfare being paramount for all animals that we take into our care, end of the day its our choice to bring them home and so its up to us to give them what they deserve. I don't have horses, but I do have dogs and I have been involved in the dog showing world and its very similar there with attitudes about pointing out certain people and their behaviour while other people do similar or worse and people turn a blind eye as long as they get a rossette.
I did wonder where some if your other horses had gone, but it makes so much sense now that you mentioned fighting lymphoma with Inca, my Lakeland Terrier Ivy has been going through surgeries and we have to delay certain jobs or buying furniture to make it work, you do what you must for those you love.
Can't wait to see your content again, dogs and horses are always such fun to watch and enjoying life alongside them makes our lives a hell of a lot better. 😊
Thank you Emma, so interesting. I could listen to you all day. Your animals are very fortunate to live in such a wonderful caring environment. I must admit I have a big soft spot for Shetlands. I would love to hear more of your experiences and opinions on other parts of the horse world such as racing and eventing. 💕💕
Thank you so much!
Microlights are very sketchy. I knew of a US air force pilot who flew fighter planes in Vietnam and took up flying microlights. He got into some wind shear and got smashed into the ground dying instantly. Maybe try sailing? Everything can be dangerous but flying tiny aircraft is more dangerous than most pursuits. Be careful out there!
Great to get this update - good to see my native Bodmin mentioned. Pretty grotty weather here today....
I fully agree with you regarding training horses in a similar way we train dogs. What I will add to that is I think horses should be trained in the way we train service dogs, with recognition that not all of them are able to be ridden. Many service dogs fail out of the program due to the high expectations of a service dog. I trained my service dog myself and she loves working. I ask her if she wants to go to work and she gets so damn excited happy and jumping and ready to go out the door. I did this because I gamified her training. I made it exciting. Training for her meant learning new things, bonding, cookies. But, most of all I based her training in cooperation. We are partners, and I respect her as she deserves. The riding world doesn't really have considerations like this; it is the insistence that if a horse is not doing a behaviour they are automatically classified as rude. I'm not saying there are no problems in the dog training world. But on this particular principle, I think a shift in mindset is necessary. I have worked with both horses and dogs and see the positive difference that animal rights & welfare considerations produce in both species.
I love that you love shetlands too. I have 3 and people drive me nuts when they say I prefer "real" horses. 😂
Thank you Emma for answering our questions. Lovely video update. ❣️❣️❣️
Your animal friends are ends in themselves, not a means to an end (as Immanuel Kant might put it.) You view them as being like your children and not as a way to aggrandize yourself. And bless you for it! I would so much rather watch your channel.
I loved this video Thankyou.
I wish we could have more of how you get such an amazing bond with your animals. We love and admire your training … but I would love to have more of behind the scenes and to be able to put your knowledge and advice into action with my own animals. I am not wanting to do the training that you do (I’m a granny) but I love to be able to provide an ever improving relationship with my 2 rescue ponies and my dog. The more I can understand their needs and how they think, then the better life they and I will have👍
You have been a total inspiration for me. I come from a competitive horse background… and wish I knew what I know now. I would have done things sooo differently. Thankyou for helping us all see how what we used to think was ok… really wasn’t. Xx
That's for answering my question. I love your vids and seeing the dogs as much as the horses. Everything you said about the horse world and the people who get seen not necessarily being the ones who should be followed can also be said about the dog world too. Reward based training using science and understanding isn't seen as entertaining or provides as dramatic and instant results. Also majority of the mostly seen trainers are also men. Hate the laughing at stress behaviours videos. 😔Some of the dog ones are out rightly dangerous and if copied could end badly for both human and dog. Hopefully the tides will change at some point. 🤞You are certianly helping with that. 💪
I’m obsessed with the ponies cuddles up with the pig 🥲🥲
My old dad used to say that 90% of any job is preparation. If you have to resort to beating a horse into doing anything then you have not done the preparation correctly, when it comes to training skipping corners is not an option ❤
Do you still have your Turkeys ? 🦃🦃🦃 PS I've loved you videos for years ❤
Ahh they are sadly over the 🌈 bridge now as that was years ago, they were such good fun to have around 😊Emx
Thank you for the horse welfare issue. I agree, the horse world is very elitist. But people are starting to be more educated on horse behavior and their needs.
Love the video can’t wait for a new home
Tour .what happened to the Warmblood that you were hoping to keep as a stallion but you had to have him gelded a year or two ago ?
👍🐎👍🐎👍
thanks for your perspective re welfare, horse rights. You can find a right balance between what we want from horses vs what they actually need. Nobody wants to see a horse get whacked. But I see a horse who is 'loved' by it's owner, never does any work and lives without any horse (or grazing animal) for companionship and that upsets me as much or more because that is the reality she lives 24/ 7.
❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Primative Rising was a prominent NH stallion. We had several good all round progeny.
He bred loads of fab horses, I had three and then grandchild of and loved them all! 👌🏼😃
What happened to oasin?
Where did Oisin go?
Lately i struggle with dressage, are they really happy walking their round and move o so relaxed in difficult circles or is it just cruel to make them so submissive every day, they cant think for their own and have to do as they are told and it makes me so sad every day that i only want to ride my young horse out hacking and doing fun stuff amd walking with her . Sorry English is not my first language.
On welfare, well said Emma
ever thought of trying llamas? Trekking with them is an eye opener. Check out the moons who rescue elite sports horses that have been dumped.
no wonder the horse came 3rd in the race... poor guy was already tuckered out 😅yes i am 5 lol
So the black shetland stallions have moved on?
Big money corrupts so many things - politics, sports, animal welfare, peoples' values, etc. Shame, shame, shame.
What happened to Osian