Why does Starfield regress from Daggerfall in it's procedural generation?
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- Опубліковано 18 тра 2024
- 1 - shallow ship combat
2 - shallow dungeons
3 - shallow exploration
4 - shallow base building
5 - shallow hub cities
SHALLOW IT"S SHALLOW IIIIITTTTTTTTTTTS SHALOW
#starfield #daggerfall #bethesda - Ігри
The way they had (paid) people making videos on how good the game is and saying it gets better after 20hrs still angers me. The one channel that praised it so much and said this 20hr thing made 3 videos and never played the game again. I now have ANOTHER 60 dollar game just sitting there unused.
It really pisses me off as well. GGGManLives is one of them but there were a surprising amount of "reviewers" that released positive reviews the first day the embargo lifted, and for some reason barely any other creators called them out for this. Another AAA game not worth booting ever again.
They did not generate dungeons in starfield at all they were all premade and just placed randomly at random place with random enemies. And they made very few of these dungeons for game that is supposed to have 1000 planets. So to answer your question they could not make better dungeon generation than dagerfall did because there is no procedural dungeon generation mechanic in a game.
Ah I see, thank you for explaining it to me. The game was in development for years and they have a huge team and a large budget and they still failed to put together a decent variety of dungeons and points of interest.
Daggerfall generation consists of very basic shapes that usually are empty, so they mix and match together much better and they all feel unique even if textures look samy. Starfield is trying to do the same, but since interiors and elements need to be detailed they repeat very soon - there are not enough unique elements made for the randomizer for it to look different. It's not that the generation regressed, it just did not have any progress at all. Comparing this to derelict freighters in No Man's Sky its just sad.
Yeah the thing about Daggerfall is while it can boast to have the biggest world map in gaming history, the fact simply is it's 99% empty flat plains. Because it came out in 1996 lol.
It is depressing that Bethesda couldn't come up with a more advanced system 25 years later. I can understand that with the more realistic graphics that empty rooms would be more obvious, but I'm sure if they spent some time they could have an algorithm that can smartly place set dressing and decals around the place right?
@@smward87 For sure, the overworld of Daggerfall is not that impressive because it is mostly empty space, but I think the way the dungeons are generated is well done.
TBO nothing TES after Oblivion is even worth playing.
👍Totally agree, I thought Skyrim sucked the first and only time I played it and it's been tiresome seeing it be paraded about as one of the best RPGs. The games have only gone lower since then.
I think Starfield's procedural generation is based on a seed which is created when you start your save, with only some locations having preset seeds (such as the cities). People have theorized whether it would be good modding practice to base all mods on a single seed so the location-modifying mods are standardized, but without the CK released yet it's unclear how exactly this will turn out.
So if you were to go to the exact same coordinates on a planet in a new run it should be a different layout with different points of interest? If modders can somehow fix this game then I think basing it on one seed would be a good idea, but perhaps the first mod needs to be a generation overhaul.
@@Forsaken.Wanderer Yes I think that's correct, each player gets a unique seed from what I understand. And 100% agreed, the world generation is terrible.
@@PetrusEksteen That is interesting. I wonder what the point of it is really when there are only a few different types of points of interest and terrian deformations, would you really notice the world is different on a new playthrough?
@@Forsaken.Wanderer Exactly, I wonder if it's even possible to land in the same cell more than once if they didn't put the waypoint there. In Daggerfall the seed was pre-set by the devs before the game launched so every player got the same world, so I wonder what prompted them to go with this method.
This will be entertaining. It’s such a shame that Starfield’s procedural generation is somehow far more lifeless than the barely stable version from a 90s game. Daggerfall despite its flaws has some really cool world gen, and thanks to mods it’s now a thousand times better. When done right procedural generation can really enhance a game (Minecraft is one of the BEST examples of this).
Hey Shreknow bro. It's just a basic rant it isn't an exciting or in depth video apologies, one day I'd like to make an analysis but that would require playing Starfield again. You are spot on, how is it possible that a game that came out in 1996 is far more advanced when it comes to generating content than a game that came out in 2023?! It just blows my mind. Minecraft and it's seeds is how to do it the right way. How long did you manage to stomach Starfield?
@Forsaken.Wanderer Makes sense. When I saw it in my recommended I assumed it would’ve been a long video essay since I tend to binge watch those (or more specifically have it playing at 1.5-2x speed while working on something else and occasionally glance at the screen or pause to take notes and expand on said notes in a schitzo post). I also recognized your username, but forgot the kind of content you’d usually post (terribly sorry about that. I suck with remembering people’s names. There’s people I’ve known irl that I haven’t memorized their names). That would be entertaining to see you expand more on it. It’s really too bad that Starfield turned out the way it did. If done right the procedural generation could’ve really enhanced the game, but they sadly didn’t go far enough with it. And the game takes away the whole appeal of a Bethesda game, which is the exploration. The rpg systems haven’t had depth since Oblivion and the story hasn’t been truly good since Morrowind, but even then you had this really fun sandbox to explore with a bunch of cool side content. Then when you get bored of that you install mods that extend the game’s life indefinitely (from what I’ve heard Fallout 76 is worth playing if you do it though GamePass just so you can explore the world and do some of the quests. After you do that there’s no reason to come back to it, unless you like the social features. I come to Fallout for a single player experience, and don’t care about multiplayer in most games).
Funny thing is I haven’t played Starfield because I couldn’t install it directly to my Xbox through GamePass. The thing would make me wait for like 15 minutes, and I’d get up to do something else instead of waiting for it to load. By the time I got back the thing would’ve timed out. Then after I lost interest I saw videos talking about how empty the game was and was glad I didn’t play it. From what I’ve heard even the modders have said it’s too boring (which is a REALLY bad sign). I’ve heard that an update fixed some of its problems, but I’m not going to play it until years later once there’s more content and a bunch of cool mods. I’m sure then it would actually be worth buying on pc. Although, that’s going off the bold assumption that modern Bethesda is somehow able to fix their mess (it would be fun to compare which game is more lifeless. Outer Worlds or Starfield. Both games show how far Bethesda and Obsidian have fallen).
@@shreksnow1918 I also like watching long video essays as well, i'm always looking for more and having one on for background noise while I have dinner or do the dishes is nice. I think we may see a 30 hour long essay soon (and maybe one day a return to informative post-com LPs).
What blows my mind with Starfield is that like all AAA games it had millions of dollars poured into it, hundreds of people work on it, and it was in development for years, and this game is the best they could come up with. For a game released in 2023 I expect an algorithm so advanced that you never see the same layout in a point of interest or dungeon, and the terrain be very unique per planet. They pushed the exploration as a selling point but it feels tacked on. I agree, Oblivion had it's issues but their games really took a massive dive from Skyrim onwards.
I'm sorry to hear about gamepass not allowing you to even download the game, perhaps it was a sign. I'm glad I just played it on my brothers gamepass and didn't pay for it. I think the problem with modding the game is that at least something like Skyrim has a solid base to build from even if it is a shallow game, where as I don't know what you would even build off of in Starfield. Everything in the game is so basic and unfinished and unconnected that it might be easier to mod Skyrim into a sci fi game.
When you see the same cryo lab 25 times... Ugh. Starfield is a turd.
And it wasn't even that spectacular the first time. Would it have been so difficult for them to assign a team to work on producing assets for 6 years so they could flesh out the world.
because it's a shit game from a hollowed out studio trading on nostalgia to harvest money for shareholders.
Yeap like the entire AAA games industry in modern day no creative hands touched this pile of trash