I started using Ubuntu way before Unity even existed, back when they'd ship free live CDs for everyone, which I still own. Seems like a step in the right direction. Now, Fedora must do the same with Wayland.
Crimson Sunrise: what do you by, "Fedora must do the same with Wayland". I believe you meant X11. Like Unity, X11 has outlived its usefulness and needs to be set aside. Wayland is Today AND the future. Fedora is backed by RHEL along with ANYTHING pertaining to GNOME development. In all fairness though, I neither care for GNOME or UNITY. I live the "Plasma Life" w/ KDE and I've never looked back!!!
Right now, Wayland has several issues: - It has performance issues because it uses pixel rasterization. - There's no possibility of a reliable RDP protocol when your rendering is based of sending chunks of the screen. - Every single GUI toolkit and application must implement their own dpi scaling and font anti-aliasing. - The guys doing Wayland don't want to implement a standard for dpi scaling and font aliasing on their server. Dpi scaling and font anti-aliasing is not the responsibility of app developers, it's the display server's responsibility. This is lazyness. Lazyness that shouldn't be awarded.
Crimson Sunrise is there any "Professional" reason they're not implementing these features? I would think there has to be some real reason why Wayland has been built this way beyond....laziness.
Rasterization - What would the alternative be? RDP - I thought it sent just windows, not the entire screen area? Because if that is the case that is *really* sloppy programming. Font and DPI - No problem. Games are used to it by now, and 99.999% of the other applications use either GTK or QT. I am certain these issues will be resolved eventually.
Hi, GPU driver dev for Linux here. Please do some research before telling people these things. Pixel rasterization is one of the last step in literally every known graphics pipeline. It is the method by which we take vertices and fragments, generated by the earlier stages of whichever pipeline you happen to be using, and translate it into pixels so that it may be displayed as an image on the monitor. Tl;dr: rasterization is not an optional feature, it's mandatory and yes, X uses rasterization as well. As for the second thing: you have things mixed up. For one, RDP could still be implemented on a backend that relies on sending client damage (or as you called it, "chunks of the screen"), there is nothing about this that would impede that. Secondly, sending damaged surfaces back and forth between client and server is an essential part of how -X- works, not Wayland. Wayland does have a concept of damage for surfaces, but because Wayland also avoids sending surfaces back and forth through the use of shared memory we don't have to resend every damaged portion of a surface on update. Additionally, there are wayland compositors with RDP backends already. Re: font anti-aliasing not being handled by the "server": basically every modern X application (e.g. GTK+ ones, Qt, Enlightenment, etc.) does not use X's font rendering, it's already client-side and has been client-side for quite a long time now. This is no different from Wayland. Re: DPI scaling not being handled by the "server": Actually, X does not handle DPI scaling for it's applications either. The only thing it does is pass down the DPI of the current display to the client, and the client handles the rest. This is no different then Wayland. And finally: I put server in quotations because Wayland is not a server; it is a common protocol that compositors are expected to implement so that applications can run flexibly on other DEs in the same manner they did with X. The equivalent term for X server in wayland terms would be "compositor".
Absolutely agree. The best video on this topic so far. Well done. I've never been a fan of Unity, but at least they were trying something different, reaching, and being ambitious. Sad to see that fail. I also wonder if seeing Samsung ready to ship, in a few weeks, tens of millions of new S8's with what is, by all accounts from early reviews, a smooth and well done Android convergence to desktop with Dex had some role in their decision...
Guys... Gnome 3 truly shines in all it's glory when you use extensions: Caffeine, Dash to Dock, Media Player Indicator, Removable Drive Menu, Suspend button, Workspaces to dock. These are just a few honorable mentions but there are many more, it is a very flexible platform.
So what happens to Ubuntu Gnome....kinda makes it redundant with Ubuntu switching to Gnome in the future. Does it die after the next LTS, these questions need answers.
Probably Ubuntu Gnome will become Ubuntu and what's currently Ubuntu will go away. I hope for 17.10 they make this switch, maybe keep old Ubuntu as an Ubuntu Unity spin for a few cycles.
Unity7 has been alright for me, the only issues I have with it is compiz bugs and crashing. Partly why I am a bit sad at the loss of unity8, because it was going to be rewritten in Qt.
But Gnome 3 is not the same as Gnome 2. Back when the maintainer of the Akonadi/Kontact packages in Fedora stepped down in 2015 because it had become such a huge mess someone wrote: Gnome does nothing but change for the sake of change, not for any sort of 'evolutionary' reason. That's a dogma I can't stand. Gnome is not friendly enough for new linux users, nor for those who come from the Windows world (like my parents). Not to mention, several of the Gnome maintainers are rude, patronising gits who think they know what's best for us. If I wanted that attitude, I'd have stuck with Apple or Microsoft. Then someone responded: No no no, you've just failed to understand the genius of their design, which is proof itself that you don't know what you're talking about. ;) just in case it's needed... And the first person said: No, I caught the sarcasm from the beginning. And it's almost like you wrote their Mission Statement for them. So you can say that Ubuntu is not going back to Gnome 3. They never were at Gnome 3. They just stayed with the under the hood developments while never ever using Gnome 3 itself. They are also not returning to Gnome 2. They are returning to Gnome 3, which is not a return.... but a departure.
@@justaturd2130 Thanks for the extra background. Change for the sake of change generally has one descriptor: marketing. If it's not that, then somebody is running a squirrels nest. I had a family member who was an engineer [I forget his forte, but think it was chemical...he was smart enough to tackle anything from civil to nuclear], who came to firmly believe after years of work one simple truth: there should only be one engineer heading a project. No exceptions - committes are for forming policy. Does that work for software? I don't know [not a coder], but it sure rings true for manufacturing/construction. Collaborative engineering ventures are fine for academia where results can be elastic and deadlines aren't as huge a taskmaster, but that's for writing whitepapers or grants - not meeting the market/serving a customer who will take their money and go do something else when focus is lost and slippage becomes the norm.
Call me old-fashioned, but I hate Gnome 3 even more than Unity-and I hate the latter with a passion! I can't stand it. The main UI of apps consists of random buttons mashed together in a sort of deformed creature born from a title bar and a toolbar. The fools took the single worst piece of UI from Mac OS X-iTunes-and made an entire desktop out of it. It's chaotic, buggy and incomprehensible. They went as far as removing all menus, all text and even the button tooltips! What are we supposed to do? Click random icons to understand what they do? "Oh, this one appears to delete the document you are working on. Oh snap." That kind of UI design is barely tolerable on phones, if understandable, giving the device limitations (fat fingers + small screens = not a lot of room for communication.) On a PC it's inexcusable. Right now I'm running Mint Cinnamon on two machines and I'm trying Mint Xfce on a third. The reason I use Mint instead of Ubuntu is that they go out of their way to replace as much Gnome 3 as possible with traditional-looking apps, with menus and toolbars.
I'd say Canonical made the biggest mistake deciding to develop their own desktop server Mir, instead of contributing to Wayland. At the time several other distros already decided to use wayland, had they chosen it also, the development would have been done a lot faster and the bugs worked out quicker since the whole community would be working on a single project. Now as for Unity, I don't quite understand all the hate it gets. Now, people who are used to what they have been using and don't want to switch, fine. But it is (was) a very usable DE, easy to use, the launcher works, and at least personally I haven't experienced any major bugs. The top bar is actually very useful with indicator-multiload, hardware sensors indicators, and so on. Recently trying Fedora's Gnome 3 I ran into several major bugs with Gnome right away. Like indicator-multiload first not working, then covering over the clock, then you need another plugin to move the clock (why??), and several other indicators just plain refuse to work. And what's with the indicator drawer on the bottom left that you have to manually open and close? That was all in the top bar on Unity, and it just worked. Not to mention the resource hogging, and what's with the tracker-miner and gnome-software shit? I don't want that, why can't I uninstall it?
I only just recently installed a lighter Desktop Enviornment on my old Ubuntu 12.04 install, because Unity was getting a little too slow (REALLY old hardware), but before about a month ago, I had been running Unity since 2013, and while it did drive me crazy sometimes, I'm a bit nostalgic for it, because it was my first Linux experience. I feel Unity is like that friend where you're constantly busting their chops, but you're still friends with them, so seeing it leave is like losing a friend in a way, so I can't help but feel a little sad.
"Convergence" is the biggest miscalculation in computer history. It should have been pretty obvious to these people that it makes no sense to have the same GUI for a 5" phone touch screen as a 65" smart-TV. It's like Harley Davidson would start using steering wheels on their motorcycles "to make the driving experience more familiar to people used to driving cars".
Gnome has come a long, long way. It's actually a very stable and efficient graphical shell. And rather pretty too, I think -especially with a few community supplied tweaks and themes. I love it. Using -v 3.18.5 on my daily driver. I really am bummed about the dropping of Ubuntu Phone and Tablet support/focus though... It's a real shame... We really do need an open source presence in the mobile device market!
That's not quite true for me since I customised Unity quite a bit and as far as I'm aware I can't do these things on Gnome. Or does something along the lines of Unity Tweak tool exist for Gnome? Also I really like Compiz and I at least think you can't use Compiz with Gnome (at least not without major problems). Please tell me if I'm misinformed!
I've switched to using cinnamon on my ubuntu. Unfortunately I'm dealing with a graphical glitch where the desktop seams to load visually as if both unity and cinnamon are running whenever I load from standby. Everything else runs fine.
Now if only Gnome would get their people weened off the drugged koolaid.. Gnome should be replaced with Mate and we'll just pretend that Gnome Shell never happened.
Luis Díaz total bullshit. KDE is too heavy. And lacks features. Gnome 3 atleast is modern. looks modern works great with touchscreens too. Better HiDPI support than KDE. Multitouch en touch in general works better on Gnome. Workflow is much better in Gnome I can go on and on how bad KDE is and how better Gnome is. It's an easy choice to choose Gnome above KDE. It's just clear logic used to come to that dicision.
I don't what kind of logic you're using. You have to install a ton of extensions to make GNOME usable, and even if they all work nicely together - which they don't - it still looks like crap. When I install KDE, I usually change the wallpaper and the fonts, and I'm done. If you want lightweight KDE, use KDE neon. If you want usable GNOME, use MATE.
@Joe Collins In Gnome 3 (aka Gnome shell, now on will write just Gnome) you can remove the top bar totally if you want(or just make it autohide, or hide on shortcut and so on), also all aspects of the top bar(or Gnome overall) you can change/modify. Also a correction Gnome has had the menu bar at top since i remember it comming out, same with the unified os for everything, Gnome 3 was creaated because of it. For people who can not code/program can use extensions.gnome.org/ to add/get 1 click install extensions to change the functionality of gnome to fit their needs better. (Was full time user for years before and a bit after gnome 3 came out, it was a mess for few years so i had to use windows for a bit to get my work done, currently 50/50, would be more if fedora would have good long support cycle. )
hate the look of unity i use Linux mint cinnamon on my laptop because i love the look of it and the os runs really good on the older core 2 duo laptop with 3gb ram and 80gb hdd but i did love the original GNOME back when i found a cd of ubuntu in 2006 when i bought a stack of pc games from a school gala for $5 then i found you could send away for free cds so i would always send away for so many free cds for all my old pc i used to use ubuntu but now i use Linux mint my main pc still uses windows 7 tho
I always have dual boot Windows and Linux. When I 1st saw 'new' Gnome, it was so hideous for me, I stopped booting/working on Linux. I restart working on Linux after the release of Ubuntu with Unity.
um with the right extentions you can hide or even remove the top bar in GS in my setup the the top bar only shows when a the focused window doesnt cover it or if i press the windows key.
I assume the reason why open source OS is not able to make headway in the cellphone world is because the carriers (at+t, verizon,sprint,etc) make it especially hard to do so?
No, He changed because of UNITY Not the base. I say that because now he is willing to come back and the only thing they are changing is Unity to Gnome. So that shoots down your better system theory.
i used ubuntu when it was part of the Gnome 2. Like the technology that Ubuntu has put out but after seeing the touch and smart devices take over. I started feeling behind the times trying to stay in the always push the start button and kick around the desktop icons. Once I change my ways the clean interface that Gnome 3 brings actually allowed me to get things done better and I keep projects in the virtual space on the right. I will probably switch to Ubuntu as a work station now that the switch is coming. Maybe some of the Ubuntu technology will spread across all of gnome. My gnome top bar has app menu, Places, app preferences, day month time, to do app, weather app, clip board, network, and control panel It does alot but yet takes up so little space. The entire desktop gets to be used for a single app in horizonal mode or two apps in side by side mode which is really cool. You really only see the apps in gnome 3 which makes for a clean well organized desktop. I like the ways the app icons come up just like android. Gnome went to this because the windows way is out and android \ ios is in. Things are different now. I see my files on my phone the same on Gnome 3. My desktop last 3 to 4 times longer than my phone or tablet which is why I use linux and its on a nice big 1080p monitor.
Replacing Unity with Gnome was one of the best things I've done to Ubuntu. Unity looks outdated, has fewer customization options and seems not to get that many meaningful updates lately. I understand people that prefer it and are more familiar with it might feel like there isn't a replacement similar to it, though.
the gnome top-bar seems crazy, is it just there as a placeholder awaiting extensions? Would apple freak out if it featured globalmenu by default? a whole panel just for the time seems absurd.
Sascha vloggt I have never quite gotten the difference between Debian and Ubuntu for 99% of things they seem to be exactly the same just with a different desktop environment by default. I run Debian on my home server and Ubuntu dual booted with win 10 on my main pc. But I still consider my self to be somewhat of a noob so if anyone who knows more would like to answer I would be happy to listen.
Ubuntu is based on Debian, meaning that it shares a lot of the base code. This is different to being forked. Ubuntu is designed to be more usable out of the box and require less configuring and tweaking than Debian and have a much larger dependancy on the GUI. Consequently they still share the same package repositories and use the same package tool (APT advanced package tool). I personally use Debian core as my main OS but I dabble in Arch (which uses pacman for packages) and Funtoo (based on Gentoo, uses portage/emerge).
I beg to differ. The Antergos installer is a pain in the neck, it hangs right at the end of the process - though it does recover - and the system you're left with at the end isn't half as nice as Manjaro. The only thing I don't like about Manjaro is that recent versions of the installer have dropped LVM support.
That seems to be for you, that bug, even in a VM I didn't experience any bugs in the Antergos installer (pretty slow but I guess it's because of the VM)
I've tried Antergos in a VM on a Mac, on a ThinkPad with an SSD, the same ThinkPad with a hard disk, and the same ThinkPad in a VM. The speed is probably due to downloading all the software fresh whilst it's installing, not the VM. The other bug happens in all three.
It's more a "return to the origin". Ubuntu did use gnome from the start, and are now returning to gnome after a sidetrack on the unity. One of the reasons to why I left ubuntu a while back, was due to unity.
USB to DisplayPort or HDMI for a big responsive display, and BlueTooth for a proper keyboard and mouse. How to change the phone shell, though? I love all system stuff in a single bar on the left, with my clearly labeled windows snapping over the rest of the displays.
It is really sad to hear. Unity is what makes Ubuntu unique. Ubuntu may end up being like every other Linux distribution and that may hurt Ubuntu or who knows it may not.
Sure, but Unity is what makes Ubuntu and the experience of using Ubuntu unique. If you take the other Ubuntu based distros. Ubuntu-MATE, Lubuntu, Xubuntu, Kubuntu etc. you have the same DEs in many Arch, Debian based distros and Fedora, Opensuse ... and the experience of using those DEs in other distros is really similar. Unity is not the same. I wonder though whether a separate team will create a Ubuntu Unity fork when Ubuntu switch to Gnome, or whether that is at all possible??
Yeah I don't get it either. If you compared it to cars it would be like buying a Toyota Tercel. Changing all the emblems. logos, lights , dashboard and style lines just so it would look and act just like a Honda Accord. Why didn't you just buy the damn Honda Accord? lol. That is what I don't get about the community. You like Arch that is fine but Ubuntu doesn't need to be another Arch. Stop already
Personally I prefer it. People who are good at developing desktop environments should do those and people who are good at Ubuntu should do that. The reason Linux works better than other OSs is because the division of labour works for everyone, not one distro.
Ryan Smith Problem??? You mean you actually want your freedom regulated? Each to their own I guess, and luckily there's plenty of regulation on the Mac and windows spyware OSes.
Here on arch been missing unity but did not want to pull down all the older gnome deps to install it. I was holding out for unity 8 and was going to switch to that :( . Hopefully at the very least we get the hud in gnome shell
How would this effect the Ubuntu repositories mainly for Linux Lite that runs an xfce desktop? Clarify they are dropping Gnome, or is this the beginning of the end for Ubuntu altogether?
It would have no effect on Linux Lite or any other distro based on Ubuntu. No one but Ubuntu uses the Unity Desktop and the other projects they dropped have little to do with Base Ubuntu. :)
+SJP I still run Debian Wheezy on all of my systems right now. So I have not used Systemd yet. I want to setup a test machine to try it out. I've never used it. I don't do anything fancy with my init anyways, so I don't know if it would matter, or not, to me. As long as a machine boots.
that just a desktop environment how on earth it implies to end of ubuntu which is a linux distribution. Guess you mastered the art of clickbaiting over the years
Midsummer light not clickbate... 'end of Ubuntu _as we know it_ ' they aren't doing touch development, that's a massive shift. They are focusing on IoT and cloud, desktop could be a side project now but we'll have to see how they get behind gnome/ Wayland/ KDE mobile.....
That's like saying that if Microsoft dropped the Windows shell and installed an X version instead Windows wouldn't change, after all, Windows is just a desktop environment, but it wouldn't be the end of Windows, which is a Windows distribution.
Gnome 3, Unity, Cinnamon and the buggy MATE were the things that kept me away from all those distros, force me to know better linux and go with Arch and Openbox, where things make more sense from a terminal guys perspective.
Could you do a video on OpenBSD as well? Just like Windows taught me to appreciate Linux, Linux taught me to appreciate OpenBSD. OpenBSD - the world's simplest and most secure Unix-like OS. Creator of the world's most used SSH implementation OpenSSH, the most elegant firewall PF, the mail server OpenSMTPD, the webserver httpd, the OpenSSL rewrite LibreSSL, and a whole bunch of other projects. OpenBSD - the cleanest kernel, the cleanest userland and the cleanest configuration syntax.
Wow I remember when all this Unity stuff was very new hat... I was still under the impression it still was. BLINK 7 years later... and now old-hat is new hat again!
The beauty of Linux is that you can use whatever desktop you prefer. Heck, I still have two dedicated test systems running with Openlook. I guess since one of the top ten queries on the Ubuntu forums was "How do I install XXX Desktop on Ubuntu YY.ZZ", someone at Canonical finally got the hint that Unity wasn't all that liked. I still maintain the source code for 13 different X11 environments - of which GNOME and KDE are simply variants. Sometimes you don't really need a Windows clone.
Midsummer light I'm aware. When he mentioned how there hasn't been a successful push for open source in the phone market, I think he forgot Android is open source.
Kyle A I think Android as we know it is so fully integrated with the closed source Google Services that it no longer can be considered an open source platform. No one runs vanilla AOSP.
Ubuntu is greater than the sum of it's parts, Unity, Mir,and Ubuntu touch were part of of Mark's grand scheme for convergence.He is absolutely right to dump these costly ventures as anyone who follows Tech news knows the whole idea of convergence was a grand one but basically died due to lack of interest from the PC community. Ubuntu will make a brief return to the Gnome desktop than will shake thing's up once more with refreshing and innovative concept's and functionality.
Debian 8 "jessie" comes standard with Gnome 3, and I found Gnome 3 so horrible to work with that I switched to another DE. Only Gnome Shell extensions make Gnome 3 more usable - but only because it makes Gnome 3 look and work like Gnome 2. Is there much difference between Unity and Gnome 3?
Nan cohesiveness between distros is the main reason I hate Linux regardless of the distro. I am a recent hopeful Linux user but after having tried Ubuntu men's q4os and others they are drive me crazy and have such simple errors that take long time if even possible to repair. Maybe Linux is more secure but there's a user coming recently from Windows XP and also Windows 7 the migration from Windows XP to Windows 7 is far easier than getting into the various distros of linux. I want to use my computer as a tool I don't want to use my time trying to perfect the tool. And your software is so bad and your fans are so unclear compare two windows. My low level recommendation is for all of your Linux groups to get together and Deeside on one and only one distro that will be called Linux desktop period!!!!! so after having spent two so after having spent two or three hundred hours and various distros and the differences between programs I am basically finished with Linux as a daily driver and I hope you can pass this alarm to all the various Linux teams!!! Develop one desktop concentrate improving the programs!!!!! I've said enough to indicate my absolute frustration and differences between all your distributions.
As a linux user, this makes me sad. The difference between the distros is trivial. The difference is usually only the desktop manager. The desktop manager really has nothing to do with linux. You can have one installed, or dozens and swap between them. The 'applications' and 'shortcuts' are almost pointless. Almost every linux user runs out of a terminal all of the time.
I cannot agree with you LESS!! The DESKTOP should be universal across linux!!! This is the FIRST thing that should be agreed between the teams. Why not take the "teams" and reorganize them into a cohesive one version linux or ok have an option for versions that use less ram etc. If linux wants to attract Windows users this IS a MUST in my opinion. Here's a link that solved a simple clock problem when dual booting from Win and Linux. This took me near 2 hours to finally fix linux distro and also with other distros but had to do it by terminal and then i could not remember how i did it before. Why not write in your code to make it compaticble with windows and/or mac clocks?? here is the link that I just now implemented and it indeed seemed (so far) to fix the issue. www.webupd8.org/2014/09/dual-boot-fix-time-differences-between.html
Because the desktop has nothing to do with linux. Its not built in like it is with windows. Its just an app. You can change it out, install more than one, or not have one at all. Its like saying 'we have to agree on which calculator app we are going to use or else we cant use linux'. Its insane.
Linux' power is in its freedom and variety. You can't really choose one desktop, because 10% of users prefer other things. And this is fine. Linux is fine. I work, play, browse and do other stuff on Linux in the past 10 years. My mother used Linux without a problem. I didn't have to babysit her computer, unlike when she used Windows. And she liked Linux more than Windows. Linux is not perfect, but it doesn't pretend to be. It doesn't closed you down. People didn't like KDE 4 back then, so they switched. Then Gnome 3 came along, they didn't like it, so they switched. Microsoft says: "You have to use this." - And people switch to, or try Linux. :)
10.04 User here. Started from 9.04 Karmic koala due to booting and wifi issues at that time. I have a DVD remastered copy with normal everyday apps pre-installed. Although it's old, it works perfectly. I still use it on desktops and laptops.
There is quality control for that, they should just hire more testers instead of using common people as testers. On windows 7 too, just because there is no this mobile crap yet. (Actually because people recommended me it over windows 8, but I'm glad I'm not wasting my time on it)
Yeah, the only official Ubuntu I've really used is Ubuntu Mate, which of course means that even though I missed Gnome 2 I probably would have been one of those ticked at the Gnome Project for Gnome 3 since I love Mate. Still, it does sadden me that I'll never get to have an Ubuntu phone. Granted, part of the reason other than apps that it didn't take off was the very small area the phones that were released came out in. I think they were, like what, just in India or something?
Convergence made sense when it was conceived. But technology changes rapidly and you have to adapt to overcome competition. There's a good chance that in the next 5 years, smartphones and tablets will be a thing of the past while AR moves in to fill that space. Might as well focus on the market that matters most with Ubuntu: the Desktop/Server market.
The original source of the news is Mark Shuttleworth's announcement he made on insights.ubuntu.com (although it is not listed on insights.ubuntu.com/canonical-announcements). I hoped I could track the original source to April Fool's, but Wikipedia entry on Ubuntu Touch seems to confirm that this in true. I happen to own the BQ Aquaris E5, Ubuntu Edition, which was the second phone to ever come out with preinstalled Ubuntu.
There are so many Desktops out there and Unity was clearly not loved as much as Ubuntu would have liked. They took their eye off the desktop with the attempt at mobile and that ultimately hurt them. Gnome is lovely and one of the reasons why i left the 'Ubuntu-like' distros. Mate is well developed and so id KDE. Those 3 desktops are hard to go up against and cover most of the user's wants and needs. Hopefully this will help the Gnome/Mate/KDE groups and have Ubuntu focus on something else
Somebody needs to fork Unity and resume work on Unity 7, taking it out of maintenance mode and back into development mode to answer the criticisms. Like you, I've been using it since 2012. It sure started out lousy, but its better than adequate now. Been on a tour of available GUIs and they are all really, really decent! Just tried out the Lubuntu desktop again and was amazed how great it was. I think KDE gets my preference right now by a very slight margin. With GUIs the more great ones we have, the better off the user is.
Happy to see Gnome come back! - I learned on GNome, and really, the title for me would be "Ubuntu is going back to its roots" :P, but guess it depends what you first used.
You can never beat the Gnome 2 Desktop Environment that shipped on earlier Ubuntu versions up to Ubuntu 11.04 I still run Ubuntu 8.04 in a VMWare Fusion virtual environment complete with Gnome 2. Lightweight, Slick and Rock Solid Stable.
I know I keep trying to install Ubunto Gnome 16.10 on a virtual machine and I put it on twice but could not sign in or could I use my keyboard so I give up on Gnome I have a great time with Pearl Gnome it works good but do not know how to put Chrome on it
I like your video, Joe, and not trying to knock it ... but there is far too much line-blurring going on between what is the OS, the Distro, and the GUI. The Desktop, GUI, or Launcher *should* be the most trivial thing about any distribution. Lots of older folks would love it if their new Winders 10 could look like Windows 3.0 with which they are familiar. Microsoft does not give them that choice. Conform! Thankfully, with Linux distros, I can run FVWM like it was 1993, anytime!
I'm kind of glad. I loved Ubuntu's Unity and Linux Mint equally. Unity reminds me a bit of OS X. Mint reminds me a bit of Windows. Both did such a great job I was always torn between which to use and always ended up dual booting. Now with Gnome which I feel adds their own spin to the worst of OS X and Windows (few reasons mentioned in this video) my decision is much easier! I'll probably give Gnome another shot when they switch but it'll be from a VM in Linux Mint.
I migrated to Manjaro Linux with the Cinnamon DE a year ago. With pacman and yaourt, you have access to pretty much any software you want. It is light, and best of all, it's built on Arch. :)
Interesting that two big companies tried this "convergence" idea and eventually abandoned it. There was Microsoft with Windows 8 and then Canonical who followed suit. On the other hand, Apple said from the very beginning that the convergence concept was inherently flawed and would never work. Apple's foresight saved themselves a ton of wasted money.
Doesn't GNOME 3 go even further on the path of convergence? At first sight it's basically Android on PC. When you look closer you see it's flexible and can be turned into something close to traditional desktop. Anyway, when I was considering switching to Linux I ended up choosing Xfce and KDE came very close second.
how superficial can anyone get?! changing just the look and feel of the desktop is not changing the o/s, but a step forward in the development of Ubuntu as a user-friendly system.
Tablets and phones are clunky as hell for any kind of general purpose computing. Nothing like a big monitor, mouse and keyboard to actually get things done.
This doesn't mean Ubuntu is coming to an end, it just means they're ditching the Unity UI and going back to Gnome. I always install XFCE anyway which is the UI I prefer. I've been using Mint with XFCE for the longest time. Even if the company that owns Ubuntu poofs, another team will just pick up the code.
I started using Ubuntu way before Unity even existed, back when they'd ship free live CDs for everyone, which I still own. Seems like a step in the right direction. Now, Fedora must do the same with Wayland.
Crimson Sunrise: what do you by, "Fedora must do the same with Wayland". I believe you meant X11. Like Unity, X11 has outlived its usefulness and needs to be set aside. Wayland is Today AND the future. Fedora is backed by RHEL along with ANYTHING pertaining to GNOME development. In all fairness though, I neither care for GNOME or UNITY. I live the "Plasma Life" w/ KDE and I've never looked back!!!
Right now, Wayland has several issues:
- It has performance issues because it uses pixel rasterization.
- There's no possibility of a reliable RDP protocol when your rendering is based of sending chunks of the screen.
- Every single GUI toolkit and application must implement their own dpi scaling and font anti-aliasing.
- The guys doing Wayland don't want to implement a standard for dpi scaling and font aliasing on their server.
Dpi scaling and font anti-aliasing is not the responsibility of app developers, it's the display server's responsibility. This is lazyness. Lazyness that shouldn't be awarded.
Crimson Sunrise is there any "Professional" reason they're not implementing these features? I would think there has to be some real reason why Wayland has been built this way beyond....laziness.
Rasterization - What would the alternative be?
RDP - I thought it sent just windows, not the entire screen area? Because if that is the case that is *really* sloppy programming.
Font and DPI - No problem. Games are used to it by now, and 99.999% of the other applications use either GTK or QT.
I am certain these issues will be resolved eventually.
Hi, GPU driver dev for Linux here. Please do some research before telling people these things.
Pixel rasterization is one of the last step in literally every known graphics pipeline. It is the method by which we take vertices and fragments, generated by the earlier stages of whichever pipeline you happen to be using, and translate it into pixels so that it may be displayed as an image on the monitor. Tl;dr: rasterization is not an optional feature, it's mandatory and yes, X uses rasterization as well.
As for the second thing: you have things mixed up. For one, RDP could still be implemented on a backend that relies on sending client damage (or as you called it, "chunks of the screen"), there is nothing about this that would impede that. Secondly, sending damaged surfaces back and forth between client and server is an essential part of how -X- works, not Wayland. Wayland does have a concept of damage for surfaces, but because Wayland also avoids sending surfaces back and forth through the use of shared memory we don't have to resend every damaged portion of a surface on update. Additionally, there are wayland compositors with RDP backends already.
Re: font anti-aliasing not being handled by the "server": basically every modern X application (e.g. GTK+ ones, Qt, Enlightenment, etc.) does not use X's font rendering, it's already client-side and has been client-side for quite a long time now. This is no different from Wayland.
Re: DPI scaling not being handled by the "server": Actually, X does not handle DPI scaling for it's applications either. The only thing it does is pass down the DPI of the current display to the client, and the client handles the rest. This is no different then Wayland.
And finally: I put server in quotations because Wayland is not a server; it is a common protocol that compositors are expected to implement so that applications can run flexibly on other DEs in the same manner they did with X. The equivalent term for X server in wayland terms would be "compositor".
Still clickbait.
The title should be "The end of the Unity desktop as we know it"
True, a clickbait
tru
I have seen 2 videos of this subject and this is the most detailed explanation video of why this is going on.
Absolutely agree. The best video on this topic so far. Well done. I've never been a fan of Unity, but at least they were trying something different, reaching, and being ambitious. Sad to see that fail.
I also wonder if seeing Samsung ready to ship, in a few weeks, tens of millions of new S8's with what is, by all accounts from early reviews, a smooth and well done Android convergence to desktop with Dex had some role in their decision...
Guys... Gnome 3 truly shines in all it's glory when you use extensions: Caffeine, Dash to Dock, Media Player Indicator, Removable Drive Menu, Suspend button, Workspaces to dock. These are just a few honorable mentions but there are many more, it is a very flexible platform.
So what happens to Ubuntu Gnome....kinda makes it redundant with Ubuntu switching to Gnome in the future. Does it die after the next LTS, these questions need answers.
Maybe they should switch to maintaining Unity ;-)
im expecting that too janne
Probably Ubuntu Gnome will become Ubuntu and what's currently Ubuntu will go away. I hope for 17.10 they make this switch, maybe keep old Ubuntu as an Ubuntu Unity spin for a few cycles.
I heard Ubuntu Gnome was going to be discontinued with the release of Ubuntu 18.04
Unity7 has been alright for me, the only issues I have with it is compiz bugs and crashing. Partly why I am a bit sad at the loss of unity8, because it was going to be rewritten in Qt.
Perfect marketing; no mention of the key phrase, *_"We made a mistake."_*
So ubuntu is going BACK to gnome? the end or back to the beginning?
But Gnome 3 is not the same as Gnome 2.
Back when the maintainer of the Akonadi/Kontact packages in Fedora stepped down in 2015 because it had become such a huge mess someone wrote:
Gnome does nothing but change for the sake of change, not
for any sort of 'evolutionary' reason. That's a dogma I can't stand. Gnome
is not friendly enough for new linux users, nor for those who come from the
Windows world (like my parents). Not to mention, several of the Gnome
maintainers are rude, patronising gits who think they know what's best for
us. If I wanted that attitude, I'd have stuck with Apple or Microsoft.
Then someone responded:
No no no, you've just failed to understand the genius of their design,
which is proof itself that you don't know what you're talking about.
;) just in case it's needed...
And the first person said:
No, I caught the sarcasm from the beginning. And it's almost like you
wrote their Mission Statement for them.
So you can say that Ubuntu is not going back to Gnome 3. They never were at Gnome 3. They just stayed with the under the hood developments while never ever using Gnome 3 itself. They are also not returning to Gnome 2. They are returning to Gnome 3, which is not a return.... but a departure.
@@justaturd2130 Thanks for the extra background. Change for the sake of change generally has one descriptor: marketing. If it's not that, then somebody is running a squirrels nest. I had a family member who was an engineer [I forget his forte, but think it was chemical...he was smart enough to tackle anything from civil to nuclear], who came to firmly believe after years of work one simple truth: there should only be one engineer heading a project. No exceptions - committes are for forming policy. Does that work for software? I don't know [not a coder], but it sure rings true for manufacturing/construction. Collaborative engineering ventures are fine for academia where results can be elastic and deadlines aren't as huge a taskmaster, but that's for writing whitepapers or grants - not meeting the market/serving a customer who will take their money and go do something else when focus is lost and slippage becomes the norm.
Call me old-fashioned, but I hate Gnome 3 even more than Unity-and I hate the latter with a passion! I can't stand it. The main UI of apps consists of random buttons mashed together in a sort of deformed creature born from a title bar and a toolbar. The fools took the single worst piece of UI from Mac OS X-iTunes-and made an entire desktop out of it.
It's chaotic, buggy and incomprehensible. They went as far as removing all menus, all text and even the button tooltips! What are we supposed to do? Click random icons to understand what they do? "Oh, this one appears to delete the document you are working on. Oh snap." That kind of UI design is barely tolerable on phones, if understandable, giving the device limitations (fat fingers + small screens = not a lot of room for communication.) On a PC it's inexcusable.
Right now I'm running Mint Cinnamon on two machines and I'm trying Mint Xfce on a third. The reason I use Mint instead of Ubuntu is that they go out of their way to replace as much Gnome 3 as possible with traditional-looking apps, with menus and toolbars.
I'd say Canonical made the biggest mistake deciding to develop their own desktop server Mir, instead of contributing to Wayland. At the time several other distros already decided to use wayland, had they chosen it also, the development would have been done a lot faster and the bugs worked out quicker since the whole community would be working on a single project.
Now as for Unity, I don't quite understand all the hate it gets. Now, people who are used to what they have been using and don't want to switch, fine. But it is (was) a very usable DE, easy to use, the launcher works, and at least personally I haven't experienced any major bugs. The top bar is actually very useful with indicator-multiload, hardware sensors indicators, and so on.
Recently trying Fedora's Gnome 3 I ran into several major bugs with Gnome right away. Like indicator-multiload first not working, then covering over the clock, then you need another plugin to move the clock (why??), and several other indicators just plain refuse to work. And what's with the indicator drawer on the bottom left that you have to manually open and close? That was all in the top bar on Unity, and it just worked. Not to mention the resource hogging, and what's with the tracker-miner and gnome-software shit? I don't want that, why can't I uninstall it?
I only just recently installed a lighter Desktop Enviornment on my old Ubuntu 12.04 install, because Unity was getting a little too slow (REALLY old hardware), but before about a month ago, I had been running Unity since 2013, and while it did drive me crazy sometimes, I'm a bit nostalgic for it, because it was my first Linux experience. I feel Unity is like that friend where you're constantly busting their chops, but you're still friends with them, so seeing it leave is like losing a friend in a way, so I can't help but feel a little sad.
"Convergence" is the biggest miscalculation in computer history. It should have been pretty obvious to these people that it makes no sense to have the same GUI for a 5" phone touch screen as a 65" smart-TV. It's like Harley Davidson would start using steering wheels on their motorcycles "to make the driving experience more familiar to people used to driving cars".
Gnome has come a long, long way. It's actually a very stable and efficient graphical shell. And rather pretty too, I think -especially with a few community supplied tweaks and themes. I love it. Using -v 3.18.5 on my daily driver.
I really am bummed about the dropping of Ubuntu Phone and Tablet support/focus though... It's a real shame... We really do need an open source presence in the mobile device market!
Templars1005 We have android AOSP in the mobile market, right?
The "useless bar"/"time" is actually your callendar and notification area... it seems you haven't used the gnome3 for a while now.
Thank Christ.. I've hated unity ever since it was first forced upon us.
You can make the top bar in Gnome go away - it is an extension called "Hide top bar"
I actualy like unity, like it's windows, the global menu, workspaces, top bar, I love it! The problem is it's bugs =\
Same here :D
why don't you use cinnamon instead
You will like gnome probably more then. It's all around just better and uses the same tools (like settings, nautilus and other tools, etc)
That's not quite true for me since I customised Unity quite a bit and as far as I'm aware I can't do these things on Gnome. Or does something along the lines of Unity Tweak tool exist for Gnome? Also I really like Compiz and I at least think you can't use Compiz with Gnome (at least not without major problems). Please tell me if I'm misinformed!
yes. Gnome-tweak-tool. Why do you like compiz?
I've switched to using cinnamon on my ubuntu. Unfortunately I'm dealing with a graphical glitch where the desktop seams to load visually as if both unity and cinnamon are running whenever I load from standby. Everything else runs fine.
the death of the the Unity desktop makes me happy hello Gnome
Now if only Gnome would get their people weened off the drugged koolaid.. Gnome should be replaced with Mate and we'll just pretend that Gnome Shell never happened.
Exactly what I was thinking.
What doesn't make me happy is that they shift to Gnome while it would be much better shifting to KDE
Luis Díaz total bullshit. KDE is too heavy. And lacks features. Gnome 3 atleast is modern. looks modern works great with touchscreens too. Better HiDPI support than KDE. Multitouch en touch in general works better on Gnome. Workflow is much better in Gnome I can go on and on how bad KDE is and how better Gnome is. It's an easy choice to choose Gnome above KDE. It's just clear logic used to come to that dicision.
I don't what kind of logic you're using. You have to install a ton of extensions to make GNOME usable, and even if they all work nicely together - which they don't - it still looks like crap. When I install KDE, I usually change the wallpaper and the fonts, and I'm done. If you want lightweight KDE, use KDE neon. If you want usable GNOME, use MATE.
Just use xfce. It's the most lightweight desktop that isn't actually annoying to use.
Personally I just use a command line 😅
yeah arguing over how the icons are placed on the window is ridiculous.
+Midsummer light
what matters is Mir vs Wayland.
me too
Do you mean that you have dropped the GUI completely (like me) or that you have your dm and wm but mostly use a terminal emulator for everything.
Finn Driver Mostly just use server distros, so no GUI. I use Windows on my main computer though.
@Joe Collins
In Gnome 3 (aka Gnome shell, now on will write just Gnome) you can remove the top bar totally if you want(or just make it autohide, or hide on shortcut and so on), also all aspects of the top bar(or Gnome overall) you can change/modify.
Also a correction Gnome has had the menu bar at top since i remember it comming out, same with the unified os for everything, Gnome 3 was creaated because of it.
For people who can not code/program can use extensions.gnome.org/ to add/get 1 click install extensions to change the functionality of gnome to fit their needs better.
(Was full time user for years before and a bit after gnome 3 came out, it was a mess for few years so i had to use windows for a bit to get my work done, currently 50/50, would be more if fedora would have good long support cycle. )
Good. I always hate Unity. It was complete crap! That;s why I abandoned Gnome and went to XCFE.
unity is better than gnome 3 imo, is sluggish and slow on older systems, I use the i3wm anyway personally
So you abandoned GNOME when you were talking about Unity?
hate the look of unity i use Linux mint cinnamon on my laptop because i love the look of it and the os runs really good on the older core 2 duo laptop with 3gb ram and 80gb hdd but i did love the original GNOME back when i found a cd of ubuntu in 2006 when i bought a stack of pc games from a school gala for $5 then i found you could send away for free cds so i would always send away for so many free cds for all my old pc i used to use ubuntu but now i use Linux mint my main pc still uses windows 7 tho
I'm glad they dropped it, unity was a bit of a shite.
I always have dual boot Windows and Linux.
When I 1st saw 'new' Gnome, it was so hideous for me, I stopped booting/working on Linux.
I restart working on Linux after the release of Ubuntu with Unity.
I am perfectly fine with it, always hated Unity preffered Gnome when using linux.
um with the right extentions you can hide or even remove the top bar in GS
in my setup the the top bar only shows when a the focused window doesnt cover it or if i press the windows key.
I think the worst news that Joe presented was the phone situation. Android or Apple? Gonnoreah or Syphillis?
Mic Mal agreed!
Lol that's truth!!!
Mic Mal Have you heard about the project aiming to make a fully free android derivative? It's called Replicant I believe. Looks interesting.
No I haven't. I will check it out!! Thank you.
also Plasma (KDE) for mobile. But they are using ubuntu phone as a base I think though
I installed i3wm and stopped worrying about desktops. Gnome stack underneath for the switchable graphics and KDE apps because they are the best
Unity sux.. Glad to welcome back gnome!!!
I never liked Unity in the first place, so this is happy news for me. It saves me from installing Ubuntu Gnome.
Exactly!!
Yep! Unity is one of the reasons I actually even stopped using Ubuntu!
True but Gnome 3 is just as bad though Mate all the way.
I guess it's really a matter of opinion in the end. But Gnome 3 does have 'Classic Mode' which is pretty similar to Gnome 2.
I assume the reason why open source OS is not able to make headway in the cellphone world is because the carriers (at+t, verizon,sprint,etc) make it especially hard to do so?
just yesterday i decided to switch to fedora because i didn't like the philosophy of unity and mir! what a coincidence!
now i might reconsider...
Why? if you like Fedora and it's working WHY would you change?
Bill Miller better system...
No, He changed because of UNITY Not the base. I say that because now he is willing to come back and the only thing they are changing is Unity to Gnome. So that shoots down your better system theory.
Here0s0Johnny Fedora is the best though! Don't go back!
i used ubuntu when it was part of the Gnome 2. Like the technology that Ubuntu has put out but after seeing the touch and smart devices take over. I started feeling behind the times trying to stay in the always push the start button and kick around the desktop icons. Once I change my ways the clean interface that Gnome 3 brings actually allowed me to get things done better and I keep projects in the virtual space on the right. I will probably switch to Ubuntu as a work station now that the switch is coming. Maybe some of the Ubuntu technology will spread across all of gnome. My gnome top bar has app menu, Places, app preferences, day month time, to do app, weather app, clip board, network, and control panel It does alot but yet takes up so little space. The entire desktop gets to be used for a single app in horizonal mode or two apps in side by side mode which is really cool. You really only see the apps in gnome 3 which makes for a clean well organized desktop. I like the ways the app icons come up just like android.
Gnome went to this because the windows way is out and android \ ios is in. Things are different now. I see my files on my phone the same on Gnome 3. My desktop last 3 to 4 times longer than my phone or tablet which is why I use linux and its on a nice big 1080p monitor.
damn it ! and i just installed ubuntu 16.04 yesterday !
Don't worry. 16.04 is supported until 2021. Thet'll give them plenty of time to smooth out any bumps with Gnome. :)
Joe Collins thanks man , also thanks god i've found this amazing channel with an amazing content . keep it up . ☺👍👍👍
First video of yours that I've seen. You're a very good speaker. Have a Thumbs Up!
I switched to linuxmint because of unity
Probably going to stay because of Gnome Shell.
Ubuntu 18.04 LTS is really coming.
i switched to linuxmint because of gnome
Replacing Unity with Gnome was one of the best things I've done to Ubuntu. Unity looks outdated, has fewer customization options and seems not to get that many meaningful updates lately. I understand people that prefer it and are more familiar with it might feel like there isn't a replacement similar to it, though.
But i love Unity 7....
I so wanted that ubuntu phone, but now they discontinue the idea after several years since they announced it.
Good, always hated Unity, I was really pissed off when Ubuntu went to Unity.
the gnome top-bar seems crazy, is it just there as a placeholder awaiting extensions? Would apple freak out if it featured globalmenu by default? a whole panel just for the time seems absurd.
Unity is only useful when it runs inside of /dev/null ...
Also works in Debian ... just try it.
:D
Sascha vloggt I have never quite gotten the difference between Debian and Ubuntu for 99% of things they seem to be exactly the same just with a different desktop environment by default. I run Debian on my home server and Ubuntu dual booted with win 10 on my main pc. But I still consider my self to be somewhat of a noob so if anyone who knows more would like to answer I would be happy to listen.
Ubuntu is based on Debian, meaning that it shares a lot of the base code. This is different to being forked. Ubuntu is designed to be more usable out of the box and require less configuring and tweaking than Debian and have a much larger dependancy on the GUI. Consequently they still share the same package repositories and use the same package tool (APT advanced package tool). I personally use Debian core as my main OS but I dabble in Arch (which uses pacman for packages) and Funtoo (based on Gentoo, uses portage/emerge).
Finn Driver thanks
By the way, the accent on MATE it's in the first syllable, not the last ;)
Mat aaaaay like Mat and hay without the h
Finally! I stopped using Ubuntu after Unity appeared.
FACT: Cinnamon used to originally be a GNOME Extension running atop GNOME 3 for 1 LM Version...
I like manjaro. Its based on Arch but user friendly.
Antergos is just much better. Has more recent software, a nicer installer, just the cool Manjaro Hardware thingy is missing.
I beg to differ. The Antergos installer is a pain in the neck, it hangs right at the end of the process - though it does recover - and the system you're left with at the end isn't half as nice as Manjaro. The only thing I don't like about Manjaro is that recent versions of the installer have dropped LVM support.
That seems to be for you, that bug, even in a VM I didn't experience any bugs in the Antergos installer (pretty slow but I guess it's because of the VM)
I've tried Antergos in a VM on a Mac, on a ThinkPad with an SSD, the same ThinkPad with a hard disk, and the same ThinkPad in a VM. The speed is probably due to downloading all the software fresh whilst it's installing, not the VM. The other bug happens in all three.
yeah yeah but arch > antergos > manjaro
It's more a "return to the origin". Ubuntu did use gnome from the start, and are now returning to gnome after a sidetrack on the unity.
One of the reasons to why I left ubuntu a while back, was due to unity.
i3wm master race
USB to DisplayPort or HDMI for a big responsive display, and BlueTooth for a proper keyboard and mouse. How to change the phone shell, though?
I love all system stuff in a single bar on the left, with my clearly labeled windows snapping over the rest of the displays.
It is really sad to hear. Unity is what makes Ubuntu unique. Ubuntu may end up being like every other Linux distribution and that may hurt Ubuntu or who knows it may not.
Sure, but Unity is what makes Ubuntu and the experience of using Ubuntu unique.
If you take the other Ubuntu based distros. Ubuntu-MATE, Lubuntu, Xubuntu, Kubuntu etc. you have the same DEs in many Arch, Debian based distros and Fedora, Opensuse ... and the experience of using those DEs in other distros is really similar. Unity is not the same.
I wonder though whether a separate team will create a Ubuntu Unity fork when Ubuntu switch to Gnome, or whether that is at all possible??
Yeah I don't get it either. If you compared it to cars it would be like buying a Toyota Tercel. Changing all the emblems. logos, lights , dashboard and style lines just so it would look and act just like a Honda Accord. Why didn't you just buy the damn Honda Accord? lol. That is what I don't get about the community. You like Arch that is fine but Ubuntu doesn't need to be another Arch. Stop already
Bill Miller the problem with free stuff. no regulation. bye bye reactos, at least end to end communication with their users.
Personally I prefer it. People who are good at developing desktop environments should do those and people who are good at Ubuntu should do that. The reason Linux works better than other OSs is because the division of labour works for everyone, not one distro.
Ryan Smith Problem??? You mean you actually want your freedom regulated? Each to their own I guess, and luckily there's plenty of regulation on the Mac and windows spyware OSes.
Here on arch been missing unity but did not want to pull down all the older gnome deps to install it. I was holding out for unity 8 and was going to switch to that :( . Hopefully at the very least we get the hud in gnome shell
KDE desktop FTW :)
tomsk when is plasma mobile ready?
Kubuntu user here
KDE Neon user :)
Sorry, I dont know
that may be true, but striking a balance between functionality & appearance is the sweet spot.
How would this effect the Ubuntu repositories mainly for Linux Lite that runs an xfce desktop? Clarify they are dropping Gnome, or is this the beginning of the end for Ubuntu altogether?
It would have no effect on Linux Lite or any other distro based on Ubuntu. No one but Ubuntu uses the Unity Desktop and the other projects they dropped have little to do with Base Ubuntu. :)
Ah, Ubuntu is based on Debian unstable. So I'd say that Debian is more influential, being as Ubuntu just follows Debian.
+SJP I still run Debian Wheezy on all of my systems right now. So I have not used Systemd yet. I want to setup a test machine to try it out. I've never used it. I don't do anything fancy with my init anyways, so I don't know if it would matter, or not, to me. As long as a machine boots.
So what exactly do you mean by preview of Unity 8? if i switch to Ubuntu 17.04 can i permanently use Unity 8??
that just a desktop environment how on earth it implies to end of ubuntu which is a linux distribution. Guess you mastered the art of clickbaiting over the years
Midsummer light not clickbate... 'end of Ubuntu _as we know it_ ' they aren't doing touch development, that's a massive shift. They are focusing on IoT and cloud, desktop could be a side project now but we'll have to see how they get behind gnome/ Wayland/ KDE mobile.....
k
That's like saying that if Microsoft dropped the Windows shell and installed an X version instead Windows wouldn't change, after all, Windows is just a desktop environment, but it wouldn't be the end of Windows, which is a Windows distribution.
'... as we know it'. You willfully misrepresent the video's title! It's sensationalist perhaps, but not actually misleading.
Gnome 3, Unity, Cinnamon and the buggy MATE were the things that kept me away from all those distros, force me to know better linux and go with Arch and Openbox, where things make more sense from a terminal guys perspective.
Could you do a video on OpenBSD as well? Just like Windows taught me to appreciate Linux, Linux taught me to appreciate OpenBSD.
OpenBSD - the world's simplest and most secure Unix-like OS. Creator of the world's most used SSH implementation OpenSSH, the most elegant firewall PF, the mail server OpenSMTPD, the webserver httpd, the OpenSSL rewrite LibreSSL, and a whole bunch of other projects.
OpenBSD - the cleanest kernel, the cleanest userland and the cleanest configuration syntax.
Wow I remember when all this Unity stuff was very new hat... I was still under the impression it still was. BLINK 7 years later... and now old-hat is new hat again!
Just stick to the Mac.. Will You? It's quite a bit Expensive, but trust Me it's WORTH it. :)
NO.
It is not worth it.
wtf
lol its not i tried it its bad
"eat mcdonalds , it's a bit disgusting but in the end its kinda good "
The beauty of Linux is that you can use whatever desktop you prefer. Heck, I still have two dedicated test systems running with Openlook. I guess since one of the top ten queries on the Ubuntu forums was "How do I install XXX Desktop on Ubuntu YY.ZZ", someone at Canonical finally got the hint that Unity wasn't all that liked.
I still maintain the source code for 13 different X11 environments - of which GNOME and KDE are simply variants. Sometimes you don't really need a Windows clone.
Android is the largest open source software in the world.
actually it's the linux kernel.
Midsummer light I'm aware. When he mentioned how there hasn't been a successful push for open source in the phone market, I think he forgot Android is open source.
k
Kyle A I think Android as we know it is so fully integrated with the closed source Google Services that it no longer can be considered an open source platform. No one runs vanilla AOSP.
Kyle A what about Java
Ubuntu is greater than the sum of it's parts, Unity, Mir,and Ubuntu touch were part of of Mark's grand scheme for convergence.He is absolutely right to dump these costly ventures as anyone who follows Tech news knows the whole idea of convergence was a grand one but basically died due to lack of interest from the PC community. Ubuntu will make a brief return to the Gnome desktop than will shake thing's up once more with refreshing and innovative concept's and functionality.
Unity was a piece of crap anyway. I prefer Kde or Gnome
It is cosmetic. It is placement of bars and tabs. Just run a different shell. Even a windows PC can run a different shell. Customize the GUI.
its the end of ubuntu as we know it and i feel fine :v
Debian 8 "jessie" comes standard with Gnome 3, and I found Gnome 3 so horrible to work with that I switched to another DE. Only Gnome Shell extensions make Gnome 3 more usable - but only because it makes Gnome 3 look and work like Gnome 2.
Is there much difference between Unity and Gnome 3?
Jon Doe debian jessie came with XFCE, or base (no desktop).
+EximiusDux -Whoops, you are right. I started with Debian 7, and not with 8. Debian 7 came with Gnome 3. I stand corrected.
Nan cohesiveness between distros is the main reason I hate Linux regardless of the distro. I am a recent hopeful Linux user but after having tried Ubuntu men's q4os and others they are drive me crazy and have such simple errors that take long time if even possible to repair. Maybe Linux is more secure but there's a user coming recently from Windows XP and also Windows 7 the migration from Windows XP to Windows 7 is far easier than getting into the various distros of linux. I want to use my computer as a tool I don't want to use my time trying to perfect the tool. And your software is so bad and your fans are so unclear compare two windows. My low level recommendation is for all of your Linux groups to get together and Deeside on one and only one distro that will be called Linux desktop period!!!!! so after having spent two so after having spent two or three hundred hours and various distros and the differences between programs I am basically finished with Linux as a daily driver and I hope you can pass this alarm to all the various Linux teams!!! Develop one desktop concentrate improving the programs!!!!! I've said enough to indicate my absolute frustration and differences between all your distributions.
As a linux user, this makes me sad. The difference between the distros is trivial. The difference is usually only the desktop manager. The desktop manager really has nothing to do with linux. You can have one installed, or dozens and swap between them. The 'applications' and 'shortcuts' are almost pointless. Almost every linux user runs out of a terminal all of the time.
I cannot agree with you LESS!! The DESKTOP should be universal across linux!!! This is the FIRST thing that should be agreed between the teams. Why not take the "teams" and reorganize them into a cohesive one version linux or ok have an option for versions that use less ram etc. If linux wants to attract Windows users this IS a MUST in my opinion. Here's a link that solved a simple clock problem when dual booting from Win and Linux. This took me near 2 hours to finally fix linux distro and also with other distros but had to do it by terminal and then i could not remember how i did it before. Why not write in your code to make it compaticble with windows and/or mac clocks?? here is the link that I just now implemented and it indeed seemed (so far) to fix the issue. www.webupd8.org/2014/09/dual-boot-fix-time-differences-between.html
Because the desktop has nothing to do with linux. Its not built in like it is with windows. Its just an app. You can change it out, install more than one, or not have one at all. Its like saying 'we have to agree on which calculator app we are going to use or else we cant use linux'. Its insane.
They do, its call distributions.
Linux' power is in its freedom and variety. You can't really choose one desktop, because 10% of users prefer other things. And this is fine. Linux is fine. I work, play, browse and do other stuff on Linux in the past 10 years. My mother used Linux without a problem. I didn't have to babysit her computer, unlike when she used Windows. And she liked Linux more than Windows.
Linux is not perfect, but it doesn't pretend to be. It doesn't closed you down. People didn't like KDE 4 back then, so they switched. Then Gnome 3 came along, they didn't like it, so they switched.
Microsoft says: "You have to use this." - And people switch to, or try Linux. :)
10.04 User here. Started from 9.04 Karmic koala due to booting and wifi issues at that time. I have a DVD remastered copy with normal everyday apps pre-installed. Although it's old, it works perfectly. I still use it on desktops and laptops.
Unity is ugly controlling and crashes. It is why I switched to windows 7.
Josh Navarro get win 10 already bro
Слободан Бранковић you can turn them off
You cam turn them off, and its not a big deal, by now even your government is spying on you
There is quality control for that, they should just hire more testers instead of using common people as testers.
On windows 7 too, just because there is no this mobile crap yet. (Actually because people recommended me it over windows 8, but I'm glad I'm not wasting my time on it)
Yeah, the only official Ubuntu I've really used is Ubuntu Mate, which of course means that even though I missed Gnome 2 I probably would have been one of those ticked at the Gnome Project for Gnome 3 since I love Mate. Still, it does sadden me that I'll never get to have an Ubuntu phone. Granted, part of the reason other than apps that it didn't take off was the very small area the phones that were released came out in. I think they were, like what, just in India or something?
Is it only me who doesn't care about ubuntu desktop? I use server only.
And a plus, who cares about unity? it's one of the most heavy desktop environments...
The first thing that I do with ubuntu now is put gnome de on there
Convergence made sense when it was conceived. But technology changes rapidly and you have to adapt to overcome competition. There's a good chance that in the next 5 years, smartphones and tablets will be a thing of the past while AR moves in to fill that space.
Might as well focus on the market that matters most with Ubuntu: the Desktop/Server market.
Well, if Ubuntu is discontinued, then I'll just switch to Kubuntu? Right?
The original source of the news is Mark Shuttleworth's announcement he made on insights.ubuntu.com (although it is not listed on insights.ubuntu.com/canonical-announcements). I hoped I could track the original source to April Fool's, but Wikipedia entry on Ubuntu Touch seems to confirm that this in true. I happen to own the BQ Aquaris E5, Ubuntu Edition, which was the second phone to ever come out with preinstalled Ubuntu.
Thanks for the video. I like Gnome 2 when it was on Ubuntu, but it will be interesting to see what happens in the future.
how did you come up with 2010 for gnome? it was released mar 3 of 1999
I was talking about Gnome 3.
oh, gotcha. Thanks for the reply!
So Gnome announced 3 before Canonical announced Unity? I never knew Unity was actually a response to Gnome 3.
There are so many Desktops out there and Unity was clearly not loved as much as Ubuntu would have liked. They took their eye off the desktop with the attempt at mobile and that ultimately hurt them. Gnome is lovely and one of the reasons why i left the 'Ubuntu-like' distros. Mate is well developed and so id KDE. Those 3 desktops are hard to go up against and cover most of the user's wants and needs. Hopefully this will help the Gnome/Mate/KDE groups and have Ubuntu focus on something else
Somebody needs to fork Unity and resume work on Unity 7, taking it out of maintenance mode and back into development mode to answer the criticisms. Like you, I've been using it since 2012. It sure started out lousy, but its better than adequate now. Been on a tour of available GUIs and they are all really, really decent! Just tried out the Lubuntu desktop again and was amazed how great it was. I think KDE gets my preference right now by a very slight margin. With GUIs the more great ones we have, the better off the user is.
How many days until we get a fork of Unity 7? I'd actually be surprised if someone didn't fork it.
You can easily remove the top bar in GNOME simply by installing an extension
Happy to see Gnome come back! - I learned on GNome, and really, the title for me would be "Ubuntu is going back to its roots" :P, but guess it depends what you first used.
I stopped using Ubuntu in 2011 because of the botched abortion of a desktop called Unity. I am very VERY happy that they have come to their senses.
You can never beat the Gnome 2 Desktop Environment that shipped on earlier Ubuntu versions up to Ubuntu 11.04
I still run Ubuntu 8.04 in a VMWare Fusion virtual environment complete with Gnome 2. Lightweight, Slick and Rock Solid Stable.
I don't mind the Unity desktop and even though I am using Ubuntu Mate I have it set up with one bar on the left.
I know I keep trying to install Ubunto Gnome 16.10 on a virtual machine and I put it on twice but could not sign in or could I use my keyboard so I give up on Gnome I have a great time with Pearl Gnome it works good but do not know how to put Chrome on it
I like your video, Joe, and not trying to knock it ... but there is far too much line-blurring going on between what is the OS, the Distro, and the GUI. The Desktop, GUI, or Launcher *should* be the most trivial thing about any distribution. Lots of older folks would love it if their new Winders 10 could look like Windows 3.0 with which they are familiar. Microsoft does not give them that choice. Conform! Thankfully, with Linux distros, I can run FVWM like it was 1993, anytime!
Does this mean they'll also stop adding tracking software? Shuttleworth is becoming to Schmidty for me. Going back to a proper Debian.
I'm kind of glad.
I loved Ubuntu's Unity and Linux Mint equally. Unity reminds me a bit of OS X. Mint reminds me a bit of Windows. Both did such a great job I was always torn between which to use and always ended up dual booting.
Now with Gnome which I feel adds their own spin to the worst of OS X and Windows (few reasons mentioned in this video) my decision is much easier!
I'll probably give Gnome another shot when they switch but it'll be from a VM in Linux Mint.
I migrated to Manjaro Linux with the Cinnamon DE a year ago. With pacman and yaourt, you have access to pretty much any software you want. It is light, and best of all, it's built on Arch. :)
It's the end of Ubuntu as we know it, and I feel fine
What does Mint use? How will the new Ubuntu compare to Mint?
I had Unity as desktop for soooo long and loved it!
Will Lenses disapear now? :(
Actually Fedora 25 ships with Gnome 3.
Interesting that two big companies tried this "convergence" idea and eventually abandoned it. There was Microsoft with Windows 8 and then Canonical who followed suit. On the other hand, Apple said from the very beginning that the convergence concept was inherently flawed and would never work. Apple's foresight saved themselves a ton of wasted money.
Doesn't GNOME 3 go even further on the path of convergence? At first sight it's basically Android on PC. When you look closer you see it's flexible and can be turned into something close to traditional desktop. Anyway, when I was considering switching to Linux I ended up choosing Xfce and KDE came very close second.
how superficial can anyone get?! changing just the look and feel of the desktop is not changing the o/s, but a step forward in the development of Ubuntu as a user-friendly system.
Tablets and phones are clunky as hell for any kind of general purpose computing. Nothing like a big monitor, mouse and keyboard to actually get things done.
This doesn't mean Ubuntu is coming to an end, it just means they're ditching the Unity UI and going back to Gnome. I always install XFCE anyway which is the UI I prefer. I've been using Mint with XFCE for the longest time. Even if the company that owns Ubuntu poofs, another team will just pick up the code.