Hey man that entire Bayo bit on expertise, how opinions are formed, etc. Love it. I feel you. Its why I just do my best and keep moving forward because the expectations randos have for any other person are obscenely tight and confusing to navigate, so we just out here
It's a fantastic bit and I truly resonated with both that AND the bit about number scores because I hate number scores too and Cvit excellently illustrated why I don't use them.
Whenever people bring up Nero as an example of a proper passing of the torch, I have to remind them that it took over ten years and a bad reboot for that to happen. Nero was NOT immediately embraced when DMC4 came out. He was reviled by many for taking up so much of the game when people just wanted more Dante, something made worse by the fact that Dante got Nero's sloppy seconds in terms of enemies and levels. Fans eventually softened on Nero after the DmC reboot (because they would take anything BUT Donte) and his character was fully fleshed out and rehabbed in DMC5, but it took a _long_ time for that to happen. If anything, Bayo 3 is trying to avoid what happened with DMC4: instead of having a newcomer abruptly usurp the beloved protag's leading role, they created a massive, content-filled send-off to Cereza while providing a starting point to tease Viola's still untapped potential. It's worth noting that a lot of folks are still on the "Viola is just a bad Nero" bandwagon, but I think they're missing the point. Platinum did make the mistake of teasing her as "girl Nero," but at worst she's a subversion of Nero, and at best she's very much her own thing. Nero is cool, hyper-competent, and has a sort of stoic tsudere thing going on in DMC4. From the start, Nero's gameplay suggested that he essentially on Dante's level, despite cutscenes and lore suggesting otherwise. However, Viola is goofy, talented but unpolished, and keeps her heart on her sleeve. Her gameplay and cutscenes both imply she's not yet equipped to take Bayo's role, and literally feel like growing pains that (like most growing pains) can only be overcome with patience and practice (both on your part and hers). She a lot of growing up to do, but clearly has unique potential that will manifest in her own game(s). For now, her appearance here is just a preview, setting the stage for the future. Unfortunately, Platinum's tactic of playfully referencing DMC while running off to do something quite different often falls flat or flies over people's heads, as folks end up focusing more on the references than on what Bayo does differently.
Did you play the same DMC4? Dante is always one step ahead of Nero from Mission 1 of DMC4 to Mission 20 of DMC5 ranging from Dante jobbing on purpose to give him a tutorial to cleaning up Nero's incomplete boss fight to finally allowing Nero to try his answer to the Dante vs Vergil feud. He was a more human foil from how he connected with regular and supposedly regular people than his devil hunting contemporaries. Even in gameplay, Nero is still portrayed as a clumsy brawler with few moves having the finesse of his father or Dante who never seem to be losing balance during any of their attacks. Nero for better and worse can be losing control during grabs, sword swings and even gun shots. DMC5 definitely helped Nero get appreciated and same can be argued for the Reboot but most of the damage to Nero was just being unable to play All 20 Missions with any character without mods. If they allowed it after a single playthrough, Nero wouldn't become a scapegoat. PlatinumGames did something good in the sense that they put Viola in the back rather than the front but still designed a very poor first impression for Viola. This comes from the controls which include how poorly designed the perfect parry timing is. This comes from the narrative which does make her seem more human and vulnerable but in a game where every verse's Bayo and their mum jobs and probably dies, that's less notable. The sendoff for the original playable cast is more akin to character assassination than anything in Bayo 3 while Dante (as well as Vergil in 5) are still in tact for future appearances.
@@thelastgogeta I think you misread my comment. I agree that Dante was portrayed as one step (or many steps) ahead of Nero in cutscenes and characterization. The thing is that in gameplay, Nero can handle everything Dante can with equal (if not greater) ease. Compare that to Viola, who is weaker and less versatile than Bayo in both narrative _and_ gameplay. She can certainly overcome the same situations as Bayo, but not without far more practice and effort. I like the fact that Viola's awkward playstyle represents the awkwardness of growing up; you and her are literally sharing the learning experience, and are getting better alongside her. Also, considering how "everyone and their mum" ostensibly "died," the fact that Viola alone "survived" would, in fact, be pretty notable. I think that while Platinum has its issues crafting narratives that the average fan can digest, the way they tell stories through gameplay is actually quite good. Also, it's almost certain no one dies at the end of Bayonetta 3, nor has Viola had her full passing of the torch. Aspects of the final battle and post credit ending indicate that everyone's been restored following the death of Singularity. Hell, Luka is confirmed alive by Rodin (and by extension, so is Bayo). This is probably the thing that went over everyone's head that Kamiya wants to address in the next game. As for Viola, until she has a game where she's the actual protagonist, I'd reserve judgement on her character. I mean, it took two games, two leading roles, and 10 years for folks to embrace Nero; we should at least give Viola ONE leading role before being so hard on her. By the way, considering how Dante was added to DMC4 because fan feedback indicated they'd be furious if he wasn't included, I don't think excluding him entirely would have left a good impression either. It was a tough situation.
@@Tenchigumi Hmm, I think I went off what you wrote as you didn't specify what made Nero strong but Viola weak as I saw it. If you mean "gameplay" as in the actual experience that players have with the game rather than my focus on how game action presentation. I'd say Nero is missing a metric ton of tools in the same way but far more intuitive. A beginner Nero has CS3 and fairly big attacks. Viola might need you to learn Block Offset to make her fully functional which you start with but the game is not designed for you to learn it.
never thought of it this way, and yes this is in no way ever gonna be viola's game, although it does create the sorrow of cereza's character assassination
I think it'd be better if you broke down why Bayo 2's story doesn't work because your breakdown of 3 makes it extremely obvious why people hate the story imo. I mean it certainly isn't anything special, but I feel it tells a better story than 3. At least there's setups and payoffs with some fun character interactions. Bayo 3 barely interacts with anything, especially the alt Bayo's. I agree on the whole with the Bayo 3 segment, on top of offscreen attacks, personally I feel the attack tells aren't as good as the previous games. It certainly doesn't help with Viola having a stricter time. As well, Demon Slave is fine, but it becomes clear throughout the game that you should not be playing like a Bayonetta game, you need to summon the Demons to do damage. I have no interest in playing infinite climax because these boring enemies will just be more spongey and enemies will hit like trucks, which I get is the point, but when the enemies suck I don't really want to fight them.
Lopter had a motivation tho, loki and lopter were both half of Aesir's soul (the god of chaos) that once gave his eyes, the eyes of the world to humanity, his soul got turned into two aswell. Loki, the godness of aesir and lopter being the bad one, he just wanted the power of the god aesir back to rule over chaos once again, and by that he needed to take loki's powers to control the eyes, and later the eyes of the world from bayo and Balder. Singularuty just wanted destruction without further explanation of why. He's the worst type of villain in fiction, a one-dimensional bad guy that is bad for only the sake of being evil.
I have more grievances with failed/convoluted attempts at depth than shallow jackasses. Shallow dudes can at least be funny, unintentional or otherwise (I've seen enough bad LN anime to get some kind of ironic joy from them). Failed depth is just generically frustrating and boring.
One-dimensional villains can work well if they compensate for it by making the character very fun. Singularity lacks the charm that makes Disney villains memorable.
Imagine instead of killing off the other Bayos, they did have them merge with the main one, giving her access to their demons and weapons. And explains that whole bit at the end where they all return.
I think the point of "killing" them (they were actually absorbed by Singularity) was precisely so that Bayonetta could smack them out of Singularity during their final battle, at which point he exclaims that Bayo is powerful enough to override his manipulation of reality, which is kind of a big deal. Of course, much of that dialogue is hard to catch during all the chaos, but it's there.
@@Tenchigumi I find the villain ending up being an evil alternative universe counterpart of Bayonetta herself, who'd go around the multiverse doing Jet Li's The One routine of making herself stronger by killing versions of herself from other universes, while our Bayo would still get the weapons and demon familiars, would have been more memorable. Bit of a cliche as the evil doppelganger from a different dimension might technically be, it would have created a stronger connection via parallelled progression to the villain, on top of just making them feel more narratively meatier and impactful of a character, with also less legwork needed to establish them as a legitimate threat, than some bloke we'd never seen before, nor got to really know to any degree during the game and who was obviously the villain as soon as they were shown on screen.
@@jondoe7036 I think the thing about Singularity that a lot of folks miss is that he's intentionally a faceless, unknowable representative of humanity and their absurdly catastrophic potential, as Bayo 3 aims to complete the thematic trinity of the trilogy. In Bayo 1, we had the glorious angels of Paradiso, all perfectly arranged in their hierarchy of orders and spheres. In Bayo 2, we had the demons of Inferno, who represented various negative emotions in a realm where order was abandoned for the pursuit of power and domination. Paradiso and Inferno were both powerful but evenly matched, and for the most part stalemated themselves into a balance of light and dark (and whenever the balance was upset, Bayo would casually step in to set things right). However, in Bayo 3 we finally reach the humans of Chaos, who were always portrayed as the weakest of the Trinity of Realities, but with the most dangerous potential. That potential manifested itself (quite literally) as Singularity. The interesting thing about Singularity is that he's an AI lifeform who was created by accident. Human technology had advanced so far that a random production anomaly resulted in this nigh-omnipotent entity, one who was on the cusp of not only annihilating the entire multiverse of Chaos, but crushing the mighty realms of Paradiso and Inferno as well. _That_ message-of how humans ingenuity, ambition, and foolishness could inadvertently create the most destructive force in all realities-is something that tends to float past everyone when discussing Singularity's threat, purpose, and value as a villain.
@@Tenchigumi I got what the themathical message of it was, I just don't find making the villain a faceless unknown with unclear motives works here. It can work for something like Lovecraftian horror, where looming unknowable threat represents the uncaring universe and our own tenuous existance amidst forces so much greater and older we can't begin to comprehend them, but it doesn't work for an action game, where villain is something to be confronted, challenged and overcome, because not really understanding whom or what it was you just clashed with, robs the meaning from that conflict and triumph. And seeing as Bayonetta is already used to represent the potential of humanity in a positive light, using alternate version of her as a counterargument for potential threat that comes with it, would have still gotten the same overall point across, no?
Really love that you put emphasis on peoples subjective experiences in your Bayo 2 thoughts. Personally loved Bayo 2 more than 1, and I still do, despite recognizing and empathizing with peoples gripes with it Thing is many of those gripes are over things that're not easy to intuit for most players, like the scoring system. I played Bayo 1 on 360 when it came out and have replayed it on every other platform I got it on, but I was never able to consistently get a high combo ranking in any playthrough. It wasn't until I google'd what the ruleset was during my most recent playthrough out of curiosity right before 3 released. (I just don't look up external resources on games, its just not how I like to experience them usually) It IS much more fun when you understand it, and I see what they were going for with it now. I have been going through Bayo 1s higher difficulties for the first time and having a blast because of it, but nothing should feel THAT obfuscated when its displayed on screen the whole game. Though Bayo 2s system is not a fix for this, it was FAR less frustrating in that respect. Bayo 1 has lots of great qualities, but a lot of its encounter and combat design wound up discouraging me from exploring them and that was not the case with 2. Bayo 2 didn't feel that different mechanically from Bayo 1 to me when I first played it, and I wound up putting like 300 hours into it on Wii U because the learning experience is just so much smoother in it (rip my pro controller triggers) Sometimes Kamiya's love for old arcade design philosophies just works against his own games, despite what it can create
I am VERY happy you pointed out the lack of inertia in Bayo 2/3 hahaha, Durga and even ABK carried Inertia momentum during its attacks in 1, so it's a shame 3 didn't carry that over, I feel like weapons such as G-Pillar would be 100x better if the inertia CARRIED over when swapping back to human form when you are in Gommorah's Demon Masquerade. I feel like it was a big miss to not add a weapon wheel to the game too, adding it to the bottom dpad woulda worked wonderfully IMO. "I hate the dialogue for this game" shows a snap of Bayonetta calling Balder daddy* _Me too man, me too._
Agree with the sound mixing. Hearing Bayonetta dancing, foot movement and body movement being louder than the music. It felt like something you would hear in a will Ferrell comedy Took me out of the scene and couldn't take it seriously
I think Viola being called Bayonetta is more a case of “you’re one of us now” rather than her taking over as the protagonist. Like she’ll be on the cover of the next main entry, but I feel like she’s not going to be a full on protagonist without cereza until 5 or 6.
Agreed. I also think Platinum is in it for the long haul with Viola. With Bayo having shown the power to defeat two creation-myth gods, death itself, and a cosmic horror whose MO was devouring infinite realities, Viola feels like Platinum dialing things back with someone who still has room to grow over time (and I do hope they take their time). That said, I feel like the only way Bayo can get any stronger is if she literally jumps out of the screen and beats up the player, or murders Kamiya during a staff meeting. After all, she's already conquered her reality; time to break out and battle those who dare to further manipulate it.
@@Tenchigumi As far as games go, I think it is better to either create a new series or ignore the scope creep. By any measure, Viola may have been one of the jobbers in this game but she was "weak" relative to a Multiverse warper in her first game still got one stab in. She also kept up to some degree with the Arch Eve and Arch Adam... Which must make her the Arch Jesus since she seems to have all of their powers. For an example of something that ignores the scope creep, Mario and Sonic which both have some narrative going on in the main games but don't think about it too much when they don't need to.
@@thelastgogeta The whole thing with scope creep of Bayonetta feels like it was losing battle anyways ever since the ending of Bayo 1, since neither of the main villains in the other two games ultimately manage to sell themselves as anywhere close to as memorable as Father Balder or as large of a looming threat as Jubileus. I can't even recall what it was we were supposed to be afraid of Loptr for and Singularity just feels like a concept for a completely different villain from the role they ended up playing by the end, since they're set up as a man-made hive-mind bio weapon gone rogue, but inexplicably can control the fabric of reality by manipulation of something called "phenomenal affirmation", making them effectively yet another evil god, but without a backstory to make that make any sense.
I smiled a bit when I saw that gameplay of Gungrave G.O.R.E. It kind of told me that you were playing and recording it for a video. I just hope for your sake that you enjoyed it, because I know some people will think you have obligations to review it after reviewing the first 2 games. Only time will tell.
One thing I haven't seen a lot of people talk about is the "fantasy" aspect as in the "character fantasy" of playing as that character archetype and honestly there are few games that let me have that "battle mage/ summoner fantasy" in action form quite like Bayo 3. Also as a power - scaling trash human I enjoy seeing character and power progression go side by side Bayo 1 "serious mode" for boss fights only Bayo 2 on demand Umbral Climax Bayo 3 straight Demon enslavement and control to the point you can fuse with them (also enjoy that post Bayo 2's Jeanne incident Cereza actually prioritized better demon taming as to avoid it happening again) Ps. DEMON MASQUERADE IS JUST SO FUCKING COOL
My only issue with Demon Masquerade is that it doesn't feel like a witch power the same way animal within is. Also the fact that every Bayo in the multiverse can use it provided they have the right weapon makes it feel less like an evolution of Bayo herself and more like a weapon powerup. The same issue with Demon Slave is that in Bayo 1 and 2, many of the QTE has Bayo overpowering things with her raw strength. In Bayo 3 the cutscenes are all demons doing the work, which ironically makes Bayo seems less powerful even though she's summoning way more powerful stuff.
@@exploshaun I cannot agree any less with the last point. In the past, summoning was mostly used as a finisher, the last bout of humiliation after Bayo trashed her enemies. She didn't actually needed to invoke demons to kill, she just did it for the spectacle. Funnily enough, not only do Demon Slave makes Bayo looks weaker, but her demons too. Before the Infernal Demons were those terrifying, mysterious entities from the pit of Hell, that seemed invincible. Now that we see them all the time, and that the demons can be hurt and even killed (even temporarily), they seems less menacing.
@@NIHIL_EGO Hmm. I agree with your last point, but on a different sort of angle. Something that helped presentation in this series was making the angels and demons stand out via having the whole Enochian language thing. In this game, they just straight up all speak English. While it hasn’t happened before in series (Rodin’s a demon and he speaks English all the time), seeing it applied to all of the Infernals Bayo meets kind of makes things feel…more generic. I feel it would’ve been more impactful if they just had them stick to the Enochian language, and then in the rhythm boss fight with Baal’s true form, she speaks English. It’d pop out more, revealing an Infernal’s true form and then, “Surprise! Rodin’s not the only Infernal who can speak English!” It’s…minor, but still. Though, about the menacing part…yeah, I admit I feel inclined to agree. The thing about the Infernals is that, well, they’re demons. They’re no one’s friends, and only aren’t an enemy if you’re not in their way. The closest to Bayo bonding with an Infernal is her relationship with Rodin, which works because the two have a professional, business-minded relationship, but they also show a lot of respect for one another.
Pretty much my same thoughts on Bayo 3 except for the new combo finishers, I like them, they're quick, flashy, hit hard and have good variety and utility. The story is ok, I like seeing all the Bayos and I like Viola and her playstyle, the people hating her just need to learn to parry. I had the same issue with Viola charging attacks by mistake and it was on a DS4. If it had a better camera, less annoying enemies and more encounters in general I'd say it's the best of the 3. And yes, the weapon limit of 2 has always been criminal.
Played Bayonetta 1. Liked it but was very bad at it as i dont play many of that kind of games Was happy to hear you mention the motorcycle and rocket sections taking too long. My biggest problem with that game was just as i started ti get into the flow I was being interupted by gimick or mini game sections
Play this 7 minute long , ball busting Afterburner mini-game. Now fight one of the hardest bosses of any action game. In a single mission with shared rankings No, you don't get your health back, what are you, a pussy?
Watched it the entire way through, and now I want to say "thank you" as well on the ending bit on Bayonetta 2. As you could see by my last comment, i'm a very big fan of Soulstice and the potential it carries on top of the already laid fundaments -- warts and all. I was willing to write down a lot of the positives on Soulstice for me personally to hopefully make you look a bit more favorably upon it than you might already do. But the things you said at the end of the Bayonetta 2 segment made me smile. That you neither want people to completely take your opinion for fact and thus never actually try game for themselves, to form their own opinion. Nor to disregard all that you have to say about a game from commendations to criticism and things in-between and beyond, relating to either the game in question or another one entirely. For what it's worth, i still hope for a number of things; that the video will bring forth more attention for the game itself; that any feedback on the comments of that video may be interesting subject for discussion and consideration, for yourself and viewers; and that Soulstice provided you with a good time and may do so again -hopefully more so- in the future (be it by replaying it, by playing a sequel or two, or both). And any other ambitious titles with heart to them that may come this world's way in the future. Thank you for making this video, and wish you a lot of fun and good luck on any future projects. Videos or otherwise.
Soulstice rules. That game has my favorite implementation of a DT mechanic… and I want that game to have a sequel bc I want to fight as the MCs final form
@@deadnalive9166 Heck yeah! Glad to see others who are fond of the game :) I've rarely ever seen a similar thing to the Berserk/DT mechanic, for both the out-of-control version at low health, as well as how Lute's skill choices influence the finisher. There's a lot to like about it, and I think it can be taken even further into interesting directions. And like you said, the Saber form of Lute and Briar would be awesome to play as. For me, their Transcended form is a mix of beautiful and cool that surpasses Bayonetta. (Heck, the creature design in general is awesome. And Jared and Jadon are up there with Agni and Rudra for entertaining twins bosses for me.) If it's alright to ask, are there any other parts about Soulstice that stand out to you? Be they positively, negatively or something in-between?
I'm glad im not the only one who felt that for the second game. I was not a huge fan of umbran climax. I felt like my normal attacks were the basic handguns just building up meter to use umbran climax instead for damage.
Bayonetta 3 feels like a result of it being an open world game in development. Which firstly, thank God it's not cause open world can go so wrong so easily. But the same moves needing to be unlocked through multiple weapons and 3 different currencies feels like something you'd do if you need to add more content to fill out the open world
Here's of my flaws on the trilogy: Bayonetta 1: The some of the enemies are lackluster into killing. I hate the fire covered angels and the fact I'd force myself to use Witch Time and counterattack, and the After Burner/Space Harrier stages including the Paradiso chapter are very lackluster imo, they felt more like filler levels rather than something to advance the gameplay and plot; but Bloody Fate gave After Burner aka Route 666 justice tho. And the fact Jubileus is a lackluster final boss, however I can take it over the False Savior in DMC4. Bayonetta 2: Jeanne doesn't get love akin to the first game and was a damsel in distress so Bayo could save her without any partner battles for these awesome witch lesbians. And I agree with Umbral Climax and the antagonist, but I'll always take Demon Masquerade over Bayo 2's equivalent to DMC's Devil Trigger, while Loptr is forgettable even though the whole reason why Baldr became the villain of Bayo 1 was based on Norse Mythology, expanded in the third game. Bayonetta 3: The framerate drops at times considering the size of the hardware/engine, unlike Bayo 1 and 2 since they run smoother with little to no framerate drops. Hellena Taylor didn't return especially via Bayo 3 spoilers which she denied offering, but Jennifer Hale at the very least tried her hardest to sound like the previous VA so she gets a pass. Viola's stages are a mixed bag, but we only got three including the last chapter and her theme reminds me of Nero's theme in DMC5. Lastly, the demon stages are slow and lacking, sure the Sin Gomorrah stage is attempting to feel exactly like an old fashioned kaiju flick, but that's just it, though the Queen Butterfly, Baal Zebul and as I call an upgraded Phantasmaranae "Purple Lava Spider" stages had much more finesse in their design. That's about it. I'm excited for Bayonetta Origins and hope it succeeds with flying colors as it's previous three for how different the game is likewise.
Good video. It's a good example of why I consider this channel underrated. It's the same kind of blend of objectivity and personality that I love from SomeCallMeJohnny, another underrated UA-camr. Most online reviewers are either bland and really straightforward, or overly wacky for the sake of it, but you nail a really solid middle ground and it's painfully uncommon.
Blaming the switch limitations for Bayo 3's poor performance doesn't make any sense to me. Bayonetta 1 and 2 look AND play better than 3, and they're both on the switch as well. There are tons of better looking and running games perfectly optimized for the switch that are exclusive, platinum just dropped the ball with this one. It's probably because it was originally intended to be an open world game, so they accepted lesser performance from the get go, and just rolled with what they had initially made when the game was retooled to not be open world.
I dunno about that. Though the previous games do look better, 3 has a lot more going on. There are a lot of models, destruction, physics, particles etc going on in certain sections that it really could be done better without the game playing at a way lower frame rate. I have a feeling just having the same amount of detail as the other games, but the same amount of stuff on 3 would cause the game to chug. And it already chugs in the gimmick sections. And before you point at mario oddysee, that game still has a lot less going on than bayo 3
there was a moment where you mentioned how it can be hard to want to talk about something if you don't feel qualified enough i've been stuck on certain projects because i felt like maybe i wasn't the right person to talk about hearing someone else say that really helped me just start it again
One thing that completely struck me about 3 was how the animation quality was better than 2 and 1. Like Masquerade Attacks from Bayo's pistols would have Madama Butterfly flourish her hands as she punched something and retreated back. Here I was thinking that animation couldn't be any better. But yeah, I agree with a lot of what you said on it. It really does feel like they had an idea and threw it in without thinking if it would actually glue nicely. Overall, I like Bayo 3, controversially more than 2 or 1 because I love using Demon Slave in conjunction with combos (and it's the 'easiest' of all three with the exception of Rodin's fight).
My main issue with Viola's new form is that I don't know what it's meant to signify. It just sort of comes out of nowhere and it feels like they just did it so they could pull a true Devil Trigger Nero like in 5. The issue is that Nero in 5 getting DT is that it yields impact. It's a result of Nero's determination reaching its zenith. He refuses to allow Dante and Vergil kill each other and succumb to a fate where one kills the other. It comes with the fact that Nero finally realizes his connection to Dante, the Yamato, and his family. It gives him the push to realize his full strength that was being held back. Nero also had a whole game prior to 5 that established his character and developed him, making him a character that by the end of 5 made it feel like he earned the right to protect humanity while Dante and Vergil fought to once again separate the Human and Demon Realm.
I'm definitely gonna have to come back to the rest of this when I finally play Bayo 3. Love the video so far though. It is really making me want to jump back in on the other 2 games, especially since I haven't played Bayo 2 since I beat it on the WiiU.
Another contributing factor to how the game feels like it skips over a lot of context is that YOU DON'T EVEN PLAY AS BAYONETTA FROM 1 OR 2! You play as past Cereza from 1, but that's only explained through her character design and in game files that you have to read.
Well, that's the take - SHE IS the original Bayonetta from 1 and 2, but there is also a timeline where only story of the 1 game happened and the timeline where only 1 and 2 games happened. Those two Cerezas are the closet to the original from 1, 2 and 3, but also had difference in their respective timeline (for example having Viola earlier). That's also mean that story of 1 and 2 does not create alternative timelines - this is a time anomaly, where the story of the first game create a story from the second one and vise versa.
4:37-4:56 bang on sir. This remake fad we’re in right now is beyond a joke at this point. Dead Space and The Last of Us are some of my favorite titles, but jesus christ I am fine with replaying those original versions years later because, beyond holding up well, they are a part of the developer’s history and you can see how they improve with further IPs and sequels. I love replaying series like Metal Gear and Resident Evil for this very reason - it’s so cool to see gameplay and presentation evolve across *titles* and not just a single *title*
Shuraba is my favorite weapon from Bayonetta and I wish it would have become as iconic as the guns. Every sequel has some kind of sword but none of them feel as good as Shuraba
"[In Bayo 2] I got platinum by just spamming a weapon at a boss..." Yep. In Bayo 1, your combo points would degrade after five hits unless you mixed in a Wicked Weave, so you couldn't spam one attack. In Bayo 3, you'd want to earn Improvisation multipliers by using every type of attack at least once (punch, kick, firearm, demon, and demon masquerade), and thus spamming one attack wouldn't be very efficient either. But in Bayo 2, there are none of these rules. Just spam away with whatever works, and if they hate then let them hate and watch the halos pile up.
"In Bayo 1, your combo points would degrade after five hits unless you mixed in a Wicked Weave... But in Bayo 2, there are none of these rules..." -- that's completely wrong. Bayo 2 has points degradation too. But it simply doesn't work in neither game because point degradation counter resets not only on Wicked Weaves but also on *any* special move and on *anything* player can do that is not a regular punch/kick: like successful Witch Time resets it, jumping on enemy resets it and so do dozens of other actions that all appear on scoreboard as "special bonus". Points degradation system implemented like that simply doesn't matter in Bayonetta 1-2 no matter how you play it. The only way to only make it matter would be playing with Sai-Fung and that would be the only way where it begins to start to make the difference.
Oh and "[In Bayo 2] I got platinum by just spamming a weapon at a boss..." would be just as applicable to Bayonetta 1 since pickable angel weapons give HUGE points bonuses and raise multiplier. Player can and should spam them while you can since they run out.
@@azekeprofit Whether or not it "worked" in your opinion, the fact remains that Bayo 1 had a system that caused your points to degrade if you didn't mix something special in between your normal attacks. And it's pretty significant: repeating normal punches and kicks will bring your combo points from 20-30 per hit down to 1 or 2 pretty quickly. As far as I know (and as far as my sources and personal experience have shown), Bayo 2 does not have a point degradation system for combos. Your punches and kicks will earn the same baseline number of points regardless of whether you mix in special attacks. Thus, a 15-hit combo with just normal attacks in Bayo 1 would be worth maybe 126 points, but in Bayo 2 would be worth roughly 300, a gap that grows exponentially as the combos get longer. That's pretty significant. In addition, Bayo 2 retains Bayo 1's multipliers for Witch Time, enraged enemies, and angel/demon weapons, and those multipliers expand the gap even further. However, one distinction is that Bayonetta 1 gave you bigger bonuses for hitting multiple enemies with Wicked Weaves, while Bayo 2 did not (which is fair, because Bayo 2's Wicked Weaves were generally much bigger and easier to land on crowds than Bayo 1's). In any case, perhaps with your style of play (using varied combos and tactics), you would never notice these distinctions. And indeed, I never noticed myself until I read the wiki years ago. But if someone were to play like a scrub and just mash X all day, they'd definitely get better results in Bayo 2. But maybe I missed something all these years, so if there's a system of diminishing returns in Bayo 2's combo counter, I'd love to hear about it. As for Angel/Demon Weapons, yes you can use them without point degradation, because they are special expendable weapons. They're literally just a burst of damage and points in limited scenarios, not something you can do endlessly on a whim.
@@Tenchigumi I didn't mean that points degradation doesn't "work" in subjective opinionated sense -- i meant it simply did not work. Mechanically. "If there's a combo point degradation system in Bayo 2, please describe it." -- you already described it: "your combo points would degrade after five hits unless you mixed in a Wicked Weave". I just launched Bayo 2 and witnessed the same points degradation of punches and kicks going from 20 to 15 and lower. However because the mere idea of points degradation implemented like that is deeply flawed i had to go out of my way not dodge, not to jump, not to do any of the special moves and just press punch which is harder than it sounds.
@@azekeprofit I think you've misunderstood what we mean by point degradation. Every attack has a baseline value. For example, with Shuraba's punch combo, the first few punches are worth 20 points each, but the rapid stabs at the end are worth roughly 1.66 points each (the points value for barrage attacks are weird). That's not point degradation: those are the baseline values of each attack. Now in Bayo 1, if you only did Shuraba's first punch repeatedly in one combo, the point values would be: 20-20-20-20-20-16-12-8-4-1-1-1. As you can see, after the fifth hit, the points degrade in value until they are only one point per hit. If you land a Wicked Weave, the degradation would reset, and the punches would once again be worth 20 points each. However in Bayo 2, if you only did Shuraba's first punch repeatedly in one combo, the point value would ALWAYS be 20 points per hit; there is no degradation. As for you example (which I assume was with Love is Blue or Scarborough Fair), you "witnessed the same points degradation of punches and kicks going from 20 to15 and lower." However, what you actually saw were normal kicks being worth 20 points, normal punches being worth 15 points, and gunfire being worth around 4.4 points a shot (usually in bursts of three or four). Those were the minimum values for those respective attacks, and if anything, you'd see them get _larger_ with Witch Time and Enrage multipliers. They don't degrade. Regardless, I'm not sure I understand what you meant by it "simply not working mechanically." There's no reason not to dodge (that's what dodge offset is for), jump (you can do Wicked Weaves and Torture Attacks in midair), or avoid special moves (I mean... that's how you reset the degradation).
it might be placebo but I think its worth mentioning that the Xbox 360 version of Bayonetta seems to be much more colorful than the other versions for whatever reason
2:30 minutes in and as someone who doesn't care about Bayonetta as a character too much but is interested in learning about mechanics of these types of games: THANK YOU SO INCREDIBLY MUCH for knowing of, and looking deeper into, Soulstice! It's presumptous for me to thank you without even knowing if your opinions on it, in broad strokes, will be positive or negative, but it's a game that I do feel has a *lot* going for it and deserves more attention. It hasn't had a lot of coverage, but your videos go about analysis and explaining stuff about it in a nice way. And I dearly hope that Soulstice is a game that sticks with you in a positive way-- perhaps even one that you love, warts and all. And that a possible sequel (or two) may be able to elicit the same feelings for you, other Soulstice fans, and fans of these types of games as a whole.
Man! I worked as QA on that game and I fckn hate it. So much wasted potential due to very poor design decisions and an absolute garbage of a plot. Tries to be mature but somehow ends up being a 10 year old child's version of edgy instead of having any substance. Surprised to see it has an audience if I'm being frank.
@@dedicateddark Sorry to hear the game leaves a bad taste in your mouth. There's definitely a decently-sized fanbase, and last week an update was released that adds an extra combat option after beating chapter 23. I'm aware Soulstice is flawed on various points, but for me it also hits a lot of right notes, and i found the characters and story to be quite on the positive side. General throughline of "save the world" is quite basic, but it's the closer-up things about the characters we learn about that really makes it stick for me and a good number of others. Lute and Briar may generally be mainly Sweet Girl and Snark Knight, but i honestly believe that the relationship between the two, and how that is shown makes them more than the sum of their parts. Kind of like a Transcended. Art direction for the characters (especially the Transcended) are awesome for me too. Voice acting can have odd inflections, but i don't hate it (though Armina was definitely the weakest)-- it can even have some charm throughout it. The VA for Dugal and Demian *especially* gave it his all. Love that guy's performances. There's nice lore for the world, as supplied by Layton, to give the idea of more than what we get to see. I generally like the writing. Also, a *lot* of weapons and combat options! Big fan of all the different uses they can have compared to one another. The Unity mechanic is cool too, it's like a Special Meter mixed with a DMC Style Meter. (though in more hectic battles, it gets difficult to keep it up). Things i will agree on taking away from the fun, were among others some annoying enemy designs. On the Steam forums i've set up a discussion thread on Best, Worst and Most Interesting parts for enemies. (The Abominations really live up to their name, but i suppose i don't need to tell you that) Camera Angles i didn't mind *too* much, but i see the issue there. Game's rather dragged out with levels, and bosses like the Weavers and Armina have their own annoying things. The Field System is something... eeehhh. On my first playthrough i didn't mind it too much either, on my Very Hard playthrough it felt at its worst, especially with the new enemy encounters and mix-ups. But I *do* find it interesting how the Overcharge mechanic can be mitigated and actually be weaponized using Lute's skill tree. There are so many options and customization, in part thanks to getting "refunds" for skills, that i can imagine there being certain "builds" for how Lute and her abilities act. I can definitely imagine Lute's side of things and the Evocation/Banishment fields mechanic being much more complicating than necessary, though. I've been listing my own ups and downs with Soulstice, but if i may ask, what are things that you would have liked to have changed about the game, in regards to design decisions and plot?
Bayonetta 3 has what could be one of my favourite mechanics in any game, and that is the ability to queue up demon slave attacks so you can still attack while the demon is attacking, it adds so much expression and depth to it. it just stinks the enemy design isnt up to snuff to support these mechanics
Great stuff! It was cool hearing some more obscure thoughts that I've also had about this game, as I've had yet to hear them in any other in-depth review. ...I'm actually in the middle of editing my own critique on this game with a lot of these similar niche points, so hopefully it doesn't appear that I'm just copying what you've said in this video. I swear it's just a coincidence!
Didn't Bayo 3 end up getting reworked? Was suppose to be open world, because I guess nobody told Platinum the switch is a toaster. That would explain why it seems like it's only about 85% done. Feels bad that the games have been on a slide after Bayo 1.
Well for me, While I don't mind them pushing Bayonetta as Viola's mother narrative, but it was abrupt and no build up. Also It would have made more sense if Luka was a Lumen which allowed Viola to be a mini Jubileus which at least allows the transformation gimic. OG Bayonetta did set a high bar of Strong Woman Character so its hard to top in in future games
So I scrolled through the comments to check first but you are half right on the purpose of the bow in 2. On Infinite Climax mode it is a useful secondary set weapon for it's two main properties. Each arrow inflicts a small amount of poison damage. And more importantly they also home in on enemies and bosses, allowing you to interact with enemies that need witch time to hit. Which is really only there to fix a problem they made in the game design. Honestly I think if we get Tag Climax or another mode that just lets us fight a randomized assortment of enemies, three would become my favorite.
I wish bayo 2 had an item with this gimmick: Makes your weapons more powerful (like they used to be in bayo 1) but you lose the ability to use umbran climax. That would've solved the biggest problem in bayo 2, at least in my opinion. The combat in bayo 3 is fine, as long as we are talking about bayo's core combat, I hated the jeanne sections, viola's chapters, the puzzles and mini games because I'm here to play bayonetta, not for additions which the game would be a thousand times better without. Also, the story this time had to be the worst in the series, and with difference, they made the first 12 chapters a non ending cycle of meeting new bayonetta, see bayonetta die, loop weapon. Repeat, Taking luka seriously as a character was cringe, they took bayonetta's charm and charisma as a character and replaced her for a tropy, boring and mute version of her, and the story in general was just boring and uninteresting the moment you realized you were doing the same thing over and over just in different universes. And the worst part (but best in retrospective because they didn't involve the bayo I loved in this mess) is the fact that we were never playing as the bayonetta from the first two games, but just another bayonetta in the multiverse, a grown up version of the cerezita bayonetta meet in bayo 1 to be precise. Last thing, Adding the cancelled "scalebound" mechanics into bayonetta was a mistake, Demon slave in the main reason why the characters look tiny in almost every scenario, the game is made with the intention of always summoning a kaiju next to you. The best things in the game were the witch time, colour my world and the spider weapon.
I disagree with the "needing" to learn from some place else the finner details of the mechanics, action games like Bayo and DMC are not that far away from how fighting games works and testing stuff is very similar, so, if you are familiar with labbing on fighting games and finding stuff that way then figuring stuff out on Bayo feels familiar. The fact that DMCV and Bayo 3 finally have traninig modes helps a lot too.
That’s a major point of that section that unless you know how to get the most out of labbing these things are worthless to some players. I’d argue that fighting games also often do a terrible job of teaching you things despite having a training mode and trials. Some people need to be shown and told what to do because they don’t know how to come to conclusions and dig for information themselves.
I blame Nier Automata for Platinum's "homogonization" of their games. It feels like they've been trying to chase that high since it came out. I can't blame them at all for it because Automata is by far their most successful title (financially), and passion doesn't always pay the mortgage. So after a while, unless you're the trust fund baby of a billionaire, you have to at times chase after what keeps the lights on. And it seems like Platinumgames have been struggling to do so in ways due to the decisions (and results) that they have been making as of recently.
tfw DMC3 Switch Edition has a weapon wheel, while both DMC5 and Bayonetta 3 restrict you to either cycle through all the weapons or limit you to two altogether.
Really vibe with the way you approached issues like skill level, folks taking your opinion as god's words type of shit. It was very insightful and helped to make this stand out from other reviews of the franchise !
I Held off from this video until I completed Bayo 3 today, and everything you pointed out was how I feel about the series as a whole, both good and bad. I absolutely love Bayonetta as the series is right now and i'm happy with the fact these games exist, even if it is the switch but how we got to the thirds' ending left a massive question mark in my brain; especially how the stakes were always shown to be galactically catastrophic... But not being able to save any of the Bayos, Jeanne being done dirty at every fucking turn when she was literally the skill bar in the first game (God her boss fights were the best) and the final thing we see of Luka and Cerezas' relationship all feels... Muddy. I can't even talk about Viola and her little secret because WE AS THE AUDIENCE ARE THE ONLY ONES WHO KNOW, Luka knows with the flower language hints in the cutscenes and when he says "I'll always love you both" But Cereza has No fucking clue, why!? It would have been entertaining as hell, shit the game could've thrown a post-pregnancy body positivity image type of message but none of it ever gets explained? We see the ending we got in Bayo 3 and it begs how Viola even *exists* at this point. If Luka had these powers his whole life, why was none of it explained or even hinted at in the last two games... like him being somewhat mentally unstable (Not outright insane but more doubtful, distrusting, fixated, almost obsessed) after literally seeing his father get murdered and realising he loves the woman who he blamed his whole life growing up for said Fathers' death would've been a better route to go for his strider side as opposed to "He be wolf man". And then, The gameplay... 2 weapon restriction on the 1st 2 games i have to somewhat disagree with because you can mix and match your feet and hands and in B2 some weapons are hands only, so you can get creative and I don't understand why it is limited in B3 for us to have the Demon Masquerade, i think you explained it best where the DM would correlate with the weapon in the hands.. The demon controlling is a great mechanic and using them as enders and counters feels like how Bayo would actually fight the larger enemies and I hope they keep this mechanic for future games but I would also like my Torture attacks and Umbran climax back also... Bayo 1, 2 & 3 need to come out with the more powerful consoles, Hell i'd take a Bayo 1 remake that runs on the REengine and looks hyper-realistic... It's upsetting that a game is so dear to me get hate for certain things that it really shouldn't do and again it feels like an injustice these games aren't running at performance levels so high it makes heads explode and mouths drown but damn... Bayonetta as a franchise and as a character role model deserved a better ending before passing the torch.
Bayo 3's finale just feel soooooo long and forced. Like it keeps doing the shonen escalation of over the top finishers on him but he just keeps no selling it to the point of when he does get killed it feels wrong. Like the full force of the bayonetta army couldn't kill him, fused bayonetta couldn't kill him, Viola finally stabbing him doesn't kill him, but team attack with luka does now? Its like if at the end of the Freiza arc Goku had his full emotional super saiyen transformation, got beat, went super saiyen 2, got beat again, and then beat him with kaiyoken with super saiyen vegeta and then they died after. Not to mention it sucks that that bland goo man is supposed to be Bayonetta's end, what makes him so much better then Jubileus and Aesir? Only thing we get is "cuz multiversal energy" which at least to me doesn't really feel as big as creator of the universe type stuff from Bayo 1 & 2.
Bayo 3 also really needs some more outfits to unlock. There's only like 5. Bayo 1 had at least twice the amount with different outfits ranging from alternative costumes from points of the story, to just fun little costumes and of course sex appeal fan service costumes
I have to say, this video articulates so much about why I say this series is 1>3>2 that I haven't really been able to. I agree with basically every point, even ones that didn't really come to me consciously like the sound design and Panther momentum. It's actually really nice to see that I'm not alone here, since I've seen a whole lot of people say 2 is the best or 3 is the worst, and while I think all three games are great I just can't agree with them. Only things I would have to say I don't agree with are on the heavy weapons (Takemikazuchi, Dead End Express, and Cassiopoea are great even if I totally agree about Cavaliere) and how I think 2 easily had the best story outside of Luka's role being superfluous. I would love to hear your thoughts on the patch that buffed Viola & gave the heavy weapons PKP Winks, as well as Bayo Origins in general. I'm really interested in the latter since it has a first time director who was inspired to move to Japan for game dev after playing Bayo 1.
As much as I love bayo 2: It felt like an over correction of how badly they were tripping in 1. I also love 1. 3's primary L was the story, being repetitive until the end where it just flat out didn't make sense, and the passing of the torch which sucks because I love viola as a character. But that's gonna put a target in her for unnecessary hate. 3 the game is an Improvement, 3 the story is abysmal and I'd rather deal with another Luka than what we got
The thing that baffles me about the graphics and framerate is that Bayo 1 and 2, which were made for consoles that are not the Switch, runs better than the Switch exclusive Bayo 3. Also I am often reluctant to blame the Switch for low framerates for exclusives when so many graphically demanding games somehow was ported to the system.
2 things regarding Summons and innertia. if you learn to use flash slave to queue and activate the summons instead of keeping the button pressed it feels more like an evolution of weaves than how Astral Chain controls, it mostly servers as a mechanic to launch big enemies that used to be tethered to the floor or only launchable with a weave during witch time. Regarding interntia, you can sustain it after web swing and the g pilar launch by just reserving your second jump instead of using your hold jump skill at the end and then use your air dodge on the air. Maybe one of the problems with people not figuring this basic shit out is how stuck they get to what it used to work instead of testing it out.
Bayo 1= Amazeballzz! Great mechanics/cheeky- once you "get it," you're having a ball. 200 hours. -Bayo 2 = Yup. Still fun 130 hours -Bayo 3 = WTF is this stripped down sh**!?? 15 hours. BORED A.F.....returned.😡
For all its shortcomings and strange parts, it's a game worth acknowledging and looking at what it has to offer. I'm probably one of the biggest fans of the game around, and I do love it-- and sincerely hope that the devs will be able to gain support to make the current game better, craft an even better sequel (or more), and be able to make other cool games.
Good vid! Personally enjoyed the game a bunch but I got reeeeealy annoyed at the cutscenes. They felt too long and kept me thinking "why can't i do the fighting in the cutscene and actually play the game instead of watching this"
Your criticism towards every game hurt as a huge fan but I’m objective and I agree with some of them. Bayo2 is my favorite & I actually think the save Jeanne from hell story is epic. When it runs at the 60fps it’s supposed to, it’s the best Bayo hands down, graphically, technically and I enjoy Umbra Climax. Is it the easiest? Absolutely. As for Bayo3, it’s the best in terms of gameplay for me. Sure, they removed some things but it has the most options and customizations. Does it always work? Nah. And I hate the story I really do. The ending broke my heart. Bayo is supposed to be strong. Making her as fragile as they presented was heartbreaking. A fallen icon for no reason. Then to kill her off? Brutal. I’ll never understand why they did this. I think Bayo4 could be really dope if it was about Bayo climbing out of hell or dammit, just make Bayo3 all a complete dream 🤣🤣🤣
*sees you made Metal Arms Glitch in The System* *Interested into your channel and your voice* *Goes through each video* *listens to the whole beyonetta video, gets to the end* *Constantly does "The Rock" Head Nod* *Hears you doing an Armored Core Video* *Eye Brow Rised, stops what I'm doing in real life and does the Pog face while gasping*
Question is the Armored Core Video Very long and covers all games or is it slightly long and covers each game or gen If you're doing the Each Game at a time in separate videos, may you please give me the Patreon Shout out on Silent Line? if it's about each gen videos could I get a shout out on the 3rd gen video? If it's the entirety of Armored Core, May you please save my shout out until you do an Armored Core Video?
12:18 Actually hitting enemies with dropped weapons gives many more points than regular attacks in any game, certainly in Bayo 1. 'Pure' rating is for getting no damage. And this 'problem' is present in any game -- it's very easy to get the highest rating in a verse with a couple or three basic enemies.
It’s funny that you mention not knowing things like dodge offset. I feel you man. I am not one for secrets. I just think it’s funny especially when I have been a fan of Matthew mattosis who loves secrets and finding!
I assume Bayo 3 made lock on the right stick is cause of Viola with the parry mechanic taking a button. But with the dodge for her being useless, I just wonder on why they didn't just have parry replace the dodge button for Viola. It's another strange decision of Platinum's. Cause right stick click for lock will always feel clunky to me
I think it's because the double tapping the dodge button also functions as her run button (which effectively replaces dodging as her main repositioning tool), a command that's a bit harder to shift around than the lock-on.
@@Tenchigumi in this case, maybe left stick click would be better? But I do think if this was included, button remapping should be here. God I hate when games don't have it. It's like the bare minimum way to make a game more accessible
@@teneesh3376 Considering that double-tapping dodge is also used as Bayo's "transform into high speed animal/demon masquerade" button as well, I imagine that L3 could also be an awkward shift for some folks (especially those who tense up and press L3 by accident, as Woolie of SBFP was notorious for). That said, I agree that they should just let us figure out our own button schemes. I can see how games with modifier buttons (like Bayo and Astral Chain) can get confusing when freely mapped, but Nioh also has modifier buttons (and a MUCH larger set of inputs) yet allows for free customization, so there's no excuse.
Though I strongly disagree with your thoughts on the pro controller (it’s probably my favorite modern controller), I agree that mapping those actions to the thumb stick click was a huge mistake. Nintendo franchises seem to be terrible at implementing control options, and I’ve never felt it worse than in this game
Yeah, I was literally holding one in my hand as he was saying that and was so utterly perplexed at him saying that it felt cheap and flimsy. Like, I literally tried to bend it in my hands and the thing is rock solid.
26:41 "I do not understand why locking on was separated from RB" -- that's because lock-on mechanic in all Bayonetta games can be done without pressing RB. And really that's how it should be done -- because this way is objectively simpler, better and easier for you own hands in the long run. From the very first footage even before you showed your controller inputs i could see you're constantly clutching manual lock-on button. One can play like that but that is simply inefficient because holding your punch/kick buttons also makes lock-on stick -- and one should be doing this anyways for a number of other Bayonetta mechanics to start clicking in place. And if you want to make Space Harrier level from Bayo 1 easier for yourself -- don't use barrel roll dodge. There is no need to use it. At all. If you just keep going in circles no bullet will reach you. Viola's charging definitely feels too eager to activate, and making sure to tap her moves also improved my gameplay. I think a lot of hate directed at her combat comes from that alone -- especially after playing Bayonetta who encourages holding buttons. Game outputting charging hits instead of regular hit affects her parry move which i suspect where a lot of complaints about hard parry come from. 46:23 "obviously Luka was not going to die but game treats it as such" absolutely correct criticism but Bayonetta 1 does this too and more often. Luka "dies" like three times, Jeanne "dies" twice, Bayo herself also "dies". Apparently, Kamiya got the idea for this "i actually did not die, haha!" gimmick from Mark Wahlberg movie "Big Hit" - a factoid i learned from watching his Let's Play of Bayonetta -- which is also where i learned what the fuck was going on in the 1st game since i definitely didn't understand it by just playing.
"For a game that wants to pass the torch you'd think Viola would have more than 3 levels" Oh good god no! She is so much more boring to play, and I hate how you are forced to play as her for those 3 levels. They may as well not exist on replay.
bayonetta 3 is just a lot of fun ideas and lore points which is good but its execution is like a bad mod to a game, its a shame it didn't get to be as good as it should have been, to be honest it should have had longer to be made or a more unified idea of what is was by the devs
I agree with some of your criticisms but I think you leaned way too much into negativity with 3. If you explicitly didn't say otherwise, I'd think that you enjoyed 2 more.
I played Ninja Gaiden Black a couple of years ago for the first time when it was on game pass and after playing it I fell in love with the genre, DMC etc. but the one series I haven't tried is Bayonetta, my big brother says that I should play them but I never got to it for some reason.
Personally I didn't feel the first playthrough does Bayonetta any favors. It wasn't until the third playthrough after I memorized the qtes and when they pop up did I actually enjoy it. It's an incredibly fun game but those boss fights and QTE due to poor direction is frustrating. But perservere and you'll be rewarded with an awesome combat system and ps2 levels of secrets and unlockables.
Hey man that entire Bayo bit on expertise, how opinions are formed, etc. Love it. I feel you. Its why I just do my best and keep moving forward because the expectations randos have for any other person are obscenely tight and confusing to navigate, so we just out here
I'm here for my favorite youtubers showing each other love! Just finished our gungrave review and it's hilarious and great🖤🖤
It's a fantastic bit and I truly resonated with both that AND the bit about number scores because I hate number scores too and Cvit excellently illustrated why I don't use them.
Someone is superknowledgy.
Yes its Kbash on cvits video and im very happy
Whenever people bring up Nero as an example of a proper passing of the torch, I have to remind them that it took over ten years and a bad reboot for that to happen. Nero was NOT immediately embraced when DMC4 came out. He was reviled by many for taking up so much of the game when people just wanted more Dante, something made worse by the fact that Dante got Nero's sloppy seconds in terms of enemies and levels. Fans eventually softened on Nero after the DmC reboot (because they would take anything BUT Donte) and his character was fully fleshed out and rehabbed in DMC5, but it took a _long_ time for that to happen.
If anything, Bayo 3 is trying to avoid what happened with DMC4: instead of having a newcomer abruptly usurp the beloved protag's leading role, they created a massive, content-filled send-off to Cereza while providing a starting point to tease Viola's still untapped potential.
It's worth noting that a lot of folks are still on the "Viola is just a bad Nero" bandwagon, but I think they're missing the point. Platinum did make the mistake of teasing her as "girl Nero," but at worst she's a subversion of Nero, and at best she's very much her own thing.
Nero is cool, hyper-competent, and has a sort of stoic tsudere thing going on in DMC4. From the start, Nero's gameplay suggested that he essentially on Dante's level, despite cutscenes and lore suggesting otherwise.
However, Viola is goofy, talented but unpolished, and keeps her heart on her sleeve. Her gameplay and cutscenes both imply she's not yet equipped to take Bayo's role, and literally feel like growing pains that (like most growing pains) can only be overcome with patience and practice (both on your part and hers). She a lot of growing up to do, but clearly has unique potential that will manifest in her own game(s). For now, her appearance here is just a preview, setting the stage for the future.
Unfortunately, Platinum's tactic of playfully referencing DMC while running off to do something quite different often falls flat or flies over people's heads, as folks end up focusing more on the references than on what Bayo does differently.
Did you play the same DMC4? Dante is always one step ahead of Nero from Mission 1 of DMC4 to Mission 20 of DMC5 ranging from Dante jobbing on purpose to give him a tutorial to cleaning up Nero's incomplete boss fight to finally allowing Nero to try his answer to the Dante vs Vergil feud. He was a more human foil from how he connected with regular and supposedly regular people than his devil hunting contemporaries.
Even in gameplay, Nero is still portrayed as a clumsy brawler with few moves having the finesse of his father or Dante who never seem to be losing balance during any of their attacks. Nero for better and worse can be losing control during grabs, sword swings and even gun shots.
DMC5 definitely helped Nero get appreciated and same can be argued for the Reboot but most of the damage to Nero was just being unable to play All 20 Missions with any character without mods. If they allowed it after a single playthrough, Nero wouldn't become a scapegoat.
PlatinumGames did something good in the sense that they put Viola in the back rather than the front but still designed a very poor first impression for Viola.
This comes from the controls which include how poorly designed the perfect parry timing is. This comes from the narrative which does make her seem more human and vulnerable but in a game where every verse's Bayo and their mum jobs and probably dies, that's less notable.
The sendoff for the original playable cast is more akin to character assassination than anything in Bayo 3 while Dante (as well as Vergil in 5) are still in tact for future appearances.
@@thelastgogeta I think you misread my comment. I agree that Dante was portrayed as one step (or many steps) ahead of Nero in cutscenes and characterization. The thing is that in gameplay, Nero can handle everything Dante can with equal (if not greater) ease.
Compare that to Viola, who is weaker and less versatile than Bayo in both narrative _and_ gameplay. She can certainly overcome the same situations as Bayo, but not without far more practice and effort. I like the fact that Viola's awkward playstyle represents the awkwardness of growing up; you and her are literally sharing the learning experience, and are getting better alongside her. Also, considering how "everyone and their mum" ostensibly "died," the fact that Viola alone "survived" would, in fact, be pretty notable.
I think that while Platinum has its issues crafting narratives that the average fan can digest, the way they tell stories through gameplay is actually quite good.
Also, it's almost certain no one dies at the end of Bayonetta 3, nor has Viola had her full passing of the torch.
Aspects of the final battle and post credit ending indicate that everyone's been restored following the death of Singularity. Hell, Luka is confirmed alive by Rodin (and by extension, so is Bayo). This is probably the thing that went over everyone's head that Kamiya wants to address in the next game.
As for Viola, until she has a game where she's the actual protagonist, I'd reserve judgement on her character. I mean, it took two games, two leading roles, and 10 years for folks to embrace Nero; we should at least give Viola ONE leading role before being so hard on her.
By the way, considering how Dante was added to DMC4 because fan feedback indicated they'd be furious if he wasn't included, I don't think excluding him entirely would have left a good impression either. It was a tough situation.
@@Tenchigumi Hmm, I think I went off what you wrote as you didn't specify what made Nero strong but Viola weak as I saw it.
If you mean "gameplay" as in the actual experience that players have with the game rather than my focus on how game action presentation. I'd say Nero is missing a metric ton of tools in the same way but far more intuitive.
A beginner Nero has CS3 and fairly big attacks. Viola might need you to learn Block Offset to make her fully functional which you start with but the game is not designed for you to learn it.
never thought of it this way, and yes this is in no way ever gonna be viola's game, although it does create the sorrow of cereza's character assassination
I think it'd be better if you broke down why Bayo 2's story doesn't work because your breakdown of 3 makes it extremely obvious why people hate the story imo. I mean it certainly isn't anything special, but I feel it tells a better story than 3. At least there's setups and payoffs with some fun character interactions. Bayo 3 barely interacts with anything, especially the alt Bayo's.
I agree on the whole with the Bayo 3 segment, on top of offscreen attacks, personally I feel the attack tells aren't as good as the previous games. It certainly doesn't help with Viola having a stricter time. As well, Demon Slave is fine, but it becomes clear throughout the game that you should not be playing like a Bayonetta game, you need to summon the Demons to do damage. I have no interest in playing infinite climax because these boring enemies will just be more spongey and enemies will hit like trucks, which I get is the point, but when the enemies suck I don't really want to fight them.
i... actualy love bayo2, i had my problems to adapt to her new hair than to notice those mechanical changes
Oh man, I actually love Bayo 2 because I love her hair despite the mechanical changes.
I hope we can still be friends.
Lopter had a motivation tho, loki and lopter were both half of Aesir's soul (the god of chaos) that once gave his eyes, the eyes of the world to humanity, his soul got turned into two aswell.
Loki, the godness of aesir and lopter being the bad one, he just wanted the power of the god aesir back to rule over chaos once again, and by that he needed to take loki's powers to control the eyes, and later the eyes of the world from bayo and Balder.
Singularuty just wanted destruction without further explanation of why. He's the worst type of villain in fiction, a one-dimensional bad guy that is bad for only the sake of being evil.
I have more grievances with failed/convoluted attempts at depth than shallow jackasses. Shallow dudes can at least be funny, unintentional or otherwise (I've seen enough bad LN anime to get some kind of ironic joy from them). Failed depth is just generically frustrating and boring.
One-dimensional villains can work well if they compensate for it by making the character very fun. Singularity lacks the charm that makes Disney villains memorable.
The only thing I liked about Lopter was the fluorescent shower curtain that he wears.
Imagine instead of killing off the other Bayos, they did have them merge with the main one, giving her access to their demons and weapons. And explains that whole bit at the end where they all return.
I think the point of "killing" them (they were actually absorbed by Singularity) was precisely so that Bayonetta could smack them out of Singularity during their final battle, at which point he exclaims that Bayo is powerful enough to override his manipulation of reality, which is kind of a big deal.
Of course, much of that dialogue is hard to catch during all the chaos, but it's there.
They do that in bayo 3 and she loses to the Final boss like 5 secs later
@@Tenchigumi I find the villain ending up being an evil alternative universe counterpart of Bayonetta herself, who'd go around the multiverse doing Jet Li's The One routine of making herself stronger by killing versions of herself from other universes, while our Bayo would still get the weapons and demon familiars, would have been more memorable. Bit of a cliche as the evil doppelganger from a different dimension might technically be, it would have created a stronger connection via parallelled progression to the villain, on top of just making them feel more narratively meatier and impactful of a character, with also less legwork needed to establish them as a legitimate threat, than some bloke we'd never seen before, nor got to really know to any degree during the game and who was obviously the villain as soon as they were shown on screen.
@@jondoe7036 I think the thing about Singularity that a lot of folks miss is that he's intentionally a faceless, unknowable representative of humanity and their absurdly catastrophic potential, as Bayo 3 aims to complete the thematic trinity of the trilogy.
In Bayo 1, we had the glorious angels of Paradiso, all perfectly arranged in their hierarchy of orders and spheres.
In Bayo 2, we had the demons of Inferno, who represented various negative emotions in a realm where order was abandoned for the pursuit of power and domination.
Paradiso and Inferno were both powerful but evenly matched, and for the most part stalemated themselves into a balance of light and dark (and whenever the balance was upset, Bayo would casually step in to set things right).
However, in Bayo 3 we finally reach the humans of Chaos, who were always portrayed as the weakest of the Trinity of Realities, but with the most dangerous potential. That potential manifested itself (quite literally) as Singularity.
The interesting thing about Singularity is that he's an AI lifeform who was created by accident. Human technology had advanced so far that a random production anomaly resulted in this nigh-omnipotent entity, one who was on the cusp of not only annihilating the entire multiverse of Chaos, but crushing the mighty realms of Paradiso and Inferno as well.
_That_ message-of how humans ingenuity, ambition, and foolishness could inadvertently create the most destructive force in all realities-is something that tends to float past everyone when discussing Singularity's threat, purpose, and value as a villain.
@@Tenchigumi I got what the themathical message of it was, I just don't find making the villain a faceless unknown with unclear motives works here. It can work for something like Lovecraftian horror, where looming unknowable threat represents the uncaring universe and our own tenuous existance amidst forces so much greater and older we can't begin to comprehend them, but it doesn't work for an action game, where villain is something to be confronted, challenged and overcome, because not really understanding whom or what it was you just clashed with, robs the meaning from that conflict and triumph.
And seeing as Bayonetta is already used to represent the potential of humanity in a positive light, using alternate version of her as a counterargument for potential threat that comes with it, would have still gotten the same overall point across, no?
Really love that you put emphasis on peoples subjective experiences in your Bayo 2 thoughts. Personally loved Bayo 2 more than 1, and I still do, despite recognizing and empathizing with peoples gripes with it
Thing is many of those gripes are over things that're not easy to intuit for most players, like the scoring system. I played Bayo 1 on 360 when it came out and have replayed it on every other platform I got it on, but I was never able to consistently get a high combo ranking in any playthrough. It wasn't until I google'd what the ruleset was during my most recent playthrough out of curiosity right before 3 released. (I just don't look up external resources on games, its just not how I like to experience them usually)
It IS much more fun when you understand it, and I see what they were going for with it now. I have been going through Bayo 1s higher difficulties for the first time and having a blast because of it, but nothing should feel THAT obfuscated when its displayed on screen the whole game.
Though Bayo 2s system is not a fix for this, it was FAR less frustrating in that respect. Bayo 1 has lots of great qualities, but a lot of its encounter and combat design wound up discouraging me from exploring them and that was not the case with 2. Bayo 2 didn't feel that different mechanically from Bayo 1 to me when I first played it, and I wound up putting like 300 hours into it on Wii U because the learning experience is just so much smoother in it (rip my pro controller triggers)
Sometimes Kamiya's love for old arcade design philosophies just works against his own games, despite what it can create
I am VERY happy you pointed out the lack of inertia in Bayo 2/3 hahaha, Durga and even ABK carried Inertia momentum during its attacks in 1, so it's a shame 3 didn't carry that over, I feel like weapons such as G-Pillar would be 100x better if the inertia CARRIED over when swapping back to human form when you are in Gommorah's Demon Masquerade. I feel like it was a big miss to not add a weapon wheel to the game too, adding it to the bottom dpad woulda worked wonderfully IMO.
"I hate the dialogue for this game" shows a snap of Bayonetta calling Balder daddy* _Me too man, me too._
Agree with the sound mixing. Hearing Bayonetta dancing, foot movement and body movement being louder than the music. It felt like something you would hear in a will Ferrell comedy
Took me out of the scene and couldn't take it seriously
I think Viola being called Bayonetta is more a case of “you’re one of us now” rather than her taking over as the protagonist. Like she’ll be on the cover of the next main entry, but I feel like she’s not going to be a full on protagonist without cereza until 5 or 6.
Agreed. I also think Platinum is in it for the long haul with Viola. With Bayo having shown the power to defeat two creation-myth gods, death itself, and a cosmic horror whose MO was devouring infinite realities, Viola feels like Platinum dialing things back with someone who still has room to grow over time (and I do hope they take their time).
That said, I feel like the only way Bayo can get any stronger is if she literally jumps out of the screen and beats up the player, or murders Kamiya during a staff meeting. After all, she's already conquered her reality; time to break out and battle those who dare to further manipulate it.
@@Tenchigumi As far as games go, I think it is better to either create a new series or ignore the scope creep.
By any measure, Viola may have been one of the jobbers in this game but she was "weak" relative to a Multiverse warper in her first game still got one stab in. She also kept up to some degree with the Arch Eve and Arch Adam... Which must make her the Arch Jesus since she seems to have all of their powers.
For an example of something that ignores the scope creep, Mario and Sonic which both have some narrative going on in the main games but don't think about it too much when they don't need to.
@@thelastgogeta The whole thing with scope creep of Bayonetta feels like it was losing battle anyways ever since the ending of Bayo 1, since neither of the main villains in the other two games ultimately manage to sell themselves as anywhere close to as memorable as Father Balder or as large of a looming threat as Jubileus. I can't even recall what it was we were supposed to be afraid of Loptr for and Singularity just feels like a concept for a completely different villain from the role they ended up playing by the end, since they're set up as a man-made hive-mind bio weapon gone rogue, but inexplicably can control the fabric of reality by manipulation of something called "phenomenal affirmation", making them effectively yet another evil god, but without a backstory to make that make any sense.
Yo spoilers bro .the game is still ne× lol
I smiled a bit when I saw that gameplay of Gungrave G.O.R.E. It kind of told me that you were playing and recording it for a video. I just hope for your sake that you enjoyed it, because I know some people will think you have obligations to review it after reviewing the first 2 games. Only time will tell.
35:17 I'm SO GLAD someone else mentioned this! I had the same experience and it was throwing me off
One thing I haven't seen a lot of people talk about is the "fantasy" aspect as in the "character fantasy" of playing as that character archetype and honestly there are few games that let me have that "battle mage/ summoner fantasy" in action form quite like Bayo 3.
Also as a power - scaling trash human I enjoy seeing character and power progression go side by side
Bayo 1 "serious mode" for boss fights only
Bayo 2 on demand Umbral Climax
Bayo 3 straight Demon enslavement and control to the point you can fuse with them (also enjoy that post Bayo 2's Jeanne incident Cereza actually prioritized better demon taming as to avoid it happening again)
Ps. DEMON MASQUERADE IS JUST SO FUCKING COOL
My only issue with Demon Masquerade is that it doesn't feel like a witch power the same way animal within is. Also the fact that every Bayo in the multiverse can use it provided they have the right weapon makes it feel less like an evolution of Bayo herself and more like a weapon powerup.
The same issue with Demon Slave is that in Bayo 1 and 2, many of the QTE has Bayo overpowering things with her raw strength. In Bayo 3 the cutscenes are all demons doing the work, which ironically makes Bayo seems less powerful even though she's summoning way more powerful stuff.
@@exploshaun I cannot agree any less with the last point. In the past, summoning was mostly used as a finisher, the last bout of humiliation after Bayo trashed her enemies. She didn't actually needed to invoke demons to kill, she just did it for the spectacle.
Funnily enough, not only do Demon Slave makes Bayo looks weaker, but her demons too. Before the Infernal Demons were those terrifying, mysterious entities from the pit of Hell, that seemed invincible. Now that we see them all the time, and that the demons can be hurt and even killed (even temporarily), they seems less menacing.
@@NIHIL_EGO Hmm. I agree with your last point, but on a different sort of angle. Something that helped presentation in this series was making the angels and demons stand out via having the whole Enochian language thing. In this game, they just straight up all speak English. While it hasn’t happened before in series (Rodin’s a demon and he speaks English all the time), seeing it applied to all of the Infernals Bayo meets kind of makes things feel…more generic. I feel it would’ve been more impactful if they just had them stick to the Enochian language, and then in the rhythm boss fight with Baal’s true form, she speaks English. It’d pop out more, revealing an Infernal’s true form and then, “Surprise! Rodin’s not the only Infernal who can speak English!” It’s…minor, but still.
Though, about the menacing part…yeah, I admit I feel inclined to agree. The thing about the Infernals is that, well, they’re demons. They’re no one’s friends, and only aren’t an enemy if you’re not in their way. The closest to Bayo bonding with an Infernal is her relationship with Rodin, which works because the two have a professional, business-minded relationship, but they also show a lot of respect for one another.
Pretty much my same thoughts on Bayo 3 except for the new combo finishers, I like them, they're quick, flashy, hit hard and have good variety and utility.
The story is ok, I like seeing all the Bayos and I like Viola and her playstyle, the people hating her just need to learn to parry. I had the same issue with Viola charging attacks by mistake and it was on a DS4.
If it had a better camera, less annoying enemies and more encounters in general I'd say it's the best of the 3.
And yes, the weapon limit of 2 has always been criminal.
Couldn't agree more
Litterly watching everything wrong with Yu-Gi-Oh and then pop a legend post an video
A*
Played Bayonetta 1. Liked it but was very bad at it as i dont play many of that kind of games
Was happy to hear you mention the motorcycle and rocket sections taking too long. My biggest problem with that game was just as i started ti get into the flow I was being interupted by gimick or mini game sections
Play this 7 minute long , ball busting Afterburner mini-game. Now fight one of the hardest bosses of any action game. In a single mission with shared rankings
No, you don't get your health back, what are you, a pussy?
Watched it the entire way through, and now I want to say "thank you" as well on the ending bit on Bayonetta 2. As you could see by my last comment, i'm a very big fan of Soulstice and the potential it carries on top of the already laid fundaments -- warts and all.
I was willing to write down a lot of the positives on Soulstice for me personally to hopefully make you look a bit more favorably upon it than you might already do.
But the things you said at the end of the Bayonetta 2 segment made me smile. That you neither want people to completely take your opinion for fact and thus never actually try game for themselves, to form their own opinion.
Nor to disregard all that you have to say about a game from commendations to criticism and things in-between and beyond, relating to either the game in question or another one entirely.
For what it's worth, i still hope for a number of things;
that the video will bring forth more attention for the game itself;
that any feedback on the comments of that video may be interesting subject for discussion and consideration, for yourself and viewers;
and that Soulstice provided you with a good time and may do so again -hopefully more so- in the future (be it by replaying it, by playing a sequel or two, or both). And any other ambitious titles with heart to them that may come this world's way in the future.
Thank you for making this video, and wish you a lot of fun and good luck on any future projects. Videos or otherwise.
Soulstice rules.
That game has my favorite implementation of a DT mechanic… and I want that game to have a sequel bc I want to fight as the MCs final form
@@deadnalive9166 Heck yeah! Glad to see others who are fond of the game :)
I've rarely ever seen a similar thing to the Berserk/DT mechanic, for both the out-of-control version at low health, as well as how Lute's skill choices influence the finisher.
There's a lot to like about it, and I think it can be taken even further into interesting directions.
And like you said, the Saber form of Lute and Briar would be awesome to play as. For me, their Transcended form is a mix of beautiful and cool that surpasses Bayonetta.
(Heck, the creature design in general is awesome. And Jared and Jadon are up there with Agni and Rudra for entertaining twins bosses for me.)
If it's alright to ask, are there any other parts about Soulstice that stand out to you? Be they positively, negatively or something in-between?
I'm glad im not the only one who felt that for the second game. I was not a huge fan of umbran climax. I felt like my normal attacks were the basic handguns just building up meter to use umbran climax instead for damage.
Oh boy I can’t wait to play the third iteration in this series of character action games
Gimmick fight
Gimmick fight
Gimmick fight
Gimmick fight
Calling bayo 3 the DCEU is god damn genius
Bayonetta 3 feels like a result of it being an open world game in development. Which firstly, thank God it's not cause open world can go so wrong so easily.
But the same moves needing to be unlocked through multiple weapons and 3 different currencies feels like something you'd do if you need to add more content to fill out the open world
Here's of my flaws on the trilogy:
Bayonetta 1: The some of the enemies are lackluster into killing. I hate the fire covered angels and the fact I'd force myself to use Witch Time and counterattack, and the After Burner/Space Harrier stages including the Paradiso chapter are very lackluster imo, they felt more like filler levels rather than something to advance the gameplay and plot; but Bloody Fate gave After Burner aka Route 666 justice tho. And the fact Jubileus is a lackluster final boss, however I can take it over the False Savior in DMC4.
Bayonetta 2: Jeanne doesn't get love akin to the first game and was a damsel in distress so Bayo could save her without any partner battles for these awesome witch lesbians. And I agree with Umbral Climax and the antagonist, but I'll always take Demon Masquerade over Bayo 2's equivalent to DMC's Devil Trigger, while Loptr is forgettable even though the whole reason why Baldr became the villain of Bayo 1 was based on Norse Mythology, expanded in the third game.
Bayonetta 3: The framerate drops at times considering the size of the hardware/engine, unlike Bayo 1 and 2 since they run smoother with little to no framerate drops. Hellena Taylor didn't return especially via Bayo 3 spoilers which she denied offering, but Jennifer Hale at the very least tried her hardest to sound like the previous VA so she gets a pass. Viola's stages are a mixed bag, but we only got three including the last chapter and her theme reminds me of Nero's theme in DMC5. Lastly, the demon stages are slow and lacking, sure the Sin Gomorrah stage is attempting to feel exactly like an old fashioned kaiju flick, but that's just it, though the Queen Butterfly, Baal Zebul and as I call an upgraded Phantasmaranae "Purple Lava Spider" stages had much more finesse in their design.
That's about it. I'm excited for Bayonetta Origins and hope it succeeds with flying colors as it's previous three for how different the game is likewise.
Good video. It's a good example of why I consider this channel underrated. It's the same kind of blend of objectivity and personality that I love from SomeCallMeJohnny, another underrated UA-camr. Most online reviewers are either bland and really straightforward, or overly wacky for the sake of it, but you nail a really solid middle ground and it's painfully uncommon.
Cool and interesting review I found this channel from your yakuza 1 and 2 retrospectives I enjoy your videos
Blaming the switch limitations for Bayo 3's poor performance doesn't make any sense to me. Bayonetta 1 and 2 look AND play better than 3, and they're both on the switch as well. There are tons of better looking and running games perfectly optimized for the switch that are exclusive, platinum just dropped the ball with this one. It's probably because it was originally intended to be an open world game, so they accepted lesser performance from the get go, and just rolled with what they had initially made when the game was retooled to not be open world.
Correct
Not sure about that. Bayo 3 with demon slave and masquerade has way more going on for the switch to handle
I dunno about that. Though the previous games do look better, 3 has a lot more going on. There are a lot of models, destruction, physics, particles etc going on in certain sections that it really could be done better without the game playing at a way lower frame rate.
I have a feeling just having the same amount of detail as the other games, but the same amount of stuff on 3 would cause the game to chug. And it already chugs in the gimmick sections.
And before you point at mario oddysee, that game still has a lot less going on than bayo 3
They made the world to big. To many polygons
The switch sucks. Platinum couldn't reach its full potential with Bayo 3 because of it.
there was a moment where you mentioned how it can be hard to want to talk about something if you don't feel qualified enough
i've been stuck on certain projects because i felt like maybe i wasn't the right person to talk about
hearing someone else say that really helped me just start it again
One thing that completely struck me about 3 was how the animation quality was better than 2 and 1. Like Masquerade Attacks from Bayo's pistols would have Madama Butterfly flourish her hands as she punched something and retreated back. Here I was thinking that animation couldn't be any better.
But yeah, I agree with a lot of what you said on it. It really does feel like they had an idea and threw it in without thinking if it would actually glue nicely. Overall, I like Bayo 3, controversially more than 2 or 1 because I love using Demon Slave in conjunction with combos (and it's the 'easiest' of all three with the exception of Rodin's fight).
My main issue with Viola's new form is that I don't know what it's meant to signify. It just sort of comes out of nowhere and it feels like they just did it so they could pull a true Devil Trigger Nero like in 5.
The issue is that Nero in 5 getting DT is that it yields impact. It's a result of Nero's determination reaching its zenith. He refuses to allow Dante and Vergil kill each other and succumb to a fate where one kills the other. It comes with the fact that Nero finally realizes his connection to Dante, the Yamato, and his family. It gives him the push to realize his full strength that was being held back. Nero also had a whole game prior to 5 that established his character and developed him, making him a character that by the end of 5 made it feel like he earned the right to protect humanity while Dante and Vergil fought to once again separate the Human and Demon Realm.
I'm definitely gonna have to come back to the rest of this when I finally play Bayo 3. Love the video so far though. It is really making me want to jump back in on the other 2 games, especially since I haven't played Bayo 2 since I beat it on the WiiU.
Ay, you killed the haters with that beginning 😂 I been waiting for you to drop and you showed out. Great content brotha
The first game is still my favorite of the three.
Just started playing the first one and the combat is amazing. Right up there with DMC5 for me.
Another contributing factor to how the game feels like it skips over a lot of context is that YOU DON'T EVEN PLAY AS BAYONETTA FROM 1 OR 2! You play as past Cereza from 1, but that's only explained through her character design and in game files that you have to read.
Well, that's the take - SHE IS the original Bayonetta from 1 and 2, but there is also a timeline where only story of the 1 game happened and the timeline where only 1 and 2 games happened. Those two Cerezas are the closet to the original from 1, 2 and 3, but also had difference in their respective timeline (for example having Viola earlier).
That's also mean that story of 1 and 2 does not create alternative timelines - this is a time anomaly, where the story of the first game create a story from the second one and vise versa.
4:37-4:56 bang on sir. This remake fad we’re in right now is beyond a joke at this point. Dead Space and The Last of Us are some of my favorite titles, but jesus christ I am fine with replaying those original versions years later because, beyond holding up well, they are a part of the developer’s history and you can see how they improve with further IPs and sequels. I love replaying series like Metal Gear and Resident Evil for this very reason - it’s so cool to see gameplay and presentation evolve across *titles* and not just a single *title*
10:38 Hey, that's me!
Also, SUPER good video. Hitting the nail on the head as always.
Bayo 3 really does feel like a fork of Astral Chain
43:11 you get a chaos gear in Egypt in the gold and treasure stage, there's even an entire cutscene of her saying it was too easy to get it.
Shuraba is my favorite weapon from Bayonetta and I wish it would have become as iconic as the guns. Every sequel has some kind of sword but none of them feel as good as Shuraba
"[In Bayo 2] I got platinum by just spamming a weapon at a boss..."
Yep. In Bayo 1, your combo points would degrade after five hits unless you mixed in a Wicked Weave, so you couldn't spam one attack. In Bayo 3, you'd want to earn Improvisation multipliers by using every type of attack at least once (punch, kick, firearm, demon, and demon masquerade), and thus spamming one attack wouldn't be very efficient either.
But in Bayo 2, there are none of these rules. Just spam away with whatever works, and if they hate then let them hate and watch the halos pile up.
"In Bayo 1, your combo points would degrade after five hits unless you mixed in a Wicked Weave... But in Bayo 2, there are none of these rules..." -- that's completely wrong.
Bayo 2 has points degradation too. But it simply doesn't work in neither game because point degradation counter resets not only on Wicked Weaves but also on *any* special move and on *anything* player can do that is not a regular punch/kick: like successful Witch Time resets it, jumping on enemy resets it and so do dozens of other actions that all appear on scoreboard as "special bonus".
Points degradation system implemented like that simply doesn't matter in Bayonetta 1-2 no matter how you play it. The only way to only make it matter would be playing with Sai-Fung and that would be the only way where it begins to start to make the difference.
Oh and
"[In Bayo 2] I got platinum by just spamming a weapon at a boss..."
would be just as applicable to Bayonetta 1 since pickable angel weapons give HUGE points bonuses and raise multiplier.
Player can and should spam them while you can since they run out.
@@azekeprofit Whether or not it "worked" in your opinion, the fact remains that Bayo 1 had a system that caused your points to degrade if you didn't mix something special in between your normal attacks. And it's pretty significant: repeating normal punches and kicks will bring your combo points from 20-30 per hit down to 1 or 2 pretty quickly.
As far as I know (and as far as my sources and personal experience have shown), Bayo 2 does not have a point degradation system for combos. Your punches and kicks will earn the same baseline number of points regardless of whether you mix in special attacks.
Thus, a 15-hit combo with just normal attacks in Bayo 1 would be worth maybe 126 points, but in Bayo 2 would be worth roughly 300, a gap that grows exponentially as the combos get longer. That's pretty significant.
In addition, Bayo 2 retains Bayo 1's multipliers for Witch Time, enraged enemies, and angel/demon weapons, and those multipliers expand the gap even further. However, one distinction is that Bayonetta 1 gave you bigger bonuses for hitting multiple enemies with Wicked Weaves, while Bayo 2 did not (which is fair, because Bayo 2's Wicked Weaves were generally much bigger and easier to land on crowds than Bayo 1's).
In any case, perhaps with your style of play (using varied combos and tactics), you would never notice these distinctions. And indeed, I never noticed myself until I read the wiki years ago. But if someone were to play like a scrub and just mash X all day, they'd definitely get better results in Bayo 2.
But maybe I missed something all these years, so if there's a system of diminishing returns in Bayo 2's combo counter, I'd love to hear about it.
As for Angel/Demon Weapons, yes you can use them without point degradation, because they are special expendable weapons. They're literally just a burst of damage and points in limited scenarios, not something you can do endlessly on a whim.
@@Tenchigumi I didn't mean that points degradation doesn't "work" in subjective opinionated sense -- i meant it simply did not work. Mechanically.
"If there's a combo point degradation system in Bayo 2, please describe it." -- you already described it: "your combo points would degrade after five hits unless you mixed in a Wicked Weave". I just launched Bayo 2 and witnessed the same points degradation of punches and kicks going from 20 to 15 and lower.
However because the mere idea of points degradation implemented like that is deeply flawed i had to go out of my way not dodge, not to jump, not to do any of the special moves and just press punch which is harder than it sounds.
@@azekeprofit I think you've misunderstood what we mean by point degradation. Every attack has a baseline value. For example, with Shuraba's punch combo, the first few punches are worth 20 points each, but the rapid stabs at the end are worth roughly 1.66 points each (the points value for barrage attacks are weird). That's not point degradation: those are the baseline values of each attack.
Now in Bayo 1, if you only did Shuraba's first punch repeatedly in one combo, the point values would be: 20-20-20-20-20-16-12-8-4-1-1-1. As you can see, after the fifth hit, the points degrade in value until they are only one point per hit. If you land a Wicked Weave, the degradation would reset, and the punches would once again be worth 20 points each.
However in Bayo 2, if you only did Shuraba's first punch repeatedly in one combo, the point value would ALWAYS be 20 points per hit; there is no degradation. As for you example (which I assume was with Love is Blue or Scarborough Fair), you "witnessed the same points degradation of punches and kicks going from 20 to15 and lower." However, what you actually saw were normal kicks being worth 20 points, normal punches being worth 15 points, and gunfire being worth around 4.4 points a shot (usually in bursts of three or four). Those were the minimum values for those respective attacks, and if anything, you'd see them get _larger_ with Witch Time and Enrage multipliers. They don't degrade.
Regardless, I'm not sure I understand what you meant by it "simply not working mechanically." There's no reason not to dodge (that's what dodge offset is for), jump (you can do Wicked Weaves and Torture Attacks in midair), or avoid special moves (I mean... that's how you reset the degradation).
it might be placebo but I think its worth mentioning that the Xbox 360 version of Bayonetta seems to be much more colorful than the other versions for whatever reason
One will always be my Bay.
2:30 minutes in and as someone who doesn't care about Bayonetta as a character too much but is interested in learning about mechanics of these types of games:
THANK YOU SO INCREDIBLY MUCH for knowing of, and looking deeper into, Soulstice! It's presumptous for me to thank you without even knowing if your opinions on it, in broad strokes, will be positive or negative, but it's a game that I do feel has a *lot* going for it and deserves more attention. It hasn't had a lot of coverage, but your videos go about analysis and explaining stuff about it in a nice way. And I dearly hope that Soulstice is a game that sticks with you in a positive way-- perhaps even one that you love, warts and all.
And that a possible sequel (or two) may be able to elicit the same feelings for you, other Soulstice fans, and fans of these types of games as a whole.
Man! I worked as QA on that game and I fckn hate it. So much wasted potential due to very poor design decisions and an absolute garbage of a plot. Tries to be mature but somehow ends up being a 10 year old child's version of edgy instead of having any substance. Surprised to see it has an audience if I'm being frank.
@@dedicateddark
Sorry to hear the game leaves a bad taste in your mouth. There's definitely a decently-sized fanbase, and last week an update was released that adds an extra combat option after beating chapter 23.
I'm aware Soulstice is flawed on various points, but for me it also hits a lot of right notes, and i found the characters and story to be quite on the positive side.
General throughline of "save the world" is quite basic, but it's the closer-up things about the characters we learn about that really makes it stick for me and a good number of others. Lute and Briar may generally be mainly Sweet Girl and Snark Knight, but i honestly believe that the relationship between the two, and how that is shown makes them more than the sum of their parts.
Kind of like a Transcended.
Art direction for the characters (especially the Transcended) are awesome for me too. Voice acting can have odd inflections, but i don't hate it (though Armina was definitely the weakest)-- it can even have some charm throughout it.
The VA for Dugal and Demian *especially* gave it his all. Love that guy's performances.
There's nice lore for the world, as supplied by Layton, to give the idea of more than what we get to see. I generally like the writing.
Also, a *lot* of weapons and combat options! Big fan of all the different uses they can have compared to one another. The Unity mechanic is cool too, it's like a Special Meter mixed with a DMC Style Meter.
(though in more hectic battles, it gets difficult to keep it up).
Things i will agree on taking away from the fun, were among others some annoying enemy designs. On the Steam forums i've set up a discussion thread on Best, Worst and Most Interesting parts for enemies.
(The Abominations really live up to their name, but i suppose i don't need to tell you that)
Camera Angles i didn't mind *too* much, but i see the issue there. Game's rather dragged out with levels, and bosses like the Weavers and Armina have their own annoying things.
The Field System is something... eeehhh. On my first playthrough i didn't mind it too much either, on my Very Hard playthrough it felt at its worst, especially with the new enemy encounters and mix-ups.
But I *do* find it interesting how the Overcharge mechanic can be mitigated and actually be weaponized using Lute's skill tree. There are so many options and customization, in part thanks to getting "refunds" for skills, that i can imagine there being certain "builds" for how Lute and her abilities act.
I can definitely imagine Lute's side of things and the Evocation/Banishment fields mechanic being much more complicating than necessary, though.
I've been listing my own ups and downs with Soulstice, but if i may ask, what are things that you would have liked to have changed about the game, in regards to design decisions and plot?
I remember getting the platinum trophy for Bayonetta 1 and I think this was the most fun I ever had with an action game
Bayonetta 3 has what could be one of my favourite mechanics in any game, and that is the ability to queue up demon slave attacks so you can still attack while the demon is attacking, it adds so much expression and depth to it. it just stinks the enemy design isnt up to snuff to support these mechanics
I will recite this entire video when asked my thoughts on the Bayonetta series
Great stuff! It was cool hearing some more obscure thoughts that I've also had about this game, as I've had yet to hear them in any other in-depth review.
...I'm actually in the middle of editing my own critique on this game with a lot of these similar niche points, so hopefully it doesn't appear that I'm just copying what you've said in this video. I swear it's just a coincidence!
Didn't Bayo 3 end up getting reworked? Was suppose to be open world, because I guess nobody told Platinum the switch is a toaster. That would explain why it seems like it's only about 85% done. Feels bad that the games have been on a slide after Bayo 1.
Welcome back love your honest game reviews
Who let Ninja Gaiden 3's main villain in Bayo 3?
Well for me, While I don't mind them pushing Bayonetta as Viola's mother narrative, but it was abrupt and no build up. Also It would have made more sense if Luka was a Lumen which allowed Viola to be a mini Jubileus which at least allows the transformation gimic.
OG Bayonetta did set a high bar of Strong Woman Character so its hard to top in in future games
The way you describe Bayo 3 really reminded me of Kh 3 in weird way
So I scrolled through the comments to check first but you are half right on the purpose of the bow in 2. On Infinite Climax mode it is a useful secondary set weapon for it's two main properties.
Each arrow inflicts a small amount of poison damage. And more importantly they also home in on enemies and bosses, allowing you to interact with enemies that need witch time to hit.
Which is really only there to fix a problem they made in the game design. Honestly I think if we get Tag Climax or another mode that just lets us fight a randomized assortment of enemies, three would become my favorite.
I wish bayo 2 had an item with this gimmick: Makes your weapons more powerful (like they used to be in bayo 1) but you lose the ability to use umbran climax.
That would've solved the biggest problem in bayo 2, at least in my opinion.
The combat in bayo 3 is fine, as long as we are talking about bayo's core combat, I hated the jeanne sections, viola's chapters, the puzzles and mini games because I'm here to play bayonetta, not for additions which the game would be a thousand times better without. Also, the story this time had to be the worst in the series, and with difference, they made the first 12 chapters a non ending cycle of meeting new bayonetta, see bayonetta die, loop weapon. Repeat, Taking luka seriously as a character was cringe, they took bayonetta's charm and charisma as a character and replaced her for a tropy, boring and mute version of her, and the story in general was just boring and uninteresting the moment you realized you were doing the same thing over and over just in different universes. And the worst part (but best in retrospective because they didn't involve the bayo I loved in this mess) is the fact that we were never playing as the bayonetta from the first two games, but just another bayonetta in the multiverse, a grown up version of the cerezita bayonetta meet in bayo 1 to be precise.
Last thing, Adding the cancelled "scalebound" mechanics into bayonetta was a mistake, Demon slave in the main reason why the characters look tiny in almost every scenario, the game is made with the intention of always summoning a kaiju next to you. The best things in the game were the witch time, colour my world and the spider weapon.
Those yoyos are busted
I always save your videos for special occasion because of how good and far between they are love your stuff
I disagree with the "needing" to learn from some place else the finner details of the mechanics, action games like Bayo and DMC are not that far away from how fighting games works and testing stuff is very similar, so, if you are familiar with labbing on fighting games and finding stuff that way then figuring stuff out on Bayo feels familiar. The fact that DMCV and Bayo 3 finally have traninig modes helps a lot too.
That’s a major point of that section that unless you know how to get the most out of labbing these things are worthless to some players. I’d argue that fighting games also often do a terrible job of teaching you things despite having a training mode and trials. Some people need to be shown and told what to do because they don’t know how to come to conclusions and dig for information themselves.
I blame Nier Automata for Platinum's "homogonization" of their games. It feels like they've been trying to chase that high since it came out. I can't blame them at all for it because Automata is by far their most successful title (financially), and passion doesn't always pay the mortgage. So after a while, unless you're the trust fund baby of a billionaire, you have to at times chase after what keeps the lights on.
And it seems like Platinumgames have been struggling to do so in ways due to the decisions (and results) that they have been making as of recently.
tfw DMC3 Switch Edition has a weapon wheel, while both DMC5 and Bayonetta 3 restrict you to either cycle through all the weapons or limit you to two altogether.
Really vibe with the way you approached issues like skill level, folks taking your opinion as god's words type of shit. It was very insightful and helped to make this stand out from other reviews of the franchise !
37:05 I definitely heard it there, it’s just super quiet
34:45 SAME! I adore the takemikazuchi hammer from bayo 2 but the removal of leg weapons in 3 makes both the g pillar and cassiopeia feel unviable
I Held off from this video until I completed Bayo 3 today, and everything you pointed out was how I feel about the series as a whole, both good and bad.
I absolutely love Bayonetta as the series is right now and i'm happy with the fact these games exist, even if it is the switch but how we got to the thirds' ending left a massive question mark in my brain; especially how the stakes were always shown to be galactically catastrophic... But not being able to save any of the Bayos, Jeanne being done dirty at every fucking turn when she was literally the skill bar in the first game (God her boss fights were the best) and the final thing we see of Luka and Cerezas' relationship all feels... Muddy.
I can't even talk about Viola and her little secret because WE AS THE AUDIENCE ARE THE ONLY ONES WHO KNOW, Luka knows with the flower language hints in the cutscenes and when he says "I'll always love you both" But Cereza has No fucking clue, why!? It would have been entertaining as hell, shit the game could've thrown a post-pregnancy body positivity image type of message but none of it ever gets explained? We see the ending we got in Bayo 3 and it begs how Viola even *exists* at this point.
If Luka had these powers his whole life, why was none of it explained or even hinted at in the last two games... like him being somewhat mentally unstable (Not outright insane but more doubtful, distrusting, fixated, almost obsessed) after literally seeing his father get murdered and realising he loves the woman who he blamed his whole life growing up for said Fathers' death would've been a better route to go for his strider side as opposed to "He be wolf man".
And then, The gameplay... 2 weapon restriction on the 1st 2 games i have to somewhat disagree with because you can mix and match your feet and hands and in B2 some weapons are hands only, so you can get creative and I don't understand why it is limited in B3 for us to have the Demon Masquerade, i think you explained it best where the DM would correlate with the weapon in the hands.. The demon controlling is a great mechanic and using them as enders and counters feels like how Bayo would actually fight the larger enemies and I hope they keep this mechanic for future games but I would also like my Torture attacks and Umbran climax back also...
Bayo 1, 2 & 3 need to come out with the more powerful consoles, Hell i'd take a Bayo 1 remake that runs on the REengine and looks hyper-realistic...
It's upsetting that a game is so dear to me get hate for certain things that it really shouldn't do and again it feels like an injustice these games aren't running at performance levels so high it makes heads explode and mouths drown but damn... Bayonetta as a franchise and as a character role model deserved a better ending before passing the torch.
Bayonetta 3 is the worst thing to happen to a franchise since The Last Jedi.
Wonderful 101 still 🐐
Anyway, Cvit, you are one of the best video game content creators on UA-cam! Keep going!
Bayo 3's finale just feel soooooo long and forced. Like it keeps doing the shonen escalation of over the top finishers on him but he just keeps no selling it to the point of when he does get killed it feels wrong. Like the full force of the bayonetta army couldn't kill him, fused bayonetta couldn't kill him, Viola finally stabbing him doesn't kill him, but team attack with luka does now? Its like if at the end of the Freiza arc Goku had his full emotional super saiyen transformation, got beat, went super saiyen 2, got beat again, and then beat him with kaiyoken with super saiyen vegeta and then they died after.
Not to mention it sucks that that bland goo man is supposed to be Bayonetta's end, what makes him so much better then Jubileus and Aesir? Only thing we get is "cuz multiversal energy" which at least to me doesn't really feel as big as creator of the universe type stuff from Bayo 1 & 2.
1:57 I love when people use dramatic formulations like that
another w review, thanks cvit
Yay your back, after 2 months. Glad to see your still doing well.
Still need to start Bayo 3. Will be back
The new joycons have small sponges that actually reduce drift. I got a pair in early 2021 and they are still working great.
Bayo 3 also really needs some more outfits to unlock. There's only like 5. Bayo 1 had at least twice the amount with different outfits ranging from alternative costumes from points of the story, to just fun little costumes and of course sex appeal fan service costumes
Bayo 1 really does have the only good (or good-adjacent) story of the three and this is a take I don't see often enough.
Funny I recently started rewatching a bunch of videos you’ve posted in the past and the next day u upload after 3 months lol
Play Astral Chain
Edit: Wait you played Astral Chain... Then do a video if you haven't.
The unlocks giving me kiwami vibes
I have to say, this video articulates so much about why I say this series is 1>3>2 that I haven't really been able to. I agree with basically every point, even ones that didn't really come to me consciously like the sound design and Panther momentum. It's actually really nice to see that I'm not alone here, since I've seen a whole lot of people say 2 is the best or 3 is the worst, and while I think all three games are great I just can't agree with them. Only things I would have to say I don't agree with are on the heavy weapons (Takemikazuchi, Dead End Express, and Cassiopoea are great even if I totally agree about Cavaliere) and how I think 2 easily had the best story outside of Luka's role being superfluous.
I would love to hear your thoughts on the patch that buffed Viola & gave the heavy weapons PKP Winks, as well as Bayo Origins in general. I'm really interested in the latter since it has a first time director who was inspired to move to Japan for game dev after playing Bayo 1.
As much as I love bayo 2: It felt like an over correction of how badly they were tripping in 1. I also love 1. 3's primary L was the story, being repetitive until the end where it just flat out didn't make sense, and the passing of the torch which sucks because I love viola as a character. But that's gonna put a target in her for unnecessary hate.
3 the game is an Improvement, 3 the story is abysmal and I'd rather deal with another Luka than what we got
Accepting that you suck and prioritizing having fun is the way
The thing that baffles me about the graphics and framerate is that Bayo 1 and 2, which were made for consoles that are not the Switch, runs better than the Switch exclusive Bayo 3. Also I am often reluctant to blame the Switch for low framerates for exclusives when so many graphically demanding games somehow was ported to the system.
2 things regarding Summons and innertia.
if you learn to use flash slave to queue and activate the summons instead of keeping the button pressed it feels more like an evolution of weaves than how Astral Chain controls, it mostly servers as a mechanic to launch big enemies that used to be tethered to the floor or only launchable with a weave during witch time.
Regarding interntia, you can sustain it after web swing and the g pilar launch by just reserving your second jump instead of using your hold jump skill at the end and then use your air dodge on the air.
Maybe one of the problems with people not figuring this basic shit out is how stuck they get to what it used to work instead of testing it out.
Bayo 1= Amazeballzz! Great mechanics/cheeky- once you "get it," you're having a ball. 200 hours.
-Bayo 2 = Yup. Still fun 130 hours
-Bayo 3 = WTF is this stripped down sh**!?? 15 hours. BORED A.F.....returned.😡
dude i was just struggling my brain trying to remember the name of Soulstice lmao. thank you for that!
For all its shortcomings and strange parts, it's a game worth acknowledging and looking at what it has to offer.
I'm probably one of the biggest fans of the game around, and I do love it-- and sincerely hope that the devs will be able to gain support to make the current game better, craft an even better sequel (or more), and be able to make other cool games.
Good vid! Personally enjoyed the game a bunch but I got reeeeealy annoyed at the cutscenes. They felt too long and kept me thinking "why can't i do the fighting in the cutscene and actually play the game instead of watching this"
Honestly, Bayo 3 is the best just from the combat alone.
Not with demon slave
@@dc7981 Including Demon Slave.
It's fun af to use against bigger enemies.
Your criticism towards every game hurt as a huge fan but I’m objective and I agree with some of them. Bayo2 is my favorite & I actually think the save Jeanne from hell story is epic. When it runs at the 60fps it’s supposed to, it’s the best Bayo hands down, graphically, technically and I enjoy Umbra Climax. Is it the easiest? Absolutely.
As for Bayo3, it’s the best in terms of gameplay for me. Sure, they removed some things but it has the most options and customizations. Does it always work? Nah. And I hate the story I really do. The ending broke my heart. Bayo is supposed to be strong. Making her as fragile as they presented was heartbreaking. A fallen icon for no reason. Then to kill her off? Brutal. I’ll never understand why they did this.
I think Bayo4 could be really dope if it was about Bayo climbing out of hell or dammit, just make Bayo3 all a complete dream 🤣🤣🤣
*sees you made Metal Arms Glitch in The System*
*Interested into your channel and your voice*
*Goes through each video*
*listens to the whole beyonetta video, gets to the end*
*Constantly does "The Rock" Head Nod*
*Hears you doing an Armored Core Video*
*Eye Brow Rised, stops what I'm doing in real life and does the Pog face while gasping*
Question is the Armored Core Video Very long and covers all games or is it slightly long and covers each game or gen
If you're doing the Each Game at a time in separate videos, may you please give me the Patreon Shout out on Silent Line?
if it's about each gen videos could I get a shout out on the 3rd gen video?
If it's the entirety of Armored Core,
May you please save my shout out until you do an Armored Core Video?
12:18 Actually hitting enemies with dropped weapons gives many more points than regular attacks in any game, certainly in Bayo 1. 'Pure' rating is for getting no damage. And this 'problem' is present in any game -- it's very easy to get the highest rating in a verse with a couple or three basic enemies.
Whoa new video! Happy holidays sir! 👽💜🎄🥷
It’s funny that you mention not knowing things like dodge offset. I feel you man. I am not one for secrets. I just think it’s funny especially when I have been a fan of Matthew mattosis who loves secrets and finding!
Bayonetta 3 was embarrassing.
This was not worth the wait.
I assume Bayo 3 made lock on the right stick is cause of Viola with the parry mechanic taking a button. But with the dodge for her being useless, I just wonder on why they didn't just have parry replace the dodge button for Viola. It's another strange decision of Platinum's. Cause right stick click for lock will always feel clunky to me
I think it's because the double tapping the dodge button also functions as her run button (which effectively replaces dodging as her main repositioning tool), a command that's a bit harder to shift around than the lock-on.
@@Tenchigumi in this case, maybe left stick click would be better? But I do think if this was included, button remapping should be here. God I hate when games don't have it. It's like the bare minimum way to make a game more accessible
@@teneesh3376 Considering that double-tapping dodge is also used as Bayo's "transform into high speed animal/demon masquerade" button as well, I imagine that L3 could also be an awkward shift for some folks (especially those who tense up and press L3 by accident, as Woolie of SBFP was notorious for).
That said, I agree that they should just let us figure out our own button schemes. I can see how games with modifier buttons (like Bayo and Astral Chain) can get confusing when freely mapped, but Nioh also has modifier buttons (and a MUCH larger set of inputs) yet allows for free customization, so there's no excuse.
Though I strongly disagree with your thoughts on the pro controller (it’s probably my favorite modern controller), I agree that mapping those actions to the thumb stick click was a huge mistake. Nintendo franchises seem to be terrible at implementing control options, and I’ve never felt it worse than in this game
Yeah, I was literally holding one in my hand as he was saying that and was so utterly perplexed at him saying that it felt cheap and flimsy. Like, I literally tried to bend it in my hands and the thing is rock solid.
Ah, a based 101 enjoyer 💕
So many good takes, I‘d say you know what you are talking about and are most definitely „qualified“.
1:45 Has anyone told him there's Platinum trophies and Platinum no hit trophies?
Bold to assume that he's actually that dedicated to actually go for the platinum trophy
26:41 "I do not understand why locking on was separated from RB" -- that's because lock-on mechanic in all Bayonetta games can be done without pressing RB. And really that's how it should be done -- because this way is objectively simpler, better and easier for you own hands in the long run.
From the very first footage even before you showed your controller inputs i could see you're constantly clutching manual lock-on button. One can play like that but that is simply inefficient because holding your punch/kick buttons also makes lock-on stick -- and one should be doing this anyways for a number of other Bayonetta mechanics to start clicking in place.
And if you want to make Space Harrier level from Bayo 1 easier for yourself -- don't use barrel roll dodge. There is no need to use it. At all. If you just keep going in circles no bullet will reach you.
Viola's charging definitely feels too eager to activate, and making sure to tap her moves also improved my gameplay. I think a lot of hate directed at her combat comes from that alone -- especially after playing Bayonetta who encourages holding buttons. Game outputting charging hits instead of regular hit affects her parry move which i suspect where a lot of complaints about hard parry come from.
46:23 "obviously Luka was not going to die but game treats it as such" absolutely correct criticism but Bayonetta 1 does this too and more often. Luka "dies" like three times, Jeanne "dies" twice, Bayo herself also "dies". Apparently, Kamiya got the idea for this "i actually did not die, haha!" gimmick from Mark Wahlberg movie "Big Hit" - a factoid i learned from watching his Let's Play of Bayonetta -- which is also where i learned what the fuck was going on in the 1st game since i definitely didn't understand it by just playing.
I couldn't even beat Bayonetta 3 I was so letdown.
"For a game that wants to pass the torch you'd think Viola would have more than 3 levels"
Oh good god no! She is so much more boring to play, and I hate how you are forced to play as her for those 3 levels. They may as well not exist on replay.
bayonetta 3 is just a lot of fun ideas and lore points which is good but its execution is like a bad mod to a game, its a shame it didn't get to be as good as it should have been, to be honest it should have had longer to be made or a more unified idea of what is was by the devs
I agree with some of your criticisms but I think you leaned way too much into negativity with 3. If you explicitly didn't say otherwise, I'd think that you enjoyed 2 more.
I played Ninja Gaiden Black a couple of years ago for the first time when it was on game pass and after playing it I fell in love with the genre, DMC etc. but the one series I haven't tried is Bayonetta, my big brother says that I should play them but I never got to it for some reason.
Personally I didn't feel the first playthrough does Bayonetta any favors. It wasn't until the third playthrough after I memorized the qtes and when they pop up did I actually enjoy it. It's an incredibly fun game but those boss fights and QTE due to poor direction is frustrating.
But perservere and you'll be rewarded with an awesome combat system and ps2 levels of secrets and unlockables.