I'm so impressed by Dogen san's passion toward Japanese pitch! It's not necessary to master it, we, Japanese understand what non Japanese people is saying☺️But if you speak Japanese dialect, you'll be very popular though! I used live in London for more than 10 years and was sharing a flat with Jamaican British girl. When I started speaking English with bit of cockney and Jamaican accent, she really loved it and telling everyone that I was speaking like a Jamaican Londoner 😂I wasn’t trying but just was mimicking native accent to sound like proper Brits. It was lovely experience that I spent so many yeas with her under the same roof! Having a good ear might be the key too. I'd been playing classical piano for 15 years before moved to London, I guess it helped me in someway🫶
Great to hear another perspective on building a creative business in unfamiliar territory. The guts it must take to quit your salary job to pursue your passion professionally right when you have baby twins is unfathomable to me. It sounds like Dogen really believed in himself. And credit to his wife for supporting such an endeavor. It's so heartening to see someone be rewarded for their hard work and belief in themselves.
Extreme Martial Arts tricking mentioned and now I just realized! Back in the days around 2008 I saw a tutorial for Titanium ankles by DOGEN - how to strengthen ankles for tricking and gymnastics and later I thought it was just a coincidence that Dogen, who makes videos about Japanese language has the same nickname. BUT it was the same person all along. Nice to see your journey
I've been watching Dogen's skits for a long time and loved his intro to pitch accent on Patreon, but had no idea about all of these interesting personal stories he has. Super interesting, great interview!
When I first started looking on UA-cam to learning japanese it seemed everyone was pointing to Dogen as being the best, it awesome to see how humble he is pointing to others that he says are better. Great guy
Great interview! It really helped me understand Dogen better and appreciate his videos even more (if that's even possible). He's such a wonderful storyteller, here and in his videos. Such an inspiring listen - thank you!
My Japanese language teacher showed us Dogen videos, and told us to look into pitch accent ourselves! I am oddly happy to hear his introduction to J-pop was the same as mine, I was obsessed with Utada and Ayumi in elementary school.
If there’s anything I’ve learned from learning a second language it’s that studying a language is just a tool in the effort to understand one’s own mind and how it works. Every aspect is a puzzle and it’s all about finding the key to making it all stick.
Less dramatic lighting. The studio lighting at his home emphasises the age of his skin while this lighting flattens his face, which makes it seem more youthful.
i was very lucky when i took japanese in community college bcuz my instructor specialized in audio so we were able to take a prosody class with her towards the end of the first year
I'm a native swedish speaker and since we have pitch accent in swedish too, it was one of the first things my japanese professor brought up to us when I took my first japanese class at a swedish university. Don't know how much it has helped my pronounciation though, but unless you really want to be percieved as a native speaker, I don't think it's the most important thing to focus on for either language, if you're trying to learn either swedish or japanese your face will give it away that your not from around anyway
Personally I wish pitch accent was taught early on in Japanese classes. I took a Japanese phonology and pronunciation class last semester and it's frustrating to me that if I want to get good at pronunciation I basically have to re-study all of the vocabulary I've learned so far. I feel like it would've been a lot more efficient to learn pitch accent together with vocabulary rather than have to study it separately as a discreet subject. I agree that there's nothing inherently wrong with having a foreign accent in another language, but having too thick of an accent can be detrimental so I think knowing pitch accent is still somewhat important even if you don't care about sounding native or not.
Beppu was one of the places I could have studied abroad (maybe it was just a home-stay? Don’t remember) during undergrad. Dogen makes me wish I had made it work 😅
Fortunately or unfortunately, one's native tongue may impact the difficulty of mastering Japanese pitch accent and pronunciation. If you listen to Japanese spoken by native Latin/Romance-language speakers, Mongolian speakers, or Russian/Slavic speakers...they will often have crisp pronunciation due to phonetic overlap, which makes it easier for natives to understand them, as well as for them to pick up the language faster. In contrast, some people from Asian countries may struggle with certain pronunciation because the sound simply doesn't exist in their native tongue. (And for reasons I don't really understand, those who've studied Japanese language in British and former Eastern Bloc/Soviet universities tend to speak better than those who've studied Japanese in American universities.)
@dogen If you like storytelling, then what about those Olly Richards books (short stories in Japanese). As a Japanese language learner I've enjoyed them and if you add the comedic twist may make them even more memorable to make learning more efficient
It's funny that when he switched his English accent to provide an example I couldn't notice any change. You probably have to be an English-speaking country native in order to distinguish between such speech patterns. On the other hand, when I hear standard British English, I immediately recognize it.
I thunk that ots because I'm dyslexic that I naturally picked up on pitch, but not sure. So I didn't study pitch, but I naturally got it while speaking with native speakers. I was able to mirror them.
Pure waffling about the emoji thing btw Don’t think too hard about it. Emojis make text easier to read, more fun, and help prevent the message being lost in the lack of direct contact between the speaker and listener.
Beautiful and interesting interview, but you can definitely tell that he is passionate about many things because once he starts, he doesn't end anymore... 😂 Very interesting tho!
i think pitch accent is great to learn, but really getting fluent first should be the main focus. for example an english speaker learning a new word needs to know kanji, pronunciation, proper use, nuance..... and with a fluent speaker speaking at 3 words a second it's just not essential to the goal. its more of a want than a need
Native speakers are used to various regional and generational speech, so a slight variation wouldn't be a serious issue for communication. But I think pitch accent is essential for anybody who wishes to attain business-level fluency, especially as the Subject is often abbreviated in Japanese. (And often times the nuance is communicated in the pitch.) Think of English spoken in the sub-continent. You can be using the correct grammar and vocab, but when a pitch accent (aka intonation) is vastly different, it becomes a different language. Which is also why we have an easier time understanding Japanese spoken by certain foreigners over others.
@@yo2trader539 Pitch accent applies to words to indicate their semantic differences. It is not the same as intonation which applies to sentences and indicates emotions or in certain cases whether the sentence is a statement or a question. Using the wrong pitch accent will never lead to miscommunication because the context is always obvious. It will just sound slightly strange. But that's also true for Japanese people who grew up in different regions. They sound strange to each other too. The same can be said about most mainstream languages.
I'm Japanese. First of all, Dogen should realize that the fact that he calls himself Dogen is making Japanese people feel uncomfortable. Mr. Dogen should consider what Americans would think if a Japanese person who likes American music referred to himself as Michael Jackson.
I don't think that would bother any American that I have ever met. Including myself. Feel absolutely free to refer to yourself as Michael Jackson. There's an saying in English: "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery."
From my experience, pitch accent is a waste of time. Most of us foreigners don’t sound native Japanese but get understood 99.9%. If you want to waste your time for that 0.1%, go for it.
Yes. To me this is very last thing to care about if at all. You will always be looked at as a foreigner no matter what you do. The only reason to learn pitch accent is if you are Japanese, but grew up not learning the language, or if you learn it for those few common words like bridge and chopstick to not sound funny when you say them even though you will be understood either way. You don’t drive your car over a chopstick or eat your food with a bridge typically. 😂 I spoke Japanese day 1 to a native and they said nihongo jozu. They will always tell you you’re the best, even when you butcher the language.
I agree. Another pet peeve is the kanji stroke order. No, we’re never going to actually write kanjis, we just have to recognise them in writing or on the keyboard.
Having a pitch accent gives you a reference point. Though, most Japanese speak in the pitch accent of their regional dialects, so context is more important IMO.
What a sour stance to take. They sure won't with that attitude! Just becoming conscious of your pitch and applying basic rules when speaking is one of the easier improvements a N2/3-level learner can make and people their perception of you will definitely change.
Knowledge about how pitch accent functions is potentially interesting but utterly irrelevant. One's pronunciation only improves through mimicry. If Dogen took his moniker seriously then he would realize that knowledge generally gets in the way of these things. Empty your mind and let the natural sounds flow in. Empty your mouth and let them flow out.
As shown in the video, he was looking for something to monetize. So clearly is obsessiveness (his term) for pitch accent isn't necessarily due to its inherent qualities but to the fact that it makes money. Japanese learners always looking for the holy grail to justify their constant failures.
I'm so impressed by Dogen san's passion toward Japanese pitch! It's not necessary to master it, we, Japanese understand what non Japanese people is saying☺️But if you speak Japanese dialect, you'll be very popular though! I used live in London for more than 10 years and was sharing a
flat with Jamaican British girl. When I started speaking English with bit of cockney and Jamaican accent, she really loved it and telling everyone that I was speaking like a Jamaican Londoner 😂I wasn’t trying but just was mimicking native accent to sound like proper Brits. It was lovely experience that I spent so many yeas with her under the same roof! Having a good ear might be the key too. I'd been playing classical piano for 15 years before moved to London, I guess it helped me in someway🫶
Great to hear another perspective on building a creative business in unfamiliar territory. The guts it must take to quit your salary job to pursue your passion professionally right when you have baby twins is unfathomable to me. It sounds like Dogen really believed in himself. And credit to his wife for supporting such an endeavor. It's so heartening to see someone be rewarded for their hard work and belief in themselves.
Thanks Randal!
Extreme Martial Arts tricking mentioned and now I just realized!
Back in the days around 2008 I saw a tutorial for Titanium ankles by DOGEN - how to strengthen ankles for tricking and gymnastics and later I thought it was just a coincidence that Dogen, who makes videos about Japanese language has the same nickname. BUT it was the same person all along. Nice to see your journey
The Interviewer listens carefully to his guest and asks the right questions
I've been watching Dogen's skits for a long time and loved his intro to pitch accent on Patreon, but had no idea about all of these interesting personal stories he has. Super interesting, great interview!
When I first started looking on UA-cam to learning japanese it seemed everyone was pointing to Dogen as being the best, it awesome to see how humble he is pointing to others that he says are better. Great guy
Agreed! Much respect!!!
Love the punk band story!! Dogen made a really great impression when he messaged the band
Great interview! It really helped me understand Dogen better and appreciate his videos even more (if that's even possible). He's such a wonderful storyteller, here and in his videos. Such an inspiring listen - thank you!
we love you dogen
My Japanese language teacher showed us Dogen videos, and told us to look into pitch accent ourselves! I am oddly happy to hear his introduction to J-pop was the same as mine, I was obsessed with Utada and Ayumi in elementary school.
If there’s anything I’ve learned from learning a second language it’s that studying a language is just a tool in the effort to understand one’s own mind and how it works. Every aspect is a puzzle and it’s all about finding the key to making it all stick.
How does he look younger here
Probably because of his hair! He shaved his head for awhile and looked older 😅
Lighting in this studio compared to his home setup.
Less dramatic lighting. The studio lighting at his home emphasises the age of his skin while this lighting flattens his face, which makes it seem more youthful.
He doesn't look younger
@@helloyou6192he does
Thank you for talking about khmer language in your video..!! I'm Cambodia and now living in Japan
i was very lucky when i took japanese in community college bcuz my instructor specialized in audio so we were able to take a prosody class with her towards the end of the first year
Fantastic interview! I love some long-form Dogen!
Finally!!!! ❤
I'm a native swedish speaker and since we have pitch accent in swedish too, it was one of the first things my japanese professor brought up to us when I took my first japanese class at a swedish university. Don't know how much it has helped my pronounciation though, but unless you really want to be percieved as a native speaker, I don't think it's the most important thing to focus on for either language, if you're trying to learn either swedish or japanese your face will give it away that your not from around anyway
Long story short, pitch accents are just side quests
DOGEN IS A TRICKER?!! He just got even cooler.
god dogen is so cool
-editor
Personally I wish pitch accent was taught early on in Japanese classes. I took a Japanese phonology and pronunciation class last semester and it's frustrating to me that if I want to get good at pronunciation I basically have to re-study all of the vocabulary I've learned so far. I feel like it would've been a lot more efficient to learn pitch accent together with vocabulary rather than have to study it separately as a discreet subject. I agree that there's nothing inherently wrong with having a foreign accent in another language, but having too thick of an accent can be detrimental so I think knowing pitch accent is still somewhat important even if you don't care about sounding native or not.
There's definitely a threshold. If it's minor I find an accent endearing; too much and it's a major hindrance.
That's what Dogen says
Great video! I realy liked it
Great insightful video
Beppu was one of the places I could have studied abroad (maybe it was just a home-stay? Don’t remember) during undergrad. Dogen makes me wish I had made it work 😅
Beppu is so nice!!
aye this channel base in Osaka? lfg!!!
Fortunately or unfortunately, one's native tongue may impact the difficulty of mastering Japanese pitch accent and pronunciation. If you listen to Japanese spoken by native Latin/Romance-language speakers, Mongolian speakers, or Russian/Slavic speakers...they will often have crisp pronunciation due to phonetic overlap, which makes it easier for natives to understand them, as well as for them to pick up the language faster. In contrast, some people from Asian countries may struggle with certain pronunciation because the sound simply doesn't exist in their native tongue. (And for reasons I don't really understand, those who've studied Japanese language in British and former Eastern Bloc/Soviet universities tend to speak better than those who've studied Japanese in American universities.)
Dogen Sensei!!🙌🙌
@dogen If you like storytelling, then what about those Olly Richards books (short stories in Japanese). As a Japanese language learner I've enjoyed them and if you add the comedic twist may make them even more memorable to make learning more efficient
I came for the japanese learning aspect and stayed for learning how to create good content
It's funny that when he switched his English accent to provide an example I couldn't notice any change. You probably have to be an English-speaking country native in order to distinguish between such speech patterns. On the other hand, when I hear standard British English, I immediately recognize it.
the southern usa one ? fair call
I thunk that ots because I'm dyslexic that I naturally picked up on pitch, but not sure. So I didn't study pitch, but I naturally got it while speaking with native speakers. I was able to mirror them.
Pure waffling about the emoji thing btw
Don’t think too hard about it.
Emojis make text easier to read, more fun, and help prevent the message being lost in the lack of direct contact between the speaker and listener.
hahaha I can imagine teenager Dogen listening to ayu 😂 lol I love it
Beautiful and interesting interview, but you can definitely tell that he is passionate about many things because once he starts, he doesn't end anymore... 😂 Very interesting tho!
this is true haha. tend to ramble
i think pitch accent is great to learn, but really getting fluent first should be the main focus. for example an english speaker learning a new word needs to know kanji, pronunciation, proper use, nuance..... and with a fluent speaker speaking at 3 words a second it's just not essential to the goal. its more of a want than a need
Native speakers are used to various regional and generational speech, so a slight variation wouldn't be a serious issue for communication. But I think pitch accent is essential for anybody who wishes to attain business-level fluency, especially as the Subject is often abbreviated in Japanese. (And often times the nuance is communicated in the pitch.) Think of English spoken in the sub-continent. You can be using the correct grammar and vocab, but when a pitch accent (aka intonation) is vastly different, it becomes a different language. Which is also why we have an easier time understanding Japanese spoken by certain foreigners over others.
@@yo2trader539 Pitch accent applies to words to indicate their semantic differences. It is not the same as intonation which applies to sentences and indicates emotions or in certain cases whether the sentence is a statement or a question. Using the wrong pitch accent will never lead to miscommunication because the context is always obvious. It will just sound slightly strange. But that's also true for Japanese people who grew up in different regions. They sound strange to each other too. The same can be said about most mainstream languages.
yall got your glasses on opposite sides of the store huh
Either this host is too young or he is being forced to host. Imagine having someone death stare you the whole show without flinching
Personally disagree-felt like Tobias made it very easy to talk!
@ course you’d say that
I have never heard him speaking English…
I know this is clickbait, and I'm still falling for it.
WHAAAAAT!? DOGE! 👏👏👏
Will the interviewers ever do some research before asking you the same questions you have answered over 10 times thus far?
To me though an accent is an accent and I just use my ears and repetition. 😃
“fossilized errors”
I'm Japanese. First of all, Dogen should realize that the fact that he calls himself Dogen is making Japanese people feel uncomfortable.
Mr. Dogen should consider what Americans would think if a Japanese person who likes American music referred to himself as Michael Jackson.
I think you’re overreacting.
what does dogen mean in Japanese ?
@@gotowealth dogen was a 13th century zen buddhist master.
I’m Japanese and I don’t give a fuck
I don't think that would bother any American that I have ever met. Including myself. Feel absolutely free to refer to yourself as Michael Jackson.
There's an saying in English: "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery."
From my experience, pitch accent is a waste of time. Most of us foreigners don’t sound native Japanese but get understood 99.9%. If you want to waste your time for that 0.1%, go for it.
Yes. To me this is very last thing to care about if at all. You will always be looked at as a foreigner no matter what you do. The only reason to learn pitch accent is if you are Japanese, but grew up not learning the language, or if you learn it for those few common words like bridge and chopstick to not sound funny when you say them even though you will be understood either way. You don’t drive your car over a chopstick or eat your food with a bridge typically. 😂 I spoke Japanese day 1 to a native and they said nihongo jozu. They will always tell you you’re the best, even when you butcher the language.
I agree. Another pet peeve is the kanji stroke order. No, we’re never going to actually write kanjis, we just have to recognise them in writing or on the keyboard.
@@contagiousintelligence5007I would agree except that learning how to write the kanji makes them 1000x easier to remember
Pitch accent is a waste of time. The locals won't treat you like one of them anyway.
Of course, culture is the only thing that will make people accept you as one of them.
Having a pitch accent gives you a reference point. Though, most Japanese speak in the pitch accent of their regional dialects, so context is more important IMO.
Some people enjoy learning subjects and acquiring new skills. It's not always about usefulness
What a sour stance to take. They sure won't with that attitude! Just becoming conscious of your pitch and applying basic rules when speaking is one of the easier improvements a N2/3-level learner can make and people their perception of you will definitely change.
Knowledge about how pitch accent functions is potentially interesting but utterly irrelevant.
One's pronunciation only improves through mimicry.
If Dogen took his moniker seriously then he would realize that knowledge generally gets in the way of these things.
Empty your mind and let the natural sounds flow in. Empty your mouth and let them flow out.
As shown in the video, he was looking for something to monetize.
So clearly is obsessiveness (his term) for pitch accent isn't necessarily due to its inherent qualities but to the fact that it makes money.
Japanese learners always looking for the holy grail to justify their constant failures.