i'm not having fun playing yu-gi-oh
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- Опубліковано 28 сер 2024
- TCG, man.
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He's so much more articulate and communicative without chat being annoying around him. Great fucking video.
he´s also not shackled by talking about bussys - really a clear moment
@@DerEliteBaum literally 1984
Joel
As someone who streams too, the less you have to focus on your game the better you can communicate.
@@DerEliteBaum You might say he's in a Clear Mind State after synchro summoning fishes.
Today's Ygo is like 90% scoop and 10% games that are actually fun and last more than 3 turns.
You cant really blame people for scooping, if they got a bad hand or something then it's not like they can recover in a game which only has a single turn due to the ever increasing speed of the game
in old yugioh. if you bricked then you didt get otk'd by 5 xyz monsters or whatever else extra deck monster so people did not scoop as much as there's still a chance of victory with modern yugioh yea if you get a bad hand then you just leave the match, it's kinda a coin flip in that regard you ether draw the thing you need or you just lose
for me that kinda gameplay just sucks
@@bob74h67eople scoop way too early. I check people's decks all the time after a win and most of the time they literally could top decked into the card they needed to get themselves out of bad situation and they would had been fine. Gone are the days of people at least trying to comeback, but the power creep of the game is responsible for people scooping so early.
@@JuwanBuchanan
''people scoop way too early''
There's no reason to stay an extra turn because if you mess the first turn then you lose, So you just scoop
there is no reason to just stay there and watch you lose for no reason other then ig as to not annoy you but nobody really cares about that
If im playing say smash bros and im to lose 2 stocks, It's entirely possible that im able to make a come back not likely ofc but you can do it with modern yugioh if you mess up the turn then it's a otk
''most of the time they literally could top decked into the card they needed to get themselves out of bad situation''
Even if your right, and they waited one turn then they would of won
the problem being, Everyone has a full board by turn 1 so they would of never made to turn 3 to even draw that card so it's best they just quit at that point as there's no point in watching you spam cards for 16 minutes when you can start another game that you may win rather then watching your defeat with nothing you can do to stop it
May wanna change those numbers to 99% scoop and 1% actually fun.
@@bob74h67 yea i agree with you i don't want to waste my time gambling in my top deck.
Better start new game
That defeated "nothing" when asking what's going to change from Konami. Man I felt that in my soul
We try to pretend Konami actually cares but if the PT and MGS incidents are any indication they do not.
I hope this kind of video and the noise that it will make can maybe change something... (or at least create a domino effect and some other yugituber will talk about this issue)
@@maximek6652 I have a sneaking suspicion we'd need Japanese people to say the same points for anything to get noticed lol
Me with my significant other
@@ashikjaman1940 But since in the OCG Yugioh are not expensive (in a competitive point of view), I fear they will never have our frustration or anger that could push them to act like us ...
Hey just wanted to say this. During YCS Philly, MBT was constantly being approached by fans, myself included. It looked exhausting, but he didn't turn a single fan down. Nothing but love for MBT! Keep being a cool dude.
Man this video is therapeutic af. Thank you for being the representation of the player base that we wish Konami could've been. Instead they're too busy printing cards that will kill their own game.
It's reasons like this that make me appreciate History of Jank so much. Helps shine a light on fun decks that may not be the best but are different enough to be interesting and potentially game winning.
''Just draw the out bro'' is new meta.
just open droll bro
Draw the out is not an exclusive thing to this format tho
new?
It's been the meta for at least 4 years
That was the meta for a while now. In Tear it was draw the shifter or lose, for example.
It's interesting. I specifically remember watching the reveal for the big 3 go second cards (Nibiru, Shifter, and DRnM.) At the time all I could think of was "This is going to create an arms race between board breakers and outs."
And yeah, that's pretty much what's happened.
Don't you love decks that can brute force through Dark Ruler No More? That's the stupidest one to me that you could possibly play past. At least with Shifter it doesn't affect all decks and Nibiru you can play around it a bit and your opponent has to make the right call on when to Nib based on your actions.
Dark Ruler though? It's so stupid that you can brute force your way through it. Crossout the Dark Ruler. Or Chain a backrow and use an effect like Hot Red RDA to negate the Dark Ruler.
@@Powerman293 I think beating out DRNM is fine.
The card is designed to be the blowout answer to monster end boards. Having a S/T counter to it or interactions to reach that counter is interesting enough, albeit generic answers are a bit sacky (though if someone crosses out your DRNM, they probably deserve it more; they're running DRNM going first).
If it was designed to be a be all end all answer, they would have made spells and traps unable to respond to it.
That was exactly my reaction to them as well. Although, to be honest, there have been a few points before that where I was thinking that as well. I think back in 2016 or 2017, I started wondering how long it's going to take for monsters to be unaffected by effects on a frequent basis, and what Konami is going to do to out them, and here we are, with cards that remove other cards by game mechanic (and while they have existed before already, they're now getting printed much more regularly).
@@tobiasfrey2793 What was the last generic card that "remove monster by game mechanics" that actually saw play? They aren't printing them more regularly at all. Hence why Kaiju (and Santa Claw), Golem and Sphere are still insane : they never printed any card as insane as those. And they're all very old cards.
@@claire6452 Isn't Thestalos the shadow firestorm monarch a new one of those?
Mtg's communication with the playerbase is absolutely wild. The lead designer, in addition to writing a weekly column covering stuff like how they approached building the latest sets, general philosophy on making sets, where previous sets have gone wrong, etc, also answers fan questions daily on his tumblr and has a podcast about various design aspects of magic.
Crazy that yugioh has to settle for "yeah therell be a ban list eventually or whatever"
Mark Rosewater?
@@KreuzDrache yeah Mark Rosewater is mtg's lead designer
I'd be careful about singing MTG's praises right now.
The parent company seems hellbent on pissing off the fan bases of both their flagship products over the last two quarters.
Not to mention Mark is not really all that great. Not the worse thing about modern Magic, but definitely has a few bug bears.
Communicating with the playerbase by sending the Pinkertons to their house
I was lucky enough to play in locals where everyone wanted to play rogue for a weekend. It was my True Draco Metalfoes Deck vs Invoked Dogmatika Shaddoll that someone not only decided to play but was also really good with. Our duel went 10+ turns where we both had plays every turn and both kept coming back every turn after we cleared each other's boards. This was in the middle of Tear 0 format. It was the last time I had fun playing Yu-Gi-Oh.
I'm in complete agreement with this, Konami absolutely needs to communicate with the fans nowadays. It is such an archaic policy to remain as silent as they have about literally every facet of yugioh. Also I'm glad to hear you aren't getting burnt out. Your content was what got me back into playing yugioh myself after a several year drought.
WHAT HAPPENED WITH ARC-V, ALREADY?!?
They started remaining silent after we roasted them for the glow-up bulb limit lmao
*TF2 players looking at Yugioh TCG players* First time?
Yes, I know this is a bad meme, but that was what I was thinking during the communication section.
@@midn8588 I mean you joke but I feel like this hits on the crux of the issue. Any answer that Konami gives will never satisfy the playerbase. So when they communicate it pretty much invariably leads to some form of backlash, so why put the effort in?
It’s just a Japanese thing. It’s how Japanese companies do business and it’s jarring to a western audience because western companies are very communicative with consumers
Dude, I watch you (and other creators) because I'm literally so over it. I love the game but damn I feel you.
I hate current meta cuz all the current hand traps are just annoying to face, gamma and droll are rlly unfun, and considering my main deck marincess loses to ghost ogre, gamma, and has weaker boards with droll c it’s rlly annoying to play without crossout
@@penguin5848 hand traps are a “necessary evil” but made this game less about creative deck building and more about drop rent money on cards or auto lose and even then you can maybe auto lose…. Cause losing the die roll
@@bloodarcher7841 powercreep got so bad they can only band-aid it with more powerful cards. The loop repeats infinitely.
The sad part is that konami does it on purpose. It's good for them to sell us expensive cardboard and the meta that beats the old meta skyrockets.
@@bloodarcher7841 I understand but some hand traps like dshifter and droll just remove any skill in certain matchups, like wow you opened d shifter against marincess, guess i auto lose. Oh you opened droll against superheavy? Awesome!!
ive started playing ygo when the first product hit europe. i was young so at first i only played casually but later full on competitive with some decent achievements in maybe back then the strongest regional in the world ( munich ). i stopped playing ygo at around the last time dragon rulers were viable. i think i know a good bunch about the game, whats healthy and whats not. over the past months ive watched a shit ton of progression series' and similar stuff, not only from cimo. ive always been a hater of the new era yugioh and i stick with it even tho there are good thing about it. but overall the game has just gotten way out of hand. just luck at the progression series: they always go from grindy to absolute shitshow. early yugioh wasnt perfect but it had the potential to be and was mostly rewarding. nowadays its mostly build a good deck, find anti, learn how to pilot your deck and what to do when hit with specific things. actual grinding to maybe unfamiliar stuff is barely a thing anymore.
As someone who only picked up the game over the past few years, I can definitely say I've always had more fun theory crafting and dekcbuilding in YGO than actually playing the game. I've always been more drawn to tier 2/3 and rogue decks because their lack of all-encompassing options makes not only deckbuilding more interesting, but games between decks on that level way more interactive. I've been playing stuff like Springans(w/o Stein BS), Dogmatika Ritual, and Constellarknights recently just to name a few. Every format really does feel like it's got some great stuff going on just below the surface that's ultimately held down by the newer, more potent(and oppressive) strategies. I'm in Philadelphia to attend my first YCS this weekend rocking yet another rogue deck, and I'm really hoping that this weekend doesn't end up as the moment YGO jumps the shark for me.
I've been having more fun building decks myself than actually playing. Just doing multiple variants of new decks that use old cards and it's newest support like Battlin Boxers, Synchrons with Junk Mail, Earthbound with the new support, and even just trying to relearn the modern game and recreating AI deck recipes from the 2020 game Link Evolution.
been having alot of fun with fluffals, if you want a rogue deck to play it's usually fun to play in person and on md
This comment sums up my whole modern ygo experience. So many times I've spend days building a deck just to realise the playing it in a competitive environment just wasn't fun (no matter if win or loss). Deckbuilding is also the reason I don't like handtraps/the concept of them...having like 9-15 must include cards is just so boring
Same, my brother plays branded, and knows full well that I can't respond to losing my normal summon, so we haven't had much fun dueling each other.
ive been fiddling with ritual dogmatika do you run guiding quem or is it just a bait? ive been trying it out but i dont really see when you would use it as your ns over ecclesia or diviner send arc light
Wtf happened to YGO? T1 opponent sets up, T2 opponent wins if you have you didn't draw your out or fishes if you have your out, T3 opponent scoops if they didn't get the out to your out.
This the most un interactive bullshit I've seen in all of my playing of card games
I'll admit that I was never that competitive of a yugioh player, but I've seen how things have changed from leaving the game for years and coming back years later. Everytime I came back it was interesting to see the game has evolved over the years from gaps of having nothing to do with it. From having decks made of different things that synergize together to archetypes and now to somewhere between the two. I do like that things are semi-generic when it comes to archetypes so you can mix them in with other decks so the archetype doesn't just die off completely. Like Swordsoul works well with Wyrm monsters in general so they can come back if there's another great Wyrm archetype in the future. Or how Labrynth works with regular trap cards. Or even how Branded just works great with Fusion monsters.
However, upon my return from a player with the mindset of a Duelist Alliance Era play it was pretty mind blowing on how much things have changed. I mean, sure floodgates were around here and there with Light/Dark-Imprisoning mirror, Vanity's Emptiness, and more but they felt far and few between. If a monster had a floodgate effect or a quick effect omni negate there were a few problems running them. These were typically the case of being not easy too summon and added inconsistency like Spell Canceller or they were archetype centric negates like Ritual Beast Ulti-Gaiapelio. Now end boards feel the same with multiple floodgates or quick effect omni-negates.
Worst part is like you said, you didn't draw the out to break the board. Games back then felt more grindy. Most games now in my experience ends at 3 turns at most. Doesn't feel that fun anymore
Fax bro, back then I remember having all out battles with my bro, duels lasted at least 10 turns and it was always exciting and captivating. I miss those days man
Droll and Lock in a format always a sign it's time for some heads to roll
The Droll and Lock Canary is dead
@@midn8588 Made me laugh
Droll in a format isn't bad, it's when cards like Droll and Shifter are being main decked that you know a format has gone to shit. Which it has.
and me as OCG player have to dealt with maxx c 😂
@@hamster6216 As a mostly master duel player, I understand man. Maxx C is cancer.
I personally think that a lot of these issues get strained because it's so expensive in many cases. Spending $500 on deck just to not draw the out and lose, is not a recipe for non-toxic gameplay.
I'm glad though you also noticed the changes in game design following tearlament. It's a good move in the long term, but it'll take quite a while for decks to catch up to that fast back and forth level of gameplay. A majority of older yugioh rogue decks are still stuck in 2019-2020 build and unbreakable end board. All and all it's a positive trend just moving to slowly.
I think you are picking up where MBT left off in some ways. Keep calling out bad business practices. We need more of that right now.
Game still sucks when you play it in a sim, pricing isn't the problem.
@@voidchaser3185 Yeah I can't even be bothered to play in DuelingBook ranked because it's not fun
@@Registeel13Ty also cause Dueling book is actually horrible to play.
My favorite part of seeing your comments in other channels is reading them in your voice and cadence. Stay cool, king.
I'm flabbergasted, MBT with a good take about the modern meta? This is how serious this got
MBT is probably the person who's takes I agree with most often, I'm not surprised we get another great take from him
legit a super solid take
As a Farfa viewer. I agree and I don't know how to read.
Where da keys at
@@Sulidaire*jingle jingle jingle* Look, keys! 🔑
Hearing MBT out of all people say that he's not having fun with modern yugioh is really a testament to how bad things are right now
Konami really needs to be less greedy and more transparent if they want to try and actually make the community last. You hit the nail on the head IMO when you said the fanbase will put up with anything, yet if things start going downhill, Konami will probably just abandon the game overnight. One of the larger problems I find is the barrier to entry, it's so much more difficult because of both cost, and the steep learning curve with in-game rulings being frustrating to learn as a new player trying to distinguish mandatory effects, chain timing, missing timing, etc.
They're basically only marketing to the hardcore fans/whales at this point because they're trying to wring every last drop of money from the playerbase with powercreep and poorly designed product/releases. Like with the new set coming up, Wild Survivors. Know what I was excited for since they were announced in the OCG? Vanquish Soul, the art looked cool, they seemed fun, and I was just excited to play them. Then I see the absolutely atrocious rarity spread, and they're going to be in a crappy side-set that's probably short-printed to all hell, AND the prices are ludicrous for a deck that's not even that powerful to merit the price. Completely killed my hype. My griping aside, solid video and sorry to hear you're not having more fun playing the game man.
BASED. Tried teaching yugioh to my friend, a smart guy, and he's had so many good questions about the broken rules of this game...
Asking Konami to do that is like asking you to stop breathing for a day
Yugioh is already a sinking ship. That’s why they’re not interested in getting new fans. It’s been on a pretty steep decline for years now. Nothings gona change. I just hope maybe a different company buys it once it goes bankrupt and changes things
Im a pretty new player and the go fish analogy really describes the feeling I have on the rare occasions I play against random people in Master Duel. It just doesnt feel good to lose to a single card you had no idea about or cant really prevent anyways. It feels like its just play the cards im dealt and pray I dont get hit with Evenly Matched or something.
This exactly. At first the game may feel lie you're making decisions, but you can honesty often times just reveal each other your opening hands, and you can see exactly how the game is gonna go. You're mostly just going through the motions, pretending you are playing a game.
I'm sorry that you were introduced to this game with the state it's in. Make sure to find people who can help you through it.
yikes and you are playing master duel where its Bo1. MD is straight up despair haha
One easy fix is in-archetype hand traps. Havnis wasn’t THE reason for Tear Zero but I think it’s fair to say having an in-archetype hand trap contributed immensely to its success.
Tearlaments was a mistake, they should been only can be triggered if they are milled by or sent by tearlaments. Cards only.
I love Chinook in blackwings that's an archetype veiler and easily searchable by Sudri or black whirlwind, It's such good design. Only bad thing is that it's a quick effect only if you control a dark synchro, which is better than needing a Blackwing synchro, but still can't be used turn one when going second
Rescue-ACE is so fun bcs of that
They don't negate or anything but being able to setup before your opponent sets an unbreakable board makes the experience much more fun
Its so fuckin annoying going first and they end up milling 8 and just playing forever on your first normal summon
Handtraps are part of the problem. In order to prevent the format from becoming "did you draw the out?", you need to simply not have a "the out" card. And most of them are handtraps. Handtraps created the problem, because they FORCED decks to play through negates. Which in turn meant the outs needed to be more powerful to combat the increased ability for the turn player to simply ignore interaction. Which in turn meant the turn player needed even more ability to ignore interaction. Which in turn meant the outs needed to be EVEN MORE POWERFUL.
Biggest reason that pushed me to play the Digimon TCG the creators are 100% transparent with everything they do. Every single ban list they give reasons why they ban or unban cards.
Issue with Konami is the reason behind a bunch of their hits would just be "money."
We hit this archetype so you'd buy the new one.
We hit this card because it's old and it supports the new cards people are still buying.
We banned this card because it's going to hard counter new cards we want to sell.
We unbanned this card because we printed new support for you to buy.
@@AnimatedCarl oh ya 100% which I why digimon is refreshing they actually use the OCG to make the TCG better. I remember in their 1st ban list they hit a card down to one that wasn't even released yet because they seen how strong it was in Japan.
was looking for a comment like this, one of the things i really appreciate about Digimon is the communication :)
Every CG is more communicative than Konami is. I've seen Vanguard, Digimon, Pokémon and several other card games have multiple banlists in the time it takes Konami to give us one bad one AND they explain why.
That's true for 99% of tcg. Konami is the exception. Digimon isn't special.
"Hey, Konami, what are your plans for the future of Yu-Gi-Oh!?"
"Huh? You mean the money printer? Yeah we plan to keep it around."
A problem that contributes is how many cards are generics that shouldn't be generic like Tri-heart, Apollusa, Borrelsavage, the entire knightmare archetype, and so much more. So many problems like super strong cards and unbreakable board states would be fix if the strongest generic negate was Quasar. How many cards could be off the banlist if they weren't generic?
I agree. It would be way better if it was my busted boss monster vs your busted boss monster instead of my engine doing the same shit that's been done for years vs your new faster engine that still does the same shit that's been done for years
This is why we need equalizers. If you don’t have bullshit like Maxx C to keep combo decks honest they’ll just make a billion bullshits.
@@mee7er Dedicating half your deck to countering Maxx C is even worse.
@@mee7er Unleashing Maxx C is not the answer. Yugioh has lost lts sense of balance. And it practically started with Maxx C and Absolute Zero. Or maybe it started with the Signer Dragons? Either way, it's when they started making very powerful monsters easily accessible. Sure, you could cheat out a Blue-Eyes White Dragon a number of ways, but it involved more work and either the same number or more cards than the regular 2 tributes. But it's just a Blue-Eyes. When you kill it, it just dies. There's no lingering effect or graveyard effect to worry about. But when they made the Elemental Heroes like Absolute Zero, they made them very powerful, but also more generic. Some (most) would say that was the best decision. But I say they should have done the opposite. A powerful effect like "dark hole", "harpies feather duster" or "raigeki" built into a monster shouldn't be easier to access. He should have been more difficult to summon than "1 HERO + 1 WATER". Fusions should have remained as difficult and specific to summon as they started out, just with stronger fusions. The only monsters that should have crazy on-board effects and omni-negates and floodgate effects and secondary graveyard effects should be ritual monsters. But keep their summoning conditions and styles in the form they were from the beginning. But, since no one played "Hungry Burger" or "Performance of Sword" Konami figured that nobody liked rituals. So they kept making them easier to achieve but also with stronger effects. And by making all of the best Synchro monsters use generic materials, it set the precedent to make ALL of the best cards generics! Cyber Dragon Inifnity was incredibly annoying and broken for its time. Instead of being easily Ranked Up from a Cyber Dragon Nova, it should have been a ritual that REQUIRED Cyber Dragon Nova as a material. Then, everything around it wouldn't have had to speed up to catch up to it. The work required to summon game changers like that should be reflected in the way they're summoned. Borreload Savage Dragon shouldn't be as generic to summon. It should have all sorts of named prerequisites to its materials. Not just "2 borrel monsters" or "3 effect monsters". Give it some gravity. FORCE the players to work for it! "Borreload Dragon + Revolver Dragon + 1 effect monster". The materials to summon big monsters are meant to be the game balancers, not just "tribute summon+".
Yeah Baronne as well
this is why older formats like edison and goat are so popular. There isn't really a 1 turn board that gets set up it takes a couple turns to get a board set up so it feels like both sides are playing more of the game.
Edison format is the DOPE dude !!! Let's goooo Keegan !
Too slow I won’t both decks to play at modern speed (tear) :,(
Edison is just perfect. Love that format.
Yeah, definitely. It has its problem. Specifically a bunch of sack like Brain Con, but it's fine for sure.
It also means that you see more cards, which makes it more likely that you're actually going to get to your unsearchable outs.
Man I feel you. I remmember when I first started playing with Paleofrog (my first deck) I was able to steal games by looping resources and choosing my negates correctly, now playing Labyrinth I either win by Erradicator turn 1 or I get Evenly'd for my life savings, it's only a few games that we get into a real game. I still love the game when I actually get to play it
… play nat runick? Most games I win in the grind by barely surviving and looping mole crickets until I manage to get the runick engine online (going second)
Going first well… Baronne + runick + molecricket is really hard to crack
Reminder that back in the day waboku was a legit monster reborn for paleos that bought you a turn... i miss paleo frog
Try the Furniture build. Waaaaaay more interesting and I think even stronger than the trap build. Doesn't lose super hard to Evenly and the like, either.
This is the first time in five years that I haven't played any form of Yugioh in months.
The short version: I feel you. The long version consists mainly complaints of having sack-based interactions, information-revealing archetypes, floodgates, and handtraps that say "negate" without working for a negate.
and the fact that you have to spend 300/400$ every 3 months to stay in shape with the meta is exhausting, even more if you don't have the time to really tryhard and spend all your time to this hobbie
Real
@@maximek6652 Yep donating a part of your pay cheque to "have fun" honestly feels like a tythe and 200-400 is being super convervative with bigger sets.
A hand trap does not even make sense, first you have to SET a trap. It is just plain bullshit.
@@gambitgambles meta followers will tell you Kuriboh existed so it's fine to negate from your hands so easily
honestly, I'm so glad to see more people chewing out the current meta. I miss being able to make it to turn 4-5 and actually having fun playing. I get all the jokes of "just draw the out" but frankly that just feels like dark soul's "just git gud" and having the duel be decided by the first 5 cards you draw or the 6th card you draw, it just makes the game boring and me not want to play
I think this is why lately I've been just playing with my brother or just on omega against bots, I feel like I'm having fun back and forth there over whatever the current meta is
I feel like 99.5% of "New" YuGiOh cards fall under two descriptions
It's either a floodgate, Or a broken "Tell Your opponent they are better off throwing their deck out the 9th floor window" effect.
What if there isn't a 9th floor?
@@youtubeuniversity3638then into the center of the earth😂
*As soon as MBT started talking about the Communication from Konami around YGO I instantly had goosebumps... hard facts all the way through*
*why the bold*
I wish we could see more of these videos. Not necessarily, MBT defeated, but MBT goving honest takes. He is one of the few peope I feel has a good enough pulse on the community, the state of the game, and the necessary speaking skills to make videos like the this work.
I feel like sharing that I've personally been having a lot of fun with Yugioh by playing it with a small group of three friends on YGO Omega. We basically all ignore meta stuff and have gentleman's agreement'd Ash Blossom into the garbage can, and we really just build decks with archetypes that interest us individually before then slamming them into each other whenever we play, usually playing a good fistful of matches where everyone gets to play against everyone else at least twice. When we're not playing we're usually just shooting the shit on ideas for decks and advice and the like. All three of my friends have way more decks than me since I'm real lazy with deck building, but I currently rock an almost pure Gunkan deck, pure Ancient Gears, and Dark Magician with a little sprinkling of Spellbook, and all three of these decks are really fun to play for each of their own reasons. Ancient Gears is BEEG PUNCH and it's really fun to just plow through defenses and punch my friends in the teeth, even if the steamrolling can be stopped fairly easily and it can prove hard to recover from over-extending. Dark Magician is Dark Magician; it's fun to blow shit up with Mr. Iconic himself. The Gunkan deck is just a deck I love the aesthetics of a ton even if it's not that strong and relies on me getting some lucky draws; in my head I can't help but see myself as like a sushi chef, serving up a whole 27-course meal mere moments after my friends waltz their way into my shop.
Anyway the point of all of this is that I think Yugioh is at its best when it's treated like mildly competitive Pokemon or a fighting game; with a focus on improving with that which you love for one reason or another. Just pick your favorite, get good with them, and have a ball.
The primary problem with YGO is that there is simply far too much 'Interaction'. Special summon chain trigger interactions, mass tribute triggers to summon effect monsters to renegotiate a new interaction. Then you get to the cross-turn 'interaction'. Hand traps and Quick Play effects are far too common. YGO could already had enough cross-turn interaction within the Trap card mechanics. It proliferated the wrong mechanism and now the game is stuck in a seemingly unrecoverable loop.
honestly letting special summons become so abused was the games BIGGEST mistake,
if they werent so easily abusable, many of these problems would be Small P problems, but still leave alot of room for actual gameplay and interaction and back and forth.
because Special summon abuse is the catalyst for alot of these degenerate boards.
im starting to think the game needs to have a MR 6 where it revamps the rules and institutes new limits. maybe even rework the ban list.
Someone else described what you described as: Yugioh went from a battle of monsters to a battle of effects.
And its true. Its way harder and more annoying to play a battle of effects all the time.
In my eyes all of this BS occured back when links arrived. Links were initially meant to slow down the game (ppl complained at the end of XYZ era that the game has become to fast). But because the link mechanic didnt match konamis selling philosophy (cards overpriced, to few printed at the begin,...) a large junk of people was unable to play the game. This again lead to complaints and konami liftet the link restriction. At this point it all went completely bonkers. A mechanic that was supposed to slow down the game ended up making it a 1 turn kill special summon fest. Then konami decided to powercreep fusions and synchros to make it feel like links arent as prevalent and since the its much more of a sh**fest. Right now it almost seems like konami doesnt know how to solve the game anymore, which is why theyve decided to allow us to play Goat and Edison at locals while keeping this BS gamestate in modern up and running.
@@TheFallinhalo Personally I wish the ED stayed the Fusion deck, or alternately that Synchro and XYZ and Link had their own counterparts to Polymerization.
That 15 card pile should be an Accomplishment To Even Use deck, not the Real Main Deck that the Main Deck is just a toolbox for...
I only watch your YT content and twitch occasionally and I gotta say, it’s kinda wild to see you relax the goofiness and just speak from the heart about how you feel about the game rn. It’s refreshing and honest. Good video
Finally. I like MBT as a real human instead of yet another Farfa (an hyperactive clown for hyperactive kids)
I've never seen another video of his. I was hoping this would be the normal.
Rotation Series feels like it will either be really incredible or miserable based on whether certain handtraps and utility cards have recieved a reprint during a timeframe. Hopefully we get to see a more fun series though, something akin to junior journey would be great
There are going to be like zero hand traps and utility cards im pretty sure right? isnt the goal of rotation in general reverse the power level back as hard as possible? so there probably wont be a need for cards that negate and shit because decks wont be putting up insane boards and will just be ending on like, 3k beaters and a battle trap
then agian maybe thats not the goal, everyone i asked about why they want roation says its to reverse and keep the power level in check at around the early xyz era and get rid of archetypes as a concept due to how they limit card design but maybe mbt has different priorities here
@@sipcee magic reprints cards they want in standard all the time look at counterspell,shock,opt for examples so Konami could just simply reprint the hand traps or broken monsters if they wanted
@@pokefantrent2065 Well yeah but like i said isnt the reason for this in general to reverse the power level back to a point when we wouldnt have things like ash or whatever? again everyone ive asked about their takes on rotation want to go to a point when the word "negate" was on very few cards and boards ended on 1 boss monster if you were lucky so having ash or imperm would just end turns most of the time in those formats
@@sipcee I think there are a lot of formats where if you included ash it would just do nothing since there's not much searching (think pre-2008 era), plus if they were designing around set rotation Ash wouldn't be needed in most formats anyway, or they can put ash in formats where it's needed.
@@sipcee The word "negate" should only ever be on trap cards. And it should always come with a substantial cost. You should NEVER go 1 for 1 with a negate, that's simply too powerful. And of course, trap cards should never be able to be activated from the hand, or the turn they're set.
Also yeah, the lack of communication from Konami is so frustrating. Like what's going on??? I've been following OCG stuff as well and things aren't all that much better communication-wise there
thats literally the main thing that is so frustrating to me about the game right now. i feel like some dumbass paypig and not a "duelist"
Konami has never been that talkative, they announce a new Silent Hill and don't say anything about the game is about, they just make the new "ultimate Yugioh simulator" and don't say schedule and drop it out of nowhere, etc.
@@LeemonIsOnYutubMaster Duels release was the weirdest thing I've seen a big company do. No hype trailers, no teasers just boom games here. The only reason I knew it existed was because of twitter.
@@LeemonIsOnYutub thats just how japanese companies work, look at the shitshow thats ff14 right now :D
I definitely agree with you. I hate literally everything about Kashtira. Most annoyingly for me is it just getting to rip apart your deck by banishing everything face down, which they have more access to your banished cards than you do half the time
Same problem as Runick :/
7:09 "A first turn where your opponent sets up. A subsequent turn where you reveal if you have drawn the out or not. And then a scoop from the opponent if they didn't draw the out for your out."
This is exactly why I quit the game _many years_ ago. So it seems at this point it's gotten so bad that even the defenders started hating it...? Good lord, I can't even imagine...
This is why my friends and I only play casually and for fun. Some archetypes are just so much more powerful so the other archetypes need get some new support that is actually good and levels the playing field.
I felt the same, ever since the Albaz universe archetypes, YGO has gone downhill in the fact that every new meta becomes more annoying to the last. Less things have having restrictions, power-creep is insane with every upcoming box, every new deck just being 1-card starters with room for 15 interruptions, and rarity bumps in the TCG are killing interest in the game. With everything now trying to meet the power Tearlaments during Tear zero format, i agree the game has now unfun and you'd have a more fun engagement and challenge just playing chess at this point.
There always a combo deck, that can be really oppressing, but I think beginning with albaz, there more like 1 card combo, like branded fusion.. that put powerful monster on the board, not just to control it but also generating advantages and you played it on your opponent turn, like branded in red to summon chimera, then returning mirror jade again. Like arguably, splight, floo, tear, kashtira do this. Kashtira might not summon during your turn, but beside that it's still accurate, since their play is about banishing and locking zones.
Sure, competitive YGO has turned into multiple decks asking you to go fish. However, going back to Tear format would just mean to be forced to play only one deck in order to play chess.
I do believe that future decks should become more recursive in order to trigger more interactions so the future main releases may need to come with multiple competitive archetypes that play like Tear in order to move the game into the next evolution phase.
There have already been Master Duel tournaments that have proven that Tear can be a pretty balanced deck if you just remove the Ishizu cards. Also, it's still a way more interesting format than the current format.
@@randumo24 As annoyed as I was seeing Tear every game, I just want to know what someone at Konami was smoking when they made the Ishizu’s. Those cards not only made a high-roll deck like Tear into an ultra consistent machine, but they also killed any Graveyard reliant strategy, which with how the Graveyard is basically a second hand nowadays is a good 90% of modern decks.
This perfectly sums up exactly why I have a problem with Tears (though an even bigger one with the Ishizu cards but I digress) as a whole. MBT joked about no other way to play YGO other than the TCG but that's not even remotely true. Like someone else here said, Master Duel exists now. And Master Duel is arguably the biggest platform to play YGO now because it's not only free and digital and multiplatform, but it's GLOBAL.
Which only just exacerbated the problems of "Tear Zero" when it arrived, more than it showed people the "excitement" of the Tear mirror they kept hyping up in the TCG. Yeah, it basically turned the game into chess, which is a high skill ceiling game. But I don't want to play chess all the time. I come to Yu-Gi-Oh to play Yu-Gi-Oh. I come to play the variety of decks that thematically got my attention and mechanically hooked me when played against other similar and varied decks. I love Mathmech, P.U.N.K., Endymion, even goddamn Shiranui when it didn't devolve into Zombie floodgate.
What I hated was Tears and/or floodgates basically not giving me a chance to play many of these and forcing me to play the same game over and over again.
@@shanehaney6040 its pretty easy to see why lol. They are supposed to support her dogshit "exchange of the spirit" playstyle from the anime, thats why they have insane mill effects, they need to in order to make their archetype playable. They even mention "exchange of the spirit" as their archetype name xD Just sad that they got splashed in much better decks
I think you misunderstood his point; he wants more decks that are designed like Tear.
It's a shame that Rush Duel is only a japan thing, because they made a lot of changes that fixed a lot of problems. there aren't quick effects, the only interaction during the opponents turn are trap cards (and continous trap don't exist). normal summon is like special summon, you draw 5 every turn so hand looping is not an issue the same way it is in the TCG/OCG. the problem with og yugi is not that they should make more things like tear, it's the opposite. they should reduce the power level if anything and simplifly the game, the way rush duel is doing.
I do think some people might not enjoy the oversimplification as it lacks a lot of the unique interactions that make ygo special
But i do think rush balances itself infinitely better thanks to hindsight and that helps make it more enjoyable.
Without set rotations, that is basically impossible, it would require a banlist so large it wouldn't make sense, that's why making more decks on Tear power level might be the answer to competitive YGO, if every deck is broken, then none of them are. And of course, that could include legacy support for older decks, truly broken cards catapulting old decks into the meta (like Circular kinda did for Mathmech in a certain way). They also should ban entirely non interactive cards like generic floodgates (yes, even the ones like Imperial Iron Wall, some decks need to banish, it is a floodgate for them), especially lingering ones, stun shouldn't be a strategy at all imo.
Still, the best way to solve some of the problems is just to create Rush Duel...
@@Keroltor i see what you mean, but i don't agree. "if every deck is broken" then every deck is broken. and konami needs to sell new stuff. what happens now is in a way set rotation, because eventually tear got nerfed to death because they need to sell kash. and kash will be nerfed to sell other stuff. it happens now, it happened before, if it stays this way will keep happening. if the banlist has to be huge so be it, eventually i think they have to draw a line, otherwise the game will implode
No one in the tcg would play it anyway.
@@AlessandroAltosoleChannel
I don't mind having a big banlist, but the one required to fix the problems would just be ridiculous I think and just be an implementation of set rotations hiding its name, which I personally don't want (but can understand the appeal of).
On another note, the real power of Tear (shufflers aside) is how much of an advantage machine it is, and how hard it is to interact with without your opponent gaining advantage, all the while getting powerful boss monsters that comes back easily while also getting even more advantage. If most deck could keep up with it, I don't think Tear would have been tier 0 even with the shufflers. And I do think there is a way to explore archetypes creation with this philosophy. Not that I want the game to take that direction, it's just a possibility.
I also read another comment saying the game should rely less on tech cards and have archetypes built with a good coverage of counter plays. I think it's a fine idea, if extended to types and attributes, Zombie isn't really an archetype, but I don't think the deck should die because of that.
The frequency of metagames like this is what makes my interest in Yu-Gi-Oh come in and out. I started actually playing the game with Master Rule 1 in the 5DS era, and have shelved Competitive more times than I can count. I'll probably just do what I always do and pivot to something like Digimon while I wait for a healthier landscape.
I did the same I just went to Warhammer since honestly its cheaper and the community is pretty chill.
I honestly believe that the reason why there has been a boom in new card games is because yugioh has reached such an untenable position that people are starting to defect and give other games a try. Vanguard, digimon and one piece have happily inherited those customers
Never actually played, huge fan of digimn and have some cards.
@@gskate117 It's fun, healthy, and easy to get into imo. Rustmarrow and CardProtagonist are some great channels for it
So the Digimon card game is alive and well? That's good to hear. I wanted to get into it, I just didn't want it to be another Yu-Gi-Oh situation.
the game sucks because every deck has a 1 card combo. "If you control no monster summon this card then if you do summon from your deck a card that allows you to search another card." Meaning without a floodgate or a hand full of negates and banishes you will get steamrolled. Linking further complicates this because if you can recycle 1 card you can link off endlessly for specific cards that I don't have to list. Exosister Rikka Melfy Mathmech Floo Branded Tear Kash they all do this and then recycle and add assuring no matter how many monsters you summon you always have a hand. It's not strategy it's solitaire you either draw your card or you lose. Playing floodgates sucks but it is your only hope to win because you HAVE to stop Martha, Robina, Merrli you have to or you just lose because you have no chance to stop the cycle once it starts.
I hate that cards are now allowed to be extenders AND starters
@@ugh5880 lol right if it doesn't have a hand effect field effect graveyard effect and banish effect it's useless unless its a floodgate
i like the fact they are going away from "give it a negate" but sometimes you give them too much, you think arise heart would be less of a problem if they made it a one sided macro cosmos for yourself? i think that would be fine, you could play normally against and the floodgate would be just to make your cards get more advantage by being banished, what i want to say is, i don't like combos that just end of in a bunch of negates, specially if they are generic outside the archtype
The memory of playing yugioh is most of the time better than playing it
Honestly MBT, your personality and humor are so dang great you could read cooking recipes and I would listen, if you ever want to branch out im sure 70 percent of us will watch you for YOU.
I’ve said it elsewhere but MBT is like if a theater kid were funny and cool
Wish he would! He's so entertaining I'd love to see him do some other creative stuff outside of yugioh
Thank you for making this, pushing the dialogue and getting people talking about the state of the game is imperative if we want to see any change
HE SUMMONED THE BANLIST
Sentiments i've seen Paul on TeamAPS have for a bit. It SUCKS to have to rely on things like "Evenly Matched" to even be able to play the game.
A great way of communicating frustrations, I’ve been feeling this way for a loooong time. It’s a question of when were getting to a point of powercreep being too much. MBT has been in a precarious position with the meta for a long time, and it being too much for a player like him, is a telling sign we’ve gone too far with it to me at least
I don't like set rotation, but I agree that we probably need a big shakeup.
Or just give us more official support for things like draft or sealed play. Or even those other formats they've talked about like common charity.
Rush duels!!!!!!!!!!
Please I hope they bring back battle pack draft sets, and actually put effort into making the packs/set good for drafting
Set rotation is a scary concept because it can't easily be implemented in Yugioh the same way as other games. But the spirit of set rotation to arrive at some sort of change is sorely needed
@@TheKaijudist A giant update to the banlist would probably be appreciated by a lot of people.
Make Speed Duels matter!
Thank you for making this. I've felt tthis way since coming back to yugioh when build-a-board started to become every single deck in the game. I personally feel like we need more maxx-c cards to slow the gamestate down possibly? I'm seriously unsure how to fix the game, but I definitely miss when onslaught of the firekings was a strong card lmao
There really is so much cool stuff in Yugioh, but i can't deal with standard play (custom draft series have been fun, though). I appreciate the chance to hear your thoughts; you really nail the issue. Hope you can follow your bliss, even if it leads away from this game!
i played at YCS Pasadena with Tear and then took a break due to health reasons. Kinda glad i really haven't really experienced this format. Turn 3 formats can suck but i've realized it's more on the length and the "content" within a duel than just a turn count. 3 turns with a lot of back and forth like tear mirrors is really fun. while 3 turns where you lose because you either lost the die roll, your opponent opened their side deck floodgate, or you didn't open your "out" is not.
Hell when branded came out i commented on how it felt like Ash/Imperm were being power crept. 1 for 1 trades just don't do enough to a lot of decks. In fact it often felt that ashing/imperming was basically going neg 1.
Yeah, Yugioh is in such a weird spot right now. Not just with the current format, but with how it’s played. Games are determined by singular cards, and very few decks have a risk/reward ratio that actually matters. I remember back in TOSS format, games were so varied because different decks had totally different philosophies behind their strategies. You had low risk but low power decks like Salamangreat, and high risk high reward combo decks like Danger Thunder. Nowadays, decks are both extremely consistent, and have enough power that they win the game on the spot unless, as Joseph said, the opponent draws “The Out.” I hope in the future we have some formats where both players get to truly play Yugioh.
Tear mirrors are 5% skill and 95% who mills Mudora and Kelbek the soonest so they can turbo out Abyss Dweller creating a one sided game.
@@isidoreaerys8745 this is why I always say ishizu cards ruined what could of been a healthy format.
@@ASoldierifyit's not healthy when on the Crack back you can play alternatives like lights worn and shuffle traps. I.e jar or avarice for tear. Tear was just unfair the moment it came out in both trying to master them sirens or just in general.
@@isidoreaerys8745 thats not True but okay.
My favorite times are still playing with friends back in 2011-2013. As well as card design then. The in-between of difficulty to summon a monster with Synchro monsters is still so much more fun to me than Link. It may be a boomer take these days but I really do miss that and early XYZ times
Ah yes 2011-2013. Wind-Up hand loop, Shock Master everywhere, into Dragon Ruler Spellbooks.
@@orga7777 why would anyone playing casually with friends be lame enough to bring that. That's how you get excommunicated
@@WillOfDavy Thats not an argument. If you ignore everything that is bad in a format, yeah no shit its good. Every format ever has really fun and interactive, equally strong decks right around Tier 3 and below. This format also has really interesting and fun decks that noone ever could win a locals with, but are awesome to play with and against, if your opponent also uses a similar deck.
@@Fertog1 there was never "I set Pend zones and summon 5 each turn" or Linking off to have a negate to most answers. The video is about having fun with a game you've loved since you were younger, and modern times lacking that.
Nowhere on my Junk Warrior or Number 39: Utopia did the text say "your opponent cannot get an effect off."
Different experiences
@@WillOfDavy Unironically thinks pendulum decks ever won a game because they summoned 5 each turn. Opinion invalidated.
I remember having this exact feeling when Ash Blossom came out and I jumped ship to MTG EDH. Been a lot happier ever since.
really interesting video definitely gonna make a response to this! I pretty much agreed with all your points minus the part about tear. the biggest issue with the tear was that even if you drew the out or multiple outs they would just rebuild their board on your turn and it became so toxic.
I think the biggest problem with the communication angle is how undermanned Konami seems to be, at least in North America. There's a grand total of two people that answer e-mail submissions/questions from OTS locations. Event materials (i.e. ones needed to run the event, not just prizes or other supplies) that locations need in order to prepare for said events can show up weeks early or only days before the event is supposed to run. I don't know what the total workforce involved with the TCG oversight is, but if they don't have enough people to do things, then *everything* gets impacted, and that includes communication, which sucks.
I know it's not a problem unique to Yu-Gi-Oh, but the lack of transparency, especially in regards to products and set information, always feels like it stings the most. My locals tries, like anyone should, to make sure that they get enough product in for sets. But, time and time again, the store ends up having less than desired of some products or massive overstock on others, because there's no good way to judge what the demand is going to be when they need to place their orders because virtually nothing about the sets is known to the public. And, look, I know that they get it, Konami wants to save reveals for things to closer to release to drum up hype for products. I, and they, understand how marketing works. But when there's no information to go on initially and then something crazy gets revealed and suddenly *everyone* wants a product (for example, see Toon Chaos, King's Court, etc. when some new fancy rarity gets added or the 2022 Tins where they added cards to the pool that wouldn't normally have been in it because the sets being reprinted were not great on their own), then the shop basically gets stuck with low supply and annoyed players that now can't get product that they want from them. Meanwhile, if the contents would have been known ahead of time, then players would have a better idea of what quantity they might want to order (barring F/L List changes / meta shifts before the product release date), which in turn gives the shop a better idea of what to order, which may or may not result in more orders for Konami if the hype is strong enough, which would be a win-win for everyone in that scenario.
That said, I'll also be a little positive about Konami's reception to feedback, at least from what I've heard. The store will often ask us whenever there are questions on their reporting. People loved Ghost Rares and were sad when they went away and would often have that as one of their comments to report in. Given that they eventually came back, I can only assume that Konami finally had gotten enough comments about them from players to find a way to make that happen in a limited manner. So, it would seem that they're at least somewhat receptive to feedback, at least to some degree. (See also Toon Chaos's limited reprint run after enough outcry about how hard to get it was, etc.)
I think a good way to go actually would be to lean more into archetype specific stuff and disincentivize random techs. If Flower Cardian had a Dark Ruler or Ogdoadic had a Grass or Vampire had a Balerdroch. Could very much lead to more unique gameplay and make decks more than just engines for handtraps and floodgates
People may hate but it's one reason i love Dinomorphia, you can't not play it mostly pure cause you'll die. It goes hard on its gimmick and works with it. There are tech options like Ferret Flames and Impudent Intrusion but the glut is the sentai dinosaurs
Also this is part of the reason my group of friends, even though we all have Meta or meta adjacent stuff, rarely play them against each other. We don't come at each other with the Kash, Floo, and Swordsoul decks we have, we bust out Cyber Dragon, Marincess, and Amazoness, and those games are a blast with the outcome never being certain
Just stop printing generic anything? That could work.
@@dontmisunderstand6041THIS! Why did they stop making boss monster hard to summon like DAD even needed a few turns of set up to hit the field.
@@DrAiPatch DAD was anything but hard to summon, so that's an horribly bad example. 😅
@@TWLSpark They literally printed Dark Grepher in the same set.
I actually kinda like that? If we take the generic awensers out behind the shed, it could see decks really seeing use becuase it has the in-archetype, specific tool for the meta? its a lot easier when a Rock paper scissors meta, which can be fun, doesn't have to worry about Rock drawing into dynamite, or Paper siding into Gun.
It's very interesting listening to this coming from Pokemon, where we have similar circumstances (PCL has never communicated card design intentions with the player base), but very different experiences. Pokemon has had its rough spots, but in general there tends to be a good amount of diversity and intrigue to a lot of decks and gameplay. In part because of how some decks can be strong, but can lose by a few key plays, and decks that have smaller Pokemon and lower caps on stuff, but force a longer game (lost box is currently holding this title). Like currently I've been having a ton of fun with the current format, and we're getting more stuff that I'm excited for in a couple weeks.
I think part of it could be that we have rotation, so when Pokemon decides to print a bunch of ridiculous cards that just read 'throw the table at your opponent and win' like the Tag Teams, they eventually fade away. When I look at modern Yugioh it feels like a lot of card design just seems stuck in that mindset where it has to be busted or it can't survive. But of course part of it is that Pokemon card design has a stricter turn flow, so it's hard for me to say for certain.
It's a number of things, and many feedback each other. Having no rotation not only means mistakes can be put under the rugs eventually, but also means you have to design not horizontally (in making innovative actions, like new win cons) but mostly upwards to sell (even when you get an interesting mechanic like Kash or Runick, they have to pump their power or they wont have an impact). This leads to the arms race MBT mentions.
Even regarding the ban list, there is a dark side to the coin, where sure you can deal with mistakes by banning them, but they can also have irresponsible and pushed design cause at the end, they CAN ban things and it is perceived as normal.
Discussing card design is fascinating, but unfortunately most YGO environment online end with "it makes it unique" and deflates any good convo.
I remember returning to Yu-Gi-Oh when I was at college and having to learn about Synchros and XYZ, this to me I feel was the good times of the game.
I feel so alienated now, I still don't get pendulum summoning and everything seems to be going at 200MPH at all times .
Very interesting perspective, and the idea that we need more Tear-like archetypes (thus removing the tier 0 aspect of their dominance which was annoying to so many people) is pertinent. This might be a point where more powercreep is needed to fix the game, since the idea of going back to pre-2018 Yu-Gi-Oh is probably far less likely to come to life.
ive been playing either vw or witchcrafter branded at locals for the past few weeks and its been great... when im not playing against kash exactly
every other deck people play at my locals (plunder, floo, machina orcust, runick, synchron pile, etc) ive been able to have a great back and forth even through multiple of these huge game takers
greatest highlight was when my opponent used nibiru and tributed their own pep not realizing its only unaffected by your opponents cards
I'm curious, what does Witchcrafter Branded do? Seems worse than just playing Branded.
@VinceOfAllTrades it's worse but it's fun. That's really it.
Okay, I think you've finally turned me around on Tear. You described it as having the tools for any situation in-engine, and that's something it has in common with most of my favorite decks. More archetypes should be playable without relying on staple problem solvers.
I agree and I think generic extra deck monsters should exist but not be the greatest monsters and focusing on one thing so older decks can use them to patch holes created by new cards. My fav deck is SHS but it has nothing (in-archetype) to end on turn 1 that doesn't get mostly murdered by raigeki.
I think it speaks volumes that I didn't quit playing during Tear 0, even when I didn't play Tear, but I can't stand playing this format.
I’m lucky I got with a friend group that looked at the meta and went “nope”, to the point where we mianly play rogue decks.
We also said no generic hand traps to allow even weaker decks a chance. Pure Cyber Dragon, Melffy, Lyrilusc, Trickstar, Crystal Beast, Gren Maju and my favorite worst deck: Fire Kings
It was fun playing Melffys against my buddy’s Vampires :P
Great video. An I agree with your take on Tears, in fact I had simular takes before. The Tears were great card design, the only problem was that nothing could match them. But I am somewhat optimistc that we could be going in that direction.
I remember when master peace was running around and honestly it felt the same as what you're describing, draw the out or lose. It did get eventually banned for being a miserable card but it was around way longer than kashtira has been and there has definitely been older formats where the same problem existed. The issue is that konami, especially the tcg, just don't do banlists frequently enough in order to push sales but they have always done this.
Great video, but the solution to the problem is definitely not to make more decks like Tear. Tear is a deck that requires a great deal of skill, practice, and patience to understand and pilot effectively. The majority of the playerbase does not have what it takes to pilot such a deck, either because they just do not have the skill, the time in their life required to learn a deck of that caliber, or simply just do not want to. And those people are valid; they deserve to be able to play the game as well, but if the only way to win becomes to play an overly complicated combo deck and other strategies just become hopelessly inert, then all that will do is drive people away from the hobby more than it already does.
It's less making decks that require a lot of skill and instead giving them everything they need in-archetype. Like how Striker just has almost everything in-archetype and their gimmick means you have to basically commit to that entire archetype because anything else in the monster zone screws you. More decks like that where you're playing the deck and not some pile of 3 or 8 different small packages in one deck.
@@Ashendal to be fair, I feel like mashing random tech cards into decks is half the fun of deckbuilding. What needs to happen is to stop making generic BOSS monsters (Baronne, Tri-Heart, Appo, Chaos Ruler, etc). All boss monsters should be Archetype specific.
so what is the solution then? unless they reboot this game the only way for komoney to sell this game is to make new stronger deck
thus some ppl suggestted to make tear despite how powerful is it compare to other deck but still give interesting concept that komoney has to offer in last 5 years and that is "our " turn concept but idk maybe I am just wrong and ygo nees is another floodgate
@@waskithonugroho3955 You've just perfectly described why set rotation of some sort is necessary in every TCG
@@Axilstealspie Tri-Heart is not generic. It puts all your stuff to defense, too. Outside of Scareclaw, that isn't really a good thing.
My suggestion to take a step towards "Printing better cards" is to release Master Duel exclusive cards that are very similar to upcoming archetypes (effects, costs, interactions, etc.) that they're questionable about the wording on.
If they have surveys for those specific cards, they can have some playtesting input from anyone that cares enough to give it; which would allow Konami the opportunity to errata problematic effects before the cards are even manufactured.
It doesn't solve the problem in it's entirety (not even close), but it would be at least a baby step towards it while using currently existing means.
Heck, they don't even need to release the card in selection packs; it could just be a Log-In reward with a notification for the survey.
To add to that they could also use Erratas more, and more specifically as essentially "balance patches" like other PVP games do
To either nerf over performing decks or buff under performing decks without needing to constantly pre-print cards only doing so when they get it "right" rather than banning them because of what something essentially completely unrelated did
you are on to something here
Yeah, I pretty much don’t play competitively anymore. Even in master duel I refuse to go above rank gold, and I’ve completely quit going to locals and tournaments, aside from very rare times where I go with a group of like 10 close friends so we compete with each other rather than everyone else. It can be a very fun game if you have friends that are on the same level and viewpoint as you, but if your only option is to play competitively and with people you don’t know at locals, it can be extremely exhausting and boring
I'm sorry to hear you're no longer having fun with Yu-Gi-Oh considering how you've grown alongside it, but I'm glad you made the video to share how you feel. Every point you've made is spot on, and I personally couldn't agree more. Wonderful video MBT, keep up the good work and best of luck trying not to get further into burnout
I agree with the sentiment, especially the conclusion. In-engine cards in general should be made to a level of power that can work through interaction and keep up if their board is broken. That shouldnt be restricted to a single tier 0 deck. You cant can power creep by over-balencing the majority of cards, and then printing cards that exactly counter the broken stuff that remains.
I still love the game, but there are so many way Konami could make it more fun.
Honestly... I would kind of love for a similar ban system like Duel Links has + Cards releasing WITH LIMITS ON THEM! Like... if you know stuff will be broken, because we saw it in the OCG... Just release them with limits or Semi limits! And don't print so generic Boss Monsters for arctypes anymore and erata older ones like Verte and Halq so that their decks can play them and others can't just abuse them! There was a reason old Syncro monsters required certain tuners unlike Baron and Borrelload Savage Dragon.
You'd have to find a balance with the playability through interaction and the endboard itself. If your deck can play through just about anything and still have an insanely strong endboard that would give incentive for more powerful cards to sack the opponent not to mention then it just feels very pointless to run non engine
It's why I like Striker so much, even though since Bystials it's kind of terrible to play. It has almost everything it needs in engine, outside of a D.D. Burial, so you can just pick what you need in-archetype and go. If more archetypes actually worked standalone on release or with a few additional cards later, and you didn't have to frankenstein some pile together because you need things from various engines to actually make a single functional deck, the game would be in a much better place.
@@Honest_Mids_Masher I'm not saying every deck should be able to play though a 5 omni-negate board and still be able to make one of their own.
I'm more saying what Joseph was describing. We should have decks that can build a powerful board, while also having the resilience to not scoop if their combo is stopped or their board is broken. Those decks should also be going against decks that can put up an offensive through those boards, and force the game to continue.
@@dungeonmaster3464 I know I'm just saying there needs to be a balance between playing through interruptions and the interruptions it can put up itself
I’ve been having a similar experience as of late. I built SHS for this format cause I just wasn’t sure I could keep playing Tear, and getting stomped by droll/shifter and the being happy I got the bye for round 3 so I didn’t have to play again and go 0-3 isn’t the way I wanna feel when I was excited to get back into the game after a long time away just a couple formats ago.
Making whole archetypes as good as tear is a pretty good idea, and it could make it so future packs have less filler cards. All Konami would have to do is be better a card design which feels like it is harder than it should be since they are getting pretty good already and they seem to just make bad pack filler on purpose.
It comes across as they're trying to stretch out release cycles of archetypes. If they make a set of cards where it's all good out of the box and a complete engine on release they can't make sure that people who liked those initial cards will buy the later sets. It they stagger things and only put some of the cards in the next 3 or 4 boxes they make sure people will buy all of them. That means they have to waste cardboard and ink on trash.
Pack filler is bs anyway
I think it would be a cool way to continue the game. The main reason I dislike tear is because nothing can match it but if that's the way the game is going I think it would be cool to have multiple insane decks. If they do that though I think they really need to implement more well known legacy formats and include them in master duel aswell because losing all the thousands of cards and archetypes that just can't compete would be tragic.
The reason why Konami makes bad pack filler on purpose is because it makes them more money. Think about it, The more pack filler there is, the more likely you're not going to get the card you want and thus you have to buy more packs.
Well.... war rocks which was about a year ago.
BRO NEW BANLIST RIGHT AFTER YOU DROPPED THIS VID YOU ARE THE MESSIAH THE MESSENGER FROM THE HEAVENS THE FABLED PROPHET THE CHOSEN ONE THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD
I pin the shift in YuGiOh back to 2017 and our good pal, Ash Blossom and Joyous Spring. I love the card, I love what it does in theory, giving you a way to interact while your opponent is comboing off into the stratosphere to hopefully mitigate how much board presence they have at the end of the turn. In practice? It set the precedent for every "out" card going forward, and for card and deck design. The next year we got Infinite Impermanence. Better effect veiler with more functionality. Then we got Called by the Grave. Now spell/trap based outs were more powerful than the ghost girl monsters. Then it got limited to 1. Now instead of feeling like an answer you can account for, it feels super unluckerdogs if your opponent has CBTG. Then we had 2019 and the year of the outs. Now you can just say "I win" with Nibiru. Now decks that are viable have to be able to set up a negate before Summon 5, and many now can. Then came more and more, and Halq, and Verte, and Auroradon, and, tbh, I felt 2020-2021 formats were actually really fun. Eldlich, Dogmatika, Despia, Swordsoul, the occasional Sky Striker. It felt like formats were constantly wide open and we would see similar decks undergo tons of variations and optimizations, where everything was a game of mix and match. The fact that you could build a deck of Dogmatika Invoked Eldlich Zoodiac Shaddolls and it actually function was hilarious and fun. But since the start of the "Planet" arc, we've seen decks that don't have much experimentation because they no longer need to. It used to be subtle optimizations to amplify certain strengths and cover weaknesses that separated good and great decks, but now you can kinda just grab any Kashtira list, run it, and it'll practically play itself. I adore YuGiOh but yeah, I really wish we could see something akin to "YuGiOh Patch Notes" on every list, explaining what interactions necessitated a ban. Even short things like "Enabled FTK strategies with upcoming cards" or "Creates and unhealthy game state where opponent's have very few uncommon options to deal with it."
Honestly, instead of just a banlist, I almost wish more games would adopt the genius competitive tournament design of Smogon for Pokemon. They have a "Usage" tier list where Pokemon are ranked based on their presence. If Konami tiered every card based on competitive presence, I think it would make for not only a surprisingly healthy standard format (which would likely be like Smogon OU or overused) while still giving YuGiBoomers and other players formats and environments that their favorite cards function in. You can still use Pokemon (or in this case, cards) from lower tiers in higher tiers, but you can't use cards from higher tiers in lower tiers. Would probably be extremely difficult to balance, but if done correctly it could make for some really fun and interesting new formats
I think in one of the Twitter Thread Videos - I wanna say it was about Alt Formats - MBT brought up that there were some people making a Smogon-style Tier list for Yugioh. It’s just that in practice, we have a fuck of a lot less to work with on figuring out rankings based on how X card interacts with Y card in a 10000+ Card Pool.
Shit on Smogon as I do, Pokémon provides enough hard numbers for a system like that to exist. Yugioh, yeah good luck.
The Tear route isnt the solution. It makes the game over complex and will inevitably result in a countermeasure being printed.
Konami isn't very subtle about this going 1st vs going 2nd arms race and as long as it exists it will get worse.
As MBT points out the solution is to revise card design and set goals and rules that will be adhered to when designing cards.
Missteps can always be banned but right now almost every card being printed is inevitably shifting future powerbalance.
Rotation isn't gonna fix anything but regardless we would need a massive banlist to remove all the currently existing carddesign violations like Dark Ruler&co and most of the generic going 1st boards.
At 3:00 I was like “damn joeseph, if you hate arise heart so much why do you have his giant card?”
The problem (like you said) are cards that are too individually powerful, both in main and extra deck. However, I cannot see Konami not printing those chase cards anymore as it obviously the by far best option "economically"
Well, its seems Konami heard you.
Yugi Boomer here, started with the first set, stopped with 2008 Tele Dad and picked up last year with Master Duel. I never played real TGC, it was only casual games with friend at the beach or at the park. And now on MD it's the same: I play fun decks with friends, I stay on Gold/Plat to try not to see too many try hard meta decks, and I enjoy the events with huge banlists that completely shake up the rules of the meta.
I'd love to go to TCG events, meet people, make friends, enjoying the competitive aspect of the game.
But it's too expensive, and it's gonna be not fun very quickly.
So I'm stuck in the Gold/Plat limbo till I die I guess.
The problems I have with the game are floodgates, big opressive boards and big 1 card combos.
I'm tired of going into a game and hoping to draw the out.
Something I would love for the game is to make more decks like tri-brigade, sky striker or swordsoul. Those decks actually just put up a few interactions and try to battle it out over multiple turns.
Back in 2021 when I've played against Tri I've never felt like I couldn't beat my opponents endboard (unless they've had IO). Most decks are able to play through Revolt + Double Dragon lords/Apo.
You nailed it. I enjoyed goat format and cards like metamorph. Needing the out kills so much creativity like dueling network days where konami printed good cards for everyone. I think dragon ruler and spellbook format was when yugioh just felt like cards were doing the most. just generic cards anyone can use and actual good archetypes like you said
I just watch History of Yugioh and Jank to appreciate the different stages of what made Yugioh what it was. Aside from that, all I do now is collect the cards and don’t play anymore.
I do that for the Pokemon Trading card game. There's just something satisfying with filling a binder with old cards.
Same... I collect Edison and Goat card mostly
@@maximek6652 For me, I mostly just collect cards that I like or want. Forgotten, favorite or cool looking archetypes, relics of the past like Grass, Master Peace or Ulti Halq, or just cards I like seeing together in a set. Started 2 years ago and currently have about 1800+ cards now.
I'm about to just do this. Collect the cards I think are cool looking. Or like all the Albaz lore cards cause it's my favorite lore arc.
and speaking of nostalgia thats why i do the retrospective series on my channel going over old formats because for me its nostalgic and for the viewer whether they played that format or not can still be a fun video to watch to see what yugioh used to be like!
2:00 "That's an awful place to be in right? When people whose job it is to play the game for a living don't want to play the game anymore?"
Tbh I'd expect people whose job it is to play the game for a living to burn out on it faster, if anything. I'm having fun playing the game, but I also can only make it to locals every 2-3 weeks lol. Huge difference to doing Yu-Gi-Oh content every day.
But yes, game could absolutely use a power correction. I think most people can see that.
I think you mentioned before that Tear gave you more challenge through decisions in the game and deckbuilding and something about it feeling weird playing more linear decks after that. Do you think you might be feeling a bit of "Rust Out" which is used to describe decreasing motivation due to lack of challenge/use of skills instead of "Burned Out" which is used for being overworked?
ehh, tear format explicitly doesn’t have deckbuilding choices, that’s why it’s a tier zero format. at most it was stuff like should i run 1 or 3 agido
@@MrMan-uw2vp that's true for the Ishizu Tear format, but Tear dud exist as a deck before that with Casino Tear and other variant and deckbuilding could get spicy during those times.
It’s funny you talk about magic being more communicative when I hear a lot of the same complaints about their card game that I do about Yu gi oh just in their own power level
I think TOSS format was probably the last format we had that felt good to play. None of the top decks did anything particularly unfair (aside from maybe Thunder Dragons sometimes) and there was a decent amount of back and forth between decks. It still amazes me that a deck like Salads was considered to be tier 1 considering how small its end boards were compared to decks today. Honestly, I think if we went back to TOSS format with a few nerfs to the top decks, then it could be one of the best formats in the history of Yugioh. Mermaid and Agarpain banned and Colossus to 1 or smth like that could make the format extremely interesting.
I think the game really started to go downhill after they printed Dark Ruler and Nibiru. That's just good justification for the card designers to make absolutely broken decks because all you need to do is play those cards to counter them and it's fair. In reality, it's just led to where we are now where either you draw the out or lose. It's especially bad in this format because there are a variety of top decks that do super unfair things so it's just not really possible for someone to have the outs prepared for every single unfair deck.
Sorry but Agarpain turbo and mystic mine were not fun. Also azathot.... if you refer to TOSS as in post banlists, you literally just had orcust and striker, two extremly boring decks.
Correct take, every post TOSS format other than Tear has been a draw the out format. And Tear format was a tier 0 format so it doesn't count.
@@shakeweller Yeah I'm not claiming TOSS format was perfect which is why I suggested the adjustments to the banlist. Mine and Azathot would definitely be on the list as well if there ever was to be some sort of adjusted TOSS format. I enjoyed TOSS format, but if you disliked it, then that's perfectly fine we just have different opinions. I still think after TOSS ended was when the game really started to spiral down towards the path of "Just draw the out".
@@shakeweller TOSS post banlist is as you said. But Striker decks are still beatable. And games are way more grindy and less dependent on drawing a specific out. Decks don't OTK as easily even with Borrelsword and games are decided mostly by card advantage. Combo decks are way more glass cannon and bricky as a payoff. Lancea does in fact is too strong vs Orcust, but post-side it's not draw Lancea or lose like early 2020 Orcust.
I can absolutely see TOSS becoming like goat or Edison in the future
6:30 wow haven't seen spy fox in a long while. Brings back memories.
Btw I think you've convinced me on set rotation on this point. I'd just wait till Albaz Standard every rotation and I'd play then I'd run off and play Pathfinder with my friends until something I like rotates in. I wanna enjoy this game because I love the lore and the art and the explosive play styles, but the Uber competitive nature of card design has killed it for me
I talked about this with a friend recently; I think peak yugioh is like playground/custom format. It's why I love watching History of Jank, Chaos Draft, Progression Series, Progression Playoffs, etc. You just make dumb decks and try your hardest to win with them. It's certainly the most fun I've ever had playing the game lol
GOAT and Draft are definitely the most fun I've had in a good while
It's why I like sitting in gold in master duel. I can run fun decks like Sacred Beasts or Vendread and still have fun. It's basically the school yard as if you get an actual good blue eyes or DM player you'll have a game instead of stomping them into the dirt.
100% agree. More restrictive deck-building generally leads to more fun duels. Modern COMPETITVE YGO is more about being a good pilot than a good deck-builder, too. It's why I think Legend Anthology was such a good event in MD, ban most of the things that keep Dark Magician and Blue-Eyes from being competitive. xD
Having a community facing team is more than possible for Konami, but the company is a mess of mismanagement at the best of times, and has shown in the past that they'd rather pull out and close shop than try to fix this marriage.
This lack of communication and the overly complex card design is why MTG will remain THE casual TCG, besides maybe Pokémon. In those games, once you know the core mechanics it's simple to stay engaged, but YGO has so many card effects that activate from the GY, the Banish zone, and even the FACE-DOWN EXTRA DECK (Zeus and other Chaos/Shining XYZ, Contact Fusion, etc), that you need to keep track of, PLUS YGO being the nitpick TCG, with When/If missed timing (super frustrating for new players to understand "if I play card, why no effect", and that's fair) and insane blowout cards with wild effects. Accesscode is considered "fair" these days, but that combination of effects makes NO SENSE in ANY OTHER TCG.
Sorry, rant over.
Too bad the most recent Legend Anthology became trash.
Konami's approach to card design in these past 4 years can best be described as burning the candle at both ends. Like Joseph said we single cards that lead to powerful boards, which leads needing stronger counters to be created, which leads to even stronger end boards and repeat. At this rate the game is just gonna be everybody using the same generic 35 to 45 power cards, in total between main and extra deck.
It's basically already at that point, everyone has roughly the same extra deck monsters and then hand traps account for the other.
And who should you partly blame for that? Players.
@Bryan Hernandez how dare players use the cards that Konami willingly created and printed
@@bryanmerel No. It's not the player's fault that Konami leaves them with no alternative other than to run the most busted generic cards instead of balancing the game.
@@mysta3152 True. I've lost track of the amount of times a deck profile has the same Hantrap package, with the same board breakers and their extra deck has Zeus, Access code, Knightmare unicorn, IP Masq, Apollousa & Baronne de Fleur.
Any TCG that gives you enough options to find cards in your deck is going to turn into a combo fiesta.
I don't think that's necessarily true.
TCGs focus too much on unstoppable combos that need to be hard countered, but I don't think it has to be that way.
@@kamikeserpentail3778 Can you clarify?
This got recommended to me today after literally complaining about how I haven't had fun playing this game in years unless it's Edison format or the occasional rouge duel with a buddy.