Swept Under the Rug: The Truth About the "Japanese Holocaust" ua-cam.com/video/18Xe9HqW8Q4/v-deo.htmlsi=dYRoaM8R0xJVVNaz This video brought to you in part by our Patrons over on Patreon. If you’d like to support our efforts here directly, and our continued efforts to improve our videos, as well as do more ultra in-depth long form videos that built in ads and even sponsors don’t always cover fully, check out our Patreon page and perks here: www.patreon.com/TodayIFoundOut And as ever, thanks for watching!
You forgot to mention that the soviet union initially belonged to the axis, fully supporting genocide and even out doing other fascists... And the evil allies willingly allied with stalin...
STOP! Just stop! Please. This lie keep floating around and it is despicable. There was a Tokyo War Crimes Trial, convictions and executions. After 31 months and more than 800 court sessions, the trial of 25 major Japanese leaders led to 7 death sentences, 16 condemned to life imprisonment, one to 20 years, and another to 7 years. The main Nuremberg Trial by comparison: 12 were sentenced to death (one in absentia) 10 of them hung in 1946, and the rest were given prison sentences ranging from 10 years to life behind bars. Hermann Göring committed suicide the night before his execution. The Germans kept records, the Japanese didn't or they were destroyed in firebombing. But the numbers are VERY CLOSE! And there were subsequent trials after Nuremberg, but also executions of Japanese war criminals in China, Philippines, etc. And a lot of Japanese war criminals committed suicide in the field. Now, if you want to talk about the Japanese Emperor specifically, fine. On his order, something only he could do, he got Japan to surrender for the first time in 1,000 years. And to subjugate themselves (and himself) to the Supreme Commander: McArthur. This, in exchange for NOT having a 20 year occupation fighting a guerrilla war in Japan where GI's would need to machine gun and burn with flamethrowers Japanese 12 year old girls charging at them with sharpened sticks. A fair trade, don't you think? So PLEASE! STOP THE LIE that the USA didn't hold Japanese war criminals accountable. It's not true.
STOP! Just stop! Please. This lie keep floating around and it is despicable. There was a Tokyo War Crimes Trial, convictions and executions. After 31 months and more than 800 court sessions, the trial of 25 major Japanese leaders led to 7 death sentences, 16 condemned to life imprisonment, one to 20 years, and another to 7 years. The main Nuremberg Trial by comparison: 12 were sentenced to death (one in absentia) 10 of them hung in 1946, and the rest were given prison sentences ranging from 10 years to life behind bars. Hermann Göring committed suicide the night before his execution. The Germans kept records, the Japanese didn't or they were destroyed in firebombing. But the numbers are VERY CLOSE! And there were subsequent trials after Nuremberg, but also executions of Japanese war criminals in China, Philippines, etc. And a lot of Japanese war criminals committed suicide in the field. Now, if you want to talk about the Japanese Emperor specifically, fine. On his order, something only he could do, he got Japan to surrender for the first time in 1,000 years. And to subjugate themselves (and himself) to the Supreme Commander: McArthur. This, in exchange for NOT having a 20 year occupation fighting a guerrilla war in Japan where GI's would need to machine gun and burn with flamethrowers Japanese 12 year old girls charging at them with sharpened sticks. A fair trade, don't you think? So PLEASE! STOP THE LIE that the USA didn't hold Japanese war criminals accountable. It's not true.
The idea of the Italians simply publishing a list of public enemies who could be killed with impunity and without trial is darkly ironic, because it has happened before. When Julius Caesar was a young man, the Dictator Sulla published such a list, which is usually referred to as "the proscriptions". Caesar, as Dictator himself later in life, refused to proscribe his enemies, and paid the price for his mercy. Following Caesar's assassination, his heirs thought better of the idea, and issued proscriptions of their own.
@@jesseberg3271 they are clearly not the same, not only their populations mixed with the Arabs in the south but also with Germanic people in all of the country. But the biggest difference remains the culture. Of those traditions and customs which defined an ancient Roman basically remains the alphabet, the language and the names of the cities.
@@Julius_Dayne and I am telling you that none of that is even remotely relevant to the discussion being had here. Go find a conversation about genetics to flog your hobbyhorse in, because it has no business being here.
Even here in Germany many got away scott free. Many were allowed to keep their companies despite working victims to death. Oetger, Leipniz, BMW, VW, Springer and so many more... They're still as big today, if not bigger.
STOP! Just stop! Please. This lie keep floating around and it is despicable. There was a Tokyo War Crimes Trial, convictions and executions. After 31 months and more than 800 court sessions, the trial of 25 major Japanese leaders led to 7 death sentences, 16 condemned to life imprisonment, one to 20 years, and another to 7 years. The main Nuremberg Trial by comparison: 12 were sentenced to death (one in absentia) 10 of them hung in 1946, and the rest were given prison sentences ranging from 10 years to life behind bars. Hermann Göring committed suicide the night before his execution. The Germans kept records, the Japanese didn't or they were destroyed in firebombing. But the numbers are VERY CLOSE! And there were subsequent trials after Nuremberg, but also executions of Japanese war criminals in China, Philippines, etc. And a lot of Japanese war criminals committed suicide in the field. Now, if you want to talk about the Japanese Emperor specifically, fine. On his order, something only he could do, he got Japan to surrender for the first time in 1,000 years. And to subjugate themselves (and himself) to the Supreme Commander: McArthur. This, in exchange for NOT having a 20 year occupation fighting a guerrilla war in Japan where GI's would need to machine gun and burn with flamethrowers Japanese 12 year old girls charging at them with sharpened sticks. A fair trade, don't you think? So PLEASE! STOP THE LIE that the USA didn't hold Japanese war criminals accountable. It's not true.
Sort of, it was also harder to differentiate culpability in Japan because there was no easy political party to point to, the whole country was guilty. Many of the biggest war crimes were not planned and ordered at high levels, but rather the result of individual units and low ranking officers (condoned by the higher ups, but not really masterminded by them).
Side note the Soviet Union had trials for 12 Japanese war criminals the Khabarovsk war crimes trials. They also let them off with light sentences ranging from 2 to 25 years which all were eventually released early 11 in 1956 and 1 in 1951 in exchange for the Unit 731 data.
@GrievousReborn To be fair, the Soviet war crimes were at a similar level of brutality to the Japanese and at an industrial level similar to the system in Germany. Unfortunately, the Soviet Union was allowed to get away with their atrocities for a decade before the war and a half century after the war.
It shows you where you commit the crimes and against who matters The Nazis brought atrocities too far west is what I've simply accepted You can kill slavs in Siberia you can kill Chinese in Manchuria you can kill blacks in Africa you CANNOT kill white people west of Poland This is hyperbole and a generalization but it's essentially what became evident
@@GrievousReborn it comes down to where you commit the crimes 😭🤬 even though they all should have been charged regardless of where and against who the atrocities took place etc The Nazis did it too far west and sometimes even other Anglo Saxon type folks who were just politically disliked
There's to note - the racial laws in Italy were the proverbial straw break the camel's back for Enrico Fermi, the man who discovered induced nuclear fission and the father of the atomic age, as he had married a Jewish woman and had Jewish children (due to the matrilineal nature of Judaism), pushing him to both defy the Fascist regime which had constantly defunded his research and threatened his family first by showing up to collect his Nobel prize in a suit rather than a Fascist military uniform (note, the Fascist regime despised the bourgoisie officially), and moving to the United States, where he designed and led the construction of the world's first nuclear reactor, and was one of the directors of Project Manhattan, arguably contributing to it more than anyone else.
Great point. Let's not forget that Laura Fermi's father, Augusto Capon, was murdered at Auschwitz. While the fascist regime waited for the return of Fermi after he was awarded the Nobel, Fermi jumped on a ship to America. A very smart move by Fermi who was much more than a great scientist. It is typical of any political establishment to see affirmation on the basis of individual. accomplishments. Not just dictators, but even democratic leaders do that.
Weird how the evil Nazis didn't want nuclear weapons HMMM are you that fucking dumb to believe Hitler wanted dead Jews but wanted peace and didn't want nuclear weapons lmao where the fuck do these people hide their heads?
@@biddygames that’s why genocide / evil governmental acts are one of those things that can be ranked on a scale. Since most countries especially those in “1st world “ countries all did messed up 💩. So we just scale it and say who did more messed up 💩 and did it with impunity, well that’s the bad guy. I think that’s how those war crimes are thought of , not saying it’s right but I get it.
One big bad villain is easier for people to understand, and more importantly, easier to process. The alternative is realizing there was a little bit of villain in everyone involved.
Not true when you think about 'the people' as communities. Communities where, for example, they saw collaborators continue as if nothing ever happened.
Shame that fear of demonitization prevents presentation of the truth. Lived in northern Japan in the early 70s. Open secret that the harbor breakwater was a Korean mass grave.
Japan had two underfunded, competing atomic bomb projects. Despite the postwar claims, I have no doubt the Japanese would have used nukes if they’d had them.
@@linda1lee2 Unfortunately, a lot of information indicates that that was not the case. The Japanese actually were open to negotiations at that point, as the blockade was making their position untenable. The pro-war faction was losing ground and the Soviet invasion of China badly rattled them. Their main sticking point, being their ability to keep the emperor, was something we eventually agreed to after the surrender anyway. Maintaining the blockade for a few more weeks or months would have forced their hand. The US just wanted to both test the bombs’ effects on real subjects AND make a statement to the Soviets.
@@Zarastro54this is literally nonsense. The bombing was absolutely necessary in ending the war. Not only were the Japanese leadership both in government and military heavily propagandized into a theocratic racial purity movement, not only were the common people so enamoured by these ideas that they valued the goals of this fascist state above their own lives (remember kamikaze pilots? The Germans were having desertion problems while the Japanese literally believed in fighting till death, for if they didn’t they faced execution at home), not only were they engaged in total war laterally exploiting every level of their society, not only were they themselves researching the bomb and had spies in nuclear states, not only had they committed crimes comparable to the nazis, not only did they still basically control Laos, Cambodia, Inner Mongolia, China, Vietnam, parts of the Philippines and parts of India, but they never even really made any attempts to negotiate. Sure, there was a fringe party in the government who made exploratory inquests into negotiations with the Soviet Union (most significantly), but that went nowhere, and had no real effort behind it at all. There was no way Japan would ever come to a negotiating table as this peace party was FRiNGE. The supreme war council, the actual people in Japan who would’ve could’ve called for peace at literally any time (and would’ve probably been givin Vietnam and parts of Korea and China based on how they faced consequences for the war crimes) were literally theocratic militarists who didn’t care how many people would have to die to achieve japans goals, and said as much.
My grandmother lived under both Italian and German occupations of her island in Greece. She always maintained that the Germans were far more brutal and cruel than the Italians were. The Italian soldiers, mostly, didn’t even want to be there.
The Italians also generally said they related culturally to the Greeks. The testimonies of the Italian soldiers and Greeks in the Dodecanese seem to match this trend
Speaking of - if you happen to see pictures of Mussolini upside-down, that's an Italian meme, as the bodies of Mussolini, his lover Claretta Petacci (who wasn't his wife, by the way, rather his mistress, his actual wife, Rachele Guidi, survived the war despite being captured by partisans and being handed over to US forces, who released her in 1958, and managed to get by, dying in 1979 at the age of 89. One of their sons, Romano, was the father of politician Alessandra Mussolini) and several other fascist officials were hung upside down from the roof of a service station in Piazzale Loreto, in Milan.
At the International Tribunal for the Far East which convened on 26 April 1946 was convened with 28 defendants. Of these 2 died of natural causes during the trial, 1 was found to be mentally unfit, 7 were found guilty and subsequently executed, 16 were found guilty and sentenced to life in prison but subsequently released on various date between 1952 and 1958. There were further trials throughout territories formally occupied be Japan with some 984 executions and numerous prison sentences.
28? You think this highly complex network consisted of 28 people? There were 21 group trials alone for nazi leadership consisting of hundreds of nazi’s who faced charges in court.
As a Greek who has spoken with people who were alive during the Nazi occupation i understand thst the Italians were not considered heinous as the Germans by the people then, to the degree that when they fell out with the Germans at some point and they were persecuted Greek people were helping to save them often.
@@Nancy20012 it has a simple explanation italy wanted to just expand its territory and wanted to grow the facist influence but the Nazis motives were different they were going for the race and it's made them to do ruthless activities.
Selective justice. Edit: And Nazi Hunters only prosecute the German concentration camp personnels until the very last one, some of them from Eastern Europe, but zero mention of Italians.
@@siewheilou399 You're right, there were no italian scientists worthy of the US protection. I mean let's be real, Italian scientists were never getting to the moon like the Germans did for the yanks!
17:08 Let me add something. My grandfather was a non commissioned officer in the Blackshirts, who joined the Italian Social Republic after the armistice and kept fighting against the Allies. After the end of the war in Italy, he was arrested and interrogated by Americans. That summary justice you talk about that killed 20k-30k Italian soldiers, wasn't carried out just by Italian partisans, but also by the Allies. They didn't care enough to set up proper trials, they would determine via interrogation if those Italians would live or be executed by firing squad right away. There were 2 things the Allies wanted to know in the interrogation, that would book you one spot in front of the firing squad: 1 - If you had committed a war crime against Americans or British (only them, they didn't care what you did in Greece, Yugoslavia etc.), doesn't matter if it was pre-armistice or post-armistice. One dead American soldier was more important than any amount of dead non Anglo-Saxons, according to the interrogators. 2 - If you had been an Italian Social Republic soldier (in case you didn't voluntarily surrendered to the Allies). The Allies demanded every Italian Social Republic soldier to surrender himself to them. Even if you hadn't commited any war crime, fighting for the Italian Social Republic and not surrendering would automatically make you a war criminal (war crime of perfidy: removing your military uniform and wearing civilian clothes, which at the end of the war was pretty normal, since any partisan would have shot you on sight if you still had your uniform on). The Allies' request was often practically unfeasible, as to surrender yourself to them, you should have somehow avoided German officers, Italian officers, Italian partisans, crossed frontlines and battlefields just to get to the Allies who then would have arbitrarily decided your fate. It was in part an excuses for the Allies to get rid of Italians who didn't like Anglo-Americans enough to collaborate with them, and create a pro-Allies new Italy. The Americans didn't find any proof that my grandfather fought for the Italian Social Republic (many archives were destroyed at the end of the war, exactly to prevent recognition) and so he avoided summary execution. You are correct in saying that many Italian officers, whether they fought for the Italian Social Republic or collaborated with the Allies didn't face justice. On the other hand, many lower rank officers and soldiers were summarily executed by the partisans or the Allies. Something you didn't mention is that certainly not all Italians who fought for the Italian Social Republic were Fascists, as there was mandatory conscription under martial law. During this retribution, neither partisans nor the Allies cared if you were a conscript with no choice or a volunteer, even because they were hard to distinguish. In Italy, the war criminal officers got away, the soldiers who - at times - had no choice, paid the price.
Spunto molto interessante. Credo fortemente che la storia dell'Italia agli sgoccioli della seconda e nell'immediato post sia raccontata, specialmente dal mondo anglosassone, in modo del tutto sommario, un po a casaccio e fortemente di parte... Purtroppo tante brave persone hanno pagato gli erroracci dei pochi in quegli anni...
@@toknode331 Sono d'accordo. La cosa che purtroppo fa male è che se uno straniero, di qualsiasi nazionalità, volesse documentarsi sulla storia Italiana della Seconda Guerra Mondiale, quasi sicuramente si documenterà con media anglosassoni, e non avrà mai una lettura discretamente precisa e completa dell'accaduto.
@@michaelmisczuk1188 Can't really help you on that. Due to my family's history, this war crime of perfidy has always been well known to me. Moreover, my grandma on the other side of the family witnessed 2 young German soldiers, who wanted to surrender, being executed by Americans because they wore civilian clothes. A villager from my grandma's village convinced the 2 Germans to stay at his home and wear civilian clothes, then went to warn the Americans who were advancing and occupying nearby towns. After those 2 were executed, everybody in the village hated this man, he was seen as a vile murderer, but nobody could do anything about him because he was under American protection. Very soon after the war, he died from a sudden illness and nobody went to his funeral.
@@SurroundEdByFreaks La grossa problematica sta proprio nella necessità di raccontare la loro guerra come la grande liberazione/guerra patriottica (dall'altro lato) al fine di giustificare una serie di crimini commessi anche da loro (durante la guerra e, per la Russia, anche per tanti anni dopo). Secondo me una prova di tutto si trova nell'enorme ipocrisia durante il processo a Skorzeny, quasi ammazzato per aver utilizzato divise alleate e salvato poi da Yeo-Thomas che testimoniò appunto dicendo che anche gli alleati commisero tale crimine. Il termine di quella guerra è stato un vero putiferio e la gente, dopo anni di sofferenze, odio, morte e dolore di fatto non ci ha capito più un cavolo di niente. Detto ciò, ho terminato i miei studi in inghilterra e ricordo grandi liti con il professore di storia perchè venivano insegnanti falsi storici pazzeschi e sta cosa non mi andava giu. Tempo fa trovai su soundcloud un "podcast" intitotalo I giorni di liberazione di Sandro Lecca. Mi permetto di condividerlo con te. C'è anche una testimonianza del mio primo insegnante di pianoforte. Da quelle testimonianze si percepisce proprio la follia e il totale non senso di quei giorni che di fatto ha aiutato a creare tutto questo sapere/nonsapere che circola intorno a questo periodo. Aggiungo un ultima cosa, perdonami per l'eterno testo: non sono fascista anzi, sono molto contento di non vivere sotto il nazifascismo. Detto questo credo che la ricerca di una verità oggettiva - seppur quasi impossibile - sia la chiave per cercare di capire, imparare e non ripetere tutti gli errori che abbiamo ricominciato a commettere.
Anyone interested in the Italian post-war cultural landscape should seek out the Don Camillo stories by Giovanni Guareschi. They run from about 1950 to about 1979, and document (humorously) the rivalry between former fascists and communists, with subtle interference by the parish priest.
I watched a few of those movies on a trip to Europe. Even visited the museum! Very interesting and hilarious films. I kinda want to sit down and watch them again, now that you have reminded me about them!
"Former fascist"? Don Camillo represent the Democraza Cristiana, the ruling party after 1945 in Italy. He's NOT a former fascist in any way possible. In one of the movies, they both put their hands on a real former fascist, who return to the town after years, and almost killed him. What are you talking about?
@@gabrielesolletico6542 I don’t seem to have made myself clear. I know Don Camillo does not represent former fascists; he is the priest trying so hard to serve God and the parish, but he sometimes gets caught between the political factions, and recent history inevitably affected people’s outlooks. I haven’t seen the movies but I love the books and the characters in them.
@@phillipescott9764You have made yourself abundantly clear. Democrazia Cristiana was not "former fascists". The MSI (Movimento Sociale Italiano) were the former fascists. Learn Italian History and political landscape before speaking.
Mussolini was weak lmao he didn't do shit Hitler did. He arguably made Italy worse and they were more concerned with staying neutral. They never invaded anyone but Ethiopia and lost. WW2 IS a perpetual lie tossed around by people who don't know any better
Note: there WAS a Grand Coucil of Fascism, it hadn't been convocated in years, it held a "free" vote after a discussion, Mussolini lost the vote. There's a suspicion that Mussolini was ready to retire. Next day he got surreptitiously arrested on orders of the king - who had always been the head of state. Eventually, some of those who voted against Mussolini were later caught and executed. Yes, it was a darn mess.
The Australians ran the war trials in Japan. Interestingly their military carried out executions for the first time. They wanted to put Hirohito on trial, but the only intervention by Washington in the trials ensured that he didn’t face justice.
Ethiopian war was far more complex than Italians coming in and committing war crimes. The Ethiopians took no prisoners and obeyed no conventions, even some of the Ethiopian internal Kingdoms joined the Italians to overthrow the negus.
There will always be internal conflict for selfish reasons. Doesnt justify anything wtf are you on about. Causing war on a whim to seem "credible" is diabolical and disgraceful.
There’s countless atrocities committed by the Germans against the Italian people after Mussolini fell. Ardeatine Cave (Rome). 335 citizens massacred, this just being one of the many atrocities.
The atrocity by the allies in Italy were far worse. They entirely destroyed cities and mass rape/killing entire villages especially allies soldier of colonial allies possessions. The allies were the "bad guys" in my opinion. Hitler just wanted a safe space for Germany never seek to attack Uk or Us.
Regardless of what you think Justice was hamstringed by the political reality of post war politics. It may have been cynical for the U.S & U.K to allow such things but rarely is international politics solely on the side of the righteous or just but with the cynical, smart & discreet mostly. Politics & War may have changed in their tactics & strategy but never in their nature.
@@alexharrington6459 It's not that simple, the Togliatti amnesty made by the Italian Communist Party leader of the same name, let off many former fascists to reconcentrate on rebuild the country, rate that give in to the mood of civil war that was brewing between the most communist partisans and the US backed former fascist soldiers of the Regio Esercito the italian army.
When I was in school in the early 50s most information was shared about the trials, then as I progressed through school stuff started to change, drastically, I went to school in mid America, unfortunately it became not important, I have forgotten about most of it, thanks for the reminder 🦑
Honestly irrelevant, italy was held accountable as an instigator of the war and reparations were demanded. The persecution of war criminals was and should have been imposed, but the post war protests in italy to the few cases carried out played a big part in the decision of letting them go.
@@Italianplayercvu not holding war criminals accountable is by definition not holding Italy accountable lmao. You cannot ignore the largest batch of crimes they committed and go, "Yeah they've been punished enough"
Italy was an allied power from 1943-45 (and ended the war as such). Also, considering the crimes of the allied powers (such as Britain and especially the Soviet Union), it would be silly to think that Italy should have been subjected to a war crimes trial.
@loreCarbonell There was only 1 legitimate Italy. That was the monarchy, led by the king and Marshal Badoglio. Under the Italian constitution, the king was the head of state, and he had the power to appoint a prime minister. Once Mussolini was deposed as PM, he was no longer a legitimate ruler.
As an Italian, I want to thank the authors of this video for speaking about the facts in the most impartial way possible. Unfortunately in Italy a serious debate on this matter is not possible, every time it is discussed the extremists on both sides only tell the part of the story that suits them.
Nothing to debate IMO, any government that got elected the people should assume responsibility! Mussolini got elected so Italians should assume for their crimes in the Balkans(Yugoslavia, Albania), Africa(Libya, Ethiopia) and other battlegrounds where they participated and inflicted loss of life. That's how it should work, but Italians got the slick way out!
@@Torcasolta There's a lot to discuss. First of all, in the last free elections of 1921, the fascist party obtained only 4.65% of the votes. In 1922 they took power through a kind of coup d'état (the "March on Rome" with the support of the king). The 1924 elections saw the absolute victory of the fascists but they were elections characterized by violence and intimidation against opponents, no longer free. After that there were no more real elections. So who really elected the fascists? Few, very few. Then speaking of crimes, even the winners committed large quantities of them, obviously no trials for them. This is good right?
@@DesertFox41 no I don't justify any crimes winner or loser a crime is a crime! Hiroshima/Nagasaki is genocide like it or not when you can erase 100000s of lives within seconds it can not be called anything else then that. But Italians haven't answered nor apologized to their crimes committed and some still have the ancient appetite to annex land that is not theirs in the politics of their country. On the island I am from the Fascists have thrown in a pit 400 civilians and no one has answered yet to it, for me it is easier to cope as I have never met those victims, but the elders that remember it is more difficult and they want closure.
@@Torcasolta the problem is simply that Italians with fascist sympathies will never apologize for things like that. While on the contrary the others do it, also because many, including some of my relatives, have suffered massacres at the hands of the fascist Nazis. It's just that it doesn't make sense that only the party that suffered the crimes is apologizing, I don't know if you understand what I mean.
@@Torcasolta that was done by subjects of the fascist kingdom of italy. now we are citizen of the republic of italy. why we should apologize for something made by others. and we have killed and hanged by his feets the responsable of that mass murder, so we have made a pretty clear statement that we strongly disagree with that policy. that's the main difference between italy and the others nations in the axis
It's fair to say Mussolini DIDN'T get away with the crimes of his regime, although it was the good citizens of Milan who dealt with the punishment. The scars of the Jewish people's fate weighs heavily on Italy today, and yet you say that initially they were shielded from the blood-thirsty Nazis. However, Mussolini's death was not through due process, no matter what he had done he deserved that. The Italians also remember the atrocities committed by the Nazis including Mazzabotto (near Bologna) where hundreds were needlessly killed, I guess they successfully misdirected the Allies away from their own criminals in favour of the "easy target" that the Nazis had presented.
You should study up on what the Ethiopian resistance did. Nanny's killing entire officer families. Comfort girls killing young officers at dances when a certain song was played. Digging up roads at night that were built during the day. When they used gas attacks to kill livestock to starve the Ethiopians to death, we ate the Italians. Even HITLER went off at Mussolini about that.
They also stole the obelisk at Axum, in one piece and then when ordered to return it in the 00's they said they would need to cut it in half. They were told by the EU to quite pissing about and shipped it back and reinstalled it in one piece.
Here on YT I heard a Hitler quote like "Italy was often vanquished in war, but managed to come out a victor anyway." Italy was historically cut A LOT of slack.
Italy was on the winning Allied side in WW I but suffered many casualties and didn't feel properly compensated which helped many WW I vets turn to fascism and joining the Axis in WW II.
When? we won the WWI and yet the British and French did not respect the agreements and did not give us the promised territories. we lost the WWII and we still have American troops in Italy after 80 years: I don't think they gave us anything then
His story is largely told in this one ua-cam.com/video/18Xe9HqW8Q4/v-deo.htmlsi=dYRoaM8R0xJVVNaz But ya, would be worthy of his own dedicated video. -Daven
The allies committed war crimes too, lets not pretend that the axis were the bad guys while the other side was pure and innocent. For what concerns Italy, the was little to gain from treating it the same way as Germany.
What is important to remember is that war crimes have always been a part of wars. What is also important is to distinctly point out the level at which war crimes turn unto wholesale genocide and ethnic cleansing. The former is a collateral aspect of war, the later is most certainly not.
Hungary and Romania delt with their crimes internally. You think that new communist regimes would give their opponents and war-criminals to the West? Almost the same with Yugoslavia...
In other words, to survive a world war even if on the loosing side... 1. learn dirty secrets of your enemies, they might help 2. do your unethical research in a clean and propper methode, it might buy you a get out of jail free pass 3. be ready to cooperate with the enemy, a change from enemy to ally goes a long way 4. be part of the elite of your country, they get a free pass just for being born in the right family. gotta lov humanity!!!
I recommend watching "The Lion of the Desert". A great film that focuses on an ignored part of 20th century history. This film has, to the best of my knowledge, never been shown on UK or US television.
Italian here. Thanks for covering these crimes. Unfortunately we never went through the denazification process here in Italy and a lot of fascists git away with what they have done scot-free. Some entered politics in the Italian Republic's parliament years after even. Because they never got properly prosecuted we haven't really dealt with our past and we still have a fascist presence in our politics. These things need to be properly explained and you have done a good job.
Because the US wanted Japan as a bullwark against communism in the East, while Italy was very quick to paint themselves as innocent victims, just like Austria. Meanwhile, Germany was the only country that ever owned up to what it did and is still ruthlessly punished for it to this very day.
You are missing the major detail that very few Italians effectively fought for the Allies in regular forces. The majority of Italian war crimes were committed in Yugoslavia, Greece and Ethiopia, and the Allies (Americans and British) cared little about those. But if Americans or British found evidence of Italian soldiers who committed war crimes against them, they'd usually have those soldiers executed, even pre 1943. Especially true if those were Italian Social Republic soldiers - who btw, greatly outnumbered the ones who actually fought for the Allies, which makes the "Italy changes sides" sentence quite biased. Your statement is true for the high officer elite who committed war crimes but then collaborated with the Allies, though.
@@SurroundEdByFreaksthey didn’t outnumber the ones of the allies not even close. Unless pf course u only count those who engaged in combat but that would be unfair as the allies ordered the Italian army to not engage in any military operation against the RSI or Germany aside from crashing their resistance in captured territory. The Italian royal army had between 2.5 and 3M soldiers by the end of the war alongside 100-500k Partisans while the rsi had at best 100k and more realistically 75k soldiers. The RSI WAS FUCKING HATED. So much so that more fascists served under the king than under the RSI. God i mean even GENTILE the philosopher of fascism started criticising the fascist militias when they killed 5communist students.
@@Boretheory What? Where did you get those 2-3M soldiers from? Are you counting the Italian soldiers who were prisoners of war that after the armistice surrendered to the Germans and passed the rest of the war in prison camps? Among all the extimates that I've read on Italian Social Republic vs Royal army soldiers, yours is very out of the range. Most datas I've seen report that at the end of the war the Italian Social Republic forces were at least 500k. How many of them were able to fight is another thing, because weapons, ammos and supplies were scarce. The largest extimate I've read on partisans was around 300k, never heard anybody going beyond that. In 1945, conscription in the South and the fact that Allies were freeing Italian prisoners of war from their prison camp meant that the co-belligerent army grew, but it has always been far, far less than the RSI, it never even reached 300k.
@sourroundedbyfreaks, Italian cobelligernt soldiers were about 10% of the Allied fighting force in Italy and 50% of the logistics. Not counting the Italians who refused to fight for the Germans and were imprisoned in camps and those who formed the partisan groups. Also not counting the tens of thousands who opposed German disarmament in Italy, Greece, Yugoslavia, France, Albania. About 90,000 Italian soldiers died in the Resistance, that was a huge effort.
@@InfoRome Sure, nobody is saying the co-belligerent army never existed, what I said is that it was a small army, smaller than the Italian Social Republic forces (also thanks to conscription, of course). Also I'd like to raise two point: first, soon after the armistice, the vast majority of Italian forces peacefully surrendered to German disarmament - not counting the entire corp of the Blackshirts and few Royal Army units that immediately sided with the Germans. The units that tried to oppose disarmament were the minority by quite a margin. Second, it's a mistake to consider all those Italians soldiers who ended up in German prison camps as part of the resistance. Remember that the order they were given (when the order actually reached them) was to resist disarmament by the Germans, and great majority of them didn't obey. While among those soldiers there were plenty of anti-Fascists, there were also plenty who had no more faith in the King, and were not willing to fight and lose their lives for the King, nor for the Allies, nor for Mussolini. Understandably, what they wanted most was the war to end. So, just like you can call them "Italians who refused to fight for the Germans", one can call them "Italians who refused to fight for King Vittorio Emanuele III".
Can you imagine falling behind an entire psychopath with no empathy or remorse? But I have been in prison and prison and military are similar in many ways. This creature was put through both, he snapped, he used his rizz to overtake most of Europe. It’s great to know that you can’t really sort out the psychopaths.
Fascinating history, Italy was left a mess after WW2, never really fully recovered, scars & under American control to this day. Plenty of War Criminals got away with terrible crimes. Great film, keep it going. Cheers 🥂
We're the 8th largest economy, with the lowest amount of homicides and r*pes in the EU, the longest life expectancy and have lower unemployment than Sweden Finland and France, how have we not recovered 😂
I still don't get why the Italians and Japanese were treated better. I've seen enough about how Allies treated German and Austrian civilians. Many who survived their wrath were damaged beyond repair. Thus, they obviously didn't give a F about human rights, public opinion or anything the like.
Frankly, I think we expected more of the Germans. We saw ourselves in them, and a large number of our politicians were impressed by Hitler and his policies until war broke out. Senate minutes regarding Germany during the thirties are truly sad and enlightening reading. So, when the manure hit the propeller, the desire was to distance oneself as fast as possible, all the while denying how close we really were.
@@raquellofstedt9713 My grandfather was working on a farm as a child for food scraps and slept on hay in the barn. The landlord was an abusive prick who did even worse to girls working for him. I can't blame my grandfather for joining the Nzs when they invaded Austria. He had little to lose and soon had a fancy uniform designed by Hugo Boss, and for the first time in his life he had electricity, running, warm water, a bed and a small collection of shoes. He also got paid really well and suddenly girls were interested in him... Who wouldn't fold under such appealing conditions? The funniest thing about him: he was a literal Nz and served a sentence for lesser war crimes, but he was one of my most tolerant relatives! When the others heard that my first love was an Indian girl, they were furious! He: so what? He was one of the few people who I believe when they said that they were never supporting the Nz ideology. He flat out told me that he joined the idiots because he wanted to get away from his old l environment and obviously because of the money...
@@raquellofstedt9713but it's not like Americans identified in their German ancestors, even though it's true it's the majority of their makeup, and that's because antigerman sentiments had been a thing since ww1. German farmers were often kidnapped and tarred and feathered decades before ww2, and some say prohibitionism was to repress German's drinking culture.
@@Bolognabeef german or Irish, I’ve heard both. I aggree with you that the grass root sentiment was far from rpo- German, but compared to the Italians or the Japanese? The predjudices were far less ro begin with, and of a different nature. My dad’s folks were German American in California’s central Valley. Hid their ancestry since wwi. I’m well aware of the bs that went down, but still, there were a lot of folks in the states that thought Hitler was right…until we were at war. Thank God my family always knew he was crap, but the racial stuff was what a lot of people wanted to hear.
Luberti case is a good example of post ww2 chaos, after a series of seemingly violent incidents which he was involved in, numerous books written by him, .....he eventually ended up decades later dying in poverty.
Let it be demonetized. Let it be age restricted. I want to learn the information and not have it censored. The most important thing is to educate. Not to profit.
@@Mohenjo_Daro_yep, also hard to do when your channel is shadowbanned or outright deleted. It ain't very forward thinking to say 'let it be demonetized.' That's the *least* of the creator's concerns.
4:35 The massacre of Derber Libanos (monastery) happened because Grazzinani thought the priest hid the people who tried to assassinate him. When they told him they didn't know their whereabouts he ordered every priest to be killed.
“We have known the bitterness of defeat and the exultation of triumph, and from both we have learned there can be no turning back. We must go forward to preserve in peace what we won in war.” - Douglas MacArthur
MacArthur was a wannabe authoritarian dictator who went against direct orders from the Commander In Chief by insisting they could keep going all the way to attack China. He ignored orders of wiser men not to do that. Over 100,000 Chinese soldiers flooded the border. His ego got us mired in the Korean War, where many men died to fight their way back to where we started. He got his ticker tape parade, and was fired for insubordination. And for generally being a narcissistic asshat.
Soviets commited a lot of atrocities, both when they were colaborating with the nazis during the first 2 years of war and also when they had the nazis as enemies.
Hi, just a couple of marginal remarks: 1) Italy registered and fired from public offices its Jewish citizens but did not deport them, the Nazist deported them *after* the capitulation of Italy on 8th September 1943. 2) Italy did not "switch side" on that same day: only 5 weeks later, on 13th October 1943, the Italian monarchy declared war against the fascist puppet state created by Mussolini on 18th September of that year. 3) Neither the monarchist army nor the anti-fascist partisans were allowed the play any significant military role in the following 1.5 years of war, since the Anglo-American didn't trust neither of them. Come on Simon, stop spreading the old war propaganda over and over again! You did your research about Italian war criminals, why not set the record straight about most basic historical facts!
Italy did not declare war on Mussolini, it declared war on Germany and fought primarily against Germany. Fascists were collaborationists of the Germans and played a smaller role than the Kingdom played in helping the Allies. It's also not true that Italians did not playing a significant role in the liberation of the country. If you add up Italian service units + Italian partisans + cobelligernt forces + logistics they played a significant role.
@@InfoRome Ma sei italiano? "Italy did not declare war on Mussolini, it delcared war on Germnay" AND WEREN'T THE REPUBLIC OF SALO PART OF THE THIRD REICH, and Mussolini just a puppet of Hitler, at that point? C'mon...
@@gabrielesolletico6542 Appunto, quindi ridurre il contributo bellico italiano a "guerra a Mussolini" è una cavolata. Gli italiani hanno combattutto i tedeschi, sia le truppe sia i partigiani, in battaglie e tanti tipi di azioni militari. Questo tipo di linguaggio è il motivo per cui nessuno ricorda il cntributo militare e partigiano italiano contro la Germania, come se gli alleati affrontassero i tedeschi e intanto gli italiani si scannavano tra loro. Non è andata così, da cobelligeranti post-43 abbiamo fatto la guerra contro la Germania e contribuito come potevamo alla vittoria alleata.
In short, the communist Soviet Union wanted to suck up to communist Yugoslavia so went after Italian war criminals who 'allegedly' committed crimes against Yugoslavians and the capitalist/non-communist allies wanted to suck up to potential business allies in Italy (and indeed Japan) and decided to err on the side of caution and let go of any such aspirations and decided not to prosecute anyone! I'm sure this has oversimplified it 🤔
0:08 this man (Rudolf Hess) secretly flew a solo mission into the UK in the middle of the night to meet with some British contacts he had for peace discussions. Unfortunately the British authorities were not interested in peace and put him in prison. Once he realized he was now liable to be tortured for German war secrets he tried to kill himself by jumping out a window. He was not successful, but sustained many injuries. He pretended to be insane, and ultimately did not divulge German secrets, but did spend the rest of his life in prison. He was in prison from 1941-1987. This is a violation of international law and a war crime considering he was there for peace discussions, But you never hear about it. Historian David Irving stated he thought Rudolf Hess should have been awarded the peace prize for his efforts, and millions of lives could have been saved if Britain had only listened….. instead the British empire was destroyed for Churchills vanity. Was he wrong? As Michael Jackson states, the history books are lies, and the Press is a criminal organization.
Oh, yes, award the peace price to the nazi who thought the brits would want peace in the name of their "common Aryan heritage" that would have looked *even better* than quietly ignoring war crimes. Also he didn't go there under orders from the nazi government last I checked and thus he was no official ambassador just a random idiot who was so hopped up on his own bullshit he thought he could end the war with the brits so they could have one less nuisance when they were killing everyone else.
The army was ineffective because it had no funding as the state wasn’t planning on going to war. The navy had 2 years of uncontested naval hegemony in the med after disabling the British fleet in the med
For most of the perpetrators of crimes during WWII, if you could keep from being arrested for about 3 years after the war, for the most part you were scot-free.
You know things were fucked up in the Pacific Theatre when the phrase "a card carrying Nazi comes out as arguably the greatest hero of the entire story of the pacific theatre" can be used without a hint of irony while also being true. Also, it's honestly insane how that one Italian SS member that was accused of killing 200 people had the defence of "It was more like 300, actually." But what's also incredible is that you have these Italian fascists that had no qualms having people in camps but even they were shielding Jewish prisoners from the Nazis.
john rabe was a weird guy. He WAS a n*zi BUT he ONLY wanted the parts about a carying society, wich was ALSO a part of this system. he distanced himself from the atrocities made by japan and germany. he REALLY thought that the german leader DIDNT know about the war crimes and would reject them . THATS why he wrote to the german leader, ultimatly leading him to be a criminal suspect in germany and beeing punished to work under less than good conditions in nepal. after the war they put him for a judge and into jail, only the intervention of chinese survivors got him free. he died 9 months later from problems he catched during his time in nepal, poor and malnourished. thats it, many people only reducing him to be a n*zi wich is bad. he was naive and a christian who couldnt imagine that other christians could comit such atrocities, i think that made him a victim of the n*zis and NOT a n*zi.
An interesting historical tidbit: When Hitler learned that Japan attacked Pearl Harbor, he was elated. He said that now, he had, "One ally that hadn't been defeated in 3000 years, and another that was always on the winning side.' indeed, Italy ended up on the winning side...by SWITCHING sides!
That sounds like a post WW2 made up quote, why would Hitler say that "Italy was always on the winning side"? What historical fact would Hitler be basing that quote upon? Also, nobody in Italy that knows anything about the war says that Italy won WW2. Switching sides is mostly Anglosaxon propaganda / memelords that ignore, willingly or not, what the Italian Social Republic was. Unless you can give me a reason why having the pro-Allies Italian co-belligerent army being outnumbered 5 to 1 against the pro-Axis Italian Social Republic forces constitutes a side switch?
Why wasn’t there an Anglo-French deceleration of war against the Soviets for invasion Poland? Why did the Soviets still receive Western aid after that even while they launched wars of aggression against Finland and the Baltics? Why did the Soviets get Anglo/Ami/ French approval to take one of the most major Polish cities in Liviv and make it a part of Soviet Ukraine?
Why wasn't Poland held accountable for joint invasion of Chechoslovakia alongside Nazi Germany? Why wasn't Poland held accountable for invading and annexing russian lands in 1920s? Why wasn't Poland held accountable for oppressing russians, belorussians and ukrainians living in Western Ukrainian Republic it had annexed? Why wasn't Poland held accountable for oppression of jews both before, during and after the war had begun? Why do ignorant poles never look at the cause of what's usually coming for them? Do you think Churchill of all people calling Poland the hyaena of Europe was unfounded?
More people spoke German in the home in America as a second language than essentially any other language. 😕 There were a whole lot of assumptions made. Not a lot of them held up.
Don't forget the Italians annexed part of Slovenia and Croatia after the end of WW1 (stopped in a battle near Ljublijana on 18 November 1918, 7 days after the end of the war). In my family's area of Slovenia, reading and speaking slovenian was banned and names were Italianised. Conscripts from these areas into the Italian army got sent to fight in Africa and Russia.
Silly Simon, Croatia didn't need an Italian to commit atrocities. The Ustache killed upwards of 1 million people, half of which were Serbs. They based their system on that of the Nazis, right down to concentration camps and the killing and torture of Jews, Gypsies and Slavs, though only the Serbian Slavs since Croatian Slavs were deemed pure. I'm not sure how Nazi Germany reconciled Croatia Slavs being acceptable, but the rest were not.
Here's another raging Serb 😂 Croatians created the Partisan movement, Croatians had the first free enclave in WW2, the Ustachi were installed by the Italian Fascists and no the Ustachi did not kill 70% od all the victims in Yugoslavia know your facts and not the SANU memorandum!
let's remember that MSI ( The party Graziani joined after the trail) was a beo fascist party and it's symbol is in the brother's of Italy logo and the higher ups of MSI are still today celebrated and remembered by the Brothers of italy
To add further to the confusing mess that this is, it should be noted that a number of Italian army units defected after the Armistice and joined the Yugoslavian resistance forces, instead of joining the Allies directly. Because we just needed to muddy the waters further.
No allied war crimes were “swept under the rug” as there was none. The small frequency of crimes committed by a few bad apples, should not paintbrush the entire allied forces and are not comparable to atrocities committed by the axis powers.
There were plenty. No one's hands were clean in that war. No one's hands are clean in any war. The Allies weren't 'the good guys.' The Allies were the guys that won, and got to paint themselves as 'the good guys.' Which means we got to pretend our war crimes didn't happen, or were less severe. Edit: and maybe you could say compared to Japan's unit 731 ours weren't as severe. But we still did awful things.
Cavalier can you name specific or go into depth of these so called events? Spacecowboy what are your thoughts on The Blitz over London and open submarine warfare to the effect of, their words not mine “starve Britain out of the war”? This all happened well before the bombing on Dresden in 45 and majority of which were complicit or turned a blind eye to the atrocities that were occurring ie Bernsdorf Subcamp!
Cavalier can you name a specific event and go into detail? Spacecowboy what is your take then on the Blitz over London and Unrestricted Submarine Warfare to the effect of, their words not mine “Starve Britain out of the War”? All this happened well before Dresden in 45!
A phrase by general mario robotti in a general order in slovenia during july/august 1942 who said "here we kill too little" I advise you to look the story of his letters for yourselves because writing a comment does not give justice to the victims of italian war crimes thanks for the video greetings from Italy
Swept Under the Rug: The Truth About the "Japanese Holocaust" ua-cam.com/video/18Xe9HqW8Q4/v-deo.htmlsi=dYRoaM8R0xJVVNaz
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Today I found out that Simon is still gettin' gooned up on poppers before these shows after nearly a decade still!!
You forgot to mention that the soviet union initially belonged to the axis, fully supporting genocide and even out doing other fascists... And the evil allies willingly allied with stalin...
STOP! Just stop! Please. This lie keep floating around and it is despicable. There was a Tokyo War Crimes Trial, convictions and executions. After 31 months and more than 800 court sessions, the trial of 25 major Japanese leaders led to 7 death sentences, 16 condemned to life imprisonment, one to 20 years, and another to 7 years. The main Nuremberg Trial by comparison: 12 were sentenced to death (one in absentia) 10 of them hung in 1946, and the rest were given prison sentences ranging from 10 years to life behind bars. Hermann Göring committed suicide the night before his execution. The Germans kept records, the Japanese didn't or they were destroyed in firebombing. But the numbers are VERY CLOSE! And there were subsequent trials after Nuremberg, but also executions of Japanese war criminals in China, Philippines, etc. And a lot of Japanese war criminals committed suicide in the field. Now, if you want to talk about the Japanese Emperor specifically, fine. On his order, something only he could do, he got Japan to surrender for the first time in 1,000 years. And to subjugate themselves (and himself) to the Supreme Commander: McArthur. This, in exchange for NOT having a 20 year occupation fighting a guerrilla war in Japan where GI's would need to machine gun and burn with flamethrowers Japanese 12 year old girls charging at them with sharpened sticks. A fair trade, don't you think? So PLEASE! STOP THE LIE that the USA didn't hold Japanese war criminals accountable. It's not true.
STOP! Just stop! Please. This lie keep floating around and it is despicable. There was a Tokyo War Crimes Trial, convictions and executions. After 31 months and more than 800 court sessions, the trial of 25 major Japanese leaders led to 7 death sentences, 16 condemned to life imprisonment, one to 20 years, and another to 7 years. The main Nuremberg Trial by comparison: 12 were sentenced to death (one in absentia) 10 of them hung in 1946, and the rest were given prison sentences ranging from 10 years to life behind bars. Hermann Göring committed suicide the night before his execution. The Germans kept records, the Japanese didn't or they were destroyed in firebombing. But the numbers are VERY CLOSE! And there were subsequent trials after Nuremberg, but also executions of Japanese war criminals in China, Philippines, etc. And a lot of Japanese war criminals committed suicide in the field. Now, if you want to talk about the Japanese Emperor specifically, fine. On his order, something only he could do, he got Japan to surrender for the first time in 1,000 years. And to subjugate themselves (and himself) to the Supreme Commander: McArthur. This, in exchange for NOT having a 20 year occupation fighting a guerrilla war in Japan where GI's would need to machine gun and burn with flamethrowers Japanese 12 year old girls charging at them with sharpened sticks. A fair trade, don't you think? So PLEASE! STOP THE LIE that the USA didn't hold Japanese war criminals accountable. It's not true.
Please watch the video before commenting to see what we say about it all. 😋
The idea of the Italians simply publishing a list of public enemies who could be killed with impunity and without trial is darkly ironic, because it has happened before. When Julius Caesar was a young man, the Dictator Sulla published such a list, which is usually referred to as "the proscriptions". Caesar, as Dictator himself later in life, refused to proscribe his enemies, and paid the price for his mercy. Following Caesar's assassination, his heirs thought better of the idea, and issued proscriptions of their own.
Well said.
If you consider "Italians" the populations who lived in the Italian peninsula before the birth of Christ then you should study that period some more
@@Julius_Dayne no, those people are all long dead. But the land is the same and it's ironic that it happened in the same place twice.
@@jesseberg3271 they are clearly not the same, not only their populations mixed with the Arabs in the south but also with Germanic people in all of the country. But the biggest difference remains the culture. Of those traditions and customs which defined an ancient Roman basically remains the alphabet, the language and the names of the cities.
@@Julius_Dayne and I am telling you that none of that is even remotely relevant to the discussion being had here. Go find a conversation about genetics to flog your hobbyhorse in, because it has no business being here.
I think its unconscionable that so many were not held accountable for the horrors they inflicted, particularly in Asia.
Even here in Germany many got away scott free. Many were allowed to keep their companies despite working victims to death. Oetger, Leipniz, BMW, VW, Springer and so many more... They're still as big today, if not bigger.
BMW and VW are certainly bigger today
Are you speaking of the second Sino-Japanese War?
STOP! Just stop! Please. This lie keep floating around and it is despicable. There was a Tokyo War Crimes Trial, convictions and executions. After 31 months and more than 800 court sessions, the trial of 25 major Japanese leaders led to 7 death sentences, 16 condemned to life imprisonment, one to 20 years, and another to 7 years. The main Nuremberg Trial by comparison: 12 were sentenced to death (one in absentia) 10 of them hung in 1946, and the rest were given prison sentences ranging from 10 years to life behind bars. Hermann Göring committed suicide the night before his execution. The Germans kept records, the Japanese didn't or they were destroyed in firebombing. But the numbers are VERY CLOSE! And there were subsequent trials after Nuremberg, but also executions of Japanese war criminals in China, Philippines, etc. And a lot of Japanese war criminals committed suicide in the field. Now, if you want to talk about the Japanese Emperor specifically, fine. On his order, something only he could do, he got Japan to surrender for the first time in 1,000 years. And to subjugate themselves (and himself) to the Supreme Commander: McArthur. This, in exchange for NOT having a 20 year occupation fighting a guerrilla war in Japan where GI's would need to machine gun and burn with flamethrowers Japanese 12 year old girls charging at them with sharpened sticks. A fair trade, don't you think? So PLEASE! STOP THE LIE that the USA didn't hold Japanese war criminals accountable. It's not true.
You mean, like how america wasn't held accountable for the atrocities they committed? Pot meet kettle. 🤦♂️
Short answer: The Allies wanted Japan as a bastion against Communism in the east, and a unified Europe in the west.
That rings true
But there have been trials in Tokyo.
Sort of, it was also harder to differentiate culpability in Japan because there was no easy political party to point to, the whole country was guilty. Many of the biggest war crimes were not planned and ordered at high levels, but rather the result of individual units and low ranking officers (condoned by the higher ups, but not really masterminded by them).
Even shorter answer: if the victims weren't White and european, the Allies didn't care so much for their suffering.
@@Zett76 Yup and we know some of them are killed and avenged those who perpetrated the warcrime.
Side note the Soviet Union had trials for 12 Japanese war criminals the Khabarovsk war crimes trials. They also let them off with light sentences ranging from 2 to 25 years which all were eventually released early 11 in 1956 and 1 in 1951 in exchange for the Unit 731 data.
Doesnt sound like Stalin
@GrievousReborn To be fair, the Soviet war crimes were at a similar level of brutality to the Japanese and at an industrial level similar to the system in Germany. Unfortunately, the Soviet Union was allowed to get away with their atrocities for a decade before the war and a half century after the war.
It shows you where you commit the crimes and against who matters
The Nazis brought atrocities too far west is what I've simply accepted
You can kill slavs in Siberia you can kill Chinese in Manchuria you can kill blacks in Africa you CANNOT kill white people west of Poland
This is hyperbole and a generalization but it's essentially what became evident
I mean, when I think of the Soviets (especially from this time period), I never really think of them as the type to be lenient on people.
@@GrievousReborn it comes down to where you commit the crimes 😭🤬 even though they all should have been charged regardless of where and against who the atrocities took place etc
The Nazis did it too far west and sometimes even other Anglo Saxon type folks who were just politically disliked
There's to note - the racial laws in Italy were the proverbial straw break the camel's back for Enrico Fermi, the man who discovered induced nuclear fission and the father of the atomic age, as he had married a Jewish woman and had Jewish children (due to the matrilineal nature of Judaism), pushing him to both defy the Fascist regime which had constantly defunded his research and threatened his family first by showing up to collect his Nobel prize in a suit rather than a Fascist military uniform (note, the Fascist regime despised the bourgoisie officially), and moving to the United States, where he designed and led the construction of the world's first nuclear reactor, and was one of the directors of Project Manhattan, arguably contributing to it more than anyone else.
That’s quite the paradox lol…
Great point. Let's not forget that Laura Fermi's father, Augusto Capon, was murdered at Auschwitz. While the fascist regime waited for the return of Fermi after he was awarded the Nobel, Fermi jumped on a ship to America. A very smart move by Fermi who was much more than a great scientist. It is typical of any political establishment to see affirmation on the basis of individual. accomplishments. Not just dictators, but even democratic leaders do that.
Marrying a Jew is as bad as nazism
“Some people just want to watch the world burn.”
Weird how the evil Nazis didn't want nuclear weapons HMMM are you that fucking dumb to believe Hitler wanted dead Jews but wanted peace and didn't want nuclear weapons lmao where the fuck do these people hide their heads?
Japan did some messed up shit
This is the understatement of the millennium.
So did Croatia, but nobody talks about that.
So did everyone else during the 1900- present
@@biddygamescame here to say that.
@@biddygames that’s why genocide / evil governmental acts are one of those things that can be ranked on a scale. Since most countries especially those in “1st world “ countries all did messed up 💩. So we just scale it and say who did more messed up 💩 and did it with impunity, well that’s the bad guy. I think that’s how those war crimes are thought of , not saying it’s right but I get it.
One big bad villain is easier for people to understand, and more importantly, easier to process. The alternative is realizing there was a little bit of villain in everyone involved.
And when the international bankers demand sacrifices, our leaders jump to obey unfortunately.
And Italy and Japan hadn't offended the bankers.
@@scottcantdance804”offended the bankers” is such an amazingly offensive way to word committed horrific war crimes tbh
Not true when you think about 'the people' as communities. Communities where, for example, they saw collaborators continue as if nothing ever happened.
@@liamevans7661what’s offensive about the truth? The truth doesn’t need laws to protect it.
This Zoomerism needs to stop. Not all sides are the same. Hitler gassing children is not the same as Churchill being a drunk ass
Shame that fear of demonitization prevents presentation of the truth. Lived in northern Japan in the early 70s. Open secret that the harbor breakwater was a Korean mass grave.
Japan had two underfunded, competing atomic bomb projects. Despite the postwar claims, I have no doubt the Japanese would have used nukes if they’d had them.
@@AcmeRacingOf course they would have. Us dropping them was still wrong and unnecessary though.
@@Zarastro54 It was quite necessary and saved lives, including Japanese ones, vs. the war dragging on at least 2 more years.
@@linda1lee2 Unfortunately, a lot of information indicates that that was not the case. The Japanese actually were open to negotiations at that point, as the blockade was making their position untenable. The pro-war faction was losing ground and the Soviet invasion of China badly rattled them. Their main sticking point, being their ability to keep the emperor, was something we eventually agreed to after the surrender anyway. Maintaining the blockade for a few more weeks or months would have forced their hand. The US just wanted to both test the bombs’ effects on real subjects AND make a statement to the Soviets.
@@Zarastro54this is literally nonsense. The bombing was absolutely necessary in ending the war. Not only were the Japanese leadership both in government and military heavily propagandized into a theocratic racial purity movement, not only were the common people so enamoured by these ideas that they valued the goals of this fascist state above their own lives (remember kamikaze pilots? The Germans were having desertion problems while the Japanese literally believed in fighting till death, for if they didn’t they faced execution at home), not only were they engaged in total war laterally exploiting every level of their society, not only were they themselves researching the bomb and had spies in nuclear states, not only had they committed crimes comparable to the nazis, not only did they still basically control Laos, Cambodia, Inner Mongolia, China, Vietnam, parts of the Philippines and parts of India, but they never even really made any attempts to negotiate. Sure, there was a fringe party in the government who made exploratory inquests into negotiations with the Soviet Union (most significantly), but that went nowhere, and had no real effort behind it at all. There was no way Japan would ever come to a negotiating table as this peace party was FRiNGE. The supreme war council, the actual people in Japan who would’ve could’ve called for peace at literally any time (and would’ve probably been givin Vietnam and parts of Korea and China based on how they faced consequences for the war crimes) were literally theocratic militarists who didn’t care how many people would have to die to achieve japans goals, and said as much.
My grandmother lived under both Italian and German occupations of her island in Greece. She always maintained that the Germans were far more brutal and cruel than the Italians were. The Italian soldiers, mostly, didn’t even want to be there.
The Italians also generally said they related culturally to the Greeks. The testimonies of the Italian soldiers and Greeks in the Dodecanese seem to match this trend
in italy we say: greek and italians, one face, one race
@@Boretheorywell no, italian soldiers did a masaacre in greece
they killed 150 civilians in domeninkon
my grandfather was in the navy fighting in Greece, and as you say he didn't want to be there fighting "a father people"
@@Simplebutnotsimpler yes and the same unit who did ended up fighting with greek partisans against the germans
Speaking of - if you happen to see pictures of Mussolini upside-down, that's an Italian meme, as the bodies of Mussolini, his lover Claretta Petacci (who wasn't his wife, by the way, rather his mistress, his actual wife, Rachele Guidi, survived the war despite being captured by partisans and being handed over to US forces, who released her in 1958, and managed to get by, dying in 1979 at the age of 89. One of their sons, Romano, was the father of politician Alessandra Mussolini) and several other fascist officials were hung upside down from the roof of a service station in Piazzale Loreto, in Milan.
At the International Tribunal for the Far East which convened on 26 April 1946 was convened with 28 defendants. Of these 2 died of natural causes during the trial, 1 was found to be mentally unfit, 7 were found guilty and subsequently executed, 16 were found guilty and sentenced to life in prison but subsequently released on various date between 1952 and 1958.
There were further trials throughout territories formally occupied be Japan with some 984 executions and numerous prison sentences.
28? You think this highly complex network consisted of 28 people? There were 21 group trials alone for nazi leadership consisting of hundreds of nazi’s who faced charges in court.
Weighed against what Japan did that is shockingly small.
As a Greek who has spoken with people who were alive during the Nazi occupation i understand thst the Italians were not considered heinous as the Germans by the people then, to the degree that when they fell out with the Germans at some point and they were persecuted Greek people were helping to save them often.
What you want to say I don't understand
@@Der_Mann_223 That the Italians when they co occupied Greece with the Nazis in WW2 were not as bad as them , no offence if you are German
In Croatia just on my island 400 civilians were killed and thrown in a endless pit. Fascists were ruthless like Nazis
@@Nancy20012 it has a simple explanation italy wanted to just expand its territory and wanted to grow the facist influence but the Nazis motives were different they were going for the race and it's made them to do ruthless activities.
@@Torcasolta remember Croatian own fascist regime killed over thousands of thousands people killed so horrible that's made Nazis worried.
Selective justice.
Edit:
And Nazi Hunters only prosecute the German concentration camp personnels until the very last one, some of them from Eastern Europe, but zero mention of Italians.
Or selective injustice.
@@1toneboy
And Italian side did not have mad scientists who needed to hide in either U's.
Also zero mention of prosecution of Croatians for why they did to Serbs and others.
@@siewheilou399 You're right, there were no italian scientists worthy of the US protection. I mean let's be real, Italian scientists were never getting to the moon like the Germans did for the yanks!
The Germans must have ruffled the feathers of the one bird you should not make cross with you.
17:08 Let me add something. My grandfather was a non commissioned officer in the Blackshirts, who joined the Italian Social Republic after the armistice and kept fighting against the Allies. After the end of the war in Italy, he was arrested and interrogated by Americans.
That summary justice you talk about that killed 20k-30k Italian soldiers, wasn't carried out just by Italian partisans, but also by the Allies. They didn't care enough to set up proper trials, they would determine via interrogation if those Italians would live or be executed by firing squad right away. There were 2 things the Allies wanted to know in the interrogation, that would book you one spot in front of the firing squad:
1 - If you had committed a war crime against Americans or British (only them, they didn't care what you did in Greece, Yugoslavia etc.), doesn't matter if it was pre-armistice or post-armistice. One dead American soldier was more important than any amount of dead non Anglo-Saxons, according to the interrogators.
2 - If you had been an Italian Social Republic soldier (in case you didn't voluntarily surrendered to the Allies). The Allies demanded every Italian Social Republic soldier to surrender himself to them. Even if you hadn't commited any war crime, fighting for the Italian Social Republic and not surrendering would automatically make you a war criminal (war crime of perfidy: removing your military uniform and wearing civilian clothes, which at the end of the war was pretty normal, since any partisan would have shot you on sight if you still had your uniform on). The Allies' request was often practically unfeasible, as to surrender yourself to them, you should have somehow avoided German officers, Italian officers, Italian partisans, crossed frontlines and battlefields just to get to the Allies who then would have arbitrarily decided your fate. It was in part an excuses for the Allies to get rid of Italians who didn't like Anglo-Americans enough to collaborate with them, and create a pro-Allies new Italy.
The Americans didn't find any proof that my grandfather fought for the Italian Social Republic (many archives were destroyed at the end of the war, exactly to prevent recognition) and so he avoided summary execution.
You are correct in saying that many Italian officers, whether they fought for the Italian Social Republic or collaborated with the Allies didn't face justice. On the other hand, many lower rank officers and soldiers were summarily executed by the partisans or the Allies. Something you didn't mention is that certainly not all Italians who fought for the Italian Social Republic were Fascists, as there was mandatory conscription under martial law. During this retribution, neither partisans nor the Allies cared if you were a conscript with no choice or a volunteer, even because they were hard to distinguish. In Italy, the war criminal officers got away, the soldiers who - at times - had no choice, paid the price.
Excellent post. Any reading recommendations on the subject of war crimes ? Your mention of perfidy being a war crime was illuminating. Thanks.f
Spunto molto interessante. Credo fortemente che la storia dell'Italia agli sgoccioli della seconda e nell'immediato post sia raccontata, specialmente dal mondo anglosassone, in modo del tutto sommario, un po a casaccio e fortemente di parte... Purtroppo tante brave persone hanno pagato gli erroracci dei pochi in quegli anni...
@@toknode331 Sono d'accordo. La cosa che purtroppo fa male è che se uno straniero, di qualsiasi nazionalità, volesse documentarsi sulla storia Italiana della Seconda Guerra Mondiale, quasi sicuramente si documenterà con media anglosassoni, e non avrà mai una lettura discretamente precisa e completa dell'accaduto.
@@michaelmisczuk1188 Can't really help you on that. Due to my family's history, this war crime of perfidy has always been well known to me.
Moreover, my grandma on the other side of the family witnessed 2 young German soldiers, who wanted to surrender, being executed by Americans because they wore civilian clothes. A villager from my grandma's village convinced the 2 Germans to stay at his home and wear civilian clothes, then went to warn the Americans who were advancing and occupying nearby towns. After those 2 were executed, everybody in the village hated this man, he was seen as a vile murderer, but nobody could do anything about him because he was under American protection. Very soon after the war, he died from a sudden illness and nobody went to his funeral.
@@SurroundEdByFreaks La grossa problematica sta proprio nella necessità di raccontare la loro guerra come la grande liberazione/guerra patriottica (dall'altro lato) al fine di giustificare una serie di crimini commessi anche da loro (durante la guerra e, per la Russia, anche per tanti anni dopo). Secondo me una prova di tutto si trova nell'enorme ipocrisia durante il processo a Skorzeny, quasi ammazzato per aver utilizzato divise alleate e salvato poi da Yeo-Thomas che testimoniò appunto dicendo che anche gli alleati commisero tale crimine. Il termine di quella guerra è stato un vero putiferio e la gente, dopo anni di sofferenze, odio, morte e dolore di fatto non ci ha capito più un cavolo di niente. Detto ciò, ho terminato i miei studi in inghilterra e ricordo grandi liti con il professore di storia perchè venivano insegnanti falsi storici pazzeschi e sta cosa non mi andava giu. Tempo fa trovai su soundcloud un "podcast" intitotalo I giorni di liberazione di Sandro Lecca. Mi permetto di condividerlo con te. C'è anche una testimonianza del mio primo insegnante di pianoforte. Da quelle testimonianze si percepisce proprio la follia e il totale non senso di quei giorni che di fatto ha aiutato a creare tutto questo sapere/nonsapere che circola intorno a questo periodo. Aggiungo un ultima cosa, perdonami per l'eterno testo: non sono fascista anzi, sono molto contento di non vivere sotto il nazifascismo. Detto questo credo che la ricerca di una verità oggettiva - seppur quasi impossibile - sia la chiave per cercare di capire, imparare e non ripetere tutti gli errori che abbiamo ricominciato a commettere.
Anyone interested in the Italian post-war cultural landscape should seek out the Don Camillo stories by Giovanni Guareschi. They run from about 1950 to about 1979, and document (humorously) the rivalry between former fascists and communists, with subtle interference by the parish priest.
I watched a few of those movies on a trip to Europe. Even visited the museum! Very interesting and hilarious films. I kinda want to sit down and watch them again, now that you have reminded me about them!
"Former fascist"? Don Camillo represent the Democraza Cristiana, the ruling party after 1945 in Italy. He's NOT a former fascist in any way possible. In one of the movies, they both put their hands on a real former fascist, who return to the town after years, and almost killed him. What are you talking about?
@@AustinBecht You can find a lot of them on UA-cam, in Italian by the way. Maybe you can find them with English subtitles as well.
@@gabrielesolletico6542 I don’t seem to have made myself clear. I know Don Camillo does not represent former fascists; he is the priest trying so hard to serve God and the parish, but he sometimes gets caught between the political factions, and recent history inevitably affected people’s outlooks. I haven’t seen the movies but I love the books and the characters in them.
@@phillipescott9764You have made yourself abundantly clear.
Democrazia Cristiana was not "former fascists".
The MSI (Movimento Sociale Italiano) were the former fascists.
Learn Italian History and political landscape before speaking.
Well the italians ousted their dictator unlike the Nazis and the Japanese
Mussolini was weak lmao he didn't do shit Hitler did. He arguably made Italy worse and they were more concerned with staying neutral. They never invaded anyone but Ethiopia and lost. WW2 IS a perpetual lie tossed around by people who don't know any better
Anarchy is good.
Note: there WAS a Grand Coucil of Fascism, it hadn't been convocated in years, it held a "free" vote after a discussion, Mussolini lost the vote. There's a suspicion that Mussolini was ready to retire. Next day he got surreptitiously arrested on orders of the king - who had always been the head of state. Eventually, some of those who voted against Mussolini were later caught and executed. Yes, it was a darn mess.
The Australians ran the war trials in Japan. Interestingly their military carried out executions for the first time. They wanted to put Hirohito on trial, but the only intervention by Washington in the trials ensured that he didn’t face justice.
Ethiopian war was far more complex than Italians coming in and committing war crimes. The Ethiopians took no prisoners and obeyed no conventions, even some of the Ethiopian internal Kingdoms joined the Italians to overthrow the negus.
thanks for the information. I felt that was somewhat importants to know. And did not know that.
Fascisti carogne tornate nelle fogne
There will always be internal conflict for selfish reasons. Doesnt justify anything wtf are you on about. Causing war on a whim to seem "credible" is diabolical and disgraceful.
Internal Kingdom's?
@@NCR-National-Reclamation-Gov I think he his talking about population intern to the nation. Like different tribes or cultures
There’s countless atrocities committed by the Germans against the Italian people after Mussolini fell. Ardeatine Cave (Rome). 335 citizens massacred, this just being one of the many atrocities.
The atrocity by the allies in Italy were far worse.
They entirely destroyed cities and mass rape/killing entire villages especially allies soldier of colonial allies possessions.
The allies were the "bad guys" in my opinion. Hitler just wanted a safe space for Germany never seek to attack Uk or Us.
it would have been funny if your editors had put in a normal picture of mussolini but rotated it 180 degrees
Haha, nice. Thank you for allowing me to end this video with a smile on my face
Communists were barbarians
Just for future reference the "gli" sound in Italian is pronounced like "ll" in Spanish or a hard "y".
Regardless of what you think Justice was hamstringed by the political reality of post war politics. It may have been cynical for the U.S & U.K to allow such things but rarely is international politics solely on the side of the righteous or just but with the cynical, smart & discreet mostly. Politics & War may have changed in their tactics & strategy but never in their nature.
As an Italian (despite the misleading name) I have often wondered this.
This script also written by an Italian. :-)
It's simple. Italians ceased being enemies from 1943 and became allies.
@@alexharrington6459 It's not that simple, the Togliatti amnesty made by the Italian Communist Party leader of the same name, let off many former fascists to reconcentrate on rebuild the country, rate that give in to the mood of civil war that was brewing between the most communist partisans and the US backed former fascist soldiers of the Regio Esercito the italian army.
@@alexharrington6459 except for the fact that Rome wasn't liberated until 1944 but ok
@@redtube8667Italy switched sides and declared war on Germany on October 13th, 1943.
A link to Swept Under The Rug should be somewhere in the description.
Very much agreed, as I went to see if there was one early on.
Here you go :-) ua-cam.com/video/18Xe9HqW8Q4/v-deo.htmlsi=dYRoaM8R0xJVVNaz
When I was in school in the early 50s most information was shared about the trials, then as I progressed through school stuff started to change, drastically, I went to school in mid America, unfortunately it became not important, I have forgotten about most of it, thanks for the reminder 🦑
Disturbing, dark information, but informative. Thank you.
This is a fascinating video, right up there with Mark Felton shit. Keep up the good work!
imagine using mark felton as a compliment
probably the same reason that the US , USSR or GB were not.
War Crimes are only used against the losing side.
the italians were on the losing side ….
You do realize that the Italians were one of the Axis Powers right?
@@emptychair3932 not after 43.
Honestly irrelevant, italy was held accountable as an instigator of the war and reparations were demanded. The persecution of war criminals was and should have been imposed, but the post war protests in italy to the few cases carried out played a big part in the decision of letting them go.
@@Italianplayercvu not holding war criminals accountable is by definition not holding Italy accountable lmao. You cannot ignore the largest batch of crimes they committed and go, "Yeah they've been punished enough"
Italy was an allied power from 1943-45 (and ended the war as such). Also, considering the crimes of the allied powers (such as Britain and especially the Soviet Union), it would be silly to think that Italy should have been subjected to a war crimes trial.
It depends WHAT Italy. Southern Kingdom yes, but not the R.S.I.
@loreCarbonell There was only 1 legitimate Italy. That was the monarchy, led by the king and Marshal Badoglio. Under the Italian constitution, the king was the head of state, and he had the power to appoint a prime minister. Once Mussolini was deposed as PM, he was no longer a legitimate ruler.
Do one on the operation gladio, it explains a lot why the US didn't go after Italian fascists
As an Italian, I want to thank the authors of this video for speaking about the facts in the most impartial way possible. Unfortunately in Italy a serious debate on this matter is not possible, every time it is discussed the extremists on both sides only tell the part of the story that suits them.
Nothing to debate IMO, any government that got elected the people should assume responsibility! Mussolini got elected so Italians should assume for their crimes in the Balkans(Yugoslavia, Albania), Africa(Libya, Ethiopia) and other battlegrounds where they participated and inflicted loss of life. That's how it should work, but Italians got the slick way out!
@@Torcasolta There's a lot to discuss. First of all, in the last free elections of 1921, the fascist party obtained only 4.65% of the votes. In 1922 they took power through a kind of coup d'état (the "March on Rome" with the support of the king). The 1924 elections saw the absolute victory of the fascists but they were elections characterized by violence and intimidation against opponents, no longer free. After that there were no more real elections.
So who really elected the fascists? Few, very few.
Then speaking of crimes, even the winners committed large quantities of them, obviously no trials for them. This is good right?
@@DesertFox41 no I don't justify any crimes winner or loser a crime is a crime! Hiroshima/Nagasaki is genocide like it or not when you can erase 100000s of lives within seconds it can not be called anything else then that. But Italians haven't answered nor apologized to their crimes committed and some still have the ancient appetite to annex land that is not theirs in the politics of their country. On the island I am from the Fascists have thrown in a pit 400 civilians and no one has answered yet to it, for me it is easier to cope as I have never met those victims, but the elders that remember it is more difficult and they want closure.
@@Torcasolta the problem is simply that Italians with fascist sympathies will never apologize for things like that. While on the contrary the others do it, also because many, including some of my relatives, have suffered massacres at the hands of the fascist Nazis.
It's just that it doesn't make sense that only the party that suffered the crimes is apologizing, I don't know if you understand what I mean.
@@Torcasolta that was done by subjects of the fascist kingdom of italy. now we are citizen of the republic of italy. why we should apologize for something made by others. and we have killed and hanged by his feets the responsable of that mass murder, so we have made a pretty clear statement that we strongly disagree with that policy. that's the main difference between italy and the others nations in the axis
The kinds of horror humans inflict on each other is mind-boggling
Thanks for this post , not pleasant but an important thing to know about recent History.
How about a trial for all the war crimes our fellow Americans committed in WW2?
They were too busy working with "former" Nazis at NASA to build the space program.
It's fair to say Mussolini DIDN'T get away with the crimes of his regime, although it was the good citizens of Milan who dealt with the punishment. The scars of the Jewish people's fate weighs heavily on Italy today, and yet you say that initially they were shielded from the blood-thirsty Nazis. However, Mussolini's death was not through due process, no matter what he had done he deserved that. The Italians also remember the atrocities committed by the Nazis including Mazzabotto (near Bologna) where hundreds were needlessly killed, I guess they successfully misdirected the Allies away from their own criminals in favour of the "easy target" that the Nazis had presented.
Ritorneremo
@@thepatriarchy819 Cos'è l'alternativa? Renzi e suoi amici? 🤣🤣🤣
@@timmellor2599 Matteo è communista 🤣
@@thepatriarchy819 appesi
Actually, the good citizens of Milan merely abused the corpses of Mussolini and his mistress, who had been summarily executed elsewhere.
Long story shory: you can commit crimes while everyone else is comitting crimes and go unpunished, aslong as your crimes arnt the very worst.
You should study up on what the Ethiopian resistance did. Nanny's killing entire officer families. Comfort girls killing young officers at dances when a certain song was played. Digging up roads at night that were built during the day. When they used gas attacks to kill livestock to starve the Ethiopians to death, we ate the Italians. Even HITLER went off at Mussolini about that.
Sources for reading?
@@Checkmate1138 theres a lot out there... But it is a massive rabbit hole.
You're kinda making me rethink if those huge Italian reprisals were right after all...
They also stole the obelisk at Axum, in one piece and then when ordered to return it in the 00's they said they would need to cut it in half. They were told by the EU to quite pissing about and shipped it back and reinstalled it in one piece.
@@sonicninja3434we do a little trolling
Here on YT I heard a Hitler quote like "Italy was often vanquished in war, but managed to come out a victor anyway." Italy was historically cut A LOT of slack.
Italy was on the winning Allied side in WW I but suffered many casualties and didn't feel properly compensated which helped many WW I vets turn to fascism and joining the Axis in WW II.
That's because being Italian is enough punishment lol
When? we won the WWI and yet the British and French did not respect the agreements and did not give us the promised territories. we lost the WWII and we still have American troops in Italy after 80 years: I don't think they gave us anything then
You should make an episode about John Rabe, if you haven't already. Man's a very interesting case.
he did, called john rabe, the good n*zi under his youtube channel, biographics, 5 years ago.
His story is largely told in this one ua-cam.com/video/18Xe9HqW8Q4/v-deo.htmlsi=dYRoaM8R0xJVVNaz But ya, would be worthy of his own dedicated video. -Daven
Very interesting.
I have always wondered why there were very few war crimes trials brought against Italians.
The allies committed war crimes too, lets not pretend that the axis were the bad guys while the other side was pure and innocent. For what concerns Italy, the was little to gain from treating it the same way as Germany.
sadly, most are one sided
because we italians are extremely charming
Because they measured with 2 different standards 🤷🏻♀️
The Germans were right
If the Germans were right, about race etc, they would have won. They were not the master race.
A fitting video right as the _World War Two TimeGhost channel_ published the last video on the Japanese signing the unconditional surrender.
War crimes during a war? Don't they know that's a crime?
Thank you for this!
What is important to remember is that war crimes have always been a part of wars.
What is also important is to distinctly point out the level at which war crimes turn unto wholesale genocide and ethnic cleansing.
The former is a collateral aspect of war, the later is most certainly not.
Thanks for spreading this knowledge.
Because the italians didn't have death camps the way germany did and they needed the japanese against russia.
We actually did have death camps during ww2, they Just weren't as cruel as german ones
@@kanyewest8324death camps?? Sources?
Great channel
What about Hungary? Romania? And Thailand too?
Hungary and Romania delt with their crimes internally.
You think that new communist regimes would give their opponents and war-criminals to the West?
Almost the same with Yugoslavia...
Can you do one for Vichy France too? Thank you!
In other words, to survive a world war even if on the loosing side...
1. learn dirty secrets of your enemies, they might help
2. do your unethical research in a clean and propper methode, it might buy you a get out of jail free pass
3. be ready to cooperate with the enemy, a change from enemy to ally goes a long way
4. be part of the elite of your country, they get a free pass just for being born in the right family.
gotta lov humanity!!!
I recommend watching "The Lion of the Desert". A great film that focuses on an ignored part of 20th century history. This film has, to the best of my knowledge, never been shown on UK or US television.
Italian here. Thanks for covering these crimes. Unfortunately we never went through the denazification process here in Italy and a lot of fascists git away with what they have done scot-free. Some entered politics in the Italian Republic's parliament years after even. Because they never got properly prosecuted we haven't really dealt with our past and we still have a fascist presence in our politics.
These things need to be properly explained and you have done a good job.
I've also come across Italians that look upon the fascist past with nostalgia. And openly supportive of Mussolini
we have a fascist lead govern, not a presence
Because the US wanted Japan as a bullwark against communism in the East, while Italy was very quick to paint themselves as innocent victims, just like Austria. Meanwhile, Germany was the only country that ever owned up to what it did and is still ruthlessly punished for it to this very day.
Italy changed sides in 1943 and fought with the allies. This could be the reason that their pre 1943 atrocities were overlooked
You are missing the major detail that very few Italians effectively fought for the Allies in regular forces. The majority of Italian war crimes were committed in Yugoslavia, Greece and Ethiopia, and the Allies (Americans and British) cared little about those. But if Americans or British found evidence of Italian soldiers who committed war crimes against them, they'd usually have those soldiers executed, even pre 1943. Especially true if those were Italian Social Republic soldiers - who btw, greatly outnumbered the ones who actually fought for the Allies, which makes the "Italy changes sides" sentence quite biased.
Your statement is true for the high officer elite who committed war crimes but then collaborated with the Allies, though.
@@SurroundEdByFreaksthey didn’t outnumber the ones of the allies not even close. Unless pf course u only count those who engaged in combat but that would be unfair as the allies ordered the Italian army to not engage in any military operation against the RSI or Germany aside from crashing their resistance in captured territory. The Italian royal army had between 2.5 and 3M soldiers by the end of the war alongside 100-500k Partisans while the rsi had at best 100k and more realistically 75k soldiers. The RSI WAS FUCKING HATED. So much so that more fascists served under the king than under the RSI. God i mean even GENTILE the philosopher of fascism started criticising the fascist militias when they killed 5communist students.
@@Boretheory What? Where did you get those 2-3M soldiers from? Are you counting the Italian soldiers who were prisoners of war that after the armistice surrendered to the Germans and passed the rest of the war in prison camps?
Among all the extimates that I've read on Italian Social Republic vs Royal army soldiers, yours is very out of the range. Most datas I've seen report that at the end of the war the Italian Social Republic forces were at least 500k. How many of them were able to fight is another thing, because weapons, ammos and supplies were scarce.
The largest extimate I've read on partisans was around 300k, never heard anybody going beyond that.
In 1945, conscription in the South and the fact that Allies were freeing Italian prisoners of war from their prison camp meant that the co-belligerent army grew, but it has always been far, far less than the RSI, it never even reached 300k.
@sourroundedbyfreaks, Italian cobelligernt soldiers were about 10% of the Allied fighting force in Italy and 50% of the logistics. Not counting the Italians who refused to fight for the Germans and were imprisoned in camps and those who formed the partisan groups. Also not counting the tens of thousands who opposed German disarmament in Italy, Greece, Yugoslavia, France, Albania. About 90,000 Italian soldiers died in the Resistance, that was a huge effort.
@@InfoRome Sure, nobody is saying the co-belligerent army never existed, what I said is that it was a small army, smaller than the Italian Social Republic forces (also thanks to conscription, of course).
Also I'd like to raise two point: first, soon after the armistice, the vast majority of Italian forces peacefully surrendered to German disarmament - not counting the entire corp of the Blackshirts and few Royal Army units that immediately sided with the Germans. The units that tried to oppose disarmament were the minority by quite a margin.
Second, it's a mistake to consider all those Italians soldiers who ended up in German prison camps as part of the resistance. Remember that the order they were given (when the order actually reached them) was to resist disarmament by the Germans, and great majority of them didn't obey. While among those soldiers there were plenty of anti-Fascists, there were also plenty who had no more faith in the King, and were not willing to fight and lose their lives for the King, nor for the Allies, nor for Mussolini. Understandably, what they wanted most was the war to end. So, just like you can call them "Italians who refused to fight for the Germans", one can call them "Italians who refused to fight for King Vittorio Emanuele III".
There is the theory that to beat a monster you must become one. When both sides become monsters, the winner decides who is the monster
12:27 "nothing's black and white"
*photo literally in black and white*
literally unwatchable
Can you imagine falling behind an entire psychopath with no empathy or remorse? But I have been in prison and prison and military are similar in many ways. This creature was put through both, he snapped, he used his rizz to overtake most of Europe. It’s great to know that you can’t really sort out the psychopaths.
Fascinating history, Italy was left a mess after WW2, never really fully recovered, scars & under American control to this day. Plenty of War Criminals got away with terrible crimes. Great film, keep it going. Cheers 🥂
what? what are you smoking lmfao
Lmao under american control
???? Last I checked Italy has its own government
We're the 8th largest economy, with the lowest amount of homicides and r*pes in the EU, the longest life expectancy and have lower unemployment than Sweden Finland and France, how have we not recovered 😂
@@ItalianplayercvuBasta vedere Gladio e quante basi dobbiamo mantenere
"Italiani brava gente" and still to these days most of us think it's true.
I still don't get why the Italians and Japanese were treated better. I've seen enough about how Allies treated German and Austrian civilians. Many who survived their wrath were damaged beyond repair.
Thus, they obviously didn't give a F about human rights, public opinion or anything the like.
Frankly, I think we expected more of the Germans. We saw ourselves in them, and a large number of our politicians were impressed by Hitler and his policies until war broke out. Senate minutes regarding Germany during the thirties are truly sad and enlightening reading.
So, when the manure hit the propeller, the desire was to distance oneself as fast as possible, all the while denying how close we really were.
@@raquellofstedt9713 My grandfather was working on a farm as a child for food scraps and slept on hay in the barn. The landlord was an abusive prick who did even worse to girls working for him. I can't blame my grandfather for joining the Nzs when they invaded Austria. He had little to lose and soon had a fancy uniform designed by Hugo Boss, and for the first time in his life he had electricity, running, warm water, a bed and a small collection of shoes. He also got paid really well and suddenly girls were interested in him...
Who wouldn't fold under such appealing conditions?
The funniest thing about him: he was a literal Nz and served a sentence for lesser war crimes, but he was one of my most tolerant relatives! When the others heard that my first love was an Indian girl, they were furious! He: so what?
He was one of the few people who I believe when they said that they were never supporting the Nz ideology. He flat out told me that he joined the idiots because he wanted to get away from his old l environment and obviously because of the money...
@@raquellofstedt9713but it's not like Americans identified in their German ancestors, even though it's true it's the majority of their makeup, and that's because antigerman sentiments had been a thing since ww1. German farmers were often kidnapped and tarred and feathered decades before ww2, and some say prohibitionism was to repress German's drinking culture.
@@Bolognabeef german or Irish, I’ve heard both. I aggree with you that the grass root sentiment was far from rpo- German, but compared to the Italians or the Japanese? The predjudices were far less ro begin with, and of a different nature. My dad’s folks were German American in California’s central Valley. Hid their ancestry since wwi. I’m well aware of the bs that went down, but still, there were a lot of folks in the states that thought Hitler was right…until we were at war. Thank God my family always knew he was crap, but the racial stuff was what a lot of people wanted to hear.
Tokyo War Crimes trials. Many Japanese war criminals were imprisoned and executed.
Luberti case is a good example of post ww2 chaos, after a series of seemingly violent incidents which he was involved in, numerous books written by him, .....he eventually ended up decades later dying in poverty.
Let it be demonetized. Let it be age restricted. I want to learn the information and not have it censored. The most important thing is to educate. Not to profit.
Well if both those things happen, it gets put out to less viewers
Hard to continue to educate when you can't get the money to pay people to make videos: Researchers, editors, script writers, etc.
@@Mohenjo_Daro_yep, also hard to do when your channel is shadowbanned or outright deleted. It ain't very forward thinking to say 'let it be demonetized.' That's the *least* of the creator's concerns.
Then you start a channel and teach the information.
They can’t pay their writers if it gets demonetized.
4:35 The massacre of Derber Libanos (monastery) happened because Grazzinani thought the priest hid the people who tried to assassinate him. When they told him they didn't know their whereabouts he ordered every priest to be killed.
“We have known the bitterness of defeat and the exultation of triumph, and from both we have learned there can be no turning back. We must go forward to preserve in peace what we won in war.” - Douglas MacArthur
MacArthur was a wannabe authoritarian dictator who went against direct orders from the Commander In Chief by insisting they could keep going all the way to attack China. He ignored orders of wiser men not to do that. Over 100,000 Chinese soldiers flooded the border. His ego got us mired in the Korean War, where many men died to fight their way back to where we started. He got his ticker tape parade, and was fired for insubordination. And for generally being a narcissistic asshat.
Great Question
I do recommend for anyone whod be interested;
Mark Felton here on the Tube. Covers the axis and allies well. Incredibly well put together.
"Malign Neglect" should be a crime in itself.
Soviets commited a lot of atrocities, both when they were colaborating with the nazis during the first 2 years of war and also when they had the nazis as enemies.
For example?
Source?
To conquer a place you have to control it.
The Italians didn't even take over the territories other than the main towns in Ethiopia.
You don't have to control something to commit crimes
Hi, just a couple of marginal remarks:
1) Italy registered and fired from public offices its Jewish citizens but did not deport them, the Nazist deported them *after* the capitulation of Italy on 8th September 1943.
2) Italy did not "switch side" on that same day: only 5 weeks later, on 13th October 1943, the Italian monarchy declared war against the fascist puppet state created by Mussolini on 18th September of that year.
3) Neither the monarchist army nor the anti-fascist partisans were allowed the play any significant military role in the following 1.5 years of war, since the Anglo-American didn't trust neither of them.
Come on Simon, stop spreading the old war propaganda over and over again!
You did your research about Italian war criminals, why not set the record straight about most basic historical facts!
Italy did not declare war on Mussolini, it declared war on Germany and fought primarily against Germany. Fascists were collaborationists of the Germans and played a smaller role than the Kingdom played in helping the Allies. It's also not true that Italians did not playing a significant role in the liberation of the country. If you add up Italian service units + Italian partisans + cobelligernt forces + logistics they played a significant role.
No this is wrong.
Italy deported jews, we had concentartion camps.
And the italian co-belligerant army was a thing.
Studia la storia, fascio
@@InfoRome Ma sei italiano? "Italy did not declare war on Mussolini, it delcared war on Germnay" AND WEREN'T THE REPUBLIC OF SALO PART OF THE THIRD REICH, and Mussolini just a puppet of Hitler, at that point? C'mon...
@@gabrielesolletico6542 Appunto, quindi ridurre il contributo bellico italiano a "guerra a Mussolini" è una cavolata. Gli italiani hanno combattutto i tedeschi, sia le truppe sia i partigiani, in battaglie e tanti tipi di azioni militari. Questo tipo di linguaggio è il motivo per cui nessuno ricorda il cntributo militare e partigiano italiano contro la Germania, come se gli alleati affrontassero i tedeschi e intanto gli italiani si scannavano tra loro. Non è andata così, da cobelligeranti post-43 abbiamo fatto la guerra contro la Germania e contribuito come potevamo alla vittoria alleata.
In short, the communist Soviet Union wanted to suck up to communist Yugoslavia so went after Italian war criminals who 'allegedly' committed crimes against Yugoslavians and the capitalist/non-communist allies wanted to suck up to potential business allies in Italy (and indeed Japan) and decided to err on the side of caution and let go of any such aspirations and decided not to prosecute anyone! I'm sure this has oversimplified it 🤔
0:08 this man (Rudolf Hess) secretly flew a solo mission into the UK in the middle of the night to meet with some British contacts he had for peace discussions.
Unfortunately the British authorities were not interested in peace and put him in prison. Once he realized he was now liable to be tortured for German war secrets he tried to kill himself by jumping out a window.
He was not successful, but sustained many injuries. He pretended to be insane, and ultimately did not divulge German secrets, but did spend the rest of his life in prison. He was in prison from 1941-1987. This is a violation of international law and a war crime considering he was there for peace discussions, But you never hear about it.
Historian David Irving stated he thought Rudolf Hess should have been awarded the peace prize for his efforts, and millions of lives could have been saved if Britain had only listened….. instead the British empire was destroyed for Churchills vanity.
Was he wrong?
As Michael Jackson states, the history books are lies, and the Press is a criminal organization.
There could and should have been no peace with that murderous regime. If that's a war crime then the definition of that law is morally wrong.
I've heard about it many times
Oh, yes, award the peace price to the nazi who thought the brits would want peace in the name of their "common Aryan heritage" that would have looked *even better* than quietly ignoring war crimes. Also he didn't go there under orders from the nazi government last I checked and thus he was no official ambassador just a random idiot who was so hopped up on his own bullshit he thought he could end the war with the brits so they could have one less nuisance when they were killing everyone else.
Good lord, how many UA-cam channels does this guy have.
We made use of the fascists... Gladio
Lol
ua-cam.com/users/shortsBmc9NFfhx74?si=pKDISSqSnccAjXUu
Il suo modo di dire badoglio mi uccide
With how ineffective the Italian military was, they were actually fighting on the Allied side
Except when they damaged beyond repair half the British navy with some motorised divers in Alexandria
The army was ineffective because it had no funding as the state wasn’t planning on going to war. The navy had 2 years of uncontested naval hegemony in the med after disabling the British fleet in the med
Being judged as "evil" by the AMERICANS and the BRITS is truly the highest honor a country may receive.
It was pizza. Everyone loves pizza and didn't want to risk losing acess to good pizza.
For most of the perpetrators of crimes during WWII, if you could keep from being arrested for about 3 years after the war, for the most part you were scot-free.
You know things were fucked up in the Pacific Theatre when the phrase "a card carrying Nazi comes out as arguably the greatest hero of the entire story of the pacific theatre" can be used without a hint of irony while also being true.
Also, it's honestly insane how that one Italian SS member that was accused of killing 200 people had the defence of "It was more like 300, actually." But what's also incredible is that you have these Italian fascists that had no qualms having people in camps but even they were shielding Jewish prisoners from the Nazis.
john rabe was a weird guy. He WAS a n*zi BUT he ONLY wanted the parts about a carying society, wich was ALSO a part of this system.
he distanced himself from the atrocities made by japan and germany. he REALLY thought that the german leader DIDNT know about the war crimes and would reject them . THATS why he wrote to the german leader, ultimatly leading him to be a criminal suspect in germany and beeing punished to work under less than good conditions in nepal.
after the war they put him for a judge and into jail, only the intervention of chinese survivors got him free. he died 9 months later from problems he catched during his time in nepal, poor and malnourished.
thats it, many people only reducing him to be a n*zi wich is bad. he was naive and a christian who couldnt imagine that other christians could comit such atrocities, i think that made him a victim of the n*zis and NOT a n*zi.
The fact that they weren't killed or brpught to a trial helped the 70 italian instability
An interesting historical tidbit: When Hitler learned that Japan attacked Pearl Harbor, he was elated. He said that now, he had, "One ally that hadn't been defeated in 3000 years, and another that was always on the winning side.' indeed, Italy ended up on the winning side...by SWITCHING sides!
That sounds like a post WW2 made up quote, why would Hitler say that "Italy was always on the winning side"? What historical fact would Hitler be basing that quote upon?
Also, nobody in Italy that knows anything about the war says that Italy won WW2. Switching sides is mostly Anglosaxon propaganda / memelords that ignore, willingly or not, what the Italian Social Republic was. Unless you can give me a reason why having the pro-Allies Italian co-belligerent army being outnumbered 5 to 1 against the pro-Axis Italian Social Republic forces constitutes a side switch?
@@SurroundEdByFreaks That quote was from John Toland's (a highly respected historian) book, "Adolf Hitler."
@@Pootycat8359 And John Toland is an hightly respected ANGLO-SAXON historian... c'mon!
@@gabrielesolletico6542 I don't "get" your point.
I’m from Albenga and almost everyone forgot his story
Why wasn’t there an Anglo-French deceleration of war against the Soviets for invasion Poland? Why did the Soviets still receive Western aid after that even while they launched wars of aggression against Finland and the Baltics? Why did the Soviets get Anglo/Ami/ French approval to take one of the most major Polish cities in Liviv and make it a part of Soviet Ukraine?
There was a war... cold war...
Why wasn't Poland held accountable for joint invasion of Chechoslovakia alongside Nazi Germany? Why wasn't Poland held accountable for invading and annexing russian lands in 1920s? Why wasn't Poland held accountable for oppressing russians, belorussians and ukrainians living in Western Ukrainian Republic it had annexed? Why wasn't Poland held accountable for oppression of jews both before, during and after the war had begun?
Why do ignorant poles never look at the cause of what's usually coming for them? Do you think Churchill of all people calling Poland the hyaena of Europe was unfounded?
I have often wondered the same thing!!!!!
Amwrica can not live without spaghetti, thats is the reason.
More people spoke German in the home in America as a second language than essentially any other language. 😕 There were a whole lot of assumptions made. Not a lot of them held up.
@@David0lyleI'm pretty sure you're lying and it's actually Spanish
Don't forget the Italians annexed part of Slovenia and Croatia after the end of WW1 (stopped in a battle near Ljublijana on 18 November 1918, 7 days after the end of the war). In my family's area of Slovenia, reading and speaking slovenian was banned and names were Italianised. Conscripts from these areas into the Italian army got sent to fight in Africa and Russia.
Silly Simon, Croatia didn't need an Italian to commit atrocities. The Ustache killed upwards of 1 million people, half of which were Serbs. They based their system on that of the Nazis, right down to concentration camps and the killing and torture of Jews, Gypsies and Slavs, though only the Serbian Slavs since Croatian Slavs were deemed pure. I'm not sure how Nazi Germany reconciled Croatia Slavs being acceptable, but the rest were not.
Here's another raging Serb 😂 Croatians created the Partisan movement, Croatians had the first free enclave in WW2, the Ustachi were installed by the Italian Fascists and no the Ustachi did not kill 70% od all the victims in Yugoslavia know your facts and not the SANU memorandum!
let's remember that MSI ( The party Graziani joined after the trail) was a beo fascist party and it's symbol is in the brother's of Italy logo and the higher ups of MSI are still today celebrated and remembered by the Brothers of italy
I fully expect that one day you'll do a video on the deTrumpification of the United States
To add further to the confusing mess that this is, it should be noted that a number of Italian army units defected after the Armistice and joined the Yugoslavian resistance forces, instead of joining the Allies directly. Because we just needed to muddy the waters further.
They were already Italian... What more punishment do you want?
Imagine being ethnically cl*ansed by Italians then, you got humiliated even harder 😂
The only thing that makes me more sick than ww2, how we handled the aftermath
No allied war crimes were “swept under the rug” as there was none. The small frequency of crimes committed by a few bad apples, should not paintbrush the entire allied forces and are not comparable to atrocities committed by the axis powers.
There were plenty. No one's hands were clean in that war. No one's hands are clean in any war. The Allies weren't 'the good guys.' The Allies were the guys that won, and got to paint themselves as 'the good guys.' Which means we got to pretend our war crimes didn't happen, or were less severe.
Edit: and maybe you could say compared to Japan's unit 731 ours weren't as severe. But we still did awful things.
The civilian population of Dresden would disagree..
Oooff such a bad and wrong take
Too much smelling of your own farts and OD-ing on the US propaganda
Cavalier can you name specific or go into depth of these so called events? Spacecowboy what are your thoughts on The Blitz over London and open submarine warfare to the effect of, their words not mine “starve Britain out of the war”? This all happened well before the bombing on Dresden in 45 and majority of which were complicit or turned a blind eye to the atrocities that were occurring ie Bernsdorf Subcamp!
Cavalier can you name a specific event and go into detail? Spacecowboy what is your take then on the Blitz over London and Unrestricted Submarine Warfare to the effect of, their words not mine “Starve Britain out of the War”? All this happened well before Dresden in 45!
A phrase by general mario robotti in a general order in slovenia during july/august 1942 who said "here we kill too little" I advise you to look the story of his letters for yourselves because writing a comment does not give justice to the victims of italian war crimes thanks for the video greetings from Italy