I have searched and searched again to figure out how to use pan, sends and others parameters to the DAW control, but it appears to me this can’t be done. Am i right in that the SQ can ONLY control the faders?
For the HUI protocol, you can control faders, solo, select and mute. Unfortunately, no pan controls. This is a limitation of HUI, not the SQ. You also have DAW control for playback with features like Record, Play, rewind, etc. You can leave that up on the screen as I mentioned in the video, or you can assign them to soft keys.
This video was insanely helpful getting the midi hooked up to protools. I’m still having issues with getting audio to output from protools but searching for an answer. New to the SQ-7 so your videos have been a godsend 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
Thanks BUD Chops! This video covers how to setup the routing for protools to do individual outputs or a summed mix back to an SQ. Look in the second half if you already have the console patched ua-cam.com/video/s76SlDOgIIo/v-deo.html
The midi control of the SQ with a DAW is independent of running the SQ as a usb interface. They actually even run on separate faders. The Midi faders on the SQ have no control over the audio channels of the SQ. If you had a small channel count you wanted to control with midi and audio, you would have to gang the Audio channel of the board with the midi channel on the board controlling the DAW channel. You only get up to 8 gangs though.
You’d have to reference the manual for both boards as far as the midi configuration info, but yes it can be done. The HUI protocol which this video covers is intended to be paired with a DAW. The SQ manual has a section breaking down all the midi info if you wanted to program it to use with anything else.
We haven't tried it but would recommend following the exact steps until you get to the Pro Tools set up (4:33) and then go into Ableton's preferences and the MIDI tab. From there you probably have to choose the SQ as your control surface along with the proper I/O, with the Track & Remote boxes clicked down below. Not entirely sure since we've never tried it but please report back if you get it to work with instructions.
When you’re in the Allen and Heath Midi Control software, try changing the protocol to Mackie, instead of HUI like I used in the video. One of the DAW control presets in Abelton is for Mackie. That may do the trick, I’m not an Abelton user so I can’t say for 100%. If you’re still having issues, reach out to support@americanmusicandsound.com.
Hi, How would i configure my master fader from protools? When i create one it uses a midi channel but doesnt pass any signal through my protools master
The midi faders on the SQ can’t see the “channel type” in protools. The SQ will see the master channel fader the same as the others. For example, if your protools session has the Master channel as the second channel, the SQ will see that as the second fader. The scribble strip will let you know which channel you’re working with. The Master Fader on the SQ does not function as a midi fader.
We will keep your suggestion in mind for a future video but you're more likely to get quicker help in a UAD forum. LUNA was designed with Pro Tools in mind and has many of the same features. I'm sure if you take it step by step, you'll eventually figure it out. Good luck.
You can do this no problem. Once the tracks are routed to the board, setup a usb output for one of your mixes. If you’re only using this as a studio mixer in this situation, the Main LR is fine. Have that coming back into your DAW on a recording track. While the audio is on the board, you can mix it however you want and it will record. Make sure your effects return is routed to the output you’re recording on.
HI whats the maximum channel count into ableton please? Is it limited to 16 with USB and then 32 over a LAN? Thanks. 32 channels over USB would be dope, im hoping its possible
Yes, SQ can record 32x32 at 48K or 96K with the usb connection. The built in LAN connection is for using the Mixpad app to control the SQs. If you want to record with an SQ over LAN, you can add a Dante card.
What would I need to do to be able to mix FOH and send the midi to Logic? Would I be able to gang the main faders to the midi faders and have the ability to one person do my FOH and Livestream mix?
The only way it would be possible to run the audio faders and midi faders together would be with Gangs. The SQs only have 8 gangs though so it would not be practical. If you're looking to do the same mix in Logic, you may want to route your mix to a matrix and do additional processing in Logic on the mix. The other option would be to use the input direct outs and set them to follow the faders so you can send individual channels to Logic. This wouldn’t send midi though. In the Global direct out settings (under routing) you can select follow fader and where in the channel strip the direct output is taken from.
Hey Carlo, the SQ is capable of writing fader and pan automation into your daw with relative ease. Same as recording automation with a mouse. I can do a video on setting this up if you like. You can also program the encoders to do specific CC commands in your daw. Conversely, you can use midi automation to control your mixer from your daw. Are you trying to write fader automation with your sq?
@@Johnbanthony Hello, sorry for the very late reply. I'm interested to get an SQ however im confused since the automation is not within the board itself but through a DAW. My Mackie d8b has its own onboard automation and i dont mess with my DAW. However it seems that today's digital mixers do not have touch sensitive automation onboard the desk. Well i have to understand well how this works. Will DAW automation works with CUBASE and the SQ? i hope this is not Protools only. Thanks
@@carlocalamatta1306 Yes, this will work with cubase. the Mackie and HUI midi protocols are both standardized, so you’ll be able to have cubase recognize the SQ without issue. The setup process may be different within Cubase though.
@@Johnbanthony is there a guideline on how to set it up with cubase? Is it possible to automate cubase through SQ and use the mixer normally like using its preamps etc or once its on control surface mode its possible only that?
@@carlocalamatta1306 You can definitely write automation for Cubase with the SQ. As far as automation and running the preamps, there isn’t a super efficient way to control both at the same time. My recommendation would be to have the preamps on one fader layer and the midi channels on another. You could mix the preamps and midi on the same fader layer if you want, but that may get confusing.
Question ... first off, thank you for video, super helpful. Our use case is to mix live in the box using Protools, for a live broadcast. Main reason I would like to have something like this, is so we could save and recall scenes on the SQ, and it move faders in Protools. I would like this to save fader positions for various songs in a live set ... will this work with SQ or any Allen and Heath usb console?
With the way that HUI works, this may not work. When you first open protools it won’t change the faders based on where the SQ faders are. If this were to work, you’d want to open protools, then recall the scene change on the SQ with the fader positions. I haven’t tested this, but that would be the only work around I can think of. This is with the HUI protocol, so this would be the same issue with any midi controller.
@@Johnbanthony Logically, you’d think if faders move in ProTools when moving a fader on SQ, they would move anytime a fader moves on SQ, including when they move with a recalled scene change. But maybe not… if you have a way to test this, sure would be handy. That would come in so useful for live setting, but also to save different versions of a mix and recall to quickly compare. I use Reaper, which has built in snapshots, so can save and recall in a snap different mixes and settings.
@@OCDrummer74 The Fader movements are done via midi so because of how the protocol works, the faders only react when sent a message. When you open a session, at least in protools, no midi commands are sent from the daw until you hit play or manually change the midi. I’m not familiar with reaper snapshots, but as long as the snapshots “move” the faders, it should send the data to the physical faders.
@@Johnbanthony Did you mean fader movements done via midi in protools, or which direction were you referring to? Main thing trying to figure out if all fader movements on a SQ will be sent to protools? If recalling a scene in SQ which moves faders, will move faders in protools?
@@OCDrummer74 So I tested this out just now. The midi faders follow your command on the SQ and protools, but protools seems to have a priority. For example, if you change between PT sessions, the SQ faders follow, but there’s no way to save the SQ midi data to a scene. Even in the global scene filters, there’s no midi option. So they’ll lock in with protools even when changing between SQ scenes. To more directly answer the question, the SQ faders are following protools, rather than the other way around. This is likely because of how HUI works. I tried this out in Logic as well, and it was the same behavior. With Protools, if you’re on Flex or Studio, I’d go into the automation window and capture/record the fader postions. More of a work around, but that’s probably going to be your best bet. You could also set markers with different fader positions and use that to save settings
Hey, thanks a lot for this! Question from a newbie to DAW (me) I’m running an SQ6 and i follow everything in this video on how to set it up. But I’m lost when it comes to how the audio for each channel is patched. Right now everything on my broadcast SQ6 is patched in from our mixrack(64) How do i then patch that through the midi channels? Does that make sense? Thanks!
Unfortunately the HUI protocol doesn’t allow you to record and run midi at the same time. If you’d like to multi track record with your SQ, we’ve covered that in a different video. Protools: ua-cam.com/video/s76SlDOgIIo/v-deo.html Logic: ua-cam.com/video/VxzoxATlWQg/v-deo.html
You can connect to a DAW for recording but you will not be able to run in and out using the DAW as an insert for plugin effects. The built in effects can be used as an insert on a channel, but it will take away an effects send/return. While there is no built in autotune, I would try the doubler as an insert on your vocal channel.
That's really interesting. So the SQ will be able to bank 24 channels at the time? (Instead of limited too only 8, as all other HUI controllers) It can be done because of the "layers" that the SQ has built in? Hope I got it right.😄 As example: this is a 48 channel mixer right? So if I was mixing an 48 track session in Pro Tools, I could just use the two layers to bank 24 channels back and forth? That would be impressive. The next question is. Can I route 48 channels, out of Pro Tools to the SQ, and basically mix on this board, like it was a analog mixer = mixing 48 track with the SQ onboard EQ & compression and, at the same time control faders and transport from Pro Tools? Also being able to write and read fader and mute automation? The reason I'm asking, is that I'm a studio guy, growing tired of working ITB with just a mouse and a keyboard. I kind of missing the old analog day, not the sound, but because of the workflow. 🙂 And I'm not impressed with the ordinary controllers right now. 🙂 I'm interested to see, if it would be possible for me to mix a full studio album, using only the SQ as my main tool. With al the plugin add-on's and as much CPU power available? I have looked at a lot of live consoles in this price range, and so far the SQ seems like the closest thing. I'm trying to see if I can figure out of the limitations of such a set-up = using the SQ only for mixing tasks in the studio. 🙂🙏 Sorry in advance, if I'm confusing things. I'm not a sound engineer. 😅 Thanks a lot.
So Yes, you would setup 3 HUI blocks of 8 in PT, and then you have 24 faders of the SQ to mix with. HUI lets you set up to 32, which is fine on the SQ7, for the SQ 5 or 6, you may only want to setup 2 or 3 HUI blocks(respectively) and you can dedicate one SQ fader layer to midi control over HUI. OR You can spread it out across 2 fader layers, totally your call. Personally, on an SQ6, I stick with one layer and bank up and down to get past the first 24 tracks. So with your example, yes I could mix 48 channels pressing two button to toggle between the first 24 channels and second 24 channels(one to bank up and one to bank back down). With all 3 boards, you can access every channel, even if you max out PT, as long as you set up the bank up and down buttons. The boards are super flexible, even with the confines of HUI running in blocks of 8. The "MIDI faders” are not limited to 48 channels, you just have to move based on how many blocks you set up (1-4, so 8, 16, 24, or 32 channels at a time)The faders are also super fast, and the track names from PT pop up on the scribble strip As far as Mixing from PT into SQ. On paper, the answer is yes, you can mix 48 channels from your DAW into the SQ and use it like a studio console/summing mixer. Couple caveats once you get past 32 channels. First is that PT limits you to a 32x32 interface without a Protools Ultimate license. I’m a protools guy myself but rely on Logic when I need to get past that limitation or starting using outboard gear as inserts. If you want to max out the SQ channels as far as DAW connectivity goes, you’ll need PTU, or want to look at Logic, cubase, etc for when you want to do an otb mix bigger than 32 channels. With the SQ, the USB port taps out at 32x32, so to get 48 channels into the board, you’ll need either a waves or Dante card. Hope this answers both of your questions. The SQs are super flexible, so it really depends on your preferences/work flow more than any limitations of the board.
Great video. I used it to connect my SQ-5 to Ableton Live 11.2. I found the TCP/IP option works well if you connect the mixer to the network. Cheers.
Thank you for watching!
I have searched and searched again to figure out how to use pan, sends and others parameters to the DAW control, but it appears to me this can’t be done. Am i right in that the SQ can ONLY control the faders?
For the HUI protocol, you can control faders, solo, select and mute. Unfortunately, no pan controls. This is a limitation of HUI, not the SQ. You also have DAW control for playback with features like Record, Play, rewind, etc. You can leave that up on the screen as I mentioned in the video, or you can assign them to soft keys.
Great info! Will I be able to create a scene to save the fader for each different songs?
When connected to a DAW the midi faders will match the channels of your DAW.
Hi!
Great video and the Logic tutorial too:)
Please could you either make a video or explain the setup for this in Ableton live?
Many thanks!
Noted!
@@Johnbanthony have you done this for Ableton live yet?
great information sir
Do you need to launch the A&H daw software every time you want to use it as a controller or does it stay locked unless disconnected?
You’ll need to launch it every time. From what I’ve noticed, it doesn’t use a lot resources from processing/ram.
Do you all have any videos explaining RTA on sound boards and to use them in live sound?
Unfortunately, no but that is a great idea we will consider. Thank you.
@@Johnbanthony thank you 😊
This video was insanely helpful getting the midi hooked up to protools. I’m still having issues with getting audio to output from protools but searching for an answer. New to the SQ-7 so your videos have been a godsend 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
Thanks BUD Chops! This video covers how to setup the routing for protools to do individual outputs or a summed mix back to an SQ. Look in the second half if you already have the console patched
ua-cam.com/video/s76SlDOgIIo/v-deo.html
Does Logic Use HUI or Mackie in protocol?
support.apple.com/guide/logicpro-css/hui-setup-ctls73678434/mac
is the daw control only purpose is for using SQ as a audio interface ?
The midi control of the SQ with a DAW is independent of running the SQ as a usb interface. They actually even run on separate faders. The Midi faders on the SQ have no control over the audio channels of the SQ. If you had a small channel count you wanted to control with midi and audio, you would have to gang the Audio channel of the board with the midi channel on the board controlling the DAW channel. You only get up to 8 gangs though.
Hi. great video. can you use this idea to make the QU-16 a midi controller for a Waves Sound Grid LV1?
You’d have to reference the manual for both boards as far as the midi configuration info, but yes it can be done. The HUI protocol which this video covers is intended to be paired with a DAW. The SQ manual has a section breaking down all the midi info if you wanted to program it to use with anything else.
can you assign soft keys for playback control?
Yes, when you’re assigning the soft keys look under MMC for the Function.
Thanks for this video! I have tried to duplicate this on Ableton Live but haven't been successful. Do you have any tips for doing this with Ableton?
We haven't tried it but would recommend following the exact steps until you get to the Pro Tools set up (4:33) and then go into Ableton's preferences and the MIDI tab. From there you probably have to choose the SQ as your control surface along with the proper I/O, with the Track & Remote boxes clicked down below. Not entirely sure since we've never tried it but please report back if you get it to work with instructions.
When you’re in the Allen and Heath Midi Control software, try changing the protocol to Mackie, instead of HUI like I used in the video. One of the DAW control presets in Abelton is for Mackie. That may do the trick, I’m not an Abelton user so I can’t say for 100%. If you’re still having issues, reach out to support@americanmusicandsound.com.
Hi, How would i configure my master fader from protools? When i create one it uses a midi channel but doesnt pass any signal through my protools master
The midi faders on the SQ can’t see the “channel type” in protools. The SQ will see the master channel fader the same as the others. For example, if your protools session has the Master channel as the second channel, the SQ will see that as the second fader. The scribble strip will let you know which channel you’re working with. The Master Fader on the SQ does not function as a midi fader.
Can a SQ7 control Fairlight in Davinci Resolve?
Fairlight supports midi controllers using the Mackie protocol.
Would this work with Reaper?
Yes, the setup process for the console is the same.
hi,very usefull video. would you be kind enough to do the same with UAD LUNA? i find myself struggling with the set up.....many thanks
We will keep your suggestion in mind for a future video but you're more likely to get quicker help in a UAD forum. LUNA was designed with Pro Tools in mind and has many of the same features. I'm sure if you take it step by step, you'll eventually figure it out. Good luck.
Hi. One question. Using Daw mode, can you use the mixer fxs like an SSL?
You can do this no problem. Once the tracks are routed to the board, setup a usb output for one of your mixes. If you’re only using this as a studio mixer in this situation, the Main LR is fine. Have that coming back into your DAW on a recording track. While the audio is on the board, you can mix it however you want and it will record. Make sure your effects return is routed to the output you’re recording on.
HI whats the maximum channel count into ableton please? Is it limited to 16 with USB and then 32 over a LAN? Thanks. 32 channels over USB would be dope, im hoping its possible
Yes, SQ can record 32x32 at 48K or 96K with the usb connection. The built in LAN connection is for using the Mixpad app to control the SQs. If you want to record with an SQ over LAN, you can add a Dante card.
What would I need to do to be able to mix FOH and send the midi to Logic? Would I be able to gang the main faders to the midi faders and have the ability to one person do my FOH and Livestream mix?
The only way it would be possible to run the audio faders and midi faders together would be with Gangs. The SQs only have 8 gangs though so it would not be practical. If you're looking to do the same mix in Logic, you may want to route your mix to a matrix and do additional processing in Logic on the mix. The other option would be to use the input direct outs and set them to follow the faders so you can send individual channels to Logic. This wouldn’t send midi though. In the Global direct out settings (under routing) you can select follow fader and where in the channel strip the direct output is taken from.
in order to write automation you need to do it on the DAW itself then the mixer will follow the movements?
Hey Carlo, the SQ is capable of writing fader and pan automation into your daw with relative ease. Same as recording automation with a mouse. I can do a video on setting this up if you like. You can also program the encoders to do specific CC commands in your daw. Conversely, you can use midi automation to control your mixer from your daw. Are you trying to write fader automation with your sq?
@@Johnbanthony Hello, sorry for the very late reply. I'm interested to get an SQ however im confused since the automation is not within the board itself but through a DAW. My Mackie d8b has its own onboard automation and i dont mess with my DAW. However it seems that today's digital mixers do not have touch sensitive automation onboard the desk. Well i have to understand well how this works. Will DAW automation works with CUBASE and the SQ? i hope this is not Protools only. Thanks
@@carlocalamatta1306 Yes, this will work with cubase. the Mackie and HUI midi protocols are both standardized, so you’ll be able to have cubase recognize the SQ without issue. The setup process may be different within Cubase though.
@@Johnbanthony is there a guideline on how to set it up with cubase?
Is it possible to automate cubase through SQ and use the mixer normally like using its preamps etc or once its on control surface mode its possible only that?
@@carlocalamatta1306 You can definitely write automation for Cubase with the SQ. As far as automation and running the preamps, there isn’t a super efficient way to control both at the same time. My recommendation would be to have the preamps on one fader layer and the midi channels on another. You could mix the preamps and midi on the same fader layer if you want, but that may get confusing.
Question ... first off, thank you for video, super helpful. Our use case is to mix live in the box using Protools, for a live broadcast. Main reason I would like to have something like this, is so we could save and recall scenes on the SQ, and it move faders in Protools. I would like this to save fader positions for various songs in a live set ... will this work with SQ or any Allen and Heath usb console?
With the way that HUI works, this may not work. When you first open protools it won’t change the faders based on where the SQ faders are. If this were to work, you’d want to open protools, then recall the scene change on the SQ with the fader positions. I haven’t tested this, but that would be the only work around I can think of. This is with the HUI protocol, so this would be the same issue with any midi controller.
@@Johnbanthony Logically, you’d think if faders move in ProTools when moving a fader on SQ, they would move anytime a fader moves on SQ, including when they move with a recalled scene change. But maybe not… if you have a way to test this, sure would be handy. That would come in so useful for live setting, but also to save different versions of a mix and recall to quickly compare. I use Reaper, which has built in snapshots, so can save and recall in a snap different mixes and settings.
@@OCDrummer74 The Fader movements are done via midi so because of how the protocol works, the faders only react when sent a message. When you open a session, at least in protools, no midi commands are sent from the daw until you hit play or manually change the midi. I’m not familiar with reaper snapshots, but as long as the snapshots “move” the faders, it should send the data to the physical faders.
@@Johnbanthony Did you mean fader movements done via midi in protools, or which direction were you referring to? Main thing trying to figure out if all fader movements on a SQ will be sent to protools? If recalling a scene in SQ which moves faders, will move faders in protools?
@@OCDrummer74 So I tested this out just now. The midi faders follow your command on the SQ and protools, but protools seems to have a priority. For example, if you change between PT sessions, the SQ faders follow, but there’s no way to save the SQ midi data to a scene. Even in the global scene filters, there’s no midi option. So they’ll lock in with protools even when changing between SQ scenes. To more directly answer the question, the SQ faders are following protools, rather than the other way around. This is likely because of how HUI works. I tried this out in Logic as well, and it was the same behavior. With Protools, if you’re on Flex or Studio, I’d go into the automation window and capture/record the fader postions. More of a work around, but that’s probably going to be your best bet. You could also set markers with different fader positions and use that to save settings
Nice
I want to now how we can do this same process with logic
Watch this video as well as this one: ua-cam.com/video/pHyK4YOoIi4/v-deo.html
Hey, thanks a lot for this!
Question from a newbie to DAW (me)
I’m running an SQ6 and i follow everything in this video on how to set it up.
But I’m lost when it comes to how the audio for each channel is patched.
Right now everything on my broadcast SQ6 is patched in from our mixrack(64)
How do i then patch that through the midi channels?
Does that make sense?
Thanks!
Unfortunately the HUI protocol doesn’t allow you to record and run midi at the same time. If you’d like to multi track record with your SQ, we’ve covered that in a different video.
Protools:
ua-cam.com/video/s76SlDOgIIo/v-deo.html
Logic:
ua-cam.com/video/VxzoxATlWQg/v-deo.html
Est-ce possible de connecter notre DAW à la console dans le but d'avoir autotune (chargé sur le DAW) en tant réel ?
You can connect to a DAW for recording but you will not be able to run in and out using the DAW as an insert for plugin effects. The built in effects can be used as an insert on a channel, but it will take away an effects send/return. While there is no built in autotune, I would try the doubler as an insert on your vocal channel.
thanks a lot !!
That's really interesting. So the SQ will be able to bank 24 channels at the time? (Instead of limited too only 8, as all other HUI controllers) It can be done because of the "layers" that the SQ has built in? Hope I got it right.😄
As example:
this is a 48 channel mixer right? So if I was mixing an 48 track session in Pro Tools, I could just use the two layers to bank 24 channels back and forth? That would be impressive.
The next question is. Can I route 48 channels, out of Pro Tools to the SQ, and basically mix on this board, like it was a analog mixer = mixing 48 track with the SQ onboard EQ & compression and, at the same time control faders and transport from Pro Tools? Also being able to write and read fader and mute automation?
The reason I'm asking, is that I'm a studio guy, growing tired of working ITB with just a mouse and a keyboard. I kind of missing the old analog day, not the sound, but because of the workflow. 🙂 And I'm not impressed with the ordinary controllers right now. 🙂
I'm interested to see, if it would be possible for me to mix a full studio album, using only the SQ as my main tool. With al the plugin add-on's and as much CPU power available?
I have looked at a lot of live consoles in this price range, and so far the SQ seems like the closest thing. I'm trying to see if I can figure out of the limitations of such a set-up = using the SQ only for mixing tasks in the studio. 🙂🙏
Sorry in advance, if I'm confusing things. I'm not a sound engineer. 😅
Thanks a lot.
So Yes, you would setup 3 HUI blocks of 8 in PT, and then you have 24 faders of the SQ to mix with. HUI lets you set up to 32, which is fine on the SQ7, for the SQ 5 or 6, you may only want to setup 2 or 3 HUI blocks(respectively) and you can dedicate one SQ fader layer to midi control over HUI. OR You can spread it out across 2 fader layers, totally your call. Personally, on an SQ6, I stick with one layer and bank up and down to get past the first 24 tracks. So with your example, yes I could mix 48 channels pressing two button to toggle between the first 24 channels and second 24 channels(one to bank up and one to bank back down). With all 3 boards, you can access every channel, even if you max out PT, as long as you set up the bank up and down buttons. The boards are super flexible, even with the confines of HUI running in blocks of 8. The "MIDI faders” are not limited to 48 channels, you just have to move based on how many blocks you set up (1-4, so 8, 16, 24, or 32 channels at a time)The faders are also super fast, and the track names from PT pop up on the scribble strip
As far as Mixing from PT into SQ. On paper, the answer is yes, you can mix 48 channels from your DAW into the SQ and use it like a studio console/summing mixer. Couple caveats once you get past 32 channels. First is that PT limits you to a 32x32 interface without a Protools Ultimate license. I’m a protools guy myself but rely on Logic when I need to get past that limitation or starting using outboard gear as inserts. If you want to max out the SQ channels as far as DAW connectivity goes, you’ll need PTU, or want to look at Logic, cubase, etc for when you want to do an otb mix bigger than 32 channels. With the SQ, the USB port taps out at 32x32, so to get 48 channels into the board, you’ll need either a waves or Dante card.
Hope this answers both of your questions. The SQs are super flexible, so it really depends on your preferences/work flow more than any limitations of the board.
You missed all the Text Display on the SQ, Also there is no color on the SQ for midi faders. WTF....
It displays the text on the strip. If you are having issues feel free to contact support on Allen & Heath's website.
If you have a video over this stuff, it'd be useful for me!!!