Animated GIFs and Space vs Time - Computerphile

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  • Опубліковано 4 лис 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 565

  • @petraarkian7720
    @petraarkian7720 9 років тому +1097

    "it was the tumblr of its day... it was awesome and then yahoo took it over and it was no longer awesome" wow... history repeats itself...

  • @anracc5302
    @anracc5302 9 років тому +1553

    They work everywhere, on every OS.
    Except for the IOS photo viewer.

  • @Creaform003
    @Creaform003 10 років тому +187

    This explains why when a video messes up, you get their face moving across the screen in the silhouette of a hand and it continues to get messed up until a new key-frame is shown.

    • @HassanSelim0
      @HassanSelim0 10 років тому +27

      yeah, I actually figured out the concept of inter-frame compression before studying it because of that kind of video glitch :)

    • @KuraIthys
      @KuraIthys 10 років тому +10

      Pretty much. I don't know for certain, but my guess is errors like that happen when one or more of the keyframes get lost somehow.

  • @NickiRusin
    @NickiRusin 10 років тому +451

    I'm too young to remember GeoCities, so I just imagined a world where every single Tumbr user has to code his page by himself. Bloody hell.

  • @ZipplyZane
    @ZipplyZane 10 років тому +399

    The idea that it should be pronounced "giff" because the G stands for graphics is silly. There's no such rule for acronyms. But pronouncing it "jiff" is still silly for one very important reason:
    When you hear "giff", and you know that old file extensions contained 3 letters, you know the word is spelled "GIF." When you hear "jiff," you could spell it "GIF," but you'd be more likely to spell it "JIF." In English, nearly all one syllable words that start with G have the so-called "hard G" sound.
    This wouldn't be a big problem, except that the "JIF" extension exists. It stands for JPEG interchange format. (The J in images tends to mean that something is connected with JPEG.) So saying "giff" is less ambiguous.

  • @CoxTH
    @CoxTH 10 років тому +60

    Oh, I was making Let's Plays once and I played Sonic Adventure and Final Fantasy VII. I noticed that the video files for Final Fantasy were much smaller than the ones for Sonic and now I finally know why:
    Sonic was pretty fast with the camera moving all the time, whereas Final Fantasy was only moving models on a fixed background. So when I recorded Sonic, the difference between each frame was much bigger and thus more data had to be stored.

  • @IMortage
    @IMortage 10 років тому +381

    I have the impression that Tom Scott's content is easier to edit than most of your contributors'. He seems to have his thoughts collected beforehand and can then just output in a nicely dense, yet easy to understand manner.
    Right?

    • @pmarintube
      @pmarintube 10 років тому +87

      I think He is just more aware of the media than the others contributors.

    • @HassanSelim0
      @HassanSelim0 10 років тому +76

      Paco Marín yeah he has a bunch of videos on his channel called "Things You Might Not Know" which are basically condensed pieces of information that are recorded in one take, so yeah he's used to that :)

  • @gravitar96
    @gravitar96 10 років тому +356

    you should do a video on webm

  • @Epenser1
    @Epenser1 10 років тому +199

    5:55 ... i hear you, man

    • @Lightningblade67
      @Lightningblade67 10 років тому +1

      Your picture D:

    • @jamesgrimwood1285
      @jamesgrimwood1285 10 років тому +20

      And comparing it to MySpace doesn't work either because that's gone away (pretty much) now, too!
      I remember when all this were trees and fields, and people used Trumpet Winsock, Netscape Navigator and a cheap dialup to Demon Internet after 6pm on a Friday. It was a simpler time where the Internet was _really boring_ ;-)

    • @DarkYuan
      @DarkYuan 10 років тому

      James Grimwood Hm... when did Piczo go down?

  • @WolvericCatkin
    @WolvericCatkin 4 роки тому +5

    I just realised that the animation at the end of the video turns the Computerphile tag into an ending tag to match with the same tag at the start, showing that it's now the end of the video, and I love that! 😁

  • @MZZenyl
    @MZZenyl 10 років тому +103

    Yay, I love Tom! He always talks about such interesting topics, and with such a passion! :)

  • @AgglomeratiProduzioni
    @AgglomeratiProduzioni 9 років тому +40

    The Italian position on the /gif/ - /ʤif/ debate:
    In the Italian language, the sound of the letter G depends on what follows it.
    So we have:
    -A soft sound for GIA, GE, GI, GIO and GIU;
    -A hard sound for GA, GHE, GHI, GO and GU;
    -A ɲ sound (spanish ñ) for GN+;
    -A ʎ sound for GLI and GLI+.
    Yes, exactly, a soft sound for GI.
    And that's why most of Italians have always pronounced it /ʤif/ before the announce that it's actually /ʤif/ instead of /gif/: written as that, is just soft in our mind.
    And this, is something you might not know.

    • @columbus8myhw
      @columbus8myhw 9 років тому +12

      And that, is something you might not've known.

  • @LeoWattenberg
    @LeoWattenberg 10 років тому +70

    It's actually really sad that there isn't a widely used more video-like alternative for GIF. There are APNG and WebP, but nearly no browser supports them :(

  • @delusionnnnn
    @delusionnnnn 10 років тому +90

    I wish that animated alpha channel PNG were considered canonical. They fix so many of the problems with animated GIFs it's absurd, but as of a few years ago, Firefox was the only major browser to support it.
    You can have a larger colour palate than 256 colour GIFs, and with the alpha channel, you can define a seamless transparency instead of the nightmare you frequently see when a transparent animated GIF created for a light background finds its way onto a dark background, or vice versa.

    • @DFX2KX
      @DFX2KX 10 років тому +4

      That standard never did get approved, but, I think all major browsers support it at this point, because, for the most part, it makes good sense.
      I used to output Animated GIFs from Anim8or in my homemade game days. You end up using a very simple color pallet just to keep the size reasonable.

    • @RunnerPack
      @RunnerPack 10 років тому +6

      Opera had APNG support 5 *days* before FF ;D en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APNG#Application_support
      I agree that it should have replaced GIF a long time ago, though. It would at least have more support if it weren't for the egotistical libpng maintainers and their overly complicated MNG format...

    • @delusionnnnn
      @delusionnnnn 10 років тому +2

      DFX2KX Unfortunately, IE, Chrome, Safari, Opera (Blink versions), iOS, Android, and Photoshop don't support it. While there are plugins and other extensions to support it in some of these browsers and in Photoshop, it won't become meaningful until it can be reasonably expected that most web browsers can support it natively. No responsible web developer is going to presume his audience uses such an extension.
      Ten people on the PNG working group effectively stood in the way of providing an alternative to the crustly, poorly-aged animated GIF format.

  • @xaostek
    @xaostek 10 років тому +26

    The point at the end is what I love the most about this video. Creating animated gifs has in itself become an artform, and the restrictions it has as an artistic medium has become a vehicle to so much creativity all over tumblr.

  • @bxdanny
    @bxdanny 4 роки тому +5

    GIFs were designed not in the mid-90s, but in 1987 (with a minor revision in 1989). The spec hasn't changed since then. Initially, most GIFs just stored single images. The spec always supported animated files, but they were rare in the format's early days. Now, they're the only kind anyone uses.

  • @Gooberslot
    @Gooberslot 10 років тому +44

    Animated gifs is also an example of an inferior standard hanging on even though there have been superior alternatives, like MNG and APNG, available for a long time.

  • @RichardKulesza
    @RichardKulesza 10 років тому +2

    I'm in a really slow internet connection right now and your hand waving actually crashed my video loading. Guess you made the point there.

  • @DaveLillethun
    @DaveLillethun 10 років тому +2

    Great video! I do generally enjoy the ones by Tom Scott. Keep up the good work!
    This one especially because understanding space/time tradeoffs really is important for programmers and computer scientists. Although I will mention one "gotcha" as far as going too much in the "space" direction, for anyone who wants some more detail...
    Basically the problem happens when your data structure (look-up-table, or whatever it happens to be) becomes SO big... (How big is it??) It's SO big that it won't fit into main memory anymore. ("main memory" is the type of memory that's referred to when someone talks about "your computer's memory")
    So in that case, some of it needs to be stored on the disk, and then you just load part of the look-up-table (or whatever it happens to be) into your memory at a time - whichever part of it you happen to need at that moment.
    The problem with this is that disk is slow. It's MUCH slower than memory. I mean, we're talking a bicycle vs. a Ferrari slower... So once you start having to go to disk to do your lookup, it may actually take more time to look something up than to compute it. (Although still maybe not, depending on how complex a calculation we're talking about... but we've shifted from _most_ things are faster to look up to _most_ things are faster to computer.)
    However, that said, there are some tricks you can use to avoid (or amortize) the expensive cost of going to disk. I won't go into them just now because that would require a lot more depth, and this is already a long comment... Perhaps another time. :)
    On a related note: Has Brady done a video on memory hierarchy? That would be a good one.

  • @noidexe
    @noidexe 10 років тому +68

    R.I.P
    YAHOO! GEOCITIES
    1994 - 2009
    "IT WAS WONDERFUL,
    AND IT WAS BOUGHT BY YAHOO,
    AND IT WAS NOT WONDERFUL ANYMORE"

  • @Reavenk
    @Reavenk 10 років тому +4

    You said Geocities and got me on a nostalgia trip... now I'm compelled to go listen to hamster dance for the first time in years.

  • @chargen
    @chargen 10 років тому +53

    Computerphile man remembers geocities. And perhaps the browser-wars. I remember the GIF89 licensing controversy that had many convinced to change to the *free* PNG format which was made suitable for animation then

  • @goeiecool9999
    @goeiecool9999 10 років тому +29

    Random fact:
    Lookup tables are commonly used for demo scenes on older machines because calculating sines takes up way too much of the cpu cycles.

  • @ZipplyZane
    @ZipplyZane 10 років тому +1

    I never thought of that, but, yeah. Vines are an attempt to bring animated GIFs into the 21st century. They give you the most important part--the loop. They add sound and decent video quality. Vine was trying to capture the audience that makes animated GIFs.
    Simply giving better compression wasn't enough, as we saw with APNG and MNG (the PNG version of animated GIFs). So features had to be added.

  • @nrviognjiocfmbkirdom
    @nrviognjiocfmbkirdom 10 років тому +1

    Another fantastic video. Your chanel is about 6 months ahead of my computer science class in school.

  • @Tonjevic
    @Tonjevic 10 років тому +3

    Am I the only one who is made slightly breathless by the way Tom Scott talks?

  • @Vizaru
    @Vizaru 10 років тому +1

    I really enjoy ow Tom explains things. He is a very good teacher.

  • @SANDVlCH
    @SANDVlCH 8 років тому +9

    Geocities is back as neocities and it is brilliant

  • @JimBCameron
    @JimBCameron 10 років тому +2

    I do GIF animations, but I really never thought to use transparent GIF's within it to tighten it up, DOH! You learn something every day! :)

  • @FishKungfu
    @FishKungfu 10 років тому +1

    Tom Scott's videos are really great!

  • @DanteEsGrande
    @DanteEsGrande 8 років тому +7

    GeoCities ... good god man, thats one way to get my memories rolling.

  • @joshstead6078
    @joshstead6078 9 років тому +383

    And then Yahoo bought tumblr, and it was not wonderful anymore

  • @Walsh2571
    @Walsh2571 9 років тому +75

    RECORD IN 60FPS. I want to observe Tom Scott's movements in much detail.

  • @TomMajerski
    @TomMajerski 10 років тому +2


    Intra-frame Codecs are still used today, but primarily in higher end, higher quality codecs such as ProRes and Cineform. These are also known as Digital Intermediate codecs. This is to differentiate it between the Capture/acquisition codec (such as h.264 in DSLR's) and the delivery Codec - which might also be mpeg4 for the web or J2k for Projection.
    The codec is used in the middle part of the process to edit with. A reason why these codecs are Intra-frame and not Inter frame is because the editor will need to jump around the video clip and cut in any place, and generally have it perform faster on playback. If you used an Inter-frame codec, the computer would have to consider several frames in order to render that one random frame and thus playback or quickly running forwards and backwards through the footage can be very intensive on the computer. Having each frame independent not only helps to maintain quality during the transcode but also to speed up the performance of the video.
    Some cameras record straight to Intra-frame codecs, but they have far larger file sizes but also much better quality. Some cameras even record video as a series of separate image files, such as the Cinema DNG format. These can be either Uncompressed, compressed losslessly or lossy.
    Re-compressing Intra-frame codecs over and over again will not be as destructive as re-compressing Inter-frame codecs over and over again. 

  • @chrissigsegv
    @chrissigsegv 9 років тому +1

    That was presented beautifully, nice editing!

  • @mfbfreak
    @mfbfreak 10 років тому +11

    Aah, animated gifs... I remember some really cheesy ones from way back when modems still made funny noises...
    Awesome presentation, delightful interaction between the cameraperson and the presenter!

  • @JXter_
    @JXter_ 8 років тому +1

    To simplify it, a .gif is essentially a sequential order in which images are displayed. For example, when you drew a basketball on a stack of sticky notes, did that a few more times, and rapidly flipped through the notes, making the image appear to move.

  • @gulllars4620
    @gulllars4620 10 років тому +165

    GIF is short for "Graphics Interchange Format". Graphics has a hard G, therefore the acronym should use the same. End of discussion.
    If you say GIF with a soft G, people will assume you talk about the JIF format: "JPEG Interchange Format", which is part of the JPEG standard.
    GIF is bitmap based.
    EDIT: Of course, if someone wants to make an "Giraffe Image Format" or something similar ( Giraffics Interchange Format... ), i will allow them to pronounce it with a soft G.

  • @EtTuBetelgeuse
    @EtTuBetelgeuse 10 років тому +1

    Great editing Sean.

  • @DaSauceful
    @DaSauceful 10 років тому

    I could listen to this guy All day

  • @zacksalvage
    @zacksalvage 10 років тому

    I really love the way this guy talks about stuff.

  • @TheMigulis
    @TheMigulis 10 років тому +800

    "GIF" sounds a lot better than "JIFF" in my opinion.

  • @ZavHeart
    @ZavHeart 9 років тому +331

    Debating "Gif" vs "Jif" is pointless... we must pronounce it "gjyfe"

    • @ZavHeart
      @ZavHeart 9 років тому

      Andy Merrett Ooo I like that one :P

  • @Sedokun
    @Sedokun 9 років тому +3

    GIF also used variable framerate (like how long each frame should last)

  • @iirelu
    @iirelu 10 років тому +2

    I make gifs a lot, so I have a lot of experience with the workings behind them, so I'll add to some of your points.
    On colours: Gifs can either have a palette of up to 256 colours per frame, or a palette of up to 256 colours for the entire gif. The latter is a lot smaller, but also uglier when you go from environment to environment. You made some notes about how anything else can have up to 256^3 colours, but gifs can use those colours too, they can only use 256 of them at a time.
    You implied that only "advanced" gif making software can use per-frame palettes, but that's not what I've seen. Unless ImageMagick and gifsicle count as advanced.

  • @16bitJack
    @16bitJack 10 років тому +2

    So much learning from these videos,

  • @jsmunroe
    @jsmunroe 8 років тому +454

    "The official way that is blatantly wrong."
    Nope that about covers it.

    • @urbanbandit630
      @urbanbandit630 8 років тому +122

      The creator of the standard, who claimed its jif, doesnt write the english language.

  • @swingAE86
    @swingAE86 9 років тому

    Tom thank you for sticking up for the right way to say gif.

  • @Deeredman4
    @Deeredman4 9 років тому +5

    Jif is a Peanut Butter! Gif is a ~>G

  • @SamMcinturff
    @SamMcinturff 10 років тому +4

    When i first saw the video i thought i would have to put up with hearing him say "jiff" every time. Correct or not, that's not how i say it in my mind. When he said gif it was such a relief.

  • @alex_squeezebox
    @alex_squeezebox 10 років тому +2

    wow that bit about interframe compression is extremely interesting! So video that has a lot of differences is actually a bigger file than something standing still.
    I wonder - does it also take into account frames that aren't right next to each other, for example if two scenes cut back to each other, does the compression algorithm know that?

    • @ZipplyZane
      @ZipplyZane 10 років тому +2

      It is technically possible, but it's rarely done. Video files are generally designed to be read sequentially. Once the player knows that a decompressed frame will never be used again, it is removed from memory to make more room for subsequent frames. The most I've ever seen in a file is allow backtracking by a couple frames.
      If it weren't designed this way, you'd have to decode the entire video in memory before displaying, and that's really slow. It's another example of the time/space tradeoff.

  • @antiHUMANDesigns
    @antiHUMANDesigns 10 років тому +9

    Hahah, geocities... when you said that word, my brain remembered the smell of the room I used to sit in when on the internet in school. :P
    And yes, it's fucked up to think that some people here were born after that...!

  • @Faladrin
    @Faladrin 10 років тому +1

    Another good example of the trade of between time and space is the original Wing Commander game. It had look up tables to avoid having to do all the sin, cos math on the fly. I'm not sure the tables were that big, but it saved lots of time using a look up table rather than asking a math coprocessor (which were not always there back then) to do it in real time.

  • @MikeSmith1337
    @MikeSmith1337 10 років тому

    Man this takes me back. 1996, first website I ever made was a fan page for a band and yes it had flaming skulls GIFs on it. :)

  • @LifeSizeTeddyBear
    @LifeSizeTeddyBear 10 років тому +1

    I'm surprised that nobody else has picked you up on the "mid 90's" date. Support for animated GIFs were added in the GIF89a format, which came out in 1989.

    • @KuraIthys
      @KuraIthys 10 років тому

      Perhaps. But the internet, as an actual thing most of the general public were actually aware of, didn't really start until 1994.
      (Yes, I know the tech behind it is much older than that. But the internet as we understand it today basically began in 1994.)

  • @matsv201
    @matsv201 10 років тому +1

    GIf:s are really effective at compressing low bit/pixel computergenerated animation. This kind of animations was quite common in the early 90-tys. If you have a standard 8-bit/pixel computer drawing and make that in to a animation, a GIF can compress better than a brand new H.264 codec. Also, the GIF is completely lossless, so low resolution is no problem
    Example, quit good quality, but still low bitrate count.
    www.wideopenspaces.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/handgun.gif
    Its when people wanted to make higher quality productions when the problem arrived. When people wanted to make 24 bit source material to GIF they usually use dithering, in steed of direct color transferring. Its get a lot better picture quality, but is painful for the GIF compression.
    Most people continue to use GIF for the wrong purpose. GIF is great for some stuff, but not all. At the mid era with more broadband connections, people did want to get more animation, and there was really only two option. GIF-animation, or download a mpeg or similar file. Some plugins supported online video, but first when flash got a mpeg integrated function the whole thing took of.

  • @siloPIRATE
    @siloPIRATE 8 років тому

    Yahoo! Geocities. I remember that thing. Don't remember ever going to it, but I remember it was a thing round about MSN Messenger days and MySpace and Bebo and Hi5

  • @duophonix
    @duophonix 10 років тому

    Intra-frame Codecs are still used today, but primarily in higher end, higher quality codecs such as ProRes and Cineform. These are also known as Digital Intermediate codecs. This is to differentiate it between the Capture/acquisition codec (such as h.264 in DSLR's) and the delivery Codec - which might also be mpeg4 for the web or J2k for Projection.
    The codec is used in the middle part of the process to edit with. A reason why these codecs are Intra-frame and not Inter frame is because the editor will need to jump around the video clip and cut in any place, and generally have it perform faster on playback. If you used an Inter-frame codec, the computer would have to consider several frames in order to render that one random frame and thus playback or quickly running forwards and backwards through the footage can be very intensive on the computer. Having each frame independent not only helps to maintain quality during the transcode but also to speed up the performance of the video.
    Some cameras record straight to Intra-frame codecs, but they have far larger file sizes but also much better quality. Some cameras even record video as a series of separate image files, such as the Cinema DNG format. These can be either Uncompressed, compressed losslessly or lossy.
    Re-compressing Intra-frame codecs over and over again will not be as destructive as re-compressing Inter-frame codecs over and over again.

    • @Markus9705
      @Markus9705 10 років тому

      Also, If you are downloading and watching a clip at the same time, you might want a intra-frame codec.

  • @Nindella
    @Nindella 9 років тому +8

    "-it (GeoCities) was the Tumblr of its day... it was wonderful, and then it was bought by Yahoo, and it was not wonderful anymore"
    Tumblr was bought by Yahoo too, history repeats >:

  • @GildedWildebeest
    @GildedWildebeest 10 років тому +3

    I never used Geocities but I knew it was around. I used MSN Groups instead, which I also filled with "super cool" gifs of Dragon Ball Z characters and flaming skulls. Interestingly, a decade before I even heard anyone pronounce 'gif' aloud, I pronounced it with a soft 'g', even though that makes less sense on paper.

  • @AminPersia
    @AminPersia 10 років тому +1

    So happy you said GIF and not JIF! :D

  • @TrollingAround
    @TrollingAround 10 років тому +1

    Interestingly GIF89a can have a palette of 256 colours (made up of 0-255 values for each red, green and blue) per frame, set a frame delay of zero and use transparency between frames and you can composite an image of much higher than 256 colours.

  • @fennecbesixdouze1794
    @fennecbesixdouze1794 3 роки тому +21

    When Tom Scott explains the difference between "inter" and "intra" by talking about intergalactic space instead of intermural sports, because there's a better chance seeing him in intergalactic space than doing sport.

  • @Lumilan
    @Lumilan 8 років тому

    Have to love those animated gifts...

  • @darkangel2139
    @darkangel2139 10 років тому

    This trade-off between space and time is actually visible EVERYWHERE.
    If you ever heard of cache or index, that's exactly what that is. Pre-compute some information (generate some HTML with dynamic programming languages, aggregate information for statistics, build search indexes, etc), and when it is needed, simple grab the pre-calculated information.
    Want to see a live example of caching in practice ? If you're using chrome (on firefox you need to download the firebug plugin), right click on the page -> Inspect element. Go to the network tab and refresh. Anything you see with status 304 not modified on ANY website is being cached by your browser. So basically your browser saves those files (images, css, js, and other) on your HDD (1-10-100 KB of space), while avoiding a request to a server (reducing bandwith and computing power for the server), thus reducing the page load time by a few miliseconds.
    The internet would crash without a few layers of caching (browser caching is just the first layer)

  • @mmd90
    @mmd90 10 років тому

    Very good editing!

  • @bno112300
    @bno112300 10 років тому +1

    I'm surprised you didn't mention BINK video.
    It's another fantastic example of lousy compression done to save time, and anyone who's played a game with a blocky and compressed looking cutscene will know what I'm talking about.

  • @tom.parryjones
    @tom.parryjones 9 років тому +36

    Was this filmed at the London Welsh Centre?

    • @Computerphile
      @Computerphile  9 років тому +11

      Tom Parry-Jones yes :) >Sean

    • @tom.parryjones
      @tom.parryjones 9 років тому +3

      ***** Lovely building. Went there for Wales v Australia last autumn. What was the reason for filming there?

    • @Computerphile
      @Computerphile  8 років тому +30

      Actually yes. It's hard to keep up with all the questions we get. It was filmed at London Welsh because they're nice people who have a room! >Sean

  • @DannyStaple
    @DannyStaple 9 років тому

    Oh my - you just reminded me - I had a siliconvalley/way suburb page back in the day. It's on the wayback machine - but it's pretty embarrassing. Anybody remember "under construction" banners, all the stuff that we thought we would find time to do...

  • @MateusAntonioBittencourt
    @MateusAntonioBittencourt 10 років тому

    Finally understood why when a part of a video file is corrupted, that part is messed up until something pass over it or the image change entirely...

  • @CarBENbased
    @CarBENbased 9 років тому

    I love how some people put "end of discussion" on their comments arguing the pronunciation of .gif and yet the discussion continues XD.

  • @functionifelse
    @functionifelse 10 років тому

    I really like this new guy you have for computerphile :D

  • @ashwith
    @ashwith 10 років тому +24

    You're using IE?! O_O
    Nice video as always :-)

    • @TheFailOrNot
      @TheFailOrNot 10 років тому +16

      IE is good for three things, imo. 1. Editing XML code 2. Live feedback of a peripheral like a camera 3. Searching and downloading a better browser, of course :D

    • @GildedWildebeest
      @GildedWildebeest 10 років тому +9

      .gif images open in IE on Windows by default

    • @ashwith
      @ashwith 10 років тому

      GildedWildebeest Good catch! I never thought of that (I use Windows mostly for gaming) :-)

    • @Computerphile
      @Computerphile  10 років тому +35

      IE just to 'preview' the animated gif once made in photoshop... not for web browsing! >Sean

  • @MaxFriedrichHartmann
    @MaxFriedrichHartmann 10 років тому

    Minor correction, the theoretical framerate limit is 1000 FPS (1 ms) since its stored as a 2 byte value in 1 ms increments (also limits longest frame duration to 65.535 seconds), the 20fps limitation is only enforced by some browsers. giflib.sourceforge.net/whatsinagif/bits_and_bytes.html
    This limitation also means that you can't sync longer GIFs perfectly to NTSC (33.367 ms) or 24fps (41.167ms) sources which have non integer frame durations in ms.

    • @Qbe_Root
      @Qbe_Root 10 років тому

      AFAIK, the delay between frames in a GIF animation is in centiseconds…

    • @MaxFriedrichHartmann
      @MaxFriedrichHartmann 10 років тому +1

      You're right. One should never underestimate the unique personality of the GIF format specs ;)

  • @mckennacisler01
    @mckennacisler01 10 років тому +14

    It's kinda cool how this virtual environment created by humans actually has it's own principles. It's can almost be related to conservation of energy: when you convert "computational energy" between states (time or space), the net "energy" has to be preserved.

  • @IceMetalPunk
    @IceMetalPunk 10 років тому

    I once made my own image format that supported full 32-bit colors (meaning transparency included) and animations. Because I was just playing around with it, I didn't care about compression, so it was essentially a list of 32-bit pixels. The only optimization it had was that alpha channels were stored first, so transparent pixels (0-alpha) were cut down from 4 bytes to 1. In the end...it was about as big as a GIF, only with full color. I was shocked, having expected it to be much larger.
    Anyway, that's my story. Also, it's Gee-Eye-Eff, not jiff or giff.

  • @balisticjoe
    @balisticjoe 10 років тому

    Thank you for pronouncing gif properly.

  • @iam0lly
    @iam0lly 10 років тому +4

    I remember geocities and its bizarre URL naming convention :)

  • @DjVortex-w
    @DjVortex-w 10 років тому +5

    _"GIF is wonderful if what you want to compress are simple line drawings."_
    Actually it isn't all that wonderful. It may be the most _popular_ format, but it isn't the best. PNG compresses 256-color images better than GIF, and webp compresses (losslessly) even better than PNG.

  • @GoodOlClint
    @GoodOlClint 10 років тому

    "It was wonderful and then it was bought by Yahoo and it was not wonderful anymore"
    That is the single best description I have ever heard of Geocities. I snorted laughing here.

  • @m4dn3zz
    @m4dn3zz 9 років тому +6

    "...or 'jif' if you wanna pronounce it the official way that's blatantly wrong."
    THANK YOU!

  • @JustAnotherPassenger
    @JustAnotherPassenger 8 років тому +10

    GIF's were misused for so long, so why did we never get proper support for either animated PNG's or a dedicated GIF replacement file type for photograph/video images?

  • @KylerChin
    @KylerChin 4 роки тому +1

    This video was exported and is being watched on your display at 25fps. Right click and click "Stats for Nerds". Happy Interneting!

  • @Lorenzo_Strozzi
    @Lorenzo_Strozzi 9 років тому +14

    if my teacher had just 1/10 of your ability to explain , now i would be so much better in computer science.

  • @bastardtubeuser
    @bastardtubeuser 8 років тому +1

    thats cool to find out what a gif is. i thought they were like tiny tv screens that reflected out movies that are hidden inside a webpage.

  • @oafkad
    @oafkad 10 років тому +5

    He zooms in and I'm thinking "Damn. Tom has an amazing complexion."
    #sojealous

  • @amyx231
    @amyx231 9 років тому +16

    I had a geocities site... Waybackmachine didn't save it, I guess it was too insignificant.

  • @trope584
    @trope584 10 років тому

    Thank you Brady

  • @therealquade
    @therealquade 10 років тому +16

    "the official way that's blatantly wrong" I love you for this.

  • @EmperorEva0001
    @EmperorEva0001 10 років тому +4

    What are the differences between other moving image files like MP4 or WebM or even WebP.
    And to anyone still arguing over "gif" and "jif" just get over it. You might as well be arguing whether it's called a Cassette or a Tape. Gif is as good as dead.

  • @Lightningblade67
    @Lightningblade67 10 років тому +346

    OMG IT'S PRONOUNCED GIF NOT GIF ....

  • @jonsprivatelife
    @jonsprivatelife 10 років тому +7

    I think my favourite thing about these channels is the enthusiasm.
    Instalike

  • @ratdude747
    @ratdude747 10 років тому

    Actually, lookup tables are what most computers (and anything that has floating point capabilities) use for doing math. For example, the infamous Pentium FDIV bug was caused by a few missing entries in said table (used for dividing).
    In electronics (my other specialty and current college major), for embedded processors (microcontrollers), often times lookup tables are used to interface to hardware. This winter for dual-class project (RF communications and advanced microcontrollers), I programmed and built an electronically tuned FM radio. To simplify things, it is controlled by an analog voltage input to a component called a VCO. Generally, the VCO's response curve is not easily controlled/defined by a formula, not to mention that FM radio is channelized (in the US, 87.9-107.7MHz, in 200kHz increments), so only 100 values are needed. It was much easier to make two arrays with 100 values (one for the VCO, one for the LED 7-segment display) than to write two complex formulas that my poor 8 bit non-floating-point microcontroller would have to run all the time (as the display is strobed one digit at a time with IIRC an 85Hz refresh rate). The only pitfall is the neutered down "free evaluation" version of my C compiler's size limit was exceeded if I did both the tables and serial terminal printouts (for debugging). That, and the arrays were tedious to make (I wrote additional C codes to make/help make them, which made it a lot easier).

    • @Tupster
      @Tupster 10 років тому

      This might have been valid in the 90s but memory speeds are so slow compared to the CPU now that recomputing a value is often faster than looking it up in memory.

  • @michelfug
    @michelfug 10 років тому +23

    I choose the middle ground: I say it is HIF.
    (Check your keyboard to see why.)

  • @AugustusBohn0
    @AugustusBohn0 9 років тому

    6:12 the phrasing makes it sound like being bought by Yahoo! is a tradeoff you see everywhere in computer science and it still makes sense.

  • @4.0.4
    @4.0.4 10 років тому +1

    One thing he forgot to mention was the whole issue with CompuServe's patents (one of the reasons PNG took off so nicely).

  • @Lampe2020
    @Lampe2020 Рік тому +1

    0:33 I was just waiting for you to say that XD
    I almost all my life pronounced it with a hard "g", but since about half a year I pronounce it "jif".

  • @anarekist
    @anarekist 10 років тому

    i remember geo cities man. and it's weird that some people have no idea what we are talking about. anyways love the computerphile serise!

  • @skitcap2705
    @skitcap2705 10 років тому

    Intraframe compression is used a lot when transferring media. For ex CGI renders are stored frame by frame, otherwise the interframe compression just muddies everything up as soon as you need to change frame speed.. I did one full hd 7s logo renderings, total space needed were more than 10gb (fast cuts, compositions and all CGI were rendered at 100FPS..). Tried to do it raw first but filesizes were just ridiculous, had to use JPEG frame by frame..

  • @alex_on_the_web
    @alex_on_the_web 10 років тому

    Now, this is a nice explanation that everyone gets :) I like this guy