I notice a lot of these games have great art. I wonder if its easier to give a game a second chance if it has great art, or if its easier to play over and over again with great art.
I've had this happen with a ton of games: * Legacy: The Testament of Duke de Crecy jumped so far up that it became one of my favorite games. I just kept on playing, getting into the storytelling of the game, learning more strategy.. and it kept on becoming a richer experience. Also with the birth event cards replacing the complications, that was a really big improvement as they have different card backs (so you know you're taking a risk) and much more variety in what can happen. * Sushi Go was also a surprise. First time I played, I hated it. But because people play it all the time, I kept on playing, and now appreciate it for the light, sweet filler that it is. Same with zombie dice - it's completely random, but it's always a good time and so I've grown to love it. * Five Tribes still gets better every time play it. First time, you're just struggling to keep the AP at bay. But the more you play, the more you get into the strategy, the more there is to love. Good expansions too, but frankly, the base game is fantastic by itself. * Village is a game I originally liked, but the Port expansion brought it to a whole new level and affected the balance of the whole game so profoundly that I refuse to play the game without it. The Inn expansion added variety for replayability, but that Port expansion is really what made the game a permanent fixture in my collection. * Scythe - have to second these from the list. First time I played, I thought Scythe was 'okay, but nothing special.' Every time I played it, though, new strategic avenues opened up to me. Then, I got to play it with all the factions playing at once and got to appreciate how amazingly fast it is even at high player counts. Then, we got better at the game and it got more and more strategic. And now a new expansion has come out and a legacy expansion is coming out - and it's now one of my absolute favorites. * Terraforming Mars - another 'good, but nothing special' game based on my initial play, but boy, I was completely wrong. We played with beginner corps the first game, but the actual corporations, and the draft, make a drastic improvement. Then, the more you play, the better you understand the cards, dynamics, relative values.. and the more cut-throat and competitive it gets. What started out as a 'let's all do our own thing' euro turned into a game where I spend other players' turns desperately hoping that the other player doesn't do X. I love it. Hellas & Elysium are a great map addition. I haven't tried Venus Next yet, because the one thing I still don't like about TM is its length... but it sounds like the new Prelude expansion may be the answer to that!
After learning more about 👻Ghost Fightin Treasure Hunters, I paused the video and bought it along with Istanbul, a game that's been on my watch list for a while now. A little under an hour later, Istanbul makes an appearance in Zee's list. 🤩🎉
I agree about Rising Sun. The Diplomacy was overhyped. My second play was much better than my first. I really liked it the second time. I want to play it more.
Funny, Rising sun has anti-hype for me. I want nothing to do with it. Chaos in the old world - super hype, Blood Rage - maximum hype... I hated both of them.. so Eric Lang comes out with yet another dudes on a map with giant dudes... I'm just bleh.
I want to see Sam do a "Top 10 Games to Paint" where he covers some games with minis that he thinks were fun to paint. Or really anyone in the DTN that might be interested in doing that list, you three are just the first i always think of (and my favorites).
I agree with Tom on Viticulture.. I played it for the first time (base game) a couple months ago, and wow. i was underwhelmed. I've heard the Dice Tower talk so much about it, and I love Scythe.. but Viticulture just felt dull. The choices I made felt almost like they were the obvious choices to make, and I was just going through the motions. In the end, I felt it was ok, but not great. Maybe I need to try it with the expansions.. but I don't really see that happening any time soon. The game that turned around for me was also King of Tokyo.. I played my first game years ago, and played with the full player count. I think I and someone else got knocked out early, and it just felt really dull. No one was really buying upgrade cards, and the whole thing was just blah! I swore I'd never play it again. Then last year, I thought my daughter might like it, I explained the game, and we tried it at a FLGS a couple times and ended up buying it. Now, I wouldn't say that it's my favorite game, but I enjoy it a lot more after a few more plays under my belt than I did after that first play.
Zee - I agree with you about #6. Uchronia is under-appreciated but is actually the best re-implemention of Glory to Rome. I sold my Black Box Glory to Rome recently but am keeping both Uchronia and Mottainai in my collection.
My top 10: 1. Five Tribes 2. Cosmic Encounter 3. Glory to Rome 4. The Resistance: Avalon 5. Thunderstone Advance 6. Viticulture 7. Champions of Midgard 8. Hero Realms 9. 7 Wonders 10. Puerto Rico
Istanbul blew me away when I first played it, and it's just gotten better. I've still not tired of the base game, and would like to play the first expansion more (and then might get the second expansion if we manage to play it enough).
Zee talking about how much better Elder Sign gets with the expansions makes me think I need to give it another chance. Any recommendations on which expansions are best to get?
It's two years later, but in case someone else has this same question, the general consensus is that Gates of Arkham is the Elder Sign expansion to get. It takes the game outside the museum and adds thematic touches not present in the base game.
I just thought dice is stupid and luck when i was starting to explore the world of games .. so i went for the deckbuilders. But as the time passed by, i saw one video of people playing tiny epic galaxies - and i was like ... ok , there's a way to mitigate even if yer roll isn't right. So i decided to try Castles of Burgundy and Stone Age on BGA and now i love the dice , when executed well.
I disagree so heavily on "King of Tokyo is pretty inexpensive" - it was definitely overpriced IMO. Great simple game, but asking for $45 (retail price) for it + $30 for the power up expansion was definitely an error for the content in the box and no one I know (not even my friends that liked it) even got close to getting it because of price factor. You could get so many great gateway and filler games for that.
Civilization: the board game gets better over time for my group. After about 30 games, we're still discovering whole new strategies, and I swear no two games have ever been the same.
A still these days cant undestand Tom’s idea of “spliting the Group into two groups to play a 4 player game and another 3 player game”. Why would i split all my friends if we are together to play so we can have a social interation with each others? Look for a game that everyone can play or dont invite everyone if we all are going to be seperated... it doens make sense
All that expansion and second addition garbage is too stupid. It is not the same game then. Of course you like it better when it gets fixed and has more stuff added to it. The game didn't get better, you simply got another game instead.
lol I still find it hilarious how many people absolutely hated Zombicide for that one rule when it's so easy to just house-rule it. The entire game is meant to be flexible and to allow for players to get creative in making their own scenarios are rules, I just don't understand the kind of mental resistance some people have to doing that.
Sam. We love the power up expansion for King of Tokyo too! Have you played it with the Halloween expansion? It’s kind of hokey (with the monsters able to wear or steal costumes), but it’s pretty fun too.
Benjamin Spears I took out all the costumes because it just doesn’t match the theme. Played it that way for years and then some friends bought their own copy and were very confused when the costumes came up. They expressed their surprise they had never encountered them before in all the times we played and I had to admit my censorship. 😁
Cthulwho? Yeah. It’s definitely breaking the theme rules, but I find that especially with kids, it’s a pretty fun edition to the game. It is more of a Halloween add on. If we were to take the theme really seriously we would probably have to get rid of the bunny, penguin, and panda too.
Spot on with Sam saying that about King/Queendomino creators making a game and then months later wishing they had done the thing in their game. This is suuuuuper common for most artistic creations especially including music and movies. George Lucas has a famous quote saying, “Moves aren’t released, they escape” meaning that a director would continuously edit their movie for all time if the publishers didn’t come and rip it out of their proverbial hands and put it out in the theaters. 😇
Couldn't disagree with Sam more on the Cash & Guns art (the old art was cool, stylized, and gritty... the new is.... Munchkin. Enough said.) So, now I want to go back and find out what this passing-the-cards-under-the-table thing was... sounds cool! ;)
That board for Ghost Fighter is essentially a reskin of the board (at least the room and door placement) for the Series of Unfortunate Events "Perilous Parlor Game" board game that no one has ever played but me, haha. They're both by Mattel so I guess it's OK, just lazy.
Sam's perspective on games seems to be understandably skewed: I love Kingdomino for what it is and it's excellent non gamer appeal, and I can see how a gamer would like Queendomino better. But there's no excessive dumbing down or what imho: the target audience is simply different. I can play Kingdomino with my parents and kids and we all get to enjoy it. Queendomino would never fly in that context. Already too complex.
the first time I played Cosmic nobody explained what kind of game it was (negotiation and betrayal) and I was expecting TI3 light (4x) and I HATED IT. Still haven't played it again but I want to.
There should be a '10 Most Pointless reskins'. The two I'd have first and second would be King of Tokyo and even worse 'Carcassonne'. I know many people who have not bothered buying anymore Carcassonne expansions because they have the original subtle artwork and can only get the expansions in the bold garish artwork.
For me, Tesla vs. Edison: War of Currents got soooo much better (and is really a different game altogether) with the Powering Up! expansion. Very much like this game now. In my top 10 for sure
Thanks for the video guys. Thought Rum & Bones Second Tide might make this list. From first edition to second, to all the expansions/factions, it has become a game I really enjoy...but took some plays to "get it" and enjoy it for what it is. Love it now.
For me, after a few plays of Kingdom Builder after buying the base box, I seriously thought about getting rid of it. It felt so bland and boring. I think I went in with the wrong mind set, hoping for it to be a more thinky, complex game than it was. I have to admit, after picking it back up again to give it another shot this year, I've come around on it. I enjoy the fun to time put in ratio. You just have to realize it is light, has a different but straight forward strategy each game, and we love the speed I which it plays. The crossroads expansion helps as well, giving more options and variation per game. For a 20 minute quickie, my wife and I love it.
Splendor... felt didnt rlly satisfied any typo of "ich" for a game, also as soon as i felt okay now my engine is going, oh game is over, i lost. But the aproach was completely wrong ;) now its one of my fav small games, top3... and i win 8/10 times.
Sam, I watch most of the things you do and agree with you a lot of the times. But I have been playing Zombicide for years, it's one of our favorite games of all time. The reason being is because it's a great game system, the rules set is simple yet elegant, including the rule you dislike. That rule is mitigated by weapons and character skills and adds uniqueness to the game, in terms of tactics and and asymmetrical abilities of the characters. In short, it incorporated friendly fire without the need for a complicated set of rules. In other words if you don't have the right weapon or a particular set of skills you should not be firing your Thomson machine gun into an area that contains your friends. But if you have the right kind of weapon or the right kind of skill, have at it. You could also just rush in a go at it face to face. We have Black Plague also but mostly play the original, which just keeps getting better and better.
Definitely Merchants and Marauders for me. Only because the expansion added more depth and complexity to the game and gives you more options to victory. Still a long game with heavy emphasis on luck of your dice rolls, but more likely to get it to the table thanks to Seas of Glory.
Between Two Cities fell flat the first time I played it, even though I liked the idea of cooperating with your neighbors. I thought the expansion really added something and now it's one of our groups' go-to shorter games.
King of Tokyo is great. The power up expansion isn't because most of the powers are anemic. So what are your favorite Icehouse games? That sounds like a good list for you7 Tom, even if the others aren't that into the game.
I really find Cyclades: Titans to be so odd. It changes the game too much to the point where it doesn't feel like Cyclades anymore. Poseidon lost its power and you no longer have that interesting way your ships get into place, causing stress to other players :(
I honestly dislike Viticulture with Tuscany more for everytime. The winter and Summer cards are so vastly unbalanced that the right draw will basically win you the game.
Maybe for me this game is Star Realms. I got it as a gift from a friend and gave it to that friend and didn’t think about it. Then I later got the app and started playing someone’s copy at game night, and while it is not exactly my favorite game, it’s much higher on my list than before.
Thanks guys for doing this one. I really appreciate that you guys are able get past your initial impressions and let these games grow to the point where you can highly recommend them.
What is interesting is that King of New York is the "Queendomino" to KoT's "Kingdomino", yet Sam et al seems to not have much love for that. I prefer KoNY because the boroughs, buildings and units make for a more strategic game.
They have such a pleasant little song at the end of the videos, but if you adjust the speed to half speed and then listen, it just makes you wanna cry.
What!? Sam & Zee on the opposite ends
My first thought was "Zee's put on some weight." Then I realised it was Sam.
Haha me 3
NOOOOOO! How can I tell them apart now?
Now Tom needs to give up the middle
so confusing!!!
Your top 10s are still my favorites. Thanks for another one.
All hail the editing wizard! 🙇🏻♂️🙇🏼♀️🧙🏼♂️
Hail
100% got the like for the "nope"
Charles Frank%q
Love the editing Zee!
Can Zee like Pandemic more? My question from the very first minute...
Tom! You're still looking trim! Good for you! Keep it up!
I LOVED the comedic editing on this one. Great job Zee!
Deception: Murder in Yggdrasil
I can’t express how happy your top 10 videos make me, I’m always excited to see them!
Zee: ‘I don’t like eurogames’
Me: ‘huh 🤔’
*checks Zee’s top 20. 10 of those are eurogames*
Someone is in denial, maybe?
He doesn't say that though, just that if he dislikes a eurogame initially then he is much less likely to give it another try.
I bought ghost fightin treasure hunters thanks to Sam's review. Loved it and my nephew loved it even more.
So glad to see all these updates to the older lists. A few surprises on this one......loved it.
I notice a lot of these games have great art. I wonder if its easier to give a game a second chance if it has great art, or if its easier to play over and over again with great art.
that turkey impression at the beginning was so hilarious :D
Magic is definitely on my list, too, especially because of Commander. So now I’m dying to know what Commander Tom plays!
I've had this happen with a ton of games:
* Legacy: The Testament of Duke de Crecy jumped so far up that it became one of my favorite games. I just kept on playing, getting into the storytelling of the game, learning more strategy.. and it kept on becoming a richer experience. Also with the birth event cards replacing the complications, that was a really big improvement as they have different card backs (so you know you're taking a risk) and much more variety in what can happen.
* Sushi Go was also a surprise. First time I played, I hated it. But because people play it all the time, I kept on playing, and now appreciate it for the light, sweet filler that it is. Same with zombie dice - it's completely random, but it's always a good time and so I've grown to love it.
* Five Tribes still gets better every time play it. First time, you're just struggling to keep the AP at bay. But the more you play, the more you get into the strategy, the more there is to love. Good expansions too, but frankly, the base game is fantastic by itself.
* Village is a game I originally liked, but the Port expansion brought it to a whole new level and affected the balance of the whole game so profoundly that I refuse to play the game without it. The Inn expansion added variety for replayability, but that Port expansion is really what made the game a permanent fixture in my collection.
* Scythe - have to second these from the list. First time I played, I thought Scythe was 'okay, but nothing special.' Every time I played it, though, new strategic avenues opened up to me. Then, I got to play it with all the factions playing at once and got to appreciate how amazingly fast it is even at high player counts. Then, we got better at the game and it got more and more strategic. And now a new expansion has come out and a legacy expansion is coming out - and it's now one of my absolute favorites.
* Terraforming Mars - another 'good, but nothing special' game based on my initial play, but boy, I was completely wrong. We played with beginner corps the first game, but the actual corporations, and the draft, make a drastic improvement. Then, the more you play, the better you understand the cards, dynamics, relative values.. and the more cut-throat and competitive it gets. What started out as a 'let's all do our own thing' euro turned into a game where I spend other players' turns desperately hoping that the other player doesn't do X. I love it. Hellas & Elysium are a great map addition. I haven't tried Venus Next yet, because the one thing I still don't like about TM is its length... but it sounds like the new Prelude expansion may be the answer to that!
I want someone to look at me in the same way that Tom looks at Zee when he's talking about Cosmic Encounter.
Hah!
Great list. Glad to see the pics of the games and roll off for number 1 :)
After learning more about 👻Ghost Fightin Treasure Hunters, I paused the video and bought it along with Istanbul, a game that's been on my watch list for a while now. A little under an hour later, Istanbul makes an appearance in Zee's list. 🤩🎉
Looked like Kingdomino evolved into Queendomino.
The editing wizardry is really making this video. I'm loving it.
So sad to see Sub Terra there with 2017 publish date yet i still haven't received my game and im a KS backer. Ugh
Dalmatinac3 haha
I agree about Rising Sun. The Diplomacy was overhyped. My second play was much better than my first. I really liked it the second time. I want to play it more.
I played it 7 times now. There's definitely more negotiations the more your group plays.
Funny, Rising sun has anti-hype for me. I want nothing to do with it. Chaos in the old world - super hype, Blood Rage - maximum hype... I hated both of them.. so Eric Lang comes out with yet another dudes on a map with giant dudes... I'm just bleh.
I want to see Sam do a "Top 10 Games to Paint" where he covers some games with minis that he thinks were fun to paint. Or really anyone in the DTN that might be interested in doing that list, you three are just the first i always think of (and my favorites).
I agree with Tom on Viticulture.. I played it for the first time (base game) a couple months ago, and wow. i was underwhelmed. I've heard the Dice Tower talk so much about it, and I love Scythe.. but Viticulture just felt dull. The choices I made felt almost like they were the obvious choices to make, and I was just going through the motions. In the end, I felt it was ok, but not great. Maybe I need to try it with the expansions.. but I don't really see that happening any time soon.
The game that turned around for me was also King of Tokyo.. I played my first game years ago, and played with the full player count. I think I and someone else got knocked out early, and it just felt really dull. No one was really buying upgrade cards, and the whole thing was just blah! I swore I'd never play it again.
Then last year, I thought my daughter might like it, I explained the game, and we tried it at a FLGS a couple times and ended up buying it. Now, I wouldn't say that it's my favorite game, but I enjoy it a lot more after a few more plays under my belt than I did after that first play.
Zee - I agree with you about #6. Uchronia is under-appreciated but is actually the best re-implemention of Glory to Rome. I sold my Black Box Glory to Rome recently but am keeping both Uchronia and Mottainai in my collection.
Everybody needs someone to look at him like Tom looking at Zee during Cosmic Encounters :D
Great top 10! And good job editing it Zee!
Thanks to you Zee, I was able to pick up the ghost fightin' treasure hunters expansion. Oh boy the kids are going to love that.
Editing on point in this one XD
so when the top ten "why are we still playing this games" is going to drop?
My top 10:
1. Five Tribes
2. Cosmic Encounter
3. Glory to Rome
4. The Resistance: Avalon
5. Thunderstone Advance
6. Viticulture
7. Champions of Midgard
8. Hero Realms
9. 7 Wonders
10. Puerto Rico
love your top10s! keep them coming! I would love to see a top10 games with beautifull artwork since i am a sucker for artwork lol
Wait a second...didn't Sam put Cash & Guns on his turkey list? Oh, I guess it was Zee. :)
Istanbul blew me away when I first played it, and it's just gotten better. I've still not tired of the base game, and would like to play the first expansion more (and then might get the second expansion if we manage to play it enough).
Quantum is the only game I haven't bought with any recommendation, and it's still one of my favorite games to this day.
Tom looks like he is going to cry with joy when Zee said he likes Cosmic Encounter.
Zee talking about how much better Elder Sign gets with the expansions makes me think I need to give it another chance.
Any recommendations on which expansions are best to get?
It's two years later, but in case someone else has this same question, the general consensus is that Gates of Arkham is the Elder Sign expansion to get. It takes the game outside the museum and adds thematic touches not present in the base game.
This was one of the funniest top 10 of all time. The edditing wizard must be on all videos lol
If I had one wish,it would be to have Zee at my birthday party, critising negatively the presents I get
I just thought dice is stupid and luck when i was starting to explore the world of games .. so i went for the deckbuilders. But as the time passed by, i saw one video of people playing tiny epic galaxies - and i was like ... ok , there's a way to mitigate even if yer roll isn't right. So i decided to try Castles of Burgundy and Stone Age on BGA and now i love the dice , when executed well.
Another top 10, everyone grab your 🍿 !
I disagree so heavily on "King of Tokyo is pretty inexpensive" - it was definitely overpriced IMO. Great simple game, but asking for $45 (retail price) for it + $30 for the power up expansion was definitely an error for the content in the box and no one I know (not even my friends that liked it) even got close to getting it because of price factor. You could get so many great gateway and filler games for that.
Spot on with Viticulture Tom. would be my #1 for all the same reasons.
Civilization: the board game gets better over time for my group. After about 30 games, we're still discovering whole new strategies, and I swear no two games have ever been the same.
Which one? There's many civilisation games
Quantum is one of my favorite games of all time! Always a hit!!
I might have to give Elder Sign another try. Wasn't impressed the first time through.
I wonder if rob Oren taught Sam this quantum game.
I was about to agree with this. Then saw who wrote it....
A still these days cant undestand Tom’s idea of “spliting the Group into two groups to play a 4 player game and another 3 player game”.
Why would i split all my friends if we are together to play so we can have a social interation with each others?
Look for a game that everyone can play or dont invite everyone if we all are going to be seperated... it doens make sense
Edit all videos with such flare and panache. Lol
All that expansion and second addition garbage is too stupid. It is not the same game then. Of course you like it better when it gets fixed and has more stuff added to it. The game didn't get better, you simply got another game instead.
"Editing wizardry" ;D Great episode!
Can you not just play Zombicide and modify the "hit your friends" rule?
Cyclades!
Not playing a game because of one rule? How about changing the rule yourself. BAM! Problem solved...
lol I still find it hilarious how many people absolutely hated Zombicide for that one rule when it's so easy to just house-rule it. The entire game is meant to be flexible and to allow for players to get creative in making their own scenarios are rules, I just don't understand the kind of mental resistance some people have to doing that.
Sam. We love the power up expansion for King of Tokyo too! Have you played it with the Halloween expansion? It’s kind of hokey (with the monsters able to wear or steal costumes), but it’s pretty fun too.
Benjamin Spears I took out all the costumes because it just doesn’t match the theme. Played it that way for years and then some friends bought their own copy and were very confused when the costumes came up. They expressed their surprise they had never encountered them before in all the times we played and I had to admit my censorship. 😁
Cthulwho? Yeah. It’s definitely breaking the theme rules, but I find that especially with kids, it’s a pretty fun edition to the game. It is more of a Halloween add on. If we were to take the theme really seriously we would probably have to get rid of the bunny, penguin, and panda too.
Wow, 10 minutes in, and I own most of what you’ve listed lol
lol celestia is with noria up there in my playlist the worst game ever haahahah
Oh boy - another top 10 while I work on some 3D projects! Thanks guys :-)
This is more a top 10 games that got better with expansions.
Will we get a "top 10 games that got worse" list?
Also: ua-cam.com/video/hPtThj2Ro60/v-deo.html
0:26. You are welcome.
Spot on with Sam saying that about King/Queendomino creators making a game and then months later wishing they had done the thing in their game. This is suuuuuper common for most artistic creations especially including music and movies. George Lucas has a famous quote saying, “Moves aren’t released, they escape” meaning that a director would continuously edit their movie for all time if the publishers didn’t come and rip it out of their proverbial hands and put it out in the theaters. 😇
Couldn't disagree with Sam more on the Cash & Guns art (the old art was cool, stylized, and gritty... the new is.... Munchkin. Enough said.) So, now I want to go back and find out what this passing-the-cards-under-the-table thing was... sounds cool! ;)
That board for Ghost Fighter is essentially a reskin of the board (at least the room and door placement) for the Series of Unfortunate Events "Perilous Parlor Game" board game that no one has ever played but me, haha. They're both by Mattel so I guess it's OK, just lazy.
Sam's perspective on games seems to be understandably skewed: I love Kingdomino for what it is and it's excellent non gamer appeal, and I can see how a gamer would like Queendomino better. But there's no excessive dumbing down or what imho: the target audience is simply different. I can play Kingdomino with my parents and kids and we all get to enjoy it. Queendomino would never fly in that context. Already too complex.
the first time I played Cosmic nobody explained what kind of game it was (negotiation and betrayal) and I was expecting TI3 light (4x) and I HATED IT. Still haven't played it again but I want to.
There should be a '10 Most Pointless reskins'. The two I'd have first and second would be King of Tokyo and even worse 'Carcassonne'.
I know many people who have not bothered buying anymore Carcassonne expansions because they have the original subtle artwork and can only get the expansions in the bold garish artwork.
For me, Tesla vs. Edison: War of Currents got soooo much better (and is really a different game altogether) with the Powering Up! expansion. Very much like this game now. In my top 10 for sure
Thanks for the video guys. Thought Rum & Bones Second Tide might make this list. From first edition to second, to all the expansions/factions, it has become a game I really enjoy...but took some plays to "get it" and enjoy it for what it is. Love it now.
For me, after a few plays of Kingdom Builder after buying the base box, I seriously thought about getting rid of it. It felt so bland and boring. I think I went in with the wrong mind set, hoping for it to be a more thinky, complex game than it was. I have to admit, after picking it back up again to give it another shot this year, I've come around on it. I enjoy the fun to time put in ratio. You just have to realize it is light, has a different but straight forward strategy each game, and we love the speed I which it plays. The crossroads expansion helps as well, giving more options and variation per game. For a 20 minute quickie, my wife and I love it.
Splendor... felt didnt rlly satisfied any typo of "ich" for a game, also as soon as i felt okay now my engine is going, oh game is over, i lost.
But the aproach was completely wrong ;) now its one of my fav small games, top3... and i win 8/10 times.
Sam, I watch most of the things you do and agree with you a lot of the times. But I have been playing Zombicide for years, it's one of our favorite games of all time. The reason being is because it's a great game system, the rules set is simple yet elegant, including the rule you dislike. That rule is mitigated by weapons and character skills and adds uniqueness to the game, in terms of tactics and and asymmetrical abilities of the characters. In short, it incorporated friendly fire without the need for a complicated set of rules. In other words if you don't have the right weapon or a particular set of skills you should not be firing your Thomson machine gun into an area that contains your friends. But if you have the right kind of weapon or the right kind of skill, have at it. You could also just rush in a go at it face to face. We have Black Plague also but mostly play the original, which just keeps getting better and better.
Definitely Merchants and Marauders for me. Only because the expansion added more depth and complexity to the game and gives you more options to victory. Still a long game with heavy emphasis on luck of your dice rolls, but more likely to get it to the table thanks to Seas of Glory.
Between Two Cities fell flat the first time I played it, even though I liked the idea of cooperating with your neighbors. I thought the expansion really added something and now it's one of our groups' go-to shorter games.
King of Tokyo is great. The power up expansion isn't because most of the powers are anemic.
So what are your favorite Icehouse games? That sounds like a good list for you7 Tom, even if the others aren't that into the game.
I really find Cyclades: Titans to be so odd. It changes the game too much to the point where it doesn't feel like Cyclades anymore. Poseidon lost its power and you no longer have that interesting way your ships get into place, causing stress to other players :(
Homeworlds is my favorite game in the Pyramid Arcade. It is definitely the most complex, but very rewarding.
Funny thing, but one of the most powerful Magic decks I've ever touched was a Red-Black Eldrazi starter deck.
I honestly dislike Viticulture with Tuscany more for everytime. The winter and Summer cards are so vastly unbalanced that the right draw will basically win you the game.
I still watching this old top 10s and enjoy them. I love the new Dice Tower team right now but you 3 have a special chemistry.
Maybe for me this game is Star Realms. I got it as a gift from a friend and gave it to that friend and didn’t think about it. Then I later got the app and started playing someone’s copy at game night, and while it is not exactly my favorite game, it’s much higher on my list than before.
i am so glad to hear about the level of diplomacy in Rising Sun according to Zee. I don't care for the "mechanism". so great!!
So Queendomino is Ms. Pac-man.
M:TG, Tom? This has taken exactly the opposite trajectory for me. Now it's just an analysis paralysis fest.
Thanks guys for doing this one. I really appreciate that you guys are able get past your initial impressions and let these games grow to the point where you can highly recommend them.
When Zee was setting up his #10, I thought he was gonna say Twilight Imperium 3 or Cosmic Encounters.
I STILL feel like King of Tokyo is just themed yatzee. Not that its a bad thing but I just don't get the overwhelming love for it.
it is.
Me too. I find it quite boring. Run, Fight or die is a way better themed yahtzee game.
What is interesting is that King of New York is the "Queendomino" to KoT's "Kingdomino", yet Sam et al seems to not have much love for that. I prefer KoNY because the boroughs, buildings and units make for a more strategic game.
If you watch their original miami dice review of it they all loved KONY.
KOT is boring as a gamer but for new people into the hobbie it is great.
I'd love to check out Sub Terra, Zee, but I'm still waiting for them to ship my backer copy!
Was hoping you guys did not allow expansions in this list: just the core games getting better with more plays.
Nope Haha
great episode, thanks!!
Uchronia - wanted to like but it's unplayable for me with their extremely poor colour choices.
They have such a pleasant little song at the end of the videos, but if you adjust the speed to half speed and then listen, it just makes you wanna cry.
Lords of Waterdeep. Boringly first try, amazing with the expansion.
Chariot Race is like this for us. The more we play it the more we like it. Simple but subtle complex strategies.
The game that got better for me would be 7 Wonders
The Titans expansion really fixes the anticlimactic ending to Cyclades? How does it do that?