How Did Pato O'Ward Lose the Indy 500? -- Post Race Discussion
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- Опубліковано 21 вер 2024
- / davidland
David Land and Kyle Cuthbertson discuss the 108th Indianapolis 500 and the historic and dramatic day that it was. We talk Pato's incredible drive, should Scott Dixon been penalized, this year vs last year, and much, much more!
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Daly did Indy proud yesterday.
29th to 10th is pretty damn good in my book!
Conner did very well
We need more superspeedways! IndyCar on superspeedways might be the best racing in the world.
indy at Daytona or Talladega would be wildly unsafe, but I do think they need more ovals like Charlotte, Kansas and Homestead-Miami
@@rowen42069 you hit the nail on the head!
@@rowen42069 agree, but i dont think drivers would agree they do indy cuz its indy but i believe they fear bigger super speedways. MI used to be great too
Indycar on ovals is the best racing product in the world. The last two Texas races were beautiful. Need one in charlotte and another mile and a half somewhere in the west. I’m sure they’d never go back to Vegas because of the one race their (while tragic as hell if they never went to tracks where a driver died it would be like what 4 races on the schedule)
@seannicol7309 that's what I was thinking, it's sad that fontana doesn't exist anymore
That hybrid engine cameo was amazing
?
Fr
Said yesterday and I’ll say it again. I believe we all saw Pato’s origin story.
Bruce Wayne’s parents, Peter Parker’s uncle, Pato’s turn 3.
Canon event
That 3-4 car pass Newgarden made earlier in the race was telling. It was a bold pass that foreshadowed his all or nothing mindset.
... and gave him confidence that his car was capable of that.
I know that the Chevy's were supposed to be equal but it did seem like the Penske cars had a little more power than the others.
@@paulgruber6946skill issue
It was massive as far as I was concerned that bolted him towards the front very ballsy.
It took some real guts for Newgarden to throw his car into turn 3 on the outside. It caught Pato by surprise, that's why he couldn't attempt to pass him back.
He had more horsepower and a huge run. Pato left him tons of room too which was a mistake. Not much guts, it was pretty easily done when u have a much faster car and someone who gives u tons of room. He’s lucky Pato is a clean racer unlike him.
@@heetseeker8017 And was also in the preferred position, which was in second place. In fact, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if he lifted down the front straightaway just enough to force O'Ward to pass him, so he would be in second place and position for the slingshot. Newgarden's from NASCAR country, and that's long been a tried and true NASCAR tactic on superspeedways, because the place to be in a NASCAR superspeedway race on the last lap is second place, not leading. And using the slingshot, he could get far enough ahead entering turn three that there wouldn't be enough time for O'Ward to counterattack, and that's exactly what happened. He may have had the best car, but he also had the best strategy for that final lap.
To copy paste my same answer from Aidan Millward’s 500 review video:
Newgarden had the better car, that’s why he beat O’Ward. Pato had been fighting the car all race, it was on the razor’s edge of the limits with how the team set it up and it showed. Josef for the most part, had a much smoother and comfortable set up and could afford to take a more aggressive approach than what Pato was capable of doing. If Pato had made the move in Turn 3 he would have put it into the wall. He made the smart move in waiting for Turn 1. Josef was just the better driver in the better car.
That’s Indy.
Pato putting all four wheels into that dirty part of track on the backstretch probably didn't help his grip, even Rossi nearly caught him through T4. But yeah, definitely just the car lol
Wrong cause pato was trimmed out and way faster on the straights and corners but over pushed it letting newgarden catch. Josef had more downforce so it was smoother but not as fast, another pato choke race. He snaked up and going down cost him the lead. If he stuck it low and faded up Josef wouldn’t had been able to pass
@@MrNascarfan1 Good analysis! "The Snake" is Bull S#!T and IndyCar needs to get rid of it. The rules have always stated that you can block only once, not twice, without gaining a penalty. Which is exactly what "The Snake" is! Also, Rule Number #1. The quickest way between point A and Point B IS ALWAYS a Straight Line.
@@MrNascarfan1 Wrong. With the car he had, Pato did incredibly well to be leading the race on the last lap. He had a top ten car at best.
Both Josef and Pato did really well yesterday. Pato did not have the car and it seemed like all of the resource at McLaren had gone into the Kyle Larson entry.
Josef was the only driver at Penske who owned the issue with the disqualification. Yet his team were punished the most whilst the driver who was least apologetic and made a very dismissive statement, got zero members banned and then had Rick Mears plus Simon Pagenaud helping him.
Both Josef and Pato got on with it. I am glad they were the top two because they both deserved it.
To come out with rubbish about it being a "pato choke race" is disrespectful to both drivers.
@@timford3599 see data says holding wheel right is faster but everyone lets the car turn natural left because comfortable and it blocks a lane, but the snaking is sucky, he definitely scrubbed a lot when he went left. And was really a moving block twice which is against rule. Pato def had a race winning car, Rossi was too trimmed out and once he got in traffic he was done. I’m glad newgarden won back to back he deserved it. Sucks so many people hate. The same McLaren fans hating for the Penske cheat this year forget last year Rossi at McLaren was putting weight in water bottles and taking it out of car in pit stops..
Great job all month David!
THANK YOU!!!
Agree 100% with your feelings on last year’s finish.
David, Kyle and Joe are both great technical additions to your Indy 500 coverage. But, I'm sure you already knew that better than anyone. This year's 500 coverage has been "The Best Ever" congrats to you and the channel. Edit: I really think that the "Day After" broadcast is nothing short of a 'Genius Idea' as it gave me an entirely new way of looking at yesterday's race through your analysis. I get so caught up in the emotions of the moment. And, this show presents a much more sobering and analytical thought process regarding what actually took place with both of your 'Insiders' look, breaking down what really happened that lead to what I believe was a truly "Classic Indianapolis 500 Mile Race" in very much the same vein as the 1991 last laps with Michael and "Rocket" Rick Mears back to back passes in turn one leading to the win that will always be regarded as one of the BEST ever. PS, I agree that Mr. Hendricks and "The Great Jeff Gordon's" decisions to forgo the World 600 in favor of "The Greatest Race in The World" as being, not only the right way to go. But, it also clearly defined the importance of IndyCar's Historically Biggest Race well over 'just another NASCAR door slamming event which always seems to lead to the 'Big One Crash Fest.'
One thing that I think went unnoticed is I know they mentioned that Penske didn’t play the lead swapping game very well, but it seemed that all started to come unraveled when they were stuck behind Robb and Daly for the first time on the restart. Rossi and Ferrucci were able to break up the Penske gang and thats when the show really began. They had to fight to get back into position and Power just fell back. All in all this was such a fun race with such a great finish
Power's car was toast after he got shuffled back. I'm sure they weren't packing much downforce.
This year's race had an exciting finish organically while last year's race had an exciting finish that was manufactured.
Very well said
Really love the idea of doing a monday video! Great work this month guys, looking forward to the rest of the season.
Newgarden's car was so good high...he must have used his tools to pull that off.
“Tools”
He did use his "tools". They were between his legs
@@arrowlock His car passed post race tech in STP also, if you recall.
What a joke..lying cheater yesterday..hero today!!
The Ending of The Coke 600 was more Devastating than Pato O'Ward's Indy 500 Defeat and that is saying a s**t ton
Big nascar L for that for sure
We need more ovals
I may be biased, but shout out to Illot. He had electrical problems at the start, having to start at the back, then his weight jacker broke and got stuck, and he managed to finish 11th.
Love your channel! Attended my first Indy 500/first indycar race this past weekend and I’m now hooked. Keep up the great content!
good point with Dixon's pass on Rossi, nowhere to be seen. yes to Monday video, yes to IMSA. great coverage throughout the month!
It cost me $20😂😂
Fr I had bet on a Rossi top 3 was looking good out of 4 idk what happened. Dixon must've had a hell of a run
I loved my Paddock seats this year and especially because no rain came down on us or sun whenever it did creep through. Though we just walk over from my cousins house in Speedway anyway so we were able to avoid the rain. In Indy the rest of the week until I have to get back down to the FLA. Will miss this weather here because it is nowhere near as hot here as it is in Laudy. Great coverage all month long as usual Land. You and Kyle da man 💪🏁
The next time Indycar is on an oval, it is Iowa with the hybrids fitted to the cars. That will be interesting to see how it works.
Yeah man, very curious how it'll work out. Those supercapacitors are so small, and the packaging was so compact inside the bellhousing. For the performance it's providing, it's really impressive what Honda and Chevy have made.
This was definitely one of my favorite races of the 26 that I've been to. Won't forget the late day or the incredible finish for a long time.
I was never a huge pato fan (Rossi and Larson are my favorite drivers), but yesterday hr gained a fan. The raw emotion was enough to earn the hearts of many. Will definately be rooting for him in next years indy 500
Yes! We need more discussion videos like this post race all year. Best passed, moments, performances, etc…. I have banging the “indycar needs more analysis content” drum for a while now!!
One thing thing as a casual spectator I’ve learned with this package….do not ever ever try to lead the Indy 500 at the white flag. Wait until the exit of 2 and then draft into the lead going into 3. Pato somehow brain farted and passed going into 1. Total losing move.
It would have been really difficult for Pato to overcome that Penske push-to-pass advantage on the last lap. 😋😉 Great drive by Pato.
Cope
On David's McLaughlin pick. It does happen sometimes BUT usually you have to run up front and fail a few times before you win the 500. McLaughlin had never ran up front before at the 500. He needed this. He needed to run up front and fail; to learn the level he needs to go to win this race.
David thank you for your coverage this month ! i grew up a huge nascar fan, got out of it for a while, and recently came back in 2020 & been hardcore ever since. I was a huge F1 fan there for a couple years and I have tried my hardest to get into other series such as WEC or IMSA, but none have capitvated me quite like Indycar has and recently your youtube has been a huge part of that, still a rookie to it but hoping to attend my first race here soon and understand this whole thing better
Join the family brother. Indy🏁
@@DustyTail 💪💪
Good work this month. Yes, your Monday recap is very solid coverage.
Pato's got the skills, the guts & determination it takes to be upthere. His first Indy500 will come soon !!! He showed a drive only the best among the best can deliver and he's only 25, got time on his side.
David and Kyle I appreciate your efforts for the month of May.
Not a JNew fan at all, but dammit he took that 500 by the neck.
David and Kyle, great work! I've never left a "500" this pumped up. Proud Fandom
I think Kyle is spot on about the weave. If you weave too hard you scrub speed because the tires are slipping more. Not to mention distance covered versus going straight.
I flew into town, for the 100th. Stayed right downtown, across from the train station... Mario & Dario were also there. Possibly others, not sure. Did a wed to Tuesday - in case of rain.
Met Conor Daly at the Plaza across the street,, He introduced me to Paul Page. What a thrill the voice of Indycar for the 25 years I spent in Vancouver and Edmonton watching live.
You are doing great work... Interesting, Kyles perspective of fuel saving?? Is 202 really OK?
Pato not tracking out of turn 2 surely scrubbed some speed. Not sure it was the difference but it had to have cost some speed.
Him snaking up then when he came down scrubbed lots of speed
He had to he was about to slide job. And knew no way had it for 3.
MICHIGAN was always an incredibly exciting IndyCar race.
Newgarden’s car was so much faster than Pato’s that he didn’t even try to follow his draft on the backstretch before passing him entering turn 3.
What had to happen for an ARROW win was both Rossi and Pato had to get past Josef so that he was behind two cars on the last lap. Rossi’s big failure was putting no pressure on Josef.
He probably could have if his fuel strategy was better someone dropped the ball on his fueling
Rossi strategist pulled him in to early. If he could've made the last stint 2 laps shorter he probably would've been running a full fuel mixture
@@Masetr0 Brian Barnhart
Yep, I was saying the same thing in the stands. Was rooting for a McLaren win, and wouldn't have been comfortable until Josef was shuffled back to 3rd.
Amazing coverage guys, congratulations!
Every year keeps getting better and better!
Thanks for all fantastic the coverage this Month of May! Can't wait to see what the rest of the year brings
My thoughts:
1) this should go down as one of the most competitive 500`s in history. The racing for 15+ was super intense
2) the alternate fuel strategies made it interesting
3) need to go rewatch all the moves and strategies by Dixon, that was pretty special
4) the emergence of a 2nd groove really surprised me! Rasmussen was making moves not seen since Scheckter
5) Honda's issues tell me they are done. Reliability issues and somewhat lacking top end speed vs. Chevy tells me they did little to no development in the off season
Thanks for all the videos. You both did a great job all month. Can't wait till next year.
Thank you David and team, great work! From your Aussie mates.🏁
Shoutout Stingray Robb too top 20 finish after leading 23 laps, and Grosjean finally getting through it as well with a top 20 finish as well
IMSA coverage coming back lol. Love that. Did you not catch Colton bailing out of a good car and being told in the garage to get back out there?
Yeah. That was a big mistake. If he had Re-fired and got to the pits, he woulda lost a couple of laps but woulda still been chasing points.
Incredible. Is there anyplace I can place a bet on a team NOT being on the podium? Probably not, because we'd all make billions on Andretti
Nice job this month guys. Well done! Hope to catch up with you soon. Will you be at Milwaukee?
We need at least one more 500 mile race on the schedule.
Pocono, Michigan, somewhere else?
Promote and if it takes a few years to get a big crowd, mark it down as part of the promotional budget.
(I know, easy for me to say, it's not my money)
Make it happen.
Illot was my dark horse pick. If he didn't have the weight jacker stuck on full max, he definitely would've been higher. Still impressive with that P11 finish.
Everyone in the tower terrace was cheering on Pato everytime he passed Newgarden.
And stand E
Paddock was going crazy for Pato as well. More shock than anything when Josef pulled off the pass in 3.
In 2022, Pato was in 2nd and had a chance to pass Ericsson for the lead into T1 on the last lap - round the outside. He backed out, and tried waiting for one more shot into T3 instead. That chance never came.
In 2023, he decided not to be patient. He wouldn't bide his time. He got aggressive. Sent it on Ericsson, in T3, and this time he didn't back out - only to wreck himself out. His mistake.
So by 2024, he'd tried being patient, and had tried being ultra aggressive. This time, he would time it to perfection. Made the pass into T1 on the last lap, and knew that he could defend into T3 because passing there is super difficult.
Only for Newgarden to pull off one of the most outrageous passes in racing history, and rip the Borg-Warner Trophy out of Pato's outstretched fingers.
He basically did everything perfect. And still lost. Thats what made it so gut-wrenching.
Throwing out the term 'choke' in a situation like this is just asinine and does nothing but take away from the skill, bravery and guts of those involved. Pato drove the race of his goddamn life, and as Marshall Pruett said, he 'cracked the code' for winning at Indy - it just so happened that someone else drove the race of his life too, and at the crucial moment nailed a pass that 99 times out of 100 puts him or any other driver in the wall.
The line between winning and losing the Indy 500 is that fine. Arguably the Penske car that SHOULD have won was Scotty, but a knackered clutch and a slow final pitstop dropped him from the lead to 8th. Still gutted about that too 😔
Great work this month guys!
I was not cheering for a Larson win but I did enjoy him remaining competitive. I was bummed out that he made such a big mistake -. He’s used to there being a pit speed. But he made other rookie mistakes too… He got swallowed up on the start of the race …. He missed a gear on another restart. Hopefully, we see him back next year and I think that we will.
Swallowed up? Didn't he remain in the top 10 for a majority of the race until the pit speed violation?
P.S. I have watched Indy 500 and season champs break the pit speed rule too...wonder if they're "used to there being a pit speed" too? LOL!
The misremembering, and outright lying about Sunday's race, is getting absolutely ridiculous...
@@codymoe4986he definitely got swallowed up to watch the restart of the race after the lap 1 crash
Thanks DL, you keep my Indy car fanatics going!!
Was so happy about everything except the rookie of the year , that’s such a slap in the face to Rasmussen
Crushed that Pado’s valiant effort wasnt enough. Excellent analysis of that turn 3 tailwind-scrubbing, momentum sapping snake move.
It was a replay of last year without the crash. So good to watch. That's oval racing.
Great stuff guys. I love the content. Keep up the good work!
David, what about Conor Daly and why will no elite team not sign him to a contract also how do they do the Rookie of the Year voting and how was it that both Malukis and Rasmussen get ROBBED of being the ROY for the Indianapolis 500?
Pato did have a good car. He was gaining spots every time it was green but unfortunately he lost all his progress every time a yellow came out. On that last pit stop I have no idea how he ended up at the front. He was too far back to be contending for the lead. I must have missed some crazy strategy call to make that happen.
When Rossi let off with a few laps left I that Newgarden had it. It was arguably the best race we’ve seen in a long time. Rollercoaster of emotions but a damn good race for sure. Too many competitors to root for, and too many jerseys to wear and koozies to fill. It was once again the Newgardens race to lose but his to win.
Yes keep doing Monday videos❤
I’m just not comfortable that the 100% controlling equity shareholder of Indy Car Series, IMS and Penske Racing is one man, even if it’s Roger Penske. It just doesn’t feel like good governance and gives the appearance of unsportsmanlike. This is not a good business model.
Pato did very well. He made a great move around Newgarde, but Newgarden was able to draft very well, and quickly passed Pato again, Pato could not gain that speed to make another pass.
Maybe next year.
I totally agree. I felt the same way when my Boy Scout Troop went to the California 500 at Ontario raceway.
This was my first 500, was disappointed about the rain but the race made up for it hand over fist
We need more oval races in the calendar, I don’t think we need to have less GPs Formula 1 and Nascar have way more races in a season
McLaren was just destined to finish 2nd and 4th yesterday.
He didn’t say “screw the 600”, he went, to Charlotte and it was set up, for him to jump, into his car, that had been, in the race; maintaining his position, until he arrived. Just as he was preparing to get, into the car, during the yellow flag, the condition changed to red and then, unfortunately, due to weather conditions, the race was declared over. He was never able to get into the race😔
From what I saw the last 10 laps of the race it was Josef being as clutch as one can be. The 3 prior times Pato passed JoNew into 1, Josef would get VERY loose and lose a bunch of time preventing him from getting Pato into 3. Whatever JoNew did on the final lap to not get loose won him the race.
Mastery of the Penske in-car tools. I do mean legal tools. Josef is "The Face of IndyCar" and has been for some time now. But, I REALLY, REALLY wanted Pato or Alex Palou to win the 108th running of "The Greatest Spectacle in Racing!!"
Enjoyed the race but a little disappointed with the outcome however. Was rooting for Rossi. Would certainly like to see these very talented racers in newer non-spec technology with more drive train power.
The driving at the end was epic. The fact they swept the track enabled Newgarden to take Pato on the right side which is normally a big mistake
I think Josef very well could’ve gotten him in turn 3 regardless but he definitely erred snaking that much down the backstretch. That said Newgarden was the only guy who was passing into turn 3 at the end there. He did it numerous times in the last 20 laps.
Also Dixon being third is absolute nonsense. Dude should’ve been a lap down.
Josef has got massive brass units to pull off that last lap pass. And Dixon being an anomaly is now considered normal, but at the same time dragging that Honda up to third is still ridiculous.
A similar thing as the 1988 was the second place car crashed. I Didn’t make any predictions but had a good feeling about Newgarden .
The point about the snake and speed is what i said last year about Ericsson and newgarden. If ericcson had just let his car walk like normal i think he would have repassed newgarden to win
PENSKE owns the league, PENSKE owns the track, PENSKE owns the front row, PENSKE had the fastest cars all month. PENSKE won the INDY 500. It was DESTINY! Yes I was rooting for anyone but PENSKE. I can't be the only one left with a bad taste in my mouth. Glad everyone was safe.
Cope
The coverage was great for this month #DL500Club
I would love Indy 500, the last race of the season, the most important in history, and the one that decided the Indy car championship!!
Totally agree re fuel saving. Get rid of it.
You guys are nerds!...... And I like it! I think IndyCar should put some sort of wicker on the rear wing that creates passing opportunity.
I love how people try to justify their feelings. You wanted their to be this certain situation so that it was a total tem effort. But if there was a late yellow or red then, I guess the team had nothing to do with the previous 190+ laps. That doesn't make sense. This is the real world, situations, and if they happen late early or actually when you want them to. Every driver in the position to win was put there by his entire team.
I sat in turn 1 for my first 500 this year. I got all the crashes.
The world isn't fair. Cheaters prosper.
Still wondering about Herta’s misstep. Couldn’t he just got a tow and replace the wing in in the pits? His error or others? With the cautions he might have been on the lead lap.
100% his error.
Wow…acting like the highest paid “rookie” in the series.
I thought the wheel broke, the steering wheel was turned a little bit but the left front was turned more than the left
I think he thought the suspension broke and the car was wrecked
But yeah, really bad look. He is so emotional, and just quit
You guys are awesome! Thank you
Nobody wanted 3 red flags last year. The only thing that woulda been worse was 4 laps of yellow after only 2 red flags. But agreed, it’s year was EPIC.
Rest up a couple days David, I'm looking forward to your next video on Detroit or earlier if you have something planned.
Kirkwood’s penalty was a terrible call by Race Control.
Newgarden likely saved more boost for the last twp corners of the race. O'Ward did nothing wrong except he likely ran out of his boost. Boost data is not shared so we may never know.
Seems like racing to me...
Great race and the last two years between Texas and Indy the Superspeedway aerokit races have been great. The fact this was the only race where that aerokit comes out this year should say something. We need the 5 for 500k 500 miler challenge. Texas, Indy, Michigan, Homestead, Pocono (or another 1.5 mile track like Chicagoland if they won’t go back after the Wickens and Wilson incidents). Winner of each race gets a 100k bonus and then if you win all 5 get an additional 500k. Replace the thermal club with this
It's a real damn shame that AAA Auto Club Fontana is being destroyed. I've always felt that it was the pre-eminent Oval track in the United States, next to IMS, of course.
Newgarden’s alternative team?
It is pretty clear that the Penske Chevys have just had more oomph than the Arrow Macs when attacking and passing. Rossi and Pato just haven't been able to move at will, like Josef did at Indy, and has done so many times. Arrow just cannot master the engine. Their drivers are great, but I don't think that superior to Pato and Alex. The engine differences are what does it.
Newgarden just comes off as phoney in many peoples eyes. O'Ward completely different. Real as it gets. So was Newgarden's win " feel good"......? Hell no.
💯
Same with his crocodile tears at the press conference, blaming everyone for the "honest mistake" of the P2P thing...
And then he dedicated the win to the engineer and strategist that pulled off the cheat?
Complete PHONEY
Cope
I think the big difference for Larson picking the 500 over the 600 has a lot to do with the playoff system and the win and in. Larson is guaranteed a spot in the show so gaining more points is less important.
Lot's of folks on the NASCAR boards claiming Larson will need a waiver because he failed to start/compete in every race on the regular season schedule...
Noticed a couple news headlines, stating the same...
Feel like McLaren need a lot more heat for screwing up Rossi's last stint strategy to fuel save .
Really Kyle helps your show
Yes, Dixon was at fault. I can't help but think that maybe the non-call was some kind of a P2P payback to Chip and company. Just can't think of why Indycar would overlook such a dangerous block.
Man. This is a tough thing to call, I personally I don’t think anyone was at fault. RHR swerved right then left, Dixon probably saw that and went down to block but wasn’t expecting him to go down in the grass. Dixon wasn’t going to lose his line bc RHR drove into the grass. But, I respect your opinion
@@103racingnetwork 100% agreed. That's the way I saw it as well and even after several replays, I came away with the same conclusion.
@@timford3599 good to know someone else agrees
@@103racingnetwork He wasn't "down in the grass" until Dixon put him there...just saying. Thousands of passes have been made there over the years, right up NEXT to the turf. A veteran like Dixon, shouldn't have been surprised by it...either he blocked him and wrecked him or screwed up and wrecked him, either way, a penalty was deserved.
i remember Paul Tracy did a race winning pass on turn 3, but it didn't quite count...
The crowd in turn 3 was ready for a Pato win. Happy for Josef for sure but definitely would have been chaos if pato got it done.
Any concerns with Herta?
15:15 I've had seats in turn 3 since 2020, its been THE BEST place to sit!!!
Where were your other seats, just so we know that you are giving a fair comparison?
@@codymoe4986 I've sat in just about every turn entry and exit except turn 2 and both sides of the finish line. The only turn apex I have sat in is 1 during the brickyard. If you want to see more than a blur, sit on the outside of a turn.
2nd place at Indy 500 when you are not at your best and recovering from illness is not bad at all. Congratulations!
Maybe get rid of the fuel restrictions?!