This is the biggest concern. We are not getting any benefit for ordering Rafale. Precisely the reason government brining in Eurofighter which is ready to move the manufacturing to India with ToT. Spending 20B and not getting any technology benefit is the biggest blocker for MRFA deal
Hmm, So it's possible that India will have 4 aircraft carrier by 2038 with 2 having weight class of 45,000 ton displacement and other two of 65,000 ton. By 2030, we can expect TEDBF. Seems like TEDBF will get induction in triple digits.
Dassault doesn't need India's order anymore , their order book is full for over a decade. I don't blame them waiting for order from India is like expecting Indian judiciary to deliver justice on time.
Maybe we can develop tedbf fighters at that cost for rafael m .private players can be hiven chance for tedbl to fast track and produce while hal will produce tejas and amca
The one thing Indian defence planners needs to understand is that only by making and purchasing indigenous products we can control the cost of any weapon system otherwise foreign firms and countries will keep charging us inflated prices and keep looting us . In 3rd term modi govt needs to fast track all fighter programs by funding and tightening grips on Drdo babus and HAL and ADA . Also land systems and drones and missile systems should be top priority.
Agreed. If they had put the money that went into Rafale towards approving and speeding up TEDBF earlier on, the current issue of foreign price gouging would not exist. Do not waste any more money on exceedingly over-priced foreign planes any more. It's killing the country financially and strategically.
The indigenous bang for your buck is vastly better. I think after the naval order and potentially another small batch for the IAF, just forget the MRFA and focus on mass production of the Tejas MK2 and AMCA. 20 billion dollars would go a vast way in getting way more of those airframes instead.
We should start building atleast 1 aircraft carrier from today onwards . It will take atleast 10 years to build that aircraft carrier. After 10 years Ins vikramaditya wil be retiring . Our resources and staff will be well utilised.
That is the best way to go. It would also free up funds to develop an air force variant of the TEDBF as a back up to AMCA which will surely be delayed.
2038 take china ke paas 11 carriers rahenge. Govt kab china ko seriously legi pata nai. Hum tisre aircraft carrier pe kaam kar rhe hai yehlog inke chauthe aircraft carrier ka trials kar rhe hai. Pata nai kya ho rha hai yaar!
@@spikeguard it's the society's job to educate the masses about these topics. It's every educated person's responsibility to educate people on how they should vote and how they should think while voting. The masses need to be aware of what's happening in their nation. Those who spread misinformation should be punished and shunned from society.
@@jayyt9584 those who get swayed and sold for money don't want to work, get skilled or get educated about anything. They keep voting based on caste and religion, not based on work. India's last 10 years were dedicated to work. But the people didn't care about this even though everyone could see this development.
Decision on 3D printing is done before design freezing as 3D printing can perform complicated manufacturing that normal fabrication cannot do,here already design is freezed.
Rafale price inflation is strange when Eurofighter Typhoon is offered at lower price....this calls for cancelling of MRFA and instead developing Tejas mk3
India should do missile test in a concealed way. Don't give performance Intel to china . Just give 2-3 day notam warning , before any ship can enter bay of Bengal
Private sector already said they aren't interested in developing amca.. They already informed they will take part in supply chain.. So if HAL keeps on waiting for private sector to take part in developing.. We can keep amca in history books
Earlier deal was around ₹60000cr so given inflation ₹50000 cr is logical amount. If remove this offset classes from these deal they'll will cost us little less.
@@mtrest4 so what should we get? Sea Harriers? Rupees have lost almost 20% value in the past 6-8 years so. If you adjust inflation you will get similar pricing. Of 1600cr per aircraft. We got them expensive in the first deal itself. That's the cost of buying things in bits and pieces
We don't need expensive air craft carriers. For one carrier, we must purchase and maintain dozens of fighter jets. The entire carrier with its air craft can be sunk with a single Dong Feng missile of China. Or by a nuclear tipped Harpoon missile that Pakistan has. Let's not show off how expensive assets we can build. Use the money judiciously to buy 5th Gen, Long range fighters and modern missiles. They can deliver the same sea-deniability that a carrier can.
@@abymathew295 France will never sell barracuda to us. It's their premium technology. One barracuda will cost no less than $25-30k cr. Money can't buy everything
India 🇮🇳 should go for Eurofighter 🇩🇪🇬🇧🇪🇸🇮🇹 Typhoon Tranche 5 Multirole fighter jets for the Indian Air Force 🇮🇳 (MRFA 114 fighter jets tender) which is offered with 33% discount to be manufactured in India with 100% Transfer of Technology and much cheaper than French 🇫🇷 Dassault Rafale Multirole fighter jets. It must be remembered that both Rafale and Typhoon were shortlisted for India and Rafale was selected due to lower price.
Nope we need separate infra and training requirements for eurofighters which'll need billions..there's also multiple settlements and hurdles as it's not owned by single country..another reason is Germany's hostile nature towards india they just need ammunition as of now to support Ukraine and this sweet talks
Yep, Typhoon looks enticing option. Remember Typhoon was selected before it lost to Rafale in price. Probably that time no one was buying Rafale making it cheaper. Now with discount, local manufacturing and ToT this looks very good option
an offset clause at 50% of the transaction value is way too much for any foreign military vendor . . . even Indian defense vendors couldn't do the same had they been exporting to foreign countries . . . export indigenous weapons & radar systems from India to foreign militaries with an offset clause set at 50% of the transaction value . . . just not financially viable . . . instead of the pending (since 2018) 50% offset clause MOD should insist Dassault to absorb some of the inflation cost of the current deal for 26 navalized carrier borne Dassault Rafale M4-R multi role fighter interceptor . . . that way direct acquisition cost can be lessened by atleast a few thousand crores if not more . . .
Let’s call iff the Rafale deal . Go for 20 Tejus twin engine deck fighters while we develop the TEDBF fighters. The navy need s to be more practical. HAL I’m sure can put the Tejus twin engine model on the carrier in two years which is far shorter time than we get the Rafales. Meanwhile TEDBF can go on developing. France is blackmailing us
So 20 twin engine Tejas won't need funds to develop ?? What kind of logic is that ? Best thing would be to scrap Rafale-M deal & take few Mig-29K or Fa-18SH on lease. Meanwhile focus the funds on TEDBF development
HAL is ready to give a Tejus twin engine deck fighter based on the existing Naval NP series using 2 GE F 404 with a slight design change . Frame is already ready for single engine . TEDBF is an entirely new design using canards and F 414 whose prototype will only be ready post 2026 !! Product 2030-32.
@@nikhilanandhegde4781 Will be useless. Airforce version has payload of 3.5 tonne which is already lowest. For navy it will further come down making it completely useless. Also i dont think they can add one more engine in Tejas which is already smallest jet.
If HAL says they can do it within minimal time , I’m sure they have already worked the alternative. Only time will tell . Meanwhile pick up a drink and enjoy the weekend.
I think India should reconsider rafale m deal instead we have a very bright opportunity to shift towards 5th gen carrier based fighter (F35) which will help us in two ways first definitly it will help our current carriers with vertical landing and take off options and second it will help us to get even with our neighbouring threat of 5th gen aircrafts so In my sight a 5th gen F35 is a better choice then going for rafale
@Wild-Weasel TEDBF development and lifecycle cost is just 38% of Rafale with much of the money spent within the country. Not just lower cost but many multiples so.
Not a bad option. Only challenge is logistics nightmare of having one more platform. F18 is cheaper, has better payload and has foldable wings compared to Rafale. Rafale may have edge in Electronics but not huge compared to its price
What's Your Opinion : : "Rafale Offset promises remain unfulfilled" ?
ＬＩＫＥ | ＣＯＭＭＥＮＴ | ＳＨＡＲＥ | ＳＵＢＳＣＲＩＢＥ
This is the biggest concern. We are not getting any benefit for ordering Rafale. Precisely the reason government brining in Eurofighter which is ready to move the manufacturing to India with ToT. Spending 20B and not getting any technology benefit is the biggest blocker for MRFA deal
@Wild-Weasel Good point. Sometimes it feels F18 would have been much cheaper for carrier though it will add logistics challenge
Best it to carry it over for the engine deal
Tedbf : 😂
@@Hriday-q6wby sharing half jet engine technology
Hmm, So it's possible that India will have 4 aircraft carrier by 2038 with 2 having weight class of 45,000 ton displacement and other two of 65,000 ton. By 2030, we can expect TEDBF. Seems like TEDBF will get induction in triple digits.
The inflated price of Rafale has made indigenous aircraft more valuable. Wow!
This has always been the case for the lifecycle cost of any foreign aircraft.
Dassault doesn't need India's order anymore , their order book is full for over a decade. I don't blame them waiting for order from India is like expecting Indian judiciary to deliver justice on time.
Scrap Rafael M, buy 50 jets of MIG 29K Indian navy already have experience using it....
Need to manage until TEDBF BECOME
Instead of buy... Rent mig 29K.
50,000cr for 26 Raffle, seriously? Even 30,000cr is too much. We should put that money to fast track TDBF and AMCA .....
With lifecycle cost taken into account, TEDBF costs just 38% of Rafale-M.
Plus the money gets spent internally for the TEDBF's development.
Lease a few more Mig-29 from Russia till the TEDBF is ready. Ask for a barter deal.
Do not waste huge amounts of funds on Rafale-M. Prices are insane.
Yeah literally ! Russian fighters kam chalu to buy some more time ! At least
The true (hidden) lifecycle cost of the Rafale must be mind blowingly large.
Its way too expensive and eats up too much money 💰💰💰
Isse better to super hornet hi le lete
Tu jaake dimaag ka ilaaj kara
@@FreeFire-uk5fi to be honest the hornet is a very good aircraft for the Navy and also performs better than the rafale in many areas
Maybe we can develop tedbf fighters at that cost for rafael m .private players can be hiven chance for tedbl to fast track and produce while hal will produce tejas and amca
It will take another 15 years, we cannot have carrier with jet till then
The one thing Indian defence planners needs to understand is that only by making and purchasing indigenous products we can control the cost of any weapon system otherwise foreign firms and countries will keep charging us inflated prices and keep looting us . In 3rd term modi govt needs to fast track all fighter programs by funding and tightening grips on Drdo babus and HAL and ADA . Also land systems and drones and missile systems should be top priority.
Agreed.
If they had put the money that went into Rafale towards approving and speeding up TEDBF earlier on, the current issue of foreign price gouging would not exist.
Do not waste any more money on exceedingly over-priced foreign planes any more. It's killing the country financially and strategically.
In another word find another way on how to delay the project even further
Indian Defence Updates.... the hottest defence updates ever
No to MRFA.
Yes to +97 Tejas mk1a
To Mk2 and AMCA.
Imagine buting 4th gen fighter for 30B dollars just to not use in war in fear of SAM systems.
The indigenous bang for your buck is vastly better. I think after the naval order and potentially another small batch for the IAF, just forget the MRFA and focus on mass production of the Tejas MK2 and AMCA. 20 billion dollars would go a vast way in getting way more of those airframes instead.
We should start building atleast 1 aircraft carrier from today onwards . It will take atleast 10 years to build that aircraft carrier. After 10 years Ins vikramaditya wil be retiring . Our resources and staff will be well utilised.
Best thing would be to scrap Rafale-M deal & take few Mig-29K or Fa-18SH on lease. Meanwhile focus the funds on TEDBF development
That is the best way to go.
It would also free up funds to develop an air force variant of the TEDBF as a back up to AMCA which will surely be delayed.
Forget about Tedbf .....Even AMCA can't be rollout in 2030......
@@michealdey3516
AMCA comes after TEDBF
DITCH THE STRYKER. GET SOME CHINOOKS INSTEAD WITH THE MONEY.
@@Hriday-q6wChinook and Indian APC . A win-win for all.
2038 take china ke paas 11 carriers rahenge. Govt kab china ko seriously legi pata nai. Hum tisre aircraft carrier pe kaam kar rhe hai yehlog inke chauthe aircraft carrier ka trials kar rhe hai. Pata nai kya ho rha hai yaar!
Govt to seriously le legi China ko, par voters ko caste and religion and freebies chaiye. Voters don't take govt elections seriously. Uska kya?
@@spikeguard it's the society's job to educate the masses about these topics. It's every educated person's responsibility to educate people on how they should vote and how they should think while voting. The masses need to be aware of what's happening in their nation. Those who spread misinformation should be punished and shunned from society.
@@jayyt9584 those who get swayed and sold for money don't want to work, get skilled or get educated about anything. They keep voting based on caste and religion, not based on work. India's last 10 years were dedicated to work. But the people didn't care about this even though everyone could see this development.
Decision on 3D printing is done before design freezing as 3D printing can perform complicated manufacturing that normal fabrication cannot do,here already design is freezed.
Imdia should not waste the US time talking about Stryker when there is no intention of purchasing it.
Get fa 18 super hornet and transfer of production line in India since rafale m will be expensive and no tot offered ir reduce price plus
Rafale price inflation is strange when Eurofighter Typhoon is offered at lower price....this calls for cancelling of MRFA and instead developing Tejas mk3
50000 crore for 26 rafael??? 35 rafael was little over 26000 crores....
Chuna lga rhe hai france wale...
They are well-known for "sucking out bone merrow" when it comes to G2G deals...
Seriously man...
Mujhe nahi lagta MRFA hone wala hai 114 rafales around 3 lakh crore ke costs aayega excluding we0p0n package and other maintenance, inventory costs.
Too expensive 💰💰💰
So much better building more TEDBF and ORCA.
India should do missile test in a concealed way.
Don't give performance Intel to china .
Just give 2-3 day notam warning , before any ship can enter bay of Bengal
Useless to go for Stryker after Tata, L&T, Kalyani group, Mahindra have already developed similar vehicles in India.
114 MRFA again in cold bag
I don't know y we r again n again talking about striker when v have tata n Mahindra, v can use them , till date they would be our best choice.
India is not ready for off ser due to poor quality control. L and T should go for partnership with dassualt.
First
Private sector already said they aren't interested in developing amca.. They already informed they will take part in supply chain.. So if HAL keeps on waiting for private sector to take part in developing.. We can keep amca in history books
Great news about AMCA & another new loitering munitions
We should fasten the amca programme, scrap the mrfa deal
3-D printing will able to reduce cost and make the fighter jet more stealthy
Hum Stryker kyon lein , mahindra aur Tata ki gadiyan hai na, Larsen and toubro aur Kalyan ki bhi bohut badhiya gadiyan hai.
Aero engine is also produce in 3d printing
Hence Pakistan is a military government
First comment 🎉
Earlier deal was around ₹60000cr so given inflation ₹50000 cr is logical amount. If remove this offset classes from these deal they'll will cost us little less.
Too expensive
@@mtrest4 so what should we get? Sea Harriers? Rupees have lost almost 20% value in the past 6-8 years so. If you adjust inflation you will get similar pricing. Of 1600cr per aircraft. We got them expensive in the first deal itself. That's the cost of buying things in bits and pieces
@@james4807M
not worth the money 💰
India already have TATA kestral, Mahindra , L&T, BEML, lot's of other companies why army needs US made Stryker vehicle.. ...to keep US happy
These information are too precise for every Indians hands off to Indian Defence Update
No rafel m fight mig 21 same e😊
High quality content. No voice over on a single boring video like others
We don't need expensive air craft carriers. For one carrier, we must purchase and maintain dozens of fighter jets. The entire carrier with its air craft can be sunk with a single Dong Feng missile of China. Or by a nuclear tipped Harpoon missile that Pakistan has. Let's not show off how expensive assets we can build. Use the money judiciously to buy 5th Gen, Long range fighters and modern missiles. They can deliver the same sea-deniability that a carrier can.
Jai Hind Jai Bharat 🇮🇳🇮🇳🇮🇳🇮🇳👍👍
Why our armed forces goes so slow ?
China on the bank of chicken neck but out army planning procurement till 2038 ....waah
50k crore for just 26 Rafale is friggin crazy, even if each of them comes with a Nuclear missile....😢😢😢😢
They come with missiles, engines and spares. Also you don't have much choice when you depend on others.
@@james4807M . I know, but Can't justify that price tag... That's an aircraft carrier money, or we could have bought 3 Barracuda class SSNs..😢😢😢😢😢😢😢
@@abymathew295 France will never sell barracuda to us. It's their premium technology. One barracuda will cost no less than $25-30k cr. Money can't buy everything
(India loses war because of under-strength air force)
IDU comments: This is congress fault 😣
India 🇮🇳 should go for Eurofighter 🇩🇪🇬🇧🇪🇸🇮🇹 Typhoon Tranche 5 Multirole fighter jets for the Indian Air Force 🇮🇳 (MRFA 114 fighter jets tender) which is offered with 33% discount to be manufactured in India with 100% Transfer of Technology and much cheaper than French 🇫🇷 Dassault Rafale Multirole fighter jets. It must be remembered that both Rafale and Typhoon were shortlisted for India and Rafale was selected due to lower price.
No typhoon is product of 4 countries if dont trust Germany dont forget histry remember kargil
@@तथास्तु Well time to change that with Germany 🇩🇪 mending ties with India 🇮🇳 especially with its P-75I submarine program.
Nope we need separate infra and training requirements for eurofighters which'll need billions..there's also multiple settlements and hurdles as it's not owned by single country..another reason is Germany's hostile nature towards india they just need ammunition as of now to support Ukraine and this sweet talks
@@तथास्तु It does not matter when manufacturing happens in India with ToT.
Yep, Typhoon looks enticing option. Remember Typhoon was selected before it lost to Rafale in price. Probably that time no one was buying Rafale making it cheaper. Now with discount, local manufacturing and ToT this looks very good option
Amca may be ready for trial " kalki yug"
Only gossip no work
Jai Hind Jai Modiji ⚘️ 🙏
Once a junk fighter is always a junk fighter 😂
How is Rafael costing 1923 crore each 🤔
2500 is closer to its actual lifecycle cost.
Insanely expensive
It's with missiles, spares, etc. Not just a bare bones aircraft.
Jai Hind Vande Mataram 🧡 🤍 💚
Nice video
Jay hind ❤🎉🇮🇳
Bharat Mata ki Jai
Jai Hind 🇮🇳
JH
You should have picked the F18.
Jai hind ❤❤❤
Hi
France has taken India to the cleaners.
Jai Hind 🇮🇳
Jai Hind ❤️❤️❤️❤️
Modi No.1 Chor. Rafale deal.
Nice🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
We don't need raffle instead we need Tejas
Rafale is a temporary transistional measure.
We cannot become aatmanirbhar in a Day
There is a vast gulf between the 2 as far as the Marine version goes. Starting with the second engine. And 4.5 gen stealth.
@@ChandranPrema123 still we need to focus on Tejas mk2 only and force hHAL to manufacture FASTER
Who are u IAF chief?
Military planner of India or some expert to comment on what airforce wants or doesn't want?
Wait for another 10 years
JAI BHARAT ❤️❤️❤️
an offset clause at 50% of the transaction value is way too much for any foreign military vendor . . . even Indian defense vendors couldn't do the same had they been exporting to foreign countries . . . export indigenous weapons & radar systems from India to foreign militaries with an offset clause set at 50% of the transaction value . . . just not financially viable . . . instead of the pending (since 2018) 50% offset clause MOD should insist Dassault to absorb some of the inflation cost of the current deal for 26 navalized carrier borne Dassault Rafale M4-R multi role fighter interceptor . . . that way direct acquisition cost can be lessened by atleast a few thousand crores if not more . . .
Those were the terms of the deal.
@@mtrest4 must admit very conflicting terms & conditions . . . but terms & conditions can always be subject to changes . . .
@@chandrachurniyogi8394
No change as it's written into the contract.
BEES saal seh haag raha tha
Amca ko cardboard se hi bana do na. Itna bhi kyu kharcha karna hai?
❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
❤
JAI MODI ❤️❤️❤️
We need AMCA
..and TEDBF + ORCA.
Let’s call iff the Rafale deal . Go for 20 Tejus twin engine deck fighters while we develop the TEDBF fighters. The navy need s to be more practical. HAL I’m sure can put the Tejus twin engine model on the carrier in two years which is far shorter time than we get the Rafales. Meanwhile TEDBF can go on developing. France is blackmailing us
So 20 twin engine Tejas won't need funds to develop ?? What kind of logic is that ? Best thing would be to scrap Rafale-M deal & take few Mig-29K or Fa-18SH on lease. Meanwhile focus the funds on TEDBF development
First there is no twin engine Tejas, what we have is TEDBF which is not even in paper.
HAL is ready to give a Tejus twin engine deck fighter based on the existing Naval NP series using 2 GE F 404 with a slight design change . Frame is already ready for single engine . TEDBF is an entirely new design using canards and F 414 whose prototype will only be ready post 2026 !! Product 2030-32.
@@nikhilanandhegde4781 Will be useless. Airforce version has payload of 3.5 tonne which is already lowest. For navy it will further come down making it completely useless. Also i dont think they can add one more engine in Tejas which is already smallest jet.
If HAL says they can do it within minimal time , I’m sure they have already worked the alternative. Only time will tell . Meanwhile pick up a drink and enjoy the weekend.
I think India should reconsider rafale m deal instead we have a very bright opportunity to shift towards 5th gen carrier based fighter (F35) which will help us in two ways first definitly it will help our current carriers with vertical landing and take off options and second it will help us to get even with our neighbouring threat of 5th gen aircrafts so In my sight a 5th gen F35 is a better choice then going for rafale
F-35 too expensive, just like Rafale.
Put the money 💰 into accelerating TEDBF and associated technologies and India will be much better off.
@Wild-Weasel
TEDBF development and lifecycle cost is just 38% of Rafale with much of the money spent within the country.
Not just lower cost but many multiples so.
Kabhi India Jung harega to sirf drdo hal ki wajeh se harega . Sale kuch karna he ni , salary chahiye har mahine full
Buy the US F18 - the French Rafale Marine is inferior
@@Hriday-q6w unlikely
@@Hriday-q6w the F18 is combat proven and can carry a superior range of advanced ordinance.
Not a bad option. Only challenge is logistics nightmare of having one more platform. F18 is cheaper, has better payload and has foldable wings compared to Rafale. Rafale may have edge in Electronics but not huge compared to its price
Rafael is better version than Hornet.......whatever they both are useless when comes to the dogfight with fifth gen Aircraft
50000 crores for just 26 jets. Our defence people has gone crazy or what? They should instead focus more on naval Tejas
Strengthen the Bharath desh defence force all respect..... Bharath maata ki jai
Close HAL ADA DRDO buy su migs 27 29 31 fox bat 25 for new aurcrsfts development in indias instead of amca tejas for next 1000 yrs to happen....?