Philip, I certainly plan on continuing and creating some videos about that. I can’t promise I’ll be able to after winter hits, but it’s coming. Till then, you can check out the videos in my FieldCraft playlist. Thanks for the video suggestion and hanging out here on the channel! Stoker.
Thank you man. You're making my "getting back" into land navigation so easy. With my first try it looks like my pace count is 62. But I'd like to try it again on rougher terrain. I'm lucky enough to have both a soccer field and emergency airstrip close to where I live. The airstrip itself is quite levelled but the terrain right beside it is just a regular field. This way I will have a chance to easily compare if there's much of a difference between my pace count on a levelled field and rougher more natural terrain. I just need to find a surveyor's wheel and I think I know someone I could borrow one from. Anyhow, thank you for all the advices!
Great, I have had this Cammenga Compass for years. I went to youtube to find out how to use it. That's how i found you. I am a Rookie and thanks to you I believe that I can now learn the basic's on how to use it. I like your fast straight talk, subscribed and going to watch more after I figure my pace count. Lol
Good video and a favorite topic of mine. Thank you for taking the time to explain pace count and the nuances with accuracy. I really liked your content and be came a subscriber!
Thank you for teaching us how to survive in the wild 😏 I live in Tulalip Washington We have excellent Mountains here 🏔 I go up every weekend with my 22 year old Daughter and I teach her new traditions from our Tribes history 🐺 I appreciate your service Brother 🇺🇸 be safe 🏔
Eric! That's awesome stuff, so glad you can get out with your daughter and learn to enjoy the mountains together! I don't make it up past Seattle often, but it is beautiful up there! Best to you and your daughter!
I’m really old let’s leave it at that😅and with full load total directional paced it comes to 75. I use a mechanical hand button counter to keep count so I don’t have to count consciously. Works very well over the years. It can be purchased cheaply though Amazon. BTW job well done.
I am a pretty fit 80 year-old. I just made Ranger Beads and started estimating my distances a few weeks ago. My preliminary assessment is that if you think that you are going to step onto a football field and get an accurate pace count, you are naive. On a six-mile hike today, my pace count going uphill was about 20% higher than the downhill. On other hikes, the roughness of the terrain makes both counts even higher. Further complicating the calculation is carrying a backpack and the amount of weight, and the steepness of the terrain. I have started to keep a log. I assess hikes as easy, moderate, or strenuous. I am noticing big differences based on the facts and circumstances. I am learning to adjust my expected pace count as I go based on known distances, such as miles marked off on the trail map or using triangulation to determine distances. My point is that you must have a range of counts to use after assessing the conditions.
ALL of your content is great. DoD needs to hire you to write the FMs & TMs. I was a PS1 (E6) in the Coast Guard and received only a little fieldcraft. And then only because I was in a "tactical" rate (Port Security). I think that every branch should get at least the bare basics in fieldcraft. It's not inconceivable that members of the CG, USN, USAF could find themselves in a position to have need for this.
Appreciate that - I couldn't agree more, and for what it's worth - not every Soldier or Marine gets proper training - IMHO. All depends on the NCOs - it's a dying art, so here I am, doing my thing!
@@STOKERMATIC I agree with your statement also. You could take it one step further. I think civilians could benefit from this also. People that like to hike, hunt or do any outdoor activity that takes them to an unknown area. I absolutely love this topic! I hunt and do geocaching and I'm always using a map & compass & a gps. I practice the map & compass all year long so I won't forget how. Thanks for all your videos and your service.
@@donaldburton6869 I found a small gift card in one cache with a little note saying " lunch is on me" I took the card and left 5 bucks. Very cool activity. Been doing it since 2012. Thanks for sharing your thoughts 🍸.
Mine was dead on 64. My Pace count when I was in the Marine Corps was so dead on I found a station 5 other guys had been looking for, because the stake was intentionally bent down behind some weeds. Once I said here it is, 5 guys raced over to it. LOL.
My Pace Count has always been between 63 and 67. It's kind of funny how even with bad knees and being a lot older that my pace count hasn't really changed much over the years.
I have. Probably not something I have the resources to offer just yet with my schedule. Not quite sure when it gets closer how I can get enough traction to let folks know. But certainly something I would like to work on. Stoker.
Hiking in the steep and deep of Idaho, I'm thinking of averaging 4 different counts. flat, up, down, and traversing. Then factor in the wicked steep and scree. And what about snowshoes? Probably a different count too.
Snowshoes definitely a different count. It’s good to know for different terrain, as well as light conditions. Good thing is with hills, you have natural features to help you determine distance. Stay Stoked!
@@STOKERMATIC An insiders joke? The max effective range of an azimuth, as if it were a SAM or other type of projective? Ha Ha. I get it! Stokermatic were you a First Sergeant or above? How long were you in for? What is Randall? He was in for 18 years more or less so is he a Sgt First Class, Master Sergeant or above?
Recommend to make a knod for certain amount of paces in a string and for a certain amount of this knod another knod. Let us say a simple knod for 20 paces and a figure eight for 10 simple knods.
63 is my pace count but I have a question, how do we break it down per foot or per meter? Say for example my pace count is 63 and I need to go 107 feet, How do I break down the 7 feet?
A bit late to the party…. Mine is 74 (technically calculated to be 73.6) and it seems to be pretty accurate over level terrain as measured/confirmed by my range finder. I use (modified Ranger beads; removed the 4 km ones and only use the 9 100m ones, since I like to do “micro navigation” - usually Re acquiring azimuth ever 300-500m…
So , if you count when your left foot goes down and you start with your left foot, you are already off a half a pace. I guess for the long haul it won't make much difference.
Property boundaries are probably the most convenient references. Most properties are on regular plot divisions meaning that their dimensions are usually regular and established by surveyors: www.blm.gov/or/landrecords/files/land-descript-diag.pdf For instance, a 40acre plot will typically be a 1/4mi x 1/4mi square. There are about 1609 meters in a mile, so one of the sides of 40acre plot is about 1609/4=402m. Pace off one side of a 40acre property and divide by 4 to get your 100m pace count. The dimensions for other size plots will be similarly regular. Knowing your average pace count is really only half of the battle. The other half is knowing the standard deviation of your pace count -- ideally taken over several real world terrains. Hoping that the various errors will cancel each other out is unhelpful. Knowing how much your pace count varies, along with your error following an azimuth, will allow you determine just how accurately you can determine your actual position. The longer you have to rely on dead reckoning, the more your location is defined by a circle of your likely positions rather than a single definite position Knowing how wide that circle is can be very important. I've taken multi-week hikes through area's of the southwestern deserts. Staying out that long required dropping caches of food and water at known locations along the route. When dropping those caches, we needed to be sure that we could actually find those caches with the accuracy that we could expect to achieve. The uncertainty of our position and the size of the circle it represented determined how wide of an area we would have to search to find the caches. It could quickly have become dangerous if the search area was too wide to locate the caches before we ran out of water.
I always enjoy a good landnav vid. Have a blessed day
Your in the right place!
And you as well brother.
Underrated content.
Thanks Phillip!
STOKERMATIC , can you please do something on landnav without a compass.
Philip, I certainly plan on continuing and creating some videos about that. I can’t promise I’ll be able to after winter hits, but it’s coming. Till then, you can check out the videos in my FieldCraft playlist. Thanks for the video suggestion and hanging out here on the channel!
Stoker.
Philip, hope youve been well and that you’ve been able to check out the content over the past month or so.
Thanks greatly appreciate all this.
68 for me. Thanks for sharing 🍸
Thanks for sharing!!
@@STOKERMATIC we are still using your techniques for over a yr. It works 💪 thanks for sharing 🍺
Thank you man. You're making my "getting back" into land navigation so easy. With my first try it looks like my pace count is 62. But I'd like to try it again on rougher terrain. I'm lucky enough to have both a soccer field and emergency airstrip close to where I live. The airstrip itself is quite levelled but the terrain right beside it is just a regular field. This way I will have a chance to easily compare if there's much of a difference between my pace count on a levelled field and rougher more natural terrain. I just need to find a surveyor's wheel and I think I know someone I could borrow one from. Anyhow, thank you for all the advices!
Thank you. Its quality. You teach land nav well
Great, I have had this Cammenga Compass for years. I went to youtube to find out how to use it. That's how i found you. I am a Rookie and thanks to you I believe that I can now learn the basic's on how to use it. I like your fast straight talk, subscribed and going to watch more after I figure my pace count. Lol
Right on! Glad our paths crossed Steve!
Learned a lot. Thank you.
Learning much from you! Thank you!👊
What a cool way to set 100 meters! Thanks for the attention to detail!
Your welcome!
Good video and a favorite topic of mine. Thank you for taking the time to explain pace count and the nuances with accuracy. I really liked your content and be came a subscriber!
Thanks! I’m glad the channel resonated with you! Looking forward to continue the conversation.
Stoker
Very informative. LUV you explain many different things in relation to outdoor activities. Keep going 💪
Thanks brother! Stay Stoked!
Thank you for teaching us how to survive in the wild 😏 I live in Tulalip Washington We have excellent Mountains here 🏔 I go up every weekend with my 22 year old Daughter and I teach her new traditions from our Tribes history 🐺 I appreciate your service Brother 🇺🇸 be safe 🏔
Eric! That's awesome stuff, so glad you can get out with your daughter and learn to enjoy the mountains together! I don't make it up past Seattle often, but it is beautiful up there! Best to you and your daughter!
Every video of yours is good
Even 70 for me. Just walked it out today at the local high school tack.
I’m really old let’s leave it at that😅and with full load total directional paced it comes to 75. I use a mechanical hand button counter to keep count so I don’t have to count consciously. Works very well over the years. It can be purchased cheaply though Amazon. BTW job well done.
Thanks George! Great idea to use a button counter too!!
I use that too !!!!!!!
Good info
Great video man, helps a lot, thank you
Right on Blake!
I am a pretty fit 80 year-old. I just made Ranger Beads and started estimating my distances a few weeks ago. My preliminary assessment is that if you think that you are going to step onto a football field and get an accurate pace count, you are naive. On a six-mile hike today, my pace count going uphill was about 20% higher than the downhill. On other hikes, the roughness of the terrain makes both counts even higher. Further complicating the calculation is carrying a backpack and the amount of weight, and the steepness of the terrain. I have started to keep a log. I assess hikes as easy, moderate, or strenuous. I am noticing big differences based on the facts and circumstances. I am learning to adjust my expected pace count as I go based on known distances, such as miles marked off on the trail map or using triangulation to determine distances. My point is that you must have a range of counts to use after assessing the conditions.
ALL of your content is great. DoD needs to hire you to write the FMs & TMs. I was a PS1 (E6) in the Coast Guard and received only a little fieldcraft. And then only because I was in a "tactical" rate (Port Security). I think that every branch should get at least the bare basics in fieldcraft. It's not inconceivable that members of the CG, USN, USAF could find themselves in a position to have need for this.
Appreciate that - I couldn't agree more, and for what it's worth - not every Soldier or Marine gets proper training - IMHO. All depends on the NCOs - it's a dying art, so here I am, doing my thing!
@@STOKERMATIC I agree with your statement also. You could take it one step further. I think civilians could benefit from this also. People that like to hike, hunt or do any outdoor activity that takes them to an unknown area. I absolutely love this topic! I hunt and do geocaching and I'm always using a map & compass & a gps. I practice the map & compass all year long so I won't forget how. Thanks for all your videos and your service.
@@donaldburton6869 I found a small gift card in one cache with a little note saying " lunch is on me" I took the card and left 5 bucks. Very cool activity. Been doing it since 2012. Thanks for sharing your thoughts 🍸.
My pace count is 67. Thanks for the video
Awesome! Thanks for sharing Nicolas!
@stokermatic what kind of bagpack is it that you use? Where can one find one of these? thanks
Kifaru
Is there a functional reason to stick with meters? Is it the way the maps are all scaled?
Mine was dead on 64. My Pace count when I was in the Marine Corps was so dead on I found a station 5 other guys had been looking for, because the stake was intentionally bent down behind some weeds. Once I said here it is, 5 guys raced over to it. LOL.
That’s awesome! 🇺🇸🇺🇸
My Pace Count has always been between 63 and 67. It's kind of funny how even with bad knees and being a lot older that my pace count hasn't really changed much over the years.
Pretty crazy interesting isn't it? Thanks for sharing that Chris!
I just have to figure out a way of measuring 100 meters now as I don’t have a range finder or a football field that I can access
Have you thought about offering in-person land nav classes?
I have. Probably not something I have the resources to offer just yet with my schedule. Not quite sure when it gets closer how I can get enough traction to let folks know. But certainly something I would like to work on.
Stoker.
Hiking in the steep and deep of Idaho, I'm thinking of averaging 4 different counts. flat, up, down, and traversing. Then factor in the wicked steep and scree. And what about snowshoes? Probably a different count too.
Snowshoes definitely a different count.
It’s good to know for different terrain, as well as light conditions.
Good thing is with hills, you have natural features to help you determine distance.
Stay Stoked!
70-71 depending
Right on!
Mine is 73. SayTop,what is the maximum effective range of an azmith?
Lol! In the hands of a 1SG or an LT? LMAO!
@@STOKERMATIC An insiders joke? The max effective range of an azimuth, as if it were a SAM or other type of projective? Ha Ha. I get it! Stokermatic were you a First Sergeant or above? How long were you in for? What is Randall? He was in for 18 years more or less so is he a Sgt First Class, Master Sergeant or above?
Recommend to make a knod for certain amount of paces in a string and for a certain amount of this knod another knod. Let us say a simple knod for 20 paces and a figure eight for 10 simple knods.
Making knots is an easy way to keep track. You can also use ranger beads, or make Talley marks in a book.
Great thoughts!
Are those pace counters accurate?
Which ones?
64 paces for me.
Right on!
63 is my pace count but I have a question, how do we break it down per foot or per meter? Say for example my pace count is 63 and I need to go 107 feet, How do I break down the 7 feet?
Use a 25 foot tape measure and set up some mini pace count courses. Then practice practice!
A bit late to the party…. Mine is 74 (technically calculated to be 73.6) and it seems to be pretty accurate over level terrain as measured/confirmed by my range finder. I use (modified Ranger beads; removed the 4 km ones and only use the 9 100m ones, since I like to do “micro navigation” - usually Re acquiring azimuth ever 300-500m…
Right on!! Thanks for sharing 👊🇺🇸
When i started i took my lenght in meters ex = 1.7m x 59paces = 100m.
My pace out is 70.
Right on brother, thanks for sharing with us!
So every 65 steps for you is a 100m?
Yes - but depending on my set up and terrain it will vary from 62-72 - most of the time to simplify my math, I'll use 70.
since I cant really find mine in the city, i'll go with 65 you're stride is about close to mine
I’m sure it’s close enough for normal operations. Thanks for hanging out Raul - hope you enjoy the content!
So , if you count when your left foot goes down and you start with your left foot, you are already off a half a pace. I guess for the long haul it won't make much difference.
Not too much. I’d say consistency is important IMO.
Property boundaries are probably the most convenient references. Most properties are on regular plot divisions meaning that their dimensions are usually regular and established by surveyors:
www.blm.gov/or/landrecords/files/land-descript-diag.pdf
For instance, a 40acre plot will typically be a 1/4mi x 1/4mi square. There are about 1609 meters in a mile, so one of the sides of 40acre plot is about 1609/4=402m. Pace off one side of a 40acre property and divide by 4 to get your 100m pace count. The dimensions for other size plots will be similarly regular.
Knowing your average pace count is really only half of the battle. The other half is knowing the standard deviation of your pace count -- ideally taken over several real world terrains. Hoping that the various errors will cancel each other out is unhelpful. Knowing how much your pace count varies, along with your error following an azimuth, will allow you determine just how accurately you can determine your actual position. The longer you have to rely on dead reckoning, the more your location is defined by a circle of your likely positions rather than a single definite position
Knowing how wide that circle is can be very important. I've taken multi-week hikes through area's of the southwestern deserts. Staying out that long required dropping caches of food and water at known locations along the route. When dropping those caches, we needed to be sure that we could actually find those caches with the accuracy that we could expect to achieve. The uncertainty of our position and the size of the circle it represented determined how wide of an area we would have to search to find the caches. It could quickly have become dangerous if the search area was too wide to locate the caches before we ran out of water.
Some good stuff right there Tim!