The plastic bag trick works essentially because it traps humidity. The moisture from inside the bread moves through the dry crust and softens it, but because it's such a small pocket of air inside the bag it can only hold so much water vapour, so instead of the bread just continuing to dry out completely like it would on the counter, it just hangs out in this slightly humid environment while the crust relaxes. It's a little sauna for your loaves.
Same principle when I'm germinating seeds: just dampen medium (ie paper towel) with seeds on top and put in ziplock. stays 'watered' and won't dry out so don't have to keep checking it or adding more water.
I like how you went with the dough conditioner to keep things simple. Home recipes are best the simpler they are. Also means making adjustments to the recipe much more straight forward.
Using the nutritional info to find the oil/fat content was genious. Even a little bit of difference make a big change. I've used too much butter and got some very tasty but unstructured bread before.
Out of all the duders on here... you definitely impress me the most... because you put the work in! And I've made yer recipes... and you got it, Kiddo 👊
@@CharlieAndersonCooking How come you don’t put the ice cube(s) in their own small container, like a little ramekin, so that the water doesn’t touch the bread rolls while melting?
The ingredients you read off were B vitamins that get added to "enriched" flour. Probably not doing much for the texture of the bread itself. Awesome results! My wife made your rolls and cheesesteak a week ago. I'm sure I'll get an updated result in another few weeks.
I tried your recipe today and the rolls came out PERFECT!! I used my Chandley Pico Plus Bread oven and they baked up BEAUTIFULLY!!! Thanks for this recipe! My husband & I had Steak Bombs for dinner and the rolls were FABULOUS!! I just subscribed & can't wait to binge watch more of your content!!
Amoroso's rolls are best described as a soft french bread even though their number of ingredients used in mass production puts them outside the threshold for that classification. Italian breads have enough varieties that you can make the exact same bread as a French bread and call it Italian. The opposite doesn't really work because of how strict France is with ingredients. If you make a soft french bread at home, you've pretty much nailed an amoroso's roll. What is considered a soft french bread is one with a spongy, but airy sourdough like interior, with a slight crisp to the exterior. I'm glad to see you managed to get such an excellent result with this recipe.
Your nutrition facts reverse engineering strategy is incredibly clever! I'm definitely going to try to use it if the need ever arises. Fantastic content as always :)
I'm just learning about baking bread, and so far, u have had the best videos. You probably have a restaurant depot near u. It's where restaurants shop. You used to need a resale and account to get in, but now they give day passes to the public."At least in California."You can get frozen pre-sliced Philly cheese steak. I also found generic Challenger bread pans a lot cheaper.
Spent a whole afternoon yesterday baking this recipe and im quite happy about it. I used convection fan, but as i observe from your video, you use conventional method. Also i can’t find in Romania dough conditioner so i might add vit D C and some potassium. Thanks for the work you put in, keep it up. I’ll be watching you ❤
I just discovered your channel, you and me seem very like-minded! I'm currently doing research on Dough Improvers because I'm in the process of reverse engineering the McDonald's Big Mac Buns. I already reverse engineered the pickles and the sauce using the ingredient list and nutritional facts. I was planning to do the exact same thing you did in this video to the buns, and didn't think this is something anyone else would actually try haha. Really enjoyed watching your process, I just subscribed. Lots of love from Germany! Now I have to binge watch your other videos
That's awesome, let me know if you figure it out! I think these are close to a fast-food style bun, but they're not quite that soft and pillowy. That's something I've been wanting to figure out for a while too!
Started these yesterday and baked them today. They were fantastic! I was not able to get the dough conditioner you used, but found Fleischmann's Bread Booster at the grocery store and used that instead. This was some of the smoothest, softest dough I've ever worked with. I'll be trying this recipe and baking in 4" round pans next. Thank you for your hard work and dedication in bringing us this perfect sandwich roll!
My plan is to use a water spray bottle to keep the Toaster Oven humid. I have Crisco coming tomorrow and I got everything else from other experiments. I haven’t found a pan to cover that fits in the toaster over YET. 13” round is my cookie sheet so 12” round 4” high aluminum is my goal.
i think the next series you should do is soul food, Chicago deep dish pizza, tacos or cheeseburgers maybe with some foods like that that everyone knows instead of something like a philly cheese steak you could re capture the insane views that the newyork slice series gave you
I make and experimented with a lot of rolls, trying to get the right crust and chew. This seems to do it, very nice. One thing, I bake a lot of no knead, higher hydration bread/rolls. From what I read on A reviews from experienced bakers, the conditioner doesn’t work for high, no knead doughs. Can’t seem to get the structure. I bake both, yeast and sourdough, so I will give these a go using yeast, straight dough.
I swear you and I are going through the same obsessions. I was just down in Philly and went to John’s pork roast- awesome hoagie and great pork roll. But! Ba le bakery (Vietnamese Bahn mi) has the absolute best hoagie and honestly, sandwich in general. Had to come home make a couple different batches of hoagie rolls. Fun stuff! Thanks for the videos
One thing I keep seeing when people try to figure out commercial bread is that kneading is ignored. Intensive kneading! Home recipes with these gentle kneading methods do not replicate commercial bread kneaded until that gluten is making the dough want to climb out of the mixer.
Charlie, I love you videos! Currently I’m making these rolls. They are in the fridge for tomorrow. Have you ever tried to use sourdough starter in lieu of the yeast? I’m guessing it would need about 30 grams of starter to sub for the yeast. Thanks! 👍
I've used this to make the grinder rolls and also made sandwich buns , just skipped the grinder forming step and substituted some bacon grease for the crisco. and it was the best bread I've ever made. can you make this with ww flour? I'd love to see how yours come out
I was reading in the xantham gum pouch that it is used also in bakery, so how the bread will come out if you add some xantham gum instead of your dough conditioner
gosh i've never felt so dumb about MATH!!! you're very smart and i have to thank you for doing all the work!!! what is the white elastic thingee that you cover the dough with???
Does the steaming ice cube method work with a dutch oven too? I can't remember if you had tried that out in the video where you first tested it. I would assume it works just as good as the cast iron oven you use.
Being from the Philadelphia area, Amoroso rolls are famous by name but most places use either Liscio's or Sarcones rolls. They are vastly superior to Amoroso.
The “French loaf” and “Italian loaf” that Walmart’s store bakery sells fits that description to a T. I would guess it’s possible they’re sourced from a major central distribution commissary here in the mid-Atlantic.
Right near the beginning you mention possibly needing to give the dough with conditioner more time to rise. Almost everything having to do with bread needs to be done by feel and appearance. There is a reason most recipes say let it rise until double in bulk rather than giving a time. The same goes with baking. Checking the color of the crust is much better than going by a certain time.
I think his might be the Ooni scale. I use 2, at work. KD-7000 from Amazon (1g) and a (0.01g) scale from Amazon for yeast. In Canada I paid about $80-90 for both and have been using them on my Food Truck for a year, so they are quite durable
I find that anything over 1% malt powder will make the dough gummy. Most bread flours have a bit of barley inside so .3 to 1% backers percentage is more then enough
Please do tip top potato buns at some point, i tried reverse engineering from the nutritional info and failed so hard.. i swear they put vinegar in there but it kills my yeast and gluten structure errytime :(
I understand it’s not useful to most people, but it would be great if you shared your own dough conditioner recipe. L-Cysteine is found in most commercial dough conditioners and is most often derived from bird feathers and thus not vegan.
Any shot you'll redo your mornay sauce (bechamel cheese sauce) recipe? The reason you got a grainy texture was because you didn't use egg yolks in the recipe. I also think you bechamel technique was flawed. There's a great video by italia squisita on bechamel, and they also show using it as a mornay sauce. A lot of youtubers don't use egg yolks, and they end up with a grainy texture. The graininess is from cheese proteins, the egg yolks help emulsify the cheese into the bechamel. I mostly just wanted to inform you as an FYI. There are a lot of ways to make a great cheese sauce. But I'm personally not into relying on sodium citrate.
Yeah they’re definitely a slightly different but they seem similar overall. I ended up using the ingredients and nutrition facts found here: www.webstaurantstore.com/amorosos-10-philadelphia-hearth-baked-unsliced-hoagie-roll-case/876AMO7111.html?GoogleShopping&gclid=Cj0KCQjwy9-kBhCHARIsAHpBjHjdCj426KgblB0zKoXW3zBLBc0ap6Rf-79noExQq15PXINjaKzjny4aAo7aEALw_wcB for their 10” rolls, which look pretty similar to the rolls the restaurants get.
So interesting reverse engineering the nutrition table! However, and I don't say this lightly: can't they simply put incorrect values on the packet? How can we be sure of that?
For me it is a no brainer to make it, here in my city we get to buy 10 big loafs of bread for less than 1 us dolar, it takes a lot of time because all people don't know how to bake and the cleaning after it just isn't very appealing lol
Also, I know that this is impossible because it isn't exactly your wheelhouse, but I really wish some scientifically minded youtuber would experiment on trying to make a gluten free bread that isn't awful at worst or mediocre at best...
There will likely be others. I can’t find that brand in Canada but they have a Koser version by someone else. I would try milk powder and sugar if you can’t find it. I’m not sure the vitamins are adding any texture. I was looking for the ingredients to replicate not buy
I think you shouldn't have dismissed the shokupan (tangzhong/yudane) method so soon - @Novita Listyani's channel has shown that you can use yudane as a natural dough improver even for non-enriched doughs
I usually enjoy your videos but this one disappoints me. You keep using Amoroso as your standard for good sandwich rolls and I find then soft, squishy and without character. I realize this is a matter of taste, but so many other shops use Sarcone's, Licios's, Aversa, DiPalma's among others. I find the shops that use these rolls produce far better sandwiches than those that use Amoroso.
Bro my family owns Amoroso. My aunt Marie and uncle Leonard passed and now my cousin Lenny has it. They’re extremely overrated. Terrible for cheesesteaks. Decent for hoagies but there are faaaaaaar better choices……and it’s pronounced Am- o-roso not Om-a-roso……and most Philly steak shops don’t know you. And your cheesesteak looks good for an outsider, but I’ll make a better one in my house and there’s no way on earth yours is better than every steak in Philly😂😂😂😂Angelo’s is king of steaks…..
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
The plastic bag trick works essentially because it traps humidity. The moisture from inside the bread moves through the dry crust and softens it, but because it's such a small pocket of air inside the bag it can only hold so much water vapour, so instead of the bread just continuing to dry out completely like it would on the counter, it just hangs out in this slightly humid environment while the crust relaxes. It's a little sauna for your loaves.
Oh I thought it was microplastics getting into the roll or something frightening like that. Whew.
Same principle when I'm germinating seeds: just dampen medium (ie paper towel) with seeds on top and put in ziplock. stays 'watered' and won't dry out so don't have to keep checking it or adding more water.
I like how you went with the dough conditioner to keep things simple. Home recipes are best the simpler they are. Also means making adjustments to the recipe much more straight forward.
"Reverse-engineer the nutrition facts." Charlie, you're a genius!
I wish you all the success. The amount of work you put in is just incredible
Using the nutritional info to find the oil/fat content was genious. Even a little bit of difference make a big change. I've used too much butter and got some very tasty but unstructured bread before.
Out of all the duders on here... you definitely impress me the most... because you put the work in! And I've made yer recipes... and you got it, Kiddo 👊
Your hard work is very much appreciated. Please keep it up, thanks for all your great infomation!
I appreciate it, thanks for watching!
@@CharlieAndersonCooking
How come you don’t put the ice cube(s) in their own small container, like a little ramekin, so that the water doesn’t touch the bread rolls while melting?
The ingredients you read off were B vitamins that get added to "enriched" flour. Probably not doing much for the texture of the bread itself.
Awesome results! My wife made your rolls and cheesesteak a week ago. I'm sure I'll get an updated result in another few weeks.
I tried your recipe today and the rolls came out PERFECT!! I used my Chandley Pico Plus Bread oven and they baked up BEAUTIFULLY!!! Thanks for this recipe! My husband & I had Steak Bombs for dinner and the rolls were FABULOUS!! I just subscribed & can't wait to binge watch more of your content!!
Amoroso's rolls are best described as a soft french bread even though their number of ingredients used in mass production puts them outside the threshold for that classification. Italian breads have enough varieties that you can make the exact same bread as a French bread and call it Italian. The opposite doesn't really work because of how strict France is with ingredients. If you make a soft french bread at home, you've pretty much nailed an amoroso's roll. What is considered a soft french bread is one with a spongy, but airy sourdough like interior, with a slight crisp to the exterior. I'm glad to see you managed to get such an excellent result with this recipe.
I love this level-up kind of culture! Can’t wait to try the recipe
Your nutrition facts reverse engineering strategy is incredibly clever! I'm definitely going to try to use it if the need ever arises. Fantastic content as always :)
Love it! These would be great with Chicago Italian beef too methinks.
I get really good results cold proofing your original roll recipe for 12 hours in the fridge. Looking forward to trying this one.
I'm just learning about baking bread, and so far, u have had the best videos.
You probably have a restaurant depot near u. It's where restaurants shop. You used to need a resale and account to get in, but now they give day passes to the public."At least in California."You can get frozen pre-sliced Philly cheese steak.
I also found generic Challenger bread pans a lot cheaper.
Very cool man, props for making your own dough conditioner.
Spent a whole afternoon yesterday baking this recipe and im quite happy about it. I used convection fan, but as i observe from your video, you use conventional method. Also i can’t find in Romania dough conditioner so i might add vit D C and some potassium. Thanks for the work you put in, keep it up. I’ll be watching you ❤
I just discovered your channel, you and me seem very like-minded! I'm currently doing research on Dough Improvers because I'm in the process of reverse engineering the McDonald's Big Mac Buns. I already reverse engineered the pickles and the sauce using the ingredient list and nutritional facts. I was planning to do the exact same thing you did in this video to the buns, and didn't think this is something anyone else would actually try haha. Really enjoyed watching your process, I just subscribed. Lots of love from Germany! Now I have to binge watch your other videos
That's awesome, let me know if you figure it out! I think these are close to a fast-food style bun, but they're not quite that soft and pillowy. That's something I've been wanting to figure out for a while too!
Started these yesterday and baked them today. They were fantastic! I was not able to get the dough conditioner you used, but found Fleischmann's Bread Booster at the grocery store and used that instead. This was some of the smoothest, softest dough I've ever worked with. I'll be trying this recipe and baking in 4" round pans next. Thank you for your hard work and dedication in bringing us this perfect sandwich roll!
My plan is to use a water spray bottle to keep the Toaster Oven humid.
I have Crisco coming tomorrow and I got everything else from other experiments.
I haven’t found a pan to cover that fits in the toaster over YET. 13” round is my cookie sheet so 12” round 4” high aluminum is my goal.
I wonder how this would work with the Yudane method instead of the dough conditioners. Extremely helpful video though. Thanks for doing all of that.
Awesome!! Total Pro!! I can't wait for the next one.
i think the next series you should do is soul food, Chicago deep dish pizza, tacos or cheeseburgers maybe with some foods like that that everyone knows instead of something like a philly cheese steak you could re capture the insane views that the newyork slice series gave you
Yeah a video about the perfect burger or burrito recipe would probably be popular
Bought the dough conditioner thru your link. I’ve tried all of your recipes and look forward to this one. Cheers.
philly restaurants may hate you, but i'm loving this series. can't wait for the finale!
I make and experimented with a lot of rolls, trying to get the right crust and chew. This seems to do it, very nice. One thing, I bake a lot of no knead, higher hydration bread/rolls. From what I read on A reviews from experienced bakers, the conditioner doesn’t work for high, no knead doughs. Can’t seem to get the structure. I bake both, yeast and sourdough, so I will give these a go using yeast, straight dough.
THEE best roll recipe in the internet!👍 wonder how this dough recipe would transfer over to a pizza dough? Bout to find out.
I swear you and I are going through the same obsessions. I was just down in Philly and went to John’s pork roast- awesome hoagie and great pork roll.
But! Ba le bakery (Vietnamese Bahn mi) has the absolute best hoagie and honestly, sandwich in general.
Had to come home make a couple different batches of hoagie rolls. Fun stuff!
Thanks for the videos
Dude! I've been waiting for this. My white whale is the very similar Piantedosi sub roll, so this is a huge help.
I’m glad to hear it! Let me know how it goes if you try it
One thing I keep seeing when people try to figure out commercial bread is that kneading is ignored. Intensive kneading! Home recipes with these gentle kneading methods do not replicate commercial bread kneaded until that gluten is making the dough want to climb out of the mixer.
Charlie, I love you videos! Currently I’m making these rolls. They are in the fridge for tomorrow. Have you ever tried to use sourdough starter in lieu of the yeast? I’m guessing it would need about 30 grams of starter to sub for the yeast. Thanks! 👍
Fantastic video, thanks. Where did you get the scale and what make is it? Greetings from Greenville, NC.
One video closer to getting me more skinny fat Charlie!!! Between this and the NYC pizza… my doctor hates you 😂
I've used this to make the grinder rolls and also made sandwich buns , just skipped the grinder forming step and substituted some bacon grease for the crisco. and it was the best bread I've ever made. can you make this with ww flour? I'd love to see how yours come out
I was reading in the xantham gum pouch that it is used also in bakery, so how the bread will come out if you add some xantham gum instead of your dough conditioner
gosh i've never felt so dumb about MATH!!! you're very smart and i have to thank you for doing all the work!!!
what is the white elastic thingee that you cover the dough with???
Does the steaming ice cube method work with a dutch oven too? I can't remember if you had tried that out in the video where you first tested it. I would assume it works just as good as the cast iron oven you use.
Yes, I’ve done his other recipe in a Dutch oven. Preheat with Dutch oven in, toss some ice in and put in your dough, that is on parchment paper, in.
Great work man!
You are way underrated and are going to make me go broke.
What temp do you bake these at? The video says 450 F but the recipe on your website says 425. Can you clarify which one is correct?
what about spraying water on the rolls?
Hi Charlie - I just noticed that the written recipe says 2.4g of Diastatic Malt Powder. Should it be 3.2g (2% as a Baker’s Percentage?)
Can you please do Bronx bastone next? That’s the greatest sub roll in the world.
Being from the Philadelphia area, Amoroso rolls are famous by name but most places use either Liscio's or Sarcones rolls. They are vastly superior to Amoroso.
This is awesome. Math was not my favorite subject so I have to convert those percentages into spoons lol..
In all your experiments did you find any tricks to give the outside of the rolls a jimmy john's like texture?
The “French loaf” and “Italian loaf” that Walmart’s store bakery sells fits that description to a T. I would guess it’s possible they’re sourced from a major central distribution commissary here in the mid-Atlantic.
Great ! Please do it for burger buns
Right near the beginning you mention possibly needing to give the dough with conditioner more time to rise. Almost everything having to do with bread needs to be done by feel and appearance. There is a reason most recipes say let it rise until double in bulk rather than giving a time. The same goes with baking. Checking the color of the crust is much better than going by a certain time.
“Oh, I can open my eyes now” 😂😂
This guy is NUTS!!! ...In a good way 👍
I keep getting wide / flat roles. Apparently I cannot roll them correctly.
Anyone use a mold to get a more rounded roll ?
It's almost funny how obsessed you are with the perfect cheesesteak🤣
The man is essentially just a cheese steak in my mind
He does it so we don't have to.
What scale are you using? It appears different than the one linked in the description.
I think his might be the Ooni scale. I use 2, at work. KD-7000 from Amazon (1g) and a (0.01g) scale from Amazon for yeast.
In Canada I paid about $80-90 for both and have been using them on my Food Truck for a year, so they are quite durable
Dude is the goat
soft roll bread
I find that anything over 1% malt powder will make the dough gummy. Most bread flours have a bit of barley inside so .3 to 1% backers percentage is more then enough
Please do tip top potato buns at some point, i tried reverse engineering from the nutritional info and failed so hard.. i swear they put vinegar in there but it kills my yeast and gluten structure errytime :(
recipe on the site has DMP at 2%, but the actual value is more like 1.5%. and in this video you said 1%. which one did you have most success with?
I understand it’s not useful to most people, but it would be great if you shared your own dough conditioner recipe. L-Cysteine is found in most commercial dough conditioners and is most often derived from bird feathers and thus not vegan.
Niacin, Reduced Iron, and Riboflavin are not dough conditioners. They are vitamins and minerals added to prevent dietary deficiencies.
Any shot you'll redo your mornay sauce (bechamel cheese sauce) recipe? The reason you got a grainy texture was because you didn't use egg yolks in the recipe. I also think you bechamel technique was flawed. There's a great video by italia squisita on bechamel, and they also show using it as a mornay sauce. A lot of youtubers don't use egg yolks, and they end up with a grainy texture. The graininess is from cheese proteins, the egg yolks help emulsify the cheese into the bechamel.
I mostly just wanted to inform you as an FYI. There are a lot of ways to make a great cheese sauce. But I'm personally not into relying on sodium citrate.
Nothing beats a m340i
I'm pretty positive the rolls you buy in a package and the rolls that steak shops get delivered fresh everyday are totally different recipes.
Yeah they’re definitely a slightly different but they seem similar overall. I ended up using the ingredients and nutrition facts found here: www.webstaurantstore.com/amorosos-10-philadelphia-hearth-baked-unsliced-hoagie-roll-case/876AMO7111.html?GoogleShopping&gclid=Cj0KCQjwy9-kBhCHARIsAHpBjHjdCj426KgblB0zKoXW3zBLBc0ap6Rf-79noExQq15PXINjaKzjny4aAo7aEALw_wcB for their 10” rolls, which look pretty similar to the rolls the restaurants get.
I find it really difficult to shape and score these. Too sticky.
So interesting reverse engineering the nutrition table! However, and I don't say this lightly: can't they simply put incorrect values on the packet? How can we be sure of that?
Now can you reverse engineer Martin's Potato Rolls? Can't get them in WA.
For me it is a no brainer to make it, here in my city we get to buy 10 big loafs of bread for less than 1 us dolar, it takes a lot of time because all people don't know how to bake and the cleaning after it just isn't very appealing lol
Amiels in rochester is king
God I feel so lucky I can just buy amaroso rolls down the road
Dude is dedicated
Having lived in South Phila in the 80's the bakery's were using whey instead of water. Just thought.
I still have no idea why I am watching this series when I am gluten intolerant. It's just depressing. Fuck I miss sandwiches...
Also, I know that this is impossible because it isn't exactly your wheelhouse, but I really wish some scientifically minded youtuber would experiment on trying to make a gluten free bread that isn't awful at worst or mediocre at best...
I dont think this `Scratch Premium Dough Conditioner` is legal to buy here in Europe😕
There will likely be others. I can’t find that brand in Canada but they have a Koser version by someone else.
I would try milk powder and sugar if you can’t find it. I’m not sure the vitamins are adding any texture. I was looking for the ingredients to replicate not buy
Crisco? Never again.
I think you shouldn't have dismissed the shokupan (tangzhong/yudane) method so soon - @Novita Listyani's channel has shown that you can use yudane as a natural dough improver even for non-enriched doughs
I usually enjoy your videos but this one disappoints me. You keep using Amoroso as your standard for good sandwich rolls and I find then soft, squishy and without character. I realize this is a matter of taste, but so many other shops use Sarcone's, Licios's, Aversa, DiPalma's among others. I find the shops that use these rolls produce far better sandwiches than those that use Amoroso.
trehalose
Bro my family owns Amoroso. My aunt Marie and uncle Leonard passed and now my cousin Lenny has it. They’re extremely overrated. Terrible for cheesesteaks. Decent for hoagies but there are faaaaaaar better choices……and it’s pronounced Am- o-roso not Om-a-roso……and most Philly steak shops don’t know you. And your cheesesteak looks good for an outsider, but I’ll make a better one in my house and there’s no way on earth yours is better than every steak in Philly😂😂😂😂Angelo’s is king of steaks…..