Don't Buy It Guide: Mercedes 107 280 SL
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- Опубліковано 9 лис 2017
- Always found the 107 series Mercedes Benz convertibles to be vastly overrated and having owned one I have developed a genuine hatred for them. The 280 is the worst of the lot...Don't buy one!!
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What a wanker. That is what you get for driving on the wrong side of the road and buying abused vehicles.
1967250s 😁 thanks! and much respect. Your logic is impeccable 👍
Number27 You are spot on with your assessment on these cars, Mercedes and rust, steers like a boat same as my w124 had a R129 as well hard to believe 124 and 129 still using streering boxes,rack and pinion on bargain basements cars from 1969. Car manufacturers got rid of rust merc brought it back in 96 and kept it till 2004, awful paint quality till last year merc parts guy told they got 143k s class in show room orange peel in paint, sprinters still rust only motor left that does. Still have my 124 estate I get into different mode when driving it, Jags and Alfa from same era drive good today these are awfull my 124 not much better. Merc today most overrated car and check under bonnet it might have a Renault engine in it as well
The 280 is a straight 6 not a V6.
Which charm school did you not bother attending!
I have a 1980 280SL which I've own for 38 years. It has 289,000 Miles on it. I rebuilt the Engine, Trans, shocks and breaks at around 275 K. I burns NO Oil, and has never died or needed to be towed.
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why did you rebuild the engine if it didnt burn oil ???
@@lesafighter He said "It burns..." At the moment.
I have a 1981 280 slc ultra low kilometers with only 13.300 km from new.
A true quality car, an icon of beauty and reliabilty.
A true sleeper
What is this? Other than a Porsche, nothing can compare to a Mercedes from this era. We can have different opinions of course, but it's a known fact that these cars are superior when it comes to quality. I drove a w123 for 2 years every day, and it never let me down and the drive was very nice and comfortable. Fantastic cars!
V6? What is your day job?
280SL has straight six engine. You claimed it`s a v6. Look under the hood sometimes...
Quite right and my fault on that one... still hate 107s though..
Spot on! Like buying a house and going on about the gutters and ignoring the foundations.. v6 ? 😂
Scratching my head... Poor engineering? Compare that to a same-period, same-use Jaguar, for heaven's sake.
Just showing himself up really.
It does if you compare it to any Japanse from same era. But even then, the Mercedes engineering quality is acceptabel and its a very elegant car.
I had one dissolved in water mot failure at six years old. Terrible engineering
If you compare it to a Jag, you'll notice it's missing 6 cylinders ...
@@NewtonInDaHouseYo I-6 jags outsold the nightmarish V12s by a huge margin. V12s are status. i6 are dailies. That's what a Merc is about. I DD one, but it's an R129.
This is a gutsy video, presented with humor, and it’s a legitimate opinion. That said, I absolutely love driving around in my 380sl. It’s reliable, easier to work on than modern cars, fun to drive, and it keeps up with modern traffic just fine. And not a day goes by that someone doesn’t wave or give me a thumbs up or stop to visit because it’s a beautiful car that provides a nostalgic and timeless driving experience. Anyway, good on you for a thoughtful and well-made video.
Very much appreciate that you don’t take this too seriously Joe!! I know lots of people love these and that it’s also my particular experience that has coloured my view. Ultimately the important thing is that we enjoy our classics, whatever they may be! Thank you for watching and for having a sense of humour!
It's a bit much to say you were cheated when you didn't inspect the car throughly. Caveat emptor and all that.
The SL from 1972 to 1989 was legendary. I have a 1989 560 SL and I love it. My next purchase is a 280 SL Manual
I think you may have missed the point of these cars. Firstly they are heavy but comfortable - like an armchair. These cars were meant to drive all day on the autobahn at 200kph without giving you a head/back/neck ache. Also there’s the glamour aspect of these cars. Its predecessor the pagoda model basically created the stylish European convertible that wasn’t a Ferrari which would break down all the time. There is a timeless elegance to these cars that were developed in the ‘60’s and sold into the ‘90’s. I can’t think of many cars with that kind of longevity. The only other car I can think of is the Alfa Spider, which is a totally different car in so many ways...and try driving one of those at 200kph!
There’s a reason these cars lasted so long, and yes they rust as every car does but the mechanical simplicity and level of engineering meant that even though they were expensive to buy, they weren’t that expensive to own, and could be easily repaired.
If you want a sports car from this era then buy a 911 - however the old ones will swap ends on you and have an eccentric pedal arrangement that doesn’t suit everyone. You also need to possess a certain level of skill to drive them properly which most people don’t have.
MB were responsible for so many innovations in the life period of the r107: crumple zones, ABS, seals belt tensioners, safety cell, airbags, traction control, anti-submarine seats - all of which we take for granted today, however drive another car from the ‘70’s and you’ll realise very quickly how much quality and engineering went into these beasts.
With regards to the actual example that you bought, well all I can say is “caveat emptor”
Thanks for your comments.. I don't disagree with what you say, particularly with regard to the Innovations in the original 70's model. However for me 107's are just not very nice to drive. There are so many other cars of that period that are far better for the driver. Including the original Pagoda which preceded the 107.
Now how about the R129? (I think I have that right ... the successor, which to me is nowhere as nice-looking, but much modernised.)
R129 is a very good car. Still a cruiser of course but great car none the less and still fun to drive! They're really starting to come into their own those..
They are the last car on earth you could drive at 200kph for a long period, they are like American Cars they need 90% of your concentration at that speed, 911 50% and jag 60%. I had r129 500 and have w124 now drive all day at 70 yes, 200 kph no Bmw yes all day long
My 107 from 1984 drive 20 years without big problems, the only reason this car need a garage (280 SL, 6 Zyl. 185 PS). Outside he is crying and want to have warm temperature. So u have a car what is ur daily friend, not more, cos high speed on the highway...mhhh... ok in the 80´it was ok about 200 - 210 km)h. ---- Before 107 DB i had Alfa Spider 2.0 with 130 PS. That is for racing and 107 is for the older racer. Garage they love both, without rust find ways u never think of. --Have a nice day guys!
I have two of these and they are just amazing cars. I took them all over Europe and they never missed a beat, put them in cruise control and they’ll go all day long, 400 miles to a full tank of fuel.
Some points you make are correct but not to the extreme you say -
I refurbished the steering boxes, did the shocks, gave them a service and got them them tuned; if these are done, you should be ok for another 30 years.
These car go over speed bumps like they’re not there and go through the gear box without you feeling it change gear.
There are good examples of all cars, I have a 300 and 380 and if you maintain them correctly, ie clean the overflows out, then most of the rust you spoke about wouldn’t be an issue. Looking at that Ferrari 308 you bought for 25k is a prime example of buying cheap because that car has cost you £1000s and it still gives you nothing but a hard time…it’s just penny wise pound foolish. I’ve had 308s and old 3.2 Carreras, they look stunning but they don’t drive like a 107, no way near, not even in the same class. You get what you pay for, old cars cost a lot to maintain or get refurbished like they’re new, you need deep pockets to get them right or buy perfect examples.
Useless video - clearly you drove cars that weren't taken care of. After 30 years you need new shocks and refreshing of steering components (coupler etc.) then they are extremely controlled and drive basically like a modern car. Don't blame a car for lack of proper care.
I have the 450SL and it is very nice beautiful car to drive... i love it
I'm glad. We are all different.. main thing is you enjoy yours!!
I find this one of the best cars ever made perfect GT better than the jags and astons from that period and also much more advanced and reliable
Go & drive another car mate ! Nothing wrong with these cars.
I think this is just click bait , when you compare a jag E type against the early 107 cars or air cooled 911 the Merc 107 was massively engineered compared to those , you can find R107’s un molested 45 years old and still driving very well and pass an mot and not much wrong with them . A similar aged E type is just a pile of rust at this stage, everyone of them you see in 2021 has had serious amounts of work to keep them going or a fortune full restoration . Interiors of 1970’s 911’s that have 100k on them and no resto are falling to bits at this point . The R107 40 years old and well maintained is easy a daily if you want , no E type or 911 could be used as a daily that age and not have to keep spending big bucks on it.
Brilliant comment totally agree with your sentiments.
This is a design from the 60s.. how can you compare this with today’s modern vehicles?
I drive my 83 280sl with a 5 speed and 250,000 miles daily and get 29mpg on the highway going 75mph, around the city it gets about 20-22mpg. The power output from the 2.8L is a respectable one, but this guy is driving a slush box auto, i'm not sure if those had the second gear start like the 500sl did (1983 model i'm referring to) but that could be the reason for it being sluggish as you claim. The high mileage example in my car will spin, burn rubber through second gear. I have never had to touch it mechanically and even with this one falling apart with age and neglect its still holding together well. Next I'd try leave emotions or feelings out when reviewing a car, go based off of the market and general feel of it. Its not a sports car, its not a muscle car, don't be upset when you come to the conclusion that it is what it is. Its a comfy couch the cruises nicely, has a removable roof, and has an old world design/look to it. I ended up buying mine from the original owner who imported it to the United States, paid 4k USD for it, eventually i looked up the car's value and found that its at about 34-36k USD over here. I wouldn't call it overrated at all, how is it overrated if the people who have them, care for them, love them, or want them are valuing them in this way? If the market agrees then its not overrated, plus it still is great to drive everyday!
It is said that a manual box transforms the way the car feels!! Have to admit I’ve never tried a manual as they are so very rare! Thanks for watching and enjoy your car!
Number27 I have also driven a friend’s 1983 500sl for an extended amount of time as well, it had some bilstein hd shocks in it and a good set of 14” tires. That thing handled great, steering was still vague as always. But the 5.0 v8 is more than adequate power even when it’s attached to the automatic transmission. It does a second gear start from the factory unless you manual put the trans in low gear and shift it back into drive when you’re moving. Even so, that thing will burn tires on any road like crazy. It even has a factory limited slip and anti-dip components in the back. That car is a blast to drive, handles well, and get decent fuel mileage in the low 20s.
It sounds like you just review the runt of the pack 6 cylinder mated to an awful automatic, only god knows why someone would’ve bought one of those originally. Plus those 280’s would’ve had a light front end and the economy suspension in comparison to a v8 model.
280SL is a straight 6, not a V6
I'm a new r107 owner, I like it, and I appreciate that you pointed out some potential pitfalls.
I had a 450 SL many years ago. It was "ok" but the steering / handling observations in the video are spot on. It really was a boat...... Admittedly a fairly quick one in a straight line......But still a boat !. I garaged mine so probably escaped the worst of the rust issues but I know they were famous for it.
Well you need such a boat when you drive across continents... It's a perfect GT and it has a drop top too.
I just drove my 280 from Las Vegas to Lexington Kentucky. 2000 miles without a glitch. I was quite often went over 100mph uphill for hours. It was snowing in North Texas and rained in Oklahoma. I drive mine to work on a regular bases. It’s a damn good car. I have it for 8 years now..... Perhaps buy a POS British car.... (I also have a few of those). Just did the same drive with my 1960 Healey. Needless to say it broke down after 1500 miles....
Look at when it was designed, the R107 came out in 71, so that means it was designed in the late 60s and put together with late 60s machinery. That car can't compare to anything modern or anything in the 80s, technology was different by the 80s and the R129 proves that. Now when it is compared to something built in the 70s and designed in the late 60s the R107 is far better, much more reliable then a Jaguar and much more better to drive the an Eldorado. I still love the R107 especially the 450SLC
Understandable Elizabeth.. we all have individual preferences. I understand your point about when it was designed but for me it is also the design direction which does not work.. the Pagoda which this replaced was a much more sporty and agile car. I just really struggle with 107's.. would rather have a an SLC than the convertible though!
And they kept it in the production until 1989....
Thanks for this, I looked at a 2nd hand one in a showroom in the 80s I believe, always loved them and I think the styling is amazing.
I walked in and a salesman came up and I asked him about it and he said battery flat come back tomorrow, the next day went back and same guy came up and said "yes mate" whilst doing his tie up, can I have a look at the Mercedes, please "oh we have not had a chance to charge yet". I walked out and never went back OR bought one of these, few stories about roof probs and rust later and then this from Jack, good call. Great design in the way of looks but be careful Folks.
I see you driving a Mercedes in this silly video but you are talking about a Jaguar right?
ingo gunzel to be honest the equivalent Jaguar which is the Xjs drives better than the 107. Yes the quality is much lower.. but the chassis ride and balance is better sorted and the steering is not as vague.. just my option of course! Thanks for watching!
It rains how much in England? Well, there ya have it, my 35yr old example in Texas has 0 rust, so, really depends on the climate, yes?
Dude my family have one of these since 1985 and it's literally the best car we ever had.
Hey, it’s just my opinion.. I’m sure it would suit other very well! Glad you guys like yours!
@@Number27 you're obviously entitled to your opinion, I just believe it's unfair to say don't buy it.
I had a neighbour who had a mid eighties 560 SL. I had the opportunity to drive it a couple of times. My impressions were just like yours. Perhaps because of its reputation I was expecting more, but I was completely underwhelmed.
I always thought I would like one, but I those thoughts were soon put to rest.
True some of the engineering was "sturdy" but totally unnecessary, adding needless weight to an already heavy car.
I remember the alternator bracket, a lump of cast steel that looked like something off a steam traction engine.
Interesting to hear, thanks Russ!!
Hi Jack, I had a 1980 450 SLC which I loved but was forced to sell to release funds at the time. A few years later I bought a apparently excellent late 300SL from a dealer you mentioned and it was bloody awful in every way. The oil consumption on a low mileage car was ridiculous, the engine was asthmatic at best and in short the car was a real let-down. I put this down to previous owners wheeling the poor thing out once a year, washing it and putting it away wet, hence rust issues, and just getting the barest service done to ease it past an MOT. As with any old car they need constant attention, problem is the average owner of these boats is clueless. The SLC was actually a good car and had a history of being looked after by someone who cared. The SL 107 is definitely overpriced and overrated but drive a well fettled one if you can actually find one and it will be a world apart from the numerous polished turds there are around 😁
Hey Nick.. and SLC might actually have suited me better! Also agree that cars that have not been used are trouble!’
BTW I watched this video after taking a look at the recent 1968 Merc video - keep them coming 😁
The SLC is one of my favorite cars! They're rare now though, I haven't seen one for ages.
that advet is from the US, we never has the 560SL, we have 3 in stock at the moment, yes the 280SL is underpowered but we have a 380SL which while obviously heavy, is a joy to drive, try a good one.
ahaha, car build quality from a British dude? you can't even get it that this is an I6 and not a V6! I've had my bright yellow SL and I get so many compliments on style everywhere I go...Dude you're not Benz worthy, go drive your Hillman!
I’m a bit of an old Merc fan Jack, I’ve just bought my 4th C124, a 300CE. I’d be interested to know if you’ve driven one, and if so what you think...they are definitely not sporty, but in the case of the 124, they do feel amazingly well engineered...I can’t speak for 107’s as I’ve no experience of them. I really enjoy your videos, and have no problem with you having your own opinions, even if they possibly differ from mine. It does tickle me to see how many Mercedes fans get rubbed up the wrong way for you daring to criticise the SL. I see that for this particular post you have more dislikes than likes!
So this guy knows every conceivable problem with R107s because he was foolish enough to buy what is really quite a complex car (of the period) without undertaking an appropriate inspection (or having requisite knowledge), and remains bitter about his own shortcomings. The lesson here is to find what appears to be a decent car, and get it checked out by a competent person - and enjoy what is a beautiful car.
I owned 380 sl from new in the 80s, it was magnificent! These cars are now 30 years old and if they aren't restored (properly) or led a cosseted life then yes they can be problematic. Caveat Emptor.
Your lack of knowledge and inability to find a properly maintained example of a 30-40 year old car is not a poor reflection on the car its a poor reflection on you. Steering gearboxes need adjustments, shocks, bushings, tie rod ends, etc wear out all of which contribute to poor handling. The car is not heavy, it weighs about the same as many 2 door sports cars today. I have 2 classic mercedes from this era, and properly maintained, they are a pleasure to drive and ride just as nice if not nicer than a modern german luxury car.
Yes, partly my realisability for choosing badly but even when fixed still hated the way this drives
I agree with Daniel. A friend of mine has a 2yr old BMW 740i and another friend a brand new 330i. I prefer driving my 450 SLC. Bumbs in the road are almost non existent. The drive is extremely smooth. One reason for your steering experience is that fact that the steering wheel is huge. The bigger it is, the more you have to turn it. Just swap it for a nice wooden Nardi classic 36” steering wheel.
Brave opinion - love the R107, but I have never driven one, does your opinion follow over to the Bismerc?
I've never owned one, but I really love the SL C107 coupe with the longer wheelbase. And probably around the last 3 building years of the coupe, it got a new aluminium block engine that was lighter and I assume that the overall handling was improved with components of the successor.
But I do have to agree with you, I believe they need a lot of maintenance and care, because I've seen restoration videos and when removing the front wings reveals a lot of rotten metalsheet in the front and motorcompartment, underneath the rear window and the sides below the doors from front to end. And you have to be cautious not to get in an accident and damage the front lights, cause they are hardly available anymore, since a lot of the American cars have been brought back to Europe and the other headlights were changed back again to the European versions. The German wikipedia told me, that if you van find new European headlights, they go for 10.000 Euro.
But I live the eastethics of the SL C107 and I hope the remaining ones will be treated with a lot of care.
Just seen one R107 for sale and it looked like it was freshly painted, no rust, straight panels and it looked really to be in a great shape. It was really great to see one.
They SL R107 were very popular in the US because of Dallas, but I renember it mostly from Hart to Hart, also a well known tv series, but wiki doesn't mention that.
Cheers
yes, I love my 500SLC, the last year of the C107,1981, was a great car. the components stayed the same, but they were the most refined. I have a '73 (first year) and '81 Last year, and love them both. One thing that is unfair about his video is driving the car with the hardop on, which makes the SL drive like a boat. Without it, it's a different beast.
You seem like an amiable chap, but boy you talk a load of tosh! These (and all other 1970s-80s Mercs) are the best cars ever built. Like everything, they have to be taken care of, but - unlike any other cars - they were designed to be infinitely serviceable. The rust problem is a very well known issue and possibly the only design flaw with the car (and - as such - it’d be very unwise to buy one without prior inspection). However, you have to consider they were the first MB model designed for the sunny US market, not for rainy Tumbrige Wells. And yes, the R107 is a cruiser, essentially a land yacht, it drives as such, and superbly so. I take my 1987 300SL from Newcastle upon Tyne to the Côte d’Azur once a year (besides using it on dry weekends), it never misses a beat. Whether I hit 125mph on the autobahn or swerve it around french country roads, it’s such a joy to drive (yes, it’s no adrenaline rush, but that’s not what the car is for). And when I get to Monte Carlo, the valet invariably park it at the front of the restaurant/hotel, while brand new Porsches/Masers end up at the back. I keep it under a waterproof cover on the street all year, and all it costs me is an average £300 for its annual service. You really can not get so much headturning glamour, rock solid reliability, and ease of use for the money.
It just seems you’ve got a lot of gripe for being fooled in buying a badly maintained car without even kicking a tyre, and you’re taking it all out on an excellent automobile. It really doesn’t reflect good on you, your judgement, or your car knowledge.
Thank you for your polite and considered comment.. I’m glad you love your car, we are after all all different with different tastes. As a boulevard cruiser the 107 does its job well but i can’t help but feel it should and could have been very much more than that! It also angers me that some of the rust traps are obvious design flaws and yet the car continues to be made that way (minus arch liners in te last cars) for 20 years.
Number27 I know what you mean, however the car was meant to be a cruiser, and a cruiser only. And as such it should be embraced and enjoyed. Back in those days, loads of nippy 2 seaters offered more excitement/fun/engagement. Not this one, which was designed primarily for lazy Americans, whether you and I like it or not (I do :-)
Saying the R107 should/could be something else is a bit like saying that the Mona Lisa is a good painting but Leonardo could have made her look a bit prettier!
As for the rust traps, they probably started rearing their ugly heads after production ended, given that most cars wouldn’t have been driven long enough in the rain to reveal the issue so the engineers could fix it during the car’s long production run. And that long production run should be hailed as a success, rather than an excuse to point finger at this Merc.
Anyway, everything is relative: my other modern classic is a C126 500SEC, and it does make the 300SL feel quite light and sporty!!!
@@TheHotshox sold
On the other hand, the SL gave us 911s. So, thank you Mercedes.
huh?
You can't deny it's a fine looking car though.
Meh..
Yep, that's why i bought it partly and because I wanted a V8. what a POS though!!
Any 107 fan knows not to buy a 380. 420, 450, 500 yes, but not a 380.
I drove as a child in a 280 SL automatic made out of aluminium. They are extremely rare, as they cost new double the price of a normal 280 SL. But, they were lighter, and did not rust. I saw the aluminium one side by side to an ordinary one, and there was no difference to be seen. Very impressive but it was also the reason it was never sold. The ride should be comfortable but firm. If not, you need new shocks maybe? The steering was indeed vague, according to my father. I did not drive as I was only 15 at the time. My father drove as a chauffeur as the owner was a (very rich) alcoholic. Speaking about drinking, I remember the fuel use was high for today's standards (14 l/100km) but back then, for wat it was, it was not bad. And they were quick (not really fast) cars. Even the 280 was quick. The SL was more like a Grand Tour (GT). Take it to Milan, Monaco, or Poland, it would be happy and make you happy.
Intersting ... never heard of an aluminium 107 series before, I will look this up!! Thanks for watching!
Now, Jack... I had a 1982 500SL that I kept for almost 11 years, using it as my daily driver. I had almost no problems with it and NONE of the drains ever got clogged; I know because I inspected them regularly. Mechanically the car was bulletproof, and the components durable well beyond normal range. And it was FAST, having a factory-uprated engine. I did have to replace the vacuum distributor, but I did it myself in less than an hour (don't remember what the part cost, but it wasn't much...or I WOULD probably remember). My car never developed any corrosion, but it was well cared-for...and I later managed a main dealer for Mercedes and really did not see an unusual level of rust on customers' cars. There is a REASON these cars have such a following - they EARNED it!! Sorry you got taken, but that wasn't the car or Mercedes' fault, now was it?
Thank you very much for your honest if not doomsday review . Believing in the afterlife I always felt that at the pearly gates would be a SL waiting for me to drive into eternity as a reward for my earthly labours now I feel it would be my one way ticket to HELL ! I heard of the rust problems . I feel that in buying one a due diligence assessment with an MB expert would be the minimum . Which car would you recommend in this class ? A Z3 (6cyl) perhaps ? Great video !! A pity , the car looked great .
I was thinking of buying a 1989 Mercedes 560 SL convertible with the 5.6 Liter V-8 engine with 230 horsepower. Does your comments apply to this car too? Please let us know. Thanks.
drive one and see if you like it. Personally, I think they are a wonderful car, and would happily drive my 500 anywhere.
My 450SL sold today, I could not be happier. I jumped into my 1.6S Capri( one point six!) and it felt like a go kart in comparison.... and quicker
Since when was a 280SL a V6 ? No wonder he bought a dud. How could anyone rely on this reviewer. Doesn't know the product, and didn't bother to have it checked before buying ....
Brandon M V6 valid criticism but it was just a slip of the tongue.. it really doesn’t change the way I perceive these cars. They’re still not very good to drive.. for me. But if you enjoy yours then good on you. There’s room in the hobby fir car enthusiasts of all persuasions! And the con man who sold me the car all those years ago was very convincing.. and I was an inexperienced pup! But again still does not change the way these cars drive. Thanks for watching though!
I had a '81 500SL, and yes the steering is very vague and the throttle pedal is hard and has some play at the beginning. I think they are very tricky to drive with precision and I do not get how so many bad drivers managed to cope with that. That said, I am far from hate them, they are so beauty and iconic...and strong: I crashed into a Honda Accord destroying it while my SL only suffered little damage.
The test driver is only a fool without Mercedes knowledge. The 107 series is one of the best and most popular in our collector scene from Mercedes. Iám a Mercedes dealer, repairing master and Mercedes collector since long. In the UK. only very few 107. But here in Germany plenty and this roadster is very high in price. The prices raise up the last 15 years fast. Every good and original R107 is quick to sell. For the silly test driver it will be better when he check next time only Toyotas UK. cars in very horrible quality but not not quality products of the world best car manufacturer Mercedes-Benz
Why would you buy a car you hate? Like you saw the car, sat in it, drove it and went "well this sucks" and then you just went on and bought it. Logic?
I know what you mean...but Loads of people buy cars they end up hating. Initially I was blinded by the wish to have my first big V8 and the appeal of a cruiser. I'd ridden motorbikes for years before and fancied something more sedate. But i was not prepared by just how horrible and uninvolving these are to drive. My test drive just was not long enough to get the full impression.
Number27
You wanted a v8. So you bought a straight six and called it a v6. ;-)
This guy has some good points in his comment here.
If you came straight from a motorcycle to an R107, I now can begin to understand were you are coming from with your opinion. This is a very heavy convertible based on the platform of the “stroke 8” or “/8” which really was designed to insulate the chassis from the subframes with rubber bushings. The result is supposed to be a smooth and comfortable ride while maintaining some precision. The 205/70/14 tire size adds comfort, but further insulated the car from the road. AMG was an aftermarket tuner in this era, and very simple modifications like 8x16 Et11 wheels make a massive difference in the handling. The 14” wheels do feel much softer than even the 15” that they switched to in 1986.
This car was designed with the revvy 3.5 v8, but really feels the most planted on the rad with a version that has the anti-squat / anti-Dive rear end. This is notable with aluminum rear control arms as opposed to steel. The 280 versions and US 4.5 and 3.8 got the steel rear control arms. 5.0, 5.6, and euro 4.5 (and I believe 3.8) got the anti-squat rear end. That really cuts out so much if the front-to-back rocking that the overly-short wheel base r107 suffers from with the standard w114/115 rear control arms.
Do take some time to look at what the SLShop in the UK has done with these cars.
Hey Mike, this was not mica.. just used it for the test. The SL I ended up with a few years back and that inspired this video was a 1982 380 "straight 8"(just joking!) Euro version. The V8 engine I actually quite liked aside from the terrible thirst! I guess mine had the anti squat rear end you mention? Also I believe the last facelift cars from the late 80's had an improved front end which made them a bit more responsive. Again I have not tried one of these. Of course it goes without saying that others can and do enjoy these cars very much. but it was just not for me. What really rankled were some of the engineering solutions that (at least in our climate) encourage rust.
Number27 you are correct that these cars are NOT for everyone. Now that I see you had a euro 380, I have to take back a bunch. The 86-89 did get an updated front end, but I don’t know if it makes the front end feel tighter than the 1971-85 front end that was essentially taken directly from the /8 w114/115 models, developed in the mid-late 1960’s.
@@Number27 so can you tell us the Car you love that was built in the same years?
"The accelerator pedal is really heavy and I think they've done that because if it was light you'd realise that pushing it up and down makes no difference to the cars forward motion"
😂 Classic!
Loved this review, really enjoyable watch. No doubt upset a few people but meh, this is your experience with them and it's quite right that not everyone will like them and should hear this point of view.
Anyone buying one today would have it as a classic for occasional use. i don't think many buyers would be hammering the motorways all day doing 40,000 miles a yr .nice looking cars. build quality is great if they exist 45 yrs on.
My choice would be BMW e30 325 manual convertible. in original spec.
I have a BMW e34 525 manual. Excellent car. very reliable. go's extremely well. never goes wrong. this yrs MOT was a bulb and a blocked washer jet.
not bad for 146,000 miles 1994 = 23 yrs old.
I would say buy one of these but you can't find any for sale in the UK. they are all safely locked in garages. stashed away.
The 87 to 89 are galvanised so much better bet!
Later cars so drive better too!! Thanks for watching!
So I should not try to trade my Jaguar XJS 95 6cyl for a car like this ????
I agree...don't buy it. Save them for folks who appreciate them for what they are...good cruisers and weekend cars. We have a 560SL and a 280SL and they are two different cars. The 560 is a pretty strong car [1970-80s comparisons] and great on the main roads for long distances [American distances, not shortened Brit distances]. The 280 is good on the twisties, going to visit parks and mountains...[I suggest the 5 speed].
Both have sloppy steering IF YOU DON'T MAINTAIN THE STEERING COMPONENTS. 30-35 years of life and the rubber bushings and steering components are tired - as with any car. Once fixed they drive like new...very nice.
But again, DON"T BUY IT, don't screw up the market for the rest of us.
Happy to help try and keep the market down for you Sharon ;) !
I believe a manual would much improve the drive for sure but in any case we all have individual preferences. The 107 simply does not work for me but I know others love them. Glad you love yours, main thing is to have a passion for cars, whatever they may be.
So did you like it?
+1. .. Nice review, informative if you're daydreaming of adding a SL to the fleet. .. If not, its an authentic, entertaining account of a fellow enthusiast's travels . .. Number27 you're scarring me, I've recently purchased a slightly newer series MY94 E320 Coupe. (USA car) .. While I'd own/drive daily a MY95 E-Class 320 new back in the day - I know the W124 vehicle series.
Bought the W124 coupe from an owner of 22 years. .. Fingers cross - the coupe is being trucked in route to Colorado. .. Rust is not good!!
I’m looking at bying a 280SL. A critical review does help, but remember that older cars are incomparable to modern ones. Not only because of less advanced engineering and technical design, but there also is a ‘human factor’ involved. How ever much reviewers do try, it’s quite a step to ignore the (subconscious) experience and feel of driving a modern car (I’m wondering whether this also is true for comparing English with German, American and Japanese cars - they really felt different then). Also the design philosophy in that era was totally different. For example even in the eighties it was fairly normal to have to do more maintenance, replace shocks, brakes etc much more frequent than nowadays. And more specific for an SL, it was probably more aimed at cruising the German ‘autobahn’ than fast acceleration and driving on twisty country roads (that’s probably one of the reasons why these cars have such a sluggish automatic gearbox).
But still, rust problems originating from poor design are unforgivable of course.
Take your car to The SL Shop in UK.
Valid points about the rust, I’ve just got a 300 and it’s shocking but... going to do a nut and bolt job....if I don’t like the drive it can sit there like artwork 😂😢
They do look
Good!!
Hi, i owned myself a 280 sl automatic gear box from 79, and i totaly agree with the rust problems , when it was raining the water came inside the cabin through the fire wall... I have now a late 1987 300 sl and this disapears!
You should check the bulhead even for the late models , this is the worst unknown place for rust for many w107 sl.
This car stills my favorite one anyhow, so beautifull and confortable, a real icon with old 70's ingeneered conceptions . ....David from La Reunion.... sorry for the english as i am French !
Were the rust problems resolved in later models?
They were definitely better.. to be honest all old classics do rust.. this is no worst than most though there are some silly design flaws
LOve my 560sl with 268,000 mile on it, and no rust. But hey, I really hated my 69 Austin America and my 84 Jaguar Vanden Plas. Road like a motor home and a rust bucket when it started. Cheers........ .
Which model year was your R107?
I understand that rust was a problem in the early years (i.e. when the 380 was built) but improved a lot in the 1980s.
If you take a late one kept in a garage, chances are that the drains were not clogged by foliage and still do their job.
I bought an R129 in 2004 - and probably could have got an R107 for less money instead; might have been the better deal.
I like the R129 - but with the more upright windscreen further away from your head, I guess that driving the R107 leisurely with the hood down feels more like being outside.
And prices have gone up a lot more than those of the R129 (yet)...
Mine was an 81.. rust improved after 85 I think
ok point's taken, but why did you not find a 450 sl or a 500sl to try ?
The later 80's model's were improved. Nice to see an autumnal Goodwood.
Not so a fair criticism, in some part true in some not...
for example
-they changed 1982 the steel supplier so in these facelift models from 1986-1989 are a lot less vulnerable to rust
-the draining system is not perfect, but the 107 was not build for british weather conditions it was build for custumers from texas or the west coast like california... over 50% of the cars went there
-280SL is of course slow, a big V8 like a 560Sl runs like a champ for a car constructed in the 60s
- you have clearly never driven one with overhauled suspension shocks and rubber bearings
www.lndian resale 1970 model benz cars.com
Ive stumbled on this and there are two things that come to mind 1. How fsr youve come in 6 years and also sound and video quality, and i think youve mellowed !
So you weren't able to find a single positive thing about the car? And then you blame people for their logic, your logic is simply impeccable
They look cool, that’s about the only
Positive for me
Oft overlooked by younger people, the other "positive" is that these models were incredibly safe, solid cars compared to the standard of the era. MB I believe invented the collapsible steering column, as well as strategically placed steel I-beams in the doors. I recall reading "crumple zones" were engineered by MB at this time as well: The closed rigid passenger "cells" (as MB refers to them) are strategically surrounded by the intended deformation zones. All of these achievements coupled with the most advanced crash-test programme in the industry, made this tiny car uncommonly safe for the era. I reckon that "useless weight" you called the thick steel and over-engineering was completely lost on you. These were marketed as safe, comfortable luxury motorcars for those who could afford them. They never aimed to be anything like a 911 or a Lancia. I believe the same recirculating ball steering system was used in both the Pagoda, as well as its successors, so the steering can't be so markedly different. If I recall correctly, the steering wheel itself was quite large in a Pagoda... possibly even larger than the 107's. All in all, the later SLCs are a better ride, but that's certainly just an opinion.
Have I failed to make mention it was MB who also invented the ABS? All these developments and features would eventually became the new standard for which lesser motorcars would aspire to. In time, the public demanded such safety features which we now take for granted.
Well I totally believe your car is like this , but have you driven a sl560 88 ? Your car looks great .
I recognize the vague steering experience. But I noticed it’s still a neck turner when I drove it from my storage hall to my home last week. You just don’t see them on the road that much anymore
They are pretty Cars John!! Thanks for watching
This is a fun video. I've owned several 107 SL models from a 280SL 5 speed, 500SL and 450SLC 5.0. I can tell just by the way that you're talking about the car that you've driven cars in very poor condition, Tie rods, pitman arm, idler arm, steering box , subframe mounts front and rear, ball joints, shocks and control arm bushings if not attended will result in exactly the same driving experience that you're describing. They're all wear items and easy to DIY. The 2.8 liter 6 with an automatic is going to be quite highly strung and will cruise around 4000RPM. As far as fuel costs and rust, do what I did and move to Texas :-D
3:55 I believe the 2.8 litre is an inline six.
Yep! Slip of the tongue as used to taking about my 964!
@@Number27 I thought so!
I drove a '78 450 today. The car looks fantastic, but the driving experience was a letdown. It feels large and heavy with a vague steering through an oversized wheel. Coming from the SLK, the soft top seems to have been made for masochists. The hardtop is cumbersome to handle, with the chrome bits easily damaged. I really wished for a different outcome.
Testdrove a 350SLC once. I remember the seating position being very low, i was barely able to look above the wheel.. :)
Apart from that, yes basically very much a cruiser.
Yep, totally. thanks for watching!
@@Number27 what are you guys are 4ft?
I had a 1988 500sl a few years ago. I thought that living in a sunny place it would be a great spare car. In three years of ownership I didn't use it a great deal. My overriding memory of it was the smell of semi burnt petrol when you sat in any kind of traffic with the roof off. It was well serviced so not sure why that was. The engine felt oversized for the car and the performance if it was there was never really accessible. On occasion though I would take it out for a local trip and returning to the car, sitting there in the setting sun on a balmy warm evening with the roof off, I can honestly say there was no car that looked more inviting even if slightly understated. Turning the key had a bit of magic to it.
Harry Metcalfe summed it up well in his very positive UA-cam review (he has one) when he said it was the classic car for the non enthusiast. I think that's spot on. It is not particularly exciting but it draws admiring glances wherever it goes. I knew some owners of similar examples who could have any car they wanted and chose this, often from new. No fuss, not showy but timeless and quite accidentally very beautiful.
I know where he's coming from on this review but his feelings seem very coloured by that earlier poor experience. It could just as easily have been the other way if he'd bought a proper example and had the opportunity to use it as it was meant.
Love your review. I’m 26 and I have a 560. I’ve drive all versions of the r107 and honestly I think you would have had a better time in the V8 cars, especially the 500 or 560SL. The power and torque alone makes me grin ear to ear. Very large difference between the inline 6 cars versus the V8 cars. Overall it’s a good video
I think you’ve totally missed the charm of this car. Maybe as your only car some of your points are valid but as part of a collection of say 3 to 7 cars i think these are fabulous and reward their owners with their character and delivery. They are not sports cars but a form of transport to relax and enjoy a journey and get out the other end not feeling exhausted or tired.
Even this beast is 30 years old. Tell me how your top of the line Ford is 30 years later. As soon as you said V6 I decided to take the rest of your comments with a large pinch of salt. The ad related to a 560 which is a different beast. A 3.0L Granada of the same period would only get 17-20 MPG The 280Sl was around the same. You should validate your data.
Ian Wright some fair criticisms there Ian! V6 has been pointed out before and was a slip of the tongue but still sloppy on my behalf. Actual Fuel consumption on this and any other SL (the 280’is not actually much better than he bigger engine cars) is nothing like 17-20 mpg, way lower and what really stings is that performance is still terrible within that high consumption . Also please drive one and tell me I’m wrong, the experience for anyone who enjoys actually driving is simply dismal. There are so many cars of that time that totally blow it away in that respect. Any BMW, Alfa, Lancia of the time.. not to mention the Porsches. It’s not that in isolation these are awful cars, it’s that they are massively overrated. Quality wise they are of course better than the Italian cars of the era but have some inherent design flaws that positively encourage rust. Thanks in any case for watching and for your measured comments!
I know all about the fuel consumption on the bigger engine. I have the 450SL a 73. I am not sure I would even try to compare the SL to anything Italian, maybe a big Citroen or even a Renault or an XJS. At the time BMW, Lancia and Alfa all had sporting ambitions and with the exception of the SLC Mercedes were really not into the 'sports' market, with most of the rally input coming from AMG which was an independent company at that time. Over the lifetime of the model 250,000 107's were built which suggests people were voting with their wallets. No it was not the fastest, the cheapest to run or buy but it had legs. More to the point there was very little to compare it with, maybe XJS... But their price depreciated like Zeppelins IF the rust didn't get them first. You should get a drive in a 500SL (1980-98) I am told that's a much more serious car, more refined.
Ian Wright in truth I’ve never tried a 500, I also hear the late 80’s facelift introduced better front suspension and geo that sharpened things up a bit so that could be the sweet spot for someone like me. Promise I’ll do another video if I get the opportunity to try one!
First, I must feel sorry for the bad experience you have gone thru. However, it also sounds like the nasty experiences which happened to you could also have happened, to other cars you decide to purchase instead. The fact is :
1. You were cheated (which could happen to a Porsche or Honda, and not just a 280SL)
2. Buyers caveats, I'm afraid you may not have done all your due diligence when you bought it
3. You have false expectations from the car. Any car from 1980's or earlier will have wallowy and imprecise suspension design, that's simply the technology available at that time. Furthermore, this was never a sports car, and everyone knows that it's a sports touring car, and the differences are huge. If you want performance, then you get a Porsche or a Corvette.
4. Gas mileage. This is not a front wheel drive 4 cyclinder light weight econobox, so should never expect miserly gas consumption
I am a very happy owner of a 1987 560SL, with 47,000 original miles on the car. All original, no new paint, nor restoration is needed. My car has always been kept dry and not a speck of rust anywhere. All the chrome on it is still in mirror finish. It's considered a bit heavy for a small 2-passenger car, but seriously built like a tank. Hence, although very fast off the line, I never expected it to be competitive to a Porsche, not by a mile. I am so happy with mine, because it brings comfort and smiles to me every time I drive it. I love it, it's a collectible and I won't be selling (even though many have complimented and offered to buy my 560SL)
I don't mean to show off what a gem I have, actually not at all, I just hope your expectations are more real, and you won't be disappointed. I don't agree with you
Same here. Bad on gas and heavy, but I love it. Will never sell it.
I think you understated the rust problems. It is by far the worst rustbucket I have ever worked on.
Depends on how it was stored
I have a 350slc from 1972. It is an amazing car, most likely my dreamcar. I feel like the reason why you are talking very trash about it, is because you look at the car all wrong. The SL r107 was build for women to drive around and cruise. The steering was made for comfort. The suspensions are made for being very soft and taking the hits from potholes and so on. The water things you said are very true, but bare in mind what it did for the automobiles later on. The slc was the safest car in its time, because it was the first car to have a front and backend that would collapse easily to prevent the hard hits when you crash it. I feel like you are talking way to trash about the car.
Awich glad you like your SLC. Very cool old convertible.. unfortunately for me the driving dynamics are just not good enough. But I take your point about the technological and safety advances that the car made in its time. Thanks for your comment!
The SLC is the c107 not the r107. So it is a coupe and build on the w116 wheelbase, so it is quite a lot bigger.
@@Number27 honestly you don't know what you are talking about, try bicycles, slc is a coupe not a convertible.
"Rust"? What is that? (I live in Arizona, in the states. Does reach 115°F/46°C in summer.) 🙂
Sounds like you're driving around in one with a dusted suspension. My 560sl had original suspension when I bought it and it didn't drive great. I rebuilt the suspension with all new mercedes bushings and bilsteins including the subframe busings and motor mounts....the car drive absolutely magically. It's NOT a sportscar, but I think the ride is sublime and it's pretty damned quick when using the 1st gear kickdown...loads and loads of torque at all RPMs. The 280sl is probably pretty anemic.
Oh dear Jack, these were good solid cars if well maintained, my favourite is 280 SE 3.5 Coupe pillarless. Up until W124.
Modern Mercedes build quality & reliability & depreciation is shocking now!
When I was young and stupid, I love these cars. I told myself “ some day I’ll have one” ,,, now that I the $$$$….I drove one and was disappointed, it was like driving a Panzer tank… great design, superb interior but just heavy,,, At 65 years old , I get better thrills from a 2012 Mazda Miata….sorry hard core MB aficionados…….
This is a funny video! genuinely always good to see both sides of the story, which we rarely see - so thankyou for that!
You missed the point of the car altogether, as others have said its not made for GB its a convertible from the early 70's which had more style and grace than any other car of it's type at the time.
Uk is one of the biggest markets for convertibles
Disagree with you but I appreciate your opinion. I have one. I agree that it uses too much gas. I agree that it is built solid. However I do enjoy driving my 280SL.
best car i ever had
Ha ha love the story about the purchase of your SL , another great video I'm really enjoying the channel Jack keep it up!🖒
Thanks Ryan!! Glad you're following the vids and enjoying them
Same thought on the W123? I'm guessing yes considering they're basically the sedan version.
I own one of those, and sir, I concur with you. Thanks for your honesty.
Thanks for watching!
OMG. There’s SOOOO much misinformation in this video and the comments. The cowl vent drains to the transmission tunnel, and if those rubber tubes are not cleared with regular maintenance, the tubes will leak onto your floors and rot them, which may also rot your rockers, but that is not where they are intended to drain. Rockers should drain any fluid that get into them inadvertently via the holes you speak of, but if they somehow fill with mud and silt tat holds water, yes, they will rot.
The steering box may need adjustment. Sorry yours sounds bad.
The m110 is an iron block with a two piece alloy head. The hood / bonnet on all 107 chassis cars switched from steel to aluminum around 1980. So maybe that’s the “aluminum 280sl” one commenter speaks of.
M110 with a stick shift and revved near the redline is the most fun.
People who don’t know the difference between an in-line and V motor or a dohc motor from a V motor should not make car review videos.
mknmike as I mentioned repeatedly in the comments the V6 comment was a slip of the tongue, you guys can use it to your heart’s content as proof I don’t know what I’m on about but the car is still a crap drive. As per the the other stuff you mention with the rockers and so on can’t really see your point? I know the water is not ‘supposed’ to drain into the rockets but the thin metal tubes that transport it rot, I’ve seen it on most for the 107s.. then the water will get into the rockers. That’s just shit design. The tubes carrying the water should have been made of plastic. They do not only rot if they get blocked up either .. over time they all go at the bottom end. I’ve driven a few of these and the Steering was terrible on all of them.
Number27 the tubes are made of rubber. You appear to be talking about jack hole tubes. The start of the drains are metal fr a few inches where they start inside the blower motor box, but they are rubber tubes that run through the passenger compartment tote transmission tunnel. It really sounds like you are confusing jack hole tubes with drain tubes.
I am big Merc fan had a Pagoda then I got R107 280sl manual 5 shift l have to agree with you on most of your comments rust wasn’t a problem for me as I was living in a hot Country at time put it this way I wouldn’t buy another. Iam now running a 1991 Mercedes 190E Sportline 2.6
Absolutely love it handles better more comfortable better performance.
I will probably get some Flack for this
Thanks for watching John and enjoy your 190!
Hi Jack, I’ve driven many 107’s, I think the car you were driving had some issues.
Whilst these are not sports cars, the ride quality, comfort, and stability are beyond reproach. Yes the steering is light but there is no kickback and these are quality cars and superbly constructed, it’s not the weight as you said.
The very early cars did rust but the later ones were fine in this respect, obviously we have no such issues here in Greece.
I think you should drive a 500SL and report back.
Very happy to visit another one of these at some point.. not sure many owners would volunteer one though!! 🤣🤣
I have a 1989 560SL and it's extremely powerful. If you wanted power, why didn't you get an R107 with a bigger engine? Also, my car is a California/Oregon car and it never had any rust issues.
250000 build in 18 years just objective the car can't be so bad
I have my 300SL 107 since 31 years put more the 300000 Miles on it and still use it as a daily driver ,WHY because it always runs it is dependable and if something breaks it can be affordable fixed.
If you have problems with the steering I would adjust it or maybe it's time for some work at the front axel ,check bushings and control arms and so on they are not good for ever you know ,maintain your car.
The quality of the build of the car is excellent and yes at one time your dashboard will crack ,you don't have to be worry about leather as you have the cheapest model someone could buy with cloth seats .
Regarding rust issues ,again do preventive maintenance and if the previous owner missed out on it don't blame the car ,take a look at a 35 year old Triumph ,MG or Jaguar
Gas mileage ? Sir it's a car from the 70s they were not that great on gas in town I need 15 Liter for 100 KM and 10 Liter on the highway I don't feel like converting it to MPG
The 300SL is probably the best variant! Also has updated suspension geometry at front so steering is a bit sharper! Enjoy yours and thanks for watching and for your great comments!
Test dove one last year, I have seen opine. Its a slow rust bucket with a rubber band for steering. Yes, I have 2 benz's. 1974 450SE & 1999 E320, I love them both. Their GREAT AUTOMOBILES!!
Glad you agree Mark.. just not for me this car!!
which is funny, because the 450SE and 450SL drive very similarly, especially if the top is off of the SL, it makes a HUGE difference
The Brit should have complained about the electroics as well. He prefers Lucas. Not enough fuel leaks for his taste.
Lucas.. the devils supplier! Electrics for be fair are better on this than Italian or Brit cars of the time.
@@Number27I just bought a 1978 MB 450 (c107) slc. There is rust, eats gas, no rack and pinion feel, stout 4.5 L v8 (timing chain?), fully mechanical fuel injection that works well, tough 722.? trans, vast supply of replacement parts online, low entry price, the '78 has a somewhat problematic climate control system. As a fledgling 60 year old mechanic I am able to fix these items without too much trouble because...the engineering behind the car is sound and workable if not perfect. My dream it to drive it through Patagonia to Cape Horn, Chile from DC. I am going to put that down in writing which is probably the best thing that has come out of your video. Thank you. ua-cam.com/video/lDASgtctEQQ/v-deo.html