Thor: Love and Thunder - Is It Good or Nah?
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- Опубліковано 12 лип 2022
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I was really annoyed that Thor just left the guardians. Endgame hyped everyone up for a full blown Thor and Guardians movie, it was perfectly set up.
remember how endgame made professor hulk the conclusion of bruce's character and now they're just gonna reverse that
man phase 4 blows.
@@hermit6123 they never knew what they were doing with hulk's arc though which is annoying
Isn’t thor going to be in gaurdians 3?
Honestly to me it felt like a temporary thing. Like this was one of Thor's spin off adventures while the rest of the Guardians were busy helping the others.
I know right. And where's Hulks movie? Why the hell did Hulk never get a redemption solo movie?
The fact that Chris Hemsworth said that the movie feels like it was made by a seven year old really just speaks volumes to me.
Lol did he really
Seriously?
And then he said in the interview that “The story was sacrifice for the jokes” which is very true.
yh it felt like a shitpost all along
Source?
7:14 that part of the movie that feels like it’s missing is loki. they mention him at the beginning, and describe thor’s grief, but they drop that so quickly too. thor doesn’t heal in this movie, he just loses more. thor and loki were perfect foils of each other and that vacuum can be felt
@klio msuo Kids should be allowed to see gay stuff
@klio msuo
"all those gay stuff" ???
Surely you must be trolling. This movie is _extremely_ heteronormative, save for about three brief moments of people *discussing* non-hetero subjects.
@klio msuo also, ‘gAy stUFf’ isn’t inappropriate
@klio msuo wut, the movie mentions an orgy and Thor appears naked, and somehow that's not worse than 3 seconds of gay scenes?
@klio msuo You people be worrying about the most ridiculous shit. "Oh I want Gorr to be a menace, a complete abomination, but the gays just existing need to go." Y'all are weird
They could've made the screaming goats thing work. Imagine how scary it would be if you suddenly hear a blood-curdling shriek, and then you see someone get gored by a giant goat. Also, the goats are a part of actual Norse mythology, they have the power to regenerate after death.
So they can't even kill em? Fucking hell
They're fine as long as you don't break their bones. That's the whole thing. Also Thor eats them every day. They're fine the next day but that happens.
@@thecommonman9524 ah a fellow magnus Chase fan
@@epicmusic9029 I mean, I am. But all of what I said is actually in the myth.
i feel like it wouldve been good if it was a one time gag, not repeated over and over again
I’d blame the mediocrity of phase 4 on the terrible time crunch.
There are 8 mcu projects every year now, 4 shows and 4 movies, with all the stories being kept under wraps from every other project.
And considering some of the mcu deleted scenes would actually have improved the stories, with the writers and directors revealing the deleted stuff, I’m not sure if the directors are entirely responsible for the mediocrity of phase 4.
Yeah, I have seen a few articles claiming VFX people are leaving due to the time crunch and some VFX have supposedly claimed that Marvel is the worst studio to work for.
Between the insane amount of projects they're putting out and the pandemic throwing everything off filming and release schedule wise, Phase 4 was going to face an uphill battle. On top of the fact that people are getting burnt out with keeping up with it all. I'm going to see what the next phase has to offer as well, but I don't know how the MCU is going to recover from this period.
@@professorthread i would say the easy thing would be to reduce the number of projects. I mean the dceu managed to release Aquaman and Shazam after completely messing up the previous movies.
@@Incognito-gh5qi
Hhh
It all comes down to Disney, as usual.
Yes! The guardians needed to come back later on, to close off the story. Not only because of Jane’s cancer, but also because Peter has EXPERIENCE with a corrupted god (his father) who was misusing his power, then ultimately chose to give his own power up. That aligns really well with Gorr’s motivations, and Jane’s illness. Such a missed opportunity.
That would've been really messy imo. I'm glad they didn't show up later.
Yeah that was one of my criticisms for the film, I felt like the Guardians with Thor, Valkyrie, Jane, and Korg would have been a better way to defeat Gorr
Honestly if they couldn't keep ALL the Guardians in the story they should've at least kept Peter for the reasons you named. He could've been able to call out the issues earlier and play a bigger part of the resolution. He'd definitely be able to relate to Gorr and use that to help the others.
peter also had experience with people close to him with cancer
@@kieranstark7213 What?
"in this movie you just dont feel the weight of it"
that exactly sums up how I felt about this - Thor reading the distress calls of people saying 'the god butcher' and seeing that colossal mole-rat with the dialogue "one of the nicest gods" it's like, okay, but can we see some of this in action please
Right, just felt underwhelming, or I couldn't have time to process the traumatic moments
We do feel the weight of Thor though. Because he's fat.
Making fun of someone for gaining weight because of depression is funny.
(I am so mad at Marvel for not taking this seriously, oh my god)
I saw this movie about a week after it came out, and I walked out of the theatre feeling like I had watched a Thor movie made by Nickelodeon. Weirdly juvenile, sacrificing a lot for comedy that gold old quick, and hints of a decent story and good writing that get trampled over to reach the more marketable things easier.
I felt the exact same things as you
Me three, thank God I’m not the only one who thinks the fourth Thor film feels exactly like a Nickelodeon movie/show! Yet people think Nickelodeon Movies always made underrated gems by justifying the major problems they have that makes them either underwhelming (Nacho Libre, Big Time Movie, The Last Airbender, the 2010s TMNT movies, The Wild Thornberrys Movie, Hotel for Dogs, Swindle (2013), the Rugrats movies, PAW Patrol: The Movie, ) or bitter (Fun Size, Lemony Snicket’s A Series of Unfortunate Events, Imagine That, Playing With Fire, Dora and the Lost City of Gold, Monster Trucks, the Fred movie trilogy, Nicky Deuce, Jinxed!, Barnyard (my favourite Nickelodeon films, not just by Viacom standards, but also anywhere close to general standards, would have to be The SpongeBob SquarePants Movie, Rango and The Adventures of Tintin. Barnyard is that bad Nickelodeon movie like the rest of them that actually manages to have the right materials to work with like the story about the cow (or bull, I mean, then again, it’s just confusing when the male cows also have udders, coming from the same company that has a male pregnancy fetish with Cosmo the Fairly OddParent, Carl Wheezer, etc) Otis growing up… but then they just had to ruin it with Miles kicking the farmer to death.), The Spiderwick Chronicles (2008), the Loud House movies, the SpongeBob SquarePants Movie sequels, Harriet the Spy (1996), the Fairly OddParents movie trilogy, Good Burger (and just All That in general), etc)!
When watching it, I didn’t fall asleep while the rest of my friends did. I feel like I completely remembered everything as a big fan of Thor.
The VERY beginning of the movie watching Gorr's daughter slowly die left such a strong impact for a darker and more reflective tone: commentary on the entitled hubris of gods, the faults of stubborn dogmatism from humans, and a reevaluation on how to find meaning in life and death. All the seeds were there. Thor being a terrible god/king in the past despite his best efforts. Jane literally DYING and finding purpose in the item that's killing her. Valkyrie losing her faith after senseless bloodshed.
And they did absolutely nothing with it! We went from that heavy scene to a horribly done montage with the Guardians acting out of character with zero stakes and Peter basically talking straight to the audience about what the movie's overdone theme was "supposed" to be. I'm still not over that whiplash. The script needed at least two other drafts to be worthwhile. Instead we got what felt like a first draft. But having seen Taika's other works I suspect this was more on Disney than him. Or they gave him TOO MUCH control and nothing to channel his creativity properly.
The opening scene is the second best scene in the movie. That shot of the desert honestly does a lot to show the expanse and emptiness of it. And... uh... there's the muzzle scene and that's the only other scene with that heavy tone.
Also....the whole gods scene had me thinking "wait....is Gorr the good guy?" cos yeah....he kinda is. The Gods were self-centred assholes
Stop pretending Taika Waititi is perfect and infallible. He made a film you don't like. And that's fine. There is no secret Disney boogeyman sabotaging this beloved auteur's precious vision.
You’re forcing yourself to hate this movie. That’s hysterical 😂😂😂
This was all Taika..
I’m not sure if anyone else has already commented this, but apparently Gorr had a lot more scenes in the movie that got cut, mostly of him slaying other gods. Bale says they were left out because they would have pushed the boundary of “family-friendly”, something the MCU still wants to stick to. I wonder what the film would have been like if this was the first Marvel movie leaning into horror instead of Doctor Strange 2.
Edit: This may be misinformation, but I read that he allegedly was slated to kill Eitri (the dwarf who forged Stormbreaker in Infinity War) and the Grandmaster. That would have been cool (and brutal) to see :(
Still wasn’t that family friendly anyway
Oh no, showing the villain doing the villainous things isn't family friendly, but Zeus is allowed to mention an orgy multiple times? Come on
F
@@ballisticboo7808 exactly. Plus all of the other sexual hints with the women gazing at thors crotch for the entire scene
@@ballisticboo7808 If you think that's always family-friendly, than you seriously need to play a God of War game.
I like your point about how Quill should have gotten to meet Jane. I hated that the Guardians didn't have any significance in this movie. Thor is the kind of character that fits well with their group dynamic. I was also thinking about how Drax in particular could have empathized with Gorr as father who lost his own children.
If James Gunn can somehow turn around Suicide Squad into being somewhat serviceable then I have to believe that Guardians 3 will be alright.
@Kryptoskillet while I do agree with that statement, I think they meant the duology of movies as a whole.
@Kryptoskillet wait did they retcon that movie then, or did the events still happen?
@Kryptoskillet oh ok. Well I knew THAT. I just thought they actually retconned it for a sec lol. I guess a man can dream
@Kryptoskillet agreed. I was literally SOOO bored watching the first one. And then the James Gunn mastapiece came out. Like the fact they were able to pull it off so well, not only after having to follow up that dark green poo on camera, they managed to pull of freaking Starro as the villain of the movie. That's mad impressive.
Good news: Guardians 3 is great
The biggest issue with Thor for me was the pacing. It’s the shortest film in the MCU in a long time and you definitely feel it. A lot of development is missing for Gorr and the love story. By the time the climax has arrived I was actually surprised because it felt like it was just getting started.
Not every film needs to be super long, but Thor needed 20 more minutes to really flesh things out.
Taika said the original cut was 4 hours long, Disney said cut it
I really wish the beginning was slower, it felt so goddamn choppy. Like, we should’ve seen Jane becoming Mighty Thor for the first time, coming to the realization that it wouldn’t save her, realizing that she does want to use this to help people even if it’s killing her faster because her only other option is dying in a bed slowly. That would be impactful.
This is exactly what I've been saying since I've seen it, down to the 20 minutes. My first thought when it ended was that 20 more minutes could have done the movie wonders, and honestly, I really hope there will be a director's cut/extended edition bc I've heard (not confirmed) that there were cut scenes of Gorr killing other gods, which I would love to see
@@redrosella same, immediately had me questioning within the first three minutes. Each cut felt 3-5 seconds too short. And I agree ab Jane, I was so confused when it seemed like she had literally just gotten her powers, then she and Valkyrie are acting like having a female Thor and their knowing each other was old news.
Thor 4 should have been 3 hours long at best to bring out the movie full potential, especially Gorr's backstory and origin.
This movie could have been an incredible story of Thor dealing with all of his trauma from the previous movies, conflicting his own anger and motivations with Gorr's, and then having Thor ultimatley choose love in the end despite the fact that he is taking one of his biggest losses yet (Jane). The jokes could have been scattered throughout and would have hit much harder if they were used less frequently
Sounds like a good story!
That really could have been a great story. They just don't do the MCU like they used to... Remember the glory days of Phase 1?
It would have made so much sense for him to be dealing with his trauma and maybe the collapse of his belief system. No Asgard, God of Olympus are trash, his mortal gf now a god. They had so much potential for this to be an epic story especially with Gorr.
That’s literally what the movie was about
Natalie Portman played Jane's cancer and struggles and fatigue so well; my mom has cancer so I could see in Jane what I see in my mom. I was so focused on that part of the movie and how Thor was dealing with it that honestly i didn't care about much else that was going on. If the movie was just about their relationship on Earth with villain stuff going on on the side it would have been great. Relationships are what build this franchise up.
I hope your mom and you are both doing well and that things are going great in life for you both.
My biggest complaint with Thor: Love is War is that it undermines the value of life (since no one important really died) and completely nullifies the tragedy of Jane's cancer and the beautiful message it gave of how to face it. I also kinda liked the screaming goats but I hated the ending. The kids magically becoming great warriors was too cheap for me.
The MCU Phase 4 overall just cheapens the value of life by not giving death value. Everyone is just revivable. Im so glad Iron Man died so they cant desecrate his character in phase 4.
Thing about Taika is his non MCU projects have very emotionally effective scenes. And it’s frustrating knowing he’s capable of that and not using it.
Ikr. My first time watching BOY I cried and I was so into Hunt For The Wilderpeople. It's a shame when someone's vision for a film gets butchered by controlling and constricting rules, requirements and regulations
@@zinzellacherry1457 This comment here
Exactly his non MCU stuff has both effective comedy and emotional moments that break your heart. He clearly knows how to make balanced movies with emotionally moving scenes he just….didn’t do it here
Exactly.
Im banking on Disney and Fiege being the controlling factors, and Taika has to cover it up. Even Bale appears to understand that Disney has a hand in it
Fiege is a control freak and won't let Taika do what he needs to do 🤷
James Gunn actually has an advantage because, since he got fired for a bit, he’s had years to iron out the story for Guardians 3, way more time than any of the other MCU guys. So I’m still looking forward to that movie, but if that one is also mid, then I don’t have much hope for the MCU moving forward.
if they mess up guardians then i dont think i'll even have the strength to remain-invested in the mcu
I have hope GOTG 3
I’ve been waiting for Vol 3 for so long that if it does end up being ass it will instantly break me, even despite the fact that I’ve been enjoying Phase 4. Maybe I’ve made a mistake with getting so emotionally invested in that movie but shit happens.
Hype for GotG 3 is real, 2 and 1 are in my top 5 MCU films, Love and Thunder seems like it had so much potential
If they screw up GotG 3, then I think it might be safe to say the problem lies 100% in Marvel & Disney
00:19-00:27 I 100% agree on that. I loved everything from Captain America to Endgame, but with the exception of Moon Knight I've found it very hard to truly get invested in anything MCU related post-Endgame.
No way home?
@@mango-jango9995 True, I did enjoy that. Maybe I liked Moon Knight and No Way Home so much because -- aside from the beginning and very end of No Way Home -- they're rather disconnected from the overarching MCU story, and work great as standalone, self contained stories.
I feel very similar. I actually liked wandavision and the continuation of Wanda in Dr strange quite a bit. (even though I would say at the end of wandavision, she is not really set up to now go completely off the rails, but I enjoyed seeing her using her power in a "villan" way)
But the other series except for moonknight - which was extremely refreshing - really didn't land for me and I would not have finished them, if I didn't feel like I had to. now they only served as kind of good "doing chores and listening to something" - entertainment.
Moon Knight and No Way Home had restored my hope that Marvel will bounce back, but that hope is going away again lol
For me, thr exception was wands vision. Loved that show.
But yeah, disney is driving the mcu into the dirt with it's show.
The bit about how Starlord should have talked with Jane about cancer and have a heart to heart didn't occur to me until now and now I'm disappointed they didn't do that. This is why you need to remember details.
That "We've Been Taking the MCU For Granted" video title now has a whole new meaning to it.
In Phase 3, Marvel was pumping out gem after gem, to the point where everyone had their expectations set very high for Phase 4.
The underwhelming results so far really just go to show how when a studio puts out multiple bad or mediocre products after a long line of good, it can leave a sour taste in our mouths and make us realize how we truly didn't know what we had until we lost it. Sound familiar? (cough) Pixar (cough)
You know, if Guardians 3 ends up being a disappointment, then I'm probably going to stop watching these movies.
Obviously these movies aren’t going to be as good as phase 3, as this is a repeat of phase 1, just on a larger scale. These movies are setting the groundwork for the future of the mcu, and they won’t have much to do with each other until the next phase where team ups start to happen.
Like in phase 1, as iron man, Thor, and captain America didn’t have anything to do with each other until they made the team movie that is avengers. This is just a repeat of that just on a bigger scale as they now have a dedicated fanbase and can take the risk.
Same here
@@brynnleyritchings4903 except the lack of interconnectedness of Iron Man didn't stop it from being a masterpiece, using the justification of setup to excuse these movies failings is ridiculous when it's pretty apparent that the movies are just very poorly executed
Man I really hope they dont mess Guardians 3 its currently the best "line" for me I absolutely love both movies. Only Marvel IP I think maintained its standard
The MCU always sucked, except for Guardians Of The Galaxy.
the joke about korgs boyfriend being called dwayne literally broke me. i walked out of the cinema and i don't think i felt a single emotion for about 2 hours afterwards
🤨
My man it was literally just him saying he got together with a guy named Dwayne. That's it. Very easy to skip over.
And oh no you walked out of the cinema after one of the last scenes of the movie. How...bad?
@@Juli_is_Online 1. yes it was at the end of the movie. i left at the end of the movie. thats normally what people do
2. its a joke
@@Juli_is_Online dwayne the rock is the joke
That moment when you realized SONIC THE HEDGEHOG 2 did a better Dwayne Johnson joke than this film
I love Taika for his shows, specifically What We Do in the Shadows, and Our Flag Means Death, and I really really enjoyed Jojo Rabbit and Ragnarok, so I think this falls on Disney's desire to churn out as much content as possible. This film had a really interesting villain, and some good potential character and plot possibilities, but felt kinda underwhelming because it just didn't have the time to really be a well created project, imo. I know Taika hasn't lost his touch; OFMD and WWDITS S4 just came out this year as well, and their amazing, so I really think this falls on Disney.
Taika has no control over anything related to the show WWDITS (he did create the movie, not the show), the creator and director of the show is Jemaine Clement. And he's only the producer of OFMD, the director and creator is David Jenkins.
@@goldflannel2968 exactlyyy lately ive been seeing so many people credit taika for jermains work, though iirc taika has directed a few episodes (or one) for wwdits.
@@goldflannel2968 You're absolulty correct that writers do not get credited enough for what they are doing in comparison to directors, but Taika is the executive producer of WWDITS the show, so he has control over it.
Nah, i'd blame this on Taika. Disney has a huge hard-on making a bunch of Marvel and is churning wayy too much stuff out, but Taika isn't a perfect director either. Most that this movie fails on are directly things that feel the most like Taika Waititi. It doesn't really matter has he done something good that released this year. I think Disney/Marvel would've been a bit more lenient if they had more serious elements.
I was so surprised, I recall thinking to myself "what are you doing taika" when watching the movie
I really like how the movie was written and marketed like a kids movie but had orgy jokes, thor saying “shit” alot and gorr traumatising a bunch of kidnapped kids
Thor is definitely one of the phase 4 MCU movies
It truly is a movie that exists.
@@anaveragejoe3918 💯. Yep
don’t do the morbius thing to this movie too, please
Phase 4 is definitely one of the MCU phases
eren
During the scene in Omnipotence City, Gorr should’ve crashed the meeting and start killing a bunch of the gods, hence keeping the “God Butcher” part of his name accurate. That would’ve made for a cooler scene than what we got instead, plus it would’ve made Gorr seem like a bigger threat.
Right? Remember when we all thought that was going to happen? God this movie was disappointing trash. Gorr the God Butcher...kills one god onscreen. More like Gorr the child snatcher, fuck me.
@@Jake-qo3mp literally Mr. Waternoose
@@cursedtails1249 Fucking lmao
Honestly, it would’ve solidified how bold and dedicated he is to his mission for killing all gods while also being on constant pursuit of Thor and co.
That City was above his budget they had the celestials there and they said that Goor couldnt enter the place. If he wouldve done that hed get killed in no time
My thoughts exactly. I seriously agree with everything you said. A lot of the scenes felt pointless and the jokes were both bad and don’t fit.
Side rant:
(The scene where Thor was stripped naked just pissed me off because that’s uncomfortable for anyone and the internet would throw an absolute fit if it happened to a woman. But apparently it’s still humorous to make a dude unwillingly undress in front of a huge crowd just to remind people he’s “good looking”)
Black Widow was more enjoyable than this because at least it took itself seriously.
Currently Spider-Man is holding up the MCU. And god I feel bad for those who work on these rushed and half assed movies.
I personally think Black Widow is the absolute worst MCU movie ever. But Thor: Love and Thunder is a close 4th
@@purple1441 other 2
@@mischief2344
2nd worst - Thor: The Dark World
3rd worst - Ant-Man and the Wasp
But honestly I'm thinking about swapping ant man 2 and Thor 4
@@purple1441 What's so bad about Ant-Man and the Wasp, exactly?
@@carloscauan7967 Suffers from the plot being a mess, also the movie is bland. It's like Black Widow except less worse.
I think this was definitely a Disney-induced issue because when it comes to more serious and less comedy-oriented movies Taika's early work was just so different. If you want a look at some real heartbreaking scenes and heart to hearts you should REALLY watch his 2010 film Boy. It's a Kiwi classic (there is a lot of it revolving around life in New Zealand) and personally one of the biggest hidden gems in the last 20 years of cinema imo.
I agree. I bet some Disney exec saw the more serious parts of this movie, that were cut, and was like " Nonono, we have to make it funny like the last Thor film, the kiddies loved that one!" Like, if this was just Taika with no other meddling here from anywhere, the main concept would make this film pretty good. But no, more Disney f-ing over franchises and directors with bullshit meddling.
I still have high hopes for Guardians 3. The script was written during the Infinity Saga and Gunn seems to be pretty competent at creating good stories looking at the first two Guardians movies.
I didn't watch the other two GOG in the theaters, and I regret it because they were both really good.
I hope they keep the original tone, and close the GOG triology magnificently.
He also made the suicide squad which came out last year for DC and it was immaculate.
@@noaheast7600 I don't know if it'll be as great as TSS, though. DC gave Gunn full creative reigns over that movie, whereas I almost guarantee Marvel/Disney won't do that.
That being said, GotG 3 is the movie I have the most hope in right now.
@@DuffyLONER64 that's a fair point. That said for me personally Guardians Vol 1 and 2 stick out massively for me amongst the rest of the MCU for their quality. So I have faith in his ability to deliver because he's done it twice before. Vol 2 is my favorite MCU film. On top of that I have to try and believe that since it's the send off film for the Guardians and Gunn in the MCU he'll get a lot of free reign
Guardians 2 wasn't that good. That said, his humor overall is pretty consistent and Guardians 3 like you said has been in the makes since 2018. Should be at least solid
As much as I found the screaming space goats annoying in this film, I admit that I had a good laugh when the goats crashed into the unexpectedly small black and white planet 😂
It wasn't unfunny, it was just SOOO overused! Like, there were so many better things they could have focused on instead? I want to see Gorr slaughtering gods, not screaming goats. The film really needed 30 minutes more to make Gorr actually threatening, to show Thor's heartbreak, to show Jane's degradation over time from the cancer. Lots of wasted potential in this movie.
@@Blobbyo25 Yep totally agree, it's less than 2 hour runtime really didnt do this film justice.
i enjoyed the goats :'D
Poor goats could have been in a better movie
The goats made me laugh , needed it in a movie about dead kids and terminal cancer
Disclaimer: Spoilers ahoy, and my memory of this movie may have been altered in the 10 hours since I first saw it but these are the impressions I've come away with.
One thing I don't really see people talking about that really irks me is that scene where Jane and Darcy talk. It starts out pretty good, with Jane going out of her way to help someone understand quantum mechanics or whatever even though she's literally dying from cancer. Then Darcy comes in with a bunch of chips and they start talking. Talking about if Jane's going to open up about her diagnosis, what she's going to do with the rest of her time. It's expected for what Jane's going through, maybe even generic, but it's natural and a decent way to provide exposition. And THEN they pivot hard to "Oooh, what about all those hot men you dated, with their hot bods-" and that's the point where I tuned out of the conversation. How do you go from a B+ to an F- on the Bechdel Test with a snap of the finger?! And not just that, but it contrasts SO hard with the LGBT "representation" because it's part of a conversation integral to Jane's arc. It can't just get cut out for the Russian or Middle Eastern version or whatever without gutting the movie. For reference, there's a scene in the movie where they cut to a woman leaning on another woman for support for an actual split-second before carrying on with the scene. That could be cut without changing the story. The Valkyrie kissing that woman's hand could be cut. Hell, Korg's boyfriend could be cut, an *entire* character, without anything meaningful to the narrative being lost. Sure, the conversation about Korg's dads and Valkyrie's girlfriends would be harder to cut, but even then, comparing to the hetero stuff, it's just different. Korg and Valkyrie are barely important to the story and mostly just tag along because Thor needed people to play off of. Neither of them have well-established story arcs. Jane *does*, at least relatively speaking, and with such an important role in the story, much of her dialogue can't be cut. Korg and Valkyrie have no such luxury.
Anyway, general movie complaints:
There is a potential version of this movie where, instead of Korg and Valkyrie tagging along, Thor and Jane travel to Omnipotence City a bit earlier in the movie and Thor actually wins over some of the weaker gods in the court with his speech. Maybe choose gods that were historically portrayed as much more merciful or caring whilst the stronger gods like Zeus still give Thor a hard time, so Gor's point about gods being callous and arbitrary mostly still stands. That way we get a cast of brand-new characters that shake things up. Korg and Valkyrie were great in Ragnarok, but this movie isn't Ragnarok, and clinging to them without justifying their role in the movie is so irritating and disappointing when we could've had new characters made to fit the conflict, who provide a natural counter-ideology to Gor. As it stands, Thor just feels like he's trying to stop the God Butcher because he's a god and has god friends, and then they tack on this stupid "it's all about love" bullshit at the very end. If they were hinting at this earlier in the movie, I totally missed it, but this movie doesn't even think about establishing a clear rebuttal to Gor's ideology until the last 15 minutes. I feel like that makes Gor's interrogation scene worse, even if it's great in a vacuum, because it adds depth to Gor's motivations and creates this imbalance between the protagonist and the antagonist. He tells Jane that she was never going to receive protection from the gods, and the help she sought out herself is only expediting her death. He tells Valkyrie that her dedication to the gods, all of the other Valkyries who died in the name of Asgard, earned her kind nothing but suffering. These are genuinely compelling points, but it makes it all the more apparent when the argument made against Gor's ideology just... isn't there. If we had a small team of gods, probably of fertility, agriculture, and peace (if there are any such gods), they could *show* why Gor is wrong. They could be the exception, the spark of hope that there just may be someone looking out for you. They could emphasize how they feel a deep personal connection with their worshippers, perhaps even a maternal/paternal love, and that's the exact kind of love that was taken from Gor. Idunno, I'm just spitballing here, and there may be some important aspects I'm forgetting, but I feel like some new supporting characters could've helped separate it from Ragnarok, making it a uniquely-toned film. Still, a little comedy wouldn't have hurt, and I feel like if they cut out half of the jokes and really focused on quality over quantity, they could've made something less cheesy and over-the-top. Again, this movie isn't Ragnarok, and it suffers from trying to cram just as many jokes into a story with far fewer opportunities for good humor. Whatever, rant over. I hope Taika Waititi isn't too discouraged by the critical reception. Between this and Free Guy, it feels like he's being overworked and rushed. And I know some fans can be horrible, especially to people of color, and being a self-described Polynesian Jew certainly makes him a target from several different angles.
I totally agree, this was such a good articulation of some of the movie’s faults!
Valkyrie(Tessa Thompson) was only in this movie cause she slept with the director
@@Snow-xd4rv he's dating Rita Ora and she is not Tessa Thomson 🙄
I hear you, but if they just left Val and Korg behind, fan would complaining- why you didn't gave us more Val and Korg and just shoved us a brand new character we don't care about ...
whats wrong with gay people? lol
As much as we love your positive reviews, you have to keep giving out these, unfortunately, negative reviews. Because they're honest. That's why we watch you. We trust you to give your honest opinion on what you like, or think is good, and what you dislike, or think is mediocre/bad quality. Keep up the good work
"in this movie, you never really feel anything" yes exactly! The premise had a lot of potential, if only anything had a smidge of an impact outside of like five minutes of the B&W scene... Like I didn't like the whole coliseum planet thing in Ragnarok, felt kinda like an unnecessary detour, but at least in that movie emotional beats, albeit not many, actually landed. Love&Thunder could have been really sweet and emotional given the premises of the story, and yet :/
And yeah half the characters felt totally out of character as well, especially Jane
honestly the only moment where i truly felt an emotion other than being bored was when zeus struck the lightning bolt through korg
I felt animosity at the absolutely wasted opportunity to tell a great story on the big screen.
Facts i legit left this movie feeling nothing… took a few hours, remembered it and was like “yeah that shit was trash”
I'm kinda glad I'm not alone on the "not feeling anything" about the movie. I wasn't looking forward to watch this movie in the cinemas to begin with but my whole family insisted we all go anyways. I expected this movie to turn out disappointing though I had hope that I may enjoy it even the slightest bit, but my expectations still turned out to be true anyways.
Majority of the movie was pretty underwhelming.
Especially of what's going on with Thor and Jane, the scene when they made up felt so...forced.
*Spoiler Warning*
The reason Omnipotent City was frustrating for me is because it *almost* made me feel something.
Zeus freaking lightning bolts Korg, and it’s like “oh snap, Thor lost one of the few remaining people he cares about”. Thor proceeds to lose his cool, just like with Thanos, catches Zeus’ Thunderbolt and literally skewers him with it. I was genuinely shocked and wondered how this was going to affect both the characters and the story moving forward.
And then it turns out Korg is fine, and Zeus is fine, so the whole thing was completely pointless and kinda disappointing.
I think the problem is Taika was given more creative control for this one. He didn’t write Ragnarok, but he wrote this one.
Is that so?
Maaybe, but that doesn't explain why other things he's written are genuinely funny. I want to blame Taika, but I feel that's a too simple of a solution.
Wait what? Taika didn't wrote Ragnarok?
And that’s why it sucked.
@@HolybasilYT I agree Taika has proven himself to be a very good director. I haven’t seen the movie, but from other reviews and videos I have seen, it is a mix of his general quirkiness and the campiness of the MCU these days. They saw the success of Ragnorok and must have pumped it to 100 because they got the wrong idea of why it worked.
I'll tell you this, Taika Waititi is a very good director who understands a child mindset and viewpoint, that's why most of his films are great and why Jojo Rabbit and Boy are really good films. He also has very polished slapstick humor. His comedic aspects are really something to take note of and he really is a great writer for those things. Now when it comes to adults, that's where Waititi falls off, he really does not like Adult content, from romance, serious undertones, or growing up. He reallt falls flat from those things, and he really doesn't know what to do when a character already is arched out. I have not much to say to that, but he isn't good at writing about adults as he is about writing children.
I have only one thought about that scene of the children with the power of Thor, it must be really funny to film. I must image how much epic must be being one of the children that participate in that.
Ngl, this reminds me of when I heard that a Make A Wish kid requested that "he's a friend from work" line for Thor to say in Ragnorok. :)
I love how they grabbed Gorr, one of the most emotional characters with the most justifiable reasons for his beliefs, a true devil who attacked the gods and used their wants for his own end game and truly had fun torturing them with his pure hatred. They then grabbed him and dumbed him down and that’s fuckin it
They really shouldnt have touched such a good story with so much potential, because it is not a funny haha story, it literally begins with a guy telling his son it’ll be ok and they’ll survive and shows the kid slowly die of starvation whilst he keeps hope in the gods, this one.. is just bad
Seems to me like the problems with these movies after Endgame is very similar to the problems with the comics. In comics, the writers kind of know they can "play" with the character for a while but at some point they need to let everything go back to the status quo for the next writer to tell a story. For some writers it's actually challenging to have to stop their stories for a big event or have to change course after an event so something similar happens and that's the main, larger problem with comics, it's both a larger story with all those characters and many individual stories for those characters. I think that's kind of what's happening here too, James Gunn probably didn't want someone telling more stories with the Guardians that interfered with his story, Endgame kind of messed up with a lot of stories and now the directors are trying to tell their story after all those things so they need to figure out how to resolve the parts they don't care about to tell the parts they care about. I don't blame anyone for feeling disappointed with these movies after Infinity War and Endgame, the MCU was building towards something and did something that seemed impossible but now it doesn't seem to have the same direction in storytelling and seems all over the place. I still liked No Way Home though... 😅
Its not the same, not because you are supposed to start telling new stories it means the movie quality should be bad. The recents MCU movies are bad and not because of their plot its because they are bad in general! bad writing bad action scenes, you are forced to watch more material in order to understand them, etc, etc.
I don't really think Endgame ruined anything, especially for Thor. One workout scene and he's right back to infinity war where he's powerful but ran by emotion and a sense of emptiness. Of course this movie kinda squandered the character all on its own.
@@fluff_bunny1885 it’s been my thoughts for a while. When the pre-infinity war movies were building up to SOMETHING, the post endgame movies and shows seems to open tons of unrelated plots lines. I mean, would it be that hard to drop a reference to Kang in Multiverse of Madness? Just enough to start giving a hint about a major crossover event coming? There used to be a continuity of sort with the stinger scenes, as in one movie stinger scene would build up hype for the next. Stuff like Coulson and Mjolnir at the end of Iron Man 2. Now they simply don’t do that anymore.
The problem is that the directors aren't willing to modify their stories to fit the current status quo. Thus the first part of the Thor movie had to be about Thor changing back to the version Taiko wants to write about, who will then have to change back to what the overarching plot needs him to be.
they need a big bad to aim for and worry about. oh well.
I was sad when I couldnt see this movie in theaters because I was too busy working but now I'm GLAD
Gorr was easily the best part of this film. Bales performance and the character of Gorr was so creepy and amazing. I don't mind the comedy as much as most other people but I do agree there is too much comedy
honestly i think this movie could have worked pretty well as two movies: one story of thor discovering who he is, coming to terms with himself, and establishing jane foster's mighty thor, and one of jane foster's mighty thor, her struggles with cancer, and gorr. The first one would be a very funny movie in the style of ragnarok while the second one would be more dramatic.
whyd u post 2 of the same comments?
@@themysticcuber992 sometimes UA-cam does that idk why
@@themysticcuber992 i didn't type and post it twice, youtube be weird sometimes
so u wanted another 'thor finds himself' movie?
I love when Thor cried out ‘it’s thorbin time’ as he sacrificed himself for gru and the minions. Truly a tear jerking moment in this film and MCU phase four.
@Thor. No thor we din't
Wow this gets funnier everytime 😐
I love when Thor cried out ‘save me from the slow ticking tendrils of time that are eating me away' as he sacrificed himself for gru and the minions. Truly a tear jerking moment in this film and MCU phase four.
@@jimmoniz3665 It was funny with Morbius and Minions the rise of Gru and now it’s not
Honstly best moment when he grabbed Stormbreaker and shouted "Ban-kai" throwing Kirin at Kaido
I think that disney is majorly limiting the freedom of their directors. Taika Waititi has a great track record but the movie only has a few moments that feel like he directed the movie. I have the same feelings with Sam Raimi on Multiverse of Madness
In the mount olympus scene with zuse with all the other gods watching, there is a missed opportunity to have a Morgan freeman god cameo.
Now considering how Marvel is treating the people who work on these movies, it makes sense as to why everything feels haphazardly put together for the story and even the VFX looks rushed at times (along with a ton of shots in the film not being used due to the VFX artists being overworked which had lots of the emotional scenes extended along with a whole scene of Natalie Portman getting powered up by mjolnir) which makes me more mad at the higher ups at Disney/marvel and not Taika Watiti. I feel bad for him since there was so much out of his control.
@Cassie Considering how he mixes humor and darkness in our flag means death this could have gone a lot deeper with the Gorr premise. Which a darker tone would have been allowed, the dark moments that were there were great: the beginning, the swords power, the black and white parts.
They probably only put him in charge so they could add more dialogue so they didn't have to do as much vfx.
Well Taika Watiti did just go and make fun of the VFX in the movie, which was NOT cool
I wonder if we could get a "Snyder Cut" part two. Like find out if Taika had a different vision that has been destroied by Disney so we could demand they finish the original version and see if it's better
I like how this movie might be the only movie where the main villain won in the end as well as the heroes. It’s a win-win for both. Gorr meets Eternity and can make any wish including killing all the gods as he intended but he chooses to bring back his daughter. In either case, he won. The heroes lost but Gorr made the right choice making the movie lovely with its central theme of love.
That made me really LOVE the ending of the movie
THANK YOU! So many people just whine, completely missing this point.
@@TheCrimsonPope to be fair this movie does have its fair share of problems but i personally like many others liked the ending
Ending is the only reason I love this movie. The goats are f'ing annoying.
What I think made the ending good was that the talk-out with the villain didn't felt like a final resort, but was genuine.
Thor said it, they lost, and that being the case, he'd rather spend his last moments with Jane rather than uselessly fighting Gorr
I’d really like to see a director’s cut. There was just a whole lot of movie missing, i think it needed more time to do what it wanted. Aside from it also likely being very rushed. #ReleaseTheTaikaTake
Didn't Taika say he would add more jokes if he had the chance?
@@piscis210 whoops 😂
@@isaacddestroy3674 Yeah I found the interview and he says ''I’d say my cut would probably have a few more jokes in there. There might be a couple of deleted scenes, but as I always say, a scene is deleted because it’s not good enough to be in the film.'' He also talks about how director cuts suck... I think Taika's one of the bigger reasons why this movie was bad. Which is disappointing because I really liked what he did with Ragnarok :/
@@piscis210 It's not just more jokes. Christian Bale said in an interview where there was supposed to be more Gorgo scenes, and idk, the rest is extended scenes of Jane, etc
Yeah no thanks. Hemsworth said that the original cut was 4 hours long and basically unwatchable. It isn’t like Snyder’s Justice League which had actual thought and care put into it, Taika literally just kept filming and filming without any thought for a story. That’s why this movie is only an hour and 40 minutes… which is pathetic for MCU standards
Something that concerns me is that now there are so many characters that we'll probably only end up seeing most of them once throughout phase 4-6, which won't end well because we need most of these characters to have natural character arcs and motivations to pit them against Kang and the Skrulls for the next cross-over movies.
Honestly, my biggest issue with the movie is Thor’s outfit. The yellow and blue armor is fine (I do despise the helmet, but he only wears that for five minutes luckily). But he wore a waaay better outfit earlier in the movie that was closer to Norse mythology. But he only wore that for about 5-10 minutes. It makes me pretty sad, since that was one of his best looks in the MCU
I'm glad I'm dot the only one bothered by this, the earlier outfit was so cool with the fur trim around the cape, the newer one looked like something out of an 80's cartoon.
Oh i loved that norse-fur trimed outfit he wore at the begining of the movie. It looked amazing. And t h e n they changed it for the pettiest reason ever. I really liked this movie, but idk why they changed that outfit when they had made something so good.
my brother said this exact thing to me after we left the cinema!
I enjoyed the movie myself, but the biggest problem with it is DEFINITELY how rushed a lot of stuff. Taika said the original cut was around 4 hours long, and I can see how-so many story beats are just pushed through with no time for the emotion to really sink in. I get the sinking feeling that when choosing between cutting dramatic moments and goofy jokes, they probably chose the former.
#ReleaseTheTaikaCut!
You mean "the former"?
I honestly wish this movie got the "Justice League" treatment and that they released a better, longer version.
Honestly it also feels like a movie where almost nothing happens. For being so long, it was very poorly paced.
@@TheCrimsonPope He doesn't want to release it... think he actually laughed off the idea lmao
I enjoyed the movie, but the way I interpreted it was that it was in Korg's perspective. So the scenes with Gor and his daughter and at eternity were much more grounded and emotional. Whereas the scenes where Korg was around and whatnot were exaggerated, hence all the quips and jokes, which did not really happen.
This is canon from now on
@@sfmaub234 ^^^^
Thats one way to cope with shitty writing.
But even the emotional parts (besides Gorr's introduction, I loved that part) is riddled with dumbassery. Gorr having a drawing of Stormbreaker, a weapon just recently forged, instead of the actual bifrost in Asgard? Dumb as shit. The revelation of eternity just being a universe wide wishing well, and somehow people know that even though no one's been there? Dumb as shit. People like Thanos not trying to find eternity, instead trying to find 6 small stones throughout the universe to get his wish? Also dumb as shit. Gorr being quickly swayed by Thor to not kill the gods, and instead wish for her daughter back? What the fuck, you're saying that Gorr never thought of that the whole time, even though his hatred for the gods is fuelled by the fact that his daughter died because of the god's negligence? Apparently Gorr is dumb as shit now. This movie is inexcusably bad, and the only reason I'm not calling it the worst MCU movie is because multiverse of madness exist.
6:08 GOD LORD MAKE IT STOP *ad plays* genius
I find it funny you mentioned a huge part of this movie was missing, cause I thought the same thing, and then I discovered that a huge part of this movie was cut. Apparently, according to Natalie Portman, there were entire planets cut from the movie. Plus there were scenes with the Grandmaster and Eitri that were cut, and according to Waititi it's because "They aren't good enough". Like if this theatrical cut is what he considered "good enough" I cannot imagine how bad those scenes must be.
I think Taika just said they weren't good enough as a cover-up for Disney/Feige telling him to cut them. Him actually meaning that would be dumb because a bunch of the movie isn't good enough
@@marrodc I can believe that because Taika is just a terrible comic book movie director. He’ll never be able to make a good comic book movie that doesn’t have campy ass comedy elements, and don’t say “Ragnarok”, that film was overrated garbage
@@drstrangelove307 ragnarok still had better themes and ironically had the smartest version of thor who managed to form a plan to escape the gladiator planet and interpret the ragnarok prophecy, unlike stoic thor who didn’t really do anything that smart.
Also his other films are well reviewed. And considering dr strange 2 was basically being reshot and same for thor 4, looks like the studio’s been interfering like for iron man 2 and dr strange 2.
Most of the cases the deleted scenes were better than the original movie like in thor 2.
I’d blame it more on the studio for scheduling 4 tv shows and 4 movies in a year, leaving audiences having to sift through a huge amount of content half of it being fluff and below marvel’s standard of consistency. Also they’re reducing the runtime of movies after dr strange 2 and Thor 4 to 2 hrs for maximum box office.
@@drstrangelove307 ....Ragnarok
@@drstrangelove307 ragnarok
I was annoyed when during the entire movie Thor was like "I need to get a team to take him down." and didn't even think of the Guardians. The group he had spent years traveling with since Endgame ended.
Thank God for your sanity. I was actually so bored during this movie and couldn't quite figure out why until much later. You really put it into perfect words. It was the lack of weight. The lack of grit and good humor.
On the movie's runtime and pacing, I've heard that they were required to hit a two hour runtime. This probably forced them to cut out quite a bit.
Finally someone talks about how Gor, one of the best villians we’ve gotten in the mcu, is barely in this movie and doesn’t even butcher gods on screen. It feels so weird for them to just sideline the main villain nearly the entire movie considering how ragnarok gave hela so much more screentime to establish her as someone we as an audience should fear.
And the whole point of Gorr is that he becomes what he hated. In the comics his people aren't dead, and when he becomes god-like, instead of helping them like he thought the gods should be doing, he goes and kills the other gods.
I wish they utilised this aspect of him more. Having a "you've become the very thing you wanted to destroy" reveal carries a lot of emotional weight for many villains.
@@Blobbyo25 ITS OVER GORR I HAVE THE EMOTIONAL HIGH GROUND
@@Blobbyo25 hey at the end of the day, this guy is better than mr “that was his mistake”.
@@emoji3266 Oh thank goodness yeah lol
Seeing the new Dr Strange right after Everything Everywhere All At Once really made me realize how bland and stale Marvel content has become. They're basically the same premise but the latter is one of the best movies I've seen in years.
Bc it actually felt like a unique vision that tried to do the most it can and take risks while Dr Strange was basically every marvel movie; high production "meh". I had more hopes for the MCU after Wandavision as it also tried something unique and fun, and was really great overall.
But that seemed to be just an outlier; and even then you see how dull and bland the MCU is (figuretively in writing and style and literally as the colors and production are duller) whenever the non tv show parts are happening in direct contrast.
So I have no interest in the new Thor hearing it's another "meh" movie. I wish Disney would just take a break for a bit or go back to when they let directors try their own styles on the movies instead of following the Russo checklist. It's like they're not allowed to be interesting anymore.
I feel like Doctor Strange would’ve been so much better if they let Sam Raimi do even more things, heck I wouldn’t be surprised that he wanted to change the script but Disney was like “no that stays”
@@miketrapper0464 Agreed. It felt like Sam Raini "lite". With some of his quirks but being forced into the MCU mold.
@@arthurdurham exactly like I really wanted more horror but there wasn’t and the Illuminati felt so random that it doesn’t seem like something he even wanted in the movie in the first place, so when they were getting killed off I was kinda happy about it because I finally got kills in the MCU even if they weren’t too bloody, especially because I didn’t care about them I didn’t even think John Krasinski fits as Reed Richards, hopefully the supposed existing 2 hour 40 minute cut of the movie had better Raimi stuff then the theatrical movie
@@miketrapper0464 I agree, cut the entire illuminati part. It was clearly just to set up other MCU movies and to allow Wanda to "kill superheroes" without worrying about consequences. It felt pointless, boring, and out of place.
I wish they played up on the aspects regarding the darkest timeline and him inhabiting his dead body but those seemed so rushed bc the movie needed room for all the other BS.
@@arthurdurham exactly
9:26
"Do I really have high hopes that James Gunn will be able to make Guardians 3 good? The answer, against my best wishes, is no."
After seeing the third and final installment of the Guardians, that aged terribly.
Schaff said he likes Guardians 3.
No, it aged terribly.
I haven't seen the film, but from what you describe it seems like there must have been a serious conflict of vision between the two writers.
Am I the only one that feels that it'll be great characterization if Gor was actually kind of nice towards the kidnapped children Instead of being creepy and one dimensionally villainous. Especially when he was recently a devout loving father who started his entire quest of killing all the gods because of the death of his child, and his Eternity wish on bringing her back.
Like seriously, Instead of conjuring and decapitating a snake to traumatize the children, Gor would summon cute shadow animals, put on a shadow theatre show, anything fun an experienced dad would do for kids . The dual personality of hatred towards gods but good nature towards children greatly empathizes Gor similarly how GOW humanizes Kratos with his interactions with Calliope, Pandora, and Atreus despite his bloodlust against the Greek and Norse gods.
To a further point, It'll been great if Axel (Heimdall's son and the Asgardian children are severely underdeveloped in the film) isn't persuaded by Gor belief that all gods should die, and claims that Thor is a hero who'll come rescue them. To this point, Gor argues that gods cannot love unless its love only to themselves. Gor goes into a tangent, that Odin built Asgard and its richness through warmongering and conquering the nine realms. Odin fails as a loving father, as his parenting methods led his son Loki (another god) into a dark path of murder and deceit. Loki disguised as Odin then let the nine realms fall into chaos, Hela (a goddess) subsequently breaks free and kills asgardian forces and the destruction of Asgard itself soon follows. All of these contributing factors allows Thanos to further genocide the Asgardian population including Axel's father, Heimdall, and erase half the universe. But did the gods come to help the grief-stricken populations due to the snap? No, they don't even help the Avengers or rebuild societies. They only party at Omnipotence City instead because according to Gor, Gods are incapable of love. Even Thor himself became a shut-in recluse before Endgame, getting fat from beer instead of leading his people in New Asgard.
But Gods are capable of Love, since Thor loves Jane Foster as a romantic companion despite being a human, and Frigga and Odin loved Loki as a son despite being a frost giant. Thor joins the Avengers to help people, and TVA Loki is going through an arc of becoming good. Its because of love that Thor and Loki despite their tumultuous past in the end are capable of recognizing each other as brothers. It becomes so potent that by the ending of Love and Thunder, that when Thor tells Gor to do what he wants with the eternity wish, Thor is comforting his dying ex-girlfriend clearly disproves Gor's philosophy that Gods cannot love.
TLDR: Gor should be like Kratos including being nice to Children; Love and thunder should've emphasized the "Love" aspect by exanimating if Gods are capable of loving others, and if all gods should be killed since they create a lot of the universe problems and refuse or ignore helping their people.
Cringe Reddit paragraph go back
Echoeing my thoughts exactly, especially for the ending.
I mean gorr did kill his wife in front of his child
@@dallasss5658 they weren't really his wife and child
Yeah, in the comics, when gorr gets attacked by thor's followers, gorr literally gives them a chance to leave or even join him. He doesn't hate mortals, he fights for them so they don't experience the same injustice as him
After I watched Endgame, I made the resolution that I wouldn't watch any marvel products after it, because it was such a good ending i felt like there simply wouldn't be a better stopping point.
And every single release, I feel more and more vindicated
I wish i did the same as you.
Honestly its a general thought i have when a story has a unique sequel and a good ending, the ending is a good stopping point especially since what comes after is different. Then I watched the Lost Agent arc from Bleach and never had that thought ever again, its almost an art how Kubo made the new arcs relevant and neccersary, without breaking the ending of the arcs to introduce the new one; even after the big ending of the Fake Karakura Town arc. I secretly hope for another time, when a sacrifice is only a new step to forward a story
I recommend watching Moon Knight, to be honest. It doesn't make any connections to other Marvel properties outside the vaguest possible ones, so if you just want to watch it disconnected from everything else, you can.
Yeah, except for Spider-man NWH, movie-wise Marvel is losing quality.
Shang-Chi was also very good, I would suggest watching that movie independently, it barely feels like an MCU film for most of the runtime.
2 months later I finally decided to watch it and yea my biggest gripe with this movie is not enough gorr and too much humor. The beginning where taika narrates tragedies in a comedic way was just so bad and really kills any seriousness. Despite that I didn’t hate the movie. I went in with low expectations and came out better than I expected. The movies highlights were some humorous scenes then the scenes where there is actual acting. Hospital scene with Jane and Thor was pretty good, the space dolphin scene was good, and the ending was very good. Gorr is awesome.
Schaff, id honestly love to see your opinions on Moon knight, it was a nice surprise to me how engaged and good it was! Specially Oscar isaac's performance, that was awesome. But i can see there is room for improvement and its definitely not flawless by anymeans, but still. Definitely on my favorite phase 4 mcu series/movies (and ive kinda been avoiding those tbh)
It's all because of kevin feige's over obsessive control during production, taika stated that thor was going to be longer, same run time as No way home, having to show case of gorr butchering various gods, falls of other civilizations and even exploring about jane's cancer, his direction was more on about exploring how thor handles his existential crisis and what to do with his life, since he kinda loses a bit of purpose and drive after the endgame war, they realy had much more layered and story ark for thor and jane, jane fighting cancer and choosing whether to live or to die and thor losing his grip ones he sees jane dying during the final arc. but kevin feige cutted the plans out so much because he wanted it to me more family friendly oriented, his plans always interefere with the directors so they had no choice but to follow, even the director of Doctor strange 1 quitted during the conflicts of the next movie's direction, in which the multiverse of madness turns out to be just meh.
If this is the case, I want a directors cut of this. This actually seems very good.
I don’t know why he had an issue with the original Dr Strange 2 guy as Sam Rami said he was allowed to do whatever he wanted, although maybe that’s just because he had a proven track record of popular superhero films.
Given how boring Jane dealing with cancer would be I'm not surprised it was cut (think how much better the Dumbledore movie would be without all the politics slowing down the plot). While the gods being butchered and the civilizations falling would be cool it wouldn't mean much since people being introduced, then dying isn't interesting. At best it introduces how much of a threat Gorr is at worst it would be a series of pointless explosions.
Also why is the thousands of years old Thor having an existential crisis? He has an entire kingdom to rule if he wants something to do. Yet another thing that needed to be cut.
@@uanime1 You watched the new Harry Potter? You know that every time you buy a Harry Potter product, you are funding active genoside against minority groups, right?
Thats the point Gorr is supposed to feel more dangerous
I felt like No Way Home was the last MCU project that felt like it had a real direction and purpose to it.
Still cautiously optimistic for GotG Vol. 3, but for the foreseeable future, the Monsterverse is the only MCU-esque thing i'll stay engaged in.
I mean Moon Knight felt with direction and purpose in my book. Loki too
most of others feel like "they KNOW what they try to do but try to bite more than they can chew so it feels like they got distracted midway through."
@@ianr.navahuber2195 I agree
My favorite part was when thor grabbed his axe and then said “it’s thorin time”
Wouldn't have felt that out of place. A lot of times that meme is used in context that makes little sense, just for the meme, but here it works. And not in TL&T's favor.
I did enjoy this movie a lot, but I will definitely concede that there needs to be more serious moments in it. I really loved the opening scene with gorr though
Watiti gave us a fun, humorous Thor in Ragnarok, while still having some serious moments. But with Love and Thunder it doesn't feel right. Thor has suffered the most out of any MCU character, and yet we are continuously told to laugh at him. And they treat Wanda as the character to sympathize because of her dead robot and two imaginary children. Thor deserves better. He's strong, he's amazing, Chris Hemsworth does him wonderfully. He should be treated how he's been set up.
Fair
Best Thor is Infinity War Thor
Ragnarok have serious moments?lol
I can only remember the death of the odin
@@LeonardoSilva-nh2gg Death of Odin
Him being beat by Hulk only to unleash his true power and then be cheated by the grandmaster.
His talk with Valkyrie.
Thor finally accepting Loki won't change and telling him he doesn't care about him anymore.
Thor vs Hela.
I would mainly agree with you if you didnt devalue wanda's character. Vision was a person, people pretending like he wasn't for sake of making wanda worse looking than she is rubs me the wrong way. You dont have to falsely criticize another unrelated character to make a pointa
Honestly Taika been losing my respect the more info I learned about him recently. Apparently he more or less forced Chris Hemsworth to do a shirtless scene despite Hemsworth voicing his discomfort at being treated like a piece of meat, he recently asked Natalie Portman if she wanted to be in a Star Wars movie despite the fact she was in all three of the prequel films, showing he really doesn't do his research on projects he's being assigned to, and then the final straw for me was his recent interview on this movie specifically where he and some lady actually took potshots at the Visual Effects Team....the same Visual Effects Team that are apparently overworked and underpaid by Disney to make these movies, to the point where people have been coming out and saying what a miserable experience being on a VFX team for a Marvel Movie is.
NO FUCKING WAY DID HE ASK IF NATALIE PORTMAN WANTED TO BE IN A STAR WARS MOVIE. Ok, that might have been a bit much but I am a very big Star Wars fan so sorry
From what I heard Chris was actually the one who wanted to film a naked scene
I heard about the latter 2 things, but didn't know about Chris's discomfort until now. Wow, when you add all those things together it really doesn't bode well for Taika or Marvel Studios in general. Yikes.
There's a reason The Boys basically portrays supes as corrupt Hollywood celebrities and directors. Marvel has been doing a lot of dodgy shit for a while.
@@Stef8988 wasn't that a joke?
Little did he know that Guardians 3 was one of the BEST Marvel MCU films EVER
I forgot Thor lost his eye, not even a reference to his eye in Love & Thunder
As someone who liked the film, this was a great review. Most people just default to the basic explanations as to why they didn’t like this film. The way you explained everything actually made me understand some of these arguments
As someone else who liked the movie, you nailed the comment. Explaining where the problems are really helps get the opinion across. Like the talk about the pacing made me realise how weird it really was, even though I was only put off by it a little while watching.
i liked the movie too but i was still put off very much by the weird pacing.
Despite what everyone else thinks I actually liked Doctor Strange: Multiverse Of Madness. It's gonna lead to something bigger
@@Young_Dab same. Just wish they made what that is clearer though. Thats why phase 4 is weaker than the rest so far, you have some really good projects but theres absolutely 0 connective thread and no vision
@@tracemcsorley6368 I have to disagree on the no vision part. There's still continuity in phase 4, in Multiverse Of Madness, the events that take place in Infinity War, Endgame the first Doctor Strange movie, WandaVizion & No Way Home are all referenced in MoM.
Same with The Eternals, these movies are actually referencing past MCU events more so than any movie did in the first 3 phases.
The movies now are starting to get more crossovers from the heroes without being an Avengers level event, things are starting to connect more which of course there's always gonna be questions and plot holes.
But I still have faith that Marvel is still great. This is still the beginning of phase 4, we still have a ton of unreleased movies for phase 4 like Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol 3. Black Panther 2, Captain Marvel 2, Blade, and a 4th Spider-Man film before we get a 5th Avengers film. So much more content to explore I don't think it's fair to determine Marvel's fate based on a couple of phase 4 movies.
“Why does nothing matter anymore??!!”
This has always been issue, even if MCU fans will probably never admit it. Remember when Endgame undid Cap’s character trajectory? Remember when everyone acted like Civil War would have hard-hitting consequences only for Infinity War to brush it off? Remember when Winter Soldier’s destruction of S.H.I.E.L.D. didn’t go anywhere? Remember when Age of Ultron completely undid Iron Man 3’s ending? Remember when Avengers 1 brushed off the ending of Thor 1? Remember when Banner forgot Betty Ross existed?
This has literally always been a problem. Always. The movies suffer for the sake of continuity but never take the time to take _advantage_ of that continuity. So all it winds up getting used for is plot devices and hard release dates people can get hyped over.
It’s cool you’re finally getting wise to it, but don’t act like it’s some new phenomenon.
Thank God that I stopped at endgame so I cannot subject myself to such mediocrity.
@@Feliciathedoll there has been some really good movies after Endgame, like the Spiderman movies
THIS. Because the directors don't seem to work together to tell stories across an entire phase, it means that so much is ignored from previous films. It's a long standing problem with the MCU, and I really think a lot of people refuse to look at how bad Marvel's storytelling actually is across the board.
I agree with everything else but how did Infinity War ignore Civil War?
@@KangarooMonkey not necesarry ignored, but everything what was left in Ciwil War was pretty quickly resorved in Infinity War
There were 3 things that made me leave the theater; The goats, the play redux , and the hammer.
When I first stepped into the theater, I thought they were still playing commercials until I saw Christian Bale. I had that same feeling the whole rest of the movie. It just feels like one big, two hour commercial.
Imma be honest, I was ready to be disappointed after all the disappointment I'd heard expressed by others, but I really did like it. I thought the real emotional sticking point that was the clear parallels between Jane and Gorr relying on power supplied by weapons that were slowly killing them was great. I liked how a lot of this movie went back to more magicy Asgardian vibes after Ragnarok (which I loved) went more science fiction. I really liked how they showed us that Thor's humor was covering up his immense pain, like the scene where he broke the vending machine:
He hears the news that Jane has been basically killing herself the whole time they've been having their fun adventures and it shakes him. So he unleashes his rage and shatters the glass of a nearby vending machine. Then we see him bringing in a bunch of snacks to Jane and casually saying, "Some idiot made a fridge without a door," like it's back in Thor 1 and he doesn't understand Earth. But we as the audience know that he broke it in rage and sorrow. He's just putting on a face for Jane.
And that scene where Jane shows up at the end and we just focus on Thor's face as he goes through the realization that she is basically sealing her fate actually got me to tear up.
IDK I just really picked up on a strong emotional core where it seems many didn't. I don't know what that says about me, and I'm not claiming I'm some amazing smart guy who picks up on things no one else does. Just sharing my take.
I wholeheartedly agree! I think some people just get it, some don't. Maybe it's because we, too, cope with the hard things in life with humour and imagination, like Taika? This seems to be the predominant theme in his productions. I think maybe in Love and Thunder he didn't drive this home in a way as obvious as in JoJo Rabbit, but still... This man is a master of conveying the dramatic through the funny, like giving kids bitter medicine in sweet juice.
Look okay the emotional core was great, the editing was just fucking weird and it felt like everything else was just filler to the emotional shit which is it good.
People always have to be disappointed even when it’s not that bad. I loved this movie too!
I agree honestly. The humor was a bit much at times so I can see why a lot of people didn’t really care for the emotional core, but I really liked it.
Yeah, I'm really just not on Schaff's wavelength this time. Maybe he just wasn't in the right headspace for a movie like this?
When Thor said “It’s Hammer Time” and hammered the enemies, I knew it was the movie of all time
One of THE movies of all time, can confirm
And when mighty thor said “it’s thorbing time” it was magical
No no no no, HE SAYS ITS THORIN TIME, NO NOO THIS WAS NOT HOW IT WAS SUPPOSED TO GO AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
bro it wasn’t funny with morbius and it’s not funny now just stop dawg 💀
@@lincolnehret I will
My dad told me this was one of his most favourite movies ever
This movie felt like, “Ok, the version of Thor at the end of Endgame was fat, depressed, and has suffered a lot of emotional trauma he still needs to work through.
How do we undo all of that in two hours so that the version of Thor in the next Avengers movie is ripped, quippy, and has someone to pass his legacy onto like all the other OG Avengers?”
There were a lot of problems with this movie, but in the end I just had so much fun watching it. Would recommend to anyone looking for an enjoyable couple hours, just don’t expect a masterpiece.
Agreed
So that just shows you have low standards
BOOO ! BOOOOOOOO ! You're bad for supporting terrible movies. BOOOO !
@@arya8165 ;(
I did too! It wasn't perfect, but it was fun, and that's really what we need with how shitty things are in the world right now
My sister brought me to watch it since she didn't want me to stay home at my desk doing nothing. I personally loved it and my sister did too.
I was honestly thinking they were going to make Gorr wish for Jane to live, but they didn't, and I'm pretty glad they didn't give her plot armour. It brought closure to Thor and Jane's story, in my opinion.
I had the same thought. If they let Jane live it would make a much more boring and predictable ending.
No they didn't let Jane live. But saying "Thor will return" after showing her welcome in Vallhalla COMPLETELY invalidated any death she had.
@@NoobsUnited9000 How did it invalidate her death? All we're seeing is that when Thor finally dies, he'll be joining her in Valhalla in the future, not anytime soon, just an eventuality. Also that she became a god too, even if only for 5-ish months (iirc?) She died a warrior's death and sacrificed herself in combat. Not like it invalidated Heimdal's death cause he showed up for 5 seconds
@@NoobsUnited9000 funny enough in the comics after the war of the realms event she became a valkyrie, helping others go to the aftelife
so there is a way to bring her back if they want to
OMG you are so right about Starlord having a connection to Thor's grief of Jane having Cancer. I never thought of that before you brought it up!
Honestly, this movie made me appreciate Thor 1 and Thor The Dark World. Thor 1 had some genuinely funny moments and Thor was taken seriously and had an actual arc and the tone was pretty well done. I still don’t like Thor The Dark World at all but once again it at least took Thor seriously and his relationship with Loki was incredibly well handled.
I’m really confused when it comes to reviews for this movie. A lot of people say that the jokes make this movie tonally inconsistent. But the thing is, I actually think that ragnarok had this issue way worse and people didn’t seem to care.
In this, gorr’s backstory is played completely straight. The god he spoke to being lighthearted is done on purpose, to show his disconnect and disrespect he has for his followers. Jane choosing to stay on earth and not go with thor is played completely straight, thor begging her not to come. And when she does, thor doesn’t crack a joke at her, he just says her name in the most heartbroken way possible. When thor realises he’s lost and that gorr has won, he doesn’t quip at him. He goes to the woman he loves to comfort her. When she’s dying in his arms they don’t quip at eachother, they just hold onto eachother and giggle together at inside jokes.
Compare that to ragnarok (not saying ragnarok is bad, just that this is a problem for ragnarok more than love and thunder). Surtur is made into a complete joke. He’s talking about destroying Asgard, and thor isn’t taking him serious at all. Loki taking odins place is played for laughs and not at all serious with its implications. Hela killing thors best friends is done so casually that it wasn’t even funny, but it wasn’t exactly done seriously either so it was confusing from a tonal perspective. Banner choosing to become the hulk again even if it means he might not come back is a joke, because he just falls onto the bridge comedically. Surtur blowing up Asgard is interrupted by korg talking about the foundations.
Again, I’m not saying ragnarok was bad by any means. However, I do believe a lot of the criticisms people are throwing at love and thunder were actually also faults with ragnarok which had been improved upon.
“When she’s dying in his arms he doesn’t quip” this is the bare minimum tho imo, the fact that this has to be said about MCU movies at all is part of the problem
i agree with you. this movie maybe had a lt more jokes in the beginning, but when it wanted to be serious it remained serious. If people like the movie or not is completely their opinion, but I feel that this movie is just being hated because it is popular to do so
@@padricburke8858 my point isn’t that doing the bare minimum makes it good, my point is that people are saying the movie doesn’t have serious moments because the jokes get in the way, and I’m pointing out a series of big serious moments in the film that are very much not played for laughs.
@@xero1048 yeah I agree the movie did have moments it at least tried to take seriously and janes death was one of those but overall I felt the tone of the movie as a whole kinda undermined it, still had a ton of fun w it, but I think less jokes would’ve made the film better
I think both THis and Ragnarok had terrible humor.
I'm glad it wasn't just me who was a bit confused about the retcon with Korg's parents
I will say though it's true character development for Disney to finally have a more accurate portrayal of Zeus in their catalogue of movies
I enjoyed that every gay character was only referenced in short 10 second clips that can be cut when showing the film in homophobic countries
@@billhoult3262 It's insulting that in every Marvel property, you can tell *exactly* when you're at *that* part of the film that will get cut out by the Disney execs so they can release it in the Middle East & China. Honestly the people who complain about them "shoving in gay characters to tick boxes and virtue signal" are mad about the completely wrong thing - Disney aren't doing it to push any 'social agenda', they're purposefully doing the barest possible effort for inclusion so they can easily cut it out for audiences with backwards sensibilities because they're money-hungry fatcats terrified of losing even the smallest amount of foreign box office earnings.
For me personally, this movie was a breath of fresh air. The recent state of the MCU has just been very depressing, as in all the recent shows/movies have been very heavy and have left me feeling like things are only going to get worse for these characters. Thor: Love and Thunder was a lot lighter BECAUSE of all the jokes and stuff, and the ending was very sweet. It’s exactly why I really enjoyed it. Because of how heavy everything else in the MCU has been, it’s really nice to have something not as serious. This is ofc just my personal opinion on it and why I liked it so much. Maybe it’s stupid, but the movie made me happy, so in my book it’s a good movie.
Yeah I concur. I went into the theater EXPECTING to not take it too seriously as it is, after all, a comic book movie. It was enjoyable enough for me and I liked it, despite its shortcomings.
Same. I really liked Gorr's fate at the very end
It could’ve been tasteful. It’s like stale air rather than fresh air. To make it light hearted they should’ve changed everything.
I agree! I had such a great time watching this movie 🙈 I don't know if I would say that other phase 4 stuff made me feel depressed because of the topics that were handled, but more because i was excited for what was to come and especially the series (with the exception of wandavision and moon knight) actually bored me and left me pretty disappointed...
Same. It was a tale narrated by korgg so I figured it was supposed to be extra campy. I had fun and that’s all that really matters for me at this point when it’s comes to stuff under the Disney monopoly
5:14 i like that him going through an existential chris and solves it and got his powers back without the hammer and they replaced it with an axe.
Finally, an opinion I trust on this movie. I’ve heard so many mixed reviews I don’t know if I should see it or not.
You should
Don't let anyone decide your opinions apart from you. You and Schafrillas are obviously really different people with inevitability different tastes. Deadass just watch the movie dude please
See it. If the opinions are not clear, then watch it. Don't bandwagon off of random people on the internet. MAKE. YOUR OWN. DAMN. OPINION.
You haven’t even finished the video….
Obviously form an opinion once you've watched it. But yeah, this movie sucked
7:55 this little continuity slip is one of my favorite bits of the movie, because Disney either unintentionally made one of korg’s parents trans, or she was just a really late addition to the polycule
I liked that movie. Had funny bits. I wasn't expecting much.
I do love the relation people have with gods, so putting it all in the conversation is cool.
I liked how they valued storytelling in the movie (when the rock person is telling the story of Thor, and Chris Bale is terrorizing the kids with stories).
I like mythology, so when the goats came out (which were canon to Nordic Mythology) I found it funny and it was always a reminder that they will treat of serious stuff in a goofy/silly way. I'm really looking forward to see how Zeus, Thor and Kanshu will talk about mythology in the MCU
You are a cheerful person and normally that's a good thing. However, all the people saying they do not expect much and buying tickets are why those films are still being made. The studios can rely on you to supply the cash and not even try.
@@mikshinee87 Don't care, I had fun and it made me happy.
@@mikshinee87 what on god's green earth are you losing from more marvel movies coming out? You don't have to watch them let others enjoy them
@@clitcrusader4897 No. Because letting people enjoy things actively ruins things. For want of a nail I guess, sure it's "good" other people are happy but then their blind obedience and lack of critical thinking actively lets the corporation make more money and continue to make bad movies that make more money, and genuinely good movies that release around the same time can't even stand a chance and it makes the studios think these good movies aren't profitable compared to franchise IPs that will make all the money regardless if there's any effort put into it. Thus theaters are pressured to put more dumb schlock in order to keep business afloat while interesting and original movies get left behind, and need to rely on DVD sales to break even.
Just because it's positive doesn't mean it's good.
I'm not really a Marvel fan, only really watch the movies if someone has it playing on the TV-- or, in this case, my mom and I went to a movie theater as a joint birthday celebration (bc our birthdays are less than a week apart) and this was one of the only movies available at the time. It was an alright movie, enjoyable enough for the time we spent watching it in theaters but I didn't really feel the need to rewatch it after that (my mom did though). But at the same time I didn't outright dislike it, probably bc I was a casual viewer who hadn't seen any of the previous Thor movies so I wasn't that invested in it. I will say the screaming goats got annoying after a while
9:07
What's That Footage From?
Really hoping one of your coming up projects is a full analysis on what makes Everything Everywhere All At Once a Cinematic Masterpiece. I wanna hear what you thought of each and every part of the movie.
@our hero gotta love potato wedges 😋
How about a full analysis of Bleach? 5 arcs, 4 movies, 4 fillers and a spinoff.
Watched it last night for the first time
Holy shot is it something else
I'm usually a big fan of Taika Waititi's films. His kiwi humor (New Zealand Humor) really sings to me as Im also a kiwi and it's always refreshing to see something that New Zealand people have been a part of. But this film was all over the place, the budget for a lot of parts honestly looks pretty low and the pacing to me just seems off. There is still kiwi humor that I recognize in it and some of the action scenes are pretty decent to me, plus I thought the villian was quite cool. But overall just a meh film. For anyone who sees this and wants to see one of Taika Waititi's better films I recommend "Hunt for the Wilderpeople" or "BOY" as they lap Thor: Love and Thunder multiple times over in quality and story.
and What We Do in the Shadows !!
I saw this movie with my grandparents earlier today, and while I personally thought it was a fine movie, my grandparents really didn't like it. I guess I can see why. Maybe I'll watch it in the next year or so, but for now, the only reason you should see it in theaters is if you have kids that want to see it.
Thor: Ragnarok made us look at Taika and said "let him cook".
This damn movie showed that we left him in the kitchen for too long!
I have hope in James Gunn solely because he's handled everything to do with the guardians from the start, I hope disney have just left him to it because he clearly knows what he's doing with these characters.
My favorite scene was when Thor and Jane joined the WWE as the superstar tag team "Love from Above and Thunder From Down Under." Truly one of the movies of phase 4.
Appreciate the persona music in the background
I liked the fight scene at the beginning with the bird aliens. Also there was going to be a scene with Zeus returning before the climax where he would teach Thor about lightning coming from the heart or something, then Jane would actually went with Thor. Why was that cut?