Yeah I’m not sure why nobody else talks about it, but I’m glad I was able to help! Like I said, once I realized that, it made the biggest difference for me in my loaves
I have been suffering from loaves with poor spring. No real ears yet. Hoping that not fermenting for the recommended 4.5 hrs helps. However I like the flavour of an unbleached bread flour sourdough best. Any tips on modifying recipe for a less thirsty dough? Nearly all recipes have whole wheat percentages and it affects how wet the dough is when I dont use whole wheat.
Yeah I think that'll help! As far as the flour, I would start with a lower hydration since bread flour is generally less thirsty than whole wheat, and gradually increase the hydration as necessary. You could also try different brands of bread flour if you're not getting the desired result with the current brand you're using since they're all slightly different.
Can you prepper bread dough in the evening and bake it first thing in the morning? Is it possible and haw should it be done ? Should you add additional east in the morning?
@@gancarzpl its possible. I recomend you to make bread in a single day at weekends to get used to the process. Then you will be able to adjust the process by yourself.
@@gancarzpl don’t add anything to the bread after bulk fermentation has ended, it will degas it; that is, remove the air bubbles and thus making in flat. If you want to let it rest overnight to bake in the morning, you might need to put it on the fridge so it doesn’t overproof.
the thing about not over-fermenting is super helpful! i also like to keep a spray bottle with just plain water in it on hand, and spray the top of the loaf right before closing the dutch oven. it just adds a little extra water that will quickly turn into steam, and it works if you spray your loaf on a baking tray too!
Guilty: over-shaping, over-proofing, and over-thinking it! Thanks for these practical, clear, concise, understandable, no-nerdy tips. Applying them now.
Really amazing video and explanations! I just love when people actually explain the details of why and how something happens, so I can actually understand what's going on. Good job, keep it up!
One extra point: oven temperature. Which depends on the oven. Recipes often tell bakers to put the oven temperature at as hot as possible 475-500° to get that spring. But my oven is very small, heat coming only from the bottom. Given the tight space and heat source, the Dutch oven got too hot, stopping the dough’s rise prematurely, and giving me saucer shaped loaves over and over again. Once I turned it down to 450° my loaves started popping up nicely and reliably. All of which is to say, if a baker follows all these key points and still gets a flat loaf, they should experiment with oven temp. Depending on the oven-large/small, convection/fan/gas only etc.-they may need to up the temp or lower it.
@@mdahsenmirza2536 😄 Oh, dear! But have you checked with an oven thermometer? You never know for sure if the oven temp matches the "dial" until you check with an oven thermometer.
Great video! It totally went too long with my last bulk ferment. It was So tempting to just let those bubbles keeping coming up and the dough was so fluffy! Then I did a 12 hour cold proof! Ugh. Even though the loaf tasted great, it got half the rise in the oven than usual and of course, struggled to get brown enough. Learning!! Thank you for your excellent presentation and amazingly helpful tips!!
"Hello, my name is John, and I am an over proofer." It all started pretty innocently. I thought that if 3 hours of fermentation would produce such great flavors then 5 hours would be even better. Before long things got out of control and I found myself proofing for 8 hours. It interfered with my work. My family became unhappy with my flat loaves and before long I was forced to move out. Now I am putting my life back together and I have not over proofed for 52 days now.
Am a newbie at Sourdough baking. Charlie you have explained all the issues of SB and I am so grateful. Will definitely follow all your tips given. Thank you so much. Thank you so much.
You are literally the clearest, straight to the point guy and that is exactly what i need! This was incredibly informative... even if the main thing i took was i need better technique 🙈. Subscriber made here 👍🏻
THANK YOU - I've been having tons of trouble and realize now that I've been over-fermenting my dough. I've been feeling so frustrated and had been completely misdiagnosing the problem up until now!
Thank you so much for the tips. Your first minute of this video explains exactly what was my weekend. Yesterday a baked my first sourdough bread and the result was like the flaten bread of the thumbnail. At least the taste is really good. Cheers from Brazil.
Not letting your dough ferment for too long is a very interesting tip. I may be guilty of that, I'll try a shorter bulk ferment and see if my loaves get a bit rounder! Thanks!
Wonderful video! Another point - If you don't use a dutch oven, at least bake it on a preheated baking stone/steel/cast iron skillet together. This allows heat transfer directly from the stone/steel to the bread. As a result, the inside of the dough increases in temperature faster before the crust is formed on the outside.
Great job on this straight-forward video, and I agree! All stuff that I unfortunately learned the hard way! The one that took me the longest to learn? Stop using a "sharp knife" and only use a razor blade for scoring. And don't be scared to go deep. I was just barely scratching the surface. constructive criticisms: 1. If you're gonna tell people to make one smooth, swift motion for scoring... then stop sawing! One top is to dip the blade in water (or even oil) to keep it from hanging up. 2. When showing the problem shaped-loaf with the good one, show things for a few more seconds in comparison so folks can see what is going on. Not all that obvious on the screen, and the "bad" one is panned off before we know what to look for. 3. Nice large work surface... barely big enough! But most troublesome is to have it move around on you. :-) Put a damp towel under it or clamp it down. Question for you: For efficiency and home-heating reasons (it is over 100ºF here today!) I have been attracted to the "cold start" process, and I'd like to learn of others experience with this. Do you have any? I no longer pre-heat my oven or the cast iron. Everything goes in at room temp, and the timer is started with everything off. Set to 450º and 30 minutes. Then the lid comes off for another 25 minutes. I believe this actually gives MORE oven spring spring since the yeast isn't killed as quickly. The trick.... what temp should the dough be.... assuming that it has been retarded in the fridge for the final rise. Something I'm playing with. Getting great results though, and I'd like to see more people doing cold start.
I’ve been troubleshooting my lack of oven spring for a while. I feel like I do everything here, with the exception of the bulk fermentation. Maybe I’m going too long! I usually do a 10-12 hour overnight bulk rise, which results in the dough doubling in volume. At this point, as you mentioned, the dough is more wet and sticky. I’d been trying to combat this issue by dropping the hydration, thinking my hydration was too high and making things sticky. But I didn’t think about the dough getting stickier and wetter as the bulk fermentation progresses. I will give this a try! I didn’t think a 20-30% increase in volume was enough!
If you're over fermenting during the BF stage, several things you can do. This is not a hydration issue. You can over ferment at 68% or 80%. First, high overnight temps will cause dough to over ferment. Also, large amounts of starter will cause it as they become extremely active. Remember, when you make your dough, you are super feeding your starter. After autloyse, the starches have been broken down into sucrose and maltose. These are simple sugars that the yeast can feed on. The easiest way to prevent over fermentation is to change your timing. Switch to daytime instead of overnight. This way, you can monitor the fermentation. The other way is to reduce the amount of starter you are using. You can use as little as 25g of starter and still have a successful loaf. Hope this helps.
most flours, except arrowhead mills bread flour (that I have found), add amylase enzyme short circuiting the natural release of sugars and destroying the gluten structure. the problem is with the gluten.
If you are using a lower hydration starter it won't pass the "float test" but will still create a great oven spring. Fermentation which I believe is about 90% of creating oven spring is about the interaction of Time and Temperature. You can't rely on one without considering the other in my experience. Thanks for your videos of baking and cooking.
So grateful I found your video. This time around I think I over fermented the bulk rise. I was told it should double in size. That took about 4 hours and then I noticed the dough was soft and kind of wet. Uggh.
Thanks for the info, love your vids. An additional one that I have experienced two times now is changing your starter flower. I have a 50-50 mix and when I change one part, the starter still doubles in size but you can simply seee its less active and thus yields flat breads with mega holes and tunnels. Frustrating, though upon changing starter content, allow for some time to build actual rise power again.
First, and totally off subject, you remind me of Noah Nicholas Reid from "Schitt's Creek" and, second, thank you SO much for relieving some of the trial and error in my new bread-baking hobby. My 50/50 organic rye/all-purpose flour sour dough starter is ready today, incredibly active (my house is on well water .. no chlorine or fluoride) and you have already saved me a couple potential errors. I made a yeast dough that I let cold ferment for seven days before baking it, last night, and it tasted wonderful but it was shaped like a 1950s sci-fi spaceship. I'll be using my new starter tomorrow, utilizing a couple of these techniques I did not pay attention to until seeing your video. Thank you!
curious i am on well water as well and have been having more success than friend in no knead bread. I thought it was my skill at doing nothing. Still on white flower. 40 years ago tried whole wheat. it did not go well.
@@jimandrews8528 Oh, I have no proof that well water is the key. Mary (from Mary's Nest) put it in my head and I've seen a few other instructional videos in which it's been suggested to set the water out for a couple hours to let the chlorine "evaporate" out of it ... if the viewer wasn't using bottled purified or spring water. Instinctually it sounds right, to me.
Even if you're using cold you shouldn't let your dough 7 days in the firdge. Unless it's a technique with very very few yeast and in this case I'm not aware, but even when working with cold you usually don't let fermentation for more than 1 day.
Your dough is so moist and wobbly! Is that a high gluten flour? I use 100% whole wheat so maybe mine will never get like that? My bulk rise is super dense. Or I’m just doing it wrong!
Yeah, it's a high gluten bread flour at about 77% hydration. You're right, whole wheat tends to absorb a lot more water than white flour, so I typically go up to like 90-95% when I'm using that. So maybe try upping the hydration if yours seems to dense, and that should help!
Thank you for this easy-to-understand, practical information. I have been baking sourdough bread for a couple of months and with all the reading and video watching nowhere was I made to understand that time to bake with my starter was at that particular point in time and could be up to up to 12 hours after refreshing.
Thanks for this! I was having hit or miss successes with my oven spring despite a vigorous starter, and I realize I was adding it at the wrong point and probably letting the bulk fermentation go on too long. Been getting a nice crust thanks to diastatic malt powder though, so very excited to keep experimenting :)
Great tips thanks. My starter, Winston, is a champ and very strong. Like many, I am plagued with weak oven spring on some loaves. I have made 8 loaves with only 2 worthy of being gifted (I have to be proud of my gift), all are delicious though. I live in Phoenix, AZ and right now my kitchen varies from 79 to 81. This is probably accelerating the fermentation process. My last loaf, Saturday, I only let it ferment 4 hours and again not impressed with the oven spring. When I score the loaf using a brand new razor blade I am not getting a solid cut, it seems the dough is loose. Is this a symptom of over fermenting?
Thanks for the ideas to help oven spring. Will be considering all of them my next baking day. Just a tip--If you would slow down your delivery, it would help us jotting down notes.
I don't have a dutch oven, but on Ciabbata bread, I steam by heating a cake pan while preheating and throwing in 5 ice cubes when I put on my bread. Seems like perfect amount.
Thanks for your video. I learnt so much from it and l am guilty for leaving bulk fermentation too long. Trying to do mine i. Barby as we are on the road fulltime and ldont have an oven in my van
@@TheRegularChef Not quite sure since there is just SO much one can do wrong. I think I was over-fermenting heavily and also not putting enough tension on my dough ball.
Your videos are really informative! But what about sourdough baking without wheat flour? Have you tried baking sourdough with spelt or rye only or a mix of them and other old flours? This is a whole other sphere. Would love to see some videos about that! :)
Thanks! Yeah I definitely want to explore that more in future videos. I incorporated a bit of spelt/einkorn into my 100% whole wheat sourdough recipe, but I haven't tried a bread using only those grains.
#6. Don't think you can just use any old all purpose flour instead of bread flour. The protein content of all purpose flour is generally too low (at the very least too inconsistent) to get good consistent results. In a pinch when I don't have proper bread flour I add about .2% gluten flour to my all purpose flour (20g red mill gluten flour to 1000g total flour) to make up for some of the protein loss. I struggled with all purpose flour for almost a year before considering that all flours truly aren't equal.
Great now this video make me hungrey kek! The good crunchy taste and especially smell of fresh bread is just the best makes me feel alive. Only deltaparoel music can do the same to me. Sometime I combine the both of them, make me feel alive!
@@claravale1756 Yes! I finally had success on attempt number 7 and it's been fairly easy to repeat ever since then. Hang in there, eventually it all comes together.
Charlie, this is a fantastic vidio, very educational. I bake all our bread, no store bought bread. I have subscribed so I can slowly work my way through your videos and learn. Thanks.
Also if you turn an oven shelf upside down above your dough and one below with the water tray and loaf on middle shelf it seems to help the steam stay near your loaf. Plus you can buy some ovens with a steam function now days
Thanks so much for the great tips and detailed explanation. I followed all your videos about sourdough starter and bread and baked almost 8 loaves for the last couple of weeks. And all my loaves were flat and rubbery, (taste was good, but they were even too dense to slice it.) I tried to figure out what was wrong and modified the recipe based on my assumption of the cause of my failure. But all my efforts were in vain so far. I stuck to your tartine bread recipe because it is the best recipe I've seen so far(simple and easy to follow). My starter passed a floating test and after the bulk rising phase, my dough had some bubble on the surface. But when I tried to shape it, it was too sticky and really difficult to shape it and build tension. (I chose 72~75% of hydration ratio, 72% of white flour, 14% of whole wheat flour and 14% of spelt flour). I assumed that I've done something wrong or missed out. Could you kindly let me know your views on my situation? It would really help me a lot!
When shaping, did you flour the outer surface of the dough to prevent it from sticking? It does take some practice to learn to shape properly. Sourdough can be a bit hard to handle at first if you're not used to it. As far as the dense loaves, it sounds like they may be under-proofed or under-hydrated. Are you able to maintain an 85 degree F environment during the bulk rise? Also, I'd recommend starting out with the baseline recipe, so stick to 90% white flour and 10% whole wheat. All flours behave differently, so using different types will significantly affect the results. Then once you get it right with those ratios, you can try to incorporate different ratios or different types of flour.
@@TheRegularChefThank you so much for your kind reply. My home is not that warm, so I keep my dough in the microwave during the autolyse and bulk rise phase to keep my dough warm enough. I also extended the bulk rising phase for 4 hours, instead of 2.5 hours, but my dough became almost like liquid. I also tried to change my proofing time for 4 hours, 8 hours in the fridge, and also 2 hours on the kitchen counter, but not worked. Maybe my flour ratio is the reason, and I'll try again with your recommendation this weekend. Thank you so much again and also for the great videos for all the recipe! I searched so many videos on UA-cam about sourdough, and your channel is the best, I think!
This was very helpful. My first loaf looked like a concrete stepping stone! I realize I did several things wrong. One of them, I believe was over-proofing. Will be more mindful the next time!
On the over fermentation part, I saw elsewhere (yet to be tested in my hands) the flour protein percent sort of determines how much we should allow the dough to rise in bulk. flour protein % dough size increase % < 10 10-20 10-12 20-40 13-14 40-70 >15 70-110
Thanks for the informative video.. I’ve been obsessing about baking sourdough for while now and I baking decent breads but they’re falling on the flatter side.. I think shortening my bulk phase might do the trick! Thanks!
About to pop my first sour dough loaf in the oven and I already know it's been over fermented based on your video. I'm gonna bake it anyway because I don't want to waste good flour but I've definitely learned my lesson for next time!
Great presentation and great job! I really appreciate the precise and well-articulated explanations of how the process works and why these tips solve the various challenges with making sourdough bread. I'm the kind of guy that needs to understand how it all works to be successful at something like baking. You struck a nice balance between casual and technical. Thanks for the great tips! Add an obscure Monty Python or Star Trek reference or two and you'd do Alton Brown proud!
A good tip is to get a longer first fermentation phase (before shaping) and a reduced second phase, for a reduced fermentation overall. This allows the gluten network to stay more tense, leading to a stronger loath and therefore a better spring. However, be aware that the nice flavor of sourdough's bread necessitate a long enough fermentation. A good hydratation is also crucial for a good spring aswell as a soft and sweet inside. Lately there's some sort of "hydratation race" on the internet, however it doesn't make sense to always go for more hydratation as what we can get depends most of your flour's baking potential (which is mainly determined by gluten's quantity in your flour). But a good hydratation is important and you need to know your flour and your dough so you can hydrate properly without going too far and destructurate your dough. In the end, bakery is a combination of knowledge, precision, and observation. It's important to have a good recipe that act as milestones, but we need to carefully observe our dough to make the necessary adjustments in response to thousands of micro parameters that you can't all control. Have a nice baking !
Hello , Thank you for the tips, I have a GAS Conventional oven with only heat fron under and do not have e Dutch Oven, what can I do to get the good Spring besides the steam??? Thank you for the feedback
No problem! Even without a dutch oven, there are other ways to steam your oven. Here's another video explaining another method in more detail: ua-cam.com/video/PabONWAcGSs/v-deo.html. He uses both lava rocks and towels, but you could use one or the other.
Wow you are the first one to talk about how over pre proofing causes loaves to be too wet. Thank you so much.
Yeah I’m not sure why nobody else talks about it, but I’m glad I was able to help! Like I said, once I realized that, it made the biggest difference for me in my loaves
I have been suffering from loaves with poor spring. No real ears yet. Hoping that not fermenting for the recommended 4.5 hrs helps. However I like the flavour of an unbleached bread flour sourdough best. Any tips on modifying recipe for a less thirsty dough? Nearly all recipes have whole wheat percentages and it affects how wet the dough is when I dont use whole wheat.
Yeah I think that'll help! As far as the flour, I would start with a lower hydration since bread flour is generally less thirsty than whole wheat, and gradually increase the hydration as necessary. You could also try different brands of bread flour if you're not getting the desired result with the current brand you're using since they're all slightly different.
Came here after baking several dense, flat loves & this is so helpful!
I thought mine was not right bc I insist on using half or all fresh ground hard white wheat berries with vital gluten added.
Tip1 Starter 1:26
Tip2 Shaping 2:29
Tip3 Overfermentation 3:43
Tip4 Scoring 4:34
Tip5 Steam in oven 5:30
Youre the Real MVP!!!
Can you prepper bread dough in the evening and bake it first thing in the morning? Is it possible and haw should it be done ? Should you add additional east in the morning?
Starter
@@gancarzpl its possible. I recomend you to make bread in a single day at weekends to get used to the process. Then you will be able to adjust the process by yourself.
@@gancarzpl don’t add anything to the bread after bulk fermentation has ended, it will degas it; that is, remove the air bubbles and thus making in flat. If you want to let it rest overnight to bake in the morning, you might need to put it on the fridge so it doesn’t overproof.
the thing about not over-fermenting is super helpful! i also like to keep a spray bottle with just plain water in it on hand, and spray the top of the loaf right before closing the dutch oven. it just adds a little extra water that will quickly turn into steam, and it works if you spray your loaf on a baking tray too!
I spray mine too ❤
Guilty: over-shaping, over-proofing, and over-thinking it! Thanks for these practical, clear, concise, understandable, no-nerdy tips. Applying them now.
Really amazing video and explanations!
I just love when people actually explain the details of why and how something happens, so I can actually understand what's going on.
Good job, keep it up!
Thanks! I feel the same way, I think it’s super important to understand the process.
Very impressive for expplaining how to fold correctly the shaping of the sourdough. Tks for the tips.
I learnt more from this 6 mins than hours of other vids. Thanks 👍🏻🤙🏻
Got to agree
Yup me too
One extra point: oven temperature. Which depends on the oven. Recipes often tell bakers to put the oven temperature at as hot as possible 475-500° to get that spring. But my oven is very small, heat coming only from the bottom. Given the tight space and heat source, the Dutch oven got too hot, stopping the dough’s rise prematurely, and giving me saucer shaped loaves over and over again. Once I turned it down to 450° my loaves started popping up nicely and reliably. All of which is to say, if a baker follows all these key points and still gets a flat loaf, they should experiment with oven temp. Depending on the oven-large/small, convection/fan/gas only etc.-they may need to up the temp or lower it.
Lol my oven has 250 as max
@@mdahsenmirza2536 😄 Oh, dear! But have you checked with an oven thermometer? You never know for sure if the oven temp matches the "dial" until you check with an oven thermometer.
@@moonwalk1031 true true 😅
@@mdahsenmirza2536 you guys are talking about two different units, C and F
@@mdahsenmirza2536 that would be 500 F not 500 Celsuis :)
Great video! It totally went too long with my last bulk ferment. It was So tempting to just let those bubbles keeping coming up and the dough was so fluffy! Then I did a 12 hour cold proof! Ugh. Even though the loaf tasted great, it got half the rise in the oven than usual and of course, struggled to get brown enough. Learning!! Thank you for your excellent presentation and amazingly helpful tips!!
"Hello, my name is John, and I am an over proofer." It all started pretty innocently. I thought that if 3 hours of fermentation would produce such great flavors then 5 hours would be even better. Before long things got out of control and I found myself proofing for 8 hours. It interfered with my work. My family became unhappy with my flat loaves and before long I was forced to move out. Now I am putting my life back together and I have not over proofed for 52 days now.
🤣🤣🤣
😂 ej im from Belgium and i understand you. Sometimes im still bussy at 4 o'clock evening overproofing.
The tip about tearing has never been mentioned before but is very helpful! Thank you- another piece of the jigsaw falls into place
Making a loaf today and thought I would do a quick search for some lift advice. I found this video very straight forward and helpful. Appreciate it!
Am a newbie at Sourdough baking. Charlie you have explained all the issues of SB and I am so grateful. Will definitely follow all your tips given. Thank you so much.
Thank you so much.
Thanks for explaining the reasons behind the steps, so many tutorial tell you what to do but not why you have to do it...
Exactly! For me, it is so much easier to remember the tips if I know the reason behind it.
You are literally the clearest, straight to the point guy and that is exactly what i need! This was incredibly informative... even if the main thing i took was i need better technique 🙈. Subscriber made here 👍🏻
I use a Dutch oven with an ice cube between the Dutch oven and parchments paper. Super helpful!
YES! I did this as well and it made all the difference.
THANK YOU - I've been having tons of trouble and realize now that I've been over-fermenting my dough. I've been feeling so frustrated and had been completely misdiagnosing the problem up until now!
wow, now i know i've been over fermenting! i didn't know that was a thing so this is very helpuf!
Thank you so much for the tips. Your first minute of this video explains exactly what was my weekend. Yesterday a baked my first sourdough bread and the result was like the flaten bread of the thumbnail. At least the taste is really good.
Cheers from Brazil.
Haha yeah we’ve all been there. I’m glad the video helped though, thanks for watching!
In Germany we would call this a bad bread as the distribution and size distribution of the pores is very uneven.
Not letting your dough ferment for too long is a very interesting tip. I may be guilty of that, I'll try a shorter bulk ferment and see if my loaves get a bit rounder! Thanks!
Well?
@@GolfSpott yup, they're rounder when you've left some yeast 'fuel' for the baking part.
And it’s not always about time, temperature plays a big part too. You can retard your dough in the fridge overnight
THANK YOU for the tips. New home baker here 🙋🏻♀️
Wonderful video! Another point - If you don't use a dutch oven, at least bake it on a preheated baking stone/steel/cast iron skillet together. This allows heat transfer directly from the stone/steel to the bread. As a result, the inside of the dough increases in temperature faster before the crust is formed on the outside.
Great video if you don't have a Dutch oven I use ice cubes in the tray to slow down the release of steam 💦
I haven't seen that suggestion yet, thanks Chef Randy!
I used a large stew pot with a 100% metal lid...worked just as well.
Great video, thanks for not skipping any steps. Please consider doing a video about using self ground flour.
Good smooth talking with concise information 👍
Great tips. I think tip #3 on over-proofing has been my issue. Looking forward to trying again with a shorter bulk proof.
Great job on this straight-forward video, and I agree! All stuff that I unfortunately learned the hard way! The one that took me the longest to learn? Stop using a "sharp knife" and only use a razor blade for scoring. And don't be scared to go deep. I was just barely scratching the surface.
constructive criticisms:
1. If you're gonna tell people to make one smooth, swift motion for scoring... then stop sawing! One top is to dip the blade in water (or even oil) to keep it from hanging up.
2. When showing the problem shaped-loaf with the good one, show things for a few more seconds in comparison so folks can see what is going on. Not all that obvious on the screen, and the "bad" one is panned off before we know what to look for.
3. Nice large work surface... barely big enough! But most troublesome is to have it move around on you. :-) Put a damp towel under it or clamp it down.
Question for you:
For efficiency and home-heating reasons (it is over 100ºF here today!) I have been attracted to the "cold start" process, and I'd like to learn of others experience with this. Do you have any? I no longer pre-heat my oven or the cast iron. Everything goes in at room temp, and the timer is started with everything off. Set to 450º and 30 minutes. Then the lid comes off for another 25 minutes. I believe this actually gives MORE oven spring spring since the yeast isn't killed as quickly. The trick.... what temp should the dough be.... assuming that it has been retarded in the fridge for the final rise. Something I'm playing with. Getting great results though, and I'd like to see more people doing cold start.
Excellent! I was not getting my spring. You explained the cause , over fermentation.
Success!!! Following your tips, I now have amazing sourdough. Thanks so much 👍🏻
Very nice instructions. Thank you!
Killer crumb structure! Looks mighty tasty
I’ve been troubleshooting my lack of oven spring for a while. I feel like I do everything here, with the exception of the bulk fermentation.
Maybe I’m going too long! I usually do a 10-12 hour overnight bulk rise, which results in the dough doubling in volume. At this point, as you mentioned, the dough is more wet and sticky. I’d been trying to combat this issue by dropping the hydration, thinking my hydration was too high and making things sticky. But I didn’t think about the dough getting stickier and wetter as the bulk fermentation progresses.
I will give this a try! I didn’t think a 20-30% increase in volume was enough!
maybe try reducing your bulk fermentation time and proof your bread overnight in a 2-4 degree (celsius) environment.
If you're over fermenting during the BF stage, several things you can do. This is not a hydration issue. You can over ferment at 68% or 80%. First, high overnight temps will cause dough to over ferment. Also, large amounts of starter will cause it as they become extremely active. Remember, when you make your dough, you are super feeding your starter. After autloyse, the starches have been broken down into sucrose and maltose. These are simple sugars that the yeast can feed on. The easiest way to prevent over fermentation is to change your timing. Switch to daytime instead of overnight. This way, you can monitor the fermentation. The other way is to reduce the amount of starter you are using. You can use as little as 25g of starter and still have a successful loaf. Hope this helps.
Food Geek did an experiment on this ua-cam.com/video/UvUJQ0nFVPg/v-deo.html
most flours, except arrowhead mills bread flour (that I have found), add amylase enzyme short circuiting the natural release of sugars and destroying the gluten structure. the problem is with the gluten.
If you are using a lower hydration starter it won't pass the "float test" but will still create a great oven spring. Fermentation which I believe is about 90% of creating oven spring is about the interaction of Time and Temperature. You can't rely on one without considering the other in my experience. Thanks for your videos of baking and cooking.
Very good, loved your vídeo ! No fireworks or unecessary information as other channels, congratz !!!!
I am obsessed with breads lately, thx for the tip
Good comments Charlie - I think I identified my problem -- over cold proofing.
So grateful I found your video. This time around I think I over fermented the bulk rise. I was told it should double in size. That took about 4 hours and then I noticed the dough was soft and kind of wet. Uggh.
Extremely helpful! I've been overfermenting!
Hi! Can I ask what size dough scraper (knife?) are you using? :)
It’s hard to make sourdough bread when I’m ADD.an informative video in less than 7 minutes.thanks.
I’m on my 7th loaf and they have all been so flat! I seriously needed this! Thank you😊😊😊
Beautifully demonstrated!
Spike the dough with commercial yeast. It makes it taste better too in my opinion. I have a very feisty mother too! I also use a Banneton.
Thanks for the info, love your vids. An additional one that I have experienced two times now is changing your starter flower. I have a 50-50 mix and when I change one part, the starter still doubles in size but you can simply seee its less active and thus yields flat breads with mega holes and tunnels. Frustrating, though upon changing starter content, allow for some time to build actual rise power again.
This is such a helpful and informative video put in an easy to understand way... thank you from me and my future fluffy loaves!
Jakrit
Nice straightforward presentation!
excellent video, tips 3 and 4 fixed my mistakes, very useful, thanks for posting
Overshaping is definitely something I used to do before realising what I was doing
First, and totally off subject, you remind me of Noah Nicholas Reid from "Schitt's Creek" and, second, thank you SO much for relieving some of the trial and error in my new bread-baking hobby. My 50/50 organic rye/all-purpose flour sour dough starter is ready today, incredibly active (my house is on well water .. no chlorine or fluoride) and you have already saved me a couple potential errors. I made a yeast dough that I let cold ferment for seven days before baking it, last night, and it tasted wonderful but it was shaped like a 1950s sci-fi spaceship. I'll be using my new starter tomorrow, utilizing a couple of these techniques I did not pay attention to until seeing your video. Thank you!
curious i am on well water as well and have been having more success than friend in no knead bread. I thought it was my skill at doing nothing. Still on white flower. 40 years ago tried whole wheat. it did not go well.
@@jimandrews8528 Oh, I have no proof that well water is the key. Mary (from Mary's Nest) put it in my head and I've seen a few other instructional videos in which it's been suggested to set the water out for a couple hours to let the chlorine "evaporate" out of it ... if the viewer wasn't using bottled purified or spring water. Instinctually it sounds right, to me.
anyone who doesn't live in the sticks can do this by just using bottled water for bread making instead of tap
Even if you're using cold you shouldn't let your dough 7 days in the firdge. Unless it's a technique with very very few yeast and in this case I'm not aware, but even when working with cold you usually don't let fermentation for more than 1 day.
@@JulianChild Better to leave your treated water out overnight in a wide mouth jar to get rid of the additives.
Thank you.Very informative.
really great video, thanks! helped me a lot im just starting my sourdough journey
Can you please tell me who painted the painting that is behind you on the wall. I believe that is one of my paintings. Thank You. Eileen Summerville
Thank you for your help. I think I have been letting my dough
ferment too long. I will follow your advice!!!
This guy needs some more love! Great video man!
That means a lot man, I appreciate it! I’m glad you enjoyed!
Hey Bro, thx for your vídeo. About tip 5, no ices or water spray at the dutch Oven?
No I haven't found that to be necessary, but you could definitely do it if it seems to help. For me though, the dutch oven alone has been enough.
A very well presented video many thanx
Your dough is so moist and wobbly! Is that a high gluten flour? I use 100% whole wheat so maybe mine will never get like that? My bulk rise is super dense. Or I’m just doing it wrong!
Yeah, it's a high gluten bread flour at about 77% hydration. You're right, whole wheat tends to absorb a lot more water than white flour, so I typically go up to like 90-95% when I'm using that. So maybe try upping the hydration if yours seems to dense, and that should help!
Thank you for this easy-to-understand, practical information. I have been baking sourdough bread for a couple of months and with all the reading and video watching nowhere was I made to understand that time to bake with my starter was at that particular point in time and could be up to up to 12 hours after refreshing.
I guess I need to check my bulk rise and shaping steps. My second loaf rose and had air pockets, but was also still tough to cut and slightly damp.
Thanks for this! I was having hit or miss successes with my oven spring despite a vigorous starter, and I realize I was adding it at the wrong point and probably letting the bulk fermentation go on too long. Been getting a nice crust thanks to diastatic malt powder though, so very excited to keep experimenting :)
Really good tips, thank you
I can't believe two of my mistakes were ones he new how to fix so easily. Can't wait to try again
Thanks for the helpful info! You’re a great teacher!!😊
Great tips thanks. My starter, Winston, is a champ and very strong. Like many, I am plagued with weak oven spring on some loaves. I have made 8 loaves with only 2 worthy of being gifted (I have to be proud of my gift), all are delicious though. I live in Phoenix, AZ and right now my kitchen varies from 79 to 81. This is probably accelerating the fermentation process. My last loaf, Saturday, I only let it ferment 4 hours and again not impressed with the oven spring. When I score the loaf using a brand new razor blade I am not getting a solid cut, it seems the dough is loose. Is this a symptom of over fermenting?
Thanks for the ideas to help oven spring. Will be considering all of them my next baking day.
Just a tip--If you would slow down your delivery, it would help us jotting down notes.
I don't have a dutch oven, but on Ciabbata bread, I steam by heating a cake pan while preheating and throwing in 5 ice cubes when I put on my bread. Seems like perfect amount.
That was really really good and very easy to follow. Nice tutorial.
You explained everything so well! Thank you.
Great video.. answered some of my questions why I wasn't getting the best result!
Thanks for your video. I learnt so much from it and l am guilty for leaving bulk fermentation too long. Trying to do mine i. Barby as we are on the road fulltime and ldont have an oven in my van
How tf do you only have 2k subs? This was SO helpful and after watching this I baked my first sourdough bread that didn't turn out as a brick :D
Haha hopefully it’s just a matter of time. That’s awesome to hear though! Which tip made the biggest difference for you?
@@TheRegularChef Not quite sure since there is just SO much one can do wrong. I think I was over-fermenting heavily and also not putting enough tension on my dough ball.
Haha that’s true, there’s definitely a lot to it. Either way, I’m glad the video helped!
Great video. Informative and concise.
Thank you this is really helpful and well explained
Nicely explained. Thank you.
Your videos are really informative! But what about sourdough baking without wheat flour? Have you tried baking sourdough with spelt or rye only or a mix of them and other old flours? This is a whole other sphere. Would love to see some videos about that! :)
Thanks! Yeah I definitely want to explore that more in future videos. I incorporated a bit of spelt/einkorn into my 100% whole wheat sourdough recipe, but I haven't tried a bread using only those grains.
#6. Don't think you can just use any old all purpose flour instead of bread flour. The protein content of all purpose flour is generally too low (at the very least too inconsistent) to get good consistent results. In a pinch when I don't have proper bread flour I add about .2% gluten flour to my all purpose flour (20g red mill gluten flour to 1000g total flour) to make up for some of the protein loss. I struggled with all purpose flour for almost a year before considering that all flours truly aren't equal.
Thanks Reg. Nice job with helpful info.
Great now this video make me hungrey kek! The good crunchy taste and especially smell of fresh bread is just the best makes me feel alive. Only deltaparoel music can do the same to me. Sometime I combine the both of them, make me feel alive!
Great vid, thank you. Nicely explained. Lots of things for me to try!
Five tries at getting that elusive oven spring. o_o Thanks for the tips, six may be my lucky number! :D
Did it work?
@@claravale1756 Yes! I finally had success on attempt number 7 and it's been fairly easy to repeat ever since then. Hang in there, eventually it all comes together.
@@pthaloblue100 What was the answer?
@@benmjt Being more patient with my starter, letting it raise and fluff up more before I used it. :)
Charlie, this is a fantastic vidio, very educational. I bake all our bread, no store bought bread. I have subscribed so I can slowly work my way through your videos and learn. Thanks.
THIS IS GOLD. Thank you!!!!
Also if you turn an oven shelf upside down above your dough and one below with the water tray and loaf on middle shelf it seems to help the steam stay near your loaf. Plus you can buy some ovens with a steam function now days
Thanks so much for the great tips and detailed explanation. I followed all your videos about sourdough starter and bread and baked almost 8 loaves for the last couple of weeks. And all my loaves were flat and rubbery, (taste was good, but they were even too dense to slice it.) I tried to figure out what was wrong and modified the recipe based on my assumption of the cause of my failure. But all my efforts were in vain so far. I stuck to your tartine bread recipe because it is the best recipe I've seen so far(simple and easy to follow). My starter passed a floating test and after the bulk rising phase, my dough had some bubble on the surface. But when I tried to shape it, it was too sticky and really difficult to shape it and build tension. (I chose 72~75% of hydration ratio, 72% of white flour, 14% of whole wheat flour and 14% of spelt flour). I assumed that I've done something wrong or missed out. Could you kindly let me know your views on my situation? It would really help me a lot!
When shaping, did you flour the outer surface of the dough to prevent it from sticking? It does take some practice to learn to shape properly. Sourdough can be a bit hard to handle at first if you're not used to it. As far as the dense loaves, it sounds like they may be under-proofed or under-hydrated. Are you able to maintain an 85 degree F environment during the bulk rise? Also, I'd recommend starting out with the baseline recipe, so stick to 90% white flour and 10% whole wheat. All flours behave differently, so using different types will significantly affect the results. Then once you get it right with those ratios, you can try to incorporate different ratios or different types of flour.
@@TheRegularChefThank you so much for your kind reply. My home is not that warm, so I keep my dough in the microwave during the autolyse and bulk rise phase to keep my dough warm enough. I also extended the bulk rising phase for 4 hours, instead of 2.5 hours, but my dough became almost like liquid. I also tried to change my proofing time for 4 hours, 8 hours in the fridge, and also 2 hours on the kitchen counter, but not worked. Maybe my flour ratio is the reason, and I'll try again with your recommendation this weekend. Thank you so much again and also for the great videos for all the recipe! I searched so many videos on UA-cam about sourdough, and your channel is the best, I think!
Thank you, learned several useful things from this!
Thank you Charlie! This video was extremely helpful! 😀
This was very helpful. My first loaf looked like a concrete stepping stone! I realize I did several things wrong. One of them, I believe was over-proofing. Will be more mindful the next time!
Yeah over-proofing is a big one. I'm glad it helped you out!
Omg this came in at the right time! My starter baby is ready for another loaf this week
On the over fermentation part, I saw elsewhere (yet to be tested in my hands) the flour protein percent sort of determines how much we should allow the dough to rise in bulk.
flour protein % dough size increase %
< 10 10-20
10-12 20-40
13-14 40-70
>15 70-110
Thanks for the informative video.. I’ve been obsessing about baking sourdough for while now and I baking decent breads but they’re falling on the flatter side.. I think shortening my bulk phase might do the trick! Thanks!
About to pop my first sour dough loaf in the oven and I already know it's been over fermented based on your video. I'm gonna bake it anyway because I don't want to waste good flour but I've definitely learned my lesson for next time!
Thanks for the tips - can you link the dutch oven you used? thx
No problem, here it is! amzn.to/2WUdGRX. It's also linked in the video description, along with the rest of the equipment I used
Great presentation and great job! I really appreciate the precise and well-articulated explanations of how the process works and why these tips solve the various challenges with making sourdough bread. I'm the kind of guy that needs to understand how it all works to be successful at something like baking. You struck a nice balance between casual and technical.
Thanks for the great tips! Add an obscure Monty Python or Star Trek reference or two and you'd do Alton Brown proud!
This helped alot!
My trick to get oven spring is triple roll the dough before put it in the proofing basket. Round like a log
A good tip is to get a longer first fermentation phase (before shaping) and a reduced second phase, for a reduced fermentation overall. This allows the gluten network to stay more tense, leading to a stronger loath and therefore a better spring. However, be aware that the nice flavor of sourdough's bread necessitate a long enough fermentation.
A good hydratation is also crucial for a good spring aswell as a soft and sweet inside. Lately there's some sort of "hydratation race" on the internet, however it doesn't make sense to always go for more hydratation as what we can get depends most of your flour's baking potential (which is mainly determined by gluten's quantity in your flour). But a good hydratation is important and you need to know your flour and your dough so you can hydrate properly without going too far and destructurate your dough.
In the end, bakery is a combination of knowledge, precision, and observation. It's important to have a good recipe that act as milestones, but we need to carefully observe our dough to make the necessary adjustments in response to thousands of micro parameters that you can't all control. Have a nice baking !
Hello , Thank you for the tips, I have a GAS Conventional oven with only heat fron under and do not have e Dutch Oven, what can I do to get the good Spring besides the steam??? Thank you for the feedback
No problem! Even without a dutch oven, there are other ways to steam your oven. Here's another video explaining another method in more detail: ua-cam.com/video/PabONWAcGSs/v-deo.html. He uses both lava rocks and towels, but you could use one or the other.
I like the wooden surface you shape the dough on. Is it a cutting board? What brand/size? Thanks
Your knowledge is appreciated, thanx!!
Thanks a lot! This was really helpful.