Per TENNISMEDIA @luciahoff on X After contacting ITIA this afternoon, I just got an email back with the clarification regarding Jannik Sinner's case to my question, if it's made public right away when a player fails a doping test. "No it does not. The WADA rules dictate when cases become public. When any player has a finding, there is a very carefully managed process to confirm the finding, investigate and then next steps agreed. If a player is provisionally suspended, then we announce it. Once a case is concluded, we announce it. In this case, the player was issued with a provisional suspension for each of the findings. On both occasions he successfully appealed the provisional suspensions to an independent arbitrator. Once an appeal is successful, it remains anonymous. Had the player's appeal been turned down, it would have been announced. I hope that clarifies." Sinner Favorite for the US Open? 👉 ua-cam.com/video/ISzfvKAczV8/v-deo.htmlsi=hVNvKMPDmyeVi3mV
Many questions remain: are the appeals normally handled very quickly? it is the case for every player? so the appeal is successful, but the investigation continues? what is the regular process here? what are the rules? any explanation? Also, the player was declared innocent, so why is he penalized (400 points, and prize money)? again, what are the rules here?
As Cahill clarified the difference between Halep and Sinner was that the origin of the doping substance was quickly determined by Sinner Staff. His team promptly presented the appeal and had the suspension lifted. I think in the case of Halep it took very long time to understand thw origin and provide explanations. The rest is just gossip
Recently there was a very similar case that was ruled exactly the same way. Look up Marco Bortolotti. Who was not a big star. So to just assume their was favoritsm looks unfounded.
Bro are you serious right now? The guy you bring up as an example that no favoritism is involved is also Italian like Sinner. C’mon man. One of the main things people are saying is that there is an unfair treatment toward Eastern countries like Russia, Romania, Croatia, Serbia. In addition, the head of the ATP since 2020 is himself Italian
@@kevinbrianfahyin Italy the substance is used in a lot of preparations over the counter, so it’s easier for Italian players to get in contact with the substance
@@Eyesonly302 Jarry's case was different, and as such treated differently. In fact he was deemed guilty of negligence after getting caught with 2 substances in his blood, ingested through contaminated supplements. I get that you're eager to point out unfairness, but you should at least inform yourself how and why cases are different and why they were differently treated. All the documentation is public.
@@kevinbrianfahy There's another italian player deemed guilty and suspended for 4 years called Stefano Battaglino. So? Where's the favoritism? You guys talk about things you do not know nor you have bothered to inform yourselves about.
Curious. If trace amounts of certain substances have no performance impact, why aren't there permitted levels in place. Surely, there's a reason that bans are given for even the smallest amounts detected, otherwise why would the lower limit be set at this level in the first place.
Good question! Reasons could be a strict zero tolerance approach and to make sure ppl do not try to microdose to get away with just below minimum values. If the substance is not readily available and easy to not ingest it's not strange to just put the responsibility completely with the player to not have it at all. For this substance it is a bit trickier for ppl in Italy since it is inside over the counter products, something an international rule probably does not take into account.
Trofodermin is pure Clostebol. It is not a pharmaceutical product where Clostebol is only one of the ingredients among others. As a pharmacist, I have never heard of an anabolic androgenic steroid being used to heat a cut on a finger. This is a real snow job on people who are not familiar with drug pharmacokinetics.
They published the actual prescription drug used. It's a 5% concentration spray. Apparently it's sold over the counter in Italy for treatment of small epidermal lesions.
Rules says that even if you are innocent (unaware and no wrong-doing) but there are traces of banned substances (1/billion of 1 gram) you need to forfeit the prize anyway. Both points and money.
It isn't a fine, he automatically loses points and prize money from the tournament where the positive test occurred. That's just standard no matter the outcome of the investigation.
@@joannemoore3976 i think that was too much penalty already. A caution was enough - u cd get this form of contamination from a handshake with someone. u know the so called doping in this case is a joke
Every doping scandal seems to be a trace amount so I’m not sure that’s important. The reason given is very ‘the dog ate my homework’ surely copious amounts would have to be transferred to result it being at all present in a sample probably several days later. How many lacerations did they both have? It seems off.
Double standards. Imagine this with Novak or any Russian player. What about Simona? Why wasn't Sinner suspended for the investigation and he continued to play in the Masters? Why was this hidden from us for six months? Seriously, the physio bought a spray that is labeled "not for use by athletes" in Italy, where there are dozens of cases around this spray, then he cut himself, after the cut, a member of Sinner's team suggested the physio to use this spray, no one even bothered to check the label considering that it’s very well known problem in Italy. Then the physio massaged him with his cut hands, but without gloves and of course the physio doesn't remember if he washed his hands. The spray evaporates instantly, it's just some kind of joke. They take us all for fools. It’s too big of a business to let the media guys go off the rails. There are always those who are allowed more than others. Well, the director of ATP is Italian. How unlucky Sinner was...
Sinner didn’t really prove anything but testing positive. What his team claims is at least dubois from some angles. Also the amount caught doesn’t represent what he might have been using, that’s why if you test positive you test positive regardless of the amount, furthermore he tested positive TWICE!, something fishy going on for sure.
Speculative conversations: Umberto : "Hey, Giamcomo, why don't you try this cream on that cut of yours". Giamcomo : "What's this say ? Closte .., closterbal .., clostebol! Hey, isn't that the stuff that 38 of our compatriots have tested positive for recently?" Umberto: "Don't worry yourself about that - you're not the one competing". Giamcomo: "Yeah, but .." Jannik : "Hey Giamcomo, how about my massage". Giamcomo : "Sure boss". Jannik : "Shouldn't you wear gloves to keep the massage oil off that dressing on your cut? And my psoriasiform dermatitis is pretty bad right now. There's even broken skin". Giamcomo : "Don't worry about it boss. I've handled worse. Do you think your feet are good for three or four hours of running each day for the next week, by the way ?". Jannik : "Guys, I've tested positive for clostebol! How the f*** ?" Umberto : "Look boss, don't get angry, but .." Actual statements: Jannik : "“We knew it straight away and we were aware of what happened. We went straight away and I was suspended for two, three days." Question: If it was so simple to identify the source, how come you were all so negligent in the first place". Jannik : "I always believe that I kept playing tennis because in my mind I knew that I haven’t done anything wrong" Observation : Missed the Olympics, where the athletes are vigorously tested for doping? This all smells bad & leaves a very bad taste.
Minuscule amount in the drug test wouldn’t enhance his performance? There’s minuscule amount when the drug test is done, cuz the bulk of it had already washed out of his system. Do other cheaters caught have large amount of a banned substance in the drug test? It’s always trace amount. Why? Cheaters know the pharmacokinetics of a substance and will take it so that by the time the drug test is done, the drug is washed out of the system by the kidneys or by the liver. Often times they get caught because the substance is removed slower than expected due to other factors, like drug interactions, which slows down the kidneys or the liver, or illness can alter the removal process, allowing the substances to circulate in the body longer than expected.
You can fantasize about many situations but none of those have been proven. 3 experts have looked at this case and stated that the contamination scenario given in Sinner's defense is highly likely and consistent with the results of the test. There is no evidence to suggest otherwise. So all what you are doing is baseless speculation, which is not a basis to judge players or punishments on.
@alessandrovalente7645 well ppl don't buy it, u r italian and u love sinner, we understand that... but doping is doping it is found twice in his system with 8 days difference between the tests! Imagine that! And it was kept secret from public despite two suspensions on him, although they were lifted the following day... i mean it is a joke, i will never ever support sinner, because of all these perks he has been given by the ITALIAN ATP CEO, which other players had not the luxury of.... that's a corruption case and it must be investigated
Sinner took 2 tests, 1 week apart from each other. They returned almost identical results. Both very low levels but the values were very close, 76 pg/ml the first one, 86 pg/ml for the second one. From a farmacokinetic point of view, what does this tell you?
Bro the entire explanation with the spray on the finger of the masseuse is worse than ALL explanations of taking a contaminated supplement in the appeals that were denied LMAO this is the most transparent thing ever!!!!
I think they lied and what a stupid story, who the fuck massage a player with a n open wound. Tennis is a big money machine, he have be in the game for a long time the pysio.They must fucking think we are sheeps. Somebody just got a huge paycheck behind the door.
Why are they interviewing Darren Cahill where is Jannik Sinner, can't he speak for himself? Well, the cross-country skier Therese Johaug had the same substance in her after, according to her own statement, using a lip salve against mouth sores, she was apparently believed but was still suspended for 18 months! It is important to have a ready-made credible story in the toolbox to bring out when the doping tests are positive!
TBH only reason others are still "innocent" is because they haven't been caught yet. I'm a firm believer no one is natty in top level pro sports, but I also don't care about PEDs at all, you still need to be high level enough to benefit from them in the first place.
Yep,you are one of the rare people who knows what they talk about,it is impossible to be a top level athlete without a little help of something illegal
1, cream for a cut? please! 2, most dopings are during trainings which help during competitions - that's why they want to detect even what seems to be tiny amount ( the tiny amount excuse is nonsense ) 3, that "prove" is similar to Lance Armstrong's butt cream prove
Totally agree. Thanks for your balanced opinion. Jannik's reputation is damaged, and I can imagine how devastating this could be for him during these months. And how it will be in the next few years because the world, especially the media, is brutal.
Don't cheat and you won't have a damaged reputation. Only stupids believe all those dumb excuses how the banned substance got randomly into his system.
So many people talking about this without knowing the rules and the process for this type of cases. I agree completely with you Nick, Sinner is Innocent.
Nadal asked n got permission to take steroids after knee surgery so he can come back on tour earlier.... reporter asked nadsl why he doped and his reply was that he got permission....look it up
Sportwise the only thing that matters is that, however and whatever, the substance didn't effect Sinner game. He is therefore at the moment the strongest player in the world, whether people like it or not. The rest is boring matter for lawyers.
Not great at all…as a fan of Sinner, follow him since winning his first ItF/challenger title, even if he is innocent, not great fot tennis, just bc he was given privileges/special treatment…I think if was a random player probably would have at least 6 months suspended
Then look at the Bortolotti case which unlike the other cases mentioned was very similar and the ruling was EXACTLY the same. However noone talked or complained about it then? I guess different players different treatment?
If it will not improve his performance, why is it banned? A mistake is a mistake whether it was unintentional or not. It should be made public immediately and an appropriate punishment must be given.
Indeed, double standards among different players and status. Sharapova, simona, yamstremska, and errani are the few female tennis that was banned whether it’s intentional or not. They were tested and positive… rules should be same across the board.
2:38 One way to make this fair would be doping test labs publishing the results right away as a rule, with no input from officials or the athletes and their staff themselves. But that's going to be a hard sell.
All I have to say is that firstly people need to recognise the difference between (1) Clostebol acetate (intramuscular injectable steroid which mimmicks the actions of naturally occuring testosterone used for performance enhancement) and (2) Clostebol Acetate Cream (topical dermatological treatment for skin conditions which has no performace enhancing benefit). Then read the report. Then after arming yourself with that knowledge, see if you still think it's right to cut Sinner to shreads in social media accounts everywhere contributing to the ruining of his reputation. Sadly stupid people are dangerous in large numbers. Unfortunately for him, Sinner's physio was a little stupid also.
He's not the ONLY person who takes banned substances... he just got caught since he didn't take the dosage correctly that's why his piss came up dirty.
This was a leftover from a steroid cycle that he did but thought it was not anymore in the system, no way the spray would last so long or show anything, there's almost nothing of the steroid in the spray and the thing would got out of a system in a day, two max. I think it's just funny how they try to package all this. I'm not saying he's the only one on drugs, but this is ridiculous. Look at him. Ge gained 7kg at least from the last season. The face is all puffy from the water retention etc. I understand why they tried to juice him, he's tall, he'll break with 101 injuries if left "natural" on that high level of play and competition.
I am Italian and obviously a big Sinner fan, I would just like to clarify a few things: many are wondering why Sinner was not suspended, in fact he was suspended twice and in both cases Sinner (as is his right) appealed and the appeal was accepted, this is the reason why he was able to continue playing. in many, many comments I read the use of double standards because Sinner was not disqualified, here too the explanation is quite simple, if the physiotherapist had applied the cream directly on Sinner for a treatment then there would have been no doubts, Sinner should have been disqualified even if he, as the anti-doping rules establish, was unaware of it. but since the cream was used by his physiotherapist on him and NOT ON Sinner, then the court recognized Sinner's non-responsibility and for this reason they did not disqualify him. in fact we are talking about contamination and not about assumption. that said I am absolutely convinced of Sinner's good faith, even if I fear that all this will influence his career.
Sinner, if he was really innocent, should have revealed the sequence of events to the media in March itself. Why was he concealing the whole thing?? And the excuse he proferred for not participating in Olympics now looks pretty odd after this sordid episode that has tarnished his image and ruined his reputation. Alas he has lived upto his name.
From a Business point of view I can understand the decision not to suspend him.After all the fuss with Halep,suspending Sinner would have caused huge damage to the reputation of the sport of tennis.We often forget,that as hardcore Tennis Fans we are minority and that the majority of people who watch tennis do not know or even care about players outside the top 20.So eventhough I agree, that it is unfair and not right to give Sinner a different treatment than is the case with less known players, I think we should not be naive and pretend, that this is something, that does not happen in other sports or areas of life. Pro Tennis is a business in the end and in the Business World You do not let the big companies fail,because their failure might cause the whole System to collapse or cause huge damage to it.
@@karmigos The rule is simple even if you are found not guilty if you fail or miss a test you have to forfeit the prize of the tournament both money and points, we could argue about the rules but it exist so no point in going against it more so for 300k(for sinner is nothing) and 400 points
Yes he was 100% doped. You can't get randomly a specific PED in your system. Everyone knows those excuses are bs but there is a lot of money invested in him so he gets away with it.
Anyone that saw sinner last year knows he was very weak and couldn’t last a long match and had bags under eyes. He is twice as muscular now, walks funny because of it, hits harder, doesn’t get tired and there is coincidentally one drug that will do that, the one deliberately every day rubbed on his body which has receiving welts for the drug. Cheaterrrrrr I hate this guy
So his team happened to just carry this banned substance, in case other people other than him got hurt? Makes no sense. They intended to use it on him in the first place.
It's actually not that weird when you read the following info: "Clostebol acetate ointment has ophthalmological and dermatological use. In some countries, such as Italy, it is available without a prescription as a topical cream or spray for the treatment of skin wounds such as abrasions, erosions, fissures and burns." It was a biilionth of a gram FFS. Pretty consistent with his statement. Steroid creams are used for dermatogical purposes, not for performace enhancing use cases. For it to be used for performance enhancement, it would have to have been administered as an intramuscular injection. This whole situation with the physio is just a case of casual carelessness, and to believe Sinner had anything to do with it is ridiculous. Not saying you think this, just in general because he's getting LOOOADS of hate right now which is unfair.
@@5eulyou keep saying the same BS on other videos about this case. Do you have a life? Did you read the papers?There is a fucking sentence that said Jannik is innocent. Do you have any proves about the Sinner guiIty?Do you know something that the court,the judge and the court experts didn’t know? Oh my god this is too simple: in this video is literally reported what an expert said and this expert said that Jannik isn’t guilty and the quantity of substance found in his body hasn’t gave him any advantage. You are just an hater…you don’t have any facts. You don’t have nothing only hatred on Jannik.
I don't agree with your argument. The player is Italian, ok so let's say all Italians are fans of him. That's 60 million ppl and the 7th biggest economy of the planet. But Sinner is liked across the world. So it's not even "Italy exclusive".
Very convenient for Jannik. No publicity, no preventive suspension, and outcome released conveniently in good timing just when the results are favorable to him. See the way they frame it, "Successfully proved" "low levels'... Woah wait so you're gonna tell it for the first time and you are already moving on from it? The point is, the utter lack of transparency and seemingly manipulative way of handling this.
Hey Nikola, Are you familiar with the story of Jamie Murrays forehand? Whats your opinion on this? Is it really possible to be all mental on this level?
@@IntuitiveTennis247 There is an article of tennisworldusa called "Jamie Murray has mental block with forehand shot" where they say they changed his forehand technique at 13 and ever since he "can't" hit forehands. Would be curious whats your take on this or if you could analyse his techique :)
@@IntuitiveTennis247 Allegedly he has a mental block because his techinque was changed at 13 and ever since he "cant" hit proper forehands. Just search jamie murray forehand in google
You're sending a confusing message Governor. 'even if a player is doping but they didn't know they were being doped illegally, they should still pay some type of penalty. Sinner, who did not know he was being doped, should not'. Bad take🤷🏿♂️
new tennis rule proposed ---> from now on - every one can cheat twice without penalty ---- ok? or we may increase it to 12 lifetime limit! how about that ?
So other players can use this precedent as excuse going forward? All they need is to prove themselves innocent? If not, should he be tested 6 times more than other players during the US open like the Chinese swimming team in Paris ?
It’s like politicians or economists during election campaigns: all of a sudden every random hater on social media thinks they have a PhD in biology and are totally entitled to draw judgements on whether that amount of that specific substance can actually make a difference in physical performance. Just enjoy sports FFS and get a life instead of just hating brainlessly what and what not
The reason it's so low is because they miscalculated the time it would take to leave his system completely, so he still had a small amount left in him when he was tested
The same rules do not apply to everyone, because Tennis is a business first and foremost. Then a sport. ATP would lose millions, now and in the future. Because they invested so much money and promotion into creating a "story" about the next generation: Sinner and Alcaraz. Losing one of these two would be a huge financial loss. Not to mention, that he is even world number 1.
It's like in a normal trial, you can never compare 2 defendants who have committed the same crime. It all depends on how they committed it, the intentionality and the modality. There are many nuances that determine the change of punishment. It's a very normal thing and if you look at the various suspensions of tennis players for doping-related crimes, each one was evaluated differently even when they were not intentionally guilty. In the Sinner case, for example, the percentages found were so minimal that they would not have helped even an ant to improve performance; furthermore, 5 minutes after the formalization of the accusation, it was discovered where the contamination came from and that this was involuntary, unlike to other cases. Let me explain better: Sinner did not directly take the substance even without knowing, but it was his physiotherapist who took it and contaminated Sinner. That's why he wasn't suspended like other tennis players.
Tatis Jr(MLB all-star player) was suspended for half a season cause of the same exact drug and contamination excuse. Zero suspension in this case is a totally corrupt move by atp
Your arguments make no sense. Anti-doping rule # 1: You are personally liable what you ingest , not your stepmother, not your ex-girlfriend. You even stated that. But it is Sinner, so that does not apply? You need 5 months to find out that your team did something wrong? And your team is highly educated in pharmaceuticals and is unable to read the huge warning on the packaging? And why on earth did his lawyers work for the ITIA before? If you test positive, you go. So stop your nonsense guessing.
intentional, gain - both is just irrelevant. the doping laws are strict. Remember Halep? they acknowledged that it was food contamination and not intentional doping.. still she was banned.
@Alexander The court accepted Halep's argument that she had taken a contaminated supplement, but ruled that the volume the player ingested could not have determined the concentration of roxadustat found in the positive sample," it said. Defects in her biological passport were another factor that tipped the court off to "probable doping."
This is really bad for tennis. The double standard here is palpable. It is not about the innocence or guilt. Players have to be treated the same, and clearly, he has been provided with special treatment. His coach was able to do an entire interview on ESPN. This does not look good at all.
A drugtest showing very low traces of a substance that is widely available in over the counter products in Italy is just not proof Sinner cheated. Sinner then collaborated quickly with an investigation and gave a plausible source of the contamination. 3 different experts have rules that this scenario is highly plausible and there is no evidence of any wrong doing by Sinner. That it looks bad for Sinner and Tennis is a shame. But it is mostly because ppl take in baseless stances and are quick to judge, simply because they do not know the facts, rules and how these processes actually work.
This one smells sssoooooo BADDDD!...now Sinner is a victim! Give me a break!!!!.....Poor Simona,..poor Nico Jarry........Italians are managing the ATP for years...that is your answer right there!!! 2 year suspension like the rest of the mortals!!
very naive to think dopping is not part of ALL pro athlete in some forms. They all do it. They just manage to go around the tests by using low doses or substances that are not illegal yet,
Nadal promotes the experimental shots, that is a CAH Nadal has said when a player tests positive they never should admit it, just don’t show up for a few months as he often was a no show. Nadal created the time clock because of his abuse of it every point. Fedal both cheat n so many ways as you now see Sinner is a total cheat that ATP supports. Nadal was allowed to use steroids since 2012 or so documented He is a creep and all see that now along with Fed, sinner, Alcaraz. They sign off income for ability to cheat.
Per TENNISMEDIA @luciahoff on X
After contacting ITIA this afternoon, I just got an email back with the clarification regarding Jannik Sinner's case to my question, if it's made public right away when a player fails a doping test.
"No it does not. The WADA rules dictate when cases become public. When any player has a finding, there is a very carefully managed process to confirm the finding, investigate and then next steps agreed.
If a player is provisionally suspended, then we announce it. Once a case is concluded, we announce it.
In this case, the player was issued with a provisional suspension for each of the findings.
On both occasions he successfully appealed the provisional suspensions to an independent arbitrator. Once an appeal is successful, it remains anonymous. Had the player's appeal been turned down, it would have been announced.
I hope that clarifies."
Sinner Favorite for the US Open?
👉 ua-cam.com/video/ISzfvKAczV8/v-deo.htmlsi=hVNvKMPDmyeVi3mV
Many questions remain: are the appeals normally handled very quickly? it is the case for every player? so the appeal is successful, but the investigation continues? what is the regular process here? what are the rules? any explanation? Also, the player was declared innocent, so why is he penalized (400 points, and prize money)? again, what are the rules here?
@@IntuitiveTennis247 An extremely opaque and convenient system for favoritism and conflicts of interest.
As Cahill clarified the difference between Halep and Sinner was that the origin of the doping substance was quickly determined by Sinner Staff. His team promptly presented the appeal and had the suspension lifted.
I think in the case of Halep it took very long time to understand thw origin and provide explanations. The rest is just gossip
Thank you for clarifying where many speak out of turn by acclaiming the non-application of rules that have in fact been applied.
Is this spray available on Amazon? Asking for friend 😊
Recently there was a very similar case that was ruled exactly the same way. Look up Marco Bortolotti. Who was not a big star. So to just assume their was favoritsm looks unfounded.
Interesting, another italian player, not suspicious at all, look up Nico Jarry's case to see the real treatment of this kind of incidents
Bro are you serious right now? The guy you bring up as an example that no favoritism is involved is also Italian like Sinner. C’mon man. One of the main things people are saying is that there is an unfair treatment toward Eastern countries like Russia, Romania, Croatia, Serbia. In addition, the head of the ATP since 2020 is himself Italian
@@kevinbrianfahyin Italy the substance is used in a lot of preparations over the counter, so it’s easier for Italian players to get in contact with the substance
@@Eyesonly302 Jarry's case was different, and as such treated differently. In fact he was deemed guilty of negligence after getting caught with 2 substances in his blood, ingested through contaminated supplements. I get that you're eager to point out unfairness, but you should at least inform yourself how and why cases are different and why they were differently treated. All the documentation is public.
@@kevinbrianfahy There's another italian player deemed guilty and suspended for 4 years called Stefano Battaglino. So? Where's the favoritism? You guys talk about things you do not know nor you have bothered to inform yourselves about.
Curious. If trace amounts of certain substances have no performance impact, why aren't there permitted levels in place. Surely, there's a reason that bans are given for even the smallest amounts detected, otherwise why would the lower limit be set at this level in the first place.
Good question! Reasons could be a strict zero tolerance approach and to make sure ppl do not try to microdose to get away with just below minimum values. If the substance is not readily available and easy to not ingest it's not strange to just put the responsibility completely with the player to not have it at all. For this substance it is a bit trickier for ppl in Italy since it is inside over the counter products, something an international rule probably does not take into account.
Trofodermin is pure Clostebol. It is not a pharmaceutical product where Clostebol is only one of the ingredients among others. As a pharmacist, I have never heard of an anabolic androgenic steroid being used to heat a cut on a finger. This is a real snow job on people who are not familiar with drug pharmacokinetics.
You nailed it. Moreover it's for skin disorders such as eczema and psoriasis, not cuts. It clearly is a steroid cream.
To make the cut heal faster of course! ;)😊
Tennis players have little scruples. It’s a sick world. They assume the public are idiots or enough Intelligent people go along with it
Trofodermin is NOT pure Clostebol, pharmacist. It also contains neomycin, in equal parts.
They published the actual prescription drug used. It's a 5% concentration spray. Apparently it's sold over the counter in Italy for treatment of small epidermal lesions.
If he is innocent how come they still penalized him points and fined him
It's just the rules, a very stupid one at that
Rules says that even if you are innocent (unaware and no wrong-doing) but there are traces of banned substances (1/billion of 1 gram) you need to forfeit the prize anyway. Both points and money.
Perche con questa storia !!! Hanno fatto tropo casino 😂😂😮
It isn't a fine, he automatically loses points and prize money from the tournament where the positive test occurred. That's just standard no matter the outcome of the investigation.
@@joannemoore3976 i think that was too much penalty already. A caution was enough - u cd get this form of contamination from a handshake with someone. u know the so called doping in this case is a joke
Every doping scandal seems to be a trace amount so I’m not sure that’s important. The reason given is very ‘the dog ate my homework’ surely copious amounts would have to be transferred to result it being at all present in a sample probably several days later. How many lacerations did they both have? It seems off.
He has psoriasis
Double standards. Imagine this with Novak or any Russian player. What about Simona? Why wasn't Sinner suspended for the investigation and he continued to play in the Masters? Why was this hidden from us for six months? Seriously, the physio bought a spray that is labeled "not for use by athletes" in Italy, where there are dozens of cases around this spray, then he cut himself, after the cut, a member of Sinner's team suggested the physio to use this spray, no one even bothered to check the label considering that it’s very well known problem in Italy. Then the physio massaged him with his cut hands, but without gloves and of course the physio doesn't remember if he washed his hands. The spray evaporates instantly, it's just some kind of joke. They take us all for fools. It’s too big of a business to let the media guys go off the rails. There are always those who are allowed more than others. Well, the director of ATP is Italian. How unlucky Sinner was...
Enjoy
Obviously you haven’t seen the differences between both cases. Might want to take comprehension classes.
He was suspended but they determined he was inocent very quickly and lifted the ban
Indeed!
@@JonathanGarza16but why was this information hidden from the public and now just released almost 6mths later???!?!
Sinner didn’t really prove anything but testing positive. What his team claims is at least dubois from some angles. Also the amount caught doesn’t represent what he might have been using, that’s why if you test positive you test positive regardless of the amount, furthermore he tested positive TWICE!, something fishy going on for sure.
Speculative conversations:
Umberto : "Hey, Giamcomo, why don't you try this cream on that cut of yours".
Giamcomo : "What's this say ? Closte .., closterbal .., clostebol! Hey, isn't that the stuff that 38 of our compatriots have tested positive for recently?"
Umberto: "Don't worry yourself about that - you're not the one competing".
Giamcomo: "Yeah, but .."
Jannik : "Hey Giamcomo, how about my massage".
Giamcomo : "Sure boss".
Jannik : "Shouldn't you wear gloves to keep the massage oil off that dressing on your cut? And my psoriasiform dermatitis is pretty bad right now. There's even broken skin".
Giamcomo : "Don't worry about it boss. I've handled worse. Do you think your feet are good for three or four hours of running each day for the next week, by the way ?".
Jannik : "Guys, I've tested positive for clostebol! How the f*** ?"
Umberto : "Look boss, don't get angry, but .."
Actual statements:
Jannik : "“We knew it straight away and we were aware of what happened. We went straight away and I was suspended for two, three days."
Question: If it was so simple to identify the source, how come you were all so negligent in the first place".
Jannik : "I always believe that I kept playing tennis because in my mind I knew that I haven’t done anything wrong"
Observation : Missed the Olympics, where the athletes are vigorously tested for doping? This all smells bad & leaves a very bad taste.
Minuscule amount in the drug test wouldn’t enhance his performance? There’s minuscule amount when the drug test is done, cuz the bulk of it had already washed out of his system. Do other cheaters caught have large amount of a banned substance in the drug test? It’s always trace amount. Why? Cheaters know the pharmacokinetics of a substance and will take it so that by the time the drug test is done, the drug is washed out of the system by the kidneys or by the liver. Often times they get caught because the substance is removed slower than expected due to other factors, like drug interactions, which slows down the kidneys or the liver, or illness can alter the removal process, allowing the substances to circulate in the body longer than expected.
1/billion of a gram. I like your enthusiasm but you sound like bollocks
Yeah sounds like same situation as the Chinese swim team. Reputation is ruined
You can fantasize about many situations but none of those have been proven. 3 experts have looked at this case and stated that the contamination scenario given in Sinner's defense is highly likely and consistent with the results of the test. There is no evidence to suggest otherwise. So all what you are doing is baseless speculation, which is not a basis to judge players or punishments on.
@alessandrovalente7645 well ppl don't buy it, u r italian and u love sinner, we understand that... but doping is doping it is found twice in his system with 8 days difference between the tests! Imagine that! And it was kept secret from public despite two suspensions on him, although they were lifted the following day... i mean it is a joke, i will never ever support sinner, because of all these perks he has been given by the ITALIAN ATP CEO, which other players had not the luxury of.... that's a corruption case and it must be investigated
Sinner took 2 tests, 1 week apart from each other. They returned almost identical results. Both very low levels but the values were very close, 76 pg/ml the first one, 86 pg/ml for the second one.
From a farmacokinetic point of view, what does this tell you?
There's no way Sinner's team didn't know they had a banned substance.
Bro the entire explanation with the spray on the finger of the masseuse is worse than ALL explanations of taking a contaminated supplement in the appeals that were denied LMAO this is the most transparent thing ever!!!!
Read the report.
I think they lied and what a stupid story, who the fuck massage a player with a n open wound. Tennis is a big money machine, he have be in the game for a long time the pysio.They must fucking think we are sheeps. Somebody just got a huge paycheck behind the door.
Now Sinner missing the Olympics makes more sense. They probably have an different committee for that than the ATP
👍
ITIA is responsible for doping.
olympic swimer testing 6 time a day😅
Right
All because of dollars and cents.
Fail a drugs test twice and still allowed to play, favouritism for a drugs cheat, the ATP is garbage.
Why are they interviewing Darren Cahill where is Jannik Sinner, can't he speak for himself?
Well, the cross-country skier Therese Johaug had the same substance in her after, according to her own statement, using a lip salve against mouth sores, she was apparently believed but was still suspended for 18 months!
It is important to have a ready-made credible story in the toolbox to bring out when the doping tests are positive!
TBH only reason others are still "innocent" is because they haven't been caught yet. I'm a firm believer no one is natty in top level pro sports, but I also don't care about PEDs at all, you still need to be high level enough to benefit from them in the first place.
Agreed 💯
You can’t generalize. Are you a pro athlete that knows what goes behind scenes in the locker rooms, at the treatment rooms?
Did we all forget about what Lance Armstrong said? They have to take them because everyone is. Its a form of controlling players imho
It's an opinion you can have and it costs you nothing to voice it.
Doesn't mean it's true for tennis though.
Yep,you are one of the rare people who knows what they talk about,it is impossible to be a top level athlete without a little help of something illegal
Sinner is not the only player that dopes. He just needs to hire Nadal’s pharmacist…..
Only your guy has a positive. Now keep crying
Dude, just stop yo shit.
Nadal in over 20+ yrs has zero positives. Same goes for Federer, Novak and Andy Murray.
I'd look into Alcaraz.
"Nadal’s pharmacist….." - not if he wants to keep that carrot top intact in 10 years.
@@TercerokoWorldPositive for what ??
Stop your rant. Sinner is as cleared as crystal. Get a life.
They scorched Simona, just imagine what would they do to GOAT Novak if it was him.
Djokovic refused to be tested all together. I don't think Djokovic uses forbidden substances but he also has played with the system and got his way
1, cream for a cut? please! 2, most dopings are during trainings which help during competitions - that's why they want to detect even what seems to be tiny amount ( the tiny amount excuse is nonsense ) 3, that "prove" is similar to Lance Armstrong's butt cream prove
Simona: Banned
Sinner: Babied. Protected. Allowed to compete 😂
Totally agree. Thanks for your balanced opinion. Jannik's reputation is damaged, and I can imagine how devastating this could be for him during these months. And how it will be in the next few years because the world, especially the media, is brutal.
💯
Don't cheat and you won't have a damaged reputation. Only stupids believe all those dumb excuses how the banned substance got randomly into his system.
So many people talking about this without knowing the rules and the process for this type of cases. I agree completely with you Nick, Sinner is Innocent.
OJ Simpson was found innocent too
Anche Bortolotti numero 350 atp e’ stato scagionato per la stessa cosa ,di cosa stiamo parlando?
Weather doping or not he was clearly favored and treated unlike any other player
Nadal asked n got permission to take steroids after knee surgery so he can come back on tour earlier.... reporter asked nadsl why he doped and his reply was that he got permission....look it up
TIL if you got permission PEDs are no longer PEDs, so I guess it's just water now 😂
he got a TUE - Serena and Lance Armstrong got TUE too
betamethasone not gonna make anyone stronger, quite the opposite
Nadal should have been Investigated long time ago.
OMG is this trurh? Nadal is steriod?
Sportwise the only thing that matters is that, however and whatever, the substance didn't effect Sinner game. He is therefore at the moment the strongest player in the world, whether people like it or not. The rest is boring matter for lawyers.
Not great at all…as a fan of Sinner, follow him since winning his first ItF/challenger title, even if he is innocent, not great fot tennis, just bc he was given privileges/special treatment…I think if was a random player probably would have at least 6 months suspended
Then look at the Bortolotti case which unlike the other cases mentioned was very similar and the ruling was EXACTLY the same. However noone talked or complained about it then? I guess different players different treatment?
Ma dai !!! Sinner 3 il ragazzo incapace di fare cose probité !!! Solo à gaurdarlo il facia !!!! 😮😮😢
Sinner is a sinner. period.
As soon as ESPN started backing up Sinner's explanations I knew
he was guilty.
US Open should ban him.
Based on what? All your impiracle evidence? Get a life.
@@pdiserisempirical*
If it will not improve his performance, why is it banned? A mistake is a mistake whether it was unintentional or not. It should be made public immediately and an appropriate punishment must be given.
Ok Judge Judy. You tell us what's what
What? You wanna hear that you're a loser?
Imagine if the name Sinner was replaced by Djokovic or Medvedev.
Indeed, double standards among different players and status. Sharapova, simona, yamstremska, and errani are the few female tennis that was banned whether it’s intentional or not. They were tested and positive… rules should be same across the board.
If he was so innocent why was he quiet about this for 6 months? His team, ATP, ITF all hid this for a reason.
Because of people like you
@@Videolistenerbecause of people like you
Wasn't Cahill Halep's coach.. hmmm.😮
Contamination, just like every other case, how interesting
2:38 One way to make this fair would be doping test labs publishing the results right away as a rule, with no input from officials or the athletes and their staff themselves. But that's going to be a hard sell.
Dont forget what ATP has done to Marin Cilic and other players.
Disgusting double standards from ATP! Pozz s Pašmana! 🌞😎🎾🍻
All I have to say is that firstly people need to recognise the difference between (1) Clostebol acetate (intramuscular injectable steroid which mimmicks the actions of naturally occuring testosterone used for performance enhancement) and (2) Clostebol Acetate Cream (topical dermatological treatment for skin conditions which has no performace enhancing benefit). Then read the report. Then after arming yourself with that knowledge, see if you still think it's right to cut Sinner to shreads in social media accounts everywhere contributing to the ruining of his reputation. Sadly stupid people are dangerous in large numbers. Unfortunately for him, Sinner's physio was a little stupid also.
His team making up excuses
It doesn’t matter if Sinner is aware or not of that banned substance. He should get at least a year ban from sports.
No need to explain. Sinner is his name.Doping is his game. Too much 💰 cheating is the short cut.,👍🚫🥇
He's not the ONLY person who takes banned substances... he just got caught since he didn't take the dosage correctly that's why his piss came up dirty.
This was a leftover from a steroid cycle that he did but thought it was not anymore in the system, no way the spray would last so long or show anything, there's almost nothing of the steroid in the spray and the thing would got out of a system in a day, two max. I think it's just funny how they try to package all this. I'm not saying he's the only one on drugs, but this is ridiculous. Look at him. Ge gained 7kg at least from the last season. The face is all puffy from the water retention etc. I understand why they tried to juice him, he's tall, he'll break with 101 injuries if left "natural" on that high level of play and competition.
I am Italian and obviously a big Sinner fan, I would just like to clarify a few things: many are wondering why Sinner was not suspended, in fact he was suspended twice and in both cases Sinner (as is his right) appealed and the appeal was accepted, this is the reason why he was able to continue playing. in many, many comments I read the use of double standards because Sinner was not disqualified, here too the explanation is quite simple, if the physiotherapist had applied the cream directly on Sinner for a treatment then there would have been no doubts, Sinner should have been disqualified even if he, as the anti-doping rules establish, was unaware of it. but since the cream was used by his physiotherapist on him and NOT ON Sinner, then the court recognized Sinner's non-responsibility and for this reason they did not disqualify him. in fact we are talking about contamination and not about assumption. that said I am absolutely convinced of Sinner's good faith, even if I fear that all this will influence his career.
Cheater, period. Why he skipped Olympic? Fear to be caught again?
Sinner, if he was really innocent, should have revealed the sequence of events to the media in March itself. Why was he concealing the whole thing?? And the excuse he proferred for not participating in Olympics now looks pretty odd after this sordid episode that has tarnished his image and ruined his reputation.
Alas he has lived upto his name.
From a Business point of view I can understand the decision not to suspend him.After all the fuss with Halep,suspending Sinner would have caused huge damage to the reputation of the sport of tennis.We often forget,that as hardcore Tennis Fans we are minority and that the majority of people who watch tennis do not know or even care about players outside the top 20.So eventhough I agree, that it is unfair and not right to give Sinner a different treatment than is the case with less known players, I think we should not be naive and pretend, that this is something, that does not happen in other sports or areas of life. Pro Tennis is a business in the end and in the Business World You do not let the big companies fail,because their failure might cause the whole System to collapse or cause huge damage to it.
Was he doped or was he not? If he was, that's cheating, volontary or not.
Well it seems he wasn't
funny thing he wasn't but his team accepted to lose points and prize money in IW 🤔 What kind of deal is this if you are 100% not guilty
@@karmigos The rule is simple even if you are found not guilty if you fail or miss a test you have to forfeit the prize of the tournament both money and points, we could argue about the rules but it exist so no point in going against it more so for 300k(for sinner is nothing) and 400 points
Yes he was 100% doped. You can't get randomly a specific PED in your system. Everyone knows those excuses are bs but there is a lot of money invested in him so he gets away with it.
Anyone that saw sinner last year knows he was very weak and couldn’t last a long match and had bags under eyes. He is twice as muscular now, walks funny because of it, hits harder, doesn’t get tired and there is coincidentally one drug that will do that, the one deliberately every day rubbed on his body which has receiving welts for the drug.
Cheaterrrrrr
I hate this guy
Ma dai !!!!! Basta di dire !!! Cretinate !!! 😂😂😮 e sempre lostesso !!!!
Well said. Also, avoided the Olympics because of the stringent testing. Tonsillitis my arse 😂😂😂
So his team happened to just carry this banned substance, in case other people other than him got hurt? Makes no sense. They intended to use it on him in the first place.
It's actually not that weird when you read the following info: "Clostebol acetate ointment has ophthalmological and dermatological use. In some countries, such as Italy, it is available without a prescription as a topical cream or spray for the treatment of skin wounds such as abrasions, erosions, fissures and burns." It was a biilionth of a gram FFS. Pretty consistent with his statement. Steroid creams are used for dermatogical purposes, not for performace enhancing use cases. For it to be used for performance enhancement, it would have to have been administered as an intramuscular injection. This whole situation with the physio is just a case of casual carelessness, and to believe Sinner had anything to do with it is ridiculous. Not saying you think this, just in general because he's getting LOOOADS of hate right now which is unfair.
So are steroid creams banned or not? Why did he got finned if steroid creams are not performance enhancing.
Hmmm… I’m gonna have a look at what La Gazetta dello Sport writes about this.
External pressure on Sinner now has to affect your USOPEN predictions.
Pressure? Bro, he should be banned and respect should be given to other players with that action!
@@5eulyou keep saying the same BS on other videos about this case. Do you have a life?
Did you read the papers?There is a fucking sentence that said Jannik is innocent. Do you have any proves about the Sinner guiIty?Do you know something that the court,the judge and the court experts didn’t know?
Oh my god this is too simple: in this video is literally reported what an expert said and this expert said that Jannik isn’t guilty and the quantity of substance found in his body hasn’t gave him any advantage.
You are just an hater…you don’t have any facts. You don’t have nothing only hatred on Jannik.
Such a hard call, I do think it affects him. I will think about it…
In that case, so were Sharapova and SHalep… I wondered where the skinny Sinner got all the energy suddenly to win a slam. What a double standard bs
Il secondo test era la controanalisi lo capite o no?
Atp pushes for Sinner's US open victory
Yet Italy is not such a so big market... 🤔
I don't agree with your argument. The player is Italian, ok so let's say all Italians are fans of him. That's 60 million ppl and the 7th biggest economy of the planet. But Sinner is liked across the world. So it's not even "Italy exclusive".
@@greyKuma536 40% of italians probably hate him
Severe favoritism for Jannik Sinner🤮 Disgusting
Very convenient for Jannik. No publicity, no preventive suspension, and outcome released conveniently in good timing just when the results are favorable to him. See the way they frame it, "Successfully proved" "low levels'... Woah wait so you're gonna tell it for the first time and you are already moving on from it? The point is, the utter lack of transparency and seemingly manipulative way of handling this.
47 years from Star Wars and continues looking very young.
Hey Nikola,
Are you familiar with the story of Jamie Murrays forehand? Whats your opinion on this? Is it really possible to be all mental on this level?
What’s the story w Jamie
@@IntuitiveTennis247 There is an article of tennisworldusa called "Jamie Murray has mental block with forehand shot" where they say they changed his forehand technique at 13 and ever since he "can't" hit forehands. Would be curious whats your take on this or if you could analyse his techique :)
@@IntuitiveTennis247 Allegedly he has a mental block because his techinque was changed at 13 and ever since he "cant" hit proper forehands. Just search jamie murray forehand in google
You're sending a confusing message Governor. 'even if a player is doping but they didn't know they were being doped illegally, they should still pay some type of penalty. Sinner, who did not know he was being doped, should not'. Bad take🤷🏿♂️
OJ was innocent too remember 😅😅
new tennis rule proposed ---> from now on - every one can cheat twice without penalty ---- ok? or we may increase it to 12 lifetime limit! how about that ?
So other players can use this precedent as excuse going forward? All they need is to prove themselves innocent? If not, should he be tested 6 times more than other players during the US open like the Chinese swimming team in Paris ?
If he wasn't top 10 player he would get a life ban.
was Sinner's current coach Cahill also Halep's former coach?
Nick... is there a double standard going on here?
How about thise who didn't know of ingridients and were punished. How do they feel now nkowing they lost years and Janik is loosing nothing?
The speculation on this has gotten ridiculous. It’s 1 / 1000000000 of a gram. There’s no evidence to the contrary.
It’s like politicians or economists during election campaigns: all of a sudden every random hater on social media thinks they have a PhD in biology and are totally entitled to draw judgements on whether that amount of that specific substance can actually make a difference in physical performance. Just enjoy sports FFS and get a life instead of just hating brainlessly what and what not
The reason it's so low is because they miscalculated the time it would take to leave his system completely, so he still had a small amount left in him when he was tested
Good to know the backstory.
The same rules do not apply to everyone, because Tennis is a business first and foremost. Then a sport.
ATP would lose millions, now and in the future. Because they invested so much money and promotion into creating a "story" about the next generation: Sinner and Alcaraz. Losing one of these two would be a huge financial loss. Not to mention, that he is even world number 1.
It's like in a normal trial, you can never compare 2 defendants who have committed the same crime. It all depends on how they committed it, the intentionality and the modality. There are many nuances that determine the change of punishment. It's a very normal thing and if you look at the various suspensions of tennis players for doping-related crimes, each one was evaluated differently even when they were not intentionally guilty. In the Sinner case, for example, the percentages found were so minimal that they would not have helped even an ant to improve performance; furthermore, 5 minutes after the formalization of the accusation, it was discovered where the contamination came from and that this was involuntary, unlike to other cases. Let me explain better: Sinner did not directly take the substance even without knowing, but it was his physiotherapist who took it and contaminated Sinner. That's why he wasn't suspended like other tennis players.
How can a Sinner be innocent, what logic?
Tatis Jr(MLB all-star player) was suspended for half a season cause of the same exact drug and contamination excuse. Zero suspension in this case is a totally corrupt move by atp
No question of status; question of money. Sinner hired a team of layers who could very quickly demonstrate his innocence
Thing is, Wada has the right to investigate and appeal and they said they are doing so.
Where's that physio who was making massage now? Was he sacked from team? I am pretty sure he was, to put all blame on him
I’m very innocent. Tennis is totally clean. If it’s not the pasta it’s my physio
Yeah, innocent. Not banned on investigation. Only announced on appeal result. Nice Sinner. Turns out the name is apt and fitting 😅😂
Sinner is a cheater. .Period... Now I know how he was able to beat Novakn8n SF of AO2024... He is NOT innocent...
Trofodermin spray comes in a box that has 🚫Doping on it… not once but twice positive? I really like Sinner but this explanation doesn’t add up.
Now we know why he did not participate at Olympics.
🤦♀🤦♀🤦♀ seriously?
If Sinner is innocent, why are they taking away his Indian Wells ATP points and prize money !? Makes no sense...
They have to pay for silence
any physio, trainer at that level would have known about the clostebol.... where theres smoke...
You can pay any expert to explain anything away. Every player is enhanced one way or another
Physio always find guilty with basketball players...same physio. Dealing with this physio was bad judgment or intentional.
Your arguments make no sense. Anti-doping rule # 1: You are personally liable what you ingest , not your stepmother, not your ex-girlfriend. You even stated that. But it is Sinner, so that does not apply? You need 5 months to find out that your team did something wrong? And your team is highly educated in pharmaceuticals and is unable to read the huge warning on the packaging? And why on earth did his lawyers work for the ITIA before?
If you test positive, you go. So stop your nonsense guessing.
Nah, unfortunately he will NEVER be innocent again 😢
No wonder he's winning a lot, he's doping 😂
Tu non sai niente aCincinnati sapendo di questa indagine si e’ dopato lo stesso?Ma cosa stai dicendo?
when is this long joke ending - there is no doping involved whatsoever
intentional, gain - both is just irrelevant. the doping laws are strict. Remember Halep? they acknowledged that it was food contamination and not intentional doping.. still she was banned.
@Alexander The court accepted Halep's argument that she had taken a contaminated supplement, but ruled that the volume the player ingested could not have determined the concentration of roxadustat found in the positive sample," it said. Defects in her biological passport were another factor that tipped the court off to "probable doping."
Different sport.
wrong
This is really bad for tennis. The double standard here is palpable. It is not about the innocence or guilt. Players have to be treated the same, and clearly, he has been provided with special treatment. His coach was able to do an entire interview on ESPN. This does not look good at all.
I don’t think it’s fair for anyone to get banned from drugs you’re completely unaware of.
A drugtest showing very low traces of a substance that is widely available in over the counter products in Italy is just not proof Sinner cheated. Sinner then collaborated quickly with an investigation and gave a plausible source of the contamination. 3 different experts have rules that this scenario is highly plausible and there is no evidence of any wrong doing by Sinner. That it looks bad for Sinner and Tennis is a shame. But it is mostly because ppl take in baseless stances and are quick to judge, simply because they do not know the facts, rules and how these processes actually work.
If your not cheating your not trying to win his last name explains everything.
This one smells sssoooooo BADDDD!...now Sinner is a victim! Give me a break!!!!.....Poor Simona,..poor Nico Jarry........Italians are managing the ATP for years...that is your answer right there!!! 2 year suspension like the rest of the mortals!!
We need USO mens preview. Please.
Main channel
very naive to think dopping is not part of ALL pro athlete in some forms. They all do it. They just manage to go around the tests by using low doses or substances that are not illegal yet,
Sinner was just dumb enough to get caught twice lol
Nonsense excuses. Guilty as Heck ! Call him Jannik ( Lance A) Sinner.
If anyone really thinks Sinner wins because of a microdosis of an illegal substance has obviously never played tennis in his life.
Nadal promotes the experimental shots, that is a CAH
Nadal has said when a player tests positive they never should admit it, just don’t show up for a few months as he often was a no show.
Nadal created the time clock because of his abuse of it every point.
Fedal both cheat n so many ways as you now see Sinner is a total cheat that ATP supports.
Nadal was allowed to use steroids since 2012 or so documented
He is a creep and all see that now along with Fed, sinner, Alcaraz. They sign off income for ability to cheat.
yessir bonus tennis rant 💪
💯
Sorry not knowing the law doesn’t give you exemption
#CancelSinner