I came across a fan comment and the fan had said that Hall Nash and Sean Waltman were doing an autograph session in Boston MA. The officials tried to rush them to hurry up and told fans the session is closed and over. Scott Hall calls the guy over and told him they will be signing until the last fan is standing in line. we can buy new plane tickets. it really stuck with me that Scott Hall did that.
I met Hall for the first time at Hogan’s Beachshop in Clearwater. I told him he was one of my favorite wrestlers of all time. He said I was obviously an intelligent guy with great taste in wrestlers 😆
He seemed like a good guy with the best of intentions and the worst of demons. It's almost as if the same driving force that made him rise to a high point of wrestling so fast was the same force that caused addiction, which was the same force that let him go to rehab and continue to fight until the end.
@@mikepelosi9877 Him, Waltman and Nash seemed like the members of the clique that you could hang out with and be friends with, unlike shawn and in some cases hunter.
I actually was at the capital center and was given free tickets. I sat in the second row. Hall and Nash came down sat next to me. Hall gave me some popcorn. I’m actually on the the broadcast. It was a thrill.
Corny said that was the only promotion that could afford to pay Sting a year to sit in the rafters but I could see AEW doing it. Only problem is Tony would forget him up there.
The mid to late 90s wrestling gave us things that we are still talking about. Hogan turning heel, the Montreal screw job, the birth of Hell in a Cell, Mankind in Hell in a Cell, Stone Cold, DX.
You are absolutely right The incredible thing is the younger generation that missed the attitude era and started watching wrestling after the attitude era make comments on attitudes era videos that late 90s era of wrestling is trash I don’t believe they actually feel that way I believe they are very jealous that they missed out on that late 90s attitude era because the ratings don’t lie Every Monday it was must see tv So glad I got to be part of it
Your missing the biggest one WCW beating WWE....... wrestlers getting paid more ,,,,,,WWE dropping the cartoon gimmick,,,,,all the deaths rip to Many so sad
And 1998-2001 were actually a part of the millennium zeitgeist. Everywhere I went as a kid I’d see Austin and The Rock. It was unavoidable because it was so good. You want a movie theater cup with The Rock, they had it. A Stone Cold bowing ball, bowling alleys had them for sale.
The Curtain Call, Shawn losing his smile, Fingerpoke of Doom, the Austin 3:16 promo, the Starrcade 1997 ending, Goldberg beating Hogan, the ending of Goldberg's streak, Luger showing up on the first Nitro, the nWo parody of the horsemen, the last Nitro show with Shane showing up, the Bash at the Beach 2000 Russo/Hogan drama... the list goes on and on... What a time to be a fan
That is not what was claimed. Bischoff finally admitted that it was supposed to be a fast count, but Hogan threw Sting under the bus by claiming Sting failed to kick out. Bischoff can't even keep his own story straight because he originally claimed that the regular count was fine because Sting wasn't ready to be champion.
Nope, Bishoff literally said Hogan changed the original finish. Where I'm sure there was no fast 3 count BS, and Sting beats Hogan clean, like what's obviously supposed to happen. But Hogan, wanted a weird ending, so he doesn't just put Sting over clean. Their solution was the fast 3 count. Where you can blame anyone, but if it was really thought of on the day of? I don't blame anyone, because they didn't practice it, or get use to it.
@@cryhwks Did Sting ever put Hogan over clean as far as pinfall. I seem to remember Sting won a crap load of their matches and can’t remember Hogan ever getting a clean pin over him even when he was considered a face.
@@chriskay1449 The huge thing about this wasn't that, it was Bischoff finally admitting that the plan was always for Sting to be put over clean but Hogan decided on the day of the ppv to use his creative control and change the finish at the last minute. Even Sting himself heavily implied that this was the case.
4:43 Don't know if Cornette knows this, and I didn't know until recently, but Bischoff didn't come up with the name, either. Larry Zbyszko did. During a show shortly before Bash at the Beach, Larry described the Outsiders by saying there will be a new world order. Bischoff recently said he didn't intentionally steal it, but that Larry saying it must have been in his subconscious when he thought of it. He said he didn't realize it until he played the tape back. I know Bischoff isn't always trustworthy, but this is believable to me.
@@L3ghairin his defense he owns everyone of his other shortcomings. Every last one. Luckily he hasn't ever messed anything up or ever been wrong. He thought he was wrong just once...but he was mistaken.
Larry Zbyszko was the first person who refereed to them as the NWO. According to BIshchoff he liked it, so he used it. Zbyszko coined it. He should get the credit.
I like Bischoff and his insights. As full of it he may be, he’s also completely honest about where he messed up, where he was wrong, and where he deserves full blame. WCW simply got to an apex where you need more competent managers around and Bischoff, as he admits, did not like to delegate tasks. Compared with Vince who delegate’s everything except creative control. Vince also stacks his execs with ex-wrestlers who are stubbornly loyal and know the business. Bischoff had media and entertainment lawyers around who did not understand wrestling at all.
Yeah, and even though Bischoff had more money to throw around due to the company being owned by Turner, this was a curse just as much as it was a blessing. For example, WCW didn't make any money out of their ppv buys, it all went to turner, that's why they hotshotted so much on weekly television. They were also forced by Turner to do things that impacted their business negatively like adding more hours to Nitro and forcing them to create WCW Thunder, which was a massive money drain on the company and a creative headache, without increasing a single penny of WCW's budget. Vince never had to deal with stuff like that that. He was in full control of his business and his budget because the company was private, the most he had to deal with was USA executives not liking some of the show's content. But even that wasn't really a big deal to the WWF because RAW's ratings were always good even at their worst, so he could always take the show to a different channel if it came to it. Bischoff didn't have that option because WCW wasn't owned by him.
@@theazureknight9399 True all that. Vince was able to "buy" the WWE from his dad using company profits. He made sure, from the get go, he'd never have a board or some other controlling entity hovering over him and his decision. Thunder was a blunder.
Vince, he wont sell blowing out his quads on national tv, in a private moment, tells the hulkster they were going to close the doors. I busted out laughing when Hulk said that.
@@edwardfarnsworth5915 Cornette. They did a sitdown discussion for WWE at one point and got along just fine but Cornette turned on Bisch for some reason afterwards. Not sure why. I know Bischoff hates CM Punk but I don't think it was that. It might have been Bischoff misremembering certain stuff about WCW. The thing is that Corny's into the in-ring product and Eric has never claimed to be an expert on that or to even be interested in it.
I always loved that. He didn't pull the same old "Well, I guess people change, and now Hogan is ok with me" stuff. He was like, "I knew it! I knew he was full of it all along, and that's why I always hated him! I been saying it for years, and now you all can finally see that I was right!" It just added to the realism.
Hogan vs Sting, Austin becoming the number one contender for the title, DX forming, Undertaker vs Kane build, Foley working all three gimmicks - all of those things were developing around the same time within a few months from each other
I dunno, i always like bischoff…i know he is a revisionist history and “forgets stuff” but like cornette said he was a hell of a heel, he was the best gm in raw history and i love hearing his stories
I still find EB very entertaining and enjoy his podcast, but take his memory with a grain of salt. Eric also has zero issue digging hard into AEW so for that alone, Eric and Corney have something in common.
Hulk Hogan as a heel was great. The best thing he ever did in his career. He even changed his look and it was great asf. He should of been a heel years ago.
I'm with Brian on how exciting pro wrestling used to be. WCW Nitro in the 90s when they got their 2 hour show was good. When they had matches, you either got the whole match before the break or if it was going to continue during the break, the commentators would act like the commercial break was a pain in the ass as something important could happen or it would end but if did, they'd show us what happened...it was very rare if that happened but it was nice of them to invite you to stay with the show vs nowadays on Raw or Smackdown, once they have a match, it goes for 2 minutes and then goes to the break immediately. The interviews were great too, whether it was Mean Gene conducting it or maybe something happened in a match that was a heel turn or something shady and he'd go down to the ring to talk to someone, etc. It was just an exciting environment. I know Corny talks about disliking Russo's creative but what was great about Raw in the Attitude Era was there was always something going on or anything could happen. WWE certainly doesn't do that anymore and AEW sorta tries to do that at times, but the booking is so atrocious. Even majority of the time they send Tony Schivanie to interview guys and they don't even let him hold the microphone to talk to people. It was rare for people to take the mic from Mean Gene back then, nobody messed with him lol
Agree with you on adapting to commercial breaks -- when you have a limitation you can get around it by being creative. I'm not a fan of him nowadays, but Jericho's "1004 Holds" promo is a great example of this. He lists off a few, they go to commercial and then he gets some cheap heat from the crowd so they're booing once the show is back on air, and when it comes back he goes on like he's been listing holds the entire time. Even works for those in attendance as they can clearly see how dishonest he's being. Good heel work.
People try to discredit Bischoff's achievement of beating WWF in the ratings by saying he knew nothing and just had the billionaire's chequebook. If that was all it took AEW would be beating WWE in the ratings.
Eric is an absolute clown of the wrestling business whose decisions directly led to not alone the destruction of one of the great old promotions but also the professional wrestling business at large.
the amount of money bischoff could spend (turner's bank account) trumped mcmahon's ability to spend in the 90s...whereas wwe and aew on much more level financial playing fields
@@mox19380 jim and brian were talking on another video about wwe having $200 million in debt, so i'm not sure if they can spend on the same level as the khans, plus tony's a moron and is easy to manipulate so i could see him spending all of his money and taking out loans just to prove how much of a bigshot he is
It was stated that Bischoff didn't have an "ending" for the NWO. But, we did *kinda* get one. Hogan did return in the red & yellow at one point afterwards to challenge them. Then came the New Blood beating him up in the red & yellow outfit, so he became a "good guy Hollywood Hogan" wearing his NWO black & white outfit allied with Flair, Sting, and Luger as I remember it. I thought that was actually a pretty good angle. Basically psychological warfare with his opponents since you never knew what kinda "Hogan" you'd be standing across the ring from.
I remember when Nash power bombed him on the stage. Me and my friends were shocked. Because in those days you didn't see announcers take bumps like that . Cutting edge stuff back then.
Vince McMahon gave away Nash's return to WCW the day of or the week before. When he went on Raw and stated that Hall and Nash no longer work for WWF. Before Nash even showed up on WCW.
No one in movies or television has been able to come up with any idea, stand alone or franchise, that is better than professional wrestling from the 1990's. I'm so glad I was a young kid in the 90's (Born in 1987). So I got to watch all this stuff when it was new and Organic. Truly an amazing time to be alive as a child and have the kind of mind that can watch TV and believe the "make believe". It really was wonderful. When I grew up and realized what the business was about that made me appreciate my time as a believer so much more.😁
Dude as a kid born in 75 I got to experience the best of it all...Living in Oklahoma City I attended the Tulsa and OKC shows for Mid South, seeing the rise of the Midnight and Rock and Roll feud..The rise of WWF and Hulkamaina, the rise of the attitude era and DX, NWO, etc..Now wrestling sucks and I can't have the same fun watching it anymore as it's just choreography..
Well in the Canadian North East, we had Raw on Mondays at 9 and on repeat at 12 and Nitros on Wednesdays at 3 pm and in repeat at 12. So I never missed anything.
If they HAD, the storyline and NWO would've gone down as one of the greatest storylines ever. But nooooo....Hogan's ego got in the way..... and instead, the NWO became a joke and a cautionary tale. The angering fact is that Hogan would've been bigger if it had just followed the natural arc! But his ego has killed no less than 2 companies.
Lets not blame hogan entirely. Hall and nash kept it alive far after hogan was gone. Heck jarrett and hart and every other yahoo in wcw kept it on life support.😂
High school years I was recording everything Monday night and not missing a second. ENERGY is the key word here. Never knew what was going to happen and every Monday was a big night.
We literally had a Wolfpack and Black and White factions in my sophomore class. Everybody in school was into music, sports and wrestling back then like you wouldn't believe. I don't think kids today even talk about wrestling anymore. My 12 year old niece had no idea who Roman Reigns was when I was watching Elimination Chamber last week. When I was 13 girls in my class loved Alex Wright and Konnan. There will never be anything like the Monday night wars ever again and those who became fans way after that could never truly understand.
In regards to The Fingerpoke Of Doom, I'm a little surprised WWE didn't use this opportunity to remind people that it was done the same night Foley won the Title. Could've put butts in seats with that.
I agree with Brian. I always thought putting the announcers in the crowd on the side of the hard cam. Seeing what we see as the hardcam. Some broadcasters and others sit high by the stairs and entry to con session in hockey. Love that
The Great Brian Last makes great points here. Bischoff, who had his faults later, was responsible for one of the most exciting and biggest times in wrestling history, that will never be touched again
THIS. we look at the lens of the Monday night wars and Attitude era with hindsight but at the time nobody knew what we know now having listened to 1000 hours of shoot interviews and wrestlers having podcasts
@@lillagahnavich7700 I miss those days when kayfabe was so believable and you actually had an honest true reaction to the turn. I can remember how genuine mad I was at Hogan for betraying all of us to a point where I threw all my Hulkamania things in our hot spare attic and didn't retrieve all of them till way later on and now they're on display in my room because they've all become collectors items.
Before the internet and instance access. Hulk turning heel was shocking. You watch Nitro now in a binge format and it’s the same thing over and over. Back then it was an event viewing each week with the nWo.
Exactly. I know it's a different property and entertainment but it's the same way the first time, as a kid, I saw Goku transform into a Super Saiyan on Namek against Frieza. Or like when Vegeta showed up against Android 19 & transformed. The build up and everything was so perfect and you only had your immediate friends & classmates to go to school and talk about it the next day. The internet didn't really exists in the capacity to spoil things or have it everywhere so that you couldn't avoid it back then. Same thing with shows like Yu Yu Hakusho & everything that happened in The Dark Tournament arc. I'm a 90s baby & there were sooo many great pop culture and entertainment moments that we were so lucky to see and experience.
@@R.A.M.10 Goku/Kakarot going super saiyan and seeing one of the dragons was why anime kicked so much ass back when we were kids as did wrestling because back in the nineties, the internet was practically nothing and so when Hogan turned into NWO Hogan, it was believable because here you had what basically Superman showing who he really was in the comics versus what tv wanted him to be.
@@jkranites Dude, they've told different stories in public for years. Hell, they've told different stories on their own damn podcasts. GTFOH. I stand by my statement. Wasn't very informative or accurate, but it was entertaining.
It sucks when these docs become the accepted version of the events. It can easily mislead people who didn’t watch this stuff unfold as it happened. How cool it was when it was good and how horrendous it was when it got bad.
Eric DID change the business. He completely RUINED professional wrestling & his decisions led directly to the demise of one of the great old promotions to ever exist. Eric is a helluva salesman for himself & complete clown 🤡 of the wrestling business
@John V 🤣🤣🤣 NOPE. My young mark friend, that is an incredibly erroneous comment. Sure "The Monday Night Wars" were can't miss TV back when TV was still a thing. But "the business" had been rolling deep since the 60s- through late 80s.
@@yoholmes273 wrestling as a whole was making way more money during the Monday night wars then ever before and it will never reach that level again. So my comment is factual, if it had been building since the 60s is irrelevant.
The part I took umbrage with was the nerdy guy saying people loved it because "Who doesn't want to beat up their boss?" At a time where Bichoff was babyfacing, and most people didn't publicly know he was the boss of WCW. Anyway, I always enjoy these. Totally forgot about running the Steiner Bros off the road! Lol. And I loved the story of the fan's wedding. I think Jim is downplaying nWo's impact a little. The concept of believing wrestling as real is of course the goal, and invasions happened before, but 1996 is a far cry from 1986, especially with the change of the cable landscape. The nWo was a really. Big. Fuckin. Deal. I'm not taking anything away from it by going oh, well so n' so did such n' such all the way back there, and etc. The fact of the matter is this was unlike anything American audiences had seen on that scale before. But I'm biased. No offense to Stone Cold vs Vince, but for my money, The initial nWo run is the best wrestling storyline ever told.
Yeah, I love Cotny, but he's always going to give compliments that are backhanded at best with the NWO. That's because he can't stand Bischoff and couldn't stand the Kliq even if it was more Michaels than Hall/Nash that he disliked. So he says it's just another angle that was well done, it was a ripoff, etc., instead of recognizing that they transformed the business.
Nwo was hot for a few weeks then ruined it as soon as the 4th member showed up. Should've always been Scott,Hulk, and kevin. Nwo is massively overrated IMO
It wasn't that they were doing revolutionary stuff with the parking lot attacks and the chaos. The Horsemen were attacking Dusty Rhodes and Lex Luger in the parking lot a decade earlier. What got the NWO storyline over initially was the idea of top WWE guys invading WCW and taking over. And of course Hogan being the 3rd guy was the perfect way to take it to the next level as he had been a superhero for the past decade. It was taking the actual wrestling war that was happening on Monday nights and turning it into an on screen kayfabe war being played out on TNT every Monday while Vince was still doing cartoon wrestling on USA. And The NWO were cooler than anything else in wrestling at the time. They felt real as compared to the cartoony, phoney WWE stuff at the time.
Austin vs McMahon went over so well, and was a better story, is because you can absolutely see that guy being somebody you know: caught up in a job with horrible bosses and decides to raises hell and just cause chaos to those in charge. It was almost like Frank Castle meets Jerry Springer in a wrestling format. The nwo was cool and worked but a band of vigilante street fighter gang, who end up working with the powers that be, to run roughshod over the good guys...it works but it's just not as poignant as the Austin vs McMahon angle was. And when the rebel Austin shook hands & hugged McMahon at Wrestlemania 17, it was going to be the beginning of the inevitable decline for the WWE...especially with that hug being tied to the rebel winning the title from the other good guy superstar who tge fans also had a genuine love, affinity and, most importantly, a belief in. Just my opinion.
I started watching WWF in Aug. 1998 and never watched WCW but the legend of WCW’s dominance for 80 something weeks is part myth. After watching both shows covered on the Reliving the War series, quality was about equal during that time, if not leaning toward WWF with what they were doing with Undertaker/HBK and Austin/Bret. But the NWO was cool. So cool that the show could be shit and people tuned in to see the NWO segments. It must’ve been frustrating for Vince to lose for so long while arguably putting out a better product. Like “what the fuck do I have to do to beat these NWO ratings?”
Brett Hart when he showed up in WCW should have been used as a baby-face to combat the nWo. Perhaps had him form a new Canadian-themed faction with Benoit and Jericho.
This is a very interesting idea and I’m sad it never happened. He def should have been a babyface, the person to next take on or take out nWo after Sting.
I loved the nWo (still do I even went to the nWo reunion 5 years ago) and not just because my three favorite wrestlers are Hogan Hall and Nash. I loved the nWo because it got the fans so involved. I can’t remember and angle before or since where the audience was split down the middle. Yes plenty of matches had the audience cheering both sides, but never a storyline where you felt compelled and almost required to pick a side.
NWO was and is the best stable of all time and I'm talking about the original members even Eric stuck through it until the end but Trillionaire Ted was shocking too when I saw him come out as was the Bogus Sting. Damn, I never wanted to miss an episode!
What Cornie doesn’t realize is that The Midnight Express spending a decade in JCP hurt them as no matter how they were I was sick of seeing them . They wrent missed because they never went away
The build up of the NWO was great. Exciting because it felt like WWF wrestlers were actually showing up to mess with WCW for real. But then after Hogan's turn, it became the worst booking in wrestling history. A one sided battle where NWO came out on top acting cool. Every single time. And what they left out was along with the PeeWee Anderson firing thing, The Steiners won the tag titles, and Bischoff said they didn't, and they had to give the titles back or be fired. Messing with titles like that hurts the company in the long term.
That's what I'm saying because if you grew up in that time you noticed he was only in the NWO for just a minute if you're not one of those people that actually grew up watching wcw than you really don't know shitt you get these new-age idiots that think that the company was always bad when they weren't even alive watching it yet but yeah X-Pac was mainly more dx
for me it was great for 6 months but they never knew what to do after that. there were great mid card matches, but all the big matches people remember were botches-and all huckster matches. "Even Shawn Michaels never did anything like that!" finally a backhanded compliment
I’ll never understand why they didn’t just have Hogan put Sting in the Scorpion Deathlock and have Nick Patrick call for the bell. It’s literally the Sharpshooter.
I hadn't thought about it since then, but that 9 years Hogan was away from the WWF seemed like an eternity, to me at least. When he came back in 2002 with Hall and Nash, I started to realize after the first couple appearances that Vince and Creative were not going to pull off this nWo revival well, it hadn't really been that long yet but those guys already seemed out of place and time just coming in as the original 3-man version with none of that same momentum after ever permutation we saw that stable go through in WCW. The fans were right, they wanted their hero back and they were gonna turn Hogan babyface themselves whether Vince liked it or not.
@@johnnyskinwalker4095 No, they were right to go with it in that instance. If it were anyone else it wouldn't have meant as much but this was Hulk Hogan and WWF fans hadn't seen him in that company in almost a decade. It's like Jim always says, "How can I miss you if you never go away?" The issue with how they handled it at the start stems back to the fact that Vince has never been a fan of stables, let alone one as big as the nWo, and he didn't understand what the group was really about because he never watched any other wrestling but his own unless Bruce or someone had a tape to show him for a specific reason.
@@robintst You are completely right that Vince never liked groups and never knew how to handle and book them. Although I liked the Hart Foundation. It's the closest the WWF managed to do it right. And sure they did book the nWo wrong from the start. But you don't kill your angle mid-way. What did turning Hogan do? Not much. The rest of the year was pure garbage and his run in red & yellow was bad. They had the most money angle in their hands, finally the nWo going to the WWE, they could have done so many things with it, they could have somewhat re-do the invasion or do it right. People don't understand the context, Toronto and Montreal crowds were always pro Hogan and were always smarky crowds, always trying to derail the shows and doing the opposite of other fans. You can never center your product around these reactions. Not to mention having seen so many wrestling, you should never change your scenario mid-stream. It's the worst thing to do as a promoter. Cause now you don't have any direction and you're lost at sea. You're like "people were too happy to see Hogan" but before Toronto, he didn't get cheered like this. All throughout the angle before Mania, the nWo were booed. But they booked Mania in Toronto and the Raw following in Montreal. Two extremely pro Hogan places. When local hero Jacques Rougeau faced Hogan in Montreal for Jacques' retirement, people were booing Jacques and cheering Hogan! Vince should have realised the anomaly of these two places. I think the following Raw after Mania, they should have had Hogan do an even more emotional speech "what you guys did for me last night, I can never repay you. You and I have a bound stronger than everything". Have him ontinue doing a babyface promo. Then have Austin(or another face) instead of the Rock come in. Cause people would shit on the Rock no matter what. He congradulates Hogan and so forth. Then have Hall & Nash come in just like it happened. You have a tag match at the end, Hogan gets the hot tag and attack his partner babyface and the three nWo guys beat him up. And the angle is back again.
It’s crazy to think that Sting was figured in for the top spot in the NWO originally. Imagine how much different that would have been. I’ve always said that the one downside of the NWO was Hogan. Yes, I admit the original shock factor of Hogan’s heel turn was great for business. However, once the shock was over, you had Hogan and his terrible main events. So, would Sting have been better? Yes and no. The original shock of a Sting heel turn wouldn’t have been as huge. The main events would have been better. The angle would have probably been ruined by guess who? Hogan. As the main face fighting the evil NWO, it would have been agonizing to watch Hogan kill another heel faction.
Read the Nitro book by Guy Evans Jim, cause you're knowledge of WCW from that time is poor and skewed. You too, Brian. Also you should have been down there back then. In a company that was calling wrestling wrestling, and not in a 'sports entertainment' one. Also also, you and Bischoff have way more in common than any of you realize. You even have the same sayings, except you say "how can I miss you if you wont go away", and Eric says "Absence makes the girl's heart grow fonder."
I've been waiting for this episode for days. When you force a doc to fit into hour and a half, you can never truly do it justice esp when the bias is so blatent. Love ya, Jimmy
It's still to this day I think the most "in depth" nwo doc. The one they had in 2012 was full of reused interviews, and the 2002 one was full on kayfabe. I just don't like how they didn't get to how the nWo got diluted everytime it was "revived" , in WWE and in TNA.
Hogans delusion in the retelling of Starcade 97 makes him the greatest of all time for me lol I’m convinced he wasn’t on prayers and vitamins for all those years but lsd and crack instead 😂😭🤣
I was very surprised to see Bryan putting over Bischoff this much. Normally he follows the Dave Meltzer narrative that Bischoff's the worst thing that ever happened to the wrestling business.
The NWO’s dominance got stale and boring real quick. They needed to give WCW more hope spots instead of getting squashed on a regular basis. Luger beating Hogan meant nothing cause he got the belt back right away and one of the time that felt could be a game changer when the Horsemen were at Wargames just ended being setup for an umpteenth swerve when Hennig turned and was the 32nd guy to join the NWO at that point.
Eric couldn’t be anyone’s boss…he had to be Hogan’s fucking butt buddy and be his best friend and the whole sting vs hulk thing all of the sudden Eric can’t remember the run in with Brett over the “fast count” that wasn’t? Such a joke, and hulk supposedly “never ever” used his creative control except for this night? Bash at the beach 2000 anyone? What a clusterfuck of a company I swear
Why u say that? Hogan would have just beat them all, at the same time, with his creative control. Shit he beat flair, 4 straight when he got there. There’s no pat off when one guy never loses
One of my favorite parts was when flair, arn, sting, and luger joined to fight the outsiders. Arn's promo swearing his soul on stopping them was fantastic. Stealing the gimmick, when fake razor and diesel invaded Mexico, the top rudos and techicos joined forces against them.
Every wrestler Hogan had a falling out with like Randy Savage he made up with on their death beds. According to Hogan, Macho called Hogan and his last words were "I love you BROTHER!" as he had a heart attack and drove into the ditch. *Hogan wipes away tear*
@@nick56677 just like the song he wrote for that kid that was terminally ill and was his guest of honour at summer slam 92 where he was main eventing lol (when hogam wasn't even on the card)
I believe, and I may be wrong somewhere, that WCW and NJPW had severed ties due to WCW not treating NJPW well during the runs of prior executives like Bill Watts, etc. I think Bischoff's claim was he rehabbed that relationship to where they can both mutually benefit from each other as opposed to WCW using NJPW stars but not giving much of anything back to NJPW.
I came across a fan comment and the fan had said that Hall Nash and Sean Waltman were doing an autograph session in Boston MA. The officials tried to rush them to hurry up and told fans the session is closed and over. Scott Hall calls the guy over and told him they will be signing until the last fan is standing in line. we can buy new plane tickets. it really stuck with me that Scott Hall did that.
I met Hall for the first time at Hogan’s Beachshop in Clearwater. I told him he was one of my favorite wrestlers of all time. He said I was obviously an intelligent guy with great taste in wrestlers 😆
He seemed like a good guy with the best of intentions and the worst of demons. It's almost as if the same driving force that made him rise to a high point of wrestling so fast was the same force that caused addiction, which was the same force that let him go to rehab and continue to fight until the end.
@@mikepelosi9877 use the force!
@@mikepelosi9877 Him, Waltman and Nash seemed like the members of the clique that you could hang out with and be friends with, unlike shawn and in some cases hunter.
Bad times don’t last. But bad guys do 💪🏾
I actually was at the capital center and was given free tickets. I sat in the second row. Hall and Nash came down sat next to me. Hall gave me some popcorn. I’m actually on the the broadcast. It was a thrill.
Make-a-wish really came through for ya huh
Tell your brother, Chuck, hello for me
Hall was always cool as fuck
No need to use the word actually
That's awesome...
I love that the moral of the story is Bobby Heenan was right about Hogan for 20 years and we hated him for telling us the truth.
Hogan and Heenan were friends in real life
Heenan never told no lie. That's why they hated him.
One thing I can say is even from a small kid I liked the heels. They made me laugh
@@CarlosMedina-vj7ot shut up you . Bobby like Hogan in Real life
@@goodfellas2994 *since
Corny said that was the only promotion that could afford to pay Sting a year to sit in the rafters but I could see AEW doing it. Only problem is Tony would forget him up there.
Well that explains the milk I just bought with Miro on a missing persons ad!
“Hello? Someone turn on the lights. I’m still up here. Hello?”
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂!!!!!!!!!!!
Well Sting’s deal now can’t be nearly the investment that the 1997 “Sting money” was worth.
sting, locked in daily's place.
The mid to late 90s wrestling gave us things that we are still talking about. Hogan turning heel, the Montreal screw job, the birth of Hell in a Cell, Mankind in Hell in a Cell, Stone Cold, DX.
You are absolutely right
The incredible thing is the younger generation that missed the attitude era and started watching wrestling after the attitude era make comments on attitudes era videos that late 90s era of wrestling is trash
I don’t believe they actually feel that way I believe they are very jealous that they missed out on that late 90s attitude era because the ratings don’t lie
Every Monday it was must see tv
So glad I got to be part of it
Wrestling was at a all time high with ratting drawing 6.9 or higher both WWE and wcw together where taking over everything even football
Your missing the biggest one WCW beating WWE....... wrestlers getting paid more ,,,,,,WWE dropping the cartoon gimmick,,,,,all the deaths rip to Many so sad
And 1998-2001 were actually a part of the millennium zeitgeist. Everywhere I went as a kid I’d see Austin and The Rock. It was unavoidable because it was so good. You want a movie theater cup with The Rock, they had it. A Stone Cold bowing ball, bowling alleys had them for sale.
The Curtain Call, Shawn losing his smile, Fingerpoke of Doom, the Austin 3:16 promo, the Starrcade 1997 ending, Goldberg beating Hogan, the ending of Goldberg's streak, Luger showing up on the first Nitro, the nWo parody of the horsemen, the last Nitro show with Shane showing up, the Bash at the Beach 2000 Russo/Hogan drama... the list goes on and on... What a time to be a fan
They finally admitted Hogan changed the finish at starrcade 97
That is not what was claimed. Bischoff finally admitted that it was supposed to be a fast count, but Hogan threw Sting under the bus by claiming Sting failed to kick out. Bischoff can't even keep his own story straight because he originally claimed that the regular count was fine because Sting wasn't ready to be champion.
Nope, Bishoff literally said Hogan changed the original finish. Where I'm sure there was no fast 3 count BS, and Sting beats Hogan clean, like what's obviously supposed to happen.
But Hogan, wanted a weird ending, so he doesn't just put Sting over clean. Their solution was the fast 3 count.
Where you can blame anyone, but if it was really thought of on the day of? I don't blame anyone, because they didn't practice it, or get use to it.
@@cryhwks Did Sting ever put Hogan over clean as far as pinfall. I seem to remember Sting won a crap load of their matches and can’t remember Hogan ever getting a clean pin over him even when he was considered a face.
Sting was out of shape and worked like crap. Over for literally showing up and doing nothing for months. "Waooooooo"
@@chriskay1449 The huge thing about this wasn't that, it was Bischoff finally admitting that the plan was always for Sting to be put over clean but Hogan decided on the day of the ppv to use his creative control and change the finish at the last minute.
Even Sting himself heavily implied that this was the case.
4:43 Don't know if Cornette knows this, and I didn't know until recently, but Bischoff didn't come up with the name, either. Larry Zbyszko did. During a show shortly before Bash at the Beach, Larry described the Outsiders by saying there will be a new world order. Bischoff recently said he didn't intentionally steal it, but that Larry saying it must have been in his subconscious when he thought of it. He said he didn't realize it until he played the tape back. I know Bischoff isn't always trustworthy, but this is believable to me.
I remember Larry saying that live.
I love how Hogan refuses to take the blame for Starrcade.
Even after all these years and literally everyone agreeing it was his fault, he still won't admit it lol
@@L3ghairin his defense he owns everyone of his other shortcomings. Every last one. Luckily he hasn't ever messed anything up or ever been wrong. He thought he was wrong just once...but he was mistaken.
It's baffling. Sting needed to beat Hogan clean in a single match and Bret needed a stronger start (and to have been used better in general).
Corny can always explain this better than anyone else trying to explain this can
Larry Zbyszko was the first person who refereed to them as the NWO. According to BIshchoff he liked it, so he used it. Zbyszko coined it. He should get the credit.
I remember that I believe it was a week before Bash at the Beach 1996
Minus partial credit for overusing "New World ODOR"
There's an interview where Scott gives Larry credit for that also
@@jenellsmith7206 better than hulks "new world organization" name
@@gr8daynegb Well he only did that once and honestly in that promo he just got done saying “organization” like a dozen times when referring to WWE.
I like Bischoff and his insights. As full of it he may be, he’s also completely honest about where he messed up, where he was wrong, and where he deserves full blame. WCW simply got to an apex where you need more competent managers around and Bischoff, as he admits, did not like to delegate tasks. Compared with Vince who delegate’s everything except creative control. Vince also stacks his execs with ex-wrestlers who are stubbornly loyal and know the business. Bischoff had media and entertainment lawyers around who did not understand wrestling at all.
Yeah, and even though Bischoff had more money to throw around due to the company being owned by Turner, this was a curse just as much as it was a blessing.
For example, WCW didn't make any money out of their ppv buys, it all went to turner, that's why they hotshotted so much on weekly television.
They were also forced by Turner to do things that impacted their business negatively like adding more hours to Nitro and forcing them to create WCW Thunder, which was a massive money drain on the company and a creative headache, without increasing a single penny of WCW's budget.
Vince never had to deal with stuff like that that. He was in full control of his business and his budget because the company was private, the most he had to deal with was USA executives not liking some of the show's content. But even that wasn't really a big deal to the WWF because RAW's ratings were always good even at their worst, so he could always take the show to a different channel if it came to it. Bischoff didn't have that option because WCW wasn't owned by him.
@The Azure Knight him having m9ney to throw around was a myth. He had a budget.
Bischoff delegated creatively, though. He pretty much let Sullivan do it all with input with guys like Hogan, etc...
@@theazureknight9399 True all that. Vince was able to "buy" the WWE from his dad using company profits. He made sure, from the get go, he'd never have a board or some other controlling entity hovering over him and his decision. Thunder was a blunder.
Now Bischoff is trying to get Tony Khan to learn from
His mistakes and occasionally cede control but of course the Booker of the Year TM knows best
Vince, he wont sell blowing out his quads on national tv, in a private moment, tells the hulkster they were going to close the doors. I busted out laughing when Hulk said that.
Vince could have told him that as a work.
This is the most positive I've heard jim towards Bischoff. He had to be pushed there by Brian but he got there.
Jim agrees with Eric on so much. Corny just can't get over his personal hangups enough to warm up to him.
@@edwardfarnsworth5915 I think they have a lot of shared beliefs, they just fundamentally don’t like each other
@@nbaldwin45 Who seems like the instigator of that dislike?
@@edwardfarnsworth5915 Cornette. They did a sitdown discussion for WWE at one point and got along just fine but Cornette turned on Bisch for some reason afterwards. Not sure why. I know Bischoff hates CM Punk but I don't think it was that. It might have been Bischoff misremembering certain stuff about WCW. The thing is that Corny's into the in-ring product and Eric has never claimed to be an expert on that or to even be interested in it.
Cornette has disliked Bischoff since 1993 when Bischoff pulled shenanigans as Bill Watts left the company.
Bobby Heenan was a huge factor for me with the nWo. I loved seeing Bobby go face. First time I ever saw that. Ha.
He was right about Hogan all along!
BUT WHOSE SIDE IS HE ON
I always loved that. He didn't pull the same old "Well, I guess people change, and now Hogan is ok with me" stuff. He was like, "I knew it! I knew he was full of it all along, and that's why I always hated him! I been saying it for years, and now you all can finally see that I was right!" It just added to the realism.
@@ColtSteele Yes, he almost gave away the biggest angle in wrestling history before it even started.
Bobby Heenan was always the smartest person in the room & always knew Hogan was truly deep down a pos selfish heel.
Bobby is a legend for all time. 🧠
Hogan vs Sting, Austin becoming the number one contender for the title, DX forming, Undertaker vs Kane build, Foley working all three gimmicks - all of those things were developing around the same time within a few months from each other
I dunno, i always like bischoff…i know he is a revisionist history and “forgets stuff” but like cornette said he was a hell of a heel, he was the best gm in raw history and i love hearing his stories
BING
Michael Cole: I have received a message from the anonymous Raw GM
Just like how Jeff Jarrett says that's for a whole another podcast
I still find EB very entertaining and enjoy his podcast, but take his memory with a grain of salt. Eric also has zero issue digging hard into AEW so for that alone, Eric and Corney have something in common.
Bischoff was always way more likable than Vince
@@genecide6869 that's almost debatable. He's definitely more poopular than Verne was.
I was one of those kids at Center Stage we had a blast! The boys & girls club would always take us. Good times.
Ive felt like ive seen this documentary a million times 😂
There needs to be as many versions of the documentary as there were members of the NWO.
Yep I was really bored.
Agree, how many times do we have to hear the same shit?
@@damonclarke3741Zero
@@damonclarke3741 until something happens that’s half as good
Hulk Hogan as a heel was great. The best thing he ever did in his career. He even changed his look and it was great asf. He should of been a heel years ago.
He was a heel years ago before Hulkamania ran wild.
@@stephenviveney5836 Was that during his run in Japan or was he in a territory
@@walterclark3198 While he was in the WWWF. He was managed by Classy Freddie Blassie!
He was good as a heel because it was believable, it's who he really is
HE WAS A HEEL PREVIOUSLY IN WWF IN CASE YOU MISSED IT!!
JC: "You can't be flipflopping."
Shitstain: "Hold my beer, bro."
I'm with Brian on how exciting pro wrestling used to be. WCW Nitro in the 90s when they got their 2 hour show was good. When they had matches, you either got the whole match before the break or if it was going to continue during the break, the commentators would act like the commercial break was a pain in the ass as something important could happen or it would end but if did, they'd show us what happened...it was very rare if that happened but it was nice of them to invite you to stay with the show vs nowadays on Raw or Smackdown, once they have a match, it goes for 2 minutes and then goes to the break immediately. The interviews were great too, whether it was Mean Gene conducting it or maybe something happened in a match that was a heel turn or something shady and he'd go down to the ring to talk to someone, etc. It was just an exciting environment. I know Corny talks about disliking Russo's creative but what was great about Raw in the Attitude Era was there was always something going on or anything could happen. WWE certainly doesn't do that anymore and AEW sorta tries to do that at times, but the booking is so atrocious. Even majority of the time they send Tony Schivanie to interview guys and they don't even let him hold the microphone to talk to people. It was rare for people to take the mic from Mean Gene back then, nobody messed with him lol
Russo should get no credit
Agree with you on adapting to commercial breaks -- when you have a limitation you can get around it by being creative. I'm not a fan of him nowadays, but Jericho's "1004 Holds" promo is a great example of this. He lists off a few, they go to commercial and then he gets some cheap heat from the crowd so they're booing once the show is back on air, and when it comes back he goes on like he's been listing holds the entire time. Even works for those in attendance as they can clearly see how dishonest he's being. Good heel work.
People try to discredit Bischoff's achievement of beating WWF in the ratings by saying he knew nothing and just had the billionaire's chequebook. If that was all it took AEW would be beating WWE in the ratings.
at least bischoff knew which guys to bring in, i just can't believe he's paying 7 figures to all those backyard wrestling douchebags
Eric is an absolute clown of the wrestling business whose decisions directly led to not alone the destruction of one of the great old promotions but also the professional wrestling business at large.
the amount of money bischoff could spend (turner's bank account) trumped mcmahon's ability to spend in the 90s...whereas wwe and aew on much more level financial playing fields
@@yoholmes273 i'm sure hogan and nash were using bischoff as their puppet
@@mox19380 jim and brian were talking on another video about wwe having $200 million in debt, so i'm not sure if they can spend on the same level as the khans, plus tony's a moron and is easy to manipulate so i could see him spending all of his money and taking out loans just to prove how much of a bigshot he is
The Mortis/Raven feud that gave rise to Kanyon will always be one of my favorite things in WCW. One of those rare heel/heel feuds that were awesome.
Who better than kanyon
Kanyon was such a cool guy. Apparently he'd happily go back to development wanting to help the next generation.
@@SensiofRabbitude it was so sickening what they did to him by making him come out of that box singing boy george
🤔Mortis is Chris Canyan!😕
@@larrybarnes6347😳........... Don't remind me!😒
It was stated that Bischoff didn't have an "ending" for the NWO. But, we did *kinda* get one. Hogan did return in the red & yellow at one point afterwards to challenge them. Then came the New Blood beating him up in the red & yellow outfit, so he became a "good guy Hollywood Hogan" wearing his NWO black & white outfit allied with Flair, Sting, and Luger as I remember it. I thought that was actually a pretty good angle. Basically psychological warfare with his opponents since you never knew what kinda "Hogan" you'd be standing across the ring from.
I was 16. I really thought Eric bischoff was an announcer. When the turn happened, I couldn't believe it!
I remember when Nash power bombed him on the stage. Me and my friends were shocked. Because in those days you didn't see announcers take bumps like that . Cutting edge stuff back then.
@Sub if you are against antifa and BLM only thing I seen prior to that was Vince taking the chair shot from Piper by accident lol
@@MrJjburgess11 wtf you talking about?
@Duck Mercy Bischoff taking a power bomb from Nash. You ?
Vince McMahon gave away Nash's return to WCW the day of or the week before. When he went on Raw and stated that Hall and Nash no longer work for WWF. Before Nash even showed up on WCW.
Randy Savage wouldn't have confused if they went "off script" Savage would have created his own "script" and did some damage to Hulk.
No one in movies or television has been able to come up with any idea, stand alone or franchise, that is better than professional wrestling from the 1990's. I'm so glad I was a young kid in the 90's (Born in 1987). So I got to watch all this stuff when it was new and Organic. Truly an amazing time to be alive as a child and have the kind of mind that can watch TV and believe the "make believe". It really was wonderful. When I grew up and realized what the business was about that made me appreciate my time as a believer so much more.😁
NOT EVEN CLOSE TO TRUE!!
Dude as a kid born in 75 I got to experience the best of it all...Living in Oklahoma City I attended the Tulsa and OKC shows for Mid South, seeing the rise of the Midnight and Rock and Roll feud..The rise of WWF and Hulkamaina, the rise of the attitude era and DX, NWO, etc..Now wrestling sucks and I can't have the same fun watching it anymore as it's just choreography..
The Monday night wars as a Canadian was awesome! TSN showed Raw live and WCW on tape delay immediately after!
I don't remember that. TSN played nitro on Tuesday at 5 or 6 ET
Well in the Canadian North East, we had Raw on Mondays at 9 and on repeat at 12 and Nitros on Wednesdays at 3 pm and in repeat at 12. So I never missed anything.
Same in central us. I'd watch raw, record nitro as I slept and watch it Tuesday after school.
I didn't realize how good the sting angle was. Then Hogan just shit cans it lol 😂
The natural ending of the NWO was when Sting won the WCW title at Starcade 97.
If they HAD, the storyline and NWO would've gone down as one of the greatest storylines ever. But nooooo....Hogan's ego got in the way..... and instead, the NWO became a joke and a cautionary tale. The angering fact is that Hogan would've been bigger if it had just followed the natural arc! But his ego has killed no less than 2 companies.
Finger poke of doom
Should have been.
Lets not blame hogan entirely. Hall and nash kept it alive far after hogan was gone. Heck jarrett and hart and every other yahoo in wcw kept it on life support.😂
Anytime Hogan relives on the past on a documentary I just cover my ears as I know he's just going to be telling a bunch of bullshit.
There are no bears in Ireland. You fraud.
High school years I was recording everything Monday night and not missing a second. ENERGY is the key word here. Never knew what was going to happen and every Monday was a big night.
WWE died after the Chris Benoit incident
We literally had a Wolfpack and Black and White factions in my sophomore class. Everybody in school was into music, sports and wrestling back then like you wouldn't believe. I don't think kids today even talk about wrestling anymore. My 12 year old niece had no idea who Roman Reigns was when I was watching Elimination Chamber last week. When I was 13 girls in my class loved Alex Wright and Konnan. There will never be anything like the Monday night wars ever again and those who became fans way after that could never truly understand.
@@makaveli4205 uhh Owen Hart was his name 1999
@@jmnyc212 Different times. There was barely an internet during the MNW.
seeing Nash cry over realizing Scott isn't here anymore was sad, and its wyld they have not done a update since 2012.
But did the show covered the NwO's greatest moment? I speak of course when they got the head of the meat sauce mafia: Virgil.
In regards to The Fingerpoke Of Doom, I'm a little surprised WWE didn't use this opportunity to remind people that it was done the same night Foley won the Title. Could've put butts in seats with that.
"Telling the truth doesn't work for me, brother."
This is the fondest I've ever heard Corny speak of Bischoff.
I wonder if Hogan thought he was leaving Savage better off every time he refused to do a job to him.
I wonder how many times Brian Last has to have a phone call with the advertisers "no i can't control him he just goes off"
DiBiase was the 4th guy. He was there before Waltman. Vincent was 5th. Waltman was 6th, hence the name Syxx. Then roll out the jobbers.
Giant was the fifth or fourth, wasn't he?
@@odeds Giant was 5th...he came before Vincent. It's hard to get it straight lol
I agree with Brian. I always thought putting the announcers in the crowd on the side of the hard cam. Seeing what we see as the hardcam. Some broadcasters and others sit high by the stairs and entry to con session in hockey. Love that
The Great Brian Last makes great points here. Bischoff, who had his faults later, was responsible for one of the most exciting and biggest times in wrestling history, that will never be touched again
24:29 now even more context to the whole “how are y’all gonna screw me today” -Sting Starrcade 97
Hogan turning heel was so natural and shocking because at the time, we didn't know he was transitioning into his natural personality.
THIS. we look at the lens of the Monday night wars and Attitude era with hindsight but at the time nobody knew what we know now having listened to 1000 hours of shoot interviews and wrestlers having podcasts
@@lillagahnavich7700 I miss those days when kayfabe was so believable and you actually had an honest true reaction to the turn. I can remember how genuine mad I was at Hogan for betraying all of us to a point where I threw all my Hulkamania things in our hot spare attic and didn't retrieve all of them till way later on and now they're on display in my room because they've all become collectors items.
Before the internet and instance access. Hulk turning heel was shocking.
You watch Nitro now in a binge format and it’s the same thing over and over. Back then it was an event viewing each week with the nWo.
Exactly. I know it's a different property and entertainment but it's the same way the first time, as a kid, I saw Goku transform into a Super Saiyan on Namek against Frieza. Or like when Vegeta showed up against Android 19 & transformed. The build up and everything was so perfect and you only had your immediate friends & classmates to go to school and talk about it the next day. The internet didn't really exists in the capacity to spoil things or have it everywhere so that you couldn't avoid it back then. Same thing with shows like Yu Yu Hakusho & everything that happened in The Dark Tournament arc. I'm a 90s baby & there were sooo many great pop culture and entertainment moments that we were so lucky to see and experience.
@@R.A.M.10 Goku/Kakarot going super saiyan and seeing one of the dragons was why anime kicked so much ass back when we were kids as did wrestling because back in the nineties, the internet was practically nothing and so when Hogan turned into NWO Hogan, it was believable because here you had what basically Superman showing who he really was in the comics versus what tv wanted him to be.
Bischoff never gets enough credit for what he really did. He was a backstage interviewer!!
These biographies are very entertaining. Not very informative or accurate but entertaining nonetheless.
most of it is accurate according to them. Also Jim wasn't there he only knows what he was told.
@@jkranites Dude, they've told different stories in public for years. Hell, they've told different stories on their own damn podcasts. GTFOH.
I stand by my statement. Wasn't very informative or accurate, but it was entertaining.
@@jkranites Jim was in the business tho and had connections in wcw to inform
It sucks when these docs become the accepted version of the events. It can easily mislead people who didn’t watch this stuff unfold as it happened. How cool it was when it was good and how horrendous it was when it got bad.
@@jimaveli That's why WWE is trying to keep Relieving The War down and went after OSW.
I 100% agree Eric completely changed the business forever. He doesn’t get enough credit at all
Too bad executives didn't want wcw on Turner.
Eric DID change the business.
He completely RUINED professional wrestling & his decisions led directly to the demise of one of the great old promotions to ever exist.
Eric is a helluva salesman for himself & complete clown 🤡 of the wrestling business
@@yoholmes273 he also made it more popular than it ever was or ever will be again.
@John V 🤣🤣🤣 NOPE.
My young mark friend, that is an incredibly erroneous comment.
Sure "The Monday Night Wars" were can't miss TV back when TV was still a thing.
But "the business" had been rolling deep since the 60s- through late 80s.
@@yoholmes273 wrestling as a whole was making way more money during the Monday night wars then ever before and it will never reach that level again. So my comment is factual, if it had been building since the 60s is irrelevant.
The part I took umbrage with was the nerdy guy saying people loved it because "Who doesn't want to beat up their boss?" At a time where Bichoff was babyfacing, and most people didn't publicly know he was the boss of WCW.
Anyway, I always enjoy these. Totally forgot about running the Steiner Bros off the road! Lol. And I loved the story of the fan's wedding. I think Jim is downplaying nWo's impact a little. The concept of believing wrestling as real is of course the goal, and invasions happened before, but 1996 is a far cry from 1986, especially with the change of the cable landscape. The nWo was a really. Big. Fuckin. Deal. I'm not taking anything away from it by going oh, well so n' so did such n' such all the way back there, and etc. The fact of the matter is this was unlike anything American audiences had seen on that scale before.
But I'm biased. No offense to Stone Cold vs Vince, but for my money, The initial nWo run is the best wrestling storyline ever told.
Yeah, I love Cotny, but he's always going to give compliments that are backhanded at best with the NWO. That's because he can't stand Bischoff and couldn't stand the Kliq even if it was more Michaels than Hall/Nash that he disliked. So he says it's just another angle that was well done, it was a ripoff, etc., instead of recognizing that they transformed the business.
Nwo was hot for a few weeks then ruined it as soon as the 4th member showed up. Should've always been Scott,Hulk, and kevin. Nwo is massively overrated IMO
@@Highly3666 agreed they had a great idea and quickly ran it into the ground
It wasn't that they were doing revolutionary stuff with the parking lot attacks and the chaos. The Horsemen were attacking Dusty Rhodes and Lex Luger in the parking lot a decade earlier. What got the NWO storyline over initially was the idea of top WWE guys invading WCW and taking over. And of course Hogan being the 3rd guy was the perfect way to take it to the next level as he had been a superhero for the past decade. It was taking the actual wrestling war that was happening on Monday nights and turning it into an on screen kayfabe war being played out on TNT every Monday while Vince was still doing cartoon wrestling on USA. And The NWO were cooler than anything else in wrestling at the time. They felt real as compared to the cartoony, phoney WWE stuff at the time.
Austin vs McMahon went over so well, and was a better story, is because you can absolutely see that guy being somebody you know: caught up in a job with horrible bosses and decides to raises hell and just cause chaos to those in charge. It was almost like Frank Castle meets Jerry Springer in a wrestling format. The nwo was cool and worked but a band of vigilante street fighter gang, who end up working with the powers that be, to run roughshod over the good guys...it works but it's just not as poignant as the Austin vs McMahon angle was.
And when the rebel Austin shook hands & hugged McMahon at Wrestlemania 17, it was going to be the beginning of the inevitable decline for the WWE...especially with that hug being tied to the rebel winning the title from the other good guy superstar who tge fans also had a genuine love, affinity and, most importantly, a belief in.
Just my opinion.
I started watching WWF in Aug. 1998 and never watched WCW but the legend of WCW’s dominance for 80 something weeks is part myth. After watching both shows covered on the Reliving the War series, quality was about equal during that time, if not leaning toward WWF with what they were doing with Undertaker/HBK and Austin/Bret. But the NWO was cool. So cool that the show could be shit and people tuned in to see the NWO segments. It must’ve been frustrating for Vince to lose for so long while arguably putting out a better product. Like “what the fuck do I have to do to beat these NWO ratings?”
Love Wrestling Bios.
@@georgemetcalf8763 same. Never miss a video when it drops.
I'm so glad Brian brought up the topic of WCW not getting enough credit. Those WWE propaganda DVDs from way back are STILL doing their damage.
"You can call this. The New World Order of Professional Wrestling Brother" - Hulk Hogan
I believe he said organization of wrestling I think I'll have to rewatch it but yeah
@@destindude1978 yes, he did
@@Minforsale Thank you 😊
@@destindude1978he did and then they edited it to “new world order” right?
@@markfroman738 oh you mean for the A & E Biography? I'm not sure yet I haven't seen it yet but originally no.
Brett Hart when he showed up in WCW should have been used as a baby-face to combat the nWo. Perhaps had him form a new Canadian-themed faction with Benoit and Jericho.
This is a very interesting idea and I’m sad it never happened. He def should have been a babyface, the person to next take on or take out nWo after Sting.
They would have got jobbed out fast and for good reason
Hulk Hogan is the Amber Heard of professional wrestling when it comes to giving credible testimonies.
33:10 The pause and then Brian: "Brother"..... I lost it🤣🤣🤣
jim revisiting big moments from the wcw/wwf war would be interesting.
He'll just take cheap shots and say it was worse than his beloved bumpkin territories.
I loved the nWo (still do I even went to the nWo reunion 5 years ago) and not just because my three favorite wrestlers are Hogan Hall and Nash. I loved the nWo because it got the fans so involved. I can’t remember and angle before or since where the audience was split down the middle. Yes plenty of matches had the audience cheering both sides, but never a storyline where you felt compelled and almost required to pick a side.
NWO was and is the best stable of all time and I'm talking about the original members even Eric stuck through it until the end but Trillionaire Ted was shocking too when I saw him come out as was the Bogus Sting.
Damn, I never wanted to miss an episode!
May 19, 1996 was the Curtain Call
May 27, 1996 was Halls debut on Nitro.
Funny. I Googled it right before they said it. Lol
What Cornie doesn’t realize is that The Midnight Express spending a decade in JCP hurt them as no matter how they were I was sick of seeing them . They wrent missed because they never went away
The build up of the NWO was great. Exciting because it felt like WWF wrestlers were actually showing up to mess with WCW for real. But then after Hogan's turn, it became the worst booking in wrestling history. A one sided battle where NWO came out on top acting cool. Every single time. And what they left out was along with the PeeWee Anderson firing thing, The Steiners won the tag titles, and Bischoff said they didn't, and they had to give the titles back or be fired. Messing with titles like that hurts the company in the long term.
Flair literally had the belt for 90 percent of the 80’s as a heel
The nwo being overpowered would have been fine IMO if Sting went over clean at Starrcade as the heroic payoff.
If you remember histroy correctly, Hogan teased a heel turn earlier than the NWO.
A&E Bios are waaaaaaaay better than any wrestling on tv since about 2003!
Lies
I wonder if Hogan ever tried the old "Thats not going to work for me Brother." on Andre. 😂
You shouldn't run outta history when someone is always making it. Damn that's deep Jim. 😂
The issue is that when you "run out" of history and keep reporting on events you just become the news.
Hogan turning heel was one of the best things that ever happened
You are right. The nwo was too until there was 40 of them and we got spin-offs
Still don't think X Pac deserved a 2nd HOF ring for NWO. Should've been just the main three.
That's what I'm saying because if you grew up in that time you noticed he was only in the NWO for just a minute if you're not one of those people that actually grew up watching wcw than you really don't know shitt you get these new-age idiots that think that the company was always bad when they weren't even alive watching it yet but yeah X-Pac was mainly more dx
I need vampire Hulk Hogan to be a real thing lol can you imagine down in the crypt the casket opens and "Real American" starts playing lol
for me it was great for 6 months but they never knew what to do after that. there were great mid card matches, but all the big matches people remember were botches-and all huckster matches. "Even Shawn Michaels never did anything like that!" finally a backhanded compliment
The only thing that could've came close or outdid the NWO was prime John Cena heel turn.
😆
I’ll never understand why they didn’t just have Hogan put Sting in the Scorpion Deathlock and have Nick Patrick call for the bell. It’s literally the Sharpshooter.
I can only imagine what could've been had Cornette been part of the NWO. He could've been the head creative writer, AND a heel manager.
'96 is my favorite year in wrestling.
I'll say 96-2001 was the best years of wrestling.
96 and 97 my favorites
I hadn't thought about it since then, but that 9 years Hogan was away from the WWF seemed like an eternity, to me at least. When he came back in 2002 with Hall and Nash, I started to realize after the first couple appearances that Vince and Creative were not going to pull off this nWo revival well, it hadn't really been that long yet but those guys already seemed out of place and time just coming in as the original 3-man version with none of that same momentum after ever permutation we saw that stable go through in WCW. The fans were right, they wanted their hero back and they were gonna turn Hogan babyface themselves whether Vince liked it or not.
They could have put on more of a effort, at least. Turning Hogan faces just cause of the cheers was stupid.
@Johnny Skinwalker it's not that simple genius
@@johnnyskinwalker4095 No, they were right to go with it in that instance. If it were anyone else it wouldn't have meant as much but this was Hulk Hogan and WWF fans hadn't seen him in that company in almost a decade. It's like Jim always says, "How can I miss you if you never go away?"
The issue with how they handled it at the start stems back to the fact that Vince has never been a fan of stables, let alone one as big as the nWo, and he didn't understand what the group was really about because he never watched any other wrestling but his own unless Bruce or someone had a tape to show him for a specific reason.
@@Highly3666 yes it's that simple, you completely control your product.
@@robintst You are completely right that Vince never liked groups and never knew how to handle and book them. Although I liked the Hart Foundation. It's the closest the WWF managed to do it right. And sure they did book the nWo wrong from the start. But you don't kill your angle mid-way. What did turning Hogan do? Not much. The rest of the year was pure garbage and his run in red & yellow was bad.
They had the most money angle in their hands, finally the nWo going to the WWE, they could have done so many things with it, they could have somewhat re-do the invasion or do it right. People don't understand the context, Toronto and Montreal crowds were always pro Hogan and were always smarky crowds, always trying to derail the shows and doing the opposite of other fans. You can never center your product around these reactions. Not to mention having seen so many wrestling, you should never change your scenario mid-stream. It's the worst thing to do as a promoter. Cause now you don't have any direction and you're lost at sea.
You're like "people were too happy to see Hogan" but before Toronto, he didn't get cheered like this. All throughout the angle before Mania, the nWo were booed. But they booked Mania in Toronto and the Raw following in Montreal. Two extremely pro Hogan places. When local hero Jacques Rougeau faced Hogan in Montreal for Jacques' retirement, people were booing Jacques and cheering Hogan! Vince should have realised the anomaly of these two places. I think the following Raw after Mania, they should have had Hogan do an even more emotional speech "what you guys did for me last night, I can never repay you. You and I have a bound stronger than everything". Have him ontinue doing a babyface promo. Then have Austin(or another face) instead of the Rock come in. Cause people would shit on the Rock no matter what. He congradulates Hogan and so forth. Then have Hall & Nash come in just like it happened. You have a tag match at the end, Hogan gets the hot tag and attack his partner babyface and the three nWo guys beat him up. And the angle is back again.
It’s crazy to think that Sting was figured in for the top spot in the NWO originally. Imagine how much different that would have been. I’ve always said that the one downside of the NWO was Hogan. Yes, I admit the original shock factor of Hogan’s heel turn was great for business. However, once the shock was over, you had Hogan and his terrible main events. So, would Sting have been better? Yes and no. The original shock of a Sting heel turn wouldn’t have been as huge. The main events would have been better. The angle would have probably been ruined by guess who? Hogan. As the main face fighting the evil NWO, it would have been agonizing to watch Hogan kill another heel faction.
A&E biography shows are great. Very interesting and the content is pretty good. The nwo was cool before it got all those members.
Read the Nitro book by Guy Evans Jim, cause you're knowledge of WCW from that time is poor and skewed. You too, Brian.
Also you should have been down there back then. In a company that was calling wrestling wrestling, and not in a 'sports entertainment' one.
Also also, you and Bischoff have way more in common than any of you realize. You even have the same sayings, except you say "how can I miss you if you wont go away", and Eric says "Absence makes the girl's heart grow fonder."
It couldn't have gotten over better than Hogan being a heel.
I've been waiting for this episode for days. When you force a doc to fit into hour and a half, you can never truly do it justice esp when the bias is so blatent. Love ya, Jimmy
It's clear that it's mainly for people who dont watch a lot of wrestling or any at all.
It's still to this day I think the most "in depth" nwo doc. The one they had in 2012 was full of reused interviews, and the 2002 one was full on kayfabe.
I just don't like how they didn't get to how the nWo got diluted everytime it was "revived" , in WWE and in TNA.
Honestly tho Scott Hall was as doing Razor before Razor. He did Razor when he was Diamond Studd in WCW
Its crazy that Goldberg is still around that 90s energy
I take it that the nWo 2000 wasn't covered in the A&E documentary
It was "covered" all the way to the WWE version of NWO after Hogan turned face against Rock.
I swear, nWo is the Wu-Tang Clan of wrestling. Everyone was a member at some point. Hell, I was a member and wasn't even born yet.
Hogans delusion in the retelling of Starcade 97 makes him the greatest of all time for me lol I’m convinced he wasn’t on prayers and vitamins for all those years but lsd and crack instead 😂😭🤣
space is the place brother
He definitely was using coke 😂
I was very surprised to see Bryan putting over Bischoff this much. Normally he follows the Dave Meltzer narrative that Bischoff's the worst thing that ever happened to the wrestling business.
The NWO’s dominance got stale and boring real quick. They needed to give WCW more hope spots instead of getting squashed on a regular basis. Luger beating Hogan meant nothing cause he got the belt back right away and one of the time that felt could be a game changer when the Horsemen were at Wargames just ended being setup for an umpteenth swerve when Hennig turned and was the 32nd guy to join the NWO at that point.
Ha I just commented the same
I just think the Wolfpack storyline could have been much better than it was
Hart should have come over much sooner and been the one to end the nWo.
The fingerpoke of doom was Greg Gagnes idea
Scott was doing the spanish entire Razor character when he was the diamond studd. He didn't change anything.
Well, he didn’t have the accent but he did everything else
& WAS IN WCW!!
Here comes Hulk Hogan! "Yeah, but who's side is he on!!" Bobby Heenan
Eric couldn’t be anyone’s boss…he had to be Hogan’s fucking butt buddy and be his best friend and the whole sting vs hulk thing all of the sudden Eric can’t remember the run in with Brett over the “fast count” that wasn’t? Such a joke, and hulk supposedly “never ever” used his creative control except for this night? Bash at the beach 2000 anyone? What a clusterfuck of a company I swear
Even tho Hogan is a vampire, it's impossible for him to get that pale. He usually looks like wet leather.
"That is Hulk Hogan's signature look. Blond Chinese hair and skin of a hotdog. It's awesome!" - Dennis Reynolds
Y’all need a video component of this podcast already the internet is ready for more Cornette
Hey Brian!! We could make a Deep Dive Omnibus!!!! On the MOTHER SHIP!!¡!!
No, we don't need more of this babbling country bumpkin. Maybe a little less.
They dropped the ball so hard on an NWO-4 Horsemen feud
Why u say that? Hogan would have just beat them all, at the same time, with his creative control.
Shit he beat flair, 4 straight when he got there. There’s no pat off when one guy never loses
If Hogan would have played ball it could have been amazing but he was a c*nt.
No they didn’t for years the horseman never lost either but when it was done to them here come the complaints.
I remember being so glad the NWO were beating the crap outta the The 4 Jackasses! 😆
& DUNGEON OF DOOM!!
Bishoffs face screamed heel day 01
One of my favorite parts was when flair, arn, sting, and luger joined to fight the outsiders. Arn's promo swearing his soul on stopping them was fantastic.
Stealing the gimmick, when fake razor and diesel invaded Mexico, the top rudos and techicos joined forces against them.
Hogan is hilarious as always he really believes his own lies lol
Metallica brother, the main event at summerslam92 brother lol
🎸 🎸 😄😁
Every wrestler Hogan had a falling out with like Randy Savage he made up with on their death beds. According to Hogan, Macho called Hogan and his last words were "I love you BROTHER!" as he had a heart attack and drove into the ditch. *Hogan wipes away tear*
@@nick56677 just like the song he wrote for that kid that was terminally ill and was his guest of honour at summer slam 92 where he was main eventing lol (when hogam wasn't even on the card)
🤣 He always seems to say something interesting at first but then somehow makes it about himself and tells some crazy lie in the process.
3:00 The origin of the thumbnail
Great story at the end of the nwo bio about the young lady and her father.
They got me a bit with that, that was sweet. Good on Bischoff.
A&E will always mean accident & emergency to me
hall and nashes story always has the same plot but the details always change and hogans story changes ever time
I believe, and I may be wrong somewhere, that WCW and NJPW had severed ties due to WCW not treating NJPW well during the runs of prior executives like Bill Watts, etc. I think Bischoff's claim was he rehabbed that relationship to where they can both mutually benefit from each other as opposed to WCW using NJPW stars but not giving much of anything back to NJPW.