I bought the Topping D90 MQA DAC based on watching SoundNews review. The D90 MQA sounds great paired with the Topping A90 Headphone Amp. I have to say I prefer the Topping A90 Headphone Amp over the THX AAA 789. The A90 presents a slightly wider soundstage and seems to have better resolution than the THX 789. It's not a big difference between the two headphone amps, more of a subtle difference. Some people might actually prefer the THX 789 if they prefer a more intimate sound signature. The headphones I have been listening to are the Sennheiser HD 660S. My music is stored on an iMac 27" using Apple's Music App (formerly known as iTunes). Most of my audio files are Apple Lossless purchased from Bandcamp.
@Fernando Martinez Actually, it's sounding great, you are wrong. Storing and maintaining huge local libraries of flac files is not necessary these days unless you really want to. Tidal Hifi (hifi and master tracks) is super convenient with great quality of sound.
I do have the same questions with the MQA, may be some of you can help me answer it. I don’t want to use any of the PC or Roon setup. Just want to stream directly through my Tidal or Quboz from Android or Ipad devices. Right now I have the Cambridge CXN V2, which this unit doesn’t support MQA at all. I want to know if I add a MQA Decoder on the top of it, would it decode Full MQA using the hardware to get 24bit / 192khz. or even higher. Here is the setup, can someone let me know if this work? Cambridge CXN V2 ---> Digital Out (Toslink/Coaxial) ---> Topping D90 (Line Input) ---> Then Coaxial RCA out ---> My Amp (Coaxial Input) What I know is if I use Digital Coax or Toslink connected from Cambridge to the MQA dac, it will bypass the decode from Cambridge and use the new MQA Dac to decode. But I want to know if this will work for full MQA decode and give me 24bit / 192khz when using either above MQA DAC. Any feedback will be great. Thanks.
Excellent insightful review. I second the previous comment about disabling the preamplifier and Bluetooth options. It seems to reveal another level of delicacy and airiness to the sound.
hi ! im a noob in the audiophile world, but i just bought the topping 90, and bryston amp+speakers. should i use the the preamp from the topping or just adjust the volume from my pc ? any noticeable differences ? and what kind of input/output should i use ? i still havent bought any cables .. thanks alot !!
I looked at getting the D90 or the D90 MQA. The only difference between the 2 is the USB input. The USB input is higher spec'ed on the MQA version. And, support for the MQA codec is added, this support is only on the USB input. I don't plan on using USB input on the system where the DAC is going so I opted for the standard D90.
Great review and thanks for taking the time to do it. I have a D90 paired with a THX 887 and Liquid Platinum and both pairings blew my former Jotunheim Multibit away. Dynamics and clarity were vastly improved especially with high cans like the Verite. I've never heard heard the top Schiit gear like Ragnarok and Yggdrasil but are they THAT much better than D90 paired with a THX 789 especially with a 3+ time price difference?
Depends on your set-up. Like the common comment about the Bifrost being a "mini Yggdrasil", it, and the D90, are only a bit behind the Yggy. In my system, A/B'ing with the best recordings I have, it's quite clear that the Yggdrasil is better (even with the D300REF hooked up as the transport for the D90), but with a lot of other music, it's almost, to completely unnoticeable.
I have no experience with a bifrost, but, sold my yggdrasil after getting mind blown by the Topping. The Topping's preamp is not up to snuff for me. I always bypass it and it's a phenomenal DAC. It is currently my secondary dac for use in my bedroom. My main DAC is currently a Denafrips Venus. I am starting to wonder why this guy's saying the opposite of what is true in my experience.
Which Yggdrasil? Original or A2? And with or without Unison USB? You might have missed the comment from "this guy" who tried with the pre-amp disabled and, with the set-up above, got it up to Yggdrasil level. But it was an expensive way to do it. I'm comparing with a Kitsune tuned SU-1 now to see if the results are similar. It still sounds a bit different from the Yggy though, depending on track.
@@EllasPOSEiDON The Venus is my all rounded "End game" DAC (coming from someone who audited the 15k Vermeer, it made the Vermeer look amateurish). But, the Topping D90 holds its ground or perhaps has an edge over the Venus for some music genres (electronica, dub trance, etc anything fast/rythmic). This is my subjective opinion and i listen to every kind of music genre out there. No one piece of equipment can tailor the max to every music genre out there (be it a Dac, Amp, speakers whatever). You would need a couple of different things if you have an eclectic taste in music.
I owned the previous version of the Bifrost with Gen 5. and now collecting data on the Bifrost 2. There has been several reviews online and now your 2nd review here. I think the best way to describe the Bifrost would be "tube like". With music or movies that I've heard, sounds are fleshed out with an accurate sense of space and aliveness. There is also a clarity and openness in the high frequencies unlike many other DAC's...my 2 cents. Cheers!
I always knew I chose Chemical Engineering vs Electrical for a reason . I had absolutely no idea what the heck all them little trinkets did. Or what they where talking about. I only remember V=IR. And from this equation comes sound. Amazing.
So I got a Bifrost 2 almost one month ago and just when I thought the D90 + A90 was my endgame it just got bested by the Bifrost 2 + THX 887. All the detail and even more micro detail than the D90 + A90, but the difference was the sense of enjoyment and fullness (not bloat at all) I get with the Bifrost 2. Music sounds more euphoric, vinyl-like and engaging through the Bifrost 2 and even paring it the Asgard 3 it still sounds more musical than the Topping stack without sounding like tubes. The Topping stack is still amazing, very clean, colorless and without real weaknesses, but Bifrost is the same price as a D90 and to my ears bests it. I am now a firm believer that perfect measurements are not the ultimate predictor of a great DAC. The human ear can only hear so much distortion and if it is inaudible then who cares if it's the measurements? I'd rather get the DAC that actually audibly sounds better with a clean amp and lets me get lost in my music.
I love how you're one of the few reviewers addressing the "Measurements are king" mentality that seems to be gaining in popularity. Great, balanced review!
People who don't hear significant differences between DACs or can't assume they're real to begin with, would rather look at measurements because those tell you whether it is a good design or not.
It's not a "mentality" lol. It makes sense. You SHOULDN'T be wowed by a piece of gear just because it's packaged in a pretty looking box. I think there was a study on headphones and people rated sound quality largely based on looks lol. We're not as unbiased as we think.
@@SoundWaveTrax here's the thing, and this review backs it up again, nothing that measures well sounds bad. Things that measure poorly can and often do sound bad. Currajong has a vested interest in his high-end Schiit stuff and even he admits the Topping it right up there with them (I'd argue its better) so are measurements valid? Of course, they are, are they an indicator it will sound good? Of course, it is... People are right not to buy purely on other peoples subjectivity.
People forget that the music is important here. Listening to modern pop vs. listening to high-quality jazz or classical, for example, makes a HUGE difference. I believe that accounts for most of the differences in opinion.
I used to own the Massdrop 789 and thought it was the pinnacle of headphone amps when I first got it, after reading all the reviews and measurements. Later on I took the plunge and started trying other equipment and quickly grew very bored of the 789. Sold it earlier this year and I don't miss it. That's my experience but I'll still say trying to judge audio gear on graphs alone is silly. You should go out and try other equipment at some point to form your own opinion, either before or after your amir purchase.
@@Currawong It's refreshing to hear a fellow Aussie voice delivering sensible and straight to the point opinions with no fluff and no nonsense. I am electronics tech since the early eighties and I well understand and appreciate the subjective findings that you are communicating. Thanks again.
Agreed. Most of the other reviewers just spout B.S., couriering favor with manufacturers or spewing forth the regular audiophile myths that refuse to die.
MidFi Guy Have you tried asking Schiit for a review unit? Maybe they can hook you up with one. I pair mine with both the Drop 789 and Asgard 3, and I love the sound on both amps. Never tried any expensive gear though, so I can’t compare to other stuff, but I’m really please with this set up.
Unfortunately the Bifrost 2 is pretty much a unicorn now. It has been backordered for months and this morning Schiit once again pushed back its shipping date, which is now 6/30. (Since Schitt, which is not exactly helping its credibility, has pushed the date back multiple times, there is no good reason to think that it will ship then.) I'm planning on getting a new DAC next week and likely would have gotten a Bifrost 2 if available. But since there is no reason to think it will ship anytime soon, my choice has narrowed to the Ares II or the D90 MQA.
Your comment in the video about sharing a list of the Chesky recording your are currently using for evaluation was intriguing. It might be interesting to see you do a video on what recordings you use for evaluating equipment and why you use them. Thanks again, great stuff as always.
I recently bought a D90 MQA to see for myself how it would compare against my Schiit Yggdrasil Analog 2 Unison USB DAC and also to try MQA with Tidal master tracks. I just received it 2 days ago and I'm very impressed with its performance in my main speaker system so far. It does many things better than my Yggy IMO, but at a cost. All that transparency is also very revealing and will not sugarcoat recording. So it's a choice between accuracy and "musicality". The Yggdrasil is still accurate IMO but not at the same level as the D90, it's a few steps below. My preference is for accuracy and I'm willing to endure poor tracks so I can get the most out of the stellar ones.
As I asked above, do you find that Tidal MQA tracks sound better with the hardware decoder than they do with software decoding? I'm currently debating between the D90 MQA, Denafrips Ares II, and Bifrost 2.
Harry Barlow they sounded good, but I need to spend some time A/B some tracks to give you a solid answer. I was set on the D90 and thought $100 extra was worth to have MQA capability. After only 2 days with the D90, I sold my Yggdrasil... I’d strongly recommend the D90 if you want the truth. It’s a matter of choice IMO, whether you want the sound sparkly and (somehow) sweeter or not. After 3 years of Multibit DACs (and I loved them), I’ve decided I had my share of R2R coloration and was loosing too much information because of it.
Harry Barlow I don’t think you can go wrong with the D90 (either version), it’s well built and well engineered. But it is focused on showing you the recordings as they are, the great ones will sound amazing (IMO better than my Yggdrasil), and the not so great will just sound what they are...
I did another comparison with the Yggdrasil last night, and, even with the D300REF as the transport for the D90, it still didn't beat the Yggdrasil in detail retrieval. It is probably worth adding here that I do leave my Yggdrasil on constantly.
To be honest I am considering the D90 as my DSD dac, and yes I do plan to stop here and enjoy life and sound. However I still wait for Aune S8 to hit the market and see how that stacks up against D90. I do aim for enjoyment and not not accuracy. Separation, sound stage, musicality, texture or excitment are what I am looking for in my dac.
Great review Amos it's a tough choice.I am thinking of a Schiit Freya+ and I like the better USB.But the LDAC and volume function are definitely pluses.
I share the same observation as you-- excellent measurements do not really translate to more musical enjoyment and realistic instrument timbre. I've had the Topping D30, D50s,and now E30 -- all of which were measurement beasts but I can't help but still prefer the lowly poor measuring Modi Multibit.
@@BwanaJesuasifiwe yes probably, I have no issues with that. ;) I've had these fancy measuring dacs but I enjoy my music more on the less measuring one. what matters at the end of the day is which one makes you more engaged with your music., not the gear.
@@BwanaJesuasifiwe But adding these things in at the DAC level is really not a good idea. You can't control them. Better to have some kind of DSP processing ahead of the DAC that lets you add the "flavoring" that you like, than have it constantly present in the DAC itself. My own experience with DACs that measure at this level is that any audible differences between them are going to be tiny, and will be inconsequential outside the realm of rigorous A/B comparisons.
Great review thank you. I have noticed that every reviewer seems to have very different opinions of these days. It is hard to estimate how they are going to sound. One said it is incredibly detailed, narrow soundstage etc.
I may be the exception, but I have found that all the improvements in DACs over the last decades essentially don't add that much in musicality, in just enjoying music. I own four old CD players, one of the 90s, the Yamaha CDX-870 and three of the 2000's : Marantz CD 5000, Marantz CD 6000KI and Denon DCD 1450AR. Next to those CD players I own a TEAC UD-301 DAC, a Musical Fidelity VDAC II , an Xcan. And recently I bought an Audio GD R2R 11 and a Marantz HD-DAC 1. Besides that I have auditioned numerous different DAC/Amps over the years. True, when you look/listen for it there are various improvements made. In general a bigger resolution, more details especially with the Delta Sigma models. Some improvements are subtle and in good taste (to my ears this would be mostly Burr Brown and Cirrus Logics DACs). Some improvements are to the extreme, in where details are forced upon you: AKM and Sabre. And where sound is polished in a unnatural way: AKM. And then you have the ladder DACs, which, in my opinion, in many cases in reality don't sound that more fluid and analogue than the Delta Sigma variants. But I like them because they don't strive for better technicalities, more details, but rather for a more pleasant tonality and timbre, without abrasive polishing. They don't always succeed though. I find the Marantz DAC for instance to be more fluid and 'analogish' sounding than the Audio GD R2R 11, the Schiit Bifrost and the Denafrips Ares II. Although arguably the sound of the Marantz is 'polished' like the AKM velvet DACs, but way less intrusive. But long story short, I own different flavors and essentially not a single flavor is the superior one in a general sense. In the end I enjoy my music equally fine with my cheap Marantz CD 5000 as with my more expensive Marantz HD-DAC 1. The differences aren't that big to begin with and the largest portion of the data/music simply sounds identical.
Thanks for the great review & comparison. I believe Sundra from Sound New noticed that the (non-MSQ version) D-90 sounded better via IsquaredS as well. Can you please review the Gustard DAC-A22 with the dual AK-4499 chip and better power supply. It appear to perform better as a pre-amp as well. Failing that can you add in the comments here a comparison between the D-90 & ARES ii (both the same price).
Well, with my Accuphase E408 amp and expensive cabels and german speakers the filter #5 of the D90 results in a more 3-D sound. I am very happy with the Topping D90. Tip: try different filters. thx!...plus, I use a high end AQVOX-USB cable with my notebook - improved sound, too.
Your reviews and shared insight are the best! Thank you. Schiit thanks you, too because I'm sold on the Bifrost now. Would love to see you do a comparison on streaming services (Tidal, Deezer, Qobuz, etc.).
Your videos are very informative and well made. Did you compare (or have any comment about it) the two DACs using an optical Toslink connection that bypasses the potential USB issues (in the Topping)?
Thanks. For optical, I've had weird results sometimes, but I haven't taken the time to nail down what is going on. Most issues seem to be eliminated to the quality of the optical cable. I now recommend in videos that people use the Sysconcept 1300 strand cable as it is not too expensive and eliminates the issues with optical transmission.
Disabling BT would likely help. BT uses RF which could cause undesired interference. Less interference should mean better sound. I don't have a D90, but turning off the preamp mode could shorten the signal path. The less transforms a signal goes through, the truer it is to the original. Since the D90 is optimized to measure very well, this is likely in the spirit of the product. :)
@@thetechq hi ! im a noob in the audiophile world, but i just bought the topping 90, and bryston amp+speakers. should i use the the preamp from the topping or just adjust the volume from my pc ? any noticeable differences ? and what kind of input/output should i use ? i still havent bought any cables .. thanks alot !!
@@DoumdaDoum you should try it for sure, since you already got the topping. i have 3 systems at home. and 1 of them i use it like this. i do like better the sound with a dedicated preamp. however it does work quiet well. specially at higher volume. at low volume it does kind of colapse the soundstage, imaging and detail. hope it helps
Thanks for your usually great review, which was very timely for me since I am planning to get a new DAC in this price range in a couple of weeks and the candidates are D90 (MQA version), Bifrost 2, and Denafrips Ares II (I'd love to see you review that one). It will be replacing a SMSL SU-8 and paired with a Liquid Platinum. Question (for anyone): virtually all my music listening is via Tidal and the D90 is now available with a MQA decoder (and upgraded XMOS chip) for an additional $100. Could I expect any SQ improvement on Tidal MQA tracks played through a hardware decoder as opposed to using the software decoder included in the Tidal Windows 10 app? If no, I'd probably get one of the other two. FWIW, all three of these DACS cost within $30 USD of each other including shipping and tax to New Jersey, USA (only Schiit charges these, Denafrips and Topping distributors do not).
I suggest ignoring MQA. It's both lossy and has audibly higher distortion on all the TIDAL albums I've tried. Analysis of MQA's claims discovered that, from the start, most of them were false, or totally the opposite.
The focus on DACs these days is overwhelming. If 100% = best music listening experience, then 55% depends on your music source - the quality of recordings, 40% depends on your speakers & your amplification system, balance, 5% is shared by DACs, your other interfaces, equipment matching, cables etc etc. Finally, most DACs sound good to very good even excellent from say $500 to $2000 mark. So, you do the maths... If someone wants to spend $5,000 to $100,000 or more well, excellent. Good on you. Just my HO. For me, I would rather change my speakers and other equipments in the ratios above before even considering a new DAC. Or go completely analog bypassing the need for a DAC.
@@Currawong I am not sure too.. not very technical but... But... It does sound better. I don't know why. Not just me. Everyone else said the samething. The DAC only mode. Anyway have you tried? Curious though, since you are the pro here. Always great review from you with much more technically covered. Cheers
@@Currawong DAC only mode skips the pre--amp part of the D90, which is said to be mediocre, and allows use of a different pre-amp which will take full advantage of the D90 DAC capability.
I have several issues with my Topping D90: 1. When connected to my MAC via the USB, the signal times out in 2 minutes. The MAC still recognizes the D90 as connected, but apparently the D90 sleeps after 2 minutes. If I switch the output and then switch it back to D90 in the MAC (via Qobuz UI, but also through the sound settings), then the Topping wakes up, but goes to sleep again at the second minute. This is documented here (www.head-fi.org/threads/topping-d90.926531/page-2). 2. Each time I switch the source in the Topping, there is a audible click coming from my speakers. 3. When connecting both the XLR and the RCA outputs from the D90 to my Emotiva XPA-2,3rd gen amp, there is loud hiss coming from speakers when the amp is set to receive signal through the RCA. If I disconnect the XLRs from the Topping, but keep the RCAs in, the hiss disappears. 4. I confirm that there is big difference between the preout and DAC settings in sound. Since the DAC is way better and only worth it, then the Preout functionality is useless. 5. When using on DAC, when streaming from Bluetooth, even the lowest volume on my BT in the phone was almost gonna blow my speakers if I didn't rush to stop the amp. The first two issues are dealbreakers, so I am talking with Shenzhen's tech support for resolution. Appears to be a USB driver problem based on the link I provided above. If anyone knows, please send info. If I don't have it resolved, I'll just get the bifrost that you recommend as a better sounding unit. Thoughts? Thanks.
Amos, great video I am getting back to the audiophile world, I just had my HH Scott tube Amp and Preamp fully restore, I am using my iPad and red dragonfly for DAC. I would like to go to the next level to get more details, sound stage with a 1,100.00 budget. I been watching some of your videos and reading comments from your community and is getting very hard to pick one. I have this one’s mind D90, Gustard A22, Arest 2, and Bifrost 2 any recommendation would be greatly appreciated thank you
Currawong, I (we, the audiophile community), need you to review the Gustard A22, Gustard X26, and the LKS MH-DA004. We need you to do an A/B comparison amongst them and with your Schiit Yggy. I'm beginning to think that at least one of these DACs may outperform the Yggy, but I need confirmation. When you do this review, I kindly (and respectfully) ask you to shed any preconceived notion of higher price equals better product, made in China can't be good or lesser brand recognition can't beat pedigree. I really want to know based on sound and sound alone, how these high end Chinese DACs measure up.
The d90 in preamp mode was a huge disappointment to me, it made loud popping noises whenever I played, paused, stopped the music, when muting the dac and anytime sample rate changed. I understand now why they're selling a separate preamp because the internal preamp module in the D90 is utterly useless. Topping support confirmed the popping noises are due to the way it's designed, so I ditched it. It was a sad choice I loved the way it sounded.
Perhaps better yet yoy can review and compare the Gustard DAC A-22 to the D-90 or Aires ii. The A-22 appears to have a better power supply, is truly balance from to back and has duel AK 4499 chip (1/channel).
@@wokthetalk3079 Must not leave out SMSL M400 then. Would love to see all $800-ish DAC battle royale! D90, A22, Ares 2, Biforst 2, and M400. By the way A18 does have the linear power supply too, but yeah only single AK4499. This is the one I'm more likely to get due to budget.
I have been listening to a number of reviews on this DAC and I'm convinced I will get something else. I stream music and would like a recommendation on a decent DAC. I am streaming from a Cambridge streamer. Can you recommend something for me?
The Soekris is awesome but the only down side is it's xmos usb interface making it sound analytical and none inspiring, very dry. To fix this, get a Gustard U16, not a singxer, and you'll extract incredible musicality from the soekris that wasn't been able before.
This one is on my list. Will listen to it when I will have a chance, wonder how it will compare to the new SMSL M400 AK4499 dac. Price wise they are very close. I You could compare it with the M400 that would be nice. Also one of the options I took into account was just getting the Fiio M15, yes its a DAP. But it could drive my SP200 when Im home.
Considering between D90se (greater transparency than D90) and the Schitt Bitfrost 2. Eventually I will stream music, however, my current needs are for an amp which only has RCA inputs and using hi quality Redbook, HDCD and SACD for many genres. Any information on which Topping v Schitt whose RCA outputs perform more closely to the XLR outputs which were probably used for reviews would be helpful. But it boils down to whether RCA outputs perform essentially close to their XLR. XLR is nice to have should I upgrade to another amp down the road. I would like to maximize a balance between musicality (amp is warmer but detailed, Keces E40, reminds me of my Hegel h160 in ways), instrument separation, depth of SS (3Dness) and transparency without being overly clinical. I had heard Topping D70s but low end bled into and affected instrument separation a bit. Still nice and perhaps a choice , but want a bit more. Anyone? Thanks.
I had both. I kept the Bifrost 2 and returned the D90. Pardon the buzz words, but more nuanced and musical does sum it up for me. I found the D90 a touch brighter. Both are solid DACs.
Great review. I have the SMSL M500, has similar measurements as the D90 but is around 300+ dollars. Would love to hear how it compares to the D90 and would D90 be an upgrade over the M500...?
it does not have similar measurements, smsl m400 does tho. m500 is known for its heat disposal problems and in general lower build quality than topping, same seems to go for m400 which do measure in the same league, its 800 dollars tho.
As always great review. Would you comment on the sound of D90 vs Audio GD R2R DACs? I know Kingwa says that as you move higher up in his R2R DAC line, you move away from that euphonic sound of the R2R 11 and move closer to a studio or opposite end of spectrum as you described.
@Currawong Thank you for review, im currently own D90 and use it in dac mode, connected to dell laptop using Supra usb cable. Is it worth to buy Singxer SU-2 digital interface for D90, there will be 10% sound improvement at least? Thank you:)
Math can’t tell you what to like. But math can say that linear time-invariant systems aren’t phased by signal complexity-they handle music and signal generators identically-and THD+N and IMD measurements describe deviations from linear time-invariance that make that less true.
Great review many thanks. Could you let me know the makes of USB to IIS converters you mentioned briefly? How do think the D90 would perform with an Audiophilleo 2 USB/SPDIF convertor hooked up to a Mac Mini?
There are ones from Audio-gd, Singxer, Kitsune (modified Singxer), Gustard and quite a few others. An Audiophilleo with it would be interesting. I used to own the AP 1, but I think that the Chinese brands have bettered it.
Currawong Thanks mate! I’m thinking of getting a Singxer SU-2 for the Topping D90 MQA for use with my Mac Mini. This will feed into a Vitus RI-101 and Focal Diablo Utopias. Currently have Naim N-DAC / XPS / 202 / HICAP/ 200 into the Focals....
I think the DX7 Pro w it’s ESS 9038 pro chip will prob be a bit more resolving than the D90 w it’s AK variant. Forget the measurements, although the DX7 Pro measures really too
Don’t think it can better Chord products. They measured really well but given the price point and not decent input and power section components they won’t be able to beat Chord.
Please tell me. I bought TOPPING DX7 Pro ES9038Pro DAC & Headphone amp , but I would like to listen to music on Sony WH-1000XM4. Do I need to buy this amplifier? What will change in terms of sound? TOPPING A90 Full Balanced Headphone Amplifier XLR Pre-Amplifier.
Turbulence3000 You are getting confused further because the Topping A90 as Power Supply has an internal solution very similar or identical to that present on the D90.
PC 12345 I remember seeing a picture of the A90 PCB and there were no “large” transformers. But I could be loosing my mind because I can’t find that image anymore...
You might as well get an RME ADI2 its the same price. Question is what output are you using on all of them just a standard fixed 2 volts not 1 volt drive it amplifier a bit harder add some distortion always sounds better
Lol why anyone should buy rme when it have much less capable chip with worse components and generic switched power supply. What makes you think that rme is so good?
First off, thanks for the detailed review as always. All I wonder is whether getting this would be a sidegrade since having an idsd micro BL. Both are full mqa decoder. I know mqa subject is a bit complicated but I only listen to music via Tidal lately. A response regarding sidegrade or upgrade would be awesome! Thanks again!
Hi Currawong, Do you reckon if someone were to add a USB cleaner such as the iFi iPurifier to the D90, the Bifrost 2 would lose its advantage over the D90?
@@skelewolf8431 te lo recomiendo totalmente, trae un muy buen dac, la etapa de amplificacion no es la mejor, pero es bastante decente, actualmente lo uso con unos monolith m1060 y unas focal chorus 605 y ambos suenan bastante bien.
@@skelewolf8431 si creo que como modo dac con otro amp seria rl mejor combo, aun que si no vas a usar la parte de amplificacion de audifonos, quizas te convenga otro como el d70 o el d50 , yo me voy a ir por un amp thx, hay uno de smsl a buen precio
@@tbobreak el smsl con amp thx es el sp200 del que te comento, bueno habrá que ver porque esta bien barato y si o si voy a comprar, pero no me decido aun el dac, este D90 o el dx7 pro, ambos traen un dac diferente
CHI-FI companies are releasing products at a faster pace attracting customers with audio measurements with cheaper prices. The time spent behind engineering Topping D70 and D90 is less than an year. And whats the difference? Different DAC chips and little performance tweaks here and there. At the end of the day, what wins in SQ is how a DAC chip is implemented. Topping is not bad at doing a proper delta sigma implementation, however, the D90 does not perform as per its asking price.
@@johnstone7697 I have the D70 ($499) Bifrost 2 multibit ($699), D90 ($699) and ADI-2 DAC ($1149) and compared them extensively through my setup (Focal Utopia plugged into Questyle CMA 600i). All the DAC's were connected to CMA600i via RCA. I covered rock, jazz, pop and grunge leaving out techno and metal. All files were 24 bit 44.1 khz FLAC. I did this over a period of 8 days. From what I have observed, the RME came first in terms of sheer musicality and details. For example, when I listened to James Blake Assume Form, the small timed piano intro of the first track "Assume Form" had so minute microscopic details that only the ADI-2 DAC was able to polish and present it to you, the Bifrost-2 came second but I had to concentrate more (if I was laid back I would have lost it). Both the D90 and D70 failed in this task (even after discerning listening with my eyes closed). On the contrary, when listening to Stone Temple Pilot's " Down", the D90 and Bifrost-2 had a soundstage so big and deep that other DAC's failed to produce. On 95% of the tracks, the Schiit Bifrost-2 multibit is similar to D90 in terms of detail retrieval with a slight edge in having more texture. the D70 looses slightly to D90 in terms of details but both have same laid back Topping sound. All of them combined loose to ADI-2 in terms of sheer musicality and technical prowess So summarizing this, I found that D90 is not a huge upgrade over D70. My ears are my experience here. But if you are a Topping fan who are just going by the measurements made on ASR site (where measurements does not talk about SQ), then you are better off buying a D90. If you want a DAC with a performance similar to D90 but with better texture, then buy the Bifrost-2 multibit (you can upgrade the hardware internally).
I have not heard the Bifrost 2 but own the Yggy 2 with Unison. A friend has the Yggy as well and a truly SOTA room. He has the Terminator as well for DSD and got the Topping D 90. I did some listening with it. It is a pleasant sounding DAC. Too pleasant. I found a sameness to the Sound from recording to recording that I did not like. I would recommend it for a bright sounding system but I will take the Yggy Unison any day over it. Of course, YMMV. It will be interesting to see how the Yggy sounds with a Unison USB source as well. Hopefully soon.
mykeldg no, the Yggy was better. When my friend plays PCM, he uses the Yggy and the Terminator is for DSD. The Terminator is good but the Yggy better, of course, YMMV.
joe Whip wow that is interesting considering the denafrips is a discreet ladder design and almost twice the cost of the yggy. Ive had many well measuring dacs like the topping and it cant even beat the mimby so maybe schiit really does some interesting designs.
mykeldg I am not the only one that feels this way. There is a review on Audioshark where the guy who praised the Terminator vs. the Yggy reversed his opinion with the Yggy 2 and when he changed his preamp. I think the Yggy excels in reproducing piano as well as the double bass. I listen to mostly jazz and have spent way too much time in jazz clubs. Ray Brown sounds as I remember him,
Check out the Bifrost 2 thread over at the Headphones Community forum: forum.headphones.com/t/schiit-bifrost-2-dac-official-thread/4074 Most people there say the Bifrost 2 is a noticeable upgrade over the Bifrost 1 There's also a D90 thread: forum.headphones.com/t/topping-d90-dac-official-thread/5334
Don't really get that point "USB to I2S converting". What is the logical reason? The most important would be not to convert to USB signal and directly send it through HDMI from I2S out to the DAC's I2S input.
@@Currawong If a streamer has an inbuilt HDD slot with the SATA you probably already I2S. Then if this streamer has an I2S output there is, the PCB signal unchanged and sent to the dac. Obviously most of the time dedicated DACs are better than streamer's inbuilt versions but obvious, not so many streamer has I2S out with HDD (SSD) slot. You're right too.
what is the point of usb to I2S converter? You already have lost the quality in the USB. Isn't there a streamer or any other source that outputs I2S directly?
USB transmission, if bit-perfect doesn't lose any quality from the music. The issues with USB have to do with the processing, which generates noise. That can be managed by careful design. There are indeed streamers which indeed do output I2S directly.
Here's my thing. If the topping improved quite a bit with a USB interface, then spending big bucks on R2R and others mega expensive dacs is truly a waste, if in 5 years time the tech will change.
I bought the Topping D90 MQA DAC based on watching SoundNews review. The D90 MQA sounds great paired with the Topping A90 Headphone Amp. I have to say I prefer the Topping A90 Headphone Amp over the THX AAA 789. The A90 presents a slightly wider soundstage and seems to have better resolution than the THX 789. It's not a big difference between the two headphone amps, more of a subtle difference. Some people might actually prefer the THX 789 if they prefer a more intimate sound signature. The headphones I have been listening to are the Sennheiser HD 660S. My music is stored on an iMac 27" using Apple's Music App (formerly known as iTunes). Most of my audio files are Apple Lossless purchased from Bandcamp.
I second those comments, I have them both A90 and D90 MQA and they sound like "nothing". My Sundara's never sounded so good.
@Fernando Martinez Actually, it's sounding great, you are wrong. Storing and maintaining huge local libraries of flac files is not necessary these days unless you really want to. Tidal Hifi (hifi and master tracks) is super convenient with great quality of sound.
I do have the same questions with the MQA, may be some of you can help me answer it. I don’t want to use any of the PC or Roon setup. Just want to stream directly through my Tidal or Quboz from Android or Ipad devices.
Right now I have the Cambridge CXN V2, which this unit doesn’t support MQA at all. I want to know if I add a MQA Decoder on the top of it, would it decode Full MQA using the hardware to get 24bit / 192khz. or even higher.
Here is the setup, can someone let me know if this work?
Cambridge CXN V2 ---> Digital Out (Toslink/Coaxial) --->
Topping D90 (Line Input) ---> Then Coaxial RCA out ---> My Amp (Coaxial Input)
What I know is if I use Digital Coax or Toslink connected from Cambridge to the MQA dac, it will bypass the decode from Cambridge and use the new MQA Dac to decode. But I want to know if this will work for full MQA decode and give me 24bit / 192khz when using either above MQA DAC.
Any feedback will be great. Thanks.
Great and detailed comment thanks
Excellent insightful review. I second the previous comment about disabling the preamplifier and Bluetooth options. It seems to reveal another level of delicacy and airiness to the sound.
I like it now using HQPlayer to up-sample to it.
hi ! im a noob in the audiophile world, but i just bought the topping 90, and bryston amp+speakers. should i use the the preamp from the topping or just adjust the volume from my pc ? any noticeable differences ? and what kind of input/output should i use ? i still havent bought any cables .. thanks alot !!
I looked at getting the D90 or the D90 MQA. The only difference between the 2 is the USB input. The USB input is higher spec'ed on the MQA version. And, support for the MQA codec is added, this support is only on the USB input. I don't plan on using USB input on the system where the DAC is going so I opted for the standard D90.
Great review and thanks for taking the time to do it. I have a D90 paired with a THX 887 and Liquid Platinum and both pairings blew my former Jotunheim Multibit away. Dynamics and clarity were vastly improved especially with high cans like the Verite. I've never heard heard the top Schiit gear like Ragnarok and Yggdrasil but are they THAT much better than D90 paired with a THX 789 especially with a 3+ time price difference?
Depends on your set-up. Like the common comment about the Bifrost being a "mini Yggdrasil", it, and the D90, are only a bit behind the Yggy. In my system, A/B'ing with the best recordings I have, it's quite clear that the Yggdrasil is better (even with the D300REF hooked up as the transport for the D90), but with a lot of other music, it's almost, to completely unnoticeable.
I have no experience with a bifrost, but, sold my yggdrasil after getting mind blown by the Topping. The Topping's preamp is not up to snuff for me. I always bypass it and it's a phenomenal DAC. It is currently my secondary dac for use in my bedroom. My main DAC is currently a Denafrips Venus. I am starting to wonder why this guy's saying the opposite of what is true in my experience.
Which Yggdrasil? Original or A2? And with or without Unison USB? You might have missed the comment from "this guy" who tried with the pre-amp disabled and, with the set-up above, got it up to Yggdrasil level. But it was an expensive way to do it. I'm comparing with a Kitsune tuned SU-1 now to see if the results are similar. It still sounds a bit different from the Yggy though, depending on track.
@@wa2368 Can I ask about your Venus? Far beyond D90? Or, maybe Matrix Element or M2Tech Yound MKIII? Brooklyn DAC+?
@@EllasPOSEiDON The Venus is my all rounded "End game" DAC (coming from someone who audited the 15k Vermeer, it made the Vermeer look amateurish). But, the Topping D90 holds its ground or perhaps has an edge over the Venus for some music genres (electronica, dub trance, etc anything fast/rythmic). This is my subjective opinion and i listen to every kind of music genre out there. No one piece of equipment can tailor the max to every music genre out there (be it a Dac, Amp, speakers whatever). You would need a couple of different things if you have an eclectic taste in music.
I owned the previous version of the Bifrost with Gen 5. and now collecting data on the Bifrost 2. There has been several reviews online and now your 2nd review here. I think the best way to describe the Bifrost would be "tube like". With music or movies that I've heard, sounds are fleshed out with an accurate sense of space and aliveness. There is also a clarity and openness in the high frequencies unlike many other DAC's...my 2 cents. Cheers!
Another fantastic review! Keep up the great work!!
I have a D90 paired with an SMSL THX through Aryas. MIND BLOWN.
Hi. I am exactly looking at this stack for my 6xx and lcd2c. How does this stack pair with my headphones, if you had tried them?
I always knew I chose Chemical Engineering vs Electrical for a reason . I had absolutely no idea what the heck all them little trinkets did.
Or what they where talking about. I only remember V=IR. And from this equation comes sound. Amazing.
So I got a Bifrost 2 almost one month ago and just when I thought the D90 + A90 was my endgame it just got bested by the Bifrost 2 + THX 887. All the detail and even more micro detail than the D90 + A90, but the difference was the sense of enjoyment and fullness (not bloat at all) I get with the Bifrost 2. Music sounds more euphoric, vinyl-like and engaging through the Bifrost 2 and even paring it the Asgard 3 it still sounds more musical than the Topping stack without sounding like tubes. The Topping stack is still amazing, very clean, colorless and without real weaknesses, but Bifrost is the same price as a D90 and to my ears bests it. I am now a firm believer that perfect measurements are not the ultimate predictor of a great DAC. The human ear can only hear so much distortion and if it is inaudible then who cares if it's the measurements? I'd rather get the DAC that actually audibly sounds better with a clean amp and lets me get lost in my music.
do you work for schiit?
You have to be the most knowledgeable reviewer out there. Impressive!
Wow, thanks!
I love how you're one of the few reviewers addressing the "Measurements are king" mentality that seems to be gaining in popularity. Great, balanced review!
People who don't hear significant differences between DACs or can't assume they're real to begin with, would rather look at measurements because those tell you whether it is a good design or not.
It's not a "mentality" lol. It makes sense. You SHOULDN'T be wowed by a piece of gear just because it's packaged in a pretty looking box. I think there was a study on headphones and people rated sound quality largely based on looks lol. We're not as unbiased as we think.
@@SoundWaveTrax here's the thing, and this review backs it up again, nothing that measures well sounds bad. Things that measure poorly can and often do sound bad. Currajong has a vested interest in his high-end Schiit stuff and even he admits the Topping it right up there with them (I'd argue its better) so are measurements valid? Of course, they are, are they an indicator it will sound good? Of course, it is... People are right not to buy purely on other peoples subjectivity.
People forget that the music is important here. Listening to modern pop vs. listening to high-quality jazz or classical, for example, makes a HUGE difference. I believe that accounts for most of the differences in opinion.
I used to own the Massdrop 789 and thought it was the pinnacle of headphone amps when I first got it, after reading all the reviews and measurements. Later on I took the plunge and started trying other equipment and quickly grew very bored of the 789. Sold it earlier this year and I don't miss it.
That's my experience but I'll still say trying to judge audio gear on graphs alone is silly. You should go out and try other equipment at some point to form your own opinion, either before or after your amir purchase.
Awesome content!
Any plans for reviewing SMSL SU-8?
The SMSL SU-9 has just been released
@@johnsoriano3812 SU-9 is double the price, so not a replacement or what I'm looking for. I went for the Topping E30/L30 stack.
@@Tealc2323 Very good choice for a stack.
Thanks for great reviews.
Glad you like them!
@@Currawong It's refreshing to hear a fellow Aussie voice delivering sensible and straight to the point opinions with no fluff and no nonsense.
I am electronics tech since the early eighties and I well understand and appreciate the subjective findings that you are communicating.
Thanks again.
Agreed. Most of the other reviewers just spout B.S., couriering favor with manufacturers or spewing forth the regular audiophile myths that refuse to die.
I would like to see a Schiit Bitfrost 2 vs Denafrips Ares II comparison
Same here. I was between those two in February 2020. Ended up going with the Bifrost 2.
I have a DAC shootout ready to film (ARES II included) but I can't find a Bifrost 2 anywhere 😓
MidFi Guy Have you tried asking Schiit for a review unit? Maybe they can hook you up with one. I pair mine with both the Drop 789 and Asgard 3, and I love the sound on both amps. Never tried any expensive gear though, so I can’t compare to other stuff, but I’m really please with this set up.
@@igorcosta8559 they don't have any review units available unfortunately
Unfortunately the Bifrost 2 is pretty much a unicorn now. It has been backordered for months and this morning Schiit once again pushed back its shipping date, which is now 6/30. (Since Schitt, which is not exactly helping its credibility, has pushed the date back multiple times, there is no good reason to think that it will ship then.) I'm planning on getting a new DAC next week and likely would have gotten a Bifrost 2 if available. But since there is no reason to think it will ship anytime soon, my choice has narrowed to the Ares II or the D90 MQA.
Your comment in the video about sharing a list of the Chesky recording your are currently using for evaluation was intriguing. It might be interesting to see you do a video on what recordings you use for evaluating equipment and why you use them. Thanks again, great stuff as always.
I've added the list in the description now. Cheers!
I recently bought a D90 MQA to see for myself how it would compare against my Schiit Yggdrasil Analog 2 Unison USB DAC and also to try MQA with Tidal master tracks. I just received it 2 days ago and I'm very impressed with its performance in my main speaker system so far. It does many things better than my Yggy IMO, but at a cost. All that transparency is also very revealing and will not sugarcoat recording. So it's a choice between accuracy and "musicality". The Yggdrasil is still accurate IMO but not at the same level as the D90, it's a few steps below. My preference is for accuracy and I'm willing to endure poor tracks so I can get the most out of the stellar ones.
As I asked above, do you find that Tidal MQA tracks sound better with the hardware decoder than they do with software decoding? I'm currently debating between the D90 MQA, Denafrips Ares II, and Bifrost 2.
Harry Barlow they sounded good, but I need to spend some time A/B some tracks to give you a solid answer. I was set on the D90 and thought $100 extra was worth to have MQA capability. After only 2 days with the D90, I sold my Yggdrasil... I’d strongly recommend the D90 if you want the truth. It’s a matter of choice IMO, whether you want the sound sparkly and (somehow) sweeter or not. After 3 years of Multibit DACs (and I loved them), I’ve decided I had my share of R2R coloration and was loosing too much information because of it.
@@sphaera3809 Thanks for the quick and helpful reply. I'm definitely getting the MQA version if I go with the D90.
Harry Barlow I don’t think you can go wrong with the D90 (either version), it’s well built and well engineered. But it is focused on showing you the recordings as they are, the great ones will sound amazing (IMO better than my Yggdrasil), and the not so great will just sound what they are...
I did another comparison with the Yggdrasil last night, and, even with the D300REF as the transport for the D90, it still didn't beat the Yggdrasil in detail retrieval. It is probably worth adding here that I do leave my Yggdrasil on constantly.
Would love to see you review the A90, and compare to the Drop THX AAA 789
To be honest I am considering the D90 as my DSD dac, and yes I do plan to stop here and enjoy life and sound. However I still wait for Aune S8 to hit the market and see how that stacks up against D90. I do aim for enjoyment and not not accuracy. Separation, sound stage, musicality, texture or excitment are what I am looking for in my dac.
Great review Amos it's a tough choice.I am thinking of a Schiit Freya+ and I like the better USB.But the LDAC and volume function are definitely pluses.
I share the same observation as you-- excellent measurements do not really translate to more musical enjoyment and realistic instrument timbre. I've had the Topping D30, D50s,and now E30 -- all of which were measurement beasts but I can't help but still prefer the lowly poor measuring Modi Multibit.
@@BwanaJesuasifiwe yes probably, I have no issues with that. ;) I've had these fancy measuring dacs but I enjoy my music more on the less measuring one. what matters at the end of the day is which one makes you more engaged with your music., not the gear.
@@BwanaJesuasifiwe But adding these things in at the DAC level is really not a good idea. You can't control them. Better to have some kind of DSP processing ahead of the DAC that lets you add the "flavoring" that you like, than have it constantly present in the DAC itself. My own experience with DACs that measure at this level is that any audible differences between them are going to be tiny, and will be inconsequential outside the realm of rigorous A/B comparisons.
Thanks for you excellent content, once again
Great review thank you. I have noticed that every reviewer seems to have very different opinions of these days. It is hard to estimate how they are going to sound. One said it is incredibly detailed, narrow soundstage etc.
I may be the exception, but I have found that all the improvements in DACs over the last decades essentially don't add that much in musicality, in just enjoying music. I own four old CD players, one of the 90s, the Yamaha CDX-870 and three of the 2000's : Marantz CD 5000, Marantz CD 6000KI and Denon DCD 1450AR. Next to those CD players I own a TEAC UD-301 DAC, a Musical Fidelity VDAC II , an Xcan. And recently I bought an Audio GD R2R 11 and a Marantz HD-DAC 1. Besides that I have auditioned numerous different DAC/Amps over the years.
True, when you look/listen for it there are various improvements made. In general a bigger resolution, more details especially with the Delta Sigma models. Some improvements are subtle and in good taste (to my ears this would be mostly Burr Brown and Cirrus Logics DACs). Some improvements are to the extreme, in where details are forced upon you: AKM and Sabre. And where sound is polished in a unnatural way: AKM. And then you have the ladder DACs, which, in my opinion, in many cases in reality don't sound that more fluid and analogue than the Delta Sigma variants. But I like them because they don't strive for better technicalities, more details, but rather for a more pleasant tonality and timbre, without abrasive polishing. They don't always succeed though. I find the Marantz DAC for instance to be more fluid and 'analogish' sounding than the Audio GD R2R 11, the Schiit Bifrost and the Denafrips Ares II. Although arguably the sound of the Marantz is 'polished' like the AKM velvet DACs, but way less intrusive.
But long story short, I own different flavors and essentially not a single flavor is the superior one in a general sense. In the end I enjoy my music equally fine with my cheap Marantz CD 5000 as with my more expensive Marantz HD-DAC 1. The differences aren't that big to begin with and the largest portion of the data/music simply sounds identical.
Thanks for the great review & comparison. I believe Sundra from Sound New noticed that the (non-MSQ version) D-90 sounded better via IsquaredS as well.
Can you please review the Gustard DAC-A22 with the dual AK-4499 chip and better power supply. It appear to perform better as a pre-amp as well. Failing that can you add in the comments here a comparison between the D-90 & ARES ii (both the same price).
Yes, please review the Gustard A22, I am thinking of buying either a Topping, Gustard or LKS.
Well, with my Accuphase E408 amp and expensive cabels and german speakers the filter #5 of the D90 results in a more 3-D sound. I am very happy with the Topping D90. Tip: try different filters. thx!...plus, I use a high end AQVOX-USB cable with my notebook - improved sound, too.
Your reviews and shared insight are the best! Thank you. Schiit thanks you, too because I'm sold on the Bifrost now.
Would love to see you do a comparison on streaming services (Tidal, Deezer, Qobuz, etc.).
Very nice! I was looking forward to this.
Your videos are very informative and well made. Did you compare (or have any comment about it) the two DACs using an optical Toslink connection that bypasses the potential USB issues (in the Topping)?
Thanks. For optical, I've had weird results sometimes, but I haven't taken the time to nail down what is going on. Most issues seem to be eliminated to the quality of the optical cable. I now recommend in videos that people use the Sysconcept 1300 strand cable as it is not too expensive and eliminates the issues with optical transmission.
@@CurrawongThank you for the prompt response. I’ve got an Audioquest so I hope it’ll do, right?
Should do. I think it's a glass cable? Be VERY careful not to damage the tips.
@@Currawong It’s just a regular Toslink optical cable.
Love your reviews. Great content.
I appreciate that!
I recommend turning off BT and preamp mode. Perhaps subjective, but to my ears it brings the best out of D90. :)
Disabling BT would likely help. BT uses RF which could cause undesired interference. Less interference should mean better sound. I don't have a D90, but turning off the preamp mode could shorten the signal path. The less transforms a signal goes through, the truer it is to the original. Since the D90 is optimized to measure very well, this is likely in the spirit of the product. :)
@@thetechq hi ! im a noob in the audiophile world, but i just bought the topping 90, and bryston amp+speakers. should i use the the preamp from the topping or just adjust the volume from my pc ? any noticeable differences ? and what kind of input/output should i use ? i still havent bought any cables .. thanks alot !!
@@DoumdaDoum you should try it for sure, since you already got the topping. i have 3 systems at home. and 1 of them i use it like this. i do like better the sound with a dedicated preamp. however it does work quiet well. specially at higher volume. at low volume it does kind of colapse the soundstage, imaging and detail. hope it helps
Agreed
DoumdaDoum nice nick!
Thx for comparsion, very helpfull as always!
Thanks for the video. Great as always. This is not a real balanced output DAC/Preamp (or maybe preamp is), am I correct?
Thanks for your usually great review, which was very timely for me since I am planning to get a new DAC in this price range in a couple of weeks and the candidates are D90 (MQA version), Bifrost 2, and Denafrips Ares II (I'd love to see you review that one). It will be replacing a SMSL SU-8 and paired with a Liquid Platinum. Question (for anyone): virtually all my music listening is via Tidal and the D90 is now available with a MQA decoder (and upgraded XMOS chip) for an additional $100. Could I expect any SQ improvement on Tidal MQA tracks played through a hardware decoder as opposed to using the software decoder included in the Tidal Windows 10 app? If no, I'd probably get one of the other two. FWIW, all three of these DACS cost within $30 USD of each other including shipping and tax to New Jersey, USA (only Schiit charges these, Denafrips and Topping distributors do not).
I suggest ignoring MQA. It's both lossy and has audibly higher distortion on all the TIDAL albums I've tried. Analysis of MQA's claims discovered that, from the start, most of them were false, or totally the opposite.
Have you tried upsampling in PC to DSD256. AKM will perform very will to that format.
The focus on DACs these days is overwhelming. If 100% = best music listening experience, then 55% depends on your music source - the quality of recordings, 40% depends on your speakers & your amplification system, balance, 5% is shared by DACs, your other interfaces, equipment matching, cables etc etc.
Finally, most DACs sound good to very good even excellent from say $500 to $2000 mark. So, you do the maths... If someone wants to spend $5,000 to $100,000 or more well, excellent. Good on you. Just my HO.
For me, I would rather change my speakers and other equipments in the ratios above before even considering a new DAC. Or go completely analog bypassing the need for a DAC.
Fixed
Finally, most DACs sound good to very good even excellent from say $100 to $1000 mark
Did you try the DAC only mode? Perhaps you could try and review more about it. Thanks
I'm not sure how "DAC only mode" could make a difference with this design. As far as I can see, it only disables the volume control.
@@Currawong I am not sure too.. not very technical but... But... It does sound better. I don't know why. Not just me. Everyone else said the samething. The DAC only mode. Anyway have you tried? Curious though, since you are the pro here. Always great review from you with much more technically covered. Cheers
@@Currawong DAC only mode skips the pre--amp part of the D90, which is said to be mediocre, and allows use of a different pre-amp which will take full advantage of the D90 DAC capability.
@@Currawong you have to try it, it makes a difference
Turn off BT as well. :)
Love the "evil comparisons" with the other flavors out on the market. Will probably aim for a bifrost myself.
I am looking to upgrade my DAC from a century-old Fostex HPA8. This looks promising.
Thanks for your detailed review.
I have several issues with my Topping D90:
1. When connected to my MAC via the USB, the signal times out in 2 minutes. The MAC still recognizes the D90 as connected, but apparently the D90 sleeps after 2 minutes. If I switch the output and then switch it back to D90 in the MAC (via Qobuz UI, but also through the sound settings), then the Topping wakes up, but goes to sleep again at the second minute. This is documented here (www.head-fi.org/threads/topping-d90.926531/page-2).
2. Each time I switch the source in the Topping, there is a audible click coming from my speakers.
3. When connecting both the XLR and the RCA outputs from the D90 to my Emotiva XPA-2,3rd gen amp, there is loud hiss coming from speakers when the amp is set to receive signal through the RCA. If I disconnect the XLRs from the Topping, but keep the RCAs in, the hiss disappears.
4. I confirm that there is big difference between the preout and DAC settings in sound. Since the DAC is way better and only worth it, then the Preout functionality is useless.
5. When using on DAC, when streaming from Bluetooth, even the lowest volume on my BT in the phone was almost gonna blow my speakers if I didn't rush to stop the amp.
The first two issues are dealbreakers, so I am talking with Shenzhen's tech support for resolution. Appears to be a USB driver problem based on the link I provided above. If anyone knows, please send info. If I don't have it resolved, I'll just get the bifrost that you recommend as a better sounding unit.
Thoughts?
Thanks.
Amos, great video I am getting back to the audiophile world, I just had my HH Scott tube Amp and Preamp fully restore, I am using my iPad and red dragonfly for DAC. I would like to go to the next level to get more details, sound stage with a 1,100.00 budget.
I been watching some of your videos and reading comments from your community and is getting very hard to pick one. I have this one’s mind D90, Gustard A22, Arest 2, and Bifrost 2 any recommendation would be greatly appreciated
thank you
Currawong, I (we, the audiophile community), need you to review the Gustard A22, Gustard X26, and the LKS MH-DA004. We need you to do an A/B comparison amongst them and with your Schiit Yggy. I'm beginning to think that at least one of these DACs may outperform the Yggy, but I need confirmation. When you do this review, I kindly (and respectfully) ask you to shed any preconceived notion of higher price equals better product, made in China can't be good or lesser brand recognition can't beat pedigree. I really want to know based on sound and sound alone, how these high end Chinese DACs measure up.
The d90 in preamp mode was a huge disappointment to me, it made loud popping noises whenever I played, paused, stopped the music, when muting the dac and anytime sample rate changed.
I understand now why they're selling a separate preamp because the internal preamp module in the D90 is utterly useless.
Topping support confirmed the popping noises are due to the way it's designed, so I ditched it.
It was a sad choice I loved the way it sounded.
Excelent review!!Thanks!!!
Love your review. What if you check Gustard A18
Please take a look at Gustard A18 also from shenzhenaudio. Specs very close to D90 at $560.
Perhaps better yet yoy can review and compare the Gustard DAC A-22 to the D-90 or Aires ii. The A-22 appears to have a better power supply, is truly balance from to back and has duel AK 4499 chip (1/channel).
@@wokthetalk3079 Must not leave out SMSL M400 then. Would love to see all $800-ish DAC battle royale! D90, A22, Ares 2, Biforst 2, and M400.
By the way A18 does have the linear power supply too, but yeah only single AK4499. This is the one I'm more likely to get due to budget.
I have been listening to a number of reviews on this DAC and I'm convinced I will get something else. I stream music and would like a recommendation on a decent DAC. I am streaming from a Cambridge streamer. Can you recommend something for me?
Currawong have you tried out PCM upsampling using HQplayer with the D90, or even better DSD upsampling with DAC in DAC MODE?
considering not getting D90 after the Soekris 1421. Might stick with the Soekris.
The Soekris is awesome but the only down side is it's xmos usb interface making it sound analytical and none inspiring, very dry. To fix this, get a Gustard U16, not a singxer, and you'll extract incredible musicality from the soekris that wasn't been able before.
This one is on my list. Will listen to it when I will have a chance, wonder how it will compare to the new SMSL M400 AK4499 dac. Price wise they are very close. I You could compare it with the M400 that would be nice. Also one of the options I took into account was just getting the Fiio M15, yes its a DAP. But it could drive my SP200 when Im home.
WIll you ever do the Benchmark HPA4?
Any affordable pci-e card or converter to let PC output I2S for the D90?
Considering between D90se (greater transparency than D90) and the Schitt Bitfrost 2. Eventually I will stream music, however, my current needs are for an amp which only has RCA inputs and using hi quality Redbook, HDCD and SACD for many genres.
Any information on which Topping v Schitt whose RCA outputs perform more closely to the XLR outputs which were probably used for reviews would be helpful.
But it boils down to whether RCA outputs perform essentially close to their XLR. XLR is nice to have should I upgrade to another amp down the road.
I would like to maximize a balance between musicality (amp is warmer but detailed, Keces E40, reminds me of my Hegel h160 in ways), instrument separation, depth of SS (3Dness) and transparency without being overly clinical.
I had heard Topping D70s but low end bled into and affected instrument separation a bit. Still nice and perhaps a choice , but want a bit more.
Anyone? Thanks.
I had both. I kept the Bifrost 2 and returned the D90. Pardon the buzz words, but more nuanced and musical does sum it up for me. I found the D90 a touch brighter. Both are solid DACs.
Are you a headphone user or speakers? Thanks
@@delvalle9256 Headphone
moviedave2001 thanks
Haha. I doubt it's better than some PCs which maybe have very noisy USB outputs, but we do love to reckon it might.
Great review. I have the SMSL M500, has similar measurements as the D90 but is around 300+ dollars. Would love to hear how it compares to the D90 and would D90 be an upgrade over the M500...?
it does not have similar measurements, smsl m400 does tho. m500 is known for its heat disposal problems and in general lower build quality than topping, same seems to go for m400 which do measure in the same league, its 800 dollars tho.
As always great review. Would you comment on the sound of D90 vs Audio GD R2R DACs? I know Kingwa says that as you move higher up in his R2R DAC line, you move away from that euphonic sound of the R2R 11 and move closer to a studio or opposite end of spectrum as you described.
He has changed things quite a bit since I did the R7, so I'd have to get one the latest ones in to do so.
Is this an MQA version? against Matrix mini-i Pro 3 w/c one is better?
I have a THX789 and use my Fiio M11 pro as a dac at home. Would D90 be a significant upgrade for my desktop setup?
Yep i have the a90 d90 stack
@Currawong Thank you for review, im currently own D90 and use it in dac mode, connected to dell laptop using Supra usb cable. Is it worth to buy Singxer SU-2 digital interface for D90, there will be 10% sound improvement at least?
Thank you:)
I don't think there will be. I'd save for a better DAC, personally.
Math can’t tell you what to like.
But math can say that linear time-invariant systems aren’t phased by signal complexity-they handle music and signal generators identically-and THD+N and IMD measurements describe deviations from linear time-invariance that make that less true.
Did you try the FIR filters if they made a difference to drop off you noticed?
So I know this measures well and sounds great for music. But would it translate well to gaming. I currently use a A90 off my PC.
Great review many thanks. Could you let me know the makes of USB to IIS converters you mentioned briefly? How do think the D90 would perform with an Audiophilleo 2 USB/SPDIF convertor hooked up to a Mac Mini?
There are ones from Audio-gd, Singxer, Kitsune (modified Singxer), Gustard and quite a few others. An Audiophilleo with it would be interesting. I used to own the AP 1, but I think that the Chinese brands have bettered it.
Currawong Thanks mate! I’m thinking of getting a Singxer SU-2 for the Topping D90 MQA for use with my Mac Mini. This will feed into a Vitus RI-101 and Focal Diablo Utopias. Currently have Naim N-DAC / XPS / 202 / HICAP/ 200 into the Focals....
How to connection for IIS LVD ? Can it accepted for BT CSR8675 i2s out? Thank you
I think the DX7 Pro w it’s ESS 9038 pro chip will prob be a bit more resolving than the D90 w it’s AK variant. Forget the measurements, although the DX7 Pro measures really too
Would you pay $800 to fix a Chord Hugo TT (first gen) or go for a new Topping D90?
Please a review on SMSL M400 Dac.
Yeah I thankfully found a store that sells both the D90 and M400 so I might be able to demo, but nobody carries schiit stuff around here.
which better vs chord 2qute?
Don’t think it can better Chord products. They measured really well but given the price point and not decent input and power section components they won’t be able to beat Chord.
One more thing! Chord’s FPGA vs off the shelf dac chip I still thing Chord wins!
Your lead in music is the same as used by UA-cam channel podcaster, “ Federico talks Watches”.
Ha! I found the some of the music on a car channel.
Please tell me. I bought TOPPING DX7 Pro ES9038Pro DAC & Headphone amp , but I would like to listen to music on Sony WH-1000XM4. Do I need to buy this amplifier? What will change in terms of sound? TOPPING A90 Full Balanced Headphone Amplifier XLR Pre-Amplifier.
No, you don't use amps and DACs with Bluetooth headphones, there is no point. ua-cam.com/video/kFXv-umvhgM/v-deo.html
Fantastic!
Nice review! In my head I thought the D90 had a switching power supply... I think I was confusing it with the A90.
Turbulence3000 You are getting confused further because the Topping A90 as Power Supply has an internal solution very similar or identical to that present on the D90.
PC 12345 I remember seeing a picture of the A90 PCB and there were no “large” transformers. But I could be loosing my mind because I can’t find that image anymore...
A90 uses ac to dc power supply
Raizel Kuroi It use an internal high performance SMPS
You might as well get an RME ADI2 its the same price.
Question is what output are you using on all of them just a standard fixed 2 volts not 1 volt drive it amplifier a bit harder add some distortion always sounds better
Lol why anyone should buy rme when it have much less capable chip with worse components and generic switched power supply. What makes you think that rme is so good?
Measurement device manufacturers: Profuse sweating intensifies.
First off, thanks for the detailed review as always. All I wonder is whether getting this would be a sidegrade since having an idsd micro BL. Both are full mqa decoder. I know mqa subject is a bit complicated but I only listen to music via Tidal lately. A response regarding sidegrade or upgrade would be awesome! Thanks again!
Hi Currawong,
Do you reckon if someone were to add a USB cleaner such as the iFi iPurifier to the D90, the Bifrost 2 would lose its advantage over the D90?
I don't think so. It wouldn't change the sound signature fundamentally.
No. All these good dacs reject noise and filter jitter.
how does it compare to a saber dac eg mdac+
Ora Graphene GQ headphone is a better leap in sound than better dacs/amps.
Is this the D90 LE or the D9SE or the D90 III
The predecessor to all of them, the original D90.
You should go into other menu and put DAC in DAC mode not in Preamp mode as it is in review. :(
estaba pensando pasar del topping dx7 pro al d90 , pero creo que me quedare mas tiempo con el. gracias por la información.
quiero comprar el DX7 Pro, me lo recomiendas? has tenido algun problema con el?
@@skelewolf8431 te lo recomiendo totalmente, trae un muy buen dac, la etapa de amplificacion no es la mejor, pero es bastante decente, actualmente lo uso con unos monolith m1060 y unas focal chorus 605 y ambos suenan bastante bien.
@@tbobreak Gracias por la información, creo que el DX7 Pro lo usaría mas como modo Dac, pienso comprar aparte un amp el smsl sp200
@@skelewolf8431 si creo que como modo dac con otro amp seria rl mejor combo, aun que si no vas a usar la parte de amplificacion de audifonos, quizas te convenga otro como el d70 o el d50 , yo me voy a ir por un amp thx, hay uno de smsl a buen precio
@@tbobreak el smsl con amp thx es el sp200 del que te comento, bueno habrá que ver porque esta bien barato y si o si voy a comprar, pero no me decido aun el dac, este D90 o el dx7 pro, ambos traen un dac diferente
Why would you assume Topping only concern themselves with measurements? Have you spoken to the engineers?
CHI-FI companies are releasing products at a faster pace attracting customers with audio measurements with cheaper prices. The time spent behind engineering Topping D70 and D90 is less than an year. And whats the difference? Different DAC chips and little performance tweaks here and there. At the end of the day, what wins in SQ is how a DAC chip is implemented. Topping is not bad at doing a proper delta sigma implementation, however, the D90 does not perform as per its asking price.
@@sandeepsoma6410 Really? What in your experience does better at USD $700? And what is the basis for your claim?
@@johnstone7697 I have the D70 ($499) Bifrost 2 multibit ($699), D90 ($699) and ADI-2 DAC ($1149) and compared them extensively through my setup (Focal Utopia plugged into Questyle CMA 600i). All the DAC's were connected to CMA600i via RCA. I covered rock, jazz, pop and grunge leaving out techno and metal. All files were 24 bit 44.1 khz FLAC. I did this over a period of 8 days. From what I have observed, the RME came first in terms of sheer musicality and details. For example, when I listened to James Blake Assume Form, the small timed piano intro of the first track "Assume Form" had so minute microscopic details that only the ADI-2 DAC was able to polish and present it to you, the Bifrost-2 came second but I had to concentrate more (if I was laid back I would have lost it). Both the D90 and D70 failed in this task (even after discerning listening with my eyes closed). On the contrary, when listening to Stone Temple Pilot's " Down", the D90 and Bifrost-2 had a soundstage so big and deep that other DAC's failed to produce. On 95% of the tracks, the Schiit Bifrost-2 multibit is similar to D90 in terms of detail retrieval with a slight edge in having more texture. the D70 looses slightly to D90 in terms of details but both have same laid back Topping sound. All of them combined loose to ADI-2 in terms of sheer musicality and technical prowess
So summarizing this, I found that D90 is not a huge upgrade over D70. My ears are my experience here. But if you are a Topping fan who are just going by the measurements made on ASR site (where measurements does not talk about SQ), then you are better off buying a D90. If you want a DAC with a performance similar to D90 but with better texture, then buy the Bifrost-2 multibit (you can upgrade the hardware internally).
is weakest link it's the usb because it's not galvanized but the overall is convincing me.
I've got an Audio_GD Compass 2 (from 2013, I think) - should I upgrade to something like this, solely based on sound quality? Have the HD 800S.
Yes, I reckon so. Should be a noticeable step up.
@@Currawong thank you for the reply.
I have not heard the Bifrost 2 but own the Yggy 2 with Unison. A friend has the Yggy as well and a truly SOTA room. He has the Terminator as well for DSD and got the Topping D 90. I did some listening with it. It is a pleasant sounding DAC. Too pleasant. I found a sameness to the Sound from recording to recording that I did not like. I would recommend it for a bright sounding system but I will take the Yggy Unison any day over it. Of course, YMMV. It will be interesting to see how the Yggy sounds with a Unison USB source as well. Hopefully soon.
was the terminator better than the yggy?
mykeldg no, the Yggy was better. When my friend plays PCM, he uses the Yggy and the Terminator is for DSD. The Terminator is good but the Yggy better, of course, YMMV.
joe Whip wow that is interesting considering the denafrips is a discreet ladder design and almost twice the cost of the yggy. Ive had many well measuring dacs like the topping and it cant even beat the mimby so maybe schiit really does some interesting designs.
mykeldg I am not the only one that feels this way. There is a review on Audioshark where the guy who praised the Terminator vs. the Yggy reversed his opinion with the Yggy 2 and when he changed his preamp. I think the Yggy excels in reproducing piano as well as the double bass. I listen to mostly jazz and have spent way too much time in jazz clubs. Ray Brown sounds as I remember him,
I believe MQA version has an improved USB, which I wonder how it compares vs Schiit's Unison.
Would the hdmi looking connector work with a Chromecast?
No. It's an I2S connector and nothing to do with HDMI at all.
i own a bifrost 1 multibit(not gen 5 usb),will the bifrost or topping be a big improvement?
thx alex
Check out the Bifrost 2 thread over at the Headphones Community forum: forum.headphones.com/t/schiit-bifrost-2-dac-official-thread/4074
Most people there say the Bifrost 2 is a noticeable upgrade over the Bifrost 1
There's also a D90 thread: forum.headphones.com/t/topping-d90-dac-official-thread/5334
@@nathan518 thank you
Don't really get that point "USB to I2S converting". What is the logical reason? The most important would be not to convert to USB signal and directly send it through HDMI from I2S out to the DAC's I2S input.
What would output the I2S though?
@@Currawong If a streamer has an inbuilt HDD slot with the SATA you probably already I2S. Then if this streamer has an I2S output there is, the PCB signal unchanged and sent to the dac. Obviously most of the time dedicated DACs are better than streamer's inbuilt versions but obvious, not so many streamer has I2S out with HDD (SSD) slot. You're right too.
He mentions USB to I2S cables a few times. But I have not been able to find anything on line.
USB to I2S converters, not cables.
@@Currawong ah, then that would likely only make things worse, as the USB to some receiver is in the loop either way.
what is the point of usb to I2S converter? You already have lost the quality in the USB. Isn't there a streamer or any other source that outputs I2S directly?
USB transmission, if bit-perfect doesn't lose any quality from the music. The issues with USB have to do with the processing, which generates noise. That can be managed by careful design. There are indeed streamers which indeed do output I2S directly.
@@Currawong Can you name names?
The only one I've used is the Soundaware D300REF which I have here. I haven't been following the streamer market at all.
Does anyone who owns the D90 notice it get warm to the touch? I’m trying to find out if it’s normal.
It's normal.
intro music same as @federicotalkswatches ? What's up with that? Is this a copyright free track?
Yes. UA-cam has a library.
Currawong Can you share a link to it? It's the best tune, especially for James bond fans! Oh and thank you for your videos I really enjoy them👍
yes - pure sound ------ and i have GOOOOOD Sounds for mental timeswitch biotuning orcestra from other galaxy for you to listen
Dx7 PRO vs D90 ?? which is better?
Sabre vs ak sound. Just different flavors of sound.
I have the D50s best value DAC
I have D50 DAC. It worked wonder with the sound of my system.
Are these IMR RAH IEM hanging on the corner of the table 😉
No, not those. Check the "Community" tab of my channel for a pic of the IEMs I'm reviewing.
Here's my thing. If the topping improved quite a bit with a USB interface, then spending big bucks on R2R and others mega expensive dacs is truly a waste, if in 5 years time the tech will change.
Is mqa only via usb?
Yes.