I like that the lights kinda shine a bit of green underneath the model -- VERY nice touch that SNW has been using in places where we saw solid colors in the original (such as the ENT bridge's lighting being Red overall)
one of the few things i was overjoyed with in picard was the romulan ship. i want one. maybe as a houseboat when i retire. "computer, two thirds impulse power, go that aways"
Love this version of the ship. And it really doesn’t look any more advanced to me. It’s just the TOS ship with more detail and green accents. My head canon placed it in TMP era but it works great here too. Once ENT established Romulan ships as being green or having green accents this far in the past, I think it makes perfect sense to fit the original BoP with green lighting. Plus if any BoP looked too advanced for the era, it is the ENT one
I agree. The ENT BoP looks much more like an evolution of the TOS than the TOS being the evolution of the ENT. SNW is a near-perfect modernization of TOS,This feeling of being more advanced is because the CGI is so much better than the old ones, that's all.
Indeed. It's like the D7 and the K'Tinga. I neevr thought they were that different. Like Sam said the wing lights (thrusters? impulse engines?) are probably the little bit overdone but even then you could argue it's needs to turn quick to get the torpedo to bear since that's it's primary offense. If they were like the Klingons you could see them using these well into the future since they wouldn't likely lose many ships due to their tactics of only engaging when they have superiority.
@@jeand5316 Though it seems like there is kind of the quirk that wasn't it suppose to be more like 100 years since the Federation had seen a Romulan ship than the 10-ish years it would be from this point in time, granted they might have finally admitted these shows are not in the classic universe, so less of an issue when various things are not congruent with shows before the reboot(s).
Look cool. I mean, these are the shipwrights who decided to paint a giant fucking "symbol of their empire" bird on the bottom of their *stealth* ship- dude, why?
What about this makes it look more "advanced" than it's old TOS counterpart? The hull plating? Honestly, I think we can move on from the TOS 'smooth hull' nonsense. The Romulans have always been advanced since we've seen them on screen. ENT established they've had a leg up on Federation members by at least a few hundred years. So, in my head-canon, this design is true canon for them. Kar Kantar's BoP in PIC was a relic they had laying around, and after the destruction of Romulus, had to pull out of mothballs.
Well you also have to consider that Humanity was the least technologically advanced member of the Federation at that time of ENT. Skip forward to TOS and humanity had adapted much of the member world technology into their starfleet, so I think it makes sense that Starfleet would have more comparable technology to the Romulans in the TOS era.
I never understand at this point of view. Even after almost 50 years every time they make a Star Wars movie they slavishly recreate the cockpit of the millennium falcon in minute detail. They would never say we are visually updating it or it's always looked like this just go along with that. Same with the ship exteriors, they may be CGI models now but they go through extreme effort to make sure they match the visual Canon established in 1974 - 76 when they came up with the designs. That's how you keep the visual continuity and recognizability of your franchise. They've made billions of dollars even with bad Star Wars material, you think the people in charge of Star Trek could learn a lesson or two.
@@Jack_Stafford the Millennium Falcon is a much, much better design than this bird of prey. The Enterprise itself has a strong silhouette and is recognizable around the world, but fans debate which versions look best, TOS, or refit (I’m partial to the refit myself) and should there be a smith hull, or aztech patterns is just a matter of personal taste.
Aside from Trek 2009 (which is off in an alternate reality and also excused by Borg tech in the comics), there's really nothing to say the post Nemesis era trek is SO much more advanced than the TOS era. It obviously is by quite a bit, but people think of tech progression in...well the way its been in the 20th and 21st century where a modern fighter jet will destroy a WW1 fighter 9999 times out of 10000. But its entirely plausible the difference between TOS and PIC eras is more akin to 1700 to 1800, or ay other two arbitrary dates. And thats not even accounting for the slightly weird ways tech sometimes develops depending on contexts - a bunch of WW2 era equipment like artillery for example is more damaging than modern stuff (though obviously you now have new tech like guidance)> A disruptor bolt from a TOS era BoP and a PIC era BoP may be hit with functionally the same energy the same way an explosive shell is basically the same thing across a century.
Well, there are a few major wrenches in that equation; namely, the Borg and the Dominion War, both of which necessitated (and sometimes facilitated) technological advancement, especially in combat. Having to adapt to both of those situations, we know the Federation came a long way (baby), and I'd doubt the RSE was sitting on their laurels while one of their chief rivals got bigger and badder.
@@Sephiroth144 They advanced yes, but there's nothing saying the yield of a photon torpedo from TOS is pathetic compared to a photon torpedo from DS9. Quantam torps seem to be the only actual weapon type change in a long time Everything else could easily be efficieny or incremental changes. Hell don't forget Starfleet went through a demilitirised period - I can easily imagine lost era / pre borg TNG ships being distinctly sub optimal at combat
@@Wirrn It does depend if you ignore the tech manuals; they detail a significant increase in the offensive/defensive effectiveness of weaponary (in both range and destructive yield). Plus there are some practical aspects, in addition to the power/range boosts- Phaser Arrays instead of Phaser Batteries, for example, giving significantly larger firing arcs. This isn't to say TOS-era ships were slouches- but they weren't up to par with the TNG-era ships.
@@Sephiroth144 oh I'd still expect a later era ship to have an advantage, and a war era oen will definitely win. I'm just not so sure they could shrug off a TOS ship without even trying
I have seen photo's of the model that was filmed in TOS, and the engine nacelles had glass domes on the front of them that were frosted from the inside. An Asian model builder had designed and built the filming model in about a 3 week period, and was suppose to get credit in the shows end credits, however they said that he wasn't in the Hollywood Prop makers guild, so they either gave credit to Matt Jefferies, or to no one. It was said that the modeler took the model and destroyed it, and thus episodes later in The Enterprise Incident they used 3 shots of the Klingon D7 model as use for Romulan Ships and remarked on Screen that the Romulans and Klingons must have been trading technologies. Then in the Digital remastered version they put in the Bird of Prey again. Anyway the Blueprints from the Technical Manual/ era 1973 to 1975 have always had the Engine Nacelles placed to high with the wing/pylons at to much of an angle. The AMT models reflect this fact and it slightly had to have altered the decals to make it work but since the company basically used the Blueprints and not a model they just made it that way. They also have balls on the front of the Nacelles instead of the inset glass. This has been fixed in the last 10 to 15 years though by more modern model designs. Ever since the Romulans became that Green color association in TNG I thought the lighting on the TOS BOP for the engine nacelles should be green lights, so I am glad that they seem to agree with that.
*POINT!:* let it be noted that it is named throughout the episode here and 60 years ago, as *plasma weapon* never *plasma torpedo* and this episode in particular is a huge turning point in favor of *weapon* and not *torpedo,* as we now canonically see the plasma hadoken being formed in front of the ship as opposed to being launched FROM the ship. it's a plasma hadoken, NOT a torpedo! I now have to go back and dust off Bridge Commander, and change the tracking of the romulan torpedo to 0. it's a cannon ball, not a guided weapon.
in which case i wondered why the enterprise didn't appear to attempt any evasive maneuver out of the path of the plasma ball? was their forward momentum too high to strafe/turn at all?
@@bcn1gh7h4wk the shot was fired at a much further range than the shot fired at the Farragut, which has just completed a fairly aerobatic maneuver. The enterprise should be even more capable of a ship but the crew didn't seem to even attempt any evasion despite having apparently several seconds of time to do so...
@@nemesis1588 Of course, who the hell was piloting the Farragut? Okay, we've climbed, the Captain said "get behind them", but I think we should just cross their T where their death ball comes from...
I like this design, and it works for SNW. The TOS BoP is one of my favorite designs and I love pretty much all iterations of it. Actually wished they'd have kept a similar aesthetic in TNG, rather than the D'deridex. The only version I don't like is the Enterprise one. Honestly, that thing looked more like something out of TNG.
The one thing I was disappointed with is the Bird Motif; the more angular one from Picard didn't have the same vibe... and we saw the TOS version on a few of the "regular" Birds of Prey during the Fleet action... (Which makes me wonder, did they accidentally use the wrong mesh/skin for the Hero Romulan ship?)
Also, I'm wondering if, during ship combat (like during the Farragut moment), the BoP was using a lower powered shot, (similar to the DS in Rogue One); they seemed to get the plasma weapon shot off far faster, and with less power drain, that the base killer shots.
About the plasma torpedo- it lost power much, much faster in SNW than in TOS- it faded out in TOS only after thirty seconds at warp four, which would have been a much longer range than in SNW. Thoughts?
My thoughts there are that Sulu, McCoy, Stiles etc. were specifically brought onto the Enterprise BY Captain Kirk, or perhaps, that several crew leave when Pike does.
@@JustSumGuy01 why not? Ortegas could be chief of security by now, actually, she's at the weapons officer/navigator station. Scotty could have been destined for the Enterprise anyway, after all, SNW is no stranger to fate.
@@MajorMagna True but after 7 + year in service, you move up. In this future timeline, both #1 and La'an moved on and Uhura came back and later became a Lt after completely Academy training
Yeah. I think one of the proble.s a lot of trekkies have are the ships being "too advanced", but you have to remember that the original was designed in the 60s, when things weren't as advanced, so modernising the ships makes sense.
I never quite understand that point of view. The Star Wars ships were created in the mid-70s and every time they make a Star Wars movie, even close to 50 years later, they slavishly recreate the cockpit of the millennium falcon precisely, down to every switch and light. They would never think of introducing a modernized one saying "this is how it always was", or we have more realistic modern looking methods now so just get used to it. Same for the exteriors, they may be CG models now, but they make sure that the CG models exactly match the original millennium falcon x-wings Star destroyer etc from the original movie. To try to visually update them would be an absolute travesty to any Canon integrity that it has left. I don't know why people think it's okay to play so free and loose with Star Trek visual continuity. Even at its worst Star Wars has made billions of dollars you think the producers of Star Trek could learn a lesson or two from them.
@@Jack_Stafford Yes, but there's a difference between SW and ST, namely, SW is more like the new ST, with detail. They do create more newer ships, it's just that the Falcon is an old rust bucket, being flown by a pirate.
@@Jack_Stafford The entire first season of TOS had the budget of the original Star Wars. Each episode of modern Trek has a budget five times that of TOS. They didn't have the money in 1966 to make things as elaborately. There's also a major difference as well between what Star Wars and Star Trek were trying to do with their visuals. Star Wars' visuals are meant to be in the past, so we accept them as a thing of the past. Star Trek though, is meant to be the future, and if it doesn't reflect the current day's view of the future it will look dated. Modern Trek is basically just updating the visuals with a higher budget (except the Discovery Klingons, which are just wrong).
Regarding the: "They didn't change it, it's the exact same." for the Picard and SNW variants i am kind of OK with it. After all the Klingon Bird of Prey wasn't changed in a hundred years either (from the design on the outside) and was also still "a force to be reckoned with" a hundred years later in the Dominion war. So why not give the same courtesy to the Romulan Bird of Prey?
In balance of terror it is stated the federation has not had contact with romulan since the war! These people just do what evar the please. This is why I do not watch anymore!
According to Memory Alpha, the TOS ship is classified as a Bird of Prey, whereas the Warbird name wasn't used till TNG (not withstanding one use of the name in Enterprise).
The "Klingon" bird of prey was originally designed to be a romulan ship on star trek 3 but very late in production the story was changed to have the klingons be the antagonist.
A fine ship, not so bad a use (for Disco-verse), but still the wrong era. This ship made sense in PICARD, when it could be seen as a later model that had been further updated through the years. But in what it is still Pre-TOS? Well, it's like seeing the TMP Constitution refit flying about. Which is sort of the case, come to think about it. Especially when it has a plasma weapon which is supposed to be a new weapon in "Balance of Terror". Yes, what with Romulan ships in ENTERPRISE, this is easier accept, and make sense with an interstellar empire that's been around for centuries, but I'm dismayed that "Balance of Terror" , the story that 'started it all' regarding the Romulans is increasingly the 'odd one out' in canon.
I don't know which is my favorite, but since the word "antique" can mean as little as 20 years old when talking about vehicles and electronics, the antique Bird of Prey in Picard could have been built as late as 2379. There's no way it is anywhere near the same age as the TOS model, not by any stretch of the imagination. If you haven't read John Byrne's Romulans graphic novel, do yourself a favor and read it ASAP. It's the closest a comic about the Romulans has come to being as good as Diane Duane's Rihannsu novels.
Fans need to get over the visual updating of these ships/sets. They all look great. 1701 has never looked better, and the BoP looks fantastic while clearly being the TOS ship.
I like this modernized in Bird of Prey. I just wish the hull was a little softer and smoother. The thrust engines on the "wings" don't please me so much, especially being green. But overall it's a great upgrade, and definitely better than the TOS version. Edit: I also wanted them to take off that "cap" on top of the bussard collector. It's a little weird.
Well, I like the plasma torpedo effect. But I don't like the the Picard version, So I wasn't happy to see it was the same ship.. I don't like the new bird logo either.
Sometimes we have to remind ourselves that Star Trek still is a Budget show. Meaning, if you break down the overall money that Kurtzman got for all of the shows to the actual amount per episode, it is really a tight budget. So it’s not surprising that they cut corners wherever they can, including reusing as many CG models as possible or incorporating STO ships. I’m fine with that, since on the other hand we finally see a TOS romulan fleet that is more than BoP and D7 designs. Also, the AR wall isn’t cheap either. So yeah, it’s definitely better than nothing.
It's like people on UA-cam going "look I made Data's face perfect all by myself" without mentioning that they weren't constrained by a TV show's budget or production timelines.
discovery and SNW have made me respect ST Enterprise so much more. Unlike discovery and SNW, Enterprise was a prequel that gave new stories, rather than re-writing known history/lore. It had older ships, that made sense while still looking good on screen.
Great job as always gents. I like this design. Hopefully, Kurtzman's people will finally admit that his Star Trek is its own world/universe of Star Trek. That way all the continuity problems (which irk me immensely) will go away.
"Doesn't fit in well with the rest of the universe" - nothing from New Trek ever did or ever will just seamlessly fit in with a decades-old design aesthetic and it's time to make peace with that.
Yup. You really can't expect it to be the same as a design from 50 years ago. TOS designs work well in Lower Decks because of their simple aesthetic, but in live action it's not the same.
@@jeand5316 I agree but I also like the idea of the retro cool future look and I think with more subtle modernizations, the original designs still hold up for the most part
@@jeand5316 I never understand at this point of view. Even after almost 50 years every time they make a Star Wars movie they slavishly recreate the cockpit of the millennium falcon in minute detail. They would never say we are visually updating it or it's always looked like this just go along with that. Same with the ship exteriors, they may be CGI models now but they go through extreme effort to make sure they match the visual Canon established in 1974 - 76 when they came up with the designs. That's how you keep the visual continuity and recognizability of your franchise. They've made billions of dollars even with bad Star Wars material, you think the people in charge of Star Trek could learn a lesson or two.
@@Jack_Stafford That's because the Star Wars designs aren't much to update. They work with modern CGI, this because of their high detail that they already had at the time. TOS ships are not known for being very detailed and therefore in need of modernization.
Love the torpedo effect, especially when it destroys the asteroid. I remember really wanting to see that on-screen in TOS as a kid
I like that the lights kinda shine a bit of green underneath the model -- VERY nice touch that SNW has been using in places where we saw solid colors in the original (such as the ENT bridge's lighting being Red overall)
Danke!
🖖😎👍very well done indeed guys, the Romulan Bird or Prey has always been one of my all time favorites 👌
one of the few things i was overjoyed with in picard was the romulan ship. i want one. maybe as a houseboat when i retire. "computer, two thirds impulse power, go that aways"
Love this version of the ship. And it really doesn’t look any more advanced to me. It’s just the TOS ship with more detail and green accents. My head canon placed it in TMP era but it works great here too.
Once ENT established Romulan ships as being green or having green accents this far in the past, I think it makes perfect sense to fit the original BoP with green lighting. Plus if any BoP looked too advanced for the era, it is the ENT one
I agree. The ENT BoP looks much more like an evolution of the TOS than the TOS being the evolution of the ENT. SNW is a near-perfect modernization of TOS,This feeling of being more advanced is because the CGI is so much better than the old ones, that's all.
Indeed. It's like the D7 and the K'Tinga. I neevr thought they were that different. Like Sam said the wing lights (thrusters? impulse engines?) are probably the little bit overdone but even then you could argue it's needs to turn quick to get the torpedo to bear since that's it's primary offense. If they were like the Klingons you could see them using these well into the future since they wouldn't likely lose many ships due to their tactics of only engaging when they have superiority.
@@jeand5316 Though it seems like there is kind of the quirk that wasn't it suppose to be more like 100 years since the Federation had seen a Romulan ship than the 10-ish years it would be from this point in time, granted they might have finally admitted these shows are not in the classic universe, so less of an issue when various things are not congruent with shows before the reboot(s).
Good morning gentlemen, Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this ship and topic
The Eaglemoss version of Picard's BOP has the struts with the glow ribbing as well. Just a re-use of the Picard model.
What does the 'rudder' do on the back of the main hull? It looks like a control surface for flying through an atmosphere.
Look cool.
I mean, these are the shipwrights who decided to paint a giant fucking "symbol of their empire" bird on the bottom of their *stealth* ship- dude, why?
The one thing that almost everyone gets wrong about the BoP is its size. In TOS, it was barely the size of the Enterprise's saucer section.
What about this makes it look more "advanced" than it's old TOS counterpart? The hull plating? Honestly, I think we can move on from the TOS 'smooth hull' nonsense. The Romulans have always been advanced since we've seen them on screen. ENT established they've had a leg up on Federation members by at least a few hundred years. So, in my head-canon, this design is true canon for them. Kar Kantar's BoP in PIC was a relic they had laying around, and after the destruction of Romulus, had to pull out of mothballs.
Well you also have to consider that Humanity was the least technologically advanced member of the Federation at that time of ENT. Skip forward to TOS and humanity had adapted much of the member world technology into their starfleet, so I think it makes sense that Starfleet would have more comparable technology to the Romulans in the TOS era.
I never understand at this point of view. Even after almost 50 years every time they make a Star Wars movie they slavishly recreate the cockpit of the millennium falcon in minute detail. They would never say we are visually updating it or it's always looked like this just go along with that. Same with the ship exteriors, they may be CGI models now but they go through extreme effort to make sure they match the visual Canon established in 1974 - 76 when they came up with the designs. That's how you keep the visual continuity and recognizability of your franchise. They've made billions of dollars even with bad Star Wars material, you think the people in charge of Star Trek could learn a lesson or two.
In a few hundred years why is a smooth hull nonsense?
@@Jack_Stafford the Millennium Falcon is a much, much better design than this bird of prey. The Enterprise itself has a strong silhouette and is recognizable around the world, but fans debate which versions look best, TOS, or refit (I’m partial to the refit myself) and should there be a smith hull, or aztech patterns is just a matter of personal taste.
Nonsense. Designs are canon. And should look 100% identical as in TOS. Star wars ships always look identical as they looked in Original trilogy.
I'm def a simp for Romulan ship designs. Especially the D'deridex
eaglemoss can just stick the plasma torpedo on the front as some orange plastic thingy and sell it for that reason
Or put in that wide "muzzle" for the torpedo in the front- Genius, Farmer, Genius!
Wish they showed different types of plasmas like in the SFB game.
Aside from Trek 2009 (which is off in an alternate reality and also excused by Borg tech in the comics), there's really nothing to say the post Nemesis era trek is SO much more advanced than the TOS era. It obviously is by quite a bit, but people think of tech progression in...well the way its been in the 20th and 21st century where a modern fighter jet will destroy a WW1 fighter 9999 times out of 10000. But its entirely plausible the difference between TOS and PIC eras is more akin to 1700 to 1800, or ay other two arbitrary dates. And thats not even accounting for the slightly weird ways tech sometimes develops depending on contexts - a bunch of WW2 era equipment like artillery for example is more damaging than modern stuff (though obviously you now have new tech like guidance)>
A disruptor bolt from a TOS era BoP and a PIC era BoP may be hit with functionally the same energy the same way an explosive shell is basically the same thing across a century.
Well, there are a few major wrenches in that equation; namely, the Borg and the Dominion War, both of which necessitated (and sometimes facilitated) technological advancement, especially in combat. Having to adapt to both of those situations, we know the Federation came a long way (baby), and I'd doubt the RSE was sitting on their laurels while one of their chief rivals got bigger and badder.
@@Sephiroth144 They advanced yes, but there's nothing saying the yield of a photon torpedo from TOS is pathetic compared to a photon torpedo from DS9. Quantam torps seem to be the only actual weapon type change in a long time
Everything else could easily be efficieny or incremental changes. Hell don't forget Starfleet went through a demilitirised period - I can easily imagine lost era / pre borg TNG ships being distinctly sub optimal at combat
@@Wirrn It does depend if you ignore the tech manuals; they detail a significant increase in the offensive/defensive effectiveness of weaponary (in both range and destructive yield).
Plus there are some practical aspects, in addition to the power/range boosts- Phaser Arrays instead of Phaser Batteries, for example, giving significantly larger firing arcs.
This isn't to say TOS-era ships were slouches- but they weren't up to par with the TNG-era ships.
@@Sephiroth144 oh I'd still expect a later era ship to have an advantage, and a war era oen will definitely win.
I'm just not so sure they could shrug off a TOS ship without even trying
I have seen photo's of the model that was filmed in TOS, and the engine nacelles had glass domes on the front of them that were frosted from the inside. An Asian model builder had designed and built the filming model in about a 3 week period, and was suppose to get credit in the shows end credits, however they said that he wasn't in the Hollywood Prop makers guild, so they either gave credit to Matt Jefferies, or to no one. It was said that the modeler took the model and destroyed it, and thus episodes later in The Enterprise Incident they used 3 shots of the Klingon D7 model as use for Romulan Ships and remarked on Screen that the Romulans and Klingons must have been trading technologies.
Then in the Digital remastered version they put in the Bird of Prey again.
Anyway the Blueprints from the Technical Manual/ era 1973 to 1975 have always had the Engine Nacelles placed to high with the wing/pylons at to much of an angle. The AMT models reflect this fact and it slightly had to have altered the decals to make it work but since the company basically used the Blueprints and not a model they just made it that way. They also have balls on the front of the Nacelles instead of the inset glass. This has been fixed in the last 10 to 15 years though by more modern model designs.
Ever since the Romulans became that Green color association in TNG I thought the lighting on the TOS BOP for the engine nacelles should be green lights, so I am glad that they seem to agree with that.
I wonder if this version of the Romulan Bird or Prey has good enough sensors to be able to identify a mining ship?
*POINT!:*
let it be noted that it is named throughout the episode here and 60 years ago, as *plasma weapon*
never *plasma torpedo*
and this episode in particular is a huge turning point in favor of *weapon* and not *torpedo,* as we now canonically see the plasma hadoken being formed in front of the ship as opposed to being launched FROM the ship.
it's a plasma hadoken, NOT a torpedo!
I now have to go back and dust off Bridge Commander, and change the tracking of the romulan torpedo to 0.
it's a cannon ball, not a guided weapon.
in which case i wondered why the enterprise didn't appear to attempt any evasive maneuver out of the path of the plasma ball? was their forward momentum too high to strafe/turn at all?
@@nemesis1588 at close range, it's almost impossible.
@@bcn1gh7h4wk the shot was fired at a much further range than the shot fired at the Farragut, which has just completed a fairly aerobatic maneuver. The enterprise should be even more capable of a ship but the crew didn't seem to even attempt any evasion despite having apparently several seconds of time to do so...
@@nemesis1588 The Prometheus School of Running was a required course at Starfleet Academy.
@@nemesis1588 Of course, who the hell was piloting the Farragut? Okay, we've climbed, the Captain said "get behind them", but I think we should just cross their T where their death ball comes from...
I like this design, and it works for SNW. The TOS BoP is one of my favorite designs and I love pretty much all iterations of it. Actually wished they'd have kept a similar aesthetic in TNG, rather than the D'deridex. The only version I don't like is the Enterprise one. Honestly, that thing looked more like something out of TNG.
You should do a video of the modernized monster maroon uniform
The one thing I was disappointed with is the Bird Motif; the more angular one from Picard didn't have the same vibe... and we saw the TOS version on a few of the "regular" Birds of Prey during the Fleet action...
(Which makes me wonder, did they accidentally use the wrong mesh/skin for the Hero Romulan ship?)
Also, I'm wondering if, during ship combat (like during the Farragut moment), the BoP was using a lower powered shot, (similar to the DS in Rogue One); they seemed to get the plasma weapon shot off far faster, and with less power drain, that the base killer shots.
About the plasma torpedo- it lost power much, much faster in SNW than in TOS- it faded out in TOS only after thirty seconds at warp four, which would have been a much longer range than in SNW.
Thoughts?
It also did a bit less damage in TOS because of that.
@@gawainethefirst I'm really not sure about that.
It's pretty clear in the episode that had it hit the Enterprise dead on, that would have been it.
They did get rid of some of the random green lights that were one the wings that were all over it.
what an episode, look forward to you farragut examination
I was really hoping in the future timeline, they'd change the bridge crew even more so or even introduce Sulu
My thoughts there are that Sulu, McCoy, Stiles etc. were specifically brought onto the Enterprise BY Captain Kirk, or perhaps, that several crew leave when Pike does.
@@MajorMagna But for some reason Scotty is here...sorta
@@MajorMagna Sure but after 7 years, Ortegas still here?
@@JustSumGuy01 why not? Ortegas could be chief of security by now, actually, she's at the weapons officer/navigator station. Scotty could have been destined for the Enterprise anyway, after all, SNW is no stranger to fate.
@@MajorMagna True but after 7 + year in service, you move up. In this future timeline, both #1 and La'an moved on and Uhura came back and later became a Lt after completely Academy training
Yeah. I think one of the proble.s a lot of trekkies have are the ships being "too advanced", but you have to remember that the original was designed in the 60s, when things weren't as advanced, so modernising the ships makes sense.
I never quite understand that point of view. The Star Wars ships were created in the mid-70s and every time they make a Star Wars movie, even close to 50 years later, they slavishly recreate the cockpit of the millennium falcon precisely, down to every switch and light.
They would never think of introducing a modernized one saying "this is how it always was", or we have more realistic modern looking methods now so just get used to it.
Same for the exteriors, they may be CG models now, but they make sure that the CG models exactly match the original millennium falcon x-wings Star destroyer etc from the original movie.
To try to visually update them would be an absolute travesty to any Canon integrity that it has left. I don't know why people think it's okay to play so free and loose with Star Trek visual continuity.
Even at its worst Star Wars has made billions of dollars you think the producers of Star Trek could learn a lesson or two from them.
@@Jack_Stafford Yes, but there's a difference between SW and ST, namely, SW is more like the new ST, with detail. They do create more newer ships, it's just that the Falcon is an old rust bucket, being flown by a pirate.
@@Jack_Stafford The entire first season of TOS had the budget of the original Star Wars. Each episode of modern Trek has a budget five times that of TOS. They didn't have the money in 1966 to make things as elaborately. There's also a major difference as well between what Star Wars and Star Trek were trying to do with their visuals. Star Wars' visuals are meant to be in the past, so we accept them as a thing of the past. Star Trek though, is meant to be the future, and if it doesn't reflect the current day's view of the future it will look dated. Modern Trek is basically just updating the visuals with a higher budget (except the Discovery Klingons, which are just wrong).
Regarding the: "They didn't change it, it's the exact same." for the Picard and SNW variants i am kind of OK with it.
After all the Klingon Bird of Prey wasn't changed in a hundred years either (from the design on the outside) and was also still "a force to be reckoned with" a hundred years later in the Dominion war. So why not give the same courtesy to the Romulan Bird of Prey?
The irony of the Eaglemoss comment haha
In balance of terror it is stated the federation has not had contact with romulan since the war! These people just do what evar the please. This is why I do not watch anymore!
foley survived the canadian internet wars
Romulan War Bird. Bird of Prey is a klingon ship.
In fact, the Romulan Bird of Prey came earlier than the Klingon version, in TOS. The Klingon BoP would only appear in the TMP era.
According to Memory Alpha, the TOS ship is classified as a Bird of Prey, whereas the Warbird name wasn't used till TNG (not withstanding one use of the name in Enterprise).
The "Klingon" bird of prey was originally designed to be a romulan ship on star trek 3 but very late in production the story was changed to have the klingons be the antagonist.
What if the manhaim project had reopened leading to the burn?
Enterprise version too
A fine ship, not so bad a use (for Disco-verse), but still the wrong era. This ship made sense in PICARD, when it could be seen as a later model that had been further updated through the years. But in what it is still Pre-TOS? Well, it's like seeing the TMP Constitution refit flying about. Which is sort of the case, come to think about it.
Especially when it has a plasma weapon which is supposed to be a new weapon in "Balance of Terror". Yes, what with Romulan ships in ENTERPRISE, this is easier accept, and make sense with an interstellar empire that's been around for centuries, but I'm dismayed that "Balance of Terror" , the story that 'started it all' regarding the Romulans is increasingly the 'odd one out' in canon.
I don't know which is my favorite, but since the word "antique" can mean as little as 20 years old when talking about vehicles and electronics, the antique Bird of Prey in Picard could have been built as late as 2379. There's no way it is anywhere near the same age as the TOS model, not by any stretch of the imagination. If you haven't read John Byrne's Romulans graphic novel, do yourself a favor and read it ASAP. It's the closest a comic about the Romulans has come to being as good as Diane Duane's Rihannsu novels.
Fans need to get over the visual updating of these ships/sets. They all look great. 1701 has never looked better, and the BoP looks fantastic while clearly being the TOS ship.
Just consume product. Never think. Consume next product. Never think. 🤡
@@neondemon5137 Not sure what you're talking about. Lots of ST I don't consume b/c I don't like it. I happen to like these updates.
I think most fans have. These two in particular really haven't.
You need to get over that some fans think the older designs are better.
@@Hunter12396 they are going the way of blackberry fans.
I like this modernized in Bird of Prey. I just wish the hull was a little softer and smoother. The thrust engines on the "wings" don't please me so much, especially being green. But overall it's a great upgrade, and definitely better than the TOS version.
Edit: I also wanted them to take off that "cap" on top of the bussard collector. It's a little weird.
I see the green on the wings gives it more of active heat exchanger after declocking.
"What's eaglemoss going to sell".....heheh. Well after todays news, probably very little.
Well, I like the plasma torpedo effect. But I don't like the the Picard version, So I wasn't happy to see it was the same ship.. I don't like the new bird logo either.
Sometimes we have to remind ourselves that Star Trek still is a Budget show. Meaning, if you break down the overall money that Kurtzman got for all of the shows to the actual amount per episode, it is really a tight budget. So it’s not surprising that they cut corners wherever they can, including reusing as many CG models as possible or incorporating STO ships. I’m fine with that, since on the other hand we finally see a TOS romulan fleet that is more than BoP and D7 designs. Also, the AR wall isn’t cheap either. So yeah, it’s definitely better than nothing.
then the solution is to stop producing as many shows and to focus on some of the quality of their designs as well.
It's like people on UA-cam going "look I made Data's face perfect all by myself" without mentioning that they weren't constrained by a TV show's budget or production timelines.
discovery and SNW have made me respect ST Enterprise so much more. Unlike discovery and SNW, Enterprise was a prequel that gave new stories, rather than re-writing known history/lore. It had older ships, that made sense while still looking good on screen.
#Romulanthunderchicken
A good looking ship, even if I am no fan of modern Star Trek outside of Pridigy.
Eaglemoss is not selling anything unfortunately 😢
🙂👍🏽🖖🏽📽
Great job as always gents. I like this design. Hopefully, Kurtzman's people will finally admit that his Star Trek is its own world/universe of Star Trek. That way all the continuity problems (which irk me immensely) will go away.
The TOS version looks very nonsensical and comically bad
"Doesn't fit in well with the rest of the universe" - nothing from New Trek ever did or ever will just seamlessly fit in with a decades-old design aesthetic and it's time to make peace with that.
Yup. You really can't expect it to be the same as a design from 50 years ago. TOS designs work well in Lower Decks because of their simple aesthetic, but in live action it's not the same.
@@jeand5316 I agree but I also like the idea of the retro cool future look and I think with more subtle modernizations, the original designs still hold up for the most part
@@jeand5316 I never understand at this point of view. Even after almost 50 years every time they make a Star Wars movie they slavishly recreate the cockpit of the millennium falcon in minute detail. They would never say we are visually updating it or it's always looked like this just go along with that. Same with the ship exteriors, they may be CGI models now but they go through extreme effort to make sure they match the visual Canon established in 1974 - 76 when they came up with the designs. That's how you keep the visual continuity and recognizability of your franchise. They've made billions of dollars even with bad Star Wars material, you think the people in charge of Star Trek could learn a lesson or two.
@@Jack_Stafford That's because the Star Wars designs aren't much to update. They work with modern CGI, this because of their high detail that they already had at the time. TOS ships are not known for being very detailed and therefore in need of modernization.
@@jeand5316 Star Wars ships are also meant to be historical, whereas Star Trek is futuristic