Former Pro Nick Wey Tries Stark VARG Electric Bike!
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- Опубліковано 29 вер 2024
- We finally got the chance to throw out leg over one of the most talked about dirt bikes across the industry as Kris Keefer welcomed former professional racer Nick Wey out to Glen Helen Raceway to try out the Stark VARG electric dirt bike. Of course, not everyone is into the idea of an electric dirt bike, but this machine offers a lot of unique features unfamiliar to everyday riders. Keefer and Wey go through how the bike feels, what the power deliver is like, compare it to the wealth of knowledge from riding combustion engines, and much more.
Film/edit: Simon Cudby
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Imagine how much yelling we could do at each other with no engine noise!
😂😂
Actually, if every bike on the track were electric they will be able to hear each other. It's the noise from ICE bikes that makes it hard to hear the electric bikes.
Åäcktjuallie /woooosh @@jrnmoe3740
80hp is for the timbersled guys!!! i personally cant wait to get a surron and a varg!
Can’t you press the red button to kill the bike instead of a clutch?
I’ll pass
Fully adjustable power curve, the ability to run both brakes on the bars, 60+hp, almost jo gyroscopic inertia AND I can ride it almost anywhere means this is an absolute win for me.
Can’t help thinking I could have a track in my back garden an no one can complain anymore 👍🏻
They will complain about something either the dust the noise of the tires the noise of the motor whining
@@denniswilder3014Not if they don't notice
@@Tazdeviloo7they always notice . People live and love knowing they stopped someone having fun. We had a bmx track in the woods in the 90s.and two miserable sea hags would call the cops.
Nick's point about having a clutch is a good one, but it harkens us old heads back to the days of power windows in cars. SO MANY people wanted a manual override to roll down electric power windows in case of getting trapped in fire, heat or water. At the end of the day you either trust the technology or you don't. Eventually, "manual" windows were no longer offered as an option and if you wanted a modern car, you had to have power windows. The same thing will happen here.
Nick has a valid point. I rode one and I did not think about it once. I did notice how crazy responsive a blip of the throttle is in the air. It can indeed get scary fast if you get in a situation with the stuck throttle for whatever reason. Other that that I had a really good time on the bike and rode for half an hour straight. I would normally be exhausted around 15 mins on my 125 ;)
@@JanWillemvanCappelleni got stuck throttle on a mini bike when i was 12 and went through the side gate in the yard. Hate to think of a stuck throttle on a 250 or 450 ..!!
That’s a really good idea to have a clutch lever as an emergency shut off. Never even thought about that.
Or the red off button could be used
@@mototodd In a panic situation with a split second to react I don’t think you’re going to find a red off button with your thumb. Most of us can find and use a clutch lever in that situation though.
To have the rear brake on the left hand is such a game changer, but for some reason he chose to have the foot brake instead
@@amoore2165 It's funny you say that. Because the big, red button, which in case of emergency you hit with your fist and thus disconnects all the power supply - is called the "panic button"...
Can the rear brake overpower the engine on these? I had a throttle stick on me once and I pulled the clutch and stomped the rear brake. The kill switch wouldn't work because it was revving too high and I ended up having to stall the engine by dumping the clutch while holding the brake.
Good point about it being to easy to go fast! I think even the four strokes were negative in that aspect. They raised the severity of injury. People go faster than they should be going.
I turned the stark down to 40hp by choice when I Test rode it :D only did one lap on 80hp to feel it :D way to much for my skill level 😂
Bringing back the Open class scariness!!!😁
Being able to tune each modes power and engine braking (in an old guy too) effectively gives you 5 bikes in one, which justifies the price to me.
Really loved the commentary and discussion around the pros/cons. The biggest advantage I see with this tech is the lack of noise, and that it may help prevent future closures of tracks. Heck, it may even eventually allow new tracks to open as there wouldn't be an issue with annoying neighbors. I see it as a good thing for the sport, and though I love gas bikes, think how much gas bikes have changed in the last 20 years. All the concerns like battery life will get improved over time, and once the traditional manufacturers start building electric variants of the YZ's/CR's/etc... the race will be on. Also I love the idea of less maintenance: No air filters, no top/bottom end rebuilds, no valve adjustments, etc... Keeping your brakes fresh, and adjusting/lubing your chain may be the extent of much of our wrenching going forward. I do like Nick's comment about the clutch, and think that's a good point. I've heard that the Varg lets you move the brake pedal up to the bars, and move things around, so who knows, maybe they could wire up some sort of physical fail-safe.
One last point on Nick's comment about the bikes making it too easy to go fast: I definitely see there being the potential for a "spec" class, where a grid of all electric bikes could be "locked" into certain power modes/settings, to make for identical riding characteristics for each bike (other than suspension/brakes), which would actually put the racing much more back on rider ability if everyone has essentially the same platform to operate on. Similar to what's done in the car racing world with Balance of Power, to keep different cars competetive.
Really excited to see where the sport goes from here!
I think the "danger aspect" is twofold. On the other hand, electric is easier to ride and less things to think about, which could be less risk. I would say a modern 450 is just as dangerous for a beginner as a Varg because of more things to keep track of and a "powerband" that is harder to manage.
Mode 3 is 450F mode
Mode 5 is crotch rocket mode
On dirt. Is it time for a dirtbike with a thumb throttle? Whisky throttle and no clutch button on a dirty crotch rocket.
Did Keefer just say he doesn't like 2-strokes? SHAME!
For us people in Europe this is a good addition for riding in more places
Same here in USA... even though we have more open space and open land, it's hard to find areas where the neighbors won't complain about noise. But with electric dirt bikes, even someone with a small parcel of only a couple acres could ride in their backyard... these things make less noise than a circular saw
@@Kampy_Yes in some area's/States its very hard to find places to ride other than The actual Motocross race Tracks, I was in the Midwest and couldn't find any place to ride or just practice. It's all ktro area or Farms.
On the west coast there is a lot more open land.
@@Kampy_ exactly!
Almost every local track in so cali has been closed in the last decade because of noise complaints. Milestones, comp edge, race town 395 r all gone.
@@ladylog5470I forget the details a law is in place in California and maybe other states that in about 3 years no internal combustion engine motorcycles will be allowed anywhere except on purpose built tracks.
If the power within the computer ranges from about a 125 to a 450 factory setup, this could be extremely dangerous for newer/inexperienced riders who might think they need all the HP possible right off the bat… A clutch (or something similar) would definitely help, but I wonder what else could be implemented to help out the idiots of the world… 🤔
(& yeah I know, “natural selection”)… but still…
I met Nick in the 90's..his personality never changed! Still keeps it real with some level of dumb humor..lol I used to have a crush on his sister...saw her at Mini o's maybe 95? I was like.."who's that girl at the races" my friends were like "it's Nick Wey's sister" I was like "no shit?" Anyways..fast forward you can do nothing but respect Nick, i love watching him ride again as a fan. I never talked to his sister...just figured i would share my Nick Wey story.
Most e bikes cut power on the brake switches
Can you still drag a brake in the ruts?
@@gpaull2 What for?
Great review but the battery isnt liquid cooled, its air cooled like the Alta is. The difference between the Stark battery pack and the Alta battery pack is 1) Stark uses 21700 size cells with lower impedance, meaning lower heat generated. 2) Stark pack has the cells oriented horizontally and each cell is thermally connected to the case at equal distances which makes cooling more even and efficient compared to Alta battery cells are oriented vertically stacked and the center cells got hotter than the exterior cells. 3) cooling fins are larger on the Stark pack vs the Alta pack.
@bwhaskell Curious how long to charge back up after say a 30min moto? say with a generator? Thanks!
@@randallgd I saw a range test where a top rider rode the bike hard on an mx track for an hour, from 100% charge to 10% charge, and then it took 2.5 hours to charge it back up to 100%. Way too long for me, until they get that charge time down to 30 minutes or less, I will never buy one. I also heard the battery is only good for 500 hours, then you need a new one, for $7,000.
7k for a 6kw battery is pure insanity... What a ripoff
Ha. “I heard . . . “ And “I also heard . . .”
Battery life is measured by recharge cycles, not hours, so you heard wrong. The battery will last the life of the bike, so you heard wrong again.
@@ChitFromChinola Stark Varg says you are wrong, clown. They say the battery is good for 500 hour of riding time, look it up, fool.
Did he not watch Jett Lawrence dominate this entire season... He's talkin about the 450 class as if everybody was relatively even in skill
Good point
Put a clutch on one and I would buy it
Why not just put the rear brake there
So does a Stark Varg have a phone number?
The no clutch , controls on bars stuff takes about 10 / 15 minutes to fall in love with ; feels more roadracer in the inputs really ( almost a delicate operation ... )
That's on a Storm Thingy ; can't wait for the big four to get their stuff together so I don't have to mumble the name of wot I'm riding ...
Once all our kids are riding Electric, I would have thought it will be about who has the better skills. Welcome to the future.
Sure but once everyone, (Or many) reach the full potential and reach the bikes limits of as fast as you can go them what.
I mean even now They are almost all going RC, JS, CR, Mcgrath speeds.
Now there are so many fast dudes.
If the can all do the same lap times then what, who gets the better start?
@@MX-CO whoever is willing to take a bigger risk..
@rtsstream Right, but when it comes to Pro's, they are already sometimes within tenths of a second of each other.
And for amateur's it doesn't seem like easier to go fast is necessary a good thing, I feel like 4-strokes already made it easier to go fast and Many many people quit due to injury, (it's the number one reason quit)I'm not against electric, but I don't think they need to be this fast, if everyone is on equal equipment than it's all good especially at the amateur level
The skill will never vanish with these. Remember when EFI 4-strokes took over the carb 2-strokes and everyone thought the same thing? People adapt to what's new and the skills only get better
An advanced 2 stroke rider still has more skills than the majority of 4 stroke riders, so does that mean they will likely find these bikes easier to ride fast and safer than 4 stroke riders
Lame af
Nick is crazy smart, enjoyed his thoughts!!
The big question here is iPhone or Android 😆 🤣
I don't know how many times pulling in the clutch on my bike saved me from a potentially bad crash. I see what Nick is saying.
Great training bike, even better for newbies and for the parts of the country with noise issues. it's the future mate.
Yet you’ll never think it’s too slow. It’s crazy fast
Rear brake on the left.!
Damn its good seeing Nick Wey ride! Homie makes an electronic bicycle look badass as fuck, lol.
The dude who said hes worried that the ebike because it allows slower riders to ride much faster means that it reduces competition with faster riders., what? Hes assuming that current fast guys wont be faster on ebikes and therefore a gap to slower riders. Perhaps he means hes worried about ebikes and ICE bikes mixing during races which I dont think should happen
The best thing about this is that you can hear the 2 stroke clear
I wonder if they plan on throwing some supermoto tires on it, and setting it up for the supermoto/street riding??
I think the lack of noise is gonna be a danger on tracks. Hearing a bike is usually the first sign of a faster rider behind you
I think thats 100 percent true if you have a mix of ICE and electric, but if all electric bikes in pack I think you can hear approaching riders
@@jpslaym0936 hell, in a pack of electric bikes, you could just call out "on your left!"
Cool idea, but an electric moto or supercross race would be about as exciting as going to Catholic Mass! they will have music blasting or piped in engine sounds, half the appeal of dirtbikes in general, the sounds and smells. take a lesson from F1 E series, yeah the one that no one watches.
F1 isn’t even a good comparison. I have been to many stadium E bike races and they are great. I don’t have to have my kids in earmuffs, you can talk about the race during the race, the riders can hear. A lot or riders wear earplugs to block out the noise.
Nah, your children are safe at a super cross race.
@@kurtheidelbach I have been going to races and racing myself, never had to wear hearing protection and my hearing is perfect. go watch a BMX event, boring as sh!t, they pipe in music blasting 3x as loud as any motorcycle. so your point is mute. half the experience of a race is aural. why do you think companies spend so much R&D on the sound of the exhaust. Then when the lithium runs out or catches fire, have fun watching the 3,000 degree flames.
@@Marleysdad808 No, actually the noise at a Supercross event is much higher then the safe level for a child moron
@@jetdr safe audio levels are 70dBa with hearing hamate starting at 85dBa. SX, NASCAR, Monster Truck are all way way above that. Especially if you have decent seats. Most responsible people care about their kids. Again, you can’t fix stupid 🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂
Small piece of flexible plastic stuck in the back wheel like use to do bicycles to make them sound like motorcycles would give you some engine noise lol. Or Ace of spades card in the spokes lol.
Seems like many people don't know this yet, but adding a faux clutch to modulate power input coming from the throttle is very easy. You can do it with a magnet and Hall sensor connected to a lever, through an electric throttle box connected to a regular clutch or brake lever, via potentiometer, etc. All you have to do is modulate the input voltage (typically 4-5v) from the signal line of the throttle to the controller and bam, you have a clutch.
Part of the beauty of these electric bikes is that they are highly and easily customizable.
I'll bet someone in e-bikes is reading this
As an old fart ex MXer, these things look scary fast, and at 59, my knees, back and 3 heart stents, say a firm No!! But I'd DEFINITELY stick Enduro lights, and a set of Gold Anodised Excel Supermoto rims, on this puppy and ride it on the road like I'd stolen it!!! 😁😊.
Im buying a horse farm....an building a
Small supercross track an a motocross track one of my neighbors house is 600 feet the other house is a 1000 feet even though there is no noise ordinance im gonna wrap my 23 YZ 250 EXHaust to the silence i ve already figured out the 24 CRF 250R honda is the quietest 4 stroke an the lightest...i want to take a little of the bite off the volume of my exhaust my motor is going to Tom Morgan for stage 3 so its gonna be wicked fast and a screamer...i not quiet ready for the full electric bike but its a pure solution....i like a little noise thats the fun of it...i saw ken Roczen rode it a year ago an it looks an ken look very comfortable on the Stark...the drive chain lash sounds was very irrating...thats all but riding it i dont care just watching it is the case...Nick still rides....wow. jk
Looking back now at these early reviews, some of the commentary is so stupid. “Essentially it felt completely different to my gasoline dirt bike and here’s all the ways it didn’t feel the same and instead of me taking time to get used to it I’m just going to portray all these things as a negative of the bike design versus me not being used to or comfortable on it yet”. Like, no way? Shocking.
Imagine no oil, air filter, fuel or engine rebuilds for YEARS of riding, makes this thing really cheap.
Sure takes a lot of the talent and skill away from riding, the phone on the bars is gay and like most things an over reliance on tech. The only win is the lack of noise. Glad im 53 and will be gone when everything is gay and all high tech and used by a bunch a pussies that can’t barely change a tire for themselves
No thanks. Already owned a modded SurRon and Nicot EBeast, think I’ll stick to gas!
Damn. Most peolle riding a bike cant keep up with this. Even if they are pro. Very quick
With no shifting and no clutching there nothing to do on the bike.
Its like going from being a factory worker to being an executive in a cushy office.
So what if you don’t have Internet can you ride this thing? I see it has a phone so what happens if you lose Internet connection will your bike just shut off on you? What happens if you crash in your stark phone breaks? Cause I live in the rural area my phones always battling for Internet connection
I rode 200k on a track just 50m from housing complex on E motorcycle - no one could hear me having Fun
They could literally create a map that is identical across all bikes to level the field and make it all about the rider. It could even mimic a specific ICE bike.
I think it's funny how everyone is talking shit on electric saying "get a real bike" now that the varg is here, it's too powerful 😂
There is no reason to have a clutch on an electric bike. he problem here is not the bike but this guy that can't round up his mind on something different.
I love the fact that I can ride it on my street and don't piss off my neighbors anymore, lol
Been waiting a long time to see this bike at Glen Helen.
Awesome show guys!! I feel like this is the first 450 built. Could it happen that fast? Could 4 strokes be taken over as fast as the 2 strokes?
I hope they don't mix them, give electric it's own separate race classes
@@MX-CO Agreed. There are classes for different CC's (horsepower) so this needs it's own class.
@@MX-CO No way they're separated. Did they make a 4-stroke class? They have to run together, that's the point.
@@usualsuspectsfor1k So? Did they make 2 & 4 strokes separate?
Nick is the man, living the life at retirement
sorry ding Dongs, I will keep my 2 stroke screamer
What are the odds of the throttle sticking on an electric?
Nick just push the red button and it will turn off or pull the phone off.
I'll wait for Yamaha to bring out a e bike. Honda is there already 😂
Wait a second… it just randomly quit on you??? That is sketch. Surprised you didn’t talk about that more.
A big no! i'll never be part of Democratic politics.
I’m sure they could easily put a Kill switch on it..
So if you want to lock the maps you just set all five the same.
I absolutely believe electric motocross bikes have a place in our sport. I've been riding 27 years now and I actually think these bike will be good for our sport. These bikes can be setup to be ALL the same so every person is on an identical map meaning it's TRULY comes down rider ability. I'd absolutely purchase the 60HP version and ride it at about 50HP-55HP. My next bike I was going to get another 350 but this time a KTM 350 instead of the Husqvarna 350 but I may even consider something like this. Hopefully the price will come down a little bit over time but I think as far as maintenance is concerned it evens out anyways. Excellent review ✌️
It should last much much longer than an ICE bike with less than half the wearable components. E.g. Teslas that hit 100k miles have shown their batteries still performing at 95% of when new
@@jpslaym0936 that's brilliant, I didn't know that. I know they use 21700 low impedance cells to get the best performance but it's good knowing they're reliable to.
Am I the only that thinks a screen as a bar pad is a stupid idea?
I want one. But waiting for the 10 other companies that are making them to get production going. Love the look of the Honda. I figure 6-18 months there will be 5 minimum to choose from.
Sometimes the only thing you get for being a pioneer is an azz full of arrows.
You're way off on your time. More likely 2-5 years away. The Honda everyone is assuming will be out soon is the same prototype the've had since '17.
put a set of slicks on it boost over load on tarmac
thats so cool (im not buying one ever)
Need to take it to sand dunes where power is needed.
come on racer x, its 2023 u are pro ! use 4k
Just think how cool it would be with a Ti exhaust and a big bore kit!
you mean "jailbreaking" it with your iPhone?! LOL
I have a feeling you're gonna break that "phone" controller often, and they are gonna be real expensive.
Did I notice that correctly....bike starts in neutral, then it's 1-down and 4-up on the left switch? That makes me really happy.
No those are just power modes.
He brake checks Teslas.
I'd like to see a slightly smaller, lighter version as well, similar to a 125cc-stroke chassis with a ridable 40-45hp and a clutch for more control of wheel-spin etc
Josh Hill spent some time on the Stark VARG. He also said adding a Clutch would provide instant override - (Safety issue) -
I like Feeding in power - Its a right of passage -
Nice socks dude...lol
Cute, but still rather have a new CR250R. Bring them back Honda.
IROC on Vargs? Then we'll find out who the best riders really are. Once everybody gets used to them.
is the kill switch not there for safety if the throttle gets stuck?
If 60hp takes u for a ride you ain’t gonna get to the kill switch
@@martynclinton8092 but you're going to clutch it? the solutions strike me as redundant. it's not like you're riding with fingers on the clutch with this bike.
The KXF rider talking about having a clutch for safety, you can add a clutch leaver power disconnect or have it as a motor kill switch, you can also add a brake leaver motor cutout switch like ebikes have.
Thanks to the lack of a clutch, if they come out with a training wheel option even snowmobilers and quadtards will be able to ride a bike now! 😂
My biggest complaint of my buddies Honda Africa Twin DCT was that there is no instinctual (without thinking) immediate disconnect of power. It takes "whiskey throttle" to a whole new level. I imagine that this must be similar.
I am curious about the possibility of utilizing a clutch between the motor and drive train. It seems as one could get the motor to act like it has a torque curve to shorten the gap of ICE feel that so many of us are accustom too, and that way you give the rider back some more control over the motorcycle.
I agree with the clutch. I wasn't thinking about the throttle getting stuck open. For me it was more about when arm pump kicks in or getting squarely in a section and getting whiskey throttle the clutch is just a good safety Lever.
Nick is awesome and presented some very valid points. And Kris is just top tier. Both killer riders who speak true words.
I heard the battery life is 500 hours, if you ride it a lot that is maybe 2 years of riding, then you have to pay $7,000 for a new battery, no thank you.
I also saw a range test where the bike went from 100% charge to 10% charge in an hour, then it took 2.5 hours to charge it back up to 100%, that is way too long to charge for an hour of riding time. Until they can charge it from 10% to 100% in 30 minutes, or less, I will never buy one.
And the real deal killer is buying a new $7,000 battery every 2 years, never.
450 needs an new piston every 50 hours so 500 bucks if you let a shop do it. full engine rebuild 100 hours. 500 hours : 10 new pistons 2500 dollar + 5x engine rebuild for 1000 a pop "7500 dollars total. plus al the air filters oil changes and fuel. most gas bikes are done after 500 hours of enduro/racing.
Agree with the charge time isseu . maybe if the battery's get cheaper you can swap them.
@@bertr286 Yeah but that money for stuff on a gas bike is spread out over a 2 year period, a little at a time, and you save a lot of money of you do it yourself, with the Stark Varg, when the battery dies out, you have to fork over $7,000 at one time. Then pay for the shipping too.
Isn't there a kill switch on the left bar? Couldn't you hit the kill switch? How accessible is it? Thanks!
Gay
Races will sound like RC e-buggy classes
Its kinda funny how the revving of the bikes around him are in sync with him accelerating 😂
Keefer looks like he's standing behind a cardboard cutout
Is it possible to add regenerative braking perhaps.
Great review.Everything from soup to nuts.
Whats its weight in kilograms and how long is run time on these steeds
It's not engine braking. It's a motor not an engine. Ridiculous
I want a clutch too. Any decent rider modulates power more with the clutch than the throttle, especially in hard enduro type riding.
Because they have to with ICE, but it's pointless with electric.
Good stuff. And nice work Mr Cudby.
what brand is the forks and shock?
Too bad they're already getting recalled