zero loss in performance under normal usage, or heavy usage? Maybe if you're gaming and it uses only 8 cores it's fine, but if you're multitasking and using 20 cores then will you still feel confident enough to say it's zero loss in performance?
@@Chr0nicPvP Normal usage is different for everyone, for me it's gaming with youtube in background and maybe some monitoring software. In CPU heavy games you just can't undervolt the CPU,it needs current to function properly, Only really effective option for me is to lock to lower clocks. This will sound dumb,but,I locked my P-cores to 55 and E-cores to 42 just to see how silent my pc can be,and what I found is that this thing works faster at lower clocks,super stable and efficient at temps hitting 87 max in cinebench,no thermal throttling,and in real world my worse core spikes to 1.35V and 75C.
@@Chr0nicPvP yes I'm confident in saying that. I tested it over and over, some trials even ran faster than stock voltage. User benchmark scores were the same or higher.
The thermal throttling is caused by the cooler contact with the ihs, many older model air and AIO just aren't made to transfer the huge amount of heat put of by Intel 13 and 14 gen CPU's. A 360mm AIO will perform no different than a 240mm of the same model at the ihs/cooler contact. The only difference between the radiator sizes is time it takes to saturate the closed loop. Both can only remove as much heat from the ihs surface , it has nothing to do with radiator size. The temp spike are coming off the ihs not the radiator coolant. If the radiator coolant actually hit 100c and not the ihs, there is no way it could drop down suddenly even if the CPU was backing off voltage from throttling. Heat simply doesn't work that way. Put some fans on a boiling pot of water, turn off the stove burner and stick your hand in the water. It's still boiling hot with fans blowing on it even though the heat source is completely off, right? So would be your AIO. It's simply thermodynamics.
Hi Prawn! Love your videos so much. Thank you! Just got my Glahad ll 280 AIO couple days ago and it makes my 14700k so good(60-70 degrees in AIDA) in tests without throttling compared to the Galahad 240 AIO (throttling in 2mins of run AIDA)
I have the i9 13900k, and an MSI Tomahawk mobo. I've noticed that there is a bios setting that defaults to "custom liquid cooling" or something like that and has a 4096 watt value. You can change that to "box cooler" or "tower cooler" and it goes to like 253 watts. Then you can tune from there and you will never see those temps again.
@@AqepbxVondx CPU contact frame. So instead of using the stock retention arm, buying a separate CPU contact frame on the market will drop your processor's temps
You can under volt these cpus using intels overclocker and drop your temps 8-10 C sometimes more and have no performance drops. Motherboards usually always over volt the CPUs
Ran into the same problems with my i7 12700k, also with a 240 aio. Undervolting helped keep my max temp around the low 80s without killing performance. Took me 3 whole days to get it right and stable (I'm a noob at this).
One more thing I would have tried was using a contact frame. That being said, a 360 is the minimum I’d use, but I’m curious how much it would have improved
I doubt a push-pull configuration will improve things. Since you enjoy tinkering stuff (yeah!) you can try replacing the fans with more powerful fans, like the Phantex T-30, through you will lose RBG. Also a 280mm AIO cooler model, better than a 360 mm since might help also as bigger fans means more air displacement. However, if you are gaming, your CPU loads only hovers 20-30%, so temperature should stay at 50-60C, which case there is no need to worry about Full CPU loads.
If your gaming onlyh with the 14900k, just limit the power, and do a bit of undervolting. 95W vs Unlimited drops temp by about 30-40C, and you lose about 1-2 fps in gaming. You will lose out on multi threaded apps. Even in CP2077 i lost about 5fps, however the temps never went above 70C~. Basically intel has pushed an insane amount of power to squeeze out performance that in gaming situations you won't see the gain, however in apps that take advantage of multithreaded, u might see something.
It shouldn't be running that hot in games. As people have said I could have undervolted but the average gamer won't know how or want to do that. Popped it back in the Evo XL with the 360 mm Lian Li Galahad 2 and the temps are much lower with no throttling and I've overclocked it ua-cam.com/video/SBDIzcOkEaM/v-deo.html
I have tested i9 14900K with Asus TUF LC 240 and then Asus ROG Ryuo III 360 and there is almost no difference - the CPU is still overheating as hell up to the level that the heat is causing errors in DIMM, PCIe and chipset resulting in random errors and freezes. What I found the problem is, is that the MoBo should limit power to the CPU, but Asus gaming MoBos (not sure about others, but for example ASRock does not have this option) has some weird default setting that for 96 seconds it allows unlimited power to the CPU. So for example when I had 850W PCU and 350W GPU (RTX 3090), the CPU (13900KF at that time) was able to run at 500W for over a minute and half, generating incredible amount of heat and grilling itself and all the components around which was causing errors (like crash every 5 minutes). Then I upgraded to 14900K and 650W GPU (RTX 4080) and the CPU got naturally limited to 200W and was running stable (with only rare crashes when GPU was idle and not consuming so much power). However once I upgraded to 1200W PCU (ironically trying to solve the crashes by providing more power), the CPU was able to run at 500+W again. My solution was to limit the CPU power back to 200W since the beginning of every BOOST which then results in better distribution of the heat between the AIO and other MoBo coolers and prevents the crashes. (In the XTU you will see this as "Power Limit Throttling" instead of "Thermal Throttling"). Why this works is because Power limit works BEFORE the CPU starts overheating which Thermal limit works AFTER is starts overheating. Also make sure your Pump is set to Full speed at all times and FAN does not use any "silent" or "slow start" setting to be able to cool the CPU as soon as the Boost kicks in.
Fun tip don’t undervolt the cpu but change the power output your motherboard gives to the cpu so it’ll edp/current throttle it’ll still give you max output but it won’t be able to go above 94% usage keeps my temps sub 70 on a air cooler
I don't have a 14900 but I did get a 14700k, it's basically the same minus 4 ecores and that means it runs a bit cooler. I was super worried about my cooler being able to cool this chip since I've seen multiple videos and threads that these new chips run very hot and can get 100c very quickly. I only have a H100i Platinum 240mm AIO, well to my great surprise the thing can cool the cpu absolutely fine! I'm using a retention block with Arctic MX-6 paste. It's only been a few days since the upgrade (coming from a 9900k) and I currently have it running at 5.7p all core and 4.6e all core at 1.35 volts, running R23 I see p core temps in the high 80's and ecore temps in the 70's and just shy of 38k score. P core temps will rise into the 90's if I loop the run a few times which is expected since a 240 has less liquid than a 360 thus heats faster but I never put the cpu under that much stress for that long, it's a gaming machine at the core and while gaming it's rarely over 55 degrees all day long. I'm quite content with the upgrade.
And what about noise ? Is it loud ? And what are your fans rpm ? Im asking cause im in the same case since i have a Fractal North and i dont have the space for a 360 aio
@@arka955 Not loud, fans are set to static 1800 rpm, can barely hear it at all, case fans are louder. All noise from the fans get completely overshadowed by the gpu fans when gaming and I always wear a noise cancelling headset so really doesn't bother me at all.
My prebuilt gaming pc came with a cheap 240 AIO for the 14900K. Ive just updated the BIOS (as per your other video, thanks) and I am seeing around 70C with Intel settings and RTX4090 gaming at 4K 100 fps ish in new games. Going to fit a contact frame and change the paste. Could fit a 280 AIO in the case (if the 240 breaks thats what I will do) but I think it’s going to be ok for now.
ty for this im already dying on a 14700k to make sure im not insane cause i dont have THE best case but it at least inspired to me swap to a 360mm to keep it cool
Yep this is very true. Intel recommends 253W PL2 limit and in the video seems that PL2 is unlimited. I've had the same problem, set it according to Intel PL1 and PL2 to 253W and no more throttling
I think something you should incorporate in your videos is clock speeds of the cpu with the temps. These CPUs are meant to go to its max temp but the difference lies on the clock speeds.
I'm certainly hoping the rumors/leaks for next gen hardware are true about an uptick in efficiency. Arrow lake is supposedly going to be around 30% more efficient than meteor/raptor lake, RTX 5090 is speculated to be a 2 slot cooler design as well. Certainly holding out for that on my next build, which I'm going from Laptop back to a desktop, probably an MATX/ITX build for my semi truck. Modern top end consumer hardware has gotten a bit ridiculous with the power draw these days, and thermal solutions. I'd certainly say it's high time to dial it back, otherwise people are gonna be using automotive size radiators just to cool their pc..😅
I've got a 360m with really good air flow and I still have this issue. Ive been researching and there is a fix for this. These new generation chips instake too much voltage - anyone reading this comment - look into undervolting your cpu. I went from 100degrees on the i9 14900k in cenebench and now im getting a max temp or 92 under extreme load. This means in gaming, my cpu temp has come down dramatically.
I have a 360 aio (arctic cool liquid freez ii) and a 50$ thermalpad, open case and still get the same amount of power as you do. the i9-14900k has to be optimized ALOT to get 2000+ score. Next upgrade I‘ll do will be a better motherboard, as I don‘t see any other way to upgrade my cooling.
Just finished building my custom water cooled pc with a i9 14900k… stripped it back down again thinking the CPU paste/ cooler…. Nope everything fine…. Glad to see I’m not on my own… I have a 420 radiator with 3 140mm fans…. Still runs to 100c 😮
@@TheProvokedPrawn yeah I did a little. Went to Bios and dropped my 14700k down by .125 volts. It increased my scores on cinebench and XTU benchmark but it still was reaching that 100° mark. I can't find a way to disable undervolt protection in XTU.
@@SaintG.K. I have the same problem on my 13900 KS. I also have a 420 mm AIO along with five fans not including the AIO fans, all intake except one exhaust as for going for positive pressure case. While playing Starfield, my temp will go up to 85c sometimes even 87c. I also used the stock thermal paste on the AIO. I’m thinking of redoing the paste, but I would also like to undervolt as well but having same problem as I’m not experienced with that and also can’t find how to disable the protection. I tried following another UA-camrs steps with same processor but it just made it unstable until I set bios back to stock. I would only need to slightly undervolt but can’t just figure it out. I also have an MSI board. They say the 13900KS can run at 80c and it does not throttle till 100c and I have never seen it go to 90 while playing game but has been close. So I’m not too worried but I would like to bring down the temp just a bit for longevity.
Hey Prawn, could you maybe showcase the difference of all size aio with modern CPUs like you did with this size, but scaled now from small to large aios.
Outputting 2004 pts in CB2024 with only 125W 13900HX (laptop one) udervolting -125 / -125 / -100 mV (Pcore, Ecore, Ring) and 5600 CL45 ram tweaked to 64000 CL38 ... And we are talking about a 17 inch laptop (not watercooled yet XMG NEO E23).
I noticed similar behaviour with my 240mm AIO. I'd love to see you retest with a 360mm AIO to see what the difference is. I'm considering buying a bigger AIO and it would be nice to know ahead of time if it will help.
I was using NZXT 280mm for my 7950x3d and temps all right but could get high during gaming so went and got 360 nzxt kraken and yeah temps cooler.High end cpus need 360mm or better imo
My thoughts are with the latest generation of Intel CPUs that the off the shelf AIOs aren't up to the task anymore. I have a i7-13700KF and an ASUS Ryujin III 240 AIO, it wasn't up to the task. I replaced the stock 30mm thick, 240mm aluminum radiator with a 65mm thick copper 240mm radiator and it is better but still hitting 90+ degC at times under stress testing with the exhaust air reaching about 35 degC temperature. My Ryujin III has an 8th gen Asetek pump but I'm thinking it's lacking the volume capacity to circulate the coolant sufficiently. When I get some time I'm planning on adding an auxiliary pump to see if that helps my cooling.
From my experience Intel XTU doesn’t work well with Asus performance motherboards like ROG series. No matter what you do on Intel utility the Asus motherboard will do its own “thing” meaning it will try always to get you to the top results with more voltage / power delivered to the CPU. The only work around is to force your own values on the bios itself and disable everything related to “enhance” the performance.
I ran my 13900KF on a 120AIO, on full optimized mode. lol. I did TJ max a few games. And would crash, periodically but for the most part I never saw over 75 in AAA games.
I run 14900k with 360 Corsair Link AIO quiet profile. Runs fine. Jumps to 80-90 for a second on a few cores. I found a happy place with Z790 AI overclock, limits removed (up to 90C to be safe). 4 sticks RAM only runs stable at 5800 vs 6400 spec though. Spread Kryonaught extreme on IHS. CPU pegs at 5.7 up to 6.2. I only bench games though. Runs stable with Starfield, Cyberpunk and Star Citizen. I think the 14900k/DDR5 performance boasts were a "bit" overstated. I only bought the 14900k cause it literally launched for sale as I was looking for a new CPU and I upgraded from 9900K, which by the way, I ran OC'd at 5.1 stable...for years with no issues. By the time updates have the 14900K stable at advertised speed, it will of course be outdated.
I have Kraken Z360 AIO for cooling down corei9 14900KF. It's still throttling. No current AIO on the market can change that I'm afraid. Maybe 420mm, but I daubt that too. It's just Corei9 that's it, they're hot guys.
@@TheProvokedPrawn thank God I don't have any stability issues or crashes or whatever. I just hit 100C only in benchmarking and CPU rendering, in games the temps go barely 45-50C
it's my opinion that radiator air should be intake, pull in cool air through the radiator to cool the liquid to the CPU. I had SERIOUSLY considered this case myself, but to just have the 3 fans at the side as intake really wont do much for the CPU, same the rear fan as intake because the CPU is COVERED by the pump and it is being cooled by the radiator. My suggestion, 360 radiator as intake to the side. The bottom fans really do not do much other than add to noise. Cases arent raised high enough to allow for much air and the GPU fans already pull in air, however, you had it set to pull air through the glass? LOL, that vertical GPU mount is not practical to me all. But no problem to install intake to the bottom once the additional fan noise no issue to you. So side & bottom intake and top and rear exhaust.
1.5V and 310W out of the allowed 253W so you are overclocked, even if you didn't do it yourself, it's not just the high end CPUs that run hot when overclocked... Also it is technically thermal throttling but is it really if you are overclocking?!
I ended up setting asus multicore enhancement to disabled-enforce all limits in the bios, and it helped a bit, but I'm going to try a cpu contact frame as mine is still running a bit hot, even with a 360 AIO.
I have h9 flow case, with galahad II trinity 360mm and 14700k. I also added 3 intake fans to bottom of the case(left the back outtake fan as is). I didn't do any overclocking but ran cinebench23 and max temp was 88. no thermal throttling in sight. Although I also have Thermalright contact thingy for cpu. I butchered my AIO installation like thermal paste shifted a lot and should probably re-do it. but since there is no problem atm I don't want to.
Good lesson in detecting the problem and some possible solutions to it. But, as is always the case, things are never simple and easy. Hot problems need cool solutions ! Good video, nonetheless !
I have a 4090 currently running 12900K and upgrading to a 14900K with a 360 AIO and 10 fans in the case already. Is it true the temps for just 4K gaming will be in the 85-90s?
Auto settings for CPU in the BIOS of all mainboard‘s in the last few years use way to much voltage for i9 CPU’s especially. They are running it so hot that CPU’s are thermal throttling. I have huge custom loop cooling both my 14900K and my 4090. Still letting it on auto makes 0 sense. I have spent quite a time playing with the core voltage and thermal limits until I came to my current setup. Now I get maximum performance with less power consumption then leaving it on auto. It was completely differently than with my 12900K and my Z690 mainboard. I have limited my constant power, I have left unlimited short duration power and I have made the overall offset of -0.050V for the core voltage. I can run Prime95 small FFT’s with 26 threads and pull maximum 404 Watt short therm and 330-ish constant load and still be in low 80’s degree Centigrade. Getting in 2300 points range in Cinebench 2024 at stock speeds. That works with my way cooling solution. 240 can cool 14900K if both short and long power limits are set on something under 250 Watt and you reduce the core Voltage for 0.030 V if it can run stable like that. It shouldn’t hit thermal throttle after it. It will make higher results in the benchmarks but the performance will be bit weaker and it will not reach its full potential. This change will though be enough not to slow down games while gaming, especially at higher resolution and higher graphic settings will not draw more than 200 Watt. You will have similar performance in games as someone with really good cooling. I wouldn’t run Prime95 with small FFT’s though. Even after limiting it will be very hard. For 14900K I would recommend 360 or 420 AIO minimum, if you want to approach its full potential. Considering that new Arctic Cooling Liquid Freezer III 420 costs like 100 bucks in white and RGB (to match your system) I would recommend that and 3 more P14 white fans to set it up in the push pull solution. That can cool the 14900K proper if fed with cool air from the outside of the case.
I have 360 AIO still runs hot...cinibench 100c thermal throttling...RDR 2 full graphics hits 79c ....I may try the contact frame..heard it can reduce temps...
Im using a 2 fan aio on my 14900k just fine mate,that case u have is terrible,the airflow from the 3 front fans is is best part missing the motherboard! swap out the stock cpu frame aswell
Why wouldn't you put Liquid Metal? IHS is Nikle-plated, pump is copper, I have it in laptop for 5 months, now I've opened it it was still liquid, removed polished schorched part on the radiator (pure copper) and now it may be applied for life - scorched part will no longer 'absorb Galium' from liquid metal compound. I can see 20C drop in high temps.
Like every YT tech reviewer said on launch day that a 240mm-280mm AIO would not be enough and even a 360mm AIO barely keeps up on a 14900K. I don't know what you were expecting here. 🙄
@@TheProvokedPrawn What??? Like every top tech reviewer said this unanimously. If everyone is saying, "Don't walk over there, there's a huge bottomless pit you'll fall down." You're the kinda person that says, "Nah... I'm gonna go see for myself and fall into the pit." 😆
You could...but why? Ive seen a 14900k bring a watercooled system to its knees. That cup is a binned 13900ks. not using it on a 240...you need a 420 or better.
Can you really just recommend a 360 over a 240 just like that? If the heatsink of a 240 and 360 is the same, it will thermal throttle the same. Unless you ran the tests for so long that the loop was saturated temperature wise, which I doubt.
Hey Provoked Prawn, do you reckon a 280mm nzxt aio with 4 fans pulling air into the case would work with a 14900ks? If not what would be a good intel cpu to look at?
Prawn IF u have an RTX4080 & corsair shift psu do you recommend LIAN LI - STRIMER PLUS V2 12VHPWR or CORSAIR Premium Individually Sleeved Type-5 PSU Cables ? ?
Hello again i am thinking of buying NZXT Kraken Elite 280mm or NZXT Kraken Z63 280mm for i9 13900k. Would that be ok or should i still consider to maybe go for NZXT Kraken Elite 360? id rather get the 280mm, but asking a PRO for help.
im having almost the same trouble while my cpu is staying cool tho the gpu is getting hot . i have a 3 fan aio in front and 2 240mm fans on top blowing air out and the fan in back is blowing air out but the 3 fans in front that is cooling the aio raditor its keeping the cpu cool but there is not really no extra air flow comming into the case from the front aio, should i get a 2 fan aio and put it on top and have it blow out and have 3 fans in front moving air into the case? i have a corsair 570x case
@@TheProvokedPrawnmy cpu is staying below 50c while gaming its my video card that is getting hot snice there is no extra air flow comming through the front aio raditor and my corsair 570x case i can not mount a 3 fan aio raditor to the top for some reason the screw holes do not line up.... if i was able to mount my 3 fan aio to the top of my case i would unless there is a way i dont see
Might be the motherboard vendor ignoring the intel spec and overclocking them "out of the box" check the bios. It's a significant difference for little to no reduction in performance
In that same Intel tuning utility you can undervolt the CPU by 0.05v with zero loss in performance and it runs about 15° cooler.
zero loss in performance under normal usage, or heavy usage? Maybe if you're gaming and it uses only 8 cores it's fine, but if you're multitasking and using 20 cores then will you still feel confident enough to say it's zero loss in performance?
@@Chr0nicPvP Normal usage is different for everyone, for me it's gaming with youtube in background and maybe some monitoring software. In CPU heavy games you just can't undervolt the CPU,it needs current to function properly, Only really effective option for me is to lock to lower clocks. This will sound dumb,but,I locked my P-cores to 55 and E-cores to 42 just to see how silent my pc can be,and what I found is that this thing works faster at lower clocks,super stable and efficient at temps hitting 87 max in cinebench,no thermal throttling,and in real world my worse core spikes to 1.35V and 75C.
You are wrong it depends on the Silicon you can actually undervolt and get the same performance
Ppl here dont know about CPUs Intel has been running hot for ober 12 years just delidd
@@Chr0nicPvP yes I'm confident in saying that. I tested it over and over, some trials even ran faster than stock voltage. User benchmark scores were the same or higher.
The thermal throttling is caused by the cooler contact with the ihs, many older model air and AIO just aren't made to transfer the huge amount of heat put of by Intel 13 and 14 gen CPU's. A 360mm AIO will perform no different than a 240mm of the same model at the ihs/cooler contact. The only difference between the radiator sizes is time it takes to saturate the closed loop. Both can only remove as much heat from the ihs surface , it has nothing to do with radiator size. The temp spike are coming off the ihs not the radiator coolant. If the radiator coolant actually hit 100c and not the ihs, there is no way it could drop down suddenly even if the CPU was backing off voltage from throttling. Heat simply doesn't work that way. Put some fans on a boiling pot of water, turn off the stove burner and stick your hand in the water. It's still boiling hot with fans blowing on it even though the heat source is completely off, right? So would be your AIO. It's simply thermodynamics.
Hi Prawn! Love your videos so much. Thank you!
Just got my Glahad ll 280 AIO couple days ago and it makes my 14700k so good(60-70 degrees in AIDA) in tests without throttling compared to the Galahad 240 AIO (throttling in 2mins of run AIDA)
thanks for sharing! have you seen this too? ua-cam.com/video/jP7nERdD-Gk/v-deo.html you probably don't need it but just in case :)
I have 14700k and GA II 280, but my 14700k always throttling after run AIDA 1 min. Can you tell me what is going on?
I have the i9 13900k, and an MSI Tomahawk mobo. I've noticed that there is a bios setting that defaults to "custom liquid cooling" or something like that and has a 4096 watt value. You can change that to "box cooler" or "tower cooler" and it goes to like 253 watts. Then you can tune from there and you will never see those temps again.
12 gen and up naturally run hot and i've noticed it helps a lot to undervolt these cpu's.
Use the LGA 1700 contact frame too. It drops the temperature by up to 7°C
I’ve go the 360 aio and lga frame and still throttling.
@@JustAlb1nme too... This cpu is a devil!
ive lowered the voltage a bit but still gets hot to quick@@evilasiov
@@AqepbxVondx CPU contact frame. So instead of using the stock retention arm, buying a separate CPU contact frame on the market will drop your processor's temps
You can under volt these cpus using intels overclocker and drop your temps 8-10 C sometimes more and have no performance drops. Motherboards usually always over volt the CPUs
Hey you can also check your bios settings..your i9 uses 345W of power. Maybe there is auto oc on or you could limit the wattage to 250W
But this wattage is used in one hour or what? Like 250W in one hour?
holy moly, maybe a delta fan can solve the problem, but its noisy asf
Yeah new bios update has 3 settings 241w 253w and unlimited wattage
I have 280aio. Huge improvement over 240aio.
Ran into the same problems with my i7 12700k, also with a 240 aio. Undervolting helped keep my max temp around the low 80s without killing performance. Took me 3 whole days to get it right and stable (I'm a noob at this).
One more thing I would have tried was using a contact frame. That being said, a 360 is the minimum I’d use, but I’m curious how much it would have improved
did this for my 14700k, reallly helped!
Very true, I think I was lucky with my results. @@johnbeaudin
@@johnbeaudin yeah those things have very small tolerance when installing. You get it wrong and you may as well not be using it
he was using a contact frame
@@ZomgZomg007 no he wasn’t. Watch the video again and you will see the stock ilm is always used.
I doubt a push-pull configuration will improve things. Since you enjoy tinkering stuff (yeah!) you can try replacing the fans with more powerful fans, like the Phantex T-30, through you will lose RBG. Also a 280mm AIO cooler model, better than a 360 mm since might help also as bigger fans means more air displacement.
However, if you are gaming, your CPU loads only hovers 20-30%, so temperature should stay at 50-60C, which case there is no need to worry about Full CPU loads.
If your gaming onlyh with the 14900k, just limit the power, and do a bit of undervolting.
95W vs Unlimited drops temp by about 30-40C, and you lose about 1-2 fps in gaming. You will lose out on multi threaded apps. Even in CP2077 i lost about 5fps, however the temps never went above 70C~.
Basically intel has pushed an insane amount of power to squeeze out performance that in gaming situations you won't see the gain, however in apps that take advantage of multithreaded, u might see something.
In your test case, you are right. But if the cpu is not being pushed to those kinds of limits, then a 240aio will be fine.
It shouldn't be running that hot in games. As people have said I could have undervolted but the average gamer won't know how or want to do that. Popped it back in the Evo XL with the 360 mm Lian Li Galahad 2 and the temps are much lower with no throttling and I've overclocked it ua-cam.com/video/SBDIzcOkEaM/v-deo.html
I'm running a 240 aio with 2 intake fans and 1 exhaust fans, same processor, and my max temp in the intel utility stress test is 64 degrees.
you can also make your AIO intake, that way your AIO will constantly get fresh cooler air instead of preheated air from the gpu and case
But that would now make the gpu hotter since hot air rises
I have tested i9 14900K with Asus TUF LC 240 and then Asus ROG Ryuo III 360 and there is almost no difference - the CPU is still overheating as hell up to the level that the heat is causing errors in DIMM, PCIe and chipset resulting in random errors and freezes.
What I found the problem is, is that the MoBo should limit power to the CPU, but Asus gaming MoBos (not sure about others, but for example ASRock does not have this option) has some weird default setting that for 96 seconds it allows unlimited power to the CPU. So for example when I had 850W PCU and 350W GPU (RTX 3090), the CPU (13900KF at that time) was able to run at 500W for over a minute and half, generating incredible amount of heat and grilling itself and all the components around which was causing errors (like crash every 5 minutes). Then I upgraded to 14900K and 650W GPU (RTX 4080) and the CPU got naturally limited to 200W and was running stable (with only rare crashes when GPU was idle and not consuming so much power). However once I upgraded to 1200W PCU (ironically trying to solve the crashes by providing more power), the CPU was able to run at 500+W again.
My solution was to limit the CPU power back to 200W since the beginning of every BOOST which then results in better distribution of the heat between the AIO and other MoBo coolers and prevents the crashes. (In the XTU you will see this as "Power Limit Throttling" instead of "Thermal Throttling"). Why this works is because Power limit works BEFORE the CPU starts overheating which Thermal limit works AFTER is starts overheating. Also make sure your Pump is set to Full speed at all times and FAN does not use any "silent" or "slow start" setting to be able to cool the CPU as soon as the Boost kicks in.
What should I get for a 4090 suprim liquid x?
Fun tip don’t undervolt the cpu but change the power output your motherboard gives to the cpu so it’ll edp/current throttle it’ll still give you max output but it won’t be able to go above 94% usage keeps my temps sub 70 on a air cooler
I don't have a 14900 but I did get a 14700k, it's basically the same minus 4 ecores and that means it runs a bit cooler. I was super worried about my cooler being able to cool this chip since I've seen multiple videos and threads that these new chips run very hot and can get 100c very quickly. I only have a H100i Platinum 240mm AIO, well to my great surprise the thing can cool the cpu absolutely fine! I'm using a retention block with Arctic MX-6 paste. It's only been a few days since the upgrade (coming from a 9900k) and I currently have it running at 5.7p all core and 4.6e all core at 1.35 volts, running R23 I see p core temps in the high 80's and ecore temps in the 70's and just shy of 38k score. P core temps will rise into the 90's if I loop the run a few times which is expected since a 240 has less liquid than a 360 thus heats faster but I never put the cpu under that much stress for that long, it's a gaming machine at the core and while gaming it's rarely over 55 degrees all day long. I'm quite content with the upgrade.
You are not alone in this case👍🏻
@@djsalamatit must be a very large case.
And what about noise ? Is it loud ? And what are your fans rpm ? Im asking cause im in the same case since i have a Fractal North and i dont have the space for a 360 aio
@@arka955 Not loud, fans are set to static 1800 rpm, can barely hear it at all, case fans are louder. All noise from the fans get completely overshadowed by the gpu fans when gaming and I always wear a noise cancelling headset so really doesn't bother me at all.
My prebuilt gaming pc came with a cheap 240 AIO for the 14900K. Ive just updated the BIOS (as per your other video, thanks) and I am seeing around 70C with Intel settings and RTX4090 gaming at 4K 100 fps ish in new games. Going to fit a contact frame and change the paste. Could fit a 280 AIO in the case (if the 240 breaks thats what I will do) but I think it’s going to be ok for now.
great video.
if you own 14900K go for new Arctic Liquid Freezer III 360 - it runs 10 degrees cooler than my previous MSI AIO 360
Thanks for sharing
ty for this im already dying on a 14700k to make sure im not insane cause i dont have THE best case but it at least inspired to me swap to a 360mm to keep it cool
Watch this too. It might help ua-cam.com/video/sVEXd-Wp8FY/v-deo.html
You have the TDP unlocked lock it to intel defaults and it will be fine. I don't get how people don't understand this yet.
Yep this is very true. Intel recommends 253W PL2 limit and in the video seems that PL2 is unlimited. I've had the same problem, set it according to Intel PL1 and PL2 to 253W and no more throttling
Brief and Useful.
Glad it was helpful!
I think something you should incorporate in your videos is clock speeds of the cpu with the temps. These CPUs are meant to go to its max temp but the difference lies on the clock speeds.
Much agreed- I want to see those clock speeds when it's running into throttle territory. Good comment ;)
I'm certainly hoping the rumors/leaks for next gen hardware are true about an uptick in efficiency. Arrow lake is supposedly going to be around 30% more efficient than meteor/raptor lake, RTX 5090 is speculated to be a 2 slot cooler design as well. Certainly holding out for that on my next build, which I'm going from Laptop back to a desktop, probably an MATX/ITX build for my semi truck.
Modern top end consumer hardware has gotten a bit ridiculous with the power draw these days, and thermal solutions. I'd certainly say it's high time to dial it back, otherwise people are gonna be using automotive size radiators just to cool their pc..😅
I've got a 360m with really good air flow and I still have this issue. Ive been researching and there is a fix for this. These new generation chips instake too much voltage - anyone reading this comment - look into undervolting your cpu. I went from 100degrees on the i9 14900k in cenebench and now im getting a max temp or 92 under extreme load. This means in gaming, my cpu temp has come down dramatically.
I have a 360 aio (arctic cool liquid freez ii) and a 50$ thermalpad, open case and still get the same amount of power as you do.
the i9-14900k has to be optimized ALOT to get 2000+ score.
Next upgrade I‘ll do will be a better motherboard, as I don‘t see any other way to upgrade my cooling.
Use a contact frame my 14900k dropped by 10 c
Just finished building my custom water cooled pc with a i9 14900k… stripped it back down again thinking the CPU paste/ cooler…. Nope everything fine…. Glad to see I’m not on my own… I have a 420 radiator with 3 140mm fans…. Still runs to 100c 😮
😅... I just did the exact same thing with my i7 14700K. I thought I had messed something up
Could try undervolting
@@TheProvokedPrawn ooo I’ll have to go and research that.. thanks ☺️
@@TheProvokedPrawn yeah I did a little. Went to Bios and dropped my 14700k down by .125 volts. It increased my scores on cinebench and XTU benchmark but it still was reaching that 100° mark. I can't find a way to disable undervolt protection in XTU.
@@SaintG.K. I have the same problem on my 13900 KS. I also have a 420 mm AIO along with five fans not including the AIO fans, all intake except one exhaust as for going for positive pressure case. While playing Starfield, my temp will go up to 85c sometimes even 87c. I also used the stock thermal paste on the AIO. I’m thinking of redoing the paste, but I would also like to undervolt as well but having same problem as I’m not experienced with that and also can’t find how to disable the protection. I tried following another UA-camrs steps with same processor but it just made it unstable until I set bios back to stock. I would only need to slightly undervolt but can’t just figure it out. I also have an MSI board. They say the 13900KS can run at 80c and it does not throttle till 100c and I have never seen it go to 90 while playing game but has been close. So I’m not too worried but I would like to bring down the temp just a bit for longevity.
Great vid 👍🏼
Hey Prawn, could you maybe showcase the difference of all size aio with modern CPUs like you did with this size, but scaled now from small to large aios.
Puget systems manage the 14900k temps with an Air Cooler by adjusting the Asus Bios settings.
Outputting 2004 pts in CB2024 with only 125W 13900HX (laptop one) udervolting -125 / -125 / -100 mV (Pcore, Ecore, Ring) and 5600 CL45 ram tweaked to 64000 CL38 ...
And we are talking about a 17 inch laptop (not watercooled yet XMG NEO E23).
I noticed similar behaviour with my 240mm AIO. I'd love to see you retest with a 360mm AIO to see what the difference is. I'm considering buying a bigger AIO and it would be nice to know ahead of time if it will help.
I ran it with a 360mm recently but with push pull and it was cooler. ua-cam.com/video/sVEXd-Wp8FY/v-deo.html
I was using NZXT 280mm for my 7950x3d and temps all right but could get high during gaming so went and got 360 nzxt kraken and yeah temps cooler.High end cpus need 360mm or better imo
@@johnnyboogalo4897 NZXT is okayish better to get CoolerMaster 360 Atmos or Arctic Liquid Cooler 2 360 A-RGB or AK Nucleus 360.
I have Kraken Z360, same temperatures throttling. Not in games though, but under Cinebench and other similar stuff.
Undervolt + Anti bending bracket is the way to go with these latest power hungry cpus.
My thoughts are with the latest generation of Intel CPUs that the off the shelf AIOs aren't up to the task anymore.
I have a i7-13700KF and an ASUS Ryujin III 240 AIO, it wasn't up to the task. I replaced the stock 30mm thick, 240mm aluminum radiator with a 65mm thick copper 240mm radiator and it is better but still hitting 90+ degC at times under stress testing with the exhaust air reaching about 35 degC temperature. My Ryujin III has an 8th gen Asetek pump but I'm thinking it's lacking the volume capacity to circulate the coolant sufficiently. When I get some time I'm planning on adding an auxiliary pump to see if that helps my cooling.
Running into your exact issue with the ASUS Strix LCII 360MM AIO
ua-cam.com/video/jP7nERdD-Gk/v-deo.html
From my experience Intel XTU doesn’t work well with Asus performance motherboards like ROG series. No matter what you do on Intel utility the Asus motherboard will do its own “thing” meaning it will try always to get you to the top results with more voltage / power delivered to the CPU. The only work around is to force your own values on the bios itself and disable everything related to “enhance” the performance.
I ran my 13900KF on a 120AIO, on full optimized mode. lol. I did TJ max a few games. And would crash, periodically but for the most part I never saw over 75 in AAA games.
280 mm is the sweet spot really And you can undervolt cpu a bit To get even more less temps on 100% loads on with no issues
As on Monday my 12900k is going under a EK 240 AIO I’ll be looking into your under-volting video.
My family member had the same cpu has air cooled works great wouldn't say undervolting it only undercolt the 13th and 14th gen
I run 14900k with 360 Corsair Link AIO quiet profile. Runs fine. Jumps to 80-90 for a second on a few cores. I found a happy place with Z790 AI overclock, limits removed (up to 90C to be safe). 4 sticks RAM only runs stable at 5800 vs 6400 spec though. Spread Kryonaught extreme on IHS. CPU pegs at 5.7 up to 6.2. I only bench games though. Runs stable with Starfield, Cyberpunk and Star Citizen. I think the 14900k/DDR5 performance boasts were a "bit" overstated. I only bought the 14900k cause it literally launched for sale as I was looking for a new CPU and I upgraded from 9900K, which by the way, I ran OC'd at 5.1 stable...for years with no issues. By the time updates have the 14900K stable at advertised speed, it will of course be outdated.
why would anyone get i9 14900K,? dead platform, huge power usage, sick temps.
I have Kraken Z360 AIO for cooling down corei9 14900KF. It's still throttling. No current AIO on the market can change that I'm afraid. Maybe 420mm, but I daubt that too. It's just Corei9 that's it, they're hot guys.
ua-cam.com/video/Nm6fXM5Qk60/v-deo.html
@@TheProvokedPrawn thank God I don't have any stability issues or crashes or whatever. I just hit 100C only in benchmarking and CPU rendering, in games the temps go barely 45-50C
@@sacifair good stuff
its running at 3000watts!! its doing reallyt good
it's my opinion that radiator air should be intake, pull in cool air through the radiator to cool the liquid to the CPU. I had SERIOUSLY considered this case myself, but to just have the 3 fans at the side as intake really wont do much for the CPU, same the rear fan as intake because the CPU is COVERED by the pump and it is being cooled by the radiator. My suggestion, 360 radiator as intake to the side. The bottom fans really do not do much other than add to noise. Cases arent raised high enough to allow for much air and the GPU fans already pull in air, however, you had it set to pull air through the glass? LOL, that vertical GPU mount is not practical to me all. But no problem to install intake to the bottom once the additional fan noise no issue to you. So side & bottom intake and top and rear exhaust.
ua-cam.com/video/qQcyYHGtArs/v-deo.html
1.5V and 310W out of the allowed 253W so you are overclocked, even if you didn't do it yourself, it's not just the high end CPUs that run hot when overclocked...
Also it is technically thermal throttling but is it really if you are overclocking?!
I just tested my i7-13700k on intel extreme tuners, it is wierdly oc’d. Around 4-5 ghz, i got to 87 degrees c, and it did 9600 marks
I ended up setting asus multicore enhancement to disabled-enforce all limits in the bios, and it helped a bit, but I'm going to try a cpu contact frame as mine is still running a bit hot, even with a 360 AIO.
The cpu frames are great took 6° off me with a 240mm aio
I have h9 flow case, with galahad II trinity 360mm and 14700k. I also added 3 intake fans to bottom of the case(left the back outtake fan as is). I didn't do any overclocking but ran cinebench23 and max temp was 88. no thermal throttling in sight. Although I also have Thermalright contact thingy for cpu. I butchered my AIO installation like thermal paste shifted a lot and should probably re-do it. but since there is no problem atm I don't want to.
👍🏼
I have h9 flow too with Corsair Link fans , my 14700k is thermal throttling suddenly, repasted but same issue , what paste are you using ?
update bios to set the default intel power limit, or set it in the bios, base power should be 125 w, and the turbo power 253 w
Maybe do the same test but using all Lian Li AL fans and 240mm radiator instead. I would be curious to see if the resutls are different.
Use the LGA 1700 contact frame, and undervolt the 12th to 14th gen K model of i9
Tried contact frame and undervolting? A video showcase on undervolting using XTU would get a lot of views I think
That's a good idea. Thank you.
Good lesson in detecting the problem and some possible solutions to it. But, as is always the case, things are never simple and easy. Hot problems need cool solutions ! Good video, nonetheless !
building an i5 14600k and im using 2 360 rads in s custom loop with contact frame and ek velocity 2 block
I tired this and it works best with the 280mm AIO rad under volted max 70c 240watts power draw with a CB SCORE of 40102
Contact frame 360 aio almost 2400mm of fans..positive pressure, gpu water cooled....14900k 87c no throttle 6.1 2 core 6.1 all. 42k r23.
With 360 I’m getting the same results!
ua-cam.com/video/jP7nERdD-Gk/v-deo.html
I have a 4090 currently running 12900K and upgrading to a 14900K with a 360 AIO and 10 fans in the case already. Is it true the temps for just 4K gaming will be in the 85-90s?
A cpu contact frame would have helped
Auto settings for CPU in the BIOS of all mainboard‘s in the last few years use way to much voltage for i9 CPU’s especially. They are running it so hot that CPU’s are thermal throttling.
I have huge custom loop cooling both my 14900K and my 4090. Still letting it on auto makes 0 sense.
I have spent quite a time playing with the core voltage and thermal limits until I came to my current setup. Now I get maximum performance with less power consumption then leaving it on auto.
It was completely differently than with my 12900K and my Z690 mainboard.
I have limited my constant power, I have left unlimited short duration power and I have made the overall offset of -0.050V for the core voltage. I can run Prime95 small FFT’s with 26 threads and pull maximum 404 Watt short therm and 330-ish constant load and still be in low 80’s degree Centigrade. Getting in 2300 points range in Cinebench 2024 at stock speeds. That works with my way cooling solution.
240 can cool 14900K if both short and long power limits are set on something under 250 Watt and you reduce the core Voltage for 0.030 V if it can run stable like that. It shouldn’t hit thermal throttle after it. It will make higher results in the benchmarks but the performance will be bit weaker and it will not reach its full potential.
This change will though be enough not to slow down games while gaming, especially at higher resolution and higher graphic settings will not draw more than 200 Watt. You will have similar performance in games as someone with really good cooling.
I wouldn’t run Prime95 with small FFT’s though. Even after limiting it will be very hard.
For 14900K I would recommend 360 or 420 AIO minimum, if you want to approach its full potential. Considering that new Arctic Cooling Liquid Freezer III 420 costs like 100 bucks in white and RGB (to match your system) I would recommend that and 3 more P14 white fans to set it up in the push pull solution. That can cool the 14900K proper if fed with cool air from the outside of the case.
I have 360 AIO still runs hot...cinibench 100c thermal throttling...RDR 2 full graphics hits 79c ....I may try the contact frame..heard it can reduce temps...
What's your fan setup like? Have you tried setting your rad fans to intake ua-cam.com/video/sVEXd-Wp8FY/v-deo.html
Ur voltage definitley too high
@Frozoken yea, I agree...lowered via offset, now temps never go above..80c..lol..
Helpful thanks
Glad it helped
Im using a 2 fan aio on my 14900k just fine mate,that case u have is terrible,the airflow from the 3 front fans is is best part missing the motherboard! swap out the stock cpu frame aswell
Powerlimit it! They have no limit set, overshooting far beyond intels TDP 253 by far
I use a contact frame with a 360 aio... Seems to keep the temps under control in my rig
Is a 1000w gold good enough to comfortably support a 4090 and an i9 14900k
ua-cam.com/video/dNseVxqqar0/v-deo.html
if your cpu sp is 100+ you can offset -0.1V. I use 280mm cooler never throttled.
ohh and CEP disabled
Great video! I just ordered a Lian Li Galahad II trinity 240mm, do you think it's gonna handle the temps on a 14900k?
People have suggested undervolting. It is likely to run hot. Just think about airflow and cool air for the rad.
Any luck bro? I just got the same AIO for a 14900K in a Fractal Design North... I can't do a 360 cause the 4090 Aero OC is too long T_T
Why wouldn't you put Liquid Metal? IHS is Nikle-plated, pump is copper, I have it in laptop for 5 months, now I've opened it it was still liquid, removed polished schorched part on the radiator (pure copper) and now it may be applied for life - scorched part will no longer 'absorb Galium' from liquid metal compound. I can see 20C drop in high temps.
Any thoughts to swapping in a contact frame on the cpu?
I did that on my pc. Kind of a scary process but it's dropped my temps quite a substantial amount.
I'm going to do it soon
There is no 1 AIO that can properly cool the 14900k so that it can use all the core stock @ 100 %
Yes
What if you upgrade the ihs to a copper rockit cool and run the same tests? Would like to see if that makes the difference to stay with a 240
Change the contact frame
Hello. I'm just looking for a cooler for my 13600kf. Which one do you advice? This one or be quiet dark rock elite air cooler? Thanks :)
Like every YT tech reviewer said on launch day that a 240mm-280mm AIO would not be enough and even a 360mm AIO barely keeps up on a 14900K. I don't know what you were expecting here. 🙄
I don't watch other people and I also don't assume that other people know everything, like you clearly do. So whatever.
@@TheProvokedPrawn What??? Like every top tech reviewer said this unanimously.
If everyone is saying, "Don't walk over there, there's a huge bottomless pit you'll fall down." You're the kinda person that says, "Nah... I'm gonna go see for myself and fall into the pit." 😆
what your setting PL1 PL2? just run 14900k . i use aircooler
Can u add a fan next to the cooler to make it look better?
Sure
the gpu placement is the problem. my 14900k stays within 92C under torture tests with a 280 aio.
Can a 240 aio can cool the 14900k with the dafault intel specs ? 125 pl1 and 253 pl2 ?
Did you try to undervolt it? Give it a try core voltage offset of -0,100
Do LM under ihs and over it
SO soft vocals. 😇😇😇😇😇
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what do you think about a large air cooler like the assassin IV ?
They're probably good enough though louder ua-cam.com/video/k0dYebv8txc/v-deo.html
Why didn’t you undervolt the cpu?
You could...but why? Ive seen a 14900k bring a watercooled system to its knees. That cup is a binned 13900ks. not using it on a 240...you need a 420 or better.
is 240 work with 14700kf - 4080 or maybe i should go 360?
You could have also used a 280mm AIO
Can you really just recommend a 360 over a 240 just like that? If the heatsink of a 240 and 360 is the same, it will thermal throttle the same. Unless you ran the tests for so long that the loop was saturated temperature wise, which I doubt.
Hey Provoked Prawn, do you reckon a 280mm nzxt aio with 4 fans pulling air into the case would work with a 14900ks? If not what would be a good intel cpu to look at?
280 would be better. Also try tweaking the bios settings according to Intel's specs and making sure your bios is up to date
Next question: Why you need this CPU?
Havent watched it but no, even my 360 cant keep it super cool. Undervolted by .08 lol
So should I return my 14900k before opening it and just buy 13900k? Please i need an advice
No?
Does it good with i7 12700Kf ؟
Prawn IF u have an RTX4080 & corsair shift psu do you recommend LIAN LI - STRIMER PLUS V2 12VHPWR or CORSAIR Premium Individually Sleeved Type-5 PSU Cables ? ?
Really a personal choice. Do you like RGB? If so, you know what to do
Hello again i am thinking of buying NZXT Kraken Elite 280mm or NZXT Kraken Z63 280mm for i9 13900k. Would that be ok or should i still consider to maybe go for NZXT Kraken Elite 360? id rather get the 280mm, but asking a PRO for help.
280 will be better than 240. As others have said you could undervolt too. Also influenced by the cooling performance of the rest of the case
im having almost the same trouble while my cpu is staying cool tho the gpu is getting hot . i have a 3 fan aio in front and 2 240mm fans on top blowing air out and the fan in back is blowing air out but the 3 fans in front that is cooling the aio raditor its keeping the cpu cool but there is not really no extra air flow comming into the case from the front aio, should i get a 2 fan aio and put it on top and have it blow out and have 3 fans in front moving air into the case? i have a corsair 570x case
Try this ua-cam.com/video/jP7nERdD-Gk/v-deo.html
@@TheProvokedPrawnmy cpu is staying below 50c while gaming its my video card that is getting hot snice there is no extra air flow comming through the front aio raditor and my corsair 570x case i can not mount a 3 fan aio raditor to the top for some reason the screw holes do not line up.... if i was able to mount my 3 fan aio to the top of my case i would unless there is a way i dont see
Turns out it is an Intel issue and new Motherboard Bios have been put out.
Yes ua-cam.com/video/Wupx-v2OGXA/v-deo.html
Might be the motherboard vendor ignoring the intel spec and overclocking them "out of the box" check the bios. It's a significant difference for little to no reduction in performance