Persona 5 Royal | Wasted Plotential
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- Опубліковано 5 жов 2024
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I absolutely understand the basis for this concept and don't inherently think this is a "bad or wrong" concept by any means, though I also feel less of a brutal cynicism towards how Royal presented the plot as is. This could definitely be interesting, and I agree that Royal's pacing takes a strange narrative turn after the death of Yaldabaoth, but the way I've always put it is that P5 structurally had a near-perfect narrative (in my eyes), while Royal has a fantastic commentary and twist on that narrative, but it sacrifices the original sanctity of that plot structure to explore a new facet to the future of the Phantom Thieves. I overall prefer the original ending of P5, but this final arc probably tops it in terms of sheer writing quality.
Oh, and I'm kinda confused why you noted that Kasumi/Sumire should be Maruki's niece instead, since it doesn't really make that major of a difference at the end of the day. If his goal is genuinely just that sense of self-important altruism, seeing a student he's known this long suffering to such an extent would cause him to act, especially in the case of P5R where she was being lead into facing her own trauma by the Phantom Thieves themselves, the only people who can actively oppose him.
So overall, great video and I get most of your arguments here! I just disagree with a point or two here and there!
Also, thanks a ton for the shoutout at the end! I still love my boy Morgana, but he can definitely be a total degenerate-
Oziach love your videos
@@kasperjensen1723 ❤
How can you love Morgana? His existence makes the game less likable
@@Christian-gr3gu I don't know based Morgana where he accepts he is cat
This would’ve worked so well for a Persona 5 Arena…
A smaller story than the base game, but one that allows characters from previous entries and ones that would canonically be dead to still be playable
I'm pretty sure that at one point your party members admit that they all knew about the fake reality just as much as the protag and Akechi, but were so caught up in finally getting all their wishes granted that they didn't want to accept the fakeness of that reality. I think it was either Futaba or Ann who said that.
Subconsciously, yes. It's clear thery're not consciously aware.
Damn I really like that idea as a spin off. Especially because it would help me live out my dream of viscously pummelling Morgana.
There's a Left 4 Dead 2 mod that turns the Jockey into him. It's dope.
@@The4thSnake My personal favorite for L4D2 is absolutely the one that makes Teddie the Tank. It's upsettingly terrifying to see the mascot bear barreling down a corridor.
@@Oziach I had him as the tank for a while.
@The4thSnake off topic but could you perhaps do another Mk miskonception but on “Mk being banned in Japan” I seen LOTS of misinformation going around that I think needs to be cleared up.
The lack of respect for mona is of annoying
I think this alternate spinoff idea sounds really cool because it brings characters from P3 and 4 in. It would be even cooler if characters from P2 were in too
Again it’s P5 not P5 spinoffs this rlly is fanfiction lmao
I mean you can fight the p3 and p4 MCs so why not
I like this I really wish they went with this idea. And also cries in persona 1 and 2 characters. I think you could a work then into this as well Especially persona 2. And I all ways wounded what was all the old characters was doing every game when the Apocalypse started happening. Or why they don't get involved especially when it's a national thing when persona users start showing up on television.
Persona 1 ans 2 might as well be an AU thing at this point.
8:54 fun fact, there actually IS full voice acting for those scenes but they go unused for some bizarre reason.
Well that’s game designing for you
this plot it's actually very interesting, and I mean it's great as spin-off plotline,also great video
Plus technically speaking the god of control was still a massive threat that it took not only the phantom theives but also all of the public massive support to take down the god of control, while dr Marki was taken down by just the group working together as a team.
Yeah Maruki wasn’t near as strong as Yaldabaoth and joker clearly lost his buff from the masses support
@@Allen-yv5xg indeed and you're right about that
@FuckOuttaHere By how much ?? Definitely not a lot, I would say 20% to 30% which even then still aren't as strong as previous Persona teams (mainly P2 and P3 teams).
I feel The whole Spin off scenario you proposed could work well with The P1 and p2 casts aswell due to all The grief they experiencie.
I dont know why I decided to comment on this particular thing but, Maruki being stronger than Yaldabaoth makes sense since he is supposed to have taken his place in mementos, essentially he is getting the power of Yaldabaoth along with his own. There is one thieves den dialogue I think where Norgana says that hadn't ut been for him being the substitute God of Control Adam Kadmon wouldnt have been the giant we see kind of like how Satanael is so big when Akira taps into the power of the peoples wishes
Wasted Potential like that P5: The Animation series.
They should do one for p5r
The only thing I disagree with is that the original final battle was climactic, I personally thought that it was a massive anticlimax to start the game with an interesting villain and then end it with a generic malevolent god. I think it's clever that they retroactively turned yaldabaoth into a red herring in royal
I wonder if Maruki's reality warping powers affected any alien species like the aliens seen in Catherine Full Body
Seriously, ATLUS are terrible when it comes to additional story in their enhanced versions of Persona, and The Royal is the better one compared to The Answer and P4 Golden. I really wished your version was the one we got.
Dziga Yu imo it was bad fanfiction I think it was integrated rlly well imo as there’s hints and nods throughout the game to it and it leads to a more personal finale to the game as Maruki was likeable and for him to be the final boss makes it a lot more likeable and relateable then destroying the world. Now There is a rlly good video on it if you want the link but I will respect your opinion even tho I do disagree with it
Ya, this plot had an interesting idea but execution is not very good.
You know I really like how you really point out how Royal is rush. Royal kinda feels like it doesn’t really had the time to really Polish the story and the main changes were gameplay. Honestly I don’t get the argument that PQ is canon because it doesn’t matter since they forget what happens it’s pretty much non canon at that point
I think it was rushed cause atlus was probably pushed by how many fans wanted new P5 content from them.
Golden Gamer well it ain’t LOL cuz the game builds up this arc well by doing his confidant like on repeat playthroughs you can see hints towards what he does it’s clear he doesn’t get this part of the game
DarkSonic180 yea lol you can’t even do third semester without maxing so it’s fine
DarkSonic180 also that’s the point of a confidant to build their character
DarkSonic180 well then it will feel tacked on to the story
Uh-oh... Here come the rumbling Persona 5 bois with their 5 hour analysis videos about how "The4Snek" just doesn't "GET" the perfect and untouchable, impossible to improve upon Persona...
"hurr durr ps5 logo looks like the persona 5 logo lolololol"
Not really. I'm cool with seeing how it could be improved
@@brandon3174 what?
@@Who-ru6hj so basically during the PlayStation 5 reveal the ps5 logo came up and the persona fanboys were saying it was the persona 5 logo
DAHAKA, GUARDIAN OF THE TIMELINE he definitely didn’t get it for sure and I don’t think really much of anything he said would be an improvement, it would be better how it is.
I agree with almost everything you have to say. Having a debate with Maruki as kind of an evolution of your conversations with him during his confidant is such a good idea. Having one month in the new world with knowledge of the old world also makes a lot of sense. Kasumi being Maruki's niece is alright. Having different party members oppose going back to the old world I also like. The only thing I don't like about your version is it being a spinoff. I think this could all work with just the P5 gang. Also, I don't think Yaldabaoth is weaker than Maruki. If Maruki and Yaldy were to fight, Yaldy would obliterate Maruki. The reason Maruki can change reality is because Yaldy is dead. When Yaldy died, Mementos went with him. Somehow, Maruki found a way to bring Mementos back and use it to fuel his Persona. That's why his Persona is so big, because he's using the power of Mementos to fuel it. Its the same thing Joker did with Sataneel, he used the people's cheers to fuel Sataneel.
I'm really glad to see I'm not the only one who noticed all those things from Royal you mentioned at the start, considering the flag I get constantly for even daring to call out a flaw in it. Really good video!
I'm glad more people are talking about this.
Junpei's GF surviving is actually one of the changes kept from Portable if the Arena games are anything to go by, so Junpei wouldn't really be impacted that much. Also Elizabeth's whole multi game spanning arc is finding some way to save Minato/Makato, so while P3's ending won't be undone, the P3 protagonist does need to be saved sometime in the future if there is to be any satisfying conclusion to that arc.
That would mean Elizabeth needs to destory the thing that minato is holding back cuz doesn't the answer show that minato is guarding the manifestation of death?
@@Kupomasters57
Death is Nyx, the thing Minato is guarding against is the manifestation of mankind's suicidal tendieces. But yeah, Elizabeth will need to stop that thing once and for all.
@@TheSwordsman100
Or have it to where Elizabeth goes on a journey in which she learns and comes to an understanding on why he died. In doing this the themes and integrity of Persona 3 are preserved. Along with that, if done well, Altus can redeem themselves a bit for The Answer. There shouldn’t be a repeat of the schlock that is preventing Chidori and Shinjiro’s deaths in the following remasters for fan service.
@@thesupremejawline5016
I'm sorry but I disagree, that would make Elzabeth's plot pointless and a rehash of the Answer's plot. Though luckily for me in canon Elizabeth already knows and understands why he died but is determined to save him from being a door anyway. Also just because you don't like Chidori and Shinjiro surviving, doesn't mean everyone wants them to stay dead, so YMMV on that being "fan service". Heck Shinjiro actually stayed dead in canon as he could only be saved by the female version of Minato/Makato. An actual good remaster would combine the different versions of P3 so that the continuity stays consistent with later games and so that every important detail is in one game. Also despite all your talk of themes you apparently missed the one regarding the protagonist's main personas since the survival of Chidori bothers you so much.
Sad no mention of Nyarly among the series best villains.
No one cares about p1 and p2
@@gejamugamlatsoomanam7716 sure.
Damn. This coulda been the plot of Strikers. Strikers definitely fumbled the bag violently with it's narrative, especially at the end when they started regurgitating the same debate every 36 seconds. Damn.
Funny how they had 2 opportunities to connect P5 to the previous games easily but took neither.
I have no clue why the kirijo group isnt even mentioned in P5S when their whole shtick is researching shadows and personas, so siri recreating the metaverse and bringing them back wouldve definitely interested them, and made a whole lot of sense for bringing SEES and the IT back.
This is also considering how when you think about it, the IT and the phantom thieves clash in many of their ideologies.
Heres hoping the one day make a P5AU just to finish the phantom thieves story, bring back the IT, and have every phantom thief unite (AKA have both Sumire and Akechi meet Sophia and Zenkichi)
Ya I agree. This would have been much better.
It's really funny you mention that the ideas in Royal would be better served in a spin-off which is exactly what happened with Persona Strikers basically being the premise of Royal's content but just better in every feasible capacity.
I kinda want to say this first maruki was never meant to challenge the group on a physical level by all accounts he’s a inexperienced persona user who skated by just because he was naturally strong. The only way he could have won was if joker sided with cause the second everyone decided to not go along with it he lost. Now making this a spin off that includes the P4 and 3 cast kinda makes the story more complicated then it needs to be while messing with the message. Cause now instead of just comparing maruki to the thieves your now comparing them to other groups that stand for other things. I also feel like it was fine as is with royal but what it would have really benefited from was one more palace one that takes place during the third semester allowing for more time to see the new world and experience it while also severing as a good way to get violet caught up with the rest of the thieves.
Honestly I think 3rd semester is... beautiful the questions it asks are so good and no one is wrong if they go either way I like that
I genuinely think the royal content is some of the best content and writing in the game, which is why the missed potential is so much more frustrating. I don’t know if it’s just me but the feeling of beating the final vanilla boss and the original ending were so climatic and great that the fact that the meta verse sort of just keeps going a few days later feels weird. I think the vanilla ending was perfect. On the other hand tho I think Maruki and the storyline in the third semester has so much potential. I think they should’ve stuck with the vanilla ending and made royal it’s own full sequel and made persona 5 a duology like persona 2. I think if they had expanded that story arc maruki would’ve been a great main antagonist of his own game. Also would’ve allowed for Kasumi and maybe Akechi to be a party member for more than 1 palace which would’ve added to the impact of their own stories. Add that to the actually great gameplay changes royal made and it would’ve been something special,
Post Royal Maruki thought might be an interesting thought. As well at the time to regain access to lost knowledge despite them being dead moments ago. I would rather have it as part of P5R then a separate game because Akechi is massively improved from being my most despised to being one of my favourites.
Btw a huge video of you analysing the vanilla P5 video or videos Would be awesome.
That's my territory. 👀
Persona: Eyes of Heaven
Aight, I was skeptical going into this, but the scenario you proposed actually sounds REALLY cool. Like, I have 0 problems with the 3rd Semester as it was originally, but your idea sounds very interesting as well.
Imo not it sounds like bad fanfiction
@@raidoukuzonoha883 so its bad fanfiction because you didn't come up with it?
Ez Scotsman no imo it’s rlly bad
@@raidoukuzonoha883 persona fanboy mad lol
Ez Scotsman or it’s just my opinion yknow
3rd semester feels a step down from beating yaldaboth
If I already loved the third semester as it is, imagine it as a full game
You know what would have been cool, if wakaba realised that she was a cognition and try to set futaba straight
It...Could Use a Couple of Dungeons to lengthen the Plot and actual depictions and hiccups in Maruki's Reality Warping, Moments in the Plot That Show Maruki's altering of certain bad moments leading to worse ones or going into 'What Dreams Maruki Deems Unworthy' or 'What Dreams Maruki values to his perspective over others' probably show certain biases he holds showing that he still has human failings despite his cosmic powers to show the Downsides of Maruki's World.
This plot sounds 10x better
Ok. Let me digest this again, Akechi goes back to the grave after Royal Events?
.
.
.
.
.
.
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YES YES YES YES.
It's kinda vague, because he briefly appears in P5R's true ending and it's not even confirmed if he actually died the first time around either.
@@thatperson1022 didn't he turn himself in on christmas? like right before maruki's world?
Joel That was during Maruki’s control, his power and influence kept growing throughout the later half of December and you only fully realize it when it’s around January.
@@somaoni8806 oooh...i didn't notice that
It's likely that Akechi is still alive. Even in the vanilla events, it's not explicitly said that he died. Just fell off the radar.
I think the biggest missed opportunity of Royal’s story was how they handled Sumire. It makes absolutely no sense that Maruki doesn’t just bring Kasumi back to life like he did with the other character’s dead relatives. You could have actually had an interesting dynamic, with the newly resurrected Kasumi joining Joker and Akechi against Maruki, with Sumire siding with Maruki, not wanting to lose her sister again.
Also I kinda wish that Akechi got more of a focus. He is the one most opposed to Maruki’s philosophy, yet he really doesn’t get to do much.
The reason he didn't is because that isn't what Sumire wished for, she didn't want Kasumi alive, she wanted to be Kasumi
Considering that Yukari's feelings for the Minato are canon, I really wouldn't want her to live through losing him again. She's my favorite girl from Persona 3, and it doesn't seem right to put her through that again. Then again... Persona 5 Arena may do this anyway if Minato actually comes back, even if it's only for a little bit.
Edit: By the way, respectable choices for love interests.
Always felt the final arc was way too short, character's and their development were never flushed out. So much more potential to really explore the alternate reality and their daily lives, but THIS... this just took the all the air out of my sails by how amazing that could have been had they gone this route. As much as i really loved and enjoyed the game, this story you presented could have given it so much more replayability as I felt P5 overall didn't have the replayability factor that P4 had.
I personally loved persona 5 royal it was really awesome and fantastic
Oh god he’s making a wasted vid on my favorite game...
*HOOOOOOO BOOOOOOOOOOY*
Imo Persona 5 Royal doesn't do enough to justify being an entire whole new 60$ game from base Persona 5. For all the good it did, for example giving Haru just a little bit more screentime so she doesn't come out of nowhere and becomes the final permanent party member right before the games climax, it missed out on tons of opportunities. The ultimate persona awakenings in royal? Where you visit their rooms? That's pretty cool, you don't get to see any of your friends houses in P4 but you can see the rooms in P3/P3P, so its nice to see how the characters kind of live their lives, but at the near end of the game? really? Not even best bro Ryuji ever invited Joker over to his house to hang out once?
Maruki having a persona in the real world that can change cognitions on a small scale is... weird. Personas in P3? Evoked from the sea of unconsciousness by feeling death/mortality, hence their Evokers. P4? Accepting your shadow, your other side and making it your power(only in the tv world). P5? Manifests from your spirit of rebellion- that applies to all persona users in P5 except for Morgana and Maruki; Morgana being a creation of Igor who is given a persona so he can aid Joker. However, what is Maruki rebelling against? I'm glad to see an actual adult persona user (cough persona 2EP) but what is he rebelling against, reality? He hates the reality of what happened to Rumi so much that he awakens to a power OUTSIDE of palaces that can affect the real world? What?
And of course as you mentioned, the Persona 5 base game ending is kinda tossed aside here for Royal. The hearts of the people turned the tide and gave Joker the power to summon Satanael and defeat Yaldabaoth? lmao nope all of yaldy's power went to Maruki out of nowhere for some reason. All his friends fall to Maruki's false reality, even after they defeated a literal god of control who gained his power through the masses of the people who wish for a supreme being to make all their choices for them? The phantom thieves just stood up to a god that controlled the peoples lives, how did they just wake up under Maruki's illusion that was controlling their lives?!?!?
Kasumi is fine, i thought her scenes throughout the game before her main role were alright, except for when she stumbles into an unknown palace (Marukis) randomly into the game and gets a Persona... But doesn't do anything with it until the third semester except help Joker in Sae's palace (not that he needed help in the 1st game lol)
I could go on, and dont get me wrong, P5R is great for most of its new content, like having unvoiced scenes from P5 being voiced in P5R, but something about the game to me seems hollow... like it could have used alot more to it.
Can I just say, what the heck was the point of her showing up in Sae's Palace?
Buster Sword User to me it did seem forced because in the OG. Joker made it out without no help until he got caught. But I think I know where they were going with. Kasumi really cared for Joker and wanted to help him even though he doesn’t believe in what the phantom thieves stand for. He has helped her throughout the game and she was trying to return the favor. That’s my take
You got me off board the moment you started to bring in Sees and the Investigation Team 😅
First of all I wanna say I think a lot of your criticism is illy formed. They did fully explore Maruki’s Methodology, from frame 1 of his council sessions you are GETTING those bits of him. Subtle characterization begins at his poor practice, from how he pries to his conversational structure
The hypocrisy is there, it’s brought up, Maruki wants to make the world a better place but the thieves oppose Maruki because he has to become the ultimate authority, he leaves no room for personal struggle and growth, while he is a good person and would be a good god of the new world, he is no better than Yaldabaoth and YHVH. He is much more complex and moral for restoring the world to eden but without it humans have no true free will, the romanticism of Satan in this piece of Japanese fiction sees it almost as a religious empowerment to be free from your shackles. The freedom of choice given by Satan in Persona 5 is constantly alluded to and is the reason for Joker’s ultimate persona. Maruki theoretically can create the best world but humans should be able to choose their own path which is more important to the human whole.
Stealing hearts is to allow those to choose their own path by depriving those in power with corrupted sin, letting people use free will to make your own life and stop those in positions from decaying society. That’s way different from Maruki.
You shouldn’t even try to incorporate the characterization of SEES, they already went through the grief in the answer they all grew and changed and understood you have to let go, they would never fold again to a false reality tbh. It also makes this theme less consistent and personal with the phantoms as you flood in this mass of 20 extra characters. It also takes the MAIN themes from being more about intentionally false perceptions and trying to escape/conform to reality more about the main theme now being about coping and death which would be an explicit retread of 3’s MAIN themes which would only smother 5’s incredibly unique identity.
Your idea is cool and the idea you have to actually try really hard to get certain characters to leave the false reality to have a full team is a great idea though
Also idk the niece part and aging part you brought up was kinda nit picky, Maruki is altruistic he’s not gonna let anyone he sees suffer from pain, dysphoria, and depression continue to suffer, Sumire doesn’t need to be motivated to inspire and drive him.
I agee with you. Also I would like to add that homeless people still existed in Maruki's "perfect world". As well as people who were suffering and got requests for in the new semester.
The thing I agree on the video on was Maruki shouldn't have taken away their "altered reality gifts". I would have liked to seen more about how the characters had felt with things around that "made their lives easier". Seeing Makoto and Sae with their dad would have been nice. Have those dead loved ones have more of a weight to them being brought back would have been nice.
insane2201 glad you picked up on that! Also that idea he had wasn’t bad but I feel like it would receive the same criticism from him if Maruki didn’t take them away? Because then Maruki seems like remorseless putting those loved ones in their life and letting them linger when they don’t wish for it. Maruki is a fighter and he’s willing to defeat the thieves for his world but he’s not a sore loser. He drops it when he’s defeated and tries his hardest to convince them consensually until he wants to use force in the finale. And even as he uses force he tries to call out to them in battle trying to pull on their admitted wants and loves.
@@insane2201 Late to the conversation here, I know, but I thought I'd point out that it doesn't seem like Maruki took anything away. He is using Mementos to overwrite reality, which would mean that if your cognition changes, he can't actualize it anymore. Anything you believe can be true, but if you actively *don't* believe it, he can't make it so.
Forget about P5 or a spin-off, there's enough potential in Maruki's completed reality for a Persona 6.
Those are some neat thoughts, Snake! Say, how about doing one more Persona related WP, but talking about Atlus ignoring P1 & P2, and how that can be fixed? These games are great and newer generations of Persona fans should be exposed to them.
P1 and P2 are closer to SMT games than current day Persona, and Atlus seems to want to make the divide between mainline SMT and Persona as big as they can for whatever reason.
I really liked how the Royal part was implemented in Persona 5, I found Maruki as an excellent antagonist, and I found Yoshizawa as a character that got implemented in a decent way (at least better than Marie), but I really liked your ideas, it would be very interesting as a spin off.
An antagonist who got beaten by *The power of friendship* ,
nyarlathotep find this pathetic , who would do everything to win own game
Such a coincidence that 2 consecutive WPs involve characters having to get some emotional hook with their revived love ones due to some reality changes.
You spoiled the final villains for Persona 3 and 4 for everyone without warning them. Normally, I'd think that meant that you think people should've played them before 5 or just shouldn't care about spoilers, but then minutes later you put an actual spoiler warning for them.
Both 3&4 are over 10 years old and anything after 5 Years of age is free to be spoiled without a warning
ALL-STAR GAM3RPUNK If that’s true, why did he feel the need to warn about spoilers for 3 and 4 later in the video?
While I did enjoy Scramble's story I feel like even the way it ended in the inevitable next spin off they could treat it like it never happened by conveniently excluding the new characters and by not mentioning any of the old events since they likely barely matter anymore. If they actually DO include the events I will be impressed. I am still not even sure if Scramble is in the same universe as Royal.
It's not scramble fallows after the events of vanilla p5.
@@Kupomasters57 strikers is in the same boat as persona 4 arena. It’s canon to persona 5 royal even if it doesn’t mention royal. Because in any future crossover events the phantom thieves will include zenkichi and Sophia.
I don't care what your opinion on this arc is it has one golden moment "I am a bit occupied so do your damn job"
I did not expect you to make a video on this
Watching this really makes me want some type of video from him on Persona 4 Arena, between the story and in game animations that's one of my favorite games of all time
This idea for what royal content actually sounds pretty interesting. Even as a spinoff. I still love the game anyways but knowing it could have been even further explored to even include the P3/P4 cast really makes me wish for something like that instead
I'll watch this video once I am done with Persona 4, Persona 5 came up on PC, and I am done with Persona 5.
I love Royal. I love Yoshizawa and Maruki as they are. I love what they did with Akechi. But man... This would be an amazing plot for an Arena game. This way we can naturally re-introduce the P3 and 4 gangs, we can get Minato and Shinji as playable characters, and we can still have proper canonicity, unlike the Q and Dancing games. I wish they'd come up with a similar plot for the actual P5 Arena... With the changes that we add the Scramble gang, make Yoshizawa naturally part of the PTs, and introduce Minkao in place of where you suggested we place Yoshizawa.
Minako is a straight up fabrication of Maruki's actions, as she is more positive and energetic of Minato, and is the very reason Shinji lived, but this makes it so that she would straight up cease existing if they are to defeat Maruki. That arms her with a very strong motivation to try and stop the... I'll call them the Phantom Operatives because that's cool and makes sense, from interfering with the actualization, and makes the eventual choice to ally with them very impactful, joining the ranks of Minato, Shinji and Akechi. And yes, I *did* have to make up a super contrived reason to have her in the game.
Still would fuck with P3s themes which no surprise snake doesn’t get
> Ann is your fav P5 Party Member.
Disgusting. 🤢Abhorrent. But understandable. Have a nice day King.
Someone needs to type up a fanfiction of your supposed Persona 5 Royal story. It sounds sick!
So when will we get Wasted Potential The Last Of Us 2?
As cool as the new idea is, I'm ok with Royal as is. Fixed some issues with the original while adding Yoshizawa who is adorable.
But I do agree that the third Persona stuff in 3rd Semester should have been voiced.
Also, Mitsuru, Yukari, Chie, Naoto, Futaba, Yoshizawa and Kawakami. Yukari, Chie and Futaba most of all though.
So this is the first time in forever that I disagree with everything you've said in this video. About the new content being poorly integrated into the original story, about Maruki not being a fantastic villain as he is, etc. Nothing about Royal was "wasted" to me.
Agreed
@DarkSonic180 No, you just have a narrow minded idea about what constitutes good character writing. I get not liking his personality because you dislike "boy scouts" or whatever though.
verymelonman12 how very pretentious of you
@DarkSonic180 he isn’t tho... ? Did you play the fucking game
Your story is pretty solid, and I always wanted to see a bit more of Yosuka and Saki together since they have an interesting story in P4. That begs the question though, what would Teddie's ideal reality be since by the end of P4 he pretty much has everything he wanted.
As for your idea of exploring other characters in this ideal reality, apart from the main cast, I would really like to see Mistuo's ideal world, even if he is by no mean a redeemable character.
Also Minato in HD is a yes. ^^
Most of the Investigation Team haven't really lost something and their main issues have been resolved in their social links. Maybe have Kanji's dad and Naoto's parents back.
That idea you talked about, I think it could actually work as a DLC plot point for a Persona 5 Arena game as a sequel story of Persona 5 Royal where perhaps someone sees the potential of Maruki's ideal reality and decided to bring it back once again, but this time, instead of us seeing how it affects the Persona 5 characters, it's all of the characters who would be part of the game.
10:25 wut
Koei. Did the plot on their own?!
Adding some p1/p2 stuff to this idea
Maki is ideal maki
Alfred is alive
All of the Snow Queen victims are alive
The p2 cast remember each other without the universe ending
Damn that spinoff idea is too good
The problem with your proposed spinoff story idea is that the P3 cast would be in their mid 20s at that point. That's ancient and unappealing by current day japanese protag age standards.
Hello it's me , Mr. Nitpicking here . Kinda surprise you left Adachi out of the wildcard group since he is one of them and he conviction to play by the rule would absolutely be strong enough to resit maruki's brain wash . Maybe we can make his plot that after meeting Yu again , he just pretended like nothing is wrong and just keep secretly watching the group from the shadow while trying to solve this mystery . Letting him confront maruki could bring up some great qquestion since by erasing everyone free will and the mistake they've make , doesn't that just mean they get a free get-out-of-jail card ? And how he dealt with someone that toy with the power of god to change reality because they want to escape from it ( like he did but adachi does actually have a body count unlike him )
I agree especially the part where you mentioned theodore. He has a lot potential. I have noticed that Atlus has sidelined and made him look lame. I they could bring back persona 3 female mc. Make them look like some sort siblings or cousins.
You should make a Persona fanfic based on this idea, you know? The ideas you presented in this video are amazing!
It’s bad fanfiction tho
Your idea is actually good, I liked it more, than what Atlus actually did. 😎
This is what I think too. They needed to keep the original p5 as it was and then (around Feb or Mar AFTER he's out of jail) they start up the Maruki storyline. It could even go into Ren's 3rd year (because Maruki made his parents change their mind about having him come home). I think having Yoshizawa as a villain instead of someone who joins the party would be more interesting, have her as a foil (you can even have her work through her trauma and still decide to side with Maruki, with her reasoning being a rewritten reality is just as good as the old one).
You don't need the other cast, I'd prefer it just be the thieves but I've never liked each group having their adventures in the same universe, the rules of magic change a little too much between games and it begs the question why they don't get involved in the adventures of the others.
considering theirs quite a bit of cut content, the chinese build even maving cut voiced lines, i suspect they may have had issues trying to integrate the old and new, and getting more content in the new month.
also nothing on Joker's third evolution being paid DLC instead of used on Adam Kadmon?
God I hate the fact that Raoul is paid DLC...
While I still adore Royal as it was, you make some great points and now even I wish it was a spinoff.
10:33 For me it’s Yukari, yukiko and makoto for party members and
Chihiro, yukiko and Kawakami overall
actually the Arena games kinda imply that the Q games have a subtle sway in the plot. For instance, the Shadow Ops and ITs should have been distrustful of each other but they seem to get along quite well.
and well
Rei and a connection to Labrys.
Says my favorite game has plot issues. That's fair.
To be fair P5 only has 1 spin off that's canonical and advances things forward is strikers as it does actually develop the cast beyond how they started originally. So for your idea to work you'd have to outright cancel strikers or have that idea take place after the events of strikers seeing as how part of maruki came from the ideas of strikers where some of bosses were like early version ideas of him and even led the phantom thieves to question themselves in a interesting way.
The idea you suggested isn't a bad one. In fact I outright agree the new content in royal should've been it's own full game as closing third part story when you tie it in to the original and strikers making for a complete trilogy.
All of the new content in P5R story wise has so much potential and while some of it does work fairly well, so much of it feels underdeveloped or cut off, like a lot of Kasumi's character. P5 is already such a cramped plot, so much happens with little breathing room, and then you have this new character who has a lot of mandatory scenes and feels extremely out of place.
P5R's new story content could've been amazing, had it been better spread out, or its own separate game entirely.
The issue with the spin-off idea is that Minato/Makoto has the universe arcana which made him pretty much a god (like how he knew that he had to seal Nyx from Erebus and not like try to attack her or something, it definitely was something related to that) so he'll definitely realize that something is wrong right from the beginning.
I haven’t played persona so I won’t watch because spoilers but I will just let the video go on muted to give you the views, keep up the good work
I genuinely enjoyed The Royal and the added content but yeah I definitely agree with your points, Snake.
So fire emblem mix with persona characters like so kinda tokyo mirga session.
Sooo..Basically The Doctor at the school said, "Hey, Wanna see dead people come alive?"
I would just like to know how they could have created an entire game with just one palace though. Not to say that your hypothetical story wouldn't slap harder than my dad, but I don't know how this game of your could last more than maybe around 20 hours which is pretty brisk for a persona title.
Also your taste in waifus is basically perfect, I basically agree with everything you said at the end of your video.
0:58 I don’t really get your complaint about Maruki giving extra time to the phantom thieves to think it over if they should live in his fake reality again. His actualization still needed more time to fully effect everyone and it was implied that the phantom thieves still end up getting affected by the end of the month, even if they rejected his reality the first time. It honestly wouldn’t have matter either for him since they would succumbed to it either way.
Yea saying Maruki felt rushed lol
DarkSonic180 I felt like you and others just fast foward his confidant lol there’s a reason he’s popular LOL man you people shouldn’t skip the dialogue
@DarkSonic180 if you don't like his character that's completely fine, but calling him one dimensional is simply not true
DarkSonic180 I feel you just skipped through his confidant with that fast forward button LOL
DarkSonic180 that’s the point of confidants
I had my own ideas of how to integrate Royal's shit into P5 also.
For one, my problem with Royal is that I feel like it strays from P5's theme of rebellion, going for more of a "seek the truth" thing, which would fit a P4 spin-off more (but we've had enough of those and I don't think enough of the P4 cats have had tragic backstories for Maruki to change via a fake reality).
So my idea was that Maruki is PART of the Shido conspiracy, using his cognitive psience research to aid Shido and Akechi in exchange for funding for his research. He could have a speech about how not everyone can just snap their fingers and change people's Hearts like the phantom thieves, and sometimes they just have to grit their teeth and endure the BS that life throws at them. Like maybe Mementos is the clean pristine one you see in the post-game and it gets more corrupted (like vanilla) as you go forward. Like a villain could go "Look at all this chaos the Phantom Thieves are causing" when really it is them exposing the evil that was always there under a pleasing mask or just ignored due to apathy.
Once you get to Shido's palace, you see all three of them, and using Metaverse BS, they kick you out, but as a way to keep you all docile, THIS is where Maruki does the fake reality. Here, it is a bribe meant to keep the Thieves quiet until the election. Like an authority figure patting you on the head and giving you a snack for being a good boy. Maybe even have Akechi interact with Wakaba and Okumura, the people he killed, and see his guilt and subsequent resolve.
As for Yoshizawa, for this idea, I was wondering how she fits in since she isn't much of a rebel since she had no authority figure looking down on her. So I thought she could represent the viewpoint of "Just because you haven't been through the tragedy of being taken advantage of, doesn't mean you shouldn't help." Like maybe she gets recruited during Futaba's Palace, during a random Mementos mission, where her Shadow/Persona chastises her for not helping the thieves because she is too afraid of being associated with delinquents/problem kids/criminals. This way we can actually get one playable party member in the Futaba Palace to run around in like in prev games (when you got Fuuka as a Navi you also got Mitsuru to play as then when you got Rise you also got Teddie as a party member).
The only other change I could think of is a dual final boss, with both Yaldabaoth AND Adam Kadmon, maybe Adam Kadom is enhanced by Yaldy similar to how P3 Protag's wild card was enhanced by Death, or how Adachi was powered up by Ameno-Sagiri. During the fight you manage to convince Maruki that this is wrong, leading to a change of heart where he uses A.K. to hold back Yaldy so Joker can use the Sinful Shell. Now, remember a Persona is just a tamed Shadow, and we've seen what happens when you kill someone's Shadow in the Metaverse. So this'd be an act of heroic sacrifice. Also, it has some Adam and Eve shit going on with the Persona name, Joker getting Satan, and trying to show him the truth and rebel against God (I know the serpent made Eve eat the apple first and then Adam did it but just roll with me here).
This ties the Royal shit into P5's main theme of Rebellion, makes Yoshizawa more integrated into the theme by giving another viewpoint instead of just being off to the side, and adds some more layers to the overall conflict.
Sorry for being long-winded, but I have had a lot of thoughts on this.
Also, IDK f you've looked at the (at least fan-translated version) Persona 5 Scramble, but many people have compared it to Royal with people being trapped in their own delusions instead of getting better, saying that all of the bosses (or "Kings" as they are called) are just like Yoshizawa? Given the fact that P5S was originally going to be a massive crossover between the Persona games, and your idea here, that would've been a great idea to combine your idea here, the o.g. idea for Scramble, AND the current plot of Scramble.
I mean, imagine Aigis and Labrys, two artificial beings who also went through the journey of learning to be human, looking after Sophia like two big sisters. Tell me that wouldn't be adorable. Maybe in a post-credits scene, they can give her A.I. an Anti-Shadow Weapon body so she can walk around in reality.
Also to really hurt people in your idea, with Minato back, imagine if he and Yukari were not only married in this fake reality but also had a kid. So if they undo this reality, the kid will also vanish, because fuck your feelings and angst is something I enjoy writing.
Also, how would Sho Minazuki play into all this because I want to know what he's been up to?
i really dislike the idea of maruki being a mere lacky to shido and by extension Yaldabaoth.
and kinda takes away what made such a great antagonist.
@DarkSonic180
he was much better antagonist than all other antagonist in persona 5
and if maruki not a great antagonist , who is?
@DarkSonic180
than what is a great antagonists...?
this is so true, you are a king!~
This idea sounds epic and I wish it was truly realized. Imagine if Royal was a standalone expansion adding the changes to the base game as DLC, kinda like The Answer. Also The4Snake, what would this hypothetical DLC, Standalone Expansion, New Game, whatever it is be called? I feel like now that it’s a crossover and a sequel it warrants a new name that isn’t Royal but I don’t wanna call it Q2 either.
The Answer is still the best Expansion of the 3 Neo Persona games.
Kamen Rider 1 yeah I really like The Answer, I don’t think it deserves the hate.
I really love your work, but I will have to wait to see this one, since my P5R copy is arriving next week. Just gonna give the like and watch it properly when I finish the game. Keep the good work. (sorry for the bad English, it isn't my first language)
See you in 200 hours, the game is addictive as coke
Maruki drew the lottery Jojo style.
If Personas were Stands frfr
Your plot would get my instant pre-order just for shutting down the Akechi wank. I'm still annoyed that they ruined the comfy road trip ending of P5 for an Akechi tease with the P5 Protag on his own, that right there solidified that I will NEVER play the Royal content again, just play the vanilla plot with the Royal fixes to gameplay. Anyway genuinely think your idea was far better than what we got overall, Atlus were just damn lazy when it came to Royal.
I think it was mentioned by Lavenza that Maruki would become a god like Yaldaboth if he ended up succeeding
so you basically want persona 3 answer but better
Well I'm late but love the idea. My only issue is that it feels like the P3 would take over a bit, being the cast with the most loss and issues, even more so since Minato would 100% be against this and since he has the most to lose that makes his argument one of the strongest. Inversely besides Yu's connection to Nanako's mom and Yusuke with his new girlfriend, P4 doesn't have as strong a stake in arguments.
I actually agree with you. I recall having a debate about Maruki and the Phantom Thieves and these points were brought up.
Thanks for the Persona 4 spoiler warning...
Regarding that debate you mentioned... maybe I just played too much Yakuza but the "Debate or Fists" seems just fine by me.
Someone hire this guy because I personally would like this more
I think Yaldaboth wasn't climatic. Him being there felt like an ass pull that just came out cause you fight god in the other games and they needed to follow the formula in there eyes instead of branching out and being unique from the other games
So Be aware that hes Not fully in control he only has very weak power hes not even able to do all of Tokyo yet as shown with momentous request and the deadline So that's the reason for stopping the illusion To help other people out.
I think It be OK As a spin off but I believe the 2 new characters in Royal would Hurt them since Both of Relying on the fact that you know them beforehand Stuff like why would I care for sumire if I don't know "Kasumi". How do I know Maruki isn't just going to brainwash And do whatever he wants with us.
Essentially it comes down to you can't develop These characters In a spin off since you need to jump straight into The 3th semester or you have 3 hours of Randomly going through every kasumi and maruki Cut scene and social link pre 3rd semester at the Start of your game. So it was an alternate timeline of the P5 story And we had played the Royal Story line I think it would be fine but sumire needs to be on your side She can't stay on the enemy side She probably would be the 1st person you convinced.
I think a big issue I have with all the cast coming is you kind of just Throw away lots of plot development for the old cast Like Any port development in the Answer
Why does everyone want junpei to spend the rest of his life with a cancer patient that has tried to murder him and his friends countless times
i feel like bringing the characters from other persona games to p5 to make the maruki decision much more dramatic is a really bad idea because a lot of the newcomers would be pretty much spoiled on the deaths and like, how the other characters are now (in p5 time).
i do agree they shouldve focused way more on the p5 characters though, instead of just having literally one really tiny segmant with each of the characters with their fabricated realities