I forgot to include it in the video, but the original marketing for Corn Flakes was to tout them as “pre-digested”. 😂 Don’t forget to sign up for the upcoming newsletter which will have extra bits of history. Link is at the bottom of any page on www.tastinghistory.com.
The image of a bunch of patients eating bland food, chewing away like cattle with the doctor amidst them, singing his little chew song... it genuinely sounds a tad dystopian.
Another fact about W K Kellogg: in school, he was considered to be dull by his teachers, only to find out later that the reason why he wasn't doing well in school was because his eyesight was bad. Once he got glasses, he became an avid reader and believed highly in the powers of education
The road to wellsville. ^-^ And i can understand. Because this was plain yogurt. Which is NOT tasty AT ALL. We're not talking today's plain yogurt, which is actually sweetened and flavored with vanilla. Unflavored yogurt can be used for cooking, as it will be flavored by the other ingredients. But eaten by itself, well, if you want to YOU can, i won't be.
I wonder how they came up with that weirdly specific and very high number of chews you should give a shallot. You'd expect some kind of very fibrous vegetable to be the top dog.
@@operatorchakkoty4257quite literally. every human society makes two things. bread and booze. they are, if you will, the bricks and the mortar of society.
In Australia we have a cereal and food company called Sanitarium which was started by seventh day adventists who poached a baker from Kelloggs original factory back at the end of the 19th century.
I've been watching a lot of Civil War history videos recently, and every time they mention hard tack (or biscuit), I immediately see Max clacking two pieces together and hear the "clack-clack."
To be fair, the electrotherapy of Kellogg wasn't as severe as electroconvulsive therapies Basically, the point for Kellogg and his ilk was to run light electrical charges through the body to stimulate muscle activity. This is still done today. However, many snake oil salesmen would claim the process treats other unrelated issues (like how some chiropractors promote their field today so they get more business)
That hardtack clip never gets old. A while ago I was watching a vid on some historical stuff, and they mentioned hardtack. I kid you not: that clip played in my head right away.
I worked in a cereal factory. Corn flakes are the easiest type cereal to produce but still take 15-20 steps from raw corn to finished flake. We had a small factory and could produce 250,000 to 300,000 pounds of corn flakes a week with 4 steam cookers, 2 mills to flatten into flakes and one dryer and one toaster.
Cereal manufacture can be fascinating. I once knew a fellow who had worked for Quaker, making puffed wheat and puffed rice. They really were shot from guns, as the song said. He quit after a few months because he got tired of going home almost deafened and covered in oil.
@@strawberryseason We didn't soak the corn first, the 20-22 pounds of steam for 30-40 minutes cooked the corn with the added water, sugar and malt flavoring.
@@johnopalko5223 We used the "Gun Puffing" process to make our brand of Cheerios (a lot of Trader Joe's O's). Hearing protection was mandatory in the factory.
Removing parts of the intestines was also a treatment he used. Experimenting on vagabonds in exchange for "free accommodation at the sanatorium" Nice guy he was...
To quote literally CAVE JOHNSON: "If you're interested in an additional sixty dollars, flag down a test associate and let 'em know. You could walk out of here with a hundred and twenty weighing down your bindle if you let us take you apart, put some science stuff in you, then put you back together good as new." "In case you're interested, there's still some positions available for that bonus opportunity I mentioned earlier. Again: all you gotta do is let us disassemble you. We're not banging rocks together here. We know how to put a man back together." "So that's a complete reassembly. New vitals. Spit-shine on the old ones. Plus we're scooping out tumors. Frankly, you oughtta be paying us."
My great-great grandfather was a patient/groundskeeper at Kellogg's sanitarium. They let him stay for free because he did work there. He also made a lot of the art that's still on display at the museum. My family contacted them and asked if we could have some of the art pieces back because we lost a lot of his work in a fire back in the 80's, but they basically told us to piss off.
@@hollyw9566 Their logic was that we couldn't prove they we were related to him, even though we had photos and documents proving it, and that the art was a gift to the museum, even though he never expressly GAVE the art to them. He just died in their care and they kept his stuff. We can't really take on their lawyers because... y'know.. poor... So we're forced to leave it alone.
William Kellogg donated his estate to Michigan State University after his death and the land is now a very well known environmental and agricultural research facility primarily focused on sustainable agriculture, ecology, and wildlife.
Back in the late 50s as a youngster I went to a summer camp near the Kellog bird sanctuary. Could hear the many birds at night when trying to get some sleep.
And then the grocier also decides to have a stay in the local insane asylum because he's concerned he's developing some rather upsetting fetishes of late.
I'm sure some of the grocers really enjoyed having women constantly winking at them, while others were probably blushing in embarrassment each time and glad when the promotion finally ended.
Note that Doc Kellog dictated this reconciliation letter to his brother only when need for money removed the stick from his behind. We will never know how much of genuine regret and how much of cold financial calculation was involved in this failed attempt.
I choose to believe that his secretary really went “nah bitch I’ve seen you shit on this dude for the last time” and stuffed it away. It’s the kind of petty revenge I’d do if I had a raging asshole as a boss and saw their thoroughly abused sibling in line for more abuse. Just me? 😂
Wasn't sure if I was being a pessimist for thinking that was a possibility, but I'm glad others had the same thought. People like that don't usually actually realize the error of their ways, but they are happy to lie to continue using you.
When I think about the 'health gurus' of the past, I always think of the saying: "even a stopped clock is right twice a day". Phototherapy is good for seasonal depression, and depression in general.
@@abradolflincler726it helps the body to produce Vitamin D, which is needed to make endorphins and Serotonin. So gut health and Vitamin D intake/levels are really important for every person
That's incredibly boring. And not as healthy as they pretend it is. Please don't do that. Cereal is just carbs with vitamins sprayed on it. Barely any nutritional value whatsoever.
@@bunchie1966 Why 'in spite' of it? It's a pretty decent light meal, well, minus the sugar of course, but if that's most if not all of the sugar intake for the day than it's completely fine.
@@lemmypop1300 You don’t require any sugar in your diet. Sugar is an addictive poison and cornflakes are full of sugar and almost devoid of nutrition, invented by a religious crackpot, who thought that meat “inflames passion”.
"Fun" fact about Will Kellog: For all his childhood, his parents thought he was stupid, because he could not read or recognized people (they still put him at work in the factory at 6 years old, and he was promoted as a general sales manager at 15 ^^'). At 20, he realized he was near-sighted and just needed glasses to see....
@@cernunnos8344not too different from fast food chains and their 16-19 years old managers... except they have poor quality of life instead of poor eyesight nowadays
Pain and harm aren't the same thing Harm leads to a release of endorphins, which leads to a form of compulsion like is also seen with gambling. Pain is meant to help refocus the brain and get it out of a spiral. It's like how hold water can shock a person out of histrionics
Me about to learn Kellogg's story: "interesting, let's listen to it" Me after knowing Kellogg's story: "yeah, let's put that away and never talk about it again"
No. Let's keep talking about it. Let's look around and see if there are still "life style healers" that push verifiable nonsense while being thoroughbred unpleasant a-holes to everyone around them. Oh... would you look at that...
"... need to get some industrial rollers ..." You went from 'quick' garum to making proper garum, Max - now I'm looking forward to two years from now when you rent a factory floor for a day just to make corn flakes the proper way. 😆
Important detail you left out, Kellogg absolutely called it "Granulah" and only changed it to "Granolah" after losing a copyright infringement suit. He later lost more legal battles against other companies he ripped off, including his brother.
There is a movie about John Kellog, his Sanitarium and making cornflakes called The Road to Wellville. It's a comedy with Anthony Hopkins, Matthew Broderick, John Cusack and Bridget Fonda
As far as I remember, one of the winning arguments in the legal case between John and William was that, because John hadn't wanted to fall foul of rules about doctors advertising themselves through a comercial products. Therefore it was William Kellogg's signature that had been used on all of the packaging and advertising not Johns.
Heck not only that, but since there were no company named Kelloggs yet William Kellogg using his own name for the company was a completely fair game. John had no leg to stand on this.
My great uncle is the designer of Cornelius Rooster. He was an artist and in the late 1950s helped a neighborhood kid with some artwork for a Kellogg cereal contest. He drew Cornelius Rooster. I'm not sure if he was aware of the Kellogg design contest or if he was just helping a kid with a drawing. I'm guessing the contest was open to just children? I've tried to find information on it but nothing exists. Next thing my Great Uncle knows he's seeing his design on a box of Cornflakes.
Nothing like giant corporations just taking designs and the designers never seeing a dime. You could be a millionaire right now but at least you have a “neat” story
Apparently it was a visiting Welsh woman who gave Kellogg the idea for a rooster as Kellogg sounds very similar to the Welsh word for cockerel. Welsh Patriots was the site where I read that, quite interesting I thought.
Love your videos Max. I've been watching for years now. I'm someone who loves to cook (I'm trained. I've done it professionally though haven't for a long time now). But I've learned so much from you. Learning about food history, recipes and cooking is fascinating, and you do it with such flair and in such an entertaining way. Food is, of course, so central to life. And culture. And so widely varied. Please don't ever stop. You're truly great.
After hearing about William Kellogg's relationship to his brother, I can't help but feel like Dr. Kellogg is Zapp Brannigan and William is Kif Croaker.
I’m going to state the obvious here but you are such an incredible story teller. And the way you incorporate cooking into it is such a unique form of content but so enjoyable. I’ve been subscribed for some time now and will continue to watch ever video. Great work.
One of the craziest things to me was later realizing that most, if not all, the silly contraptions from the movie were actual inventions from the Sanitarium.
The movie the road to wellville was so silly until you realized it was no longer a comedy but more of a documentary after reading the history of Dr. Kelogg 🤣
When I was eight years old, a long long time ago, on a summer vacation, my family visited the Keloggs cereal factory. Every visitor got a plastic wrapped bundle of mini boxes of all of their cereals straight off of the production line. Really fresh cereal is amazing. I remember sitting around the breakfast table and all of us saying, "Even the corn flakes are good!" Of course, that was Will's recipe. Dr. Kellogg sounds like a legit Sadist.
I think the Redwall books liked using the "instructing everyone to chew at least 20 times, so they eat less, therefore I can eat more" joke a lot. That's immediately where my mind went.
Dr. Kellogg was a controversial figure, but I appreciate how sympathetic you are towards every story you tell, without downplaying the abhorrent things someone has done. I had only previously heard a rough summary of the history of Kellogg cereal, and I'll admit, I kind of want to try making my own breakfast cereal just for fun. Your dedication to avoiding the spread of misinformation and painting as factual a picture of events as possible, while still being immensely entertaining, is incredible. It's a skill few have, thank you for sharing it with us! Also, yogurt enema is nightmare fuel, and sounds like some kind if horrible infection just waiting to happen.
I agree! I love how Max is always careful to be as accurate as possible! Elsewhere it's just more and more misinformation or repeating the same myths (as an Italian it's particularly annoying, since half of our "food tradition" was made up during the past 80 years)
Try the term "Rollermill". There are a few countertop versions of unknown usefulness. They are extremely common in the livestock feed industry, and do flatten grain like what you were aiming for. Steamrolling, steaming the grain while or before flattening it basically gets you exactly what you were looking for here.
I have a fuzzy recollection of my great-great-grandfather remarking "the food at the San wasn't bad for a veterinary hospital." I never quite knew what he meant by that until reading "The Road to Wellville" in 1993.
@rosameryroajas-delcerro1059 a hole is a hole. We are topologically donuts. What is fundamentally disgusting about whether something is going in or out?
Light therapy for seasonal depression isn't as farfetched as it sounds. He was actually onto something there. UV light stimulates vitamin D production in the human body, which is linked with mood and depression. It's why seasonal affective disorder is a real thing in places with lots of cloudy weather like Seattle and Alaska, and tanning salons get a lot of business in those places.
@@thomasdjonesnRegardless if he did, it did turn into a happy little accident of a discovery. And it's not like it's the only accidental discovery that benefited us.
Most treatments have limited use. The problem is that most treatments get sold as a panacea by quacks You still see this today with things like cupping, chlorophyll water, alkaline water, acupuncture, chiropractors... As a rule of thumb, if a treatment is said to treat unrelated ailments; it's snake oil
Every time I hear someone talk about Kellogg, I have PTSD flashbacks to the scene in The Road to Wellville where Sir Anthony Hopkins, playing Kellogg, demands stool samples from his "patients" and judges them based on their samples' size and consistency.
Ha! You know the version of the chewing song they sing in that movie? When I was a kid, if I ate too quick and started choking, my parents would actually sing that at me (after making sure I was okay), because they thought it was hilarious. I only found out a couple years ago they yoinked it from that movie.
As a resident of Battle Creek Michigan who is currently making renovations at the Post factory, this is amazing to listen to rught now. I am in spitting of the Federal Center that used to be the Battle Creek Sanitarium.
I really liked this video! I grew up not far from Battle Creek, in the heart of the SDA school system - we went to the Kellogg Museum to learn about this. I would encourage you to look into "special K loaf" - it's an adventist meal i grew up eating that is a vegetarian meat loaf made from corn flakes. It sounds gross, but i promise it can be done quite deliciously. I always thought the Kellogg brother's story would make a great prestige TV miniseries with expensive costumes lol.
I don't know if you still can, but it used to be that bear hunters who wanted sweet and strong smelling bait could go to the Battle Creek Kelloggs plant. There is always cereal and dust on the floor which is waste and not for human consumption. They would do a sweep and collect all the dust and floor cereal and compress it into a large 500lb or so block. Hunters could then break off chunks and leave them out to attract bears.
Great video! You kept your stance, focusing in the original recipe, that's one great feat! And it's also great that you put the Kellogg brothers in perspective, while usually people try to portrait John as a cruel weirdo or an excentric genius. From a celebrity sanatorium to a top brand that made possible or affordable or billions (trillions?) of breakfasts, it's such a great story you told!
I went to MSU for half my degree and there is a building on the campus called the Kellog Center. Every student on campus knows the disturbing story of corn flakes. The event hall is where my forensics teacher got married/had his reception. Nice building. Good landscaping.
The 400 lb. Taft was once sent to the Philippines. His friends were worried about his health. They wired him a letter asking how he was doing in the tropical heat. He responded that he felt well and had gone horse back ridding that morning. His friends then wired back asking how the horse was doing.😂
Remarkable that of all the dark periods in human history that you’ve touched upon, the cornflakes rabbit hole is one of the darkest I’ve ever seen you approach…
Plenty more if you watch the docuseries called "The Food That Built America." The first season alone is worth a look, if you can sit through ninety minutes of food brand history apiece for three episodes. The rest of the show starting with Season Two cuts the run time down to forty-five minutes per episode while following a specific market (e.g. Famous Amos and Mrs. Fields for cookies, Subway and Blimpie's for submarine sandwiches, Dunkin' and Krispy Kreme for donuts, and the rivalry between Pizza Hut and Domino's). The first episode starts with the Kelloggs in Michigan, Henry Heinz (the inventor of tomato-based ketchup) in Philadelphia, and John Pemberton (the creator of Coca-Cola) in Atlanta. They even cover Harlan Sanders - yes, _the_ Colonel Sanders - and his start in Hell's Half Acre, Kentucky.
@@AdderTude Oh it's a pretty good series but it doesn't go into detail on the medical career for a reason. I've seen a grown man become pale and faint upon hearing about some of the human medical experimentation Dr. Kellogg was getting away with.
@@emilynelson5985 Yeah, I'm aware of it because it needed to be family-friendly. John was pretty damned stingy and refused to see the bigger picture all because he was the favorite child. I actually like the profile on Marjorie Post. One of the best businesswomen of the 20th century.
@@AdderTude but seriously. Anyone who does that kind of stuff should be locked up. That man spent his whole career in the painstaking development of unnecessary procedures which were recognized to be unsavory even in their time. The ideas put forward in his “work” are still causing profound harm across the globe to this day which should not be understated. The fact that we can talk about a crazy inventor but not the women trying to recover from the proceedures
I grew up in Battle Creek, and I went to prom at the Sanitarium. My grandma was a nurse, and she did part of her training there before it closed (as a sanitarium).
I just love your channel and your attention to detail and accuracy. I was apprehensive of watching this episode since I am a Seventh day Adventist and often we misunderstood by way of association with Waco and Kellogg. I was relieved to see your factual account thank you so much for your integrity. Couple other fun facts which maybe you know and just couldn’t fit into your video, Post did some dirty work behind-the-scenes and that also led to Kellogg’s having difficulty financially (to do with dollar manufacturing). There’s a couple videos I think on the history channel but not 100% sure on that, of the Post Kellogg issue. And secondly, while Kellogg started off in the Adventist church he was removed (you alluded to this) because he started to get more and more extreme, his ideas leading in a direction of harm. Eventually, Kellogg became so obsessed that he even thought plants felt pain which led to him to extreme stress around all food. This stress, I think compounded to his not thinking rationally/clearly. I think that’s still true today (to a lesser degree) for many of us when we get really stressed around food or work or life itself, it can lead to burn out and then we don’t think so clearly. I think relationships suffer when we get to this point. At least as a therapist that’s my take. Anyway, thank you for a great program. I really enjoy watching.
Unfortunately, anti-vegans have been using this comment section as a platform to spread misinformation and hate speech against vegans and Seventh Day Adventists. That kind of abuse is dangerous because it may lead to hate crimes, as mentioned by this research paper published in a scholarly journal: *‘Against the cult of veganism’: Unpacking the social psychology and ideology of anti-vegans* by Rebecca Gregson, Jared Piazza, and Ryan L. Boyd published November 2022 in Appetite, Volume 178 “Despite the established health and ecological benefits of a plant-based diet, ...individuals who stand vehemently against veganism...have sprung up across the internet. Much scholarship on veganism characterizes anti-vegans in passing, painting them as ill-informed, uneducated, or simply obstinate. ...This largely survey-based body of research has found that those more willing to denigrate vegans are typically...lower-educated individuals” “Many of the subreddits that r/AntiVegan users frequent, particularly r/darkjokes and r/AccidentalRacism, include the expression of prejudicial attitudes towards groups including (but not limited to) women and people of colour.” “This increasing popularity of vegan diets has paralleled a rise in selective eating habits, leading to the common misperception that veganism is a new-age fad diet. Far from short-lived, the concept of abstaining from animal-derived food products for ethical reasons, is said to date back some 5000 years to Ancient Egypt, was later popularised by Greek philosopher Pythagoras in around 500 BCE and has a rich tradition among several world religions, including Jainism, Hinduism, and Buddhism” “Today, with the growing popularity of meat-free diets, anti-vegan sentiments have become increasingly apparent. This has led scholars and legal bodies to recognise anti-veganism as a prejudice, resulting in the protection of “ethical veganism” under the UK Equality Act 2010. Some evidence, reported by The Times, even suggests that vegan-related hate crimes may be on the rise in the UK. According to the article, there were 172 instances of vegan hate crimes between the years 2015-2020, one-third of which occurred in 2020 alone.”
I'm only halfway in and this is already SO cool and interesting, it's shedding light on why my parents gave the sort direction on what me and my siblings needed to eat. Granola was from mom. My dad told us to chew our food as long as possible. Man, this is why I love history!
A disturbingly weird and unpleasant individual. I used to think these stories were just urban legend, years back when I first heard them, but then -- nah -- all turns out to be true.
Kellogg may have been very smart in some respects, but the man was likely very disturbed. Kudos to his younger brother for overshadowing him in success.
Isn't it? Why do you think civilization is going broke? When humans, or any animal, outbreed their ecosystem, they commit ecocide and die. How many people were alive during Kellog's day? About 3 billion. How many are alive today? 9 Billion? I lost track. Tick tock.
It was actually a fairly prevalent notion. The Catholic Church had been espousing the benefits of celibacy for centuries, it wasn’t a huge step to concluding that everyone, not just the clergy, should abstain.
@@anna9072 Yeah, but if you don't reproduce, it's kind of hard to get new members for your church. Just ask the Shakers. The Catholic Church didn't forbid sex. They just put many restrictions on it.
@@johnopalko5223 no, they didn’t forbid sex, in fact, they considered it a woman’s duty to marry and produce children if she did not “marry” Christ. But they did view the act of sex as inherently sinful, and glorified chastity.
@@johnopalko5223 I think the concept was that they didn’t need to reproduce, that holiness and oneness with god were the goals and that perpetuating the species was an unnecessary distraction. Something like that, anyway.
fun fact: when the original cereal company burned down, William Kellogg had trouble replacing the rollers due to the company being in an exclusive contract with Post and not being able to take on new clients. But Kellogg was a "Returning" Client and so they could certainly help him.
I though I could swoop in and make a joke about the funny peepee cereal man, but was stunned by the story about the Kellogg brother's and the sad ending of unreconciled emotions after decades of feuding. Great episode!
damn, that really was an unexpectedly sad story for the origin of cornflakes~ it was heart-wrenching, hearing that the brothers never reconciled because of that meddling assistant. John would've died thinking that his brother still hated him ..and William would've never had the closure of recognition from his brother for his efforts :( that was amazingly-told though Max -- you're a true storyteller, and it was a pleasure again
My grandfather, who has long since passed, was born in 1922. I never once heard him refer to corn flakes as corn flakes. They were always Post Toasties (even if they weren't from the Post brand!)
Thanks for another wonderful video, Max. I'm sure I'm not the only one who struggles with, uh, --(gestures broadly at everything around lately)--, and seeing how absolutely passionate and enthusiastic you are to share your research and information lifts my spirits in a really special way, I don't get it much from other UA-camrs I watch. You really do have these "gaw-geous, simply gaw-geous" eyes that exude childlike wonder, and it's such an endearing and, honestly, encouraging thing to see. Also I absolutely love seeing you drop by the Sorted set, same energy and vibe only compounded by their energy and enthusiasm as well. It's silly, but it gives me hope that I'll find joy in things in this life.... of which I generally have little lately. I just wanted to thank you for being you and being able to share yourself with the world, because ... man, that's HARD. Stay positive and I hope nothing but good comes your way!
Adam Ragusea made a great video covering the history of corn flakes, and the specific grain used, as well as the "dough" conundrum was addressed - turns out a wet mass of boiled grain could be called "dough"
Max, have you been working out? You’re looking awesome! My husband works at the Hinsdale Sanitarium Hospital which was started by Kellogg here in the Chicago area, run by the Adventists in the late 1800s. There are books about the Kellogg people there, along with those photos you have shown. This is an amazing video!
Try checking in with your local pizza restaurants for rollers. One of the places here uses them to run dough through before adding all the usual pizza fixings! Just sprinkle on some flour to keep it from sticking to the metal rollers.
Yogurt enema is interesting cause it DOES have some scientific merit; the bacteria in yogurt is what your gut needs when youre having microbio issues and an enema IS a much faster and more direct way to the gut than through the usual end. still wouldn't want to try it though...
Oh wow I guess it's actually a legit thing. Going in the other end protects the probiotics from your stomach acid. And you can make yogurt at home cheaply and easily But probiotics affect everyone differently, so it isn't always beneficial. Also if you have a weakened immune system the bacteria can overcome it and make you sick
Your struggle to make the flakes mirrors the same issues that William Kellogg had in trying to make them. Eventually he arrived on heavy duty rollers and that solved the issue.
Excellent episode, i knew nothing about John's relationship with his brother... thank you for your thorough research. Now I feel like cornflakes and banana, but just a serving or two, and I'm wondering if I'll get far winking at a grocer!!!?!
When my father made polenta, it would leave a crusty film of cornmeal stuck to the pot. I loved breaking pieces off and nibbling while the table was being set.
I never knew cereal could be so interesting. I learned a lot from the comments too. My mom was from Battle Creek and every time we went to see family we would visit Kellogg's for a factory tour and a treat at the end of the tour - a scoop of ice cream on top of some sort of colorful sugary cereal Plus get a full variety package of their single serving cereals Post Cereal also gave out variety packs of their single serve cereal when you visited their museum. A museum highlight was the chair Abe Lincoln was sitting in when he was shot - blood included. Creepy and fascinating for all the cousins on the tour.
I'm sure it's part of the wider research, but here in Australia one of our largest cereal companies is called Sanitarium. They got started in the late 1890's when a high ranking Seventh day Adventist William C White came to Australia. He managed to poach a baker from Kellogg in Battle Creek, Edward Halsey, who permanently emigrated. They started with the same foods, Granola and Granose. Eventually they did adjust the recipe with some sugar and Weet-Bix is now probably the most recognized Australian and New Zealand cereal. I also found it interesting that as part of their church founding, they operate totally tax exempt on profits in both countries.
William C. White is also a son of two of the major founders of the Seventh-day Adventist denomination, specifically the main figure Ellen G. White, and his parents eventually moved to the same country.
As flawed "The Road to Wellville" is as a recounting of Kellogg, it's still a fun film to watch, and Anthony Hopkins is very good in it. It was probably the first time I heard of the origins of Kellogg and the cereal empire, and then I found the actual story over time. I definitely ate my share of Corn Flakes as a kid, since it's a great sugar delivery vehicle. :)
Easily one of your best historical videos Max! Thank you for this! I knew some, but not all of this story and I really appreciate the completeness without going into too much minutae.
This is one of the topics I was most looking forward to! Can't believe you're finally covering the Kellogg brothers. Thank you for the phenomenal content, Max!
Its worth mentioning that you can visit William Kellogg's house at Cal Poly Pomona. The campus was built on the Kellogg's ranch and still raises the Arabian Horses similar to what Kellogg had.
You should read more about John Harvey. Dude was a damn whackadoo. I'm actually from Battle Creek. Lived there most of my life. Shitty town, so don't visit unless you want good cannabis. Very interesting story though. Dude was so out there. A vegetarian for health reasons then is wild enough on its own. Then he was a big part of a crazy ass church (I'm sure Max covered it), but they're goofy too. Really long hair and skirts only for the girls. Very cult like. Seventh Day Adventists I believe.
@@rickwilliams967Thing is, as crazy as it sounds, Seventh-day Adventists had a point when it comes to health education. They were the only ones that created an area full of centenarians on the basis of mere religion instead of ethnicity. Also, John Harvey Kellogg was a product of his time; most of his contraptions were used in other parts of the world as well as part of the general craziness of the Victorian period medicine. Medicine at that time was highly experimental, and were developing into the modern hospitals we have today, complete with all of the apparatus. The more we consider this, the more we should realize that we are standing on the shoulders of giants.
I'm from Battle Creek, Michigan too. I miss the tours of Kellogg's. We got to smell the making of their cereals when i was at Southeastern Junior high. This video makes me want to dive into a bowl of cereal. 🍴
Unfortunately, this is 100% true. John Kellogg was a sick, sick man. The Road to Wellville (1994) is a disturbing and mostly accurate depiction of the weirdness that went down in Battle Creek.
I worked at Kellogg's for 31 years, during which time we used the whole kernel. The kernels were cooked with a flavoring solution and stored for a time to reach the right consistency, resulting in a rubbery red kernel that then went to the mills.
I forgot to include it in the video, but the original marketing for Corn Flakes was to tout them as “pre-digested”. 😂
Don’t forget to sign up for the upcoming newsletter which will have extra bits of history. Link is at the bottom of any page on www.tastinghistory.com.
Oh no. 😬
That's a phrase that should NEVER be added to food!
I made the Tudor Strawberry tart last Friday - it was amazing!!
Oh my God, I'm so glad they don't market them that way today😂
Signed up!
@@Secretgeek2012That's a phrase fitting all cooked food.
"Yogurt enema" qualifies as a two word horror story.
Absolutely 🤣
I'm definitely glad we've advanced medically beyond those.
And just like that I put down my morning Greek yogurt with chocolate protein powder 🤢
I had to replay that part a few times, thought i had misheard or gotten high from breathing air.
It sounds...disgustingly euphemistic.
The image of a bunch of patients eating bland food, chewing away like cattle with the doctor amidst them, singing his little chew song... it genuinely sounds a tad dystopian.
Yes! Ever watch the movie “The Road to Wellville”?
Also I suggest “The Nuts Among the Berries”
@@Dotsaa2 I didn't know there was a movie, but I read the book.
more than a 'tad'
You don't say?
Another fact about W K Kellogg: in school, he was considered to be dull by his teachers, only to find out later that the reason why he wasn't doing well in school was because his eyesight was bad. Once he got glasses, he became an avid reader and believed highly in the powers of education
He jacked off too often according to himself
I think you're referring to his brother Will Keith Kellogg
So he had bad eyesight and he also said that chronic masturbation causes bad eyesight? Interesting…. 😂
@@funeats8201it's always the ones who participates extensively in the things they publicly hate..
i guess we all know why he had bad eyesight 😉
"Sir? I don't think I can eat 3 quarts of yoghurt."
"Oh, it's not going in that end!"
"Quart and a half.. oof, I'm stuffed." - "Oh, you will be..."
LOL
Perfect two sentence horror story.
The road to wellsville. ^-^
And i can understand. Because this was plain yogurt. Which is NOT tasty AT ALL. We're not talking today's plain yogurt, which is actually sweetened and flavored with vanilla.
Unflavored yogurt can be used for cooking, as it will be flavored by the other ingredients. But eaten by itself, well, if you want to YOU can, i won't be.
Yay, I was hoping someone would reference The Road to Wellville! Fantastic assortment of famous actors & really funny!
Avoid shallots?! Never! You can have my alliums when you take them from my cold, dead hands.
I have said the same about bread.
@@nathanhoffman20000 Good crusty German bread, soft and flaky french croissants...bread is life.
I wonder how they came up with that weirdly specific and very high number of chews you should give a shallot. You'd expect some kind of very fibrous vegetable to be the top dog.
@@nathanhoffman20000 garlic bread??? yuum
@@operatorchakkoty4257quite literally.
every human society makes two things.
bread and booze.
they are, if you will, the bricks and the mortar of society.
In Australia we have a cereal and food company called Sanitarium which was started by seventh day adventists who poached a baker from Kelloggs original factory back at the end of the 19th century.
Please tell me that they've contracted with Metallica for their jingle.
And just like Kellogg’s, it’s a weird, weird company. Tax exemptions for being a church, anyone?
Holy shit, I get my nut milk from this brand 😂
That feels really on brand for Australia /positive
@@joanderson6880
I like that all of your videos are like 6 degrees of separation, but instead of people, it’s hard tack
*clack clack*
Really more like 1 degree of separation!
It all comes back to hardtack.
6 degrees of hardtack *clack clack*
One of the most important foods in history.
I've been watching a lot of Civil War history videos recently, and every time they mention hard tack (or biscuit), I immediately see Max clacking two pieces together and hear the "clack-clack."
Forget shock therapy and the slapper, that chewing song is definitely the worst torture of all.
Yeah. I though so too.
Nah, the yoghurt enema is the true nightmare
Ha haaaaaa 😂
@@jamiefookes1579 I don’t know, the machine designed to basically shake you until you crap yourself seems a little out there
To be fair, the electrotherapy of Kellogg wasn't as severe as electroconvulsive therapies
Basically, the point for Kellogg and his ilk was to run light electrical charges through the body to stimulate muscle activity. This is still done today. However, many snake oil salesmen would claim the process treats other unrelated issues (like how some chiropractors promote their field today so they get more business)
That hardtack clip never gets old. A while ago I was watching a vid on some historical stuff, and they mentioned hardtack. I kid you not: that clip played in my head right away.
It’s Pavlovian at this point 😂
Every time I eat a bowl of frosted flakes, I like to imagine that Kellogg is screaming at me from Hell.
"from hell" 💀
🤣🤣
He was Adventist so his bones would just thwack in his grave
@@sleepyoteHe did all that weird garbage to torture people, he doesn’t get to be mad for being in hell 😂😂😂
Even worse in my place, instant noodles.🤣 We have freaking Kellogg's instant noodles.
I worked in a cereal factory. Corn flakes are the easiest type cereal to produce but still take 15-20 steps from raw corn to finished flake. We had a small factory and could produce 250,000 to 300,000 pounds of corn flakes a week with 4 steam cookers, 2 mills to flatten into flakes and one dryer and one toaster.
that's super interesting!
Do you know if they soaked the corn first?
Cereal manufacture can be fascinating. I once knew a fellow who had worked for Quaker, making puffed wheat and puffed rice. They really were shot from guns, as the song said. He quit after a few months because he got tired of going home almost deafened and covered in oil.
@@strawberryseason
We didn't soak the corn first, the 20-22 pounds of steam for 30-40 minutes cooked the corn with the added water, sugar and malt flavoring.
@@johnopalko5223 We used the "Gun Puffing" process to make our brand of Cheerios (a lot of Trader Joe's O's).
Hearing protection was mandatory in the factory.
Removing parts of the intestines was also a treatment he used.
Experimenting on vagabonds in exchange for "free accommodation at the sanatorium"
Nice guy he was...
... I feel like I recall reading a comic about a supervillain doing that. *Eesh*
😰
Yayyyyyyy 😰
They still do this. It's called gastric bypass, a surgery often done on obesity patients.
To quote literally CAVE JOHNSON:
"If you're interested in an additional sixty dollars, flag down a test associate and let 'em know. You could walk out of here with a hundred and twenty weighing down your bindle if you let us take you apart, put some science stuff in you, then put you back together good as new."
"In case you're interested, there's still some positions available for that bonus opportunity I mentioned earlier. Again: all you gotta do is let us disassemble you. We're not banging rocks together here. We know how to put a man back together."
"So that's a complete reassembly. New vitals. Spit-shine on the old ones. Plus we're scooping out tumors. Frankly, you oughtta be paying us."
My great-great grandfather was a patient/groundskeeper at Kellogg's sanitarium. They let him stay for free because he did work there. He also made a lot of the art that's still on display at the museum.
My family contacted them and asked if we could have some of the art pieces back because we lost a lot of his work in a fire back in the 80's, but they basically told us to piss off.
Those were some horrible people.
As gracious as ever.
Art heist incoming
"Alright ramblers let's get rambling"
@@hollyw9566 Their logic was that we couldn't prove they we were related to him, even though we had photos and documents proving it, and that the art was a gift to the museum, even though he never expressly GAVE the art to them. He just died in their care and they kept his stuff.
We can't really take on their lawyers because... y'know.. poor... So we're forced to leave it alone.
@@GirtheAlienGoldfish wow, that’s super gross of them. I’m sorry to hear that.
William Kellogg donated his estate to Michigan State University after his death and the land is now a very well known environmental and agricultural research facility primarily focused on sustainable agriculture, ecology, and wildlife.
pushing the Adventist cult propaganda no doubt
John Kellogg could never
Something tells me his brother wouldn't have...
Back in the late 50s as a youngster I went to a summer camp near the Kellog bird sanctuary. Could hear the many birds at night when trying to get some sleep.
Ironic considering how devastating large scale monocrop industrial grains production is destryoing the soil!
"Locking it up in a cage" I know a number of people who would enjoy that way more than intended.
Where do you think that kink comes from?
I think that’s the point. It was Dr. John Kellog’s fetish.
The "stop winking" thing had me actually laughing. I love the directness! Must have been a fun time to be a grocer
And then the grocier also decides to have a stay in the local insane asylum because he's concerned he's developing some rather upsetting fetishes of late.
It was a clever campaign for it's time.
John Kellogg: Stop w_nking!
also William Kellogg: Stop w_nking!
@@tiarkrezar I see what you did there 👏🏽
I'm sure some of the grocers really enjoyed having women constantly winking at them, while others were probably blushing in embarrassment each time and glad when the promotion finally ended.
Note that Doc Kellog dictated this reconciliation letter to his brother only when need for money removed the stick from his behind. We will never know how much of genuine regret and how much of cold financial calculation was involved in this failed attempt.
I choose to believe that his secretary really went “nah bitch I’ve seen you shit on this dude for the last time” and stuffed it away.
It’s the kind of petty revenge I’d do if I had a raging asshole as a boss and saw their thoroughly abused sibling in line for more abuse.
Just me? 😂
You're right about that. People sure do treat you better when they want money from you. Well, unless they kill you for it.
Wasn't sure if I was being a pessimist for thinking that was a possibility, but I'm glad others had the same thought. People like that don't usually actually realize the error of their ways, but they are happy to lie to continue using you.
Maybe the reason the secretary didn't send it was because she got the idea that it wasn't sincere.
@@skystygian Would be in character, given just how much labor he siphoned off of William.
When I think about the 'health gurus' of the past, I always think of the saying: "even a stopped clock is right twice a day". Phototherapy is good for seasonal depression, and depression in general.
How?
@@abradolflincler726 It helps the brain produce the chemicals that it's missing. Seasonal depression is partially caused by a lack of light.
Though a stopped clock only ever truly tells you when it broke.
Yes, here in Finland plenty of people use it for seasonal depression in the winter time. The darkness really messes things up.
@@abradolflincler726it helps the body to produce Vitamin D, which is needed to make endorphins and Serotonin. So gut health and Vitamin D intake/levels are really important for every person
My Grandfather ate the same breakfast for 50+ years
Corn and Bran flakes mixed, Spoonful of sugar, cut up banana and whole milk
That's incredibly boring. And not as healthy as they pretend it is. Please don't do that. Cereal is just carbs with vitamins sprayed on it. Barely any nutritional value whatsoever.
My dad did the same thing.
And he survived in spite of the diet.
@@bunchie1966 Why 'in spite' of it? It's a pretty decent light meal, well, minus the sugar of course, but if that's most if not all of the sugar intake for the day than it's completely fine.
@@lemmypop1300 You don’t require any sugar in your diet. Sugar is an addictive poison and cornflakes are full of sugar and almost devoid of nutrition, invented by a religious crackpot,
who thought that meat “inflames passion”.
"Fun" fact about Will Kellog: For all his childhood, his parents thought he was stupid, because he could not read or recognized people (they still put him at work in the factory at 6 years old, and he was promoted as a general sales manager at 15 ^^'). At 20, he realized he was near-sighted and just needed glasses to see....
The fact he still became a manager at 15 without knowing he was nearsighted is funny
It's impressive.
@@cernunnos8344not too different from fast food chains and their 16-19 years old managers... except they have poor quality of life instead of poor eyesight nowadays
"Pain as a cure for mental issues". That is the mindset for a lot of self injury which is very VERY frowned upon.
Doctors back then were actual psychos, good lord
Back then, it wasn't seen as a problem. Today, we kinda-sorta know better.
It was rebranded. It's been "work as a cure for mental illness" for as long as I've lived with my boomer parents
Pain and harm aren't the same thing
Harm leads to a release of endorphins, which leads to a form of compulsion like is also seen with gambling.
Pain is meant to help refocus the brain and get it out of a spiral. It's like how hold water can shock a person out of histrionics
@@AllanTidgwell you can't cause pain without causing harm.
Me about to learn Kellogg's story: "interesting, let's listen to it"
Me after knowing Kellogg's story: "yeah, let's put that away and never talk about it again"
No. Let's keep talking about it. Let's look around and see if there are still "life style healers" that push verifiable nonsense while being thoroughbred unpleasant a-holes to everyone around them. Oh... would you look at that...
I'm grateful for the Sawbones podcast where they sprinkle humor into the subject, usually.
I think there is an episode about Kellogg on "Foods that built America" but this Tasting History was pretty thorough in the history aspect.
I don't remember if it was SYSK or Missed it History where I first heard Kellog's story but yeah, it's one of those that never stops being weird AF
"I stared into the abyss and content not looking into it again."
"... need to get some industrial rollers ..."
You went from 'quick' garum to making proper garum, Max - now I'm looking forward to two years from now when you rent a factory floor for a day just to make corn flakes the proper way. 😆
Yep - the world needs "Max Miller's Milled Maize Masticatables"!
"Hi Andrew! You know how you have budget and we had a fun time making sweets and talking about tits? Listen, I have an idea..."
No need, a simple rolling mill could put out the pressure needed and would do the job easily and cheaply seeing as you can find them for around $150.
Let's hope he doesn't run out of content to the point of trying the yogurt enema 😂
@@rafael_lana 🤣
"Eat Granola and Live" sounds like a threat XD
Trap from the saw franchise?
Sounds like the motto for California's health nut population (I should know).
It's a great motto for a state!
Definitely sounds better than: "Eat Granola or Die"!
I love it anytime "hard tack" makes an appearance
Clack clack!
So do I, fellow Food History Lover!
I think he knows that. He almost always finds a way to work it into the story now.
It become a dopamine trigger for me. I need more clack.
Important detail you left out, Kellogg absolutely called it "Granulah" and only changed it to "Granolah" after losing a copyright infringement suit. He later lost more legal battles against other companies he ripped off, including his brother.
"... named the great ... masticator."
Smooth as a yogurt enema.
Dr. Kellogg was more than a bit of a freak - a prurient weirdo. But his brother had some solid business sense.
Mainly loading the stuff with sugar.
That would be an understatement lol. I feel sorry for William
New word learned today. But honestly, all the religious types are like that: way too interested about what happens inside people's bedrooms.
Freaky flakes
@@CalebCalixFernandez agreed
Kellogg was a complete nut... or corn flake perhaps.
He was quite clearly against that
C.W. Post was the nut, thank you very much lol.
The GrapeNUT@@dragonwitch27
On the contrary, the really interesting thing about all this is how mainstream he was in the medical science and culture of his day and age.
@@dragonwitch27 The grape-nut.
There is a movie about John Kellog, his Sanitarium and making cornflakes called The Road to Wellville. It's a comedy with Anthony Hopkins, Matthew Broderick, John Cusack and Bridget Fonda
The novel the film is based on is also awesome.
As far as I remember, one of the winning arguments in the legal case between John and William was that, because John hadn't wanted to fall foul of rules about doctors advertising themselves through a comercial products. Therefore it was William Kellogg's signature that had been used on all of the packaging and advertising not Johns.
Heck not only that, but since there were no company named Kelloggs yet William Kellogg using his own name for the company was a completely fair game. John had no leg to stand on this.
My great uncle is the designer of Cornelius Rooster. He was an artist and in the late 1950s helped a neighborhood kid with some artwork for a Kellogg cereal contest. He drew Cornelius Rooster. I'm not sure if he was aware of the Kellogg design contest or if he was just helping a kid with a drawing. I'm guessing the contest was open to just children? I've tried to find information on it but nothing exists. Next thing my Great Uncle knows he's seeing his design on a box of Cornflakes.
Neat!
@@stubbornmountaintree my great uncle used to design cereal boxes for G&M back in the 70's and 80's.
Nothing like giant corporations just taking designs and the designers never seeing a dime. You could be a millionaire right now but at least you have a “neat” story
I wonder how he would feel about the vullaby pokemon homage😮
Apparently it was a visiting Welsh woman who gave Kellogg the idea for a rooster as Kellogg sounds very similar to the Welsh word for cockerel. Welsh Patriots was the site where I read that, quite interesting I thought.
Love your videos Max. I've been watching for years now. I'm someone who loves to cook (I'm trained. I've done it professionally though haven't for a long time now). But I've learned so much from you. Learning about food history, recipes and cooking is fascinating, and you do it with such flair and in such an entertaining way. Food is, of course, so central to life. And culture. And so widely varied. Please don't ever stop. You're truly great.
After hearing about William Kellogg's relationship to his brother, I can't help but feel like Dr. Kellogg is Zapp Brannigan and William is Kif Croaker.
Yeah... that seems like an apt comparison.
"William, fetch me my 15 liter a minute butt pump."
William looking dead inside. "Yes sir..."
Particularly the sexlexia.
@@CantankerousDave No, that's the main point at which they differ.
@@MatthewTheWanderer The puritans could be downright freaks. It's odd they got the pop culture reputation for anything different.
That is the best comparison I've ever seen.
I’m going to state the obvious here but you are such an incredible story teller. And the way you incorporate cooking into it is such a unique form of content but so enjoyable. I’ve been subscribed for some time now and will continue to watch ever video. Great work.
"The Road to Wellness" is a great book. The movie was pretty good too.
"One should never interrupt a man's desire to defecate." Hahaha
😂 not me on throne reading this ❤🎉
Words to live by 😆
One of the craziest things to me was later realizing that most, if not all, the silly contraptions from the movie were actual inventions from the Sanitarium.
It’s The Road to Wellville
The movie the road to wellville was so silly until you realized it was no longer a comedy but more of a documentary after reading the history of Dr. Kelogg 🤣
My grandmother grew up in Battle Creek, she used to tell me stories of what she called the cereal wars. Between Kellogg, Post, and G&M.
Ralston Purina used to make cereal as well, including Chex, but sold them off to General Mills a while back.
@@crowing7I've got this vision of a box of Chex labeled "Purina People Chow."
Sounds like the town was well-named.
When I was eight years old, a long long time ago, on a summer vacation, my family visited the Keloggs cereal factory. Every visitor got a plastic wrapped bundle of mini boxes of all of their cereals straight off of the production line. Really fresh cereal is amazing. I remember sitting around the breakfast table and all of us saying, "Even the corn flakes are good!" Of course, that was Will's recipe. Dr. Kellogg sounds like a legit Sadist.
"ENRICH THE BLOOD" is the creepiest tag line I've ever seen casually on an advertisement
"Pre-digested" is right up there XD
Bad blood is responsible for 125% of human disease and mental disorders. Obviously.
Reminds me of Bloodborne.
Proper Khorne Flakes
"ENRICH THE BLOOD, LINE YOUR BRAIN WITH EYES TODAY!"
"The Great Masticator" was also my nickname in high school
I'm sure Rhett beat you to it. ;-)
Mine was "the human pregnancy test"
I think the Redwall books liked using the "instructing everyone to chew at least 20 times, so they eat less, therefore I can eat more" joke a lot. That's immediately where my mind went.
@@masonasaro2118 you got pissed on?
“Stop masticating!” Was what my 6th grade science teacher always told students who were caught eating or chewing gum in class. 😅
It’s official, Max Miller has a super power. Only explanation for how he was able to tell those stories with a straight face. Bravo, friend.
Truly, a man who loves his craft.
Dr. Kellogg was a controversial figure, but I appreciate how sympathetic you are towards every story you tell, without downplaying the abhorrent things someone has done.
I had only previously heard a rough summary of the history of Kellogg cereal, and I'll admit, I kind of want to try making my own breakfast cereal just for fun.
Your dedication to avoiding the spread of misinformation and painting as factual a picture of events as possible, while still being immensely entertaining, is incredible.
It's a skill few have, thank you for sharing it with us!
Also, yogurt enema is nightmare fuel, and sounds like some kind if horrible infection just waiting to happen.
I agree! I love how Max is always careful to be as accurate as possible! Elsewhere it's just more and more misinformation or repeating the same myths (as an Italian it's particularly annoying, since half of our "food tradition" was made up during the past 80 years)
It sounds like a half baked punishment that then turned into a "I'm going to make you think about what you've done" type thing
Dang...
The guy behind Muesli (Bircher )was a bit of a weirdo too. There's something about cereals...
As was the guy behind the first cold cereal, granula.
Don't even get me started on Tony the Tiger...
@@TastingHistory Count Granula, the vegetarian vampire
Looking forward to you diving in to the history of the graham cracker, Sylvester Graham was quite the character, as well @@TastingHistory
Makes sense to me that they were a little unhinged. They're only one step away from being cereal killers.
Try the term "Rollermill". There are a few countertop versions of unknown usefulness.
They are extremely common in the livestock feed industry, and do flatten grain like what you were aiming for. Steamrolling, steaming the grain while or before flattening it basically gets you exactly what you were looking for here.
I have a fuzzy recollection of my great-great-grandfather remarking "the food at the San wasn't bad for a veterinary hospital." I never quite knew what he meant by that until reading "The Road to Wellville" in 1993.
Had to explain what an enema was to my 6 year old. He hasn't stopped giggling since.
Anyone older than that would be disgusted, horrified or traumatized or all of the above...
Now he knows the ticklish spot. Hehehe
@rosameryroajas-delcerro1059 a hole is a hole. We are topologically donuts. What is fundamentally disgusting about whether something is going in or out?
@@jamesyoungquist6923 wtf my guy
🚩
Light therapy for seasonal depression isn't as farfetched as it sounds. He was actually onto something there. UV light stimulates vitamin D production in the human body, which is linked with mood and depression. It's why seasonal affective disorder is a real thing in places with lots of cloudy weather like Seattle and Alaska, and tanning salons get a lot of business in those places.
Alaskan here - thumbs up for light therapy and daily vitamin D supplements.
Yeah but he didn't know any of that.
@@thomasdjonesnRegardless if he did, it did turn into a happy little accident of a discovery.
And it's not like it's the only accidental discovery that benefited us.
Most treatments have limited use. The problem is that most treatments get sold as a panacea by quacks
You still see this today with things like cupping, chlorophyll water, alkaline water, acupuncture, chiropractors...
As a rule of thumb, if a treatment is said to treat unrelated ailments; it's snake oil
Every time I hear someone talk about Kellogg, I have PTSD flashbacks to the scene in The Road to Wellville where Sir Anthony Hopkins, playing Kellogg, demands stool samples from his "patients" and judges them based on their samples' size and consistency.
"No more scent than the heated biscuit!"
I too am scarred.
Ha! You know the version of the chewing song they sing in that movie? When I was a kid, if I ate too quick and started choking, my parents would actually sing that at me (after making sure I was okay), because they thought it was hilarious. I only found out a couple years ago they yoinked it from that movie.
@@benn454 and claimed that his stools “smelled like freshly baked bread”!
I was about to mention this movie. It's pretty fun, although as you mention, some parts of it are really strange!
Wow...
As a resident of Battle Creek Michigan who is currently making renovations at the Post factory, this is amazing to listen to rught now. I am in spitting of the Federal Center that used to be the Battle Creek Sanitarium.
I really liked this video! I grew up not far from Battle Creek, in the heart of the SDA school system - we went to the Kellogg Museum to learn about this. I would encourage you to look into "special K loaf" - it's an adventist meal i grew up eating that is a vegetarian meat loaf made from corn flakes. It sounds gross, but i promise it can be done quite deliciously.
I always thought the Kellogg brother's story would make a great prestige TV miniseries with expensive costumes lol.
9:10 "that's a lot of water" was pretty hilarious i laughed instantaneously lol
The way he said made me chuckle. If it was possible it could be almost as famous as the clack-clack. 🙂🖖💕
Same! 😂
LMAO
I don't know if you still can, but it used to be that bear hunters who wanted sweet and strong smelling bait could go to the Battle Creek Kelloggs plant. There is always cereal and dust on the floor which is waste and not for human consumption. They would do a sweep and collect all the dust and floor cereal and compress it into a large 500lb or so block. Hunters could then break off chunks and leave them out to attract bears.
Great video! You kept your stance, focusing in the original recipe, that's one great feat!
And it's also great that you put the Kellogg brothers in perspective, while usually people try to portrait John as a cruel weirdo or an excentric genius.
From a celebrity sanatorium to a top brand that made possible or affordable or billions (trillions?) of breakfasts, it's such a great story you told!
Max was recently on Sorted Food, in UK. He was a great addition to their antique gadgets series, contributing pearls of wisdom!
Weren't they awesome together?!!!!!!!💖💖💋💋🎈🎈💖💖
I reeeaaallly hope you’ve clipped “That’s a lot of water” to use randomly in future episodes
I went to MSU for half my degree and there is a building on the campus called the Kellog Center. Every student on campus knows the disturbing story of corn flakes. The event hall is where my forensics teacher got married/had his reception. Nice building. Good landscaping.
When I think of “good health” President Taft doesn’t usually come to mind.
But I can certainly imagine him seeking treatment for indigestion.
That’s basically what I said! “I don’t think Taft followed the diet…“
The 400 lb. Taft was once sent to the Philippines. His friends were worried about his health. They wired him a letter asking how he was doing in the tropical heat. He responded that he felt well and had gone horse back ridding that morning.
His friends then wired back asking how the horse was doing.😂
@@jollyjohnthepirate3168 That’s one helluva horse.
@stevesmin or😊lty
Remarkable that of all the dark periods in human history that you’ve touched upon, the cornflakes rabbit hole is one of the darkest I’ve ever seen you approach…
Plenty more if you watch the docuseries called "The Food That Built America." The first season alone is worth a look, if you can sit through ninety minutes of food brand history apiece for three episodes. The rest of the show starting with Season Two cuts the run time down to forty-five minutes per episode while following a specific market (e.g. Famous Amos and Mrs. Fields for cookies, Subway and Blimpie's for submarine sandwiches, Dunkin' and Krispy Kreme for donuts, and the rivalry between Pizza Hut and Domino's).
The first episode starts with the Kelloggs in Michigan, Henry Heinz (the inventor of tomato-based ketchup) in Philadelphia, and John Pemberton (the creator of Coca-Cola) in Atlanta. They even cover Harlan Sanders - yes, _the_ Colonel Sanders - and his start in Hell's Half Acre, Kentucky.
@@AdderTude Oh it's a pretty good series but it doesn't go into detail on the medical career for a reason. I've seen a grown man become pale and faint upon hearing about some of the human medical experimentation Dr. Kellogg was getting away with.
@@emilynelson5985
Yeah, I'm aware of it because it needed to be family-friendly. John was pretty damned stingy and refused to see the bigger picture all because he was the favorite child.
I actually like the profile on Marjorie Post. One of the best businesswomen of the 20th century.
@@AdderTude but seriously. Anyone who does that kind of stuff should be locked up. That man spent his whole career in the painstaking development of unnecessary procedures which were recognized to be unsavory even in their time. The ideas put forward in his “work” are still causing profound harm across the globe to this day which should not be understated. The fact that we can talk about a crazy inventor but not the women trying to recover from the proceedures
Which he invented is crazy.
This has been the best episode I have seen so far! Informative and humorous
“El confleis” for “breakfast cereal (corn flakes)” is a Spanish/ Spanglish word whose existence still makes me chuckle.
Can confirm!
I grew up in Battle Creek, and I went to prom at the Sanitarium. My grandma was a nurse, and she did part of her training there before it closed (as a sanitarium).
I just love your channel and your attention to detail and accuracy. I was apprehensive of watching this episode since I am a Seventh day Adventist and often we misunderstood by way of association with Waco and Kellogg. I was relieved to see your factual account thank you so much for your integrity.
Couple other fun facts which maybe you know and just couldn’t fit into your video, Post did some dirty work behind-the-scenes and that also led to Kellogg’s having difficulty financially (to do with dollar manufacturing). There’s a couple videos I think on the history channel but not 100% sure on that, of the Post Kellogg issue. And secondly, while Kellogg started off in the Adventist church he was removed (you alluded to this) because he started to get more and more extreme, his ideas leading in a direction of harm. Eventually, Kellogg became so obsessed that he even thought plants felt pain which led to him to extreme stress around all food. This stress, I think compounded to his not thinking rationally/clearly. I think that’s still true today (to a lesser degree) for many of us when we get really stressed around food or work or life itself, it can lead to burn out and then we don’t think so clearly. I think relationships suffer when we get to this point. At least as a therapist that’s my take. Anyway, thank you for a great program. I really enjoy watching.
Unfortunately, anti-vegans have been using this comment section as a platform to spread misinformation and hate speech against vegans and Seventh Day Adventists.
That kind of abuse is dangerous because it may lead to hate crimes, as mentioned by this research paper published in a scholarly journal:
*‘Against the cult of veganism’: Unpacking the social psychology and ideology of anti-vegans*
by Rebecca Gregson, Jared Piazza, and Ryan L. Boyd
published November 2022
in Appetite, Volume 178
“Despite the established health and ecological benefits of a plant-based diet, ...individuals who stand vehemently against veganism...have sprung up across the internet. Much scholarship on veganism characterizes anti-vegans in passing, painting them as ill-informed, uneducated, or simply obstinate. ...This largely survey-based body of research has found that those more willing to denigrate vegans are typically...lower-educated individuals”
“Many of the subreddits that r/AntiVegan users frequent, particularly r/darkjokes and r/AccidentalRacism, include the expression of prejudicial attitudes towards groups including (but not limited to) women and people of colour.”
“This increasing popularity of vegan diets has paralleled a rise in selective eating habits, leading to the common misperception that veganism is a new-age fad diet. Far from short-lived, the concept of abstaining from animal-derived food products for ethical reasons, is said to date back some 5000 years to Ancient Egypt, was later popularised by Greek philosopher Pythagoras in around 500 BCE and has a rich tradition among several world religions, including Jainism, Hinduism, and Buddhism”
“Today, with the growing popularity of meat-free diets, anti-vegan sentiments have become increasingly apparent. This has led scholars and legal bodies to recognise anti-veganism as a prejudice, resulting in the protection of “ethical veganism” under the UK Equality Act 2010. Some evidence, reported by The Times, even suggests that vegan-related hate crimes may be on the rise in the UK. According to the article, there were 172 instances of vegan hate crimes between the years 2015-2020, one-third of which occurred in 2020 alone.”
The Hard Tack Tap was totally unexpected.
But oh, so necessary.
Always expect it
Really? When Max started talking about something "being baked to an inch of its life", I thought, "oh, here comes the hard tack". Sure enough. . .
I never get tired of it!
@@virgoboi24
"NOBODY EXPECTS THE HARDTACK INQUISITION!"
*Clack clack*
Father Maximillian
I CACKLED at the horn honk censor when talking about the slapping machine 😂
I always think about the line “sitting on a cornflake!” From I Am The Walrus
I'm only halfway in and this is already SO cool and interesting, it's shedding light on why my parents gave the sort direction on what me and my siblings needed to eat. Granola was from mom. My dad told us to chew our food as long as possible. Man, this is why I love history!
A disturbingly weird and unpleasant individual. I used to think these stories were just urban legend, years back when I first heard them, but then -- nah -- all turns out to be true.
Same. I have yet to internalize the idea that humanity can be this absurd, and I am nearing my 30's...
@@theotherohlourdespadua1131 I'm 35 and its only getting worse.
Kellogg may have been very smart in some respects, but the man was likely very disturbed. Kudos to his younger brother for overshadowing him in success.
And its religion we have to thank for said insanity
@@flannelpillowcase6475 Having grown up as a member of that church, I can agree. It's not all bad but it had some pretty weird spots.
It is baffling that anyone listened to someone who believed that the basic act of reproduction was the root of all evil.
Isn't it? Why do you think civilization is going broke? When humans, or any animal, outbreed their ecosystem, they commit ecocide and die. How many people were alive during Kellog's day? About 3 billion. How many are alive today? 9 Billion? I lost track. Tick tock.
It was actually a fairly prevalent notion. The Catholic Church had been espousing the benefits of celibacy for centuries, it wasn’t a huge step to concluding that everyone, not just the clergy, should abstain.
@@anna9072 Yeah, but if you don't reproduce, it's kind of hard to get new members for your church. Just ask the Shakers. The Catholic Church didn't forbid sex. They just put many restrictions on it.
@@johnopalko5223 no, they didn’t forbid sex, in fact, they considered it a woman’s duty to marry and produce children if she did not “marry” Christ. But they did view the act of sex as inherently sinful, and glorified chastity.
@@johnopalko5223 I think the concept was that they didn’t need to reproduce, that holiness and oneness with god were the goals and that perpetuating the species was an unnecessary distraction. Something like that, anyway.
fun fact: when the original cereal company burned down, William Kellogg had trouble replacing the rollers due to the company being in an exclusive contract with Post and not being able to take on new clients. But Kellogg was a "Returning" Client and so they could certainly help him.
Post was a massive douchecanoe/ yogurt enema
So...then he didn't have trouble replacing the rollers after all?
@@its_cleansounds like they had trouble at first, until they found this "returning client" phrase as a workaround.
I though I could swoop in and make a joke about the funny peepee cereal man, but was stunned by the story about the Kellogg brother's and the sad ending of unreconciled emotions after decades of feuding. Great episode!
damn, that really was an unexpectedly sad story for the origin of cornflakes~ it was heart-wrenching, hearing that the brothers never reconciled because of that meddling assistant. John would've died thinking that his brother still hated him ..and William would've never had the closure of recognition from his brother for his efforts :(
that was amazingly-told though Max -- you're a true storyteller, and it was a pleasure again
My grandfather, who has long since passed, was born in 1922. I never once heard him refer to corn flakes as corn flakes. They were always Post Toasties (even if they weren't from the Post brand!)
My grandmother was born in 22 and also referred to them as "Post Toasties" 😂😂😂 As in, "who peed in your Post Toasties?"
Thanks for another wonderful video, Max. I'm sure I'm not the only one who struggles with, uh, --(gestures broadly at everything around lately)--, and seeing how absolutely passionate and enthusiastic you are to share your research and information lifts my spirits in a really special way, I don't get it much from other UA-camrs I watch. You really do have these "gaw-geous, simply gaw-geous" eyes that exude childlike wonder, and it's such an endearing and, honestly, encouraging thing to see. Also I absolutely love seeing you drop by the Sorted set, same energy and vibe only compounded by their energy and enthusiasm as well. It's silly, but it gives me hope that I'll find joy in things in this life.... of which I generally have little lately. I just wanted to thank you for being you and being able to share yourself with the world, because ... man, that's HARD. Stay positive and I hope nothing but good comes your way!
The Kellogg brothers both lived to 91; maybe there was something to their insane diets.
Adam Ragusea made a great video covering the history of corn flakes, and the specific grain used, as well as the "dough" conundrum was addressed - turns out a wet mass of boiled grain could be called "dough"
Max, have you been working out? You’re looking awesome!
My husband works at the Hinsdale Sanitarium Hospital which was started by Kellogg here in the Chicago area, run by the Adventists in the late 1800s. There are books about the Kellogg people there, along with those photos you have shown.
This is an amazing video!
Thank you. I have been 😁
Try checking in with your local pizza restaurants for rollers. One of the places here uses them to run dough through before adding all the usual pizza fixings! Just sprinkle on some flour to keep it from sticking to the metal rollers.
Yogurt enema is interesting cause it DOES have some scientific merit; the bacteria in yogurt is what your gut needs when youre having microbio issues and an enema IS a much faster and more direct way to the gut than through the usual end. still wouldn't want to try it though...
I imagine it would be especially bad if the yogurt is cold
@@joshc5613 thanks the mental image wasn't clear enough already
Oh wow I guess it's actually a legit thing. Going in the other end protects the probiotics from your stomach acid. And you can make yogurt at home cheaply and easily
But probiotics affect everyone differently, so it isn't always beneficial. Also if you have a weakened immune system the bacteria can overcome it and make you sick
@@Leto_0 I only have strawberry yogurt in the fridge... you think that will work?
@@andersjjensen As long as it still has the yogurt cultures in it, it's all good.
Your struggle to make the flakes mirrors the same issues that William Kellogg had in trying to make them. Eventually he arrived on heavy duty rollers and that solved the issue.
So Max's inability to duplicate the recipe is indeed due to his lack of industrial rollers.
@@ChrisMattern-oh6wx Correct!
Excellent episode, i knew nothing about John's relationship with his brother... thank you for your thorough research. Now I feel like cornflakes and banana, but just a serving or two, and I'm wondering if I'll get far winking at a grocer!!!?!
When my father made polenta, it would leave
a crusty film of cornmeal stuck to the pot. I loved breaking pieces off and nibbling while the table was being set.
Ah, le croste di polenta. Every kids dream in Northern Italy.
There’s a movie about this made in the mid 90s. It’s called “the road to wellville “ it stars John Cusak and it’s actually a pretty good comedy.
Anthony Hopkins plays Kellogg. He's brilliant.
But the star was Matthew Broderick.
"Chew, chew, chewww. Good food is good for youuu 🎶 "
@@Chad48309🎵Chew, chew, chew, but only if you chew; that is the right thing to do!🎵
@@drewharrison6433 not many films can make that claim with Broderick
I stumbled accross this video by accident. So interesting, you kept me hooked with the story. You have a new subscriber. I'm watching more now 👀
I never knew cereal could be so interesting. I learned a lot from the comments too.
My mom was from Battle Creek and every time we went to see family we would visit Kellogg's for a factory tour and a treat at the end of the tour - a scoop of ice cream on top of some sort of colorful sugary cereal Plus get a full variety package of their single serving cereals Post Cereal also gave out variety packs of their single serve cereal when you visited their museum. A museum highlight was the chair Abe Lincoln was sitting in when he was shot - blood included. Creepy and fascinating for all the cousins on the tour.
I'm sure it's part of the wider research, but here in Australia one of our largest cereal companies is called Sanitarium. They got started in the late 1890's when a high ranking Seventh day Adventist William C White came to Australia. He managed to poach a baker from Kellogg in Battle Creek, Edward Halsey, who permanently emigrated. They started with the same foods, Granola and Granose. Eventually they did adjust the recipe with some sugar and Weet-Bix is now probably the most recognized Australian and New Zealand cereal. I also found it interesting that as part of their church founding, they operate totally tax exempt on profits in both countries.
William C. White is also a son of two of the major founders of the Seventh-day Adventist denomination, specifically the main figure Ellen G. White, and his parents eventually moved to the same country.
Granose, it sounds like a Marvel villain. Except that when he snaps half the population receives a yogurt enema!
Instead of a snap, it's two taps of hard tack
I think that would be the point where the Marvel Cinematic Universe has officially given up.
0:14…. I’m sorry yogurt WHAT?!
you know... ;)
Yogurt enema sounds like a weird porn fetish. Which is odd because he wanted people to not masturbate.
As flawed "The Road to Wellville" is as a recounting of Kellogg, it's still a fun film to watch, and Anthony Hopkins is very good in it. It was probably the first time I heard of the origins of Kellogg and the cereal empire, and then I found the actual story over time.
I definitely ate my share of Corn Flakes as a kid, since it's a great sugar delivery vehicle. :)
Easily one of your best historical videos Max! Thank you for this! I knew some, but not all of this story and I really appreciate the completeness without going into too much minutae.
This is by far the earliest I've ever been to a video, how perfect is it to be an episode close to home!
This is one of the topics I was most looking forward to! Can't believe you're finally covering the Kellogg brothers. Thank you for the phenomenal content, Max!
Its worth mentioning that you can visit William Kellogg's house at Cal Poly Pomona. The campus was built on the Kellogg's ranch and still raises the Arabian Horses similar to what Kellogg had.
William Kellogg: “Wink at your grocer.”
Also William Kellogg: “Don’t wink.”
Now, now, I said, that's enough!
I'm up late studying often these days (aussie) so i'm always glad to see a 1am max upload
You should read more about John Harvey. Dude was a damn whackadoo. I'm actually from Battle Creek. Lived there most of my life. Shitty town, so don't visit unless you want good cannabis. Very interesting story though. Dude was so out there. A vegetarian for health reasons then is wild enough on its own. Then he was a big part of a crazy ass church (I'm sure Max covered it), but they're goofy too. Really long hair and skirts only for the girls. Very cult like. Seventh Day Adventists I believe.
@@rickwilliams967Thing is, as crazy as it sounds, Seventh-day Adventists had a point when it comes to health education. They were the only ones that created an area full of centenarians on the basis of mere religion instead of ethnicity. Also, John Harvey Kellogg was a product of his time; most of his contraptions were used in other parts of the world as well as part of the general craziness of the Victorian period medicine. Medicine at that time was highly experimental, and were developing into the modern hospitals we have today, complete with all of the apparatus. The more we consider this, the more we should realize that we are standing on the shoulders of giants.
I'm from Battle Creek, Michigan too. I miss the tours of Kellogg's. We got to smell the making of their cereals when i was at Southeastern Junior high. This video makes me want to dive into a bowl of cereal. 🍴
12:05 All roads lead to Hardtack *CLACK CLACK*
Unfortunately, this is 100% true. John Kellogg was a sick, sick man. The Road to Wellville (1994) is a disturbing and mostly accurate depiction of the weirdness that went down in Battle Creek.
I worked at Kellogg's for 31 years, during which time we used the whole kernel. The kernels were cooked with a flavoring solution and stored for a time to reach the right consistency, resulting in a rubbery red kernel that then went to the mills.
From egypt love your videos when you post a video it makes my day