Thank you for these guides. I had a vague idea of what the different tuning options do, but couldn't quite fully grasp what they actually lead to when changed. These proper examples and the way you explain them really help me visualise what's actually happening and understand it. Very, very useful. 👍
Right. True edification comes when a teacher shows you WHY things work rather than giving a step by step list. Understanding principles and concepts rather than memorizing details. This kind of video permanently increases our ability to understand the setups. Hope this channel grows.
I guess Ive been out the loop for too long. I did not know about some of these factors being a part of the game. This guide was helpful in all kinds of ways. Thanks!
Very good narrator and content creator. Not only are your videos accurate and useful, but they are also enjoyable to watch ! Can't wait for the part 2.
I had my M3 97 tuned without adjusting the suspension and the auto-drive AI spun into the wall immediatly. It was funny xD Now I know how to properly adjust the suspension, thanks!!
Fantastic video. Clear and concise. I've been tinkering with some of my setups, this evening, and it has made the world of difference. I had loads of cars I've done up to racing spec, but had a low frequency on the suspension, which was making them very twitchy. Thank you. Looking forward to part 2.
What would make this all much easier and logical, is if PD would add a real time telemetry to read from, you know, like real engineers do, and like most circuit racing games have, tire temperature alone would help a ton, it would allow you to get your camber/toe and suspension stiffness just right, this is what makes tuning hard because all you have to go by is how it feels.
I found the best way to tune suspension for racing tyres was to replicate the Gr4 settings which you can do to any car... buy fully customisable suspension, dont touch ride height until you try it out as 80% work perfectly even on the Nordschleife... anti roll bar 5 front and rear... dont touch dampers as they are fine... natural frequency 3.00 front and rear for racing tyres and no less than 2.50 for sports tyres... camber 3.5 front 3.0 rear... toe out .10 front... toe in .25 rear... Hope this helps someone lol
In tuning my cars, l believe that if l piss in the wind long and hard enough i'm bound to find a setting that works...and it ends up feeling like magic. 👍
It's worth noting that rear-engined cars may require a significantly higher rear natural frequency than the front, for two reasons. First, that engine location is extremely dependent on weight transfer towards the front under braking for stability. Second, if that weight transfers back rearward too quickly when you release the brakes, especially if you're trail braking, the sudden load shift can make the rear snap oversteer almost uncontrollably.
thanks for the tip! Currently “tuning” the 81’ 930 Turbo on 18” wide offset and width Sport Tires for a 650 pp limit around the Nurburgring and I left the HA suspension and FC diff. as stock as possible before deciding to catch some rest on it. Only so many power spins a man can endure.
@@kalsten2236 More weight in the front helps mitigate it somewhat, more weight in the rear makes it worse. It's also car dependent to some degree, if a particular car has abnormally high rear grip levels the effect will tend to be less pronounced, because the tires can handle the additional load more effectively. As a sidenote this also means you need to be careful about adding too much rear ballast to an otherwise front-heavy car, since the rear tires and suspension were never intended to deal with that much strain.
@@kalsten2236 Somewhat. I try to pack as little ballast as I can as a general rule, but some cars need it more than others. The 992 Turbo S and RUF RGT 4.2 are both remarkably stable without any sort of ballast, but any 911 pre-997 is pure nightmare fuel without at least _some_ extra weight in the nose.
Learnt a lot from this. Throwing some cars into corners would have the rear come around and couldn't figure it out. Wasnt into tuning. Fixed my lancer and Mitsubishi gto. With both cars on SS. I tried 3.0 but found while it was more stable, i lost grip. I dropped them to about 2.50 and 2.75 and the grip started to come back. Thanks very much.
I'm sure someone else pointed that out already, but natural frequency and spring rate are not at all the same. One is the frequency and the other the rate, meaning one is giving you the wavelength over time or resonance while the other gives you a rate of force per mm. With different weighing cars you have different spring rates to achieve the same frequency. That's a very important difference
Dude, I was configuring a Lancer yesterday (new from the update) and it was horrible at the Nurburgring (I configured it at Tsukuba), I only changed the roll bars and the shock absorbers. Now seeing your implication on natural frequency, I feel ready for new tests. My car is doing exactly what the Corvette in the video did, just by taking my foot off the accelerator it comes out of the back and spins. The frequencies are at 1.50/1.65 only. PS. I use soft sports tires. Thank you very much for her explanation!
Probably different Lancer but i was struggling with one and touching the brakes would spin the rear end around. I didnt understand why. Ive never really been into tuning suspension. I started by looking at the Gr.4 cars. Similar pp group to the 650pp car i was using. They all have a natural frequency of 3.0, front and rear. 1st trial with this was a huge difference. Back end stopped coming around. Came 1st by a mile and a huge amount of relief was lifted. Ill continue to test this but its feels so much more controllable with that 1 change. Also fixed the Mitsubishi gto that had a lose end. So awesome.
Even though I'm quite familiar with GT7 & tuning, I still learned a lot more about how GT7's physics work thanks to the direct comparisons back-to-back. Very great video!
Holy Cow!! What a huge wealth of information! One statement from you about Natural Frequency could cover a whole video! Subscribed, saved, and a big thank you. Keep 'em coming guys (& gals, Hell idk.. ;)
8:42 I'm so glad that you explained the issue with bottoming the car. I recently got it with my trusty Cayman GT4 with pretty high downforce and relatively soft suspension as I prefer it, especially at the Nurburgring. I suddenly lost my car like I got hit by something, I really thought it was a glitch. Now I want to test it myself to be really sure that I bottom my front suspension there.
@@fossilfueled27 It happened exactly at the same spot at Nurburgring as shown in the video. Yes, I will figure out how to deal with it, but I want to study this on other cars first. Looks very interesting to me.
First, thank you for the videos. Your videos has helped me in a lot of areas I've been struggling in. But I found something that you might want to look at. Have you noticed the effects natural frequency has to *off-throttle* sway?... For example, if you accelerate to 100ish mph, completely let off the throttle and do wide sway left to right. You can see if the car has too much oversteer/understeer depending on how high or low the front/rear is set. Hope this helps. 😊👍
Good video as always, for suspension / differentials I'm feeling the guides aren't aim for the best tuning method for speed and consistency, but for the driver style, with some hard facts about them. Some may prefer more oversteer pivoting, with detail explanation, everyone can try their own formula
Love the guides. Your video is the first one I've seen that even acknowledges the problem of violent changes in direction from wheel well rubbing. I do wish that you used a second and possibly third car in your examples. The S2000 has a 50/50 wd, and I presume that cars with front or rear weight biases react differently to suspension changes. I, again, presume that a car with a high rear weight bias like the 991 911 gt3 rs would require f/r natural frequencies that reflect its f/r weight distribution. This used to be the road car I was fastest with around my preferred time trial course but as I have gotten better I have been reducing the driving assists like abs and traction control. Without any assists, my times have gotten significantly slower and most of my cars are now "less than drivable".
I use the S2000 as the primary example because it shows the difference certain adjustments will make. With a 911 trying to spin, the changes made by suspension tweaks will be less obvious. The basics that I cover apply on all cars, though.
Just came across your very interesting video on Suspension Part 1. really good. Great job. Will be checking out your other videos. I drive Gr2 mainly and have struggled to find a setup that works, literally spent months and months working to find a setup that works. I am close to it but know theres still more refinement needed. I love the Nurb and thats what i am concentrating my build on. I use the Honda NSX, its fully upgraded so is very quick. My present best lap is 5:16.9 so not slow but I know theres more in the track to take. I have saved the lap in Showcase so can be seen there. Would be interested in your feed back on how the car handles.
Awesome video! I have yet to test it in game, but from my experience with my real life auto cross Miata, the stiffness of the anti roll bars really only makes a significant difference if they’re stiffer than the springs on the vehicle. It would be nice to have actual spring rates in game for both the anti roll bars and the natural frequency. For my Miata, as it’s a built for maximum grip in lower speed corners, I have a softer setup for the shocks and springs, so it transfers the weight forward and backwards, but a stiff setup for the anti roll bars, so it feels flatter when quickly changing directions.
One thing if you are tuning a Tomahawk S, GTS-R, X, you MUST set ride height as low as possible to dramatically inprove cornering and slightly increase top speed. (Coming from testing)
I know that wheel arch rubbing is a thing but, some cars like C7 ZR1 has the wheel arch rubbing problem AT STOCK settings. Try going around the standard layout Deep Forest in a bone stock C7 ZR1, the car violently goes to the left at the final straight as there is a change in altitude. The suspension system works as intended but, the default values are incorrect as I am sure a C7 ZR1 irl doesn't suffer from this problem.
It wouldn't have that problem, no. For the physics changes in Update 1.49 PD basically just dialled up body roll, which has had unintended consequences on softly-sprung road cars. Whether they'll tweak the physics *yet again* remains to be seen.
Does anyone know how the shot of the yellow Mitsubishi was done in the intro? How the camera is fixed in front of the car but the car is not centered? Timestamp 0:37 to 1:27
6:47 "I haven't really touched on how natural frequency will affect a car's ability to take bumps." I'm confused by what he means here, since at 1:48 he said that a "low natural frequency will result in a car... that can deal with bumps and high curbs well."
Thanx so much for the explanation. Is it possible to make Bugatti GR.1 less slidy on higher speed turns? It would be the perfect car if it can be tamed in this regard.
How do we induce more oversteer under braking? Seems GT7 has a very understeery-feeling physics, and I want my cars to rotate under trailbraking more. It's it reducing rear rollbars?
Reducing rear roll bars, dramatically reducing rear frequency, decreasing initial torque and braking sensitivity all contribute. Though you may find that a lot of cars can become quite difficult to control under braking as a result.
hey buddy, could you please make a tutorial about tuning the 4wd car! since it's getting worse especially after the last physics, too much understeering on brake or unstable when you left off accelerate..
What do I set on the Anti roll bar if my Car oversteer while braking but also while accelerating in corners?? 🫠🫠🫠 (Trying to tune the old Chevrolet which is currently in the Legend Car shop)
The Camaro? That probably needs a lot of different settings to tame. Are you using it fully upgraded on racing tyres? If so, the most important thing is downforce. It needs an ugly rear wing to keep the back end stable at high speeds. Adding some toe out angle to the front can help with oversteer, adding toe in to the rear can help, and as for the anti roll bars, I'd try it both ways and see what you prefer.
@@fossilfueled27 I was hoping not having to use that wing, it really doesn't look good on him...but anyways I ll try to add some toe out/toe in and if it doesn't help then I guess I have a new drift car 😂
@@LingXiaoyu-m5p If you're on sports tyres it'll handle ok without a rear wing. If you're on racing tyres it absolutely needs a rear wing. You can use the smallest custom wing without any winglets, paint it matte black and it looks like a classic muscle car spoiler.
Thank you for these guides. I had a vague idea of what the different tuning options do, but couldn't quite fully grasp what they actually lead to when changed. These proper examples and the way you explain them really help me visualise what's actually happening and understand it. Very, very useful. 👍
Right. True edification comes when a teacher shows you WHY things work rather than giving a step by step list. Understanding principles and concepts rather than memorizing details. This kind of video permanently increases our ability to understand the setups. Hope this channel grows.
This is the best video that I saw on the subject so far
Agreed!
I guess Ive been out the loop for too long. I did not know about some of these factors being a part of the game. This guide was helpful in all kinds of ways. Thanks!
Thanks for this since I’ve been trying to find videos that go into depth about tuning after the physic changes.
Very good narrator and content creator.
Not only are your videos accurate and useful, but they are also enjoyable to watch !
Can't wait for the part 2.
I had my M3 97 tuned without adjusting the suspension and the auto-drive AI spun into the wall immediatly. It was funny xD
Now I know how to properly adjust the suspension, thanks!!
Fantastic video. Clear and concise. I've been tinkering with some of my setups, this evening, and it has made the world of difference. I had loads of cars I've done up to racing spec, but had a low frequency on the suspension, which was making them very twitchy. Thank you. Looking forward to part 2.
What would make this all much easier and logical, is if PD would add a real time telemetry to read from, you know, like real engineers do, and like most circuit racing games have, tire temperature alone would help a ton, it would allow you to get your camber/toe and suspension stiffness just right, this is what makes tuning hard because all you have to go by is how it feels.
I found the best way to tune suspension for racing tyres was to replicate the Gr4 settings which you can do to any car... buy fully customisable suspension, dont touch ride height until you try it out as 80% work perfectly even on the Nordschleife... anti roll bar 5 front and rear... dont touch dampers as they are fine... natural frequency 3.00 front and rear for racing tyres and no less than 2.50 for sports tyres... camber 3.5 front 3.0 rear... toe out .10 front... toe in .25 rear...
Hope this helps someone lol
In tuning my cars, l believe that if l piss in the wind long and hard enough i'm bound to find a setting that works...and it ends up feeling like magic. 👍
For some cars it can feel like this. The Plymouth Superbird comes to mind :)
It's worth noting that rear-engined cars may require a significantly higher rear natural frequency than the front, for two reasons. First, that engine location is extremely dependent on weight transfer towards the front under braking for stability. Second, if that weight transfers back rearward too quickly when you release the brakes, especially if you're trail braking, the sudden load shift can make the rear snap oversteer almost uncontrollably.
thanks for the tip!
Currently “tuning” the 81’ 930 Turbo on 18” wide offset and width Sport Tires for a 650 pp limit around the Nurburgring and I left the HA suspension and FC diff. as stock as possible before deciding to catch some rest on it. Only so many power spins a man can endure.
does this still happen more if the ballast was set to the front or rear?
@@kalsten2236 More weight in the front helps mitigate it somewhat, more weight in the rear makes it worse. It's also car dependent to some degree, if a particular car has abnormally high rear grip levels the effect will tend to be less pronounced, because the tires can handle the additional load more effectively. As a sidenote this also means you need to be careful about adding too much rear ballast to an otherwise front-heavy car, since the rear tires and suspension were never intended to deal with that much strain.
@@griffinfaulkner3514 so its much better to not trust the ratio too much?
@@kalsten2236 Somewhat. I try to pack as little ballast as I can as a general rule, but some cars need it more than others. The 992 Turbo S and RUF RGT 4.2 are both remarkably stable without any sort of ballast, but any 911 pre-997 is pure nightmare fuel without at least _some_ extra weight in the nose.
The best suspension guide I've stumbled into yet, kudos! Can't wait for part 2 :)
Learnt a lot from this.
Throwing some cars into corners would have the rear come around and couldn't figure it out. Wasnt into tuning.
Fixed my lancer and Mitsubishi gto. With both cars on SS. I tried 3.0 but found while it was more stable, i lost grip. I dropped them to about 2.50 and 2.75 and the grip started to come back.
Thanks very much.
cool. first time I find a video explaining this in a way I understand it. thanks. more of that please
I'm sure someone else pointed that out already, but natural frequency and spring rate are not at all the same. One is the frequency and the other the rate, meaning one is giving you the wavelength over time or resonance while the other gives you a rate of force per mm. With different weighing cars you have different spring rates to achieve the same frequency. That's a very important difference
Wow! Very informative! I love the visuals. Thank you!
Dude, I was configuring a Lancer yesterday (new from the update) and it was horrible at the Nurburgring (I configured it at Tsukuba), I only changed the roll bars and the shock absorbers.
Now seeing your implication on natural frequency, I feel ready for new tests.
My car is doing exactly what the Corvette in the video did, just by taking my foot off the accelerator it comes out of the back and spins.
The frequencies are at 1.50/1.65 only.
PS. I use soft sports tires.
Thank you very much for her explanation!
Probably different Lancer but i was struggling with one and touching the brakes would spin the rear end around. I didnt understand why. Ive never really been into tuning suspension.
I started by looking at the Gr.4 cars. Similar pp group to the 650pp car i was using.
They all have a natural frequency of 3.0, front and rear.
1st trial with this was a huge difference. Back end stopped coming around. Came 1st by a mile and a huge amount of relief was lifted. Ill continue to test this but its feels so much more controllable with that 1 change.
Also fixed the Mitsubishi gto that had a lose end. So awesome.
Even though I'm quite familiar with GT7 & tuning, I still learned a lot more about how GT7's physics work thanks to the direct comparisons back-to-back. Very great video!
Holy Cow!! What a huge wealth of information! One statement from you about Natural Frequency could cover a whole video! Subscribed, saved, and a big thank you. Keep 'em coming guys (& gals, Hell idk.. ;)
You are the best gt7 content creator
8:42 I'm so glad that you explained the issue with bottoming the car. I recently got it with my trusty Cayman GT4 with pretty high downforce and relatively soft suspension as I prefer it, especially at the Nurburgring. I suddenly lost my car like I got hit by something, I really thought it was a glitch. Now I want to test it myself to be really sure that I bottom my front suspension there.
It almost certainly is. You'll either need to increase body height or increase natural frequency
@@fossilfueled27 It happened exactly at the same spot at Nurburgring as shown in the video. Yes, I will figure out how to deal with it, but I want to study this on other cars first. Looks very interesting to me.
Immaculately done video my friend. Very informative setups.
really enjoying the videos so far 👍
First, thank you for the videos. Your videos has helped me in a lot of areas I've been struggling in.
But I found something that you might want to look at. Have you noticed the effects natural frequency has to *off-throttle* sway?...
For example, if you accelerate to 100ish mph, completely let off the throttle and do wide sway left to right.
You can see if the car has too much oversteer/understeer depending on how high or low the front/rear is set.
Hope this helps. 😊👍
Good video as always, for suspension / differentials I'm feeling the guides aren't aim for the best tuning method for speed and consistency, but for the driver style, with some hard facts about them. Some may prefer more oversteer pivoting, with detail explanation, everyone can try their own formula
Love the guides. Your video is the first one I've seen that even acknowledges the problem of violent changes in direction from wheel well rubbing.
I do wish that you used a second and possibly third car in your examples. The S2000 has a 50/50 wd, and I presume that cars with front or rear weight biases react differently to suspension changes. I, again, presume that a car with a high rear weight bias like the 991 911 gt3 rs would require f/r natural frequencies that reflect its f/r weight distribution. This used to be the road car I was fastest with around my preferred time trial course but as I have gotten better I have been reducing the driving assists like abs and traction control. Without any assists, my times have gotten significantly slower and most of my cars are now "less than drivable".
I use the S2000 as the primary example because it shows the difference certain adjustments will make. With a 911 trying to spin, the changes made by suspension tweaks will be less obvious. The basics that I cover apply on all cars, though.
Just came across your very interesting video on Suspension Part 1. really good. Great job. Will be checking out your other videos. I drive Gr2 mainly and have struggled to find a setup that works, literally spent months and months working to find a setup that works. I am close to it but know theres still more refinement needed. I love the Nurb and thats what i am concentrating my build on. I use the Honda NSX, its fully upgraded so is very quick. My present best lap is 5:16.9 so not slow but I know theres more in the track to take. I have saved the lap in Showcase so can be seen there. Would be interested in your feed back on how the car handles.
Thank you I been looking for a video like this i hope you come out with more just like this
Awesome video! I have yet to test it in game, but from my experience with my real life auto cross Miata, the stiffness of the anti roll bars really only makes a significant difference if they’re stiffer than the springs on the vehicle. It would be nice to have actual spring rates in game for both the anti roll bars and the natural frequency.
For my Miata, as it’s a built for maximum grip in lower speed corners, I have a softer setup for the shocks and springs, so it transfers the weight forward and backwards, but a stiff setup for the anti roll bars, so it feels flatter when quickly changing directions.
One thing if you are tuning a Tomahawk S, GTS-R, X, you MUST set ride height as low as possible to dramatically inprove cornering and slightly increase top speed. (Coming from testing)
Very helpful. Thank you!
I'm happy with this guide thanks bro 👍🏼
This video is gold
I know that wheel arch rubbing is a thing but, some cars like C7 ZR1 has the wheel arch rubbing problem AT STOCK settings. Try going around the standard layout Deep Forest in a bone stock C7 ZR1, the car violently goes to the left at the final straight as there is a change in altitude.
The suspension system works as intended but, the default values are incorrect as I am sure a C7 ZR1 irl doesn't suffer from this problem.
It wouldn't have that problem, no. For the physics changes in Update 1.49 PD basically just dialled up body roll, which has had unintended consequences on softly-sprung road cars. Whether they'll tweak the physics *yet again* remains to be seen.
YES! thank you for the video!
Great videos 👍 are those setting affecting fully tuned AI cars in the same way?
Thanks again👍🏻👍🏻💯
If only all your summaries existed somewhere in written form. Because when you open a tuning sheet, you immediately forget everything.
Make a note on your phone lol
Does anyone know how the shot of the yellow Mitsubishi was done in the intro? How the camera is fixed in front of the car but the car is not centered? Timestamp 0:37 to 1:27
This video here explains how to do it.
ua-cam.com/video/TJWmL9VBAVU/v-deo.html
@@fossilfueled27Amazing, thanks!
how about a tutorial about setting up lightweight and heavyweight cars?
6:47 "I haven't really touched on how natural frequency will affect a car's ability to take bumps."
I'm confused by what he means here, since at 1:48 he said that a "low natural frequency will result in a car... that can deal with bumps and high curbs well."
What I mean is that I only mention it, not going into much detail.
@@fossilfueled27 Thanks for the clarification. Your videos have been really helping me out lately. You're doing an amazing job with these!
Thanx so much for the explanation. Is it possible to make Bugatti GR.1 less slidy on higher speed turns? It would be the perfect car if it can be tamed in this regard.
I don't normally drive or tune race cars, but it's probably just a case of increasing the rear downforce.
How do we induce more oversteer under braking? Seems GT7 has a very understeery-feeling physics, and I want my cars to rotate under trailbraking more. It's it reducing rear rollbars?
Reducing rear roll bars, dramatically reducing rear frequency, decreasing initial torque and braking sensitivity all contribute. Though you may find that a lot of cars can become quite difficult to control under braking as a result.
hey buddy, could you please make a tutorial about tuning the 4wd car! since it's getting worse especially after the last physics, too much understeering on brake or unstable when you left off accelerate..
A lot of 4WD tuning is covered in the differential video.
@fossilfueled27 thank man, I'll check it out
@fossilfueled27 I thought it's a suspension setup not diff , I'll watch the video and hopefully it'll work
@@TamerN.S-u1l Diff settings have the biggest effect on 4WD handling
Here we go again
Thank you
Do you think this video could somewhat be used for gt6?
Possibly though I wouldn't be 100% sure.
'69 Camaro also suffers wheel arch rubbing.
My supra rz is very good but at high speeds its kinda understeery and its not as fast
my suzuki cappuccino just falls over no matter wwhat i do to it
Try increasing anti roll bars, downforce and reducing body height
More grip more stiff
What do I set on the Anti roll bar if my Car oversteer while braking but also while accelerating in corners?? 🫠🫠🫠
(Trying to tune the old Chevrolet which is currently in the Legend Car shop)
The Camaro? That probably needs a lot of different settings to tame. Are you using it fully upgraded on racing tyres? If so, the most important thing is downforce. It needs an ugly rear wing to keep the back end stable at high speeds. Adding some toe out angle to the front can help with oversteer, adding toe in to the rear can help, and as for the anti roll bars, I'd try it both ways and see what you prefer.
@@fossilfueled27
I was hoping not having to use that wing, it really doesn't look good on him...but anyways I ll try to add some toe out/toe in and if it doesn't help then I guess I have a new drift car 😂
@@LingXiaoyu-m5p If you're on sports tyres it'll handle ok without a rear wing. If you're on racing tyres it absolutely needs a rear wing.
You can use the smallest custom wing without any winglets, paint it matte black and it looks like a classic muscle car spoiler.
@@fossilfueled27
Adding toe in/toe out and switching to sport tires helped a lot! I can drive the Camaro without wing now 👍
Thank you kind stranger 🫶🏻