I have did both. I am 74 years old, so for ease of use I bought several power stations, but since I was an Electrical Contractor for around 50 years I just had to build the DIY systems too. Actually building the DIY systems is a lot of fun.
Very good video. You touched on all of the key points. I was having the same discussion with a guy just the other day, and he was impacted by Milton. He said the advantages of a commercial power station (or a self-made portable power station) are that you can take it with you when getting out of harm's way, and you can use it for other mobile applications, like RV, van-life or camping. On the other side, he said if you're going to stay put during a disaster, the money you saved building your own (stationary or mobile) power solution can go into more solar panels. He said that's absolutely critical during an extended power outage and something he's going to emphasize more in his future preparations.
Excellent analysis. I did the same analysis. Purchased a power station for my parents (in their 80s) and did DIY stuff for me in the 3kw+ range. I did also buy a power station for me in the 1800w class, for exactly the "ease of use, pick it up and go" case - 47 pounds with all the functionality in a comparatively small box is easier to lug around than the smallest equivalent DIY I investigated.
Had an eco flow, but returned within a week. Solar panel is the limiting factor with those in my opinion. The DIY system is a much better value with 24v being more efficient. Could also make a 48v system with 2 24v batteries with even greater efficiency. Victron charge controllers are an excellent product. I started with renogy and it wasn’t doing the job. Switched to victron and have multiple systems and the have worked flawlessly. Great video!
Definitely Noticed the MPTT so much more efficient also doesn’t have to be connected to internet, not that they all do. But a DIY one can be made nice and simple or be complicated link to internet, it’s you choice. I have a few of each system that send power to different areas, I like the fact if one brakes others can simply replace that load.
For 5k tossed together 3.6kw panels ground mounted using some wood, EG4 3kw inverter charger and 10kwh of 48v EG4 batteries. Extremely happy with the whole deal, panels were used from SanTan.
100% agree that both have their place depending on multiple factors that can only be determined by the end user. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience!
I bought a 2300W power station for the RV in the summer and home backup in the winter. I like the mobility of the unit. As for expansion, I built my own with LiFePo batteries because their name branded expansion cost way too much.
Jesse Mueller on UA-cam put in a whole-home power station system that is well worth checking out and it too is self-contained and on solar panels. For my own home, I have a 3600Wh unit from EcoFlow to provide limited but essential backup. (On sale of course) With Aloha...
going off grid next year.. living in an RV.. we are using Renogy for our solar.. 8-100watt panels with 4-100Ah Lipo batteries and a 2000w inverter.. but the shed we are putting on the land will have a Bluetti 1800w power station with 200w of solar.. due to having a 40 amp 100v charge controller we will be running the solar panels in series/parallel.. at some point down the road we will be upgrading the solar controller so we can add more panels..
I did the small power station because i knew it was wise to have some sort of backup in an outage. It was on sale, so i went for it. I plan to go the diy setup when i know what im doing
Good morning from East Coast. And i have to say this again. Your knowledge on the power stations and a solar builds are phenomenal you should write a book. And it's very educational as well and thank you for taking the time to sit down and explain this to us people. Like I can change out breakers and light switches and run some rough and wire and some outlets but getting to the solar I got a lot of good information and explain it simple in layman's terms. Hope you have a good and safe and blessed weekend to you and your family buddy
The most important factor is component failure. A home made rig shines there as opposed to replacing a entire expensive heavy brick. Or hoping someone honors their warranty. Also factor in shipping weight costs for replacement. Victron is the best imho, they are solid.
The portable power stations shine because they're portable. I run a shed using a DIY system. It runs 3 chest freezers with 1200 watts of solar.I use a 36v system because the trolling motor on my boat is 36v. I have a 36v AC charger available and a Litime 60a charge controller. I have 3 power stations. I can throw one in the Gator and run power tools along the back fence. I can carry them in the house to run pretty much anything I need. Like you said, if you want to get up into the 8-30kwh systems, the power stations become cost prohibitive compared to DIY systems.
I started with solar 12 years ago, I still have my MorngingStar charge controller and solar panels.After lead acid,I bought an Oupes Mega2, I now have 2 Mega2 and 4 xtra batteries. After watching one of your previos videos decided to put my charge controller back to work. I bought a 48 volt lifepo 50AH 5060 WH battery for less than half the price of an Oupes xtra. Oupes units are 2048WH each. My next purchase may be a Victron step up transformer then I could run the whole house. Having fun in retirement.
I have 2 large capacity power stations and expansion batteries that are connected to a permanently mounted solar arrays that run 24/7. My refrigerator, 2 freezers, lights and modem are disconnected from the grid unless there is no sun for 2 or 3 days. I live in Florida; when hurricanes hit we could go without electricity for a week or more. I’ve offset my light bill to the point the solar system is paying for itself. I like the ease of the using the plug and play system. As for the cost, I added a little at a time.
I think you can call my system a hybrid. I love power stations as I do not need to be off grid and I know their limitations. I do not believe in expansion batteries specifically made for that unit. I did build a portable diy power station on a hand truck using a 48V system with a server rack battery. I realized that for my need it was not the best way to go as it was to power my fridge and the inverter sucks a lot of energy on idle. Instead I use a Delta 2 Ecoflow with a 1024 battery capacity and an 1800 watt inverter. What I do now is directly connect my 51.2V battery to the Ecoflow and it charges it at 400+ watts and the setup alone will run my 26cu.ft fridge for 55 hours straight before charging it whereas with the 3KW 48V inverter it only ran my fridge for 37 hours.. My fridge is very old so not efficient. If you were to give me 2500 dollars I would buy 2 more 51.2 server rack batteries to expand my capacity to 15KW. It's a heck of a deal. My needs are small for the occasional outages but the extra 10KW batteries would be useful in powering a window unit during the Texas summers. You touched on all good points, great job..
I've got a setup that's a little of both. Sort of. I've got an Ecoflow Delta Pro, the alternator charger from Ecoflow, and a 230ah Litime battery. That gets me to around 6500 kwh of battery. The alternator charger allows me to charge the external battery right from the Delta Pro, or charge the Delta Pro right from the external battery. I've got solar hooked up to the Delta Pro that does a good job on sunny days of charging everything up to get me to the next day if needed. The Delta Pro is connected to my home through a transfer switch and I run everything in the house from it except for the stove, hot water heater, and furnace/AC. It's nice to be able to just unhook the Delta Pro and take it with me if and when I need to (and sometimes I do need to). If we're only counting the Delta Pro, Alternator Charger + adapter, and the Litime battery, I spent just under $2900 thanks to grabbing stuff during sales and have 6500kwh of battery, a 3600 watt inverter, and a good solar charge controller. I think where things start to make far more sense for the DIY side is once you want to expand things beyond that 3600kwh range.
I was about to pull the trigger on an Anker F2000 here in UK for £1700.... Held back, watched some You Tube and built a Renogy 12v (x2) 100ah LiFePo4 with 20A AC charger and 1000w inverter for £700 including crimpers, lugs,cables and fuses (Only need it for TV, internet, lights)...So to supplement it I bought a 2.2kw P1PE (Hyundai engine?) inverter generator and 2x 10 litre fuel cans for £400 which can power some of the bigger things in the house and recharge the batteries during daylight hours.... I'm now, with the £600 I have left (theoretically) getting 2x 220w bifacial Renogy solar panels, 6m cables and a Renogy 40a SCC(£400)..... So for the cost of one "portable box" I have a solar/battery system that's bigger, and a generator to back that up and £300 left over. Biggest downside to solar is the North of Scotland at 57N.... solar hours in December are 0.25 on a good day, that's why a generator is crucial!! It's been a damn steep learning curve in the last 2-3 weeks, only thing I'd do different is maybe 24V to enable cheaper solar panels and double the watts into the controller(s)....(We can get 455w bifacial here in builders merchants for £70). I've stuck with Renogy through this though and if there's any issues there should be no complications as I've not used any "conflicting" parts....But then a lot of this 12V stuff is good for a van conversion at some point, or a garden/summer house should I upgrade the main house system....
Great video with some well thought out points. I may build my own system in the future just for the experience, but for now I have purchased commercial power stations. I have three Anker C1000's which are 1056wh each and a 12v 100Ah Lifepo4 battery that is 1280wh that I can connect to any of the power stations for additional capacity. All together I have 4,448wh of capacity. I got all of the pieces on sale for a total of $1,780 plus the price of a charger for the Lifepo4 battery and a couple of cables. I also have 200 watts of solar, which is pretty useless where I live as we have so many cloudy days. The reason I went with power stations initially, was the cost and convenience. I like the idea I can move them around the house and garage wherever I might need them as well as throw them in the truck if I need to take them somewhere to use. I also like the idea of being able to take one or two of them to my kids houses if they have a power outage and need to keep their refrigerator going for a while. I priced out an equivalent homemade system and it would have been more expensive. I am also going to get a dual fuel inverter generator to charge the power stations when it is too cloudy for solar in the event of an extended power outage.
Trace was much better than Xantrex has ever been, and Outback is it if it just absolutely CAN NOT FAIL, but dang they are expensive. My VFX2812 has been running non-stop 24-7 for so many years I can't even remember now.
The key cost for a large power station is the storage component and (often) its limited solar wattage capabilities. It turns out that the solar and battery components are the easiest to build a system using discrete components. Your solar panels, discrete charge controller(s) (like the Victron), and discrete LiFePO4 batteries. Plus some fusing for safety. People who go whole-hog on the discrete components also throw in DC breakers as convenient 2-pole disconnects (makes maintenance easier), a shunt to monitor the state of charge, combiner boxes to accomodate more solar, and it goes on. But a beginner making a smaller system can skip most of that and simply just have a main battery fuse. Any outputs from the discrete battery system should also be individually fused or breakerd. LiFePO4 battery banks are very powerful beasts, so safety is paramount. -- Then it gets into the weeds. What system voltage do you choose? More technically minded people often go straight to 48V (aka 51.2V LiFePO4 batteries), because a higher system voltage has a whole slew of advantages. But using a lower 24V (25.6V LiFePO4) system voltage has the unique advantage of being able to connect the system directly to the "solar" input of a power station to charge the power station at a decent clip. 48V system voltages are often too high for the power station's solar input thus requiring a DC-DC to really make it work. My go-to Victron charge controller is either a Smart Solar 100/20 or a 150/35. Both of these can handle 12/24/48 system voltages and are very cost competitive. At 25.6V a single low-cost Victron 100/20 can handle roughly 512W of solar and at 51.2V the 100/20 can handle over 1000W of solar. The Victron 150/35 has a more generous DC voltage range so it can handle small strings of solar panels plus a lot of paralleling (if necessary) of solar with its 35A output. -- The output component is where power stations can be really useful again. Since you've already got all the storage you need, you can buy a cheaper, smaller power station that just gives you the AC wattage you need without necessarily having to have a lot of built-in storage. That gives you nice protected AC outlets, 12VDC, and USB-A and USB-C outlets, plus portability all in one convenient little package. The power station can be charged directly from the discrete battery bank or (at worst) through a DC-DC, so you aren't limited by the power station's solar panel limitations. It can trickle-charge at a decent clip 24x7 from the system battery, as needed. And there is nothing preventing you from also connecting your discrete battery system to multiple power stations and multiple discrete inverters as you get comfortable with and slowly scale up your system. The biggest advantage of having a discrete solar + charge controller + battery system is the flexibility. You can do almost anything with it. -Matt
So old jarhead, is semper fi appropriate? If so then a retired “doc” here. Ha any way was going to build but kids talked me out of it as they think I might get bit and they need to remind me I do have a pacemaker . So first great video, now I want to be able to set and forget with solar panels to run chest freeEr and refrigerator/freezer when we need to evacuate and or loose power. I live on gulf coast of florida near cedar key and we stayed so far this year to feed the generators even so they recommended we leave. Whew so bottom line which brand do you recommend in 3500 watt area Thanks John
Semper Fi Doc (and yes - we love our docs!) - I like what Sunelec does sunelec.com/solar-panel-kits-systems/ but I'd not get the FLA's. So drop the batteries and replace with LiFePo4's. Now, I've bought all my panels from them and my original system was mostly from them (I just called them and discussed what I wanted and then sourced my batteries locally). But if you are having someone else put it together, then I'd probably look for someone who can do similar around the same pricing. I'm not sure they are the best priced out there and you could call Backwoods Solar (in Idaho) as well (they are great guys!) and just tell them what you want and see what they come up with. Also I think AltEStore is still around and I'd be happy to see if they are. Best bet is to get someone to provide a quote on the whole system as you will get to see all the components that way :D
I see alot of channels talking about power stations, once they are out of warranty, or you buy it used,or at least one I saw if you don't buy direct,how do you get them repaired?
I bought 2 Delta 2s during the recent sale. 459 each. I doubt they made that much money on them considering the battery, solar charger, AC charger, and inverter. Bought 2 JJN bifacial 200 watt panels. Two more on the way. It’s a start. I’m not a DIY kind of person. Wish that I was. But I’m pretty smart too. I can figure this out. And I like to save a dollar when I can.
Serious question. What does the home owner insurance companies say about DIY Solar vs commercial solar added into the homes electrical system? If you put a DIY system and you don’t have it inspected. If your house catches on fire, would the Insurance not pay out since you didn’t have it inspected?
You would have to have it inspected, just like any electrical add on -- I added 500sqft to a home once and every inch had to be inspected and it would be the same for DIY solar.
We have 3 ecoflow delta 2 s. They're easy to have instant power in spots where power isn't easily set up. Amazon prime day is the time to buy them, you will save hundreds of dollars. Now we have new not set up an 8000 watt split phase invertor and nearly 2000 watts of solar panels on our house waiting to be hooked up lol we need it to run our well without starting the generator. Next week hopefully it will be in operation, the batteries are in just need to run to town and get them. It all takes lots of time and effort ,nobody here is idle but when everything needs to be cleared of trees homesteading takes time. So power stations are great , I love them tbh but darn it I want to flush my toilet without lifting a pail of water to do so...thanks for the video
@TheOldJarhead your perspective of how it all takes longer than you first think it will is so true. I don't think being younger would help much, time is truly the most precious resource we have!
I built my offgrid system . Panels , batteries , enverters , ext. It's a lot of power . I try and tell people build your own powering. I know there are good all in one's. But whaoo are they high .
@TheOldJarhead I have a small solar system, I can break it down in about 20 minutes pack it up find a nice spot,park or side of road ,good to go,remember one thing military teaches,how to be homeless 😎
@TheOldJarhead I use cheap components, home built system, however,years ago I was working at a walmart after a hurricane bought a ups backup used for computers,it was on the shelf, walmart was running on generator so I charge it at work take it home to run a light and charge phone,SO with a power station and you can find somewhere that has power,charge it,take it home good to go
If you need portable a power station will always win. How ever once a DIY setup is installed you can put a victron smart shunt in and becids portable that's the only way a power station would win.
I'll dig them up but I ran the AIMS 4kw inverter charger from 2013 until early, this year when I switched to a SunGoldPower version with LiFePo4 settings. Heavy buggers but last forever
You need a power source to keep a power station charged. When it runs out of power you have nothing. That's why I have a 3000W generator with batteries and an inverter rather than a power station.
Build a house that can't burn Pumicecrete is by far the best building material on the planet. Pumicecrete is a mixture of pumice cement and water mixed and poured into a set of reusable forms walls are poured from 12"to 24" thick pumicecrete is fireproof termite proof rust rot and mold proof non toxic and has a high R value and good sound attenuation solid poured walls means no critters can live in your walls Pumicecrete can be built for a fraction of the cost and time and pumice is a perfect DIY project Google all the walls of my house are made of pumicecrete Take care Ray
I have did both. I am 74 years old, so for ease of use I bought several power stations, but since I was an Electrical Contractor for around 50 years I just had to build the DIY systems too. Actually building the DIY systems is a lot of fun.
Makes total sense, you can't beat that experience!
Very good video. You touched on all of the key points. I was having the same discussion with a guy just the other day, and he was impacted by Milton. He said the advantages of a commercial power station (or a self-made portable power station) are that you can take it with you when getting out of harm's way, and you can use it for other mobile applications, like RV, van-life or camping. On the other side, he said if you're going to stay put during a disaster, the money you saved building your own (stationary or mobile) power solution can go into more solar panels. He said that's absolutely critical during an extended power outage and something he's going to emphasize more in his future preparations.
Good points!
Excellent analysis. I did the same analysis. Purchased a power station for my parents (in their 80s) and did DIY stuff for me in the 3kw+ range. I did also buy a power station for me in the 1800w class, for exactly the "ease of use, pick it up and go" case - 47 pounds with all the functionality in a comparatively small box is easier to lug around than the smallest equivalent DIY I investigated.
Totally agree - portability is key sometimes.
Had an eco flow, but returned within a week. Solar panel is the limiting factor with those in my opinion.
The DIY system is a much better value with 24v being more efficient. Could also make a 48v system with 2 24v batteries with even greater efficiency.
Victron charge controllers are an excellent product. I started with renogy and it wasn’t doing
the job. Switched to victron and have multiple systems and the have worked flawlessly.
Great video!
Totally agree - you can do a lot with DIY!
Definitely
Noticed the MPTT so much more efficient also doesn’t have to be connected to internet, not that they all do.
But a DIY one can be made nice and simple or be complicated link to internet, it’s you choice.
I have a few of each system that send power to different areas, I like the fact if one brakes others can simply replace that load.
Amen!
I have both. Cost and curiosity, are the biggest factors for me.
Makes perfect sense!
For 5k tossed together 3.6kw panels ground mounted using some wood, EG4 3kw inverter charger and 10kwh of 48v EG4 batteries. Extremely happy with the whole deal, panels were used from SanTan.
Sounds like a great setup!
100% agree that both have their place depending on multiple factors that can only be determined by the end user. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience!
Thanks!
I bought a 2300W power station for the RV in the summer and home backup in the winter. I like the mobility of the unit. As for expansion, I built my own with LiFePo batteries because their name branded expansion cost way too much.
That's a great idea. You can't beat the price of a DIY expansion battery!
Jesse Mueller on UA-cam put in a whole-home power station system that is well worth checking out and it too is self-contained and on solar panels. For my own home, I have a 3600Wh unit from EcoFlow to provide limited but essential backup. (On sale of course) With Aloha...
A 3600Wh unit is definitely a good start. You might find that you'll want to add more capacity or add another station in the future.
going off grid next year.. living in an RV.. we are using Renogy for our solar.. 8-100watt panels with 4-100Ah Lipo batteries and a 2000w inverter.. but the shed we are putting on the land will have a Bluetti 1800w power station with 200w of solar.. due to having a 40 amp 100v charge controller we will be running the solar panels in series/parallel.. at some point down the road we will be upgrading the solar controller so we can add more panels..
That sounds like a great setup. You'll get great use out of that Bluetti power station.
I did the small power station because i knew it was wise to have some sort of backup in an outage. It was on sale, so i went for it. I plan to go the diy setup when i know what im doing
Victron is a top brand too! quality product.
That's why I used them 😉
Very well thought out video, thanks and Semper Fidelis.
Thanks! Semper Fi!
Saw the Jeep so checked out your channel and subbed. You can see my jeep at TheOldJarheadsJeep
@@TheOldJarhead Subscribed. Good looking JK
Thanks! I love my 10A ;)@@Montana_Outdoor_Adventures
Good morning from East Coast. And
i have to say this again. Your knowledge on the power stations and a solar builds are phenomenal you should write a book. And it's very educational as well and thank you for taking the time to sit down and explain this to us people. Like I can change out breakers and light switches and run some rough and wire and some outlets but getting to the solar I got a lot of good information and explain it simple in layman's terms. Hope you have a good and safe and blessed weekend to you and your family buddy
Thanks so much!
@@TheOldJarhead welcome
👍
The most important factor is component failure. A home made rig shines there as opposed to replacing a entire expensive heavy brick. Or hoping someone honors their warranty. Also factor in shipping weight costs for replacement. Victron is the best imho, they are solid.
Yup, agreed.
The portable power stations shine because they're portable.
I run a shed using a DIY system. It runs 3 chest freezers with 1200 watts of solar.I use a 36v system because the trolling motor on my boat is 36v. I have a 36v AC charger available and a Litime 60a charge controller.
I have 3 power stations. I can throw one in the Gator and run power tools along the back fence. I can carry them in the house to run pretty much anything I need.
Like you said, if you want to get up into the 8-30kwh systems, the power stations become cost prohibitive compared to DIY systems.
Makes sense! I love the flexibility a power station offers.
I started with solar 12 years ago, I still have my MorngingStar charge controller and solar panels.After lead acid,I bought an Oupes Mega2, I now have 2 Mega2 and 4 xtra batteries. After watching one of your previos videos decided to put my charge controller back to work. I bought a 48 volt lifepo 50AH 5060 WH battery for less than half the price of an Oupes xtra. Oupes units are 2048WH each. My next purchase may be a Victron step up transformer then I could run the whole house. Having fun in retirement.
Nice!
It’s great to see that you’re still making your system work for you!
I have 2 large capacity power stations and expansion batteries that are connected to a permanently mounted solar arrays that run 24/7. My refrigerator, 2 freezers, lights and modem are disconnected from the grid unless there is no sun for 2 or 3 days. I live in Florida; when hurricanes hit we could go without electricity for a week or more. I’ve offset my light bill to the point the solar system is paying for itself. I like the ease of the using the plug and play system. As for the cost, I added a little at a time.
Sounds like a great setup, congrats!
I think you can call my system a hybrid. I love power stations as I do not need to be off grid and I know their limitations. I do not believe in expansion batteries specifically made for that unit. I did build a portable diy power station on a hand truck using a 48V system with a server rack battery. I realized that for my need it was not the best way to go as it was to power my fridge and the inverter sucks a lot of energy on idle. Instead I use a Delta 2 Ecoflow with a 1024 battery capacity and an 1800 watt inverter. What I do now is directly connect my 51.2V battery to the Ecoflow and it charges it at 400+ watts and the setup alone will run my 26cu.ft fridge for 55 hours straight before charging it whereas with the 3KW 48V inverter it only ran my fridge for 37 hours.. My fridge is very old so not efficient. If you were to give me 2500 dollars I would buy 2 more 51.2 server rack batteries to expand my capacity to 15KW. It's a heck of a deal. My needs are small for the occasional outages but the extra 10KW batteries would be useful in powering a window unit during the Texas summers. You touched on all good points, great job..
Sounds like a great setup that really works for you!
Take a look at the Pecron E3600LP.
I've heard it's a great unit for the money.
Great video.. appreciate you sharing it. Take care
You bet!
Thanks for your video
Appreciate you checking it out!
I've got a setup that's a little of both. Sort of.
I've got an Ecoflow Delta Pro, the alternator charger from Ecoflow, and a 230ah Litime battery. That gets me to around 6500 kwh of battery. The alternator charger allows me to charge the external battery right from the Delta Pro, or charge the Delta Pro right from the external battery. I've got solar hooked up to the Delta Pro that does a good job on sunny days of charging everything up to get me to the next day if needed.
The Delta Pro is connected to my home through a transfer switch and I run everything in the house from it except for the stove, hot water heater, and furnace/AC.
It's nice to be able to just unhook the Delta Pro and take it with me if and when I need to (and sometimes I do need to).
If we're only counting the Delta Pro, Alternator Charger + adapter, and the Litime battery, I spent just under $2900 thanks to grabbing stuff during sales and have 6500kwh of battery, a 3600 watt inverter, and a good solar charge controller.
I think where things start to make far more sense for the DIY side is once you want to expand things beyond that 3600kwh range.
Sounds like a very well thought out system!
I was about to pull the trigger on an Anker F2000 here in UK for £1700.... Held back, watched some You Tube and built a Renogy 12v (x2) 100ah LiFePo4 with 20A AC charger and 1000w inverter for £700 including crimpers, lugs,cables and fuses (Only need it for TV, internet, lights)...So to supplement it I bought a 2.2kw P1PE (Hyundai engine?) inverter generator and 2x 10 litre fuel cans for £400 which can power some of the bigger things in the house and recharge the batteries during daylight hours.... I'm now, with the £600 I have left (theoretically) getting 2x 220w bifacial Renogy solar panels, 6m cables and a Renogy 40a SCC(£400)..... So for the cost of one "portable box" I have a solar/battery system that's bigger, and a generator to back that up and £300 left over. Biggest downside to solar is the North of Scotland at 57N.... solar hours in December are 0.25 on a good day, that's why a generator is crucial!! It's been a damn steep learning curve in the last 2-3 weeks, only thing I'd do different is maybe 24V to enable cheaper solar panels and double the watts into the controller(s)....(We can get 455w bifacial here in builders merchants for £70). I've stuck with Renogy through this though and if there's any issues there should be no complications as I've not used any "conflicting" parts....But then a lot of this 12V stuff is good for a van conversion at some point, or a garden/summer house should I upgrade the main house system....
Sounds awesome
Great video with some well thought out points. I may build my own system in the future just for the experience, but for now I have purchased commercial power stations. I have three Anker C1000's which are 1056wh each and a 12v 100Ah Lifepo4 battery that is 1280wh that I can connect to any of the power stations for additional capacity. All together I have 4,448wh of capacity. I got all of the pieces on sale for a total of $1,780 plus the price of a charger for the Lifepo4 battery and a couple of cables. I also have 200 watts of solar, which is pretty useless where I live as we have so many cloudy days.
The reason I went with power stations initially, was the cost and convenience. I like the idea I can move them around the house and garage wherever I might need them as well as throw them in the truck if I need to take them somewhere to use. I also like the idea of being able to take one or two of them to my kids houses if they have a power outage and need to keep their refrigerator going for a while.
I priced out an equivalent homemade system and it would have been more expensive. I am also going to get a dual fuel inverter generator to charge the power stations when it is too cloudy for solar in the event of an extended power outage.
That's smart to have both a generator and solar for charging. It gives you options!
Trace was much better than Xantrex has ever been, and Outback is it if it just absolutely CAN NOT FAIL, but dang they are expensive. My VFX2812 has been running non-stop 24-7 for so many years I can't even remember now.
Love my outback!
The key cost for a large power station is the storage component and (often) its limited solar wattage capabilities. It turns out that the solar and battery components are the easiest to build a system using discrete components. Your solar panels, discrete charge controller(s) (like the Victron), and discrete LiFePO4 batteries. Plus some fusing for safety.
People who go whole-hog on the discrete components also throw in DC breakers as convenient 2-pole disconnects (makes maintenance easier), a shunt to monitor the state of charge, combiner boxes to accomodate more solar, and it goes on. But a beginner making a smaller system can skip most of that and simply just have a main battery fuse.
Any outputs from the discrete battery system should also be individually fused or breakerd. LiFePO4 battery banks are very powerful beasts, so safety is paramount.
--
Then it gets into the weeds. What system voltage do you choose? More technically minded people often go straight to 48V (aka 51.2V LiFePO4 batteries), because a higher system voltage has a whole slew of advantages. But using a lower 24V (25.6V LiFePO4) system voltage has the unique advantage of being able to connect the system directly to the "solar" input of a power station to charge the power station at a decent clip. 48V system voltages are often too high for the power station's solar input thus requiring a DC-DC to really make it work.
My go-to Victron charge controller is either a Smart Solar 100/20 or a 150/35. Both of these can handle 12/24/48 system voltages and are very cost competitive. At 25.6V a single low-cost Victron 100/20 can handle roughly 512W of solar and at 51.2V the 100/20 can handle over 1000W of solar. The Victron 150/35 has a more generous DC voltage range so it can handle small strings of solar panels plus a lot of paralleling (if necessary) of solar with its 35A output.
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The output component is where power stations can be really useful again. Since you've already got all the storage you need, you can buy a cheaper, smaller power station that just gives you the AC wattage you need without necessarily having to have a lot of built-in storage. That gives you nice protected AC outlets, 12VDC, and USB-A and USB-C outlets, plus portability all in one convenient little package. The power station can be charged directly from the discrete battery bank or (at worst) through a DC-DC, so you aren't limited by the power station's solar panel limitations. It can trickle-charge at a decent clip 24x7 from the system battery, as needed.
And there is nothing preventing you from also connecting your discrete battery system to multiple power stations and multiple discrete inverters as you get comfortable with and slowly scale up your system.
The biggest advantage of having a discrete solar + charge controller + battery system is the flexibility. You can do almost anything with it.
-Matt
You make a great point about the flexibility of DIY systems - they can really be scaled up to do almost anything you want.
So old jarhead, is semper fi appropriate? If so then a retired “doc” here. Ha any way was going to build but kids talked me out of it as they think I might get bit and they need to remind me I do have a pacemaker . So first great video, now I want to be able to set and forget with solar panels to run chest freeEr and refrigerator/freezer when we need to evacuate and or loose power. I live on gulf coast of florida near cedar key and we stayed so far this year to feed the generators even so they recommended we leave. Whew so bottom line which brand do you recommend in 3500 watt area
Thanks
John
Semper Fi Doc (and yes - we love our docs!) - I like what Sunelec does sunelec.com/solar-panel-kits-systems/ but I'd not get the FLA's. So drop the batteries and replace with LiFePo4's. Now, I've bought all my panels from them and my original system was mostly from them (I just called them and discussed what I wanted and then sourced my batteries locally). But if you are having someone else put it together, then I'd probably look for someone who can do similar around the same pricing.
I'm not sure they are the best priced out there and you could call Backwoods Solar (in Idaho) as well (they are great guys!) and just tell them what you want and see what they come up with. Also I think AltEStore is still around and I'd be happy to see if they are. Best bet is to get someone to provide a quote on the whole system as you will get to see all the components that way :D
OH and don't forget to check out signature Solar -- good guys there too!
I see alot of channels talking about power stations, once they are out of warranty, or you buy it used,or at least one I saw if you don't buy direct,how do you get them repaired?
That is a good question, and I have one I'm testing that could answer that, but all of them should be capable of swapping out the cells.
I'm going 48v in my build. Save a fortune on copper that way.
Yes!
Having done both I would buy again a power station with warranty. Mainly because I have limited space in my van.
They are handy 😉
@@TheOldJarhead Failed to mention it fit my limited space. Another great video!
Nice! Always a win when something fits just right, right? Thanks for watching!
I bought 2 Delta 2s during the recent sale. 459 each. I doubt they made that much money on them considering the battery, solar charger, AC charger, and inverter. Bought 2 JJN bifacial 200 watt panels. Two more on the way. It’s a start. I’m not a DIY kind of person. Wish that I was. But I’m pretty smart too. I can figure this out. And I like to save a dollar when I can.
And that's the key! You are combining both 😉
Serious question. What does the home owner insurance companies say about DIY Solar vs commercial solar added into the homes electrical system? If you put a DIY system and you don’t have it inspected. If your house catches on fire, would the Insurance not pay out since you didn’t have it inspected?
You would have to have it inspected, just like any electrical add on -- I added 500sqft to a home once and every inch had to be inspected and it would be the same for DIY solar.
We have 3 ecoflow delta 2 s. They're easy to have instant power in spots where power isn't easily set up. Amazon prime day is the time to buy them, you will save hundreds of dollars. Now we have new not set up an 8000 watt split phase invertor and nearly 2000 watts of solar panels on our house waiting to be hooked up lol we need it to run our well without starting the generator. Next week hopefully it will be in operation, the batteries are in just need to run to town and get them. It all takes lots of time and effort ,nobody here is idle but when everything needs to be cleared of trees homesteading takes time. So power stations are great , I love them tbh but darn it I want to flush my toilet without lifting a pail of water to do so...thanks for the video
Nice! and agreed, especially the toilet, though we use a camp mug to flush ours 😆
@TheOldJarhead do you live off grid full time? If not trust me it gets old.
I have yes, but I do not now.
@TheOldJarhead your perspective of how it all takes longer than you first think it will is so true. I don't think being younger would help much, time is truly the most precious resource we have!
Amen! When I was younger I could work harder, longer and more often but today...not so much lol
I built my offgrid system . Panels , batteries , enverters , ext. It's a lot of power .
I try and tell people build your own powering. I know there are good all in one's. But whaoo are they high .
You can definitely save money doing it yourself.
Whole house alternative power system,flood ,hurricane, can't find the house it was here yesterday
That will always be an issue for catastrophic events
@TheOldJarhead I have a small solar system, I can break it down in about 20 minutes pack it up find a nice spot,park or side of road ,good to go,remember one thing military teaches,how to be homeless 😎
Ahh I see your point. Yes that works well with power stations.
@TheOldJarhead I use cheap components, home built system, however,years ago I was working at a walmart after a hurricane bought a ups backup used for computers,it was on the shelf, walmart was running on generator so I charge it at work take it home to run a light and charge phone,SO with a power station and you can find somewhere that has power,charge it,take it home good to go
@Bob-p2q9q Good point
If you need portable a power station will always win. How ever once a DIY setup is installed you can put a victron smart shunt in and becids portable that's the only way a power station would win.
No usb ports, no 110plug in, no 30amp plug in for RVs. Non portable. The EcoFlow won this fight I think.
For portable sure but cost above 3kwh no.
Even with a power station if you don't have solar it's just a battery.
Yup
Good Morning ! I SUBD you a while back & been watching you. Where in your play list is your low frequency inverter choice & build PLEASE. TAKE CARE..
I'll dig them up but I ran the AIMS 4kw inverter charger from 2013 until early, this year when I switched to a SunGoldPower version with LiFePo4 settings. Heavy buggers but last forever
ua-cam.com/video/Vde6fJ24Y68/v-deo.html I think this is the first video I mention the AIMS inverter in. Cheers!
You need a power source to keep a power station charged. When it runs out of power you have nothing. That's why I have a 3000W generator with batteries and an inverter rather than a power station.
For most cases I agree though I add solar too
Build a house that can't burn
Pumicecrete is by far the best building material on the planet.
Pumicecrete is a mixture of pumice cement and water mixed and poured into a set of reusable forms walls are poured from 12"to 24" thick pumicecrete is fireproof termite proof rust rot and mold proof non toxic and has a high R value and good sound attenuation solid poured walls means no critters can live in your walls Pumicecrete can be built for a fraction of the cost and time and pumice is a perfect DIY project
Google all the walls of my house are made of pumicecrete
Take care Ray
Thanks for sharing your insights on pumicecrete, Ray! It's amazing to see such innovative building materials gaining attention.
EG 4 6000 watt inverter + EG 4 5kw server rack battery much cheaper
Signature solar
Definitely DIY systems are hard to beat!
Components in a power station are not replaceable or repairable or as reliable.
That's why I prefer to have both!