These are great points that I don't often see in most instructional videos. Recently, I've started hitting flatter and through the ball more and became much better in playing matches, especially doubles which requires hitting flat, low balls. I often exaggerate my follow through, stay closer to the baseline and hit as deep as possible. In doing this, during matches I noticed that this practice helped me hit shots much cleaner while keeping the same amount of topspin. The spin now is more forward rather than upward, which increases ball speed and requires less amount of effort.
A few more comments: Paul Annacone explains it well. There are aggressive shots and aggressive locations. Also, I think that we players need to think about hitting left, right, front, and back, as well as our height and weight levels. Next, hitting with topspin does not require much extra effort with the right technique. The modern and next-gen forehands are efficient, especially with today's strings. Lastly, I received great advice years ago: We workout to play tennis, we don't play tennis to workout. I believe that the work off the court is what builds me for the court. Vamos!!
„Next, hitting with topspin does not require much extra effort with the right technique. The modern and next-gen forehands are efficient, especially with today's strings.“ I totally agree but the footwork and timing is decisive.
I've been playing for some 40+ years as well and I instinctively tend to hit flat, deep shots, with forward body momentum as can be mustered. But I've developed #3 top spins as well for going wide and for passing shots.
This is my problem. I started tennis watching nadal, that made me starting tennis with topspin in mind, always. Now in my 30s, i struggle to use small headsize racquet because my shots tend to be short because i'm used to brush the ball, instead of hitting THROUGH the ball.
Thanks, that is what my message is about, too much topspin too early without developing a clean flat shot will cause lots of problems. Work on hitting lower and flatter as part of your development. Again, I am not saying you should play balls flat and low forever, but I am saying that hitting like that for 15 minutes of even the whole hour will be very beneficial for later when you want to hit with more spin.
@@sunglee3935 drop the racquet below the ball a lot to get more topspin? What grip do you use, continental? I think it's probably easier to change racquet face angle at contact point: more perpendicular face angle, more topspin, higher and shorter shots, and vice versa. Just play with the angle and find your perfect stroke. Also, these days all pros use bigger headsize racquets(98 and above) anyway what was your reason for switching to smaller headsize racquet?
This was exactly my problem. Being a Nadal fan, I was obsessed with hitting more topspin even though my racquet head speed was/is no where close to Nadal's. My shots were slow and loopy, and it worked ok at lower levels. But players at higher levels attacked them.
Really good explanation, makes lots of sense. I tend to get ahead of myself and just topspin like crazy but your right hitting through the ball will create more consistency and your balls won’t be out, as much as top spin hits. Will keep this in mind.
Yup me too. I'm glad you also understand what Tomas is saying. I think however he is going to get a lot of pushback from some players who can't separate regular spin (which we all do anyhow) from that crazy Nadal topspin which is what coach is referring to. So many times I mishit the ball or off the rim because I'm trying to Nadal topspin...going to knock it off right now 😂
@karen9244 Safer shots is one of the purposes of topsin, so you shouldn't get more balls out with it, quite the opposite. But Tomaz is on point as it does wear you out.
Flat = prone to overhitting and net errors Top spin = prone to producing short balls with no penetration One needs to find some balance between the two. It also depends on a racket you use. Some are more flat hitting friendly with lower launch angle, others are designed for heavy top spin with higher launch angle.
Interesting video , The last singles match I played 2wks ago I found that actually accuracy/placement rather than heavy top-spinned shots won me the match comfortably. Pause for thought there 🤔 Singles is a lot tougher at my age now 😂
If that's the case, your top spin is not really heavy. At amateur level, say 4.0 or 4.5, I rarely played anyone with top spin I would consider heavy. If you play against a real heavy top spin, and you're not good enough to handle that, the opponent does not have to place the ball anywhere near the line because eventually you'd break down.
This is so right... I'm just started tennis in my 40, still under a year and I tried too much spin on every ball and the result is the ball dont have speed and not penetrating enough, and a lot of it end up in the net.. And now I only hit hard spin if the ball worth it and just flat the ball and slice it accordingly, And my tennis improved a lot, I can rally more and have a good return ball. And can now enjoys the game with my friends more
The way I see it, the difference between hitting a ball with a lot of topspin and a ball that is "heavy" is the ability to hit the ball cleanly and "flat." In other words, high levels of spin can be achieved by simply brushing against the ball but with not enough forward velocity due to trading off "swing through" for "brush up" technique. Achieving the "heavy" ball is where enough forward swing deforms the ball at contact so much that any kind of brushing up that also happens at that time applies a massive amount of spin due to how much more strings are in contact with the ball. With less deformation the contact area is theoretically a point. With more deformation, the contact area will look like a fat square.
What a coincidence that you made this video today. I have been thinking a lot about how I shape the ball because I make a lot of mistakes. Mostly off center hits or shanks. And I’ve been thinking that the way I learned to play tennis, as a mostly self taught 35 year old, has something to do with it. I think I overemphasized topspin in the beginning and now the foundation of the shot is “always topspin” irrespective of my positioning or contact point. And I use a grip that is sort of half way between eastern and semiwestern, which makes high balls more of a problem.
Yes, off center shots and shanks happen when you start adding too much topspin to your shots BEFORE you develop the skill of hitting the ball clean and flat into the sweet spot. When that is in place, then topspin shots become cleaner and more penetrating.
Playing topspin at 2 and 3 level on both wings, on every shot, has been my way of playing since the 80s. I´ve always been a chronic stringbreaker. My friends say my shots are heavy. But, now at 57, I´m thinking (after this video) to start playing at 1 or flat. Anyone remember Jimmy Arias? That´s my playing style, hehe.
I played in a few youth tournaments with Arias.. not in his league clearly and never got paired / played him..but watched him play a few times... the topspin on his backhand was something. miss all the one handed backhands form the 70's and 80's
Hitting through the ball with even a slight upward motion would generate more topspin than the brushing up motion because the strings grip the ball then snap back very fast. Even a 'flat' shot with a slight upward motion hit quickly will have a lot of topspin. I guess if you hardly hit the ball, but then the strings aren't working for you anyway and it would be the same with a plank of wood. People should watch a slow motion video of a ball hitting the string bed.
I love Tomasz's instruction, but I have to say that at 58 I can hit heavy balls for 2-3 with no problem. The keys: Be in great shape and #2 relaxation.
That's what I am talking about! You play tennis to stay in shape, why would you back off on hitting heavy balls? You get a little rest in between shots anyway, Go for it! And I don't care about winning, when I hit with topspin, all my shots seem to go in! If I go back to hitting flat, it will go Out!
100% True. Guys trying to hit heavy topspin on each shot are fooling themselves. As Tomas says, it cannot be done yet all the rec players try it on 90% of their shots. I see guys, even on high balls, trying to hit max topspin. Also, hitting out in front is a huge mistake for the club player. Find your optimal contact point (where you get easy power and control). When you find it, build your swing around that. Great lesson!!
I think there are two kinds of topspin shots. Extremely loopy high trajectory Nadal-style topspin, but also a low trajectory superficially 'flatter' shot where the ball is still rotating forwards and has a very tight spin, it just doesn't look like a topspin shot.
Federer has close to as much topspin as Nadals has but it's hard to see it on TV. If you see his short crosscourts from the right angle you can see the crazy dive on his ball, a mere mortal hitting that shot in that speed would have put it far outside the double line.
Yes, the shot can be loopier like Nadal's or more straight like Federer's, but necessarily Nadal's shots will have more topspin. Federer's shots will also have topspin but Nadal's have more. This is captured by the physical concept called "Magnus effect". Topspin will drag the ball down. If Federer's low trajectory shots carried as much topspin as Nadals, they would be dragged down before clearing the net. Nadal plays with more net clearance, hence needs to produce more topspin (or else his shots would be slowish, which they obviously aren't)
The latter type is called a dipping topspin shot. It's hit with the racquet face more closed at contact, so the ball still has topspin but the trajectory is lower. This shot is great for passing the net player.
Hi, very good points. Thanks for your reply to the question I saw below about moving from Eastern grip to semi Western grip. Ive been trying to generate too much forced spin recently by heading my grip more towards semi western, and my game has suffered through inconsistency.
Thanks! Just to make sure, I am not telling you NOT to hit topspin when you play matches. But what I am suggesting is that one practices a lot of flat clean hitting of low balls to improve the ability to hit through the ball so that when at some point you decide to spin it more, you will have a cleaner and more penetrating topspin shot.
Interesting perspective. I don't fundamentally disagree. I find that people don't focus on the time aspect. Everyone wants to hit harder, and they focus on playing a ton of topspin. But instead of hitting harder, how about you just take the ball on the rise or early, don't wait for the ball to drop. Drive the ball with a flatter more penetrating shot and take time away. There is a time and place for all shots and strategies but this is what is so refreshing about the style of all court players. Anyways I don't want to minimize the importance of topspin in the effects it has to disrupt opponents, timing and strike zone and margin of error by clearing the net higher.
I recently moved from hitting flat and moderate topspin to heavy topspin and prefer the latter because of the high net clearance and also because it challenges my tennis partner. We don't suffer, but instead enjoy the challenge of heavy high bouncing topspin that lands deep. Also, by using semi Western grip instead of Eastern grip, it's actually relaxing to hit heavy topspin. Not as effortful as Tomaz in video.
👍👍 I like to clear the net by 2-4’ with a bit of top. Not a huge amount of power but deep, if possible. I wish I wasn’t so old (68)-but the alternative isn’t attractive.
The kind of topspin we would want is the ball accelerated forward and upward after bouncing. If we only get the upward but not enough forward, and if it lands short, that's a bad combination because that's the kind of ball that bothers the opponent least. So whatever kind of shot (except drop shots), we want sufficient forward speed.
Exactly, and the way to develop the "speed component" is to isolate it for a part of practice (over long period of time) and hit low, flat and clean. So that later on when you "add topspin", you have a better speed "vector" and more penetrating shots.
Look at Federer. Prime he played a slightY flatter ball. After 2008 in particular he started putting more spin on it to win RG and his game suffered. After 09 he became more aggressive again
The part I disagree with: Top players generate more topspin, not less. They also produce more speed. You can check the net clearance by players like Sinner or Nadal: it's high margin. Net clearance (through drag) is just one of the reasons for topspin, the others being penetration upon bounce and the difficulty controlling it upon impact. The part I agree with: At the lower levels you can indeed have good net clearance with a flatter stroke, because the speed is lower, and so gravity will do most of the job that otherwise topspin drag needs to do. More topspin with similar energy input will result in slower, spinnier shots, with ridiculous net clearance and lack of depth. The exception is indeed an incoming slice, which you have to take low, so to clear the net, the starting angle is bigger; this then requires some drag, hence topspin. Same for a shorter ball, which you often need to take when it's already descending in its trajectory, and for which the overall distance to cover is shorter. I'm also unsure whether your call-outs flat/1/2 actually refer to the amount of topspin. It seems to me they are more related to how low you take the shots and therefore bend your knees. In theory these should then indeed get more topspin (as explained above) but what I observe is that they are either slower or have a lower net clearance. I don't observe much difference in the curviness. Thanks for the video and the chance to react.
You misunderstand the idea of high level players. I am referring to me and other 5.0+ tennis players, not pros. I almost never reference the pros because their skill level is unattainable to recreational tennis players who watch videos on UA-cam. So I refer to myself and my friend who are 5.0+ level of tennis and all of us "top level" tennis players hit very flat in free hitting sessions since we enjoy challenging our skills to play low and fast over the net, we enjoy the sensation of hitting the ball clean, we enjoy the effortlessness that comes with that kind of hitting. Even a 4.0 level player cannot possibly rally like me and is at least 5 years away from attaining such skill. And I KNOW that this ability of hitting the ball clean and flat gives me the foundation on which - if I add topspin to it - I get a very heavy deep fast ball. While a 3.0 to 4.0 players try to spin like crazy and their ball goes nowhere... As for net clearance, it has nothing to do with topspin, they are not related. I can hit the exact same net clearance with a flat shot and with a topspin shot. If topspin and net clearance were related and there was some causality, then I would not be able to hit with lots of topspin a low ball over the net. Obviously every skilled player can do that, in fact, I can hit a heavily spun ball into the bottom of the net. So lots of misconceptions about topspin, I see I need to make another video to explain that...
If you watch pros up close in person, you’ll see that they hit a lot flatter than on tv. It’s true for Sinner, Novak and Carlos. I’ve watched them in person and the net clearness is low. At their level, too much clearance means giving opponents more time to react.
@@feeltennis I can't disagree with the first part of your message, where you advise amateurs to go for clean striking first, then add topspin if they really want to. We still disagree on the other thing, which is of course the more interesting part of the debate :) "As for net clearance, it has nothing to do with topspin, they are not related. I can hit the exact same net clearance with a flat shot and with a topspin shot." Sure you can, but then you will have to compromise on speed. A slow flat shot can clear the net and still land inside the court. A fast flat shot with high net clearance will go out. So to combine net clearance and speed and landing in, you need topspin to drag the ball down. There is, physically speaking, no way around it.
@ Well I haven't seen them live but I did watch many court side level videos. And the clearance is definitely high. They are taking a considerable margin.
@ maybe your definition of high is different from mine. It’s about a racket grip length (from butt cap to bottom of the racket throat). And I’m talking about neutral balls, not defensive shots. Also, the sound from racket struck the ball you can tell they really “hit through” the ball and not some brushing sounds from coaches “low to high” or “vertical swing path “.
Tomaz, really interesting concept. I play with a lot of top spin (level 3, the ball is on or above my opponent's shoulder), but I struggle to produce those shots. Only once in a while I get that level of bounce. Most balls are short. After watching this video I realize is because of my focus in on spinning the ball as much as I can, paying not attention to other factors as hitting clean, or going deep. Any advice on how to hit the flat, clean shot?
Yes, hitting flat and low often like you see me play in your free hitting sessions so that you "clean up" your strokes. We coaches literally use this phrase to "clean up" or to "polish" the strokes or the contact point when we see players that hit the ball "too rough" and often off center which makes the ball drop short with not enough speed. Very important to also pay attention to breathing and exhaling when you hit the ball: ua-cam.com/video/3ncD61w69og/v-deo.html
This is so true. What I found out lately is that the older I get, the flatter ball I hit. It's easier to hit flat ball because you can swing slower (easier on timing), but still be able to send to ball back deep. Less miss-hit because your hitting zone is larger (more through the ball). This helps me on handling the high balls too - just hit it totally flat (because it's already higher than the net) and let the gravity pull it down to the court.
On rec level tennis might become a very costly hobby playing with heavy top spin because hitting with top spin rapidly destroys a tennis ball and your strings because of a friction.
The problem about amateur s topspin is that they don’t really have speed accompanying that jump. so it becomes just a weak high ball. if they try to add speed to topspin they will certainly have wrist and elbow problems. Pros spend decades building their tfcc and elbow tendons for this reason 😊
Yes, exactly. And that's because they started to hit heavy topspins before being able to hit the ball flatter and control it well. And it's not their fault, only the coach's fault. If two people got stranded on a lonely island and have never played tennis before, but there was a nice tennis court with balls and rackets and they started to play tennis (and got enough food and water) but they would NOT have access to UA-cam, they would have learned to play tennis over a longer period of time very nicely without excessive topspin. ;)
In my opinion, when you demonstrate the „heavy“ topspin strokes, you are not hitting enough through the ball (I.e. get your body weiht into the swing direction) which is why your topspin needs quite some afford but is not much penetrating. I am 59 and have the same problem. If I, however, have the right timing and swing „through“ the ball with the right contact in front of me, it is not more afford than a flat ball but much safer. Of course, I have a semi-western to western grip and not a slight eastern grip as you Thomaz. This is no offense, just my perception. Of course, the timing is we’re pros are much better and it is also result of good footwork. And, I cannot run as quick and explosiv as 20-30 years ago 😄
If I were to hit more through the ball then I would not be hitting high rate of topspin, that means that would not be a heavy ball. Heavy ball has certain characteristics and one of them is a high trajectory. So again, hitting lower and faster is a different type of shot, they obviously exist, but it is not a heavy ball anymore. Watch here: ua-cam.com/video/5wS36C9VapY/v-deo.html
i think a perfect fast flat shot still has a liitle topspin, just enough to arc the ball into the court. like medvedev for example. and the best thing is imo to do it all, from 0 to 3 just to confuse your oponent.
At about 6:40 (7:19) you state that hitting flat is the foundation of tennis, and if you wish to proceed to hitting with increase topspin, you'd best master the "flat" shot first. I'm a beginner and I'd certainly agree. Forehand, straight and flat, first, then play around with different spinning levels.
Good, here are former #1 tennis players in the world who played very flat: Jimmy Connors, John McEnroe, Pete Sampras, Andre Agassi, Serena Williams, Maria Sharapova and many others. Here's my food for thought for other reading this comment: which technique is more attainable to recreational tennis players: the one from Jimmy Connors or the one from Rafael Nadal? ;)
I started with eastern and flat, but i tried switching to semiwest grip and changing my swing to add some spin, and it was the most detrimental thing i've ever done to my game.
Thanks for sharing, yes, that is what happens with extreme grips and not having good clean swing path through the ball. Changing grips is very very risky and best not to do at adult age. Any grip can hit flat and topspin, just practice...
i've never had any coaching in tennis, i picked up a racquet and just started swinging. I guess all my shot making early on was just bad variations of a flat ball with only the most vague amounts of spin. These days i tend to overuse slice shots where my racquet passes somewhat under the ball. Some of my shots are literally "bend it like beckham" and since i play doubles only it will curve past the net player hit the ground and bounce away from the one i was cross court rallying with. At the end of the day, I dont even know how i picked up that, and i bet i'll never know how to topspin
Many amateur's can not return a slice correctly because they have not been taught how spin works or are too unathletic to run for the ball. So slice away 🤣 you'll probably win more hitting only slices than a forehand.
The physicality to hit with top spin still allows you to hit a flat shot. The problem with a flat shot is it does not develop the physicality to hit top spin. You literally demonstrate this in the video, more later. Moreover the shots you are calling flat is what most people would call top spin Furthermore when defining the difference between flat and top spin, most of all your shots the top of the balls trajectory is much closer the bounce, where as a flat shot the top of the trajectory and the flaw/area of improvement for most players is the hit the ball with the top of the trajectory is close or at the top of the net. Also in the scheme of things, most errors are into the net, so hitting flat does not solve one of the major barriers to success in tennis, which is, To hit the ball over the net AND in LAST. Finally, swinging your racquet with what is primarily an arm based swing, will tire you out very quickly when trying to hit with a lot of top spin Words have meaning, and when people start redefining what words mean, then anybody can say anything and you cannot say they are wrong, because in their universe, up means down, left means right, black is white, etc etc.
The shots that I call flat are flat tennis wise, what all tennis experts agree on and what I feel. The ball either spins sideways or spins foward with very low rate of spin - which again we call flat. So if you say "most people would call topspin what I call flat" - no, only amateurs would call that topspin. Tennis coaches of higher level call that flat. "Flat" is also a solid contact of the ball that 95% of recreational players never find, they are unable to so effortlessly hit the ball off their racket as they always "brush" the ball upwards. I constantly hit into the sweet spot very flat. Rec players cannot only dream about that. That is the whole premise of this video - you have got to learn and keep mastering the ability to hit flat clean shots (every pros does that at the start of the warm up) as when you start adding spin on to them later you have the right type of penetrating spin. What is the purpose or meaning of your comment I have no idea.
You're conflating physicality and technique. And the video is definitely showing relatively flatter shots, not sure where you're getting the "most people call that top spin" from.
Would you consider Nadal's average forehand and Federers average forehand flat or topspin? I mean are we talking trajectory or the actual spin? Nadal hits his forehands on average 3 nethights over the net, whereas Roger's forehands clear the net at just one extra nethight. Yet they almost have the same rpm's (rotations per minute). Technically all shots apart from slice have topspin. So flat would then mean a more horizontal trajectory? Because even a 'flat' shot van have the same amount of rotations. It could also be the difference between a drive and a shaped ball. I teach my students the difference between a ball that is on the rise or a ball that is on it's way down. A ball on the rise you can or actually should DRIVE. You hit that more trough the ball with a more horizontal swing. Yet the ball still gets some hight because that's what a ball does when it hits something when on the rise. Still both will have spin.
No, trajectory has nothing to do with topspin - just like you said, Federer plays massive amount of topspin much lower over the net. Topspin rate is topspin rate. ;) So every pro in the last 20 years or so hits with massive amount of topspin in 95% of the cases regardles of the trajectory! Some shots have sidespin (not intentional) when they go for a fast risky shot. Observe the slow motion replays of matches and you will spot them. So at the current pro tour, every player plays with very high rate of spin. But Jimmy Connors, John McEnroe, Chris Evert and many others from many years ago all played shots with topspin but at a much lower rate of spinning and we call that flat. They were all nr1 in the world, by the way... If you drive through the ball that's rising, it will have a much lower rate of spin than if you are hitting the ball that is on the way down. That is true even at pro level although the spin rate difference is much less than at junior level.
Would be good to clarify terms like racquet launch angle etc. What kind of racquet is Tomas using? Proper loading is required for the amount of racquet head speed that getting decent amount of topspin requires. Legs, hips, shoulder line and most importantly a loose wrist.
Ok, but the point of my video is to NOT to obsess about topspin but rather work on hitting the ball clean and flat as you see all higher level players capable of doing. This is our foundation and we can add topspin on top of it if we need to get a fast topspin shot whereas most club players lose all the speed if they try to hit with lots of topspin.
@@feeltennis True. Even Nadal, a pro, suffered from this. I've seen him lose matches where his heavy topspin balls land just around the service line and a player steps in and just hits flat past him or puts him immediately on defense. Or worse, he has the advantage, but the shortness of his ball gives his opponent time to get back into the play because he hasn't hit through the court. I agree with the video...at rec level, we especially need to be able to consistently hit the ball flat, clean, efficiently and deep in the court or else you just give your opponents the opportunity to step in and run you around.
I think you should research a little more. While you’re right that topspin won’t “solve all your problems” The leading difference between college players and pro is the amount of topspin they can hit
I think his channel is geared more towards rec players though. Rec players sometimes try to copy pros and college players and it can cause more harm than good.
As you saw the comment below - there are no college players watching mine or any other UA-cam channels. You also have not really watched the video in full to really understand my point and to what audience at what level I am speaking to.
My understanding was that there are two barriers to overcome. First is the net and the second is side and back of the opponent's court. Topspin allows a greater margin of safety in getting ball over the net and into the opponents court. Isn't this why most advanced players use the semi-western or strong semi-western grip? If you're old and unfit then the least tiring and safest shot is the slice. Many older players do slice much of the time and just push the ball back. it can be frustrating to play against.
You have to watch the video more carefully. You arguing against a point I never made which seems to be that I recommend people to play flat and not topspin. That is NOT what I am saying. I am saying the hitting flat is the FOUNDATION of tennis groundstrokes where you develop the ability to hit effortlessly and cleanly the ball into the sweet spot which gives the ball very easy power. If you develop that foundation and nurture it over the years constantly, then when you decide to apply topspin to the ball, you will have a good penetrating topspin. If on the other hand you are trying to hit the ball with lots of topspin just like 95% of the online tennis pros hype you to (since they don't know tennis well), then you will hit too much around the ball (you will "brush" it) and while you will have topspin your shots will be SLOW and SHORT! They will land around the service line or shorter because you lack the foundation of hitting THROUGH the ball cleanly which only develops over years and years of also practicing hitting very clean and flat shots. At 4.0 NTRP and higher you will be constantly attacked and you will lose matches all the time because your shots are too slow and too short. Do you understand now?
Many older players use continental grip for all strokes and they would feel like Nadal if they managed to hit something close to those "flat shots" and cleared the net with more than 10 inches. :)
😆This is so oldschool. Hitting each other easy balls, while admitting that Alcaraz/Nadal(38) would eat you both up for breakfast (whole doubles court, yes two of you against one of him). Those of us who've been in tennis a long time are not bothered by pace (besides extreme pace, which requires heavy spin to be consistent). Most players struggle much more with reading and timing against a difficult bounce. (A kickserve past the forehead or a nasty slice troubles them more than a medium fast serve that offers pace to feed on) So vary the spin, and don't always give a deep ball if it will be nicely in their low/waist strikezone. I'm 47 and I admire old men for their tremendous skill in aim. But they end up drinking beers together chatting about us "youngsters" slaughtering them. The heavy ball is easy hitting for me if I'm loose, and exhausting for them as they can't catch up properly to a ball kicking away from them, leaving the strikezone too. Games of doubles are fantastic fun, with us all going for more low aim, power, volleys and angles. But then, if we play singles, these oldsters lose 2-6 1-6 without me even needing to risk going near the lines. This video shows you emphasis on the linear hand-through-ball and clean contact. You need this *and* you need rotation. But don't force the topspin or you'll get tired: instead, let yourself get comfortable loosening and flowing/"ripping" (non-oldschool). To hit with impressive power, Jannik Sinner hits a lot of revs on both sides, and see how easy he makes it look *because good balance and timing, and inbuilt🌀margin of error*
You have not watched the video carefully enough to understand my message. Watch it again carefully and listen to what I am saying... Your perception and interpretation of this video is clouded by your convictions of how tennis should be played whereas I am NOT saying that tennis should be played low and flat. So watch the video again and feel free to comment with your corrected understanding.
@@feeltennisWatch your video from 9:30 onwards. No-one needs to say how tennis 'should' be play: enjoyment of the match and results will tell you more. You can take it as a lower level analogy to how talented Daniil Medvedev is unable to win a slam again, against fully integrated techniques. Your video can be used as a training exercise tho for players who struggle with timing.
All my videos are training exercises because I am coach teaching people progressions. You are not a coach I assume so you don't know how to teach. You assume teaching is "telling" someone what to do. Not in any sport where you teach skills. Your response starting with "This is so old school" means that you are arguing against a statement that says "players should play low and flat shots as they play tennis (practice and match)". That is what you are arguing against and yet that was not my statement. You are not paying attention to what I am teaching so now you are arguing against your own beliefs, not against me. I will allow you one more comment to apologize and adjust your statements and also to adjust your tone to be more respectful.
Shock! Guy in his 40s can beat people much older. I am 60, super fit and a high level player. But my lateral movement is no where near where it was when I was your age. So it no surprise that topspin angles would be a solid strategy where there is a large difference in age. Totally irrelevant to the points being made in this video though.
Really, and how do you know what is our goal? We are not playing matches in any league or tournament for 20 years. We are not training to become better, we have mastered the skills of tennis and we enjoy them in 1 hour free hitting sessions once a week. You need to be more open minded and humble always assuming that you don't have all the information and that you don't know everything. I will expect that from your future comments here...
Well, they may have no said that but the whole tennis UA-cam content is flooded with videos on how to hit with more topspin as if that's going to solve all your problems since you'll never miss again.
Some people who hit flat want to hit with topspin, but it's like learning tennis all over again! No one learns to hit topspin one day and that make them a better tennis player the next day?
The GOAT of coaches for us rec players. Will you ever come back to Singapore? I'd love to get a lesson from you!
These are great points that I don't often see in most instructional videos. Recently, I've started hitting flatter and through the ball more and became much better in playing matches, especially doubles which requires hitting flat, low balls. I often exaggerate my follow through, stay closer to the baseline and hit as deep as possible. In doing this, during matches I noticed that this practice helped me hit shots much cleaner while keeping the same amount of topspin. The spin now is more forward rather than upward, which increases ball speed and requires less amount of effort.
Exactly my point, thanks for sharing.
A few more comments: Paul Annacone explains it well. There are aggressive shots and aggressive locations. Also, I think that we players need to think about hitting left, right, front, and back, as well as our height and weight levels. Next, hitting with topspin does not require much extra effort with the right technique. The modern and next-gen forehands are efficient, especially with today's strings.
Lastly, I received great advice years ago: We workout to play tennis, we don't play tennis to workout. I believe that the work off the court is what builds me for the court. Vamos!!
„Next, hitting with topspin does not require much extra effort with the right technique. The modern and next-gen forehands are efficient, especially with today's strings.“ I totally agree but the footwork and timing is decisive.
10/10 video. Great work Tomaz!
I've been playing for some 40+ years as well and I instinctively tend to hit flat, deep shots, with forward body momentum as can be mustered. But I've developed #3 top spins as well for going wide and for passing shots.
This is my problem. I started tennis watching nadal, that made me starting tennis with topspin in mind, always. Now in my 30s, i struggle to use small headsize racquet because my shots tend to be short because i'm used to brush the ball, instead of hitting THROUGH the ball.
Thanks, that is what my message is about, too much topspin too early without developing a clean flat shot will cause lots of problems. Work on hitting lower and flatter as part of your development. Again, I am not saying you should play balls flat and low forever, but I am saying that hitting like that for 15 minutes of even the whole hour will be very beneficial for later when you want to hit with more spin.
Idk I wanna be alcaraz thoo 😂
@@feeltennisif I just drop the racquet below the ball a lot and hit then I get the topspin so I don’t try to brush up.
@@sunglee3935 drop the racquet below the ball a lot to get more topspin? What grip do you use, continental? I think it's probably easier to change racquet face angle at contact point: more perpendicular face angle, more topspin, higher and shorter shots, and vice versa. Just play with the angle and find your perfect stroke. Also, these days all pros use bigger headsize racquets(98 and above) anyway what was your reason for switching to smaller headsize racquet?
This was exactly my problem. Being a Nadal fan, I was obsessed with hitting more topspin even though my racquet head speed was/is no where close to Nadal's. My shots were slow and loopy, and it worked ok at lower levels. But players at higher levels attacked them.
This dude is the OG
I & many others echo your statement....
Really good explanation, makes lots of sense. I tend to get ahead of myself and just topspin like crazy but your right hitting through the ball will create more consistency and your balls won’t be out, as much as top spin hits. Will keep this in mind.
Yup me too. I'm glad you also understand what Tomas is saying. I think however he is going to get a lot of pushback from some players who can't separate regular spin (which we all do anyhow) from that crazy Nadal topspin which is what coach is referring to.
So many times I mishit the ball or off the rim because I'm trying to Nadal topspin...going to knock it off right now 😂
@karen9244 Safer shots is one of the purposes of topsin, so you shouldn't get more balls out with it, quite the opposite. But Tomaz is on point as it does wear you out.
Flat = prone to overhitting and net errors
Top spin = prone to producing short balls with no penetration
One needs to find some balance between the two. It also depends on a racket you use. Some are more flat hitting friendly with lower launch angle, others are designed for heavy top spin with higher launch angle.
Good and clear explanation of use of top spin in 🎾👍🙏
Interesting video ,
The last singles match I played 2wks ago I found that actually accuracy/placement rather than heavy top-spinned shots won me the match comfortably.
Pause for thought there 🤔
Singles is a lot tougher at my age now 😂
If that's the case, your top spin is not really heavy. At amateur level, say 4.0 or 4.5, I rarely played anyone with top spin I would consider heavy. If you play against a real heavy top spin, and you're not good enough to handle that, the opponent does not have to place the ball anywhere near the line because eventually you'd break down.
Hey Tomas .. still cranking out good stuff. Well done!
This is so right... I'm just started tennis in my 40, still under a year and I tried too much spin on every ball and the result is the ball dont have speed and not penetrating enough, and a lot of it end up in the net.. And now I only hit hard spin if the ball worth it and just flat the ball and slice it accordingly, And my tennis improved a lot, I can rally more and have a good return ball. And can now enjoys the game with my friends more
The way I see it, the difference between hitting a ball with a lot of topspin and a ball that is "heavy" is the ability to hit the ball cleanly and "flat." In other words, high levels of spin can be achieved by simply brushing against the ball but with not enough forward velocity due to trading off "swing through" for "brush up" technique. Achieving the "heavy" ball is where enough forward swing deforms the ball at contact so much that any kind of brushing up that also happens at that time applies a massive amount of spin due to how much more strings are in contact with the ball. With less deformation the contact area is theoretically a point. With more deformation, the contact area will look like a fat square.
What a coincidence that you made this video today. I have been thinking a lot about how I shape the ball because I make a lot of mistakes. Mostly off center hits or shanks. And I’ve been thinking that the way I learned to play tennis, as a mostly self taught 35 year old, has something to do with it. I think I overemphasized topspin in the beginning and now the foundation of the shot is “always topspin” irrespective of my positioning or contact point. And I use a grip that is sort of half way between eastern and semiwestern, which makes high balls more of a problem.
Yes, off center shots and shanks happen when you start adding too much topspin to your shots BEFORE you develop the skill of hitting the ball clean and flat into the sweet spot. When that is in place, then topspin shots become cleaner and more penetrating.
Hey coach, great lesson. Thank you.
Playing topspin at 2 and 3 level on both wings, on every shot, has been my way of playing since the 80s. I´ve always been a chronic stringbreaker. My friends say my shots are heavy. But, now at 57, I´m thinking (after this video) to start playing at 1 or flat. Anyone remember Jimmy Arias? That´s my playing style, hehe.
I played in a few youth tournaments with Arias.. not in his league clearly and never got paired / played him..but watched him play a few times... the topspin on his backhand was something. miss all the one handed backhands form the 70's and 80's
Hitting through the ball with even a slight upward motion would generate more topspin than the brushing up motion because the strings grip the ball then snap back very fast. Even a 'flat' shot with a slight upward motion hit quickly will have a lot of topspin.
I guess if you hardly hit the ball, but then the strings aren't working for you anyway and it would be the same with a plank of wood. People should watch a slow motion video of a ball hitting the string bed.
I love Tomasz's instruction, but I have to say that at 58 I can hit heavy balls for 2-3 with no problem. The keys: Be in great shape and #2 relaxation.
Very good, maybe 1% of your level tennis players can do that.
That's what I am talking about! You play tennis to stay in shape, why would you back off on hitting heavy balls? You get a little rest in between shots anyway, Go for it! And I don't care about winning, when I hit with topspin, all my shots seem to go in! If I go back to hitting flat, it will go Out!
100% True. Guys trying to hit heavy topspin on each shot are fooling themselves. As Tomas says, it cannot be done yet all the rec players try it on 90% of their shots. I see guys, even on high balls, trying to hit max topspin. Also, hitting out in front is a huge mistake for the club player. Find your optimal contact point (where you get easy power and control). When you find it, build your swing around that. Great lesson!!
I think there are two kinds of topspin shots. Extremely loopy high trajectory Nadal-style topspin, but also a low trajectory superficially 'flatter' shot where the ball is still rotating forwards and has a very tight spin, it just doesn't look like a topspin shot.
Federer has close to as much topspin as Nadals has but it's hard to see it on TV. If you see his short crosscourts from the right angle you can see the crazy dive on his ball, a mere mortal hitting that shot in that speed would have put it far outside the double line.
Yes, the shot can be loopier like Nadal's or more straight like Federer's, but necessarily Nadal's shots will have more topspin. Federer's shots will also have topspin but Nadal's have more. This is captured by the physical concept called "Magnus effect". Topspin will drag the ball down. If Federer's low trajectory shots carried as much topspin as Nadals, they would be dragged down before clearing the net. Nadal plays with more net clearance, hence needs to produce more topspin (or else his shots would be slowish, which they obviously aren't)
The latter type is called a dipping topspin shot. It's hit with the racquet face more closed at contact, so the ball still has topspin but the trajectory is lower. This shot is great for passing the net player.
I could not agree more, if you don't know how to hit topspin it's better to not hit it in a game indeed.
Hi, very good points. Thanks for your reply to the question I saw below about moving from Eastern grip to semi Western grip. Ive been trying to generate too much forced spin recently by heading my grip more towards semi western, and my game has suffered through inconsistency.
Excellent video coach! Thanks 👍🏼
Notwithstanding your advice not to hit top spin, your top spin shots are are really impressive with that kick and arc on the ball.
Thanks! Just to make sure, I am not telling you NOT to hit topspin when you play matches. But what I am suggesting is that one practices a lot of flat clean hitting of low balls to improve the ability to hit through the ball so that when at some point you decide to spin it more, you will have a cleaner and more penetrating topspin shot.
Interesting perspective. I don't fundamentally disagree. I find that people don't focus on the time aspect. Everyone wants to hit harder, and they focus on playing a ton of topspin. But instead of hitting harder, how about you just take the ball on the rise or early, don't wait for the ball to drop. Drive the ball with a flatter more penetrating shot and take time away. There is a time and place for all shots and strategies but this is what is so refreshing about the style of all court players. Anyways I don't want to minimize the importance of topspin in the effects it has to disrupt opponents, timing and strike zone and margin of error by clearing the net higher.
I recently moved from hitting flat and moderate topspin to heavy topspin and prefer the latter because of the high net clearance and also because it challenges my tennis partner. We don't suffer, but instead enjoy the challenge of heavy high bouncing topspin that lands deep. Also, by using semi Western grip instead of Eastern grip, it's actually relaxing to hit heavy topspin. Not as effortful as Tomaz in video.
👍👍
I like to clear the net by 2-4’ with a bit of top. Not a huge amount of power but deep, if possible. I wish I wasn’t so old (68)-but the alternative isn’t attractive.
The kind of topspin we would want is the ball accelerated forward and upward after bouncing. If we only get the upward but not enough forward, and if it lands short, that's a bad combination because that's the kind of ball that bothers the opponent least. So whatever kind of shot (except drop shots), we want sufficient forward speed.
Exactly, and the way to develop the "speed component" is to isolate it for a part of practice (over long period of time) and hit low, flat and clean. So that later on when you "add topspin", you have a better speed "vector" and more penetrating shots.
Look at Federer. Prime he played a slightY flatter ball. After 2008 in particular he started putting more spin on it to win RG and his game suffered. After 09 he became more aggressive again
The part I disagree with: Top players generate more topspin, not less. They also produce more speed. You can check the net clearance by players like Sinner or Nadal: it's high margin.
Net clearance (through drag) is just one of the reasons for topspin, the others being penetration upon bounce and the difficulty controlling it upon impact.
The part I agree with: At the lower levels you can indeed have good net clearance with a flatter stroke, because the speed is lower, and so gravity will do most of the job that otherwise topspin drag needs to do. More topspin with similar energy input will result in slower, spinnier shots, with ridiculous net clearance and lack of depth. The exception is indeed an incoming slice, which you have to take low, so to clear the net, the starting angle is bigger; this then requires some drag, hence topspin. Same for a shorter ball, which you often need to take when it's already descending in its trajectory, and for which the overall distance to cover is shorter.
I'm also unsure whether your call-outs flat/1/2 actually refer to the amount of topspin. It seems to me they are more related to how low you take the shots and therefore bend your knees. In theory these should then indeed get more topspin (as explained above) but what I observe is that they are either slower or have a lower net clearance. I don't observe much difference in the curviness.
Thanks for the video and the chance to react.
You misunderstand the idea of high level players. I am referring to me and other 5.0+ tennis players, not pros. I almost never reference the pros because their skill level is unattainable to recreational tennis players who watch videos on UA-cam. So I refer to myself and my friend who are 5.0+ level of tennis and all of us "top level" tennis players hit very flat in free hitting sessions since we enjoy challenging our skills to play low and fast over the net, we enjoy the sensation of hitting the ball clean, we enjoy the effortlessness that comes with that kind of hitting.
Even a 4.0 level player cannot possibly rally like me and is at least 5 years away from attaining such skill. And I KNOW that this ability of hitting the ball clean and flat gives me the foundation on which - if I add topspin to it - I get a very heavy deep fast ball. While a 3.0 to 4.0 players try to spin like crazy and their ball goes nowhere...
As for net clearance, it has nothing to do with topspin, they are not related. I can hit the exact same net clearance with a flat shot and with a topspin shot. If topspin and net clearance were related and there was some causality, then I would not be able to hit with lots of topspin a low ball over the net. Obviously every skilled player can do that, in fact, I can hit a heavily spun ball into the bottom of the net. So lots of misconceptions about topspin, I see I need to make another video to explain that...
If you watch pros up close in person, you’ll see that they hit a lot flatter than on tv. It’s true for Sinner, Novak and Carlos. I’ve watched them in person and the net clearness is low. At their level, too much clearance means giving opponents more time to react.
@@feeltennis
I can't disagree with the first part of your message, where you advise amateurs to go for clean striking first, then add topspin if they really want to. We still disagree on the other thing, which is of course the more interesting part of the debate :)
"As for net clearance, it has nothing to do with topspin, they are not related. I can hit the exact same net clearance with a flat shot and with a topspin shot."
Sure you can, but then you will have to compromise on speed. A slow flat shot can clear the net and still land inside the court. A fast flat shot with high net clearance will go out. So to combine net clearance and speed and landing in, you need topspin to drag the ball down. There is, physically speaking, no way around it.
@ Well I haven't seen them live but I did watch many court side level videos. And the clearance is definitely high. They are taking a considerable margin.
@ maybe your definition of high is different from mine. It’s about a racket grip length (from butt cap to bottom of the racket throat). And I’m talking about neutral balls, not defensive shots. Also, the sound from racket struck the ball you can tell they really “hit through” the ball and not some brushing sounds from coaches “low to high” or “vertical swing path “.
Tomaz, really interesting concept.
I play with a lot of top spin (level 3, the ball is on or above my opponent's shoulder), but I struggle to produce those shots. Only once in a while I get that level of bounce. Most balls are short.
After watching this video I realize is because of my focus in on spinning the ball as much as I can, paying not attention to other factors as hitting clean, or going deep.
Any advice on how to hit the flat, clean shot?
Yes, hitting flat and low often like you see me play in your free hitting sessions so that you "clean up" your strokes. We coaches literally use this phrase to "clean up" or to "polish" the strokes or the contact point when we see players that hit the ball "too rough" and often off center which makes the ball drop short with not enough speed. Very important to also pay attention to breathing and exhaling when you hit the ball: ua-cam.com/video/3ncD61w69og/v-deo.html
Agreed but Rafa is an odd, rare exception. Rafa burns a lot of energy pushing Xtra spin into the ball but it does give control.
This is so true. What I found out lately is that the older I get, the flatter ball I hit. It's easier to hit flat ball because you can swing slower (easier on timing), but still be able to send to ball back deep. Less miss-hit because your hitting zone is larger (more through the ball). This helps me on handling the high balls too - just hit it totally flat (because it's already higher than the net) and let the gravity pull it down to the court.
On rec level tennis might become a very costly hobby playing with heavy top spin because hitting with top spin rapidly destroys a tennis ball and your strings because of a friction.
The problem about amateur s topspin is that they don’t really have speed accompanying that jump. so it becomes just a weak high ball. if they try to add speed to topspin they will certainly have wrist and elbow problems. Pros spend decades building their tfcc and elbow tendons for this reason 😊
Yes, exactly. And that's because they started to hit heavy topspins before being able to hit the ball flatter and control it well. And it's not their fault, only the coach's fault. If two people got stranded on a lonely island and have never played tennis before, but there was a nice tennis court with balls and rackets and they started to play tennis (and got enough food and water) but they would NOT have access to UA-cam, they would have learned to play tennis over a longer period of time very nicely without excessive topspin. ;)
In my opinion, when you demonstrate the „heavy“ topspin strokes, you are not hitting enough through the ball (I.e. get your body weiht into the swing direction) which is why your topspin needs quite some afford but is not much penetrating. I am 59 and have the same problem. If I, however, have the right timing and swing „through“ the ball with the right contact in front of me, it is not more afford than a flat ball but much safer. Of course, I have a semi-western to western grip and not a slight eastern grip as you Thomaz. This is no offense, just my perception. Of course, the timing is we’re pros are much better and it is also result of good footwork. And, I cannot run as quick and explosiv as 20-30 years ago 😄
If I were to hit more through the ball then I would not be hitting high rate of topspin, that means that would not be a heavy ball. Heavy ball has certain characteristics and one of them is a high trajectory. So again, hitting lower and faster is a different type of shot, they obviously exist, but it is not a heavy ball anymore. Watch here: ua-cam.com/video/5wS36C9VapY/v-deo.html
i think a perfect fast flat shot still has a liitle topspin, just enough to arc the ball into the court. like medvedev for example. and the best thing is imo to do it all, from 0 to 3 just to confuse your oponent.
Interesting that the amount of spin is both correlated with how low the ball is and how much you bend your legs. 1 low bend, 2 deeper bend.
At about 6:40 (7:19) you state that hitting flat is the foundation of tennis, and if you wish to proceed to hitting with increase topspin, you'd best master the "flat" shot first. I'm a beginner and I'd certainly agree. Forehand, straight and flat, first, then play around with different spinning levels.
Good, here are former #1 tennis players in the world who played very flat: Jimmy Connors, John McEnroe, Pete Sampras, Andre Agassi, Serena Williams, Maria Sharapova and many others. Here's my food for thought for other reading this comment: which technique is more attainable to recreational tennis players: the one from Jimmy Connors or the one from Rafael Nadal? ;)
I started with eastern and flat, but i tried switching to semiwest grip and changing my swing to add some spin, and it was the most detrimental thing i've ever done to my game.
Thanks for sharing, yes, that is what happens with extreme grips and not having good clean swing path through the ball. Changing grips is very very risky and best not to do at adult age. Any grip can hit flat and topspin, just practice...
i've never had any coaching in tennis, i picked up a racquet and just started swinging. I guess all my shot making early on was just bad variations of a flat ball with only the most vague amounts of spin. These days i tend to overuse slice shots where my racquet passes somewhat under the ball. Some of my shots are literally "bend it like beckham" and since i play doubles only it will curve past the net player hit the ground and bounce away from the one i was cross court rallying with. At the end of the day, I dont even know how i picked up that, and i bet i'll never know how to topspin
You cannot overuse the slice in tennis, the one who hits the last point in wins the point!
Many amateur's can not return a slice correctly because they have not been taught how spin works or are too unathletic to run for the ball. So slice away 🤣 you'll probably win more hitting only slices than a forehand.
The physicality to hit with top spin still allows you to hit a flat shot.
The problem with a flat shot is it does not develop the physicality to hit top spin. You literally demonstrate this in the video, more later.
Moreover the shots you are calling flat is what most people would call top spin
Furthermore when defining the difference between flat and top spin, most of all your shots the top of the balls trajectory is much closer the bounce, where as a flat shot the top of the trajectory and the flaw/area of improvement for most players is the hit the ball with the top of the trajectory is close or at the top of the net.
Also in the scheme of things, most errors are into the net, so hitting flat does not solve one of the major barriers to success in tennis, which is, To hit the ball over the net AND in LAST.
Finally, swinging your racquet with what is primarily an arm based swing, will tire you out very quickly when trying to hit with a lot of top spin
Words have meaning, and when people start redefining what words mean, then anybody can say anything and you cannot say they are wrong, because in their universe, up means down, left means right, black is white, etc etc.
The shots that I call flat are flat tennis wise, what all tennis experts agree on and what I feel. The ball either spins sideways or spins foward with very low rate of spin - which again we call flat. So if you say "most people would call topspin what I call flat" - no, only amateurs would call that topspin. Tennis coaches of higher level call that flat.
"Flat" is also a solid contact of the ball that 95% of recreational players never find, they are unable to so effortlessly hit the ball off their racket as they always "brush" the ball upwards. I constantly hit into the sweet spot very flat. Rec players cannot only dream about that.
That is the whole premise of this video - you have got to learn and keep mastering the ability to hit flat clean shots (every pros does that at the start of the warm up) as when you start adding spin on to them later you have the right type of penetrating spin. What is the purpose or meaning of your comment I have no idea.
You're conflating physicality and technique. And the video is definitely showing relatively flatter shots, not sure where you're getting the "most people call that top spin" from.
@@jackx410 I can't help what you don't know.
@@Whisper555 nobody asked you. 😉
@ Ok Mr "conflating physicality and technique"
Maybe don't use big words you do not understand
Would you consider Nadal's average forehand and Federers average forehand flat or topspin? I mean are we talking trajectory or the actual spin? Nadal hits his forehands on average 3 nethights over the net, whereas Roger's forehands clear the net at just one extra nethight. Yet they almost have the same rpm's (rotations per minute).
Technically all shots apart from slice have topspin. So flat would then mean a more horizontal trajectory? Because even a 'flat' shot van have the same amount of rotations.
It could also be the difference between a drive and a shaped ball. I teach my students the difference between a ball that is on the rise or a ball that is on it's way down. A ball on the rise you can or actually should DRIVE. You hit that more trough the ball with a more horizontal swing. Yet the ball still gets some hight because that's what a ball does when it hits something when on the rise. Still both will have spin.
No, trajectory has nothing to do with topspin - just like you said, Federer plays massive amount of topspin much lower over the net. Topspin rate is topspin rate. ;) So every pro in the last 20 years or so hits with massive amount of topspin in 95% of the cases regardles of the trajectory!
Some shots have sidespin (not intentional) when they go for a fast risky shot. Observe the slow motion replays of matches and you will spot them.
So at the current pro tour, every player plays with very high rate of spin. But Jimmy Connors, John McEnroe, Chris Evert and many others from many years ago all played shots with topspin but at a much lower rate of spinning and we call that flat. They were all nr1 in the world, by the way...
If you drive through the ball that's rising, it will have a much lower rate of spin than if you are hitting the ball that is on the way down. That is true even at pro level although the spin rate difference is much less than at junior level.
Would be good to clarify terms like racquet launch angle etc. What kind of racquet is Tomas using? Proper loading is required for the amount of racquet head speed that getting decent amount of topspin requires. Legs, hips, shoulder line and most importantly a loose wrist.
Ok, but the point of my video is to NOT to obsess about topspin but rather work on hitting the ball clean and flat as you see all higher level players capable of doing. This is our foundation and we can add topspin on top of it if we need to get a fast topspin shot whereas most club players lose all the speed if they try to hit with lots of topspin.
@@feeltennis True. Even Nadal, a pro, suffered from this. I've seen him lose matches where his heavy topspin balls land just around the service line and a player steps in and just hits flat past him or puts him immediately on defense. Or worse, he has the advantage, but the shortness of his ball gives his opponent time to get back into the play because he hasn't hit through the court.
I agree with the video...at rec level, we especially need to be able to consistently hit the ball flat, clean, efficiently and deep in the court or else you just give your opponents the opportunity to step in and run you around.
I don’t how “cleaner” = “flat” at all.
8:23 agreed
I think you should research a little more.
While you’re right that topspin won’t “solve all your problems”
The leading difference between college players and pro is the amount of topspin they can hit
I think his channel is geared more towards rec players though.
Rec players sometimes try to copy pros and college players and it can cause more harm than good.
As you saw the comment below - there are no college players watching mine or any other UA-cam channels. You also have not really watched the video in full to really understand my point and to what audience at what level I am speaking to.
Ok yeah you’re right
My understanding was that there are two barriers to overcome. First is the net and the second is side and back of the opponent's court. Topspin allows a greater margin of safety in getting ball over the net and into the opponents court. Isn't this why most advanced players use the semi-western or strong semi-western grip? If you're old and unfit then the least tiring and safest shot is the slice. Many older players do slice much of the time and just push the ball back. it can be frustrating to play against.
You have to watch the video more carefully. You arguing against a point I never made which seems to be that I recommend people to play flat and not topspin. That is NOT what I am saying. I am saying the hitting flat is the FOUNDATION of tennis groundstrokes where you develop the ability to hit effortlessly and cleanly the ball into the sweet spot which gives the ball very easy power.
If you develop that foundation and nurture it over the years constantly, then when you decide to apply topspin to the ball, you will have a good penetrating topspin. If on the other hand you are trying to hit the ball with lots of topspin just like 95% of the online tennis pros hype you to (since they don't know tennis well), then you will hit too much around the ball (you will "brush" it) and while you will have topspin your shots will be SLOW and SHORT!
They will land around the service line or shorter because you lack the foundation of hitting THROUGH the ball cleanly which only develops over years and years of also practicing hitting very clean and flat shots. At 4.0 NTRP and higher you will be constantly attacked and you will lose matches all the time because your shots are too slow and too short. Do you understand now?
Many older players use continental grip for all strokes and they would feel like Nadal if they managed to hit something close to those "flat shots" and cleared the net with more than 10 inches. :)
😆This is so oldschool. Hitting each other easy balls, while admitting that Alcaraz/Nadal(38) would eat you both up for breakfast (whole doubles court, yes two of you against one of him).
Those of us who've been in tennis a long time are not bothered by pace (besides extreme pace, which requires heavy spin to be consistent).
Most players struggle much more with reading and timing against a difficult bounce. (A kickserve past the forehead or a nasty slice troubles them more than a medium fast serve that offers pace to feed on) So vary the spin, and don't always give a deep ball if it will be nicely in their low/waist strikezone.
I'm 47 and I admire old men for their tremendous skill in aim. But they end up drinking beers together chatting about us "youngsters" slaughtering them. The heavy ball is easy hitting for me if I'm loose, and exhausting for them as they can't catch up properly to a ball kicking away from them, leaving the strikezone too.
Games of doubles are fantastic fun, with us all going for more low aim, power, volleys and angles. But then, if we play singles, these oldsters lose 2-6 1-6 without me even needing to risk going near the lines.
This video shows you emphasis on the linear hand-through-ball and clean contact. You need this *and* you need rotation. But don't force the topspin or you'll get tired: instead, let yourself get comfortable loosening and flowing/"ripping" (non-oldschool). To hit with impressive power, Jannik Sinner hits a lot of revs on both sides, and see how easy he makes it look *because good balance and timing, and inbuilt🌀margin of error*
You have not watched the video carefully enough to understand my message. Watch it again carefully and listen to what I am saying... Your perception and interpretation of this video is clouded by your convictions of how tennis should be played whereas I am NOT saying that tennis should be played low and flat. So watch the video again and feel free to comment with your corrected understanding.
@@feeltennisWatch your video from 9:30 onwards.
No-one needs to say how tennis 'should' be play: enjoyment of the match and results will tell you more.
You can take it as a lower level analogy to how talented Daniil Medvedev is unable to win a slam again, against fully integrated techniques.
Your video can be used as a training exercise tho for players who struggle with timing.
All my videos are training exercises because I am coach teaching people progressions. You are not a coach I assume so you don't know how to teach. You assume teaching is "telling" someone what to do. Not in any sport where you teach skills.
Your response starting with "This is so old school" means that you are arguing against a statement that says "players should play low and flat shots as they play tennis (practice and match)". That is what you are arguing against and yet that was not my statement. You are not paying attention to what I am teaching so now you are arguing against your own beliefs, not against me.
I will allow you one more comment to apologize and adjust your statements and also to adjust your tone to be more respectful.
Shock! Guy in his 40s can beat people much older. I am 60, super fit and a high level player. But my lateral movement is no where near where it was when I was your age. So it no surprise that topspin angles would be a solid strategy where there is a large difference in age. Totally irrelevant to the points being made in this video though.
You are Not doing your "friend" Or yourself any good by Not hitting topspin at him!
Really, and how do you know what is our goal? We are not playing matches in any league or tournament for 20 years. We are not training to become better, we have mastered the skills of tennis and we enjoy them in 1 hour free hitting sessions once a week. You need to be more open minded and humble always assuming that you don't have all the information and that you don't know everything. I will expect that from your future comments here...
In all my 5 decades of playing tennis I've never heard or come across anyone saying topspin is the "holy grail" of tennis.
Well, they may have no said that but the whole tennis UA-cam content is flooded with videos on how to hit with more topspin as if that's going to solve all your problems since you'll never miss again.
If u watch kids competing in tournaments u will see above shoulder topspin all the time. It’s the ultimate weapon in professional tennis
Some people who hit flat want to hit with topspin, but it's like learning tennis all over again! No one learns to hit topspin one day and that make them a better tennis player the next day?
@@joeshmoe7768 Yes, and who is stating that one learns topspin in one day which is what you are arguing against?
@@feeltennis So you just suggest to amateur's that if all the balls are going out they should just hit less hard ? Because that is the wrong path.