DrumDial Drum Tuning Part 3 (Troubleshooting)
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- Опубліковано 6 лис 2012
- Part 3 shows how to troubleshoot common drum tuning problems and how to correct them. Bad bearing edges, loose lugs, warped hoops, uneven lug pitches are diagnosed and are easily fixed. DrumDial is the only drum tuning device that can accurately detect these problems.
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I bought the drum dial and always had problem with tuning. This troubleshoot video helped me figuring out that all my shells where damaged. Very helpful;-)
I've had my drum dial for years and it makes tuning so easy! Unfortunately I never saw these videos before. I've spent so many hours in confusion trying to tune around lugs that sound too high or low, even though the tension was the same. Now that I've watched these videos, I'm pretty certain that my drums have some of the problems described here. Looks like I'll need to check my bearing edges and hoops.
I am definitely purchasing one of these!
Mainly because i've "chased" that note many times on the batter and reso heads while tuning (yes, other head was muted, i promise haha). Thank you for the insight in the videos. Now i can tune my 7 piece set without so much pain.
Very cool I think you have a new customer
If the bearing edges are even all the way around and the heads are new, you are correct that the hoop may have some high spots. The wooden hoops are not as easy to repair as the metal ones. Check the wooden hoops on a flat surface just like you would for the bearing edges. Wooden hoops can be repaired if needed by most drum repair shops.
Yes, I tried the ambassador...more volume, more sustain, more rebound, vintage sound...so much better than amy other Emperor, G2, Ec2, Pinstripe etc. head...
Very helpful!
That does sound like your surface test area is not very even and flat. You can check the table top, flat test area by using a long metal level or other known flat tool, like a large carpenters square. If the test surface has low spots, they can be built up with layers of craft paper taped at the edges. The flat glass test for the bearing edge and hoop sound like you got them perfect! Definitely time to tune up.
Yes, but it will only be temporary. The hoop and head will deform again. Bearing edges are an inexpensive fix and can be repaired in a few days at most drum repair shops and custom drum shops.
Match the top and bottom heads. For example use a Remo Ambassador on both the top and bottom and match the DrumDial readings (75 top and bottom). A thicker head, like a 2 ply, matched on the top and bottom will have less sustain than a thinner head tuned to its mid range.
Excellent drum tuning video. I’ve had my DrumDial for about 5 years now but struggled with the best drum tensions for the various batter and bottom heads. It was interesting to see the various recommendations for the various kits in your reply’s to questions. I play classic rock on a 7 piece Tama Rockstar kit. From what I can pull from your recommendations the following looks like what you might suggest. Would you have any suggestions on changing the following. 14” Snare Batter 85 and bottom head 81. Mounted Toms 10” Batter and bottom 76, 12” Batter and bottom 75, 13” Batter 75 and bottom 72, Floor Toms 16” and 18” Batters and bottoms 74 and finally the Bass 24” Front and back 74. Thank you in advance for your guidance
Kerry, yes those very good mid point settings with excellent stick response and a natural downward sound progression. It is OK to tune the snare tighter to 88 top batter for more stick response.
If I repair the deformed hoop and change the head of the drum without fixing the bearing edge, may I get likewise a rather accurate tuning avoiding loose tension rods?
Hi, settings for a Ludwig backbeat.
Bassdrum: 22x16 emad2 batter, and factory reso.
Tom: 12x9 ec2 batter and factory reso.
Floor tom: 16x16 ec2 batter and factory reso.
Snare drum: 14x6.5 g1 batter and 300 for reso.
22" 74 kick batter 74 front resonant,
12" 75 top batter 75 bottom resonant ,
16" 74 top batter 74 bottom resonant,
Snare 88 top batter 80 bottom resonant
@@DrumDial thanks a lot
I absolutely love my drum dial! It helped me discover a bad bearing edge. Now, were would I look for someone to fix the bad spot?
Custom drum builders and local drum shops will do drum repair and bearing edges. We are in Arizona and usually go to TJS custom drums in Phoenix. Search for custom drum builders in your area or search under drum repair.
It is possible to get the hoops very straight and flat. The surface you are checking against must be very flat, otherwise you may end up bending the straight portions of your hoop. An easy fix for this is to only check the hoop, as you rotate it, at the same area on the flat test surface (table top, etc.). A tiny bit of wobble? We can absolutely work with that.
I have 10", 12", 16" toms... a 14" wood snare (Ayotte) and 22" kick. Suggested tunings? Is there a formula for changing the tunings for different keys?
Each tic mark lower will reduce by about 1/2 step.10 76 top batter 76 bottom resonant
12 75 top batter 75 bottom resonant
16 74 top batter 74 bottom resonant
22 73 kick batter 72 front resonant
snare 88 top batter 82 bottom resonant
Hello! I have a brass snare that have exactly the same problems.
My question is: can a brass snare be fixed if it have a bad bearing edge?
Catalin, there is no easy way to repair a brass or copper bearing edge. Tune the drum as best as you can, but the high spots will still be there. Tuning in a circular pattern in small increments will help. Be sure to mark the hoop and a lug so that you will always place the hoop back in its original position between head changes. The hoop will also warp over time and can unintentionally transfer problems to other areas of the drum if not put back on the same as when you removed it.
Hi, I have a new 20X17.5 Sonor Select Force Bass Drum. While trying to tuning the resonant following your recommendations I can't tune it below 80 without the lugs being loose. I try the circular and the cross pattern. Any advice appreciated, Thanks
Some newer bass drum heads are pretensioned from the factory. It is OK to tune your bass drum higher than 80 and it will work in and loosen over time. You can also apply palm pressure to the center of the bass head while seating to help loosen the head for a lower tension. Lastly, make sure that your tuner is calibrated. See the calibration videos on our channel here on UA-cam or directly from our website.
In part 2 of this series you tuned the toms to around 75 on the DrumDial. Here in part 3 you have this tom's batter head at 85 on the DrumDial. Is there one of your lessons that explains why, or can you explain here?
Excellent question! In this video (part 3), the drum shown is a snare drum, not a tom like in video 2. Snare drums are tuned much higher than toms.
I've been battling with a couple of snare drums with loose tension rods at higher indicated pressure on the drumdial, but my tests show the issue is the hoop rather than the bearing edge. I'm pretty sure the bearing edges aren't the problem because they all passed the paper test. Does that sound plausible, or is there something else I should look for?
Michael Juliano It could be a bad hoop. Once the hoop is straightened, the head will need to be replaced with a new one. The old head will stay permanently deformed.
Hi, settings for a Tama Superstar hyperdrive?
Kick drum: 22x18 emad2 Batter and std tama reso
Rack toms: 10x6.5 and 12x7 ec2 batter and std tama reso
Floor toms: 14x12 and 16x14 batter ec2 and std tama reso
Snare drum: 14x5.5 g1 batter and Evans reso.
22" 74 kick batter 73 front resonant,
10" 76 top batter 76 bottom resonant,
12" 75 top batter 75 bottom resonant ,
14" 74 top batter 74 bottom resonant,
16" 74 top batter 74 bottom resonant,
Snare 89 top batter 82 bottom resonant
Hello, I have digital drum dial
How can I tune my set?
snare 13 "
Tom 12 "
Floor tom 14 "
Floor tom 16 "
Bass drum 20 "
12 75 top batter 75 bottom resonant
14 74 top batter 74 bottom resonant
16 74 top batter 74 bottom resonant
20 73 kick batter 72 front resonant
snare 90 top batter 82 bottom resonant
are you just using a normal tuning program on the computer there? Like a guitar tuner?
The software is our own. You can get a similar program called "Audacity" . We use a spectrum analyzer and spectrum analysis to build the filters.
Audacity is a free software and is an excellent starting point for what you are after. You can use a standard chromatic / guitar tuner if you muffle the edge.
Would a shell thats out of round, or a head thats been over tightened also cause a loose lug?
If the head is overtightened unevenly, it can cause that. Once the inside collar of the drum head is deformed, it is permanent. If the shell is out of round, it can cause the counter hoop to be out of round and the drum head ring will stick to the inside the hoop and not move freely. This will cause a loose lug also. The drum head should move freely inside of the counter hoop.
Any recommendations on tension for 8x8, 10x10, and 12x12 toms, 14x14, and 16x16 floor toms, and 22x18 bass drum?
8" 77 top batter 77 bottom resonant ,
10" 77 top batter 77 bottom resonant
12" 76 top batter 76 bottom resonant ,
14" 74 top batter 74 bottom resonant,
16" 74 top batter 74 bottom resonant
22" 73 kick batter 73 front resonant
If interested, a good starting point:
snare 88 top batter 80 bottom resonant
@@DrumDial Thanks. The snares are tuned and set in the factory.
@@DrumDial I tuned them at 77 on the 10×12 tom" and it sounds high pitched with a ec2 clear 2-ply batter and Evans clear resonant head. What should I do
Rene, reduce all of the settings by 2 tics. For example, instead of 77 use 75.
@@DrumDial ok thanks. Il try right now
Very Nice, what is the application you use on your pc to tune. thank you.-
The software is our own. You can get a similar program called "Audacity" . We use a spectrum analyzer and spectrum analysis to build the filters.
Audacity is a free software and is an excellent starting point for what you are after.
Hello Steve! What software do you use for tuning?
The software is our own. You can get a similar program called "Audacity" . We use a spectrum analyzer and spectrum analysis to build the filters. We hope to make the software available in the future.
Hi, I have a 14x 5.5 Tomahawk Steel snare, On my resonant head- lugs by snare wires are stuck at 90 and wont let me go below as it is usually loose by now while all other readings can reach to 85. Is this a frame warp issue?, my top head is at 90 and I cant get the bottom to a proper 85. It also sounds pretty high pitched but also pretty good! so I wonder if this issue is detrimental as I like a low snare but cant seem to get there.
I have G1 Clear on reso, G2 coated on Batter.
Have you tried tuning to the outside of the snare bed? See the video here: www.drumdial.com/videos/snare-drum-tuning/
Snare side tuning starts at around the 1:30 mark
I can tune a drum by just going in a circle rather than doing the star pattern?
Seat the head in the standard star, criss cross pattern, then, always fine tune in the circular pattern up to your final tension.
What program is that on the laptop behind the drum at the 3:37 time mark?
The software is our own. You can get a similar program called "Audacity" . We use a spectrum analyzer and spectrum analysis to build the filters.
Audacity is a free software and is an excellent starting point for what you are after. You can use a standard chromatic / guitar tuner if you muffle the edge.
I just got a digital drum dial and have a question. Is it normal for the reading to change after tuning another lug?
After seating the head in the criss cross star pattern, just below your final setting, tune in small increments in a circular pattern up yo your final setting.
@@DrumDial thank you, I made a comment In another one of your videos. I'm going to give it a shot.
Why don't you sell the software shown in the video? I believe there would be a market for it.
+Charles Vazquez We hope to make the software available in the future. In the meantime, you can use a chromatic tuner and apply a gel dampener at the edge of the drum. We will make a video to show you how also.
DrumDial that software looks neat and I think that would be great.
Hello, what is the name of the application you have on the computer
The software is our own. You can get a similar program called "Audacity" . We use a spectrum analyzer and spectrum analysis to build the filters.
Audacity is a free software and is an excellent starting point for what you are after.
What's the pc software shown on 2:40? Thanks
+Kildos The software is our own. You can get a similar program called "Audacity" . We use a spectrum analyzer and spectrum analysis to build the filters.
Could you please explain the filters you use? Thanks.
Using spectrum analysis, we find the principal tone, fundamental tone and the overall fundamental if the drum has two heads. A drum produces many in-harmonic frequencies, not a simple harmonic like other instruments. The filters we build remove the unwanted frequencies so that we can look at the one we want. In this case, the edge frequency or principal tone.
Thank you for the quick response. If my understanding is correct, the fundamental is the lowest frequency with the highest amplitude. How do you find the principal tone? Also, do you use FFT for these measurements? I've been searching, but most people don't really understand nor use these methods.
The fundamental is the center frequency. The principal tone is the edge frequency. Yes, FFT but it is built into our spectrum analyzer also.
How does the drum develop a bad bearing edge? Is it just a mess-up from the factory or does it form over time?
Andrew, excellent question. It is usually a factory defect. An impact from a drop or something similar will also cause this.