Honestly, a GOOD DM can absolutely turn a bad system into a good game. Being involved in RPG's since the 70's, I've played with a lot of masters who took slender rulesets and added their flair to the game. I played 1 game at GenCon with Gary Gygax under his original rules in the 90's and he DEFINITELY had a fun game... That ruleset barely covered the rules compared to modern RPG's. He made the game.
My group and I had an awkward moment about year ago. All sitting around the table, and I was like, "Looks like they're making new books...do you guys wanna just make our own RPG instead of paying a company to do it worse?" I kid you not, everyone at the same time said, "Uh, yuh!" So, that's what we play, instead of WOTC pulp bull.
And you'll end up with a system specifically designed for YOUR group, not a product that is trying to please everyone all at once (and fails to do so).
You're no taking into account that players who aren't used to great DMs with great homebrew campaigns wont complain because they dont know any better. I agree that the hobby is going to shrink, but it has shrunk before and then grown again. The pendulum will swing again.
@@Joethelawyer I cant see dungeons and dragons going away. Even if WoTC stops making the books, the hobby will continue. WotC just isnt capable of stopping the hobby
@Joethelawyer D&D can't die out, though. Even if Hasbro axed it, it will always exist. Worst case scenario is that there are no future updates, and I'm not sure that's detrimental to the staying power of D&D
what kills me about this blatant strategy, is that they could just keep pulling a baldurs gate 3 and just make good games that are dnd-related, and make people want to play ACTUAL dnd even more. A lot of my friends from the college days got into dnd mainly because of tie-in video games. wotc could easily do this, yet theyre convinced the VTT is the way forward
So right.. ONE D&D is set for digital.. all maps and all.. they are aiming to take out the table and replace it with computers, and video game style play
Too bad for them that TTRPGs are so decentralized in general that there's more than enough great games out there to fill the void, to say nothing of just continuing to play 5E and the bazillion unofficial supplements that exist.
I think wizards kinda lost touch with this more in-person scene a long time ago. Due to the rise of streamed games, many players love the idea of joining a game, but there is no support infrastructure for them (I.e. actual games being run by people they know). I don’t think the hobby is dying tho. There are so many fantastic and creative alternative games out there. The grassroots movement for this hobby is impossible to eradicate.
This is also why I started in my town to host workshops for players who are interested to become GMs no matter what system they play and to find their OWN UNIQUE WAY to GM. This is the way.
Our local hobby store started two years ago with one D&D game every other Wednesday on a night that catered to Magic card games. Within six months it was two tables (same campaign; two GMs). within a year we had other folks stepping up to GM on the opposite Wednesdays adn the card players found another night. NOw we have a rotating Wednesday night schedule of four D&D games, two Pathfinder games, three Star wars games, and an EDH game, all at the hobby store with the expectation that you'll include neew players if they show up. It CAN happen if the hobby store is wiliing
Modern D&D will become a videogame. The rest ot us will continue to play other TTRPGs. The TTRPG hobby doesn't need D&D anymore. There are plenty of alternatives or old editions.
Yeah, the whole ‘we’re the only game in town’ WotC swagger is like watching a lion trying to take down a rhino. We know you’re all up in our face about this whatever this is you’re doing. We just don’t care and there’s not a hell of a lot you can do about it.
Exactly. In the last year Ive played & GMed, Cyberpunk, Dragonbane, Stormbringer, Call of Chthulu, Barbarians of Lemuria and a couple of homebrew things. Who needs WotC ?
Good DMs don't really grow the business though. From WOTC's perspective, a good DM is suboptimal - a good DM tends to retain the same players for a long time, which means they're not very often running for new players and their players aren't needing to develop an interest in D&D as a brand outside of their DM's game. A good DM is also much less interested in buying WOTC's products, and much more willing to try other systems. WOTC's business model for a while now has been to try to create an audience of people who identify themselves as "D&D players" but who don't actually play D&D much. The most profitable person is the one who buys all the player-facing material to theorycraft more characters than they'll ever play. Good DMs don't buy that many books because WOTC's books are useless to good DMs, and players who have regular tables don't buy many books because their DM has all the information they need for their game. The people who do buy lots of books are the people who drift between online games and drop-in AL-style games, who are creating a new character every couple of weeks because that's how long they stay in a game. And I think this is why WOTC has been so hostile to DMs for the past 4 years or so - they want there to be tension between DMs and players, because they want players feeling unsatisfied by any game they join. It's the perception that no D&D is better than imperfect D&D that keeps players hooked on D&D as a brand rather than D&D as a game: If every DM is running the game wrong, WOTC gets to remain sacred and the player buys another book so that next time they drop into a game, they can play something even stupider than the human-sized bacterium they played last time.
@@Joethelawyer agree but one could argue that really content creators grew their business for them. If not for Critical Role and the plethora of other content creators would it have really grown based on the quality and content. I would argue no it would not have. The third party content is often far better and is why WOTC tried to make a grab for a higher percentage of the license profit from them. WOTC simply has the golden goose but not sure they know what to do with it. Which is proven time and time again when they demonize and isolate their customer base.
@Brian-px9gu those things are responsible for the huge increase of late. But these idiots at wotc think they are responsible for it. Like being born on third base and running you hit a triple. They don’t know what to do. You’re right. Outside of those anomalies though, I think it’s DM’s that are responsible for growth
The BEST videogame has a three to eleven year life span. D&D has been going for fifty. They are not the same thing, and following videogames is bass ackwards.
The gamble they're taking is that they can be the League of Legends, that lasts forever by creating addiction; and if that fails, they want to be the Fifa, that releases a new identical replacement game every year, that people buy because of brand loyalty and because that's where the rest of the playerbase has moved.
@@Joethelawyer I think what they are doing with the VTT is going to shift the game to almost 100% digital. WOTC knows that players only buy a few things, and DM's are their primary customers with pen and paper D&D. Digital D&D--every one pay subscription fees and for all the cool upgrades--you'll eventually have micro transactions. I expect they will develop AI DMs in the not too distant future, too. It's going to be a completely different game.
My group survived the Edition Wars and 4E - I mostly ran homebrew during those years. Between what I have and what I can make, if the industry collapsed today, my group will keep going. You are right though - WotC doesn't care enough about DMs and the hobby. They're trying to figure out how to monetize the "community" they've cultivated from Twitter, Seattle, and Critical Role.
I'm a 2nd gen or Legacy TTRPG player. My Father played Chainmail in college (not sure which Gen he started on), and he passed down the experiences to me started at age 7 With DnD. I remember playing Palace of the Vampire Queen with a table populated by family and friends (We won through Raw luck). I was drawn into the hobby by family, and in High School I started running ADnD games for my friends. Putting them through Secret of Bone hill (and another I can't recall the name of ATM). I matured and continued playing and running games. I also have the controversial opinion of liking 4th Editions strong mechanical structure empowering roleplay but I'm not going to make that argument here 😂. Years of running games have made me a great DM with strong improvisational skills. My Brother and various friends have gone on to continue playing and running games for their kids. Whom we can hope will grow to love TTRPGs as well. That said I've watched the hobby morph and change over my life. The rise and fall of Gaming stores, and the death of the pickup game. Pickup games died because frankly, we don't want to put up with players that are abrasive to our enjoyment of the game. So now a protective layer has been constructed to antagonistic players from joining and to help kick them out if they get in. With computers and the internet, we don't have to worry about a poorly socialized individual sitting down and trying to TPK the party just for the laughs (jokes on us, this totally still happens). There are downsides to this approach. Smaller local communities, less storefront support, fewer opportunities to experiment with new systems, and of course, people being denied the opportunity to learn how to deal with troublesome players (often folk just end games rather than kick out the problem player). So hopefully, we will find a happy balance.
You are way optimistic about WotC’s future development of DnD than I. If it was as simple as WotC providing more tools for people that like or need some on-line content then a happy balance is possible. Unfortunately, WotC’s motivation appears to have much more sinister undertones.
💯- they make crappy settings, crappy adventures, and complex rules to drive book sales... not to enable creative players and game masters to do what was the core of D&D since 1974 - have FUN together. We've NEVER needed more books or new editions - they do to make more money.
Agreed!! They peaked at 2e. All downhill from there in terms of creativity and style. The rules are better organized and make more sense in later editions. But the 3.x bloat sucked. 4.0 was a living abortion. 5e had the clearest rules but the game lacked something. No soul. Like it was made by committee
It’s unrealistic to expect growth to continue quarter after quarter. But you can tell that to Wall Street. So companies like wotc lie and make bullshit up while they look for new jobs before the inevitable failure
@Joethelawyer It's called Capitalism. That's how it works. Don't like it? Become a communist and destroy intellectual property rights. Make DnD a product produced by the masses for the masses.
i play since 1983, in a place kept far away from the markets until the 2000s (no eady access to renewals) ... i went through chaotic 1e, nuttered 2e, mechanic 3e, videogamish 4e and bought 5 ed but never played it cause it was enough ... last 10 years ive played a homebrew mix of rules that pleases my group and lets the narrative developpe while the mechanics run smoothly enough ... this kind of game will never die cause it trascends trends or fashions, cause its a way of life
Your homebrew approach to adopting, rejecting and modifying game mechanics to suit your style and group is exactly what WotC hates and fears most. Because once you start viewing DnD content through a critical lens it becomes apparent that most of what passes for modern DnD canon is irrelevant nonsense that can be happily ignored without affecting the quality of your gaming experience. And if WotC can’t convince you that they have a monopoly on your ideas they can’t convince you that they have a monopoly on your wallet. They’re like that annoying furry at a tourist attraction that keeps pestering you to take a selfie for five bucks. They’re not actually that important to your experience and they know it. What they hope is that you don’t know it.
The AI currently available can't improvise anywhere near the ability of even a novice DM. Role playing is about the experience and current AI simply cannot supply that.
Great video fellow lawyer. Basic Fantasy is free. Dungeon Crawl Classics and Shadowdark starter sets are free. Spread the word. I will do my level best to never buy another Wizards product or Hasbro for that matter. I just passed on something yesterday when I noticed it was Hasbro, and hope they cell Dungeons & Dragons.
@@darby2314 It reminds me of going back to Skyrim and playing the entire game as just a thief with just daggers or just a fighter with no magic etc. It's more of a challenge. Otherwise we tend to just make the same optimized multiclass player we always do and play it just the way we always do.
my last purchase was old TSR player's handbook, MM and DMG. i never cared for WOTC. i've run my games using online resources alone. they haven;t gotten a cent from me.
@@Joethelawyer Cairn RPG is a newish 20 page indie game based on a few other rules sets. You can look up the SRD. No rolls to see if you can succeed. Only saves and damage.
If WOTC kills D&D, the hobby will live on without them. My games are doing fine and I haven't bought so much as a single magic card from them in 3 years. All they have is the IP and the logo at this point, and aren't likely to improve. BG3 was a huge shot in the arm for them... of which they contributed nothing but the existing game system the game uses (most fun i've had playing 5e in a long time) but the setting already existed before them. everything else was done by Larian's staff, not WOTC. If the game does die, there will be a period of suspended animation that gives people a break from official crap while homebrew rules the day, and emerges as the new replacement. Games and storytelling have been around since the dawn of time (hell, we found a d20 from ancient rome...), and this just was a cool intersection that won't be lost to history because too many people are making their own, superior thing and just need to publish it.
I don't really care what WotC does, I already own my books and set up my own challenges for the players. No matter what bad decision WotC does I can outlive them.
I have been a DM for 37 years, been playing since 1980. I have discovered the independent OSR gaming scene and have full switched to EZD6 and Shadowdark. The hardest part of playing these days is getting a group of dedicated players. Campaigns die off after session 5, and getting players to sit and play is a serious issue. This DM is looking for players.
A DM that I think does an excellent job is Jon Britton, of 3d6, Down the Line. He uses houseruled OSE rules, and he just runs the game. There is no ten minute back story whenever a player introduces a new character. His group is currently playing through “The Halls of Arden Vul”.
The OSR is a blessing. Did you ckeck the Knave 2e Jam? Lots of old school material there. I made my own called Arms of the Undying, even used the no-repro blue for extra oldschoolness. Hope you like it. Great channel.
I wouldn’t discount AI / LLM, I am not so sure that they will “always suck”. We come full circle back to MUX/MUD/MUSH in the sense of a text-based experience mediated by a computer screen but I think with mobile integration that over time a viable “product” will emerge. Not to mention the IP and brand represent a gold mine for Hasbro, outside of grognards playing at a tabletop. Movies, video games, etc.
Developing AI for virtual gaming is never going to be a cutting edge priority. There’s much more money to be made, and therefore focus, on industries like car manufacturing. And the AI for self-driving cars is dangerously inapt and inept. It copes well enough when conditions are predictable but is regularly derailed by events and obstacles that would barely register with a human driver. At the moment AI is like the programmed responses from old text based adventures with the ability to add or modify responses from ‘experience’ using fuzzy logic. It can barely drive a car. The range of possible options for RPG players in any given moment is infinitely more varied and require a GM to use a variety of skills and judgment calls that AI does not yet have the capacity to match. Get back to me when AI can drive a car as competently as a human. Then, maybe, we can talk about the use case for AI GMs.
Just yesterday I watched the UA-cam Video "The Rise of Boutique RPGs" and it matches so well with this video. Mancave used to look like this coach next to a book shelve and now they are over the top merch and tables with screen and beamers and fog machines, lots of LEDs. It's more conspicuous consumption than really a love for the hobby.
Joe, I am just discovering you. Awesome channel. I been playing since '82 Moldvay Boxed Set. My favorite games now are BECMI, CoC and Mythras. D&D ain't going out like that. I've been training High Schoolers (I'm a Techer, and I got a rpg club - they named it Talisman!) to run games for a few years now and they can see the difference between "emergent" play and railroading. I'm holding it down on my end! 😎👍
WOTC doesn't have a problem with this game at all, they just don't care about the current format that its in right now. Everyone knows they want to take the IP and change it over into a digital game, a video game. The legacy version of the game with books and physical dice will just be a novelty that they continue to make which makes them a little money, but is more for nostalgia and data mining. Much like Marvel and DC comics have become. So its not that they hate or dislike D&D or Dungeon Masters, its just that they don't care about that format anymore. 100% of their attention is focused on a monatized digital format.
D&D 5E just doesn't support DMs... WotC has focused on monetizing the players while neglecting good products for DMs and have handled everything horrendously - from how they treat the local game store to how they create/design products, etc... but that isn't the only problem with tabletop gaming. I'm a huge OSR fan, and eventually committed to Old School Essentials, primarily because it's kind of the 'premier' OSR game out there in an effort to be able to find as many people near me to play as possible, but there are so many (awesome, I might add) OSR choices, that the community is fractured and its really difficult to get a game in with people that actually know the system you're playing. The OSR community is incredibly fractured with myriads of new games getting released every day it seems... most of them are based on some older system with a minor tweak and are relatively compatible... but others aren't... Also, game stores and their owners have been f'd so hard for so long by WotC, that they're essentially battered wives just looking for any bit of kindness - the local store near me pretty much exclusively sells WotC D&D 5E products and only lets you set up a time for 5E on their website... so I just showed up there with two buddies to play Old School Essentials and the owner came over and kind of gave us some crap because they don't sell that book there, and he said to pick a system of what they do carry, which of course is only D&D 5E... I asked the guy why they didn't carry a few copies of OSE and he just shrugged...
@eitherorlok lol yeah the dmg is kinda of useless for 5e. I read it and couldn’t find any good advice in it on how to actually run a game. Just broad topic overviews. Only useful for the magic item tables etc.
WOTC have failed to explain how they will develop adventures for the VTT in a timely manner. They showed the toolset being used and had to speed up the footage just to build a small inn . Try cranking out Queen of the spiders in less than a year.
I recall Disney infinity and marvel at the toy boxes they created and shared whilst it was active. Now replace those with DMs using the vtt to create their own games and as they improve wotc and Hasbro look on eagerly thinking it’s only a matter of time before the ai learns to do the same. Very unlikely but what will it take before they recognise that?
Rather bleak mindset. I agree WOTC are terrible. But I'm also a new DM using a VTT to play a weekly game. I have two 'forever DMs' as players who 25 sessions in report they're having a great time. I've played D&D for 2 years, and DMd for only 6 months. The hobby isn't going to die. It'll thrive in spite of WOTC. The D&D movie just smashed it on Netflix. Stranger Things hasn't finished yet. Baldurs Gate 3 was incredible and I'm seeing swathes of people who want more of that joining groups I'm in online. D&D is changing in our new digital landscape, but it isn't going anywhere
4:54 PRECISELY. WotC figures the only way you can pry a young customer base from the screen in their hand is to glue them to the screen in their houses with all sorts of pixelated "Ooh, shinys!" that will bleed your wallet dry. All "run" by a sterile, clunky, and soulless AI "DM" that can't run a real adventure no matter how many CPU cycles you throw at it. Good luck, WotC, you're gonna need it. And as I watch you flounder, I'll be ever-expanding on my 40+ year old homebrew setting.
At the moment DnD is the biggest fish in the pond. The problem that WotC are going to have is that once they go digital they will be a small fish in a big pond of other, bigger shinies. Not sure why you’d exchange overwhelming market dominance for whatever the hell else they seem to doing but what do I know?
@@Joethelawyer ive come to the right channel then. Myself and many in my DnD group share many of the sentiments youve laid out in this vid. I am our newest DM, and I feel like WotC is leaving us behind. Ive been seeking out old books and game systems since.
I dont get why people rage so much against D&D, most players have found a system they like and stick to it. Nobody HAS to buy the new stuff Wizards releases, plenty of old school games or even older versions of D&D floating around.
"they would not recognized a creative, skilled or talented person if they dumbed an espresso on their head" THIS, exactly this. But this is not only a Hollywood or WOTC problem. It's a problem across all industries that go mainstream. One example is the IT industry. Talented, passionate developers with decades of experience get skipped over graduates from prestigious unis. That's another topic of course, but that happens when industry make it big. There is also the shitification-pipeline. Start good and then go over to monetization and shareholder-pipeline.
Spot on. The phenomenon is everywhere. In the CRPG realm, look what happened to BioWare. They were universally lauded for their work. They were successful. Then they got acquired by EA and had to expand the customer base to make more $$. In the process, in my opinion, they lost the things that made their games truly great. Now they're just another developer.
The mba’s took over and drove the good creative out so the mba’s could take all the credit. Even though they know jack shit about being a creative person.
I think WotC makes the game more complicated so they can sell more books. What a headache. I left 5e long before the ogl debacle. Simpler games like Shadowdark are my jam now. Screw WotC.
So, our group switched to basic fantasy years ago and isn't looking back because D&D became 1) way too complicated and 2) way too expensive. basic fantasy's price point is zero dollars and zero cents if you want PDF on your phone or cheap if you want physical copies. Folks, if you can't have fun with 4 races and 4 classes then having 50 of each won't help you.
In my experience, gaming at stores has always sucked. The only way to play is to have a group of friends and family that has a set schedule, whether that be every week, every two weeks, or once a month. My kids, most are now adults, and they still play with me and my friends.
Capitalism is an economic system based on the private ownership of the means of production and their operation for profit. Cronyism is a form of favoritism that rewards friends or allies with jobs, contracts, or advantages, especially in politics and business. Unless there are extenuating details of which I am unaware, Capitalism appears to be, on balance, the more appropriate word in this particular case. Am I doing this right?
On point man. And they could learn a thing or two from the big gyms. Even though most of them people don't stay there for very long as individual a lot of them manage to keep people going by investing on their coaches, and giving them space to work with "privet" clients there.
Epic rant. Not sure I 100% would have used your phraseology or comparisons to express the same concepts but valid points at their core all round. One of the major problems that Wizards of the Coast have is their assumptions about player expectations. Not expectations of how WotC will behave, which are rock bottom (see 5.1th edition), but expectations of the player’s game experience. And this is where good GMs come in and why WotC hates them. Because a good GM provides a theatre of the imagination that transcends the rules mechanics of any particular RPG. The system is less important than the enjoyment of the participants involved, so rules are bent, broken, ignored, home-brewed and followed to the letter by the GM in pursuit of that enjoyment. And once you’ve played with a good GM your expectations of your experience change. RPG is not multiplayer, on-line with less racial slurs. There is a fundamental difference in the interactions between the player and the game. You can only win an RPG in the narrowest sense. Mostly, the goal is survival with style, from moment to moment, session to session, campaign to campaign. The game mechanics provide the framework and a good GM provides everything else. And once you realise that a good GM is more important than blind adherence to the combat bonuses from dual wielding against left-handed orcs in bright sunlight it slowly dawns that perhaps, none of the rules are set in stone. Perhaps worshipping at the alter of whatever power creep, class abilities your character gained from the latest edition of Gekko’s Cesspit of Nihilism is a distraction. Baubles and circuses. Good GMs not only know what makes a good game but also educate their players by example. And that makes them dangerous. Martin Luther dangerous. Defenders of the true faith that expose the crumbling edifice of deceit and subterfuge that now serves no-one but Mammon. WotC knows this. And hate GMs with every fibre of their bloated, corporate being because of it.
Appreciate that. Sorry about the wall of text. Cut my teeth on Keep on the Borderlands. Played AD&D and 2nd ed. for years. Came back to standard 5E a few years ago. Different but OK I can work with this. Everything since has been a deliberately crafted shit show of monumental proportions designed to appeal to ignorance and arrogance. Including, and possibly especially, the latest cynical, bland, absolute disaster of a reboot that seeks to codify and sanctify the official lobotomisation of the player base so that they never realise what’s actually missing. I was actually mad and disappointed with how badly they dropped the ball for 5.1th edition. Until I realised it’s a feature, not a bug. Stick a fork in ‘em, they’re done.
Brother, what did you do to deserve so many blandnamefourdigit shilltrolls in your comments section? I’ve been playing whackamole with them all day which is fun but exhausting. It’s almost as if some of the commentariat lack even a rudimentary understanding of the salient points you discussed and instead focus on tangential inconsequentialities that seem to be informed by a fundamental misunderstanding of your basic premise and a lack of willingness to engage in anything that resembles a good faith argument. Or something.
Spot on wotc is filled with some very wicked and demented people and does not really deserve to continue as a company and will not succeed the rot is too deep and set in in their company. OSR is the future of this hobby
The hobby has collectors and players. They have books and miniatures. You have to cater to all the audiences to make money. There is also the UA-camr content makers, and especially live play. Which caters to the section of the community that doesn't want to collect or play but just watch someone else play. The corpos want to push it all online and then micro transactions the players to death without giving anyone any real value. Support the hobby by supporting people making collectable content and then play with the books and the miniatures.
Re books. I’m actively ignoring anything produced in the last ten years. Modified 2014 PHB rules only. They’re goofy and a little unbalanced as written but they still have some heart and soul. None of the modules or supplements produced since have the slightest appeal whatsoever. Cynically devised, uniformly awful content for the sake of content.
Oh I completely agree. There was one 2ed(?) module from the late 80’s that we spent five sessions playing before everyone agreeing to give it up. Don’t remember its name but it was a classic railroad before any of us had ever heard of the term. Green dragon encounter is the only detail that sticks out but otherwise a forgettable grind. If anyone can remember its name I’d appreciate it if you kept it to yourself.
I predict we are going to see a lot more homebrewed systems, even simple ones, gain traction when wizard's virtual one comes out. As we seen it happen before when people became disillusioned with DND. 4th edition and later the ogl? Both times players and dms went to other systems, notably pathfinder.
The thing is some of us are very fond of the old girl. Sure, some of it was completely janky and we rarely played strictly rules as written but that was tacitly encouraged. DnD has long been a fun framework to build on/modify because one of its strengths is its customisability. The problem is that WotC has spent the last ten years white-anting the framework of DnD by releasing a series of truly awful supplements, each one worse than the last, that add bloat at the expense of verisimilitude. So the basic rules are now barely worth customising and once it goes on-line that will barely be an option. So we get to play by their objectively awful rules, unmodified, or we don’t play at all. What WotC doesn’t seem to understand is that’s not nearly as much of a threat as they seem to think it is.
The weird thing is that the dust had barely settled on the underaged, indentured servants hand-stitching the covers on the first run of the 2014 PHB before comments sections all over the internet were full of gnarly old grognards predicting more or less the situation we find ourselves in today. Warning us that WotC were suffering under a delusion that they were nurturing a raptor which, impressive as that seems, would slowly evolve the brightly coloured plumage of its Bird of Paradise final form. And now, ten years later, that delusion has all but guaranteed the end of an era, the last of the pencil and paper, dining room table, clatter of dice and ice, stained character sheets with a small hole where the hit points total used to be, hard back DnD rules books. For in the end it didn’t matter what type of dinosaur WotC actually had, only the dinosaur they thought they had. The rainforest goose that would lay a thousand eggs and a thousand more logs barely distinguishable from the eggs and lo, the inchoate and the exudate would together be worth a Magic the Gathering youtuber’s ransom. Also, if you’re not publishing books you never have to finish writing one worth publishing. When the rules are all part of an on-line gaming ‘experience’ you can just patch them as you go using an underpaid, offshore workforce. I hear Kolkata’s lovely this time of year. Also, also that whole ‘underaged hand stitching’ bit from the first paragraph may have been a bit out of line. The 2014 PHB was glued.
Hi! I've been running a "home brew" combining the best elements of AD&D(1st and 2nd) with Palladium that results in a very fast and tight game. But newer players in my group are taken aback by it cause most of them come from 5e and/or video games. They think that they're supposed to be super heros at level one!😅
old man yells out cloud. theres lots of games that people play outside of dnd. lancer, shadowdark, dragonbane. people run games online all the time. but offline people play with people they know mostly. just because you don't see alot of people playing random games in stores because dnd with randos sucks. if you want to start pickup games start a local group. if you build it they will come. section at 8:00 is mad cringe. " the hobby" is more than dungeons and dragons 5th edition.
I feel lucky that I only recently got into the hobby via the OSR, and I’ve got no desire to play 5E or whatever they’re calling the new one. One other thing about generating adventures using AI is it will just churn out bland porridge sludge because all it can do is mash together existing adventures. It won’t even truly understand the adventures it makes, it’ll just understand that one type of word usually follows another type so it puts them together, e.g. a [princess] has been kidnapped by a [wizard]. It doesn’t have any idea what a princess or a wizard is, it just regularly sees them put together in that way so it recreates that sentence. It’ll never write anything like some of the wacky gonzo stories you get in a game like Dungeon Crawl Classics.
Plus they’re going to have to appeal to a whole new cohort of players. Serious doubts there will be much uptake from current players unless there’s some brilliant twist to the plan we’ve all missed.
Art makes you feel and contemplate. And when that happens there is a very real danger that people might come to the slow realisation that they don’t need to consume our BRAND NEW AND EXCITING THING.
I think these rants miss two important things. Hasbro is big enough to put thousands of programmers onto a project. If they do it well, they can utilise that project for way more than D&D. It’s well within their remit to completely reinvent the RPG experience because of their size. Apple changed the phone. Microsoft changed computing. Size matters. And it’s OK for them to change it. They are going to lose their core market position doing it, but that’s their risk to take. Second issue is that the game of D&D needs to create profit to justify local store time. The nature of the hobby is that card games make money. Selling food makes money. Selling drinks makes money. You’re running the equivalent of a Bible study in a local game shop. No profits if people don’t buy minis constantly (worthwhile business proposal?) etc. just like church. It’s a nonprofit task. Maybe thirdly, you seem to have a thesis but don’t explain how D&D is actually antiDM. They are simply developing a product, and they can’t mentor people into loving the game. It’s like asking a boxing glove manufacturer to grow the sport of boxing. They run sewing machines, not sports clubs. Hasbro is completely unrelated to the community. They sell books. They don’t run the cons. The shops. The game nights. Perhaps it’s worth rethinking what the community needs. I don’t think it’s useful to blame Hasbro, because I don’t see them having anything to do with my TSR books. They are just as irrelevant to me as Warhammer 40k models. It’s somethi I see in the shop. That’s it.
Have you ever tasted chocolate made with corn syrup? It is objectively worse than chocolate made with sugar. Have you ever noticed that the chocolate used to make Easter eggs is objectively worse than other chocolate? Cheaper ingredients and manufacturing processes are deliberately used to maximise profits because of what amounts to a captive market. WotC has been aggressively marketing corn syrup Easter eggs for years and wants consumers to believe that this is the only chocolate that exists. And for consumers who have never tried anything else, it is. Without wishing to appear rude, your post comes across as a little tangential to the point of the discussion and a little apologist regarding WotC’s motivation and role. If WotC was serious about chocolate they’d be trying to compete with Lindt by making a quality product rather than pretending they’re competing with Lindt but producing the bland, floury, cloying, uninspiring blocks of regret in shiny wrappers that are constantly disgorged in bulk quantities from their factory of sadness. Problem is, I’ve tried Lindt and can tell the difference.
But tell us what you really think.... OSR Old School Rant. Sounds like an American, talks like an Aussie. I played old school- Difficulty level- Tough but kept you on your toes. 3.5- Moderate challenge 5- Easy but accesable. . 2024 Watered down it down so much, they've missed the whole point of D&D. Hey, gain Inspiration for a having a long rest, halfings moving at 30, Screw Elrond, cant have half-races. AND they have mistook D&D for a computer game.
I should add that I am not against your position, I think my point is that we still maintain some interest in the company and the brand despite it being completely irrelevant to the hobby for us. You play a game, you don’t owe anything to Hasbro. It’s like owing something to the NBA because you play pickup basketball. If you really don’t like any of the teams, you don’t have to care about anything the NBa does. 💡
@@Joethelawyer they are caretakers of a brand name. Your investment isn’t like a car. You bought a basketball so go play with your friends rather than get upset about Ari’s Kobe joke or Le Bron’s travelling. Most parasocial relationships with a brand are not deeply negative like Hasbro. But this time you really get to realise that they have no power other than that which you give them. I have Jenga and Monopoly. I don’t care about what Hasbro is doing with those brands. That relationship has concluded.
@@Joethelawyer if you play monopoly once a month for years, that’s a hobby. You are inserting the brand when it literally has no business being present. Does Penguin have any impact on you once you’ve bought the book? D&D is just a game too. The hobby is getting together and playing it. It’s not purchasing WOTC products. (And in fairness, I think the card games are different. Purchases of cards IS part of the hobby)
I will say as a new dm and my 3 players are all new as well. We knew of dnd, but my gf got me into critical role, we all played bg3 and liked the dnd movie and none of us are big stranger things people but I know that has gotten alot of people interesting as well. As newer players I think with the wide spread of media that is how people are getting into the game now, not people asking others and if that is the case most of the people doing that are online friends and the games are played online. I am running the starter kit for ice spire (since the other phandalin one isn't sold anymore) was 15 dollars on Amazon for me to help get into the game. From a perspective of a new dm/player I do like the book, it gives me a guide for the overall adventure story. I have changed drastically the entire story but I have a nice shell, made some npcs evil, it's now based around talos trying to do things, the dragon is secondary, the pcs are all based around their gods story wise and they are really enjoying the game. I will also say regarding dissing the magic school adventure is just saying it's not something for you rather than it's stupid. I do like Harry potter stuff I was in second grade when the first movie came out and I'm 32 now. I probably wouldn't play it however I know some super fans of Harry potter and the world there and that adventure wpuld probably get them into dnd honestly, and they'd have a good time. Saying as well that dnd players are all nerds that can't get laid is also a bit of an odd (to me atleast) ideology being stated, I have a gf and she is a player, my friends fiance is a player, and I know abd have seen alot of females play dnd. Having an AI be a dm I do find odd but for instance I'd like to be a player myself atleast once but my friends arnt really the best or into being a dm, they kind of have the idea of it being really stressful. So I can see how if someone wanted to play but every new player was afraid to dm instead of not ever playing they may feel more comfortable having an AI adventure atleast at first, maybe that gets them to say "it's not that hard I guess I can do that". I think it's better to just say "maybe this product isn't for me" and move on, new players need guidance for sure to some level and they want to try to entice new players so I get where they are coming from. The younger generation from me is all about technology, and will probably be alot more based online. I was interested in what you had to say at first but ypu just sort of went in a spiral of negativity and if I didn't know much or was newer and haven't watch alot of UA-cam dnd content I'd probably either just avoid the hobby entirely due to thinking players will be this negative in the game as well as real life, and also everything adventure wise to help me learn is terrible so I don't have the time or ability at first to create a whole world. Secondly I can tell you are very passionate about dnd and that's great but your mindset seems extremely narrow, basically stating zero women play the game is kind of an odd take, again it's not 1970 or 1980 anymore, that was 50 plus years ago. Segregation was only 20ish years before that time frame so kind of crazy to view it like that. I'd say maybe not be so brutal with your statements because you may chase new people off that find your videos. It's perfectly great to be critical and I like that, maybe talk specifically about some adventures and instead of say whatever the hell that is and trash something think of how popular said idea is and how it may actually sell dnd to new comers which should be a good thing. There is enough out there to pull in new players, but if I can only read the dms guide and then create 50 hours of lore for my homebrew world (this is kind of the idea I feel like you were saying should be the case? Again not entirely sure you just seemed annoyed ranting to me personally so wasn't sure of what other than 90 percent of things with dnd makes you mad). I don't have time for all that and wouldn't do that, changing some adventures to my own things sure, but I can't dedicate that much of my life to something new especially that idk if I'd even enjoy. Maybe just take a deep breath, you seem really stressed about things out of your control, it's ok to disagree or not like decisions but being so negative it may drive away new people. Not trying to be mean or anything and your entitled to your own opinions of course but just giving you a perspective of a new player, since it sounds like you don't really know new players but people who have played for a very long time. Best of luck to you and your channel
The weird thing is that the dust had barely settled on the underaged, indentured servants hand-stitching the covers on the first run of the 2014 PHB before comments sections all over the internet were full of gnarly old grognards predicting more or less the situation we find ourselves in today. Warning us that WotC were suffering under a delusion that they were nurturing a raptor which, impressive as that seems, would slowly evolve the brightly coloured plumage of its Bird of Paradise final form. And now, ten years later, that delusion has all but guaranteed the end of an era, the last of the pencil and paper, dining room table, clatter of dice and ice, stained character sheets with a small hole where the hit points total used to be, hard back DnD rules books. For in the end it didn’t matter what type of dinosaur WotC actually had, only the dinosaur they thought they had. The rainforest goose that would lay a thousand eggs and a thousand more logs barely distinguishable from the eggs and lo, the inchoate and the exudate would together be worth a Magic the Gathering youtuber’s ransom. Also, if you’re not publishing books you never have to finish writing one worth publishing. When the rules are all part of an on-line gaming ‘experience’ you can just patch them as you go using an underpaid, offshore workforce. I hear Kolkata’s lovely this time of year. Also, also that whole ‘underaged hand stitching’ bit from the first paragraph may have been a bit out of line. The 2014 PHB was glued.
You bring up some solid concerns but I feel like a lot of this is kinda making assumptions on future decisions and products WotC is making. And like I get the company deserves to be looked at with a lot of criticism but this video comes off just kinda ranting on the idea that everything they're doing is and will be bad. I'm also confused about the argument that the core books are published one at a time would be made just to make them more money. It's 3 big books with plenty to go through. There's no rush to get them out and publishing them all at once would just leave plenty of things unnoticed with it. Of course it's money wise smart too but it's not like they're bullying the players by releasing them a few months apart. Maybe it's just me personally but I've been glad to have time to go through the player's handbook with time and I'm really excited about the DMG next month. And I'm sure if I got them all at the same time I would have just rushed through them all. Maybe I'm just too optimistic.
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm if the people who ran WotC, actually loved the game they bought, instead of trying to mutilate it in 1999 upon the third edition release, two decades later, we wouldn't be making snide jokes at something that a generation ago gave us much joy. Instead, everyone in my age bracket went off to OSR-land and we won't be back. It offers nothing for us but trying to repackage our memories in the new shitty mechanics they try to shovel out on us. They have marketing, but their product is easily beaten by what innovation has been made by others who grew up on it.
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm Have you heard of Adventurer Conquerer King System? It is fantastic, and Alex Macris, the designer, I feel is writing a real version of what should have been Third Edition.
Right now I feel like 5e culture is rampant with really poor 'dm advice' they need to focus way more on how to run the game vs 'narrative and developing the world' 'how the characters fit in the world' etc. We need to present a simple to use steps in running a game, with an emphasis on respecting the player's time. I literally sat in sessions where just one player and the DM just ran a the character in a shop negotiating with the shop owner and detailing all the items available and the player wanting to get a customized staff for a his character. Like cmon get on with the adventure.
My general opinion with D&D in particular is not bad DM advice. The problem is bad player advice. Optimisation of characters, power play builds. Builds that try to break the game and abilities (spells ect) that can nullify entire situations.
@TheNanoNinja certain game design choices lends itself to that nonsense. They try to pander to players who want more more more. The game suffers. The dm suffers having to run a game with all that nonsense. And DM’s stop DM’ing. Less games.
lol. The oldest amongst us may not be able to drink as much booze. Or have as much salt or sugar. But we’re here with the best games and the best approach to gaming
Study the great tech moguls and you find one common theme: they were skilled at what they did and leveraged that skill into a thriving business. Long before there was a "Microsoft" or "Apple" or "Dell Computers" there were single men driving themselves to success by working in the tech industry every way they could. By working I mean programming, soldering circuits, actually hands-on-doing the things that led to their success. They were building their business based on their skills long before they became a success. Long before they built their business or even went to college. A big company - and it seems the bigger the worse - tends to attract "business" people whose only skill is in "business" itself. WOTC's and Hasbro's upper-level staff lacks any talent or knowledge of the hobby which in itself is based on fantasy role-playing gaming - having fun pretending to be adventurers and doing things your own way without a lot of rules to bog it all down - they just want to maneuver the titanic ship around in hopes of not hitting an iceberg. While being blindly ignorant of the actual business - fun gaming - they are supposed to be pursuing. The one way WOTC might make it gangbusters would be if the management was forced to attend a six-month retreat where they designed and played a role-playing game of their own. Not gonna happen. The success, small as it is, of various OSR ventures is in that the CREATORS are basing their WORK on how they PLAY and HAVE PLAYED and ENJOY PLAYING. Not basing it on a business plan that relies on riding the shoulders of the people playing (and designing) games and adventures.
If I want a weird ass custom sword for my character and visualise it, I will commission an artist to draw it. In the long run it will probably be cheaper also and I will have a truly unique piece of art. No need for bloody micro transactions that'll stealth kill your wallet (Most people use dice collecting for that)
At least with dice collecting, you can bring them with you from game to game, group to group. And you don't need a server or subscription to keep hold of them.
So my take is that, at some point one of two things will happen. Either the D&D brand will become unprofitable due to serious mismanagement then get bought by another company at bargain basement prices. -OR- Wizards/Hasbro will find a way to right the ship by putting out stuff that pushes creativity. You see little sparks of what it could be in some supplements like Curse of Strahd and The Deck/Book of Many Things.
Yeah but the latter are from another era just remade for today. They don’t have the talent there to make something like that now. The corporate environment there makes it impossible
The books always mention that these aren't hard rules, that you can and should change anything that you don't like. Some people prefer one edition over another but that doesn't mean that they are right, it's just their preference. No, not all adventure modules are good butthey never were all good. There are so many ttrpg's out there that no one has to ever make homebrew, considering how much time and effort it takes and people's lack of free time. I would suggest people look at what other ttrpg's exist other than D&D because if you can think of it then someone has probably already made it.❤
Honestly, VTTs are fantastic-just not the one Hasbro is making. I play on Roll20, and it's been great for me. I live in a small town where no one plays D&D anymore. Most of my friends either stopped playing or moved away, but through Roll20, I found a bunch of great people and some really good games.
How is the Roll20 backend for homebrew/rules exceptions/rules modifications? I had a go at some of the modification mechanics on DnDbeyond (spells, a subclass, character stats) and it was more difficult and less reliable than corporate tax law.
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm Classes and subclasses can be easily modified on the character sheet. You can change damage values, spell descriptions, and other details right on the sheet. Essentially, the character sheet is fully editable, but you have to manually make those changes. I don’t really homebrew much beyond the setting itself.
Here's the 2nd UA-camr that is truthful with his opinion( which is 💯 correct ). States the problem and what happened to the hobby(which was 💯 correct) not only with Hasbro/WOTC but at the gamestores as well. Thx for making this no bs video stating the real truth. I enjoyed this video alot thx again.
WOTC can do whatever they want with their IP. It will still get utilized and played the way we players and DM's want to play it, no matter how much WOTC stamps its feet.
Yup! I strip mined a lot of their stuff for my game. I found some gems I could use early on. As the years went on though I found less and less gems. More and more steaming hot piles of dogshit. I haven’t bought any of their stuff in a few years
My favorite quote: "It's hard for DM's, no matter who good they are, to make Lasagna out of shit."
lol. I had lasagna last weekend. Still on my mind. 😂
this needs to be on a tshirt
YES!!!!
@lord17c lol. Maybe I should trademark it!
Honestly, a GOOD DM can absolutely turn a bad system into a good game. Being involved in RPG's since the 70's, I've played with a lot of masters who took slender rulesets and added their flair to the game. I played 1 game at GenCon with Gary Gygax under his original rules in the 90's and he DEFINITELY had a fun game... That ruleset barely covered the rules compared to modern RPG's. He made the game.
My group and I had an awkward moment about year ago. All sitting around the table, and I was like, "Looks like they're making new books...do you guys wanna just make our own RPG instead of paying a company to do it worse?" I kid you not, everyone at the same time said, "Uh, yuh!" So, that's what we play, instead of WOTC pulp bull.
@@wardhuckabay8262 well done! I’m in the process of ding the same thing 😎
I'm jealous. Good work.
Just takes some time. 👍
And you'll end up with a system specifically designed for YOUR group, not a product that is trying to please everyone all at once (and fails to do so).
Exactly. No more tinkering. And who knows, maybe you can publish it some day. :)
You're no taking into account that players who aren't used to great DMs with great homebrew campaigns wont complain because they dont know any better. I agree that the hobby is going to shrink, but it has shrunk before and then grown again. The pendulum will swing again.
It doesn't always swing back. sometimes products just die out.
@@Joethelawyer I cant see dungeons and dragons going away. Even if WoTC stops making the books, the hobby will continue. WotC just isnt capable of stopping the hobby
@@govetenko Even AD&D 1st edition will be continued to be played for the next 500 yrs.
@Joethelawyer D&D can't die out, though. Even if Hasbro axed it, it will always exist. Worst case scenario is that there are no future updates, and I'm not sure that's detrimental to the staying power of D&D
@@govetenko it will continue in a much smaller way than it is now
Clubs. People have to do it themselves.
Create and join clubs. Pool the club funds, rent an office, turn it into a club space and play.
Plus, the d6 bludgeoning damage increases to d8 if you end up turning it into a great club.
Hasbro is banking on turning the 'hobby' into a video game that they can milk for all it's worth. They want in person play to fade out.
Yup. Cant monetize it.
what kills me about this blatant strategy, is that they could just keep pulling a baldurs gate 3 and just make good games that are dnd-related, and make people want to play ACTUAL dnd even more. A lot of my friends from the college days got into dnd mainly because of tie-in video games. wotc could easily do this, yet theyre convinced the VTT is the way forward
So right.. ONE D&D is set for digital.. all maps and all.. they are aiming to take out the table and replace it with computers, and video game style play
Too bad for them that TTRPGs are so decentralized in general that there's more than enough great games out there to fill the void, to say nothing of just continuing to play 5E and the bazillion unofficial supplements that exist.
@nicholasrova3698 yup. They’re screwed
I think wizards kinda lost touch with this more in-person scene a long time ago. Due to the rise of streamed games, many players love the idea of joining a game, but there is no support infrastructure for them (I.e. actual games being run by people they know).
I don’t think the hobby is dying tho. There are so many fantastic and creative alternative games out there. The grassroots movement for this hobby is impossible to eradicate.
Agreed. By hobby in the video I means the DnD hobby. Not rhe rpg hobby
WIZARDS OWNS THE NAME
DMs PRODUCE THE GAME
We produce more of their product than they themselves do ...
And we do a damn good job at it. Better than they do
Just like skyrim modders and Bethesda
This is also why I started in my town to host workshops for players who are interested to become GMs no matter what system they play and to find their OWN UNIQUE WAY to GM. This is the way.
That’s awesome!
@@andreamauriziomedici6306 This IS the way...
Our local hobby store started two years ago with one D&D game every other Wednesday on a night that catered to Magic card games. Within six months it was two tables (same campaign; two GMs). within a year we had other folks stepping up to GM on the opposite Wednesdays adn the card players found another night. NOw we have a rotating Wednesday night schedule of four D&D games, two Pathfinder games, three Star wars games, and an EDH game, all at the hobby store with the expectation that you'll include neew players if they show up. It CAN happen if the hobby store is wiliing
That’s fucking fantastic. I wish it could grow like that here
Evil can't create. It can only corrupt.
Tolkien ftw!
@@chrisgenson2278 it creates pain lol
Love all the images from the rule books. Great memories.
So nostalgic to me 😎
Modern D&D will become a videogame. The rest ot us will continue to play other TTRPGs. The TTRPG hobby doesn't need D&D anymore. There are plenty of alternatives or old editions.
Yeah, the whole ‘we’re the only game in town’ WotC swagger is like watching a lion trying to take down a rhino.
We know you’re all up in our face about this whatever this is you’re doing.
We just don’t care and there’s not a hell of a lot you can do about it.
Exactly. In the last year Ive played & GMed, Cyberpunk, Dragonbane, Stormbringer, Call of Chthulu, Barbarians of Lemuria and a couple of homebrew things. Who needs WotC ?
I think that the endgame for WoTC is to make D&D a MMORPG, eliminating everything involving imagination, tabletop friendships and DMs.
Quite possibly the lamest supervillain evil empire on the planet.
Let the slightly balding, socially awkward nerds feel the wrath of our might!
Agreed
@MonteGruhlke There was a D&D MMO; didn't last all that long.
@JakeSweeper I played it for a while. It was fun. But yeah it gets old. It’s still out there
But we already had that several times. Its fun and all but its not a TTRPG
Good DMs don't really grow the business though. From WOTC's perspective, a good DM is suboptimal - a good DM tends to retain the same players for a long time, which means they're not very often running for new players and their players aren't needing to develop an interest in D&D as a brand outside of their DM's game. A good DM is also much less interested in buying WOTC's products, and much more willing to try other systems.
WOTC's business model for a while now has been to try to create an audience of people who identify themselves as "D&D players" but who don't actually play D&D much. The most profitable person is the one who buys all the player-facing material to theorycraft more characters than they'll ever play. Good DMs don't buy that many books because WOTC's books are useless to good DMs, and players who have regular tables don't buy many books because their DM has all the information they need for their game. The people who do buy lots of books are the people who drift between online games and drop-in AL-style games, who are creating a new character every couple of weeks because that's how long they stay in a game.
And I think this is why WOTC has been so hostile to DMs for the past 4 years or so - they want there to be tension between DMs and players, because they want players feeling unsatisfied by any game they join. It's the perception that no D&D is better than imperfect D&D that keeps players hooked on D&D as a brand rather than D&D as a game: If every DM is running the game wrong, WOTC gets to remain sacred and the player buys another book so that next time they drop into a game, they can play something even stupider than the human-sized bacterium they played last time.
That’s an interesting perspective
Honestly, WOTC hasn’t really grown their business either… 5E is really just a dumbed down version of 3.5E.
@@Brian-px9gu they grew their revenue. Thats all that matters to them
@@Joethelawyer agree but one could argue that really content creators grew their business for them. If not for Critical Role and the plethora of other content creators would it have really grown based on the quality and content. I would argue no it would not have. The third party content is often far better and is why WOTC tried to make a grab for a higher percentage of the license profit from them.
WOTC simply has the golden goose but not sure they know what to do with it. Which is proven time and time again when they demonize and isolate their customer base.
@Brian-px9gu those things are responsible for the huge increase of late. But these idiots at wotc think they are responsible for it. Like being born on third base and running you hit a triple. They don’t know what to do. You’re right. Outside of those anomalies though, I think it’s DM’s that are responsible for growth
The BEST videogame has a three to eleven year life span. D&D has been going for fifty.
They are not the same thing, and following videogames is bass ackwards.
The gamble they're taking is that they can be the League of Legends, that lasts forever by creating addiction; and if that fails, they want to be the Fifa, that releases a new identical replacement game every year, that people buy because of brand loyalty and because that's where the rest of the playerbase has moved.
I’m not a video game guy but that sounds plausible
@@Joethelawyer I think what they are doing with the VTT is going to shift the game to almost 100% digital. WOTC knows that players only buy a few things, and DM's are their primary customers with pen and paper D&D. Digital D&D--every one pay subscription fees and for all the cool upgrades--you'll eventually have micro transactions. I expect they will develop AI DMs in the not too distant future, too. It's going to be a completely different game.
@@andrewlustfield6079 yup. Thats the master plan
@@andrewlustfield6079 yup. Sadly.
My group survived the Edition Wars and 4E - I mostly ran homebrew during those years. Between what I have and what I can make, if the industry collapsed today, my group will keep going. You are right though - WotC doesn't care enough about DMs and the hobby. They're trying to figure out how to monetize the "community" they've cultivated from Twitter, Seattle, and Critical Role.
Exactly. Critical role moved on though stranger things and big bang their and the beer bug are over. They’re screwed
We survived the Edition Wars by getting off the damned carousel at 3.5/PF1. Never looked back.
i subbed for the smokes stayed for the liquor
lol thanks!
I'm a 2nd gen or Legacy TTRPG player. My Father played Chainmail in college (not sure which Gen he started on), and he passed down the experiences to me started at age 7 With DnD. I remember playing Palace of the Vampire Queen with a table populated by family and friends (We won through Raw luck).
I was drawn into the hobby by family, and in High School I started running ADnD games for my friends. Putting them through Secret of Bone hill (and another I can't recall the name of ATM).
I matured and continued playing and running games. I also have the controversial opinion of liking 4th Editions strong mechanical structure empowering roleplay but I'm not going to make that argument here 😂.
Years of running games have made me a great DM with strong improvisational skills. My Brother and various friends have gone on to continue playing and running games for their kids. Whom we can hope will grow to love TTRPGs as well.
That said I've watched the hobby morph and change over my life. The rise and fall of Gaming stores, and the death of the pickup game.
Pickup games died because frankly, we don't want to put up with players that are abrasive to our enjoyment of the game. So now a protective layer has been constructed to antagonistic players from joining and to help kick them out if they get in. With computers and the internet, we don't have to worry about a poorly socialized individual sitting down and trying to TPK the party just for the laughs (jokes on us, this totally still happens).
There are downsides to this approach. Smaller local communities, less storefront support, fewer opportunities to experiment with new systems, and of course, people being denied the opportunity to learn how to deal with troublesome players (often folk just end games rather than kick out the problem player). So hopefully, we will find a happy balance.
You are way optimistic about WotC’s future development of DnD than I.
If it was as simple as WotC providing more tools for people that like or need some on-line content then a happy balance is possible.
Unfortunately, WotC’s motivation appears to have much more sinister undertones.
💯- they make crappy settings, crappy adventures, and complex rules to drive book sales... not to enable creative players and game masters to do what was the core of D&D since 1974 - have FUN together. We've NEVER needed more books or new editions - they do to make more money.
Agreed!! They peaked at 2e. All downhill from there in terms of creativity and style. The rules are better organized and make more sense in later editions. But the 3.x bloat sucked. 4.0 was a living abortion. 5e had the clearest rules but the game lacked something. No soul. Like it was made by committee
So if 2nd ed. is THE classic version of DnD are you saying 2nd ed. is the classical music of DnD?
Because that sounds like a genius comparison.
One of these days folks will realize just how ponzi stupid the stock market is.
Having profit as your only goal is a dumb way to die.
It’s unrealistic to expect growth to continue quarter after quarter. But you can tell that to Wall Street. So companies like wotc lie and make bullshit up while they look for new jobs before the inevitable failure
@Joethelawyer It's called Capitalism. That's how it works. Don't like it? Become a communist and destroy intellectual property rights. Make DnD a product produced by the masses for the masses.
i play since 1983, in a place kept far away from the markets until the 2000s (no eady access to renewals) ... i went through chaotic 1e, nuttered 2e, mechanic 3e, videogamish 4e and bought 5 ed but never played it cause it was enough ... last 10 years ive played a homebrew mix of rules that pleases my group and lets the narrative developpe while the mechanics run smoothly enough ... this kind of game will never die cause it trascends trends or fashions, cause its a way of life
Your homebrew approach to adopting, rejecting and modifying game mechanics to suit your style and group is exactly what WotC hates and fears most.
Because once you start viewing DnD content through a critical lens it becomes apparent that most of what passes for modern DnD canon is irrelevant nonsense that can be happily ignored without affecting the quality of your gaming experience.
And if WotC can’t convince you that they have a monopoly on your ideas they can’t convince you that they have a monopoly on your wallet.
They’re like that annoying furry at a tourist attraction that keeps pestering you to take a selfie for five bucks. They’re not actually that important to your experience and they know it.
What they hope is that you don’t know it.
So Joe, tell us how you really feel?! lmfao Needless to say - you are spot on with your observations and comments.
How can we bring back the RPGA?
Thanks! I have lots of those membership cards in all my old stuff. I wonder what will happen if I send one in 😂
The AI currently available can't improvise anywhere near the ability of even a novice DM. Role playing is about the experience and current AI simply cannot supply that.
Totally agree
AI doesn't know what's funny or simply what's cool and fun.
So many other channels out there tiptoeing around this... You just cut right to the core. Subbed!
Thanks! I try to tell it like it is.
Great video fellow lawyer.
Basic Fantasy is free. Dungeon Crawl Classics and Shadowdark starter sets are free. Spread the word.
I will do my level best to never buy another Wizards product or Hasbro for that matter. I just passed on something yesterday when I noticed it was Hasbro, and hope they cell Dungeons & Dragons.
Thanks! Yeah well it it won’t be the worst thing
DCC is an amazing system. I always end up with the funnel character I hate, and 4 levels later weap over their demise. It lends to peak story telling.
@@darby2314 It reminds me of going back to Skyrim and playing the entire game as just a thief with just daggers or just a fighter with no magic etc. It's more of a challenge. Otherwise we tend to just make the same optimized multiclass player we always do and play it just the way we always do.
my last purchase was old TSR player's handbook, MM and DMG.
i never cared for WOTC.
i've run my games using online resources alone.
they haven;t gotten a cent from me.
Good man!
Same, FY WoTC! FY Hasbro!
@@Dinofaustivoro 😂
I discovered Cairn. Doesn't even need to OGL.
nice! what is it?
@@Joethelawyer Cairn RPG is a newish 20 page indie game based on a few other rules sets. You can look up the SRD. No rolls to see if you can succeed. Only saves and damage.
@@Joshuazx cool man. Have fun!
The secret is we no longer need them.
We never really did after odd was published. Yet we keep buying shit…and don’t get me started on dice 🤣
Not a secret. GG mentioned it in 1978.
It is ...
If people don't know that...
@Joethelawyer yeah not me!
I codified my homebrew to easy play and all the old stuff new players don't know!
We never did.
If WOTC kills D&D, the hobby will live on without them. My games are doing fine and I haven't bought so much as a single magic card from them in 3 years. All they have is the IP and the logo at this point, and aren't likely to improve. BG3 was a huge shot in the arm for them... of which they contributed nothing but the existing game system the game uses (most fun i've had playing 5e in a long time) but the setting already existed before them. everything else was done by Larian's staff, not WOTC.
If the game does die, there will be a period of suspended animation that gives people a break from official crap while homebrew rules the day, and emerges as the new replacement. Games and storytelling have been around since the dawn of time (hell, we found a d20 from ancient rome...), and this just was a cool intersection that won't be lost to history because too many people are making their own, superior thing and just need to publish it.
Agreed! The DnD aspect of the rpg hobby will shrink. The rpg hobby will continue to roll along
I don't really care what WotC does, I already own my books and set up my own challenges for the players. No matter what bad decision WotC does I can outlive them.
Yup! I get that
I don’t see what is the enticing part of buying the new DMG (well I also did not get the new pbh since most of it seams not be worth for a perma dm)
It’s apparently well organised.
They hired the surviving crew members who were in charge of the deck chairs on The Titanic.
I have been a DM for 37 years, been playing since 1980. I have discovered the independent OSR gaming scene and have full switched to EZD6 and Shadowdark. The hardest part of playing these days is getting a group of dedicated players. Campaigns die off after session 5, and getting players to sit and play is a serious issue. This DM is looking for players.
Yeah it took years to get a good group. We can only get together online. Roll20. We’re all from different parts of the country
I play by post but it is not as fun as a live game
@nathanh2664 I tried that once. Went to slow for me
A DM that I think does an excellent job is Jon Britton, of 3d6, Down the Line.
He uses houseruled OSE rules, and he just runs the game. There is no ten minute back story whenever a player introduces a new character.
His group is currently playing through “The Halls of Arden Vul”.
Nice!
The OSR is a blessing. Did you ckeck the Knave 2e Jam? Lots of old school material there. I made my own called Arms of the Undying, even used the no-repro blue for extra oldschoolness. Hope you like it. Great channel.
I will check it out
I wouldn’t discount AI / LLM, I am not so sure that they will “always suck”. We come full circle back to MUX/MUD/MUSH in the sense of a text-based experience mediated by a computer screen but I think with mobile integration that over time a viable “product” will emerge. Not to mention the IP and brand represent a gold mine for Hasbro, outside of grognards playing at a tabletop. Movies, video games, etc.
If it does get to be good I doubt it will be good soon enough for hasbro to make money off it.
@@Joethelawyer I would be lying if I said that wasn’t my hope too 😂
Developing AI for virtual gaming is never going to be a cutting edge priority.
There’s much more money to be made, and therefore focus, on industries like car manufacturing.
And the AI for self-driving cars is dangerously inapt and inept. It copes well enough when conditions are predictable but is regularly derailed by events and obstacles that would barely register with a human driver.
At the moment AI is like the programmed responses from old text based adventures with the ability to add or modify responses from ‘experience’ using fuzzy logic.
It can barely drive a car. The range of possible options for RPG players in any given moment is infinitely more varied and require a GM to use a variety of skills and judgment calls that AI does not yet have the capacity to match.
Get back to me when AI can drive a car as competently as a human. Then, maybe, we can talk about the use case for AI GMs.
Just yesterday I watched the UA-cam Video "The Rise of Boutique RPGs" and it matches so well with this video. Mancave used to look like this coach next to a book shelve and now they are over the top merch and tables with screen and beamers and fog machines, lots of LEDs. It's more conspicuous consumption than really a love for the hobby.
Funny thing is that’s a pic from my old apartment. 😂. Thats my throne I used to sit in while reading and watching tv 😎
@@Joethelawyer hahaha, awesome.
Cool take :)
Sidequest question: I still play 2e. Is it considered OSR?
Not sure. At least it’s still considered DnD.
I did a whole video on that actually lol
Joe, I am just discovering you. Awesome channel. I been playing since '82 Moldvay Boxed Set. My favorite games now are BECMI, CoC and Mythras. D&D ain't going out like that. I've been training High Schoolers (I'm a Techer, and I got a rpg club - they named it Talisman!) to run games for a few years now and they can see the difference between "emergent" play and railroading. I'm holding it down on my end! 😎👍
Thanks buddy! I appreciate you taking the time to say this. 😎. Hold it down buddy! Hold it down!
I like to see *the Dude* in your background. He is my spiritual advisor; we abide.
lol I love that movie
WOTC doesn't have a problem with this game at all, they just don't care about the current format that its in right now. Everyone knows they want to take the IP and change it over into a digital game, a video game. The legacy version of the game with books and physical dice will just be a novelty that they continue to make which makes them a little money, but is more for nostalgia and data mining. Much like Marvel and DC comics have become. So its not that they hate or dislike D&D or Dungeon Masters, its just that they don't care about that format anymore. 100% of their attention is focused on a monatized digital format.
Well said. Like comics books as compared to the movies. Just something to be mined
D&D 5E just doesn't support DMs... WotC has focused on monetizing the players while neglecting good products for DMs and have handled everything horrendously - from how they treat the local game store to how they create/design products, etc... but that isn't the only problem with tabletop gaming.
I'm a huge OSR fan, and eventually committed to Old School Essentials, primarily because it's kind of the 'premier' OSR game out there in an effort to be able to find as many people near me to play as possible, but there are so many (awesome, I might add) OSR choices, that the community is fractured and its really difficult to get a game in with people that actually know the system you're playing. The OSR community is incredibly fractured with myriads of new games getting released every day it seems... most of them are based on some older system with a minor tweak and are relatively compatible... but others aren't...
Also, game stores and their owners have been f'd so hard for so long by WotC, that they're essentially battered wives just looking for any bit of kindness - the local store near me pretty much exclusively sells WotC D&D 5E products and only lets you set up a time for 5E on their website... so I just showed up there with two buddies to play Old School Essentials and the owner came over and kind of gave us some crap because they don't sell that book there, and he said to pick a system of what they do carry, which of course is only D&D 5E... I asked the guy why they didn't carry a few copies of OSE and he just shrugged...
Jesus. Sounds like the game store guy is shooting him self in the foot with that attitude. I agree with everything you said there
I saw a video titled “The 2024 DMG is better than the old one” and damn that’s an easy bar to clear. 5e as a player is great. 5e as a DM is Sisyphean.
@eitherorlok lol yeah the dmg is kinda of useless for 5e. I read it and couldn’t find any good advice in it on how to actually run a game. Just broad topic overviews. Only useful for the magic item tables etc.
WOTC have failed to explain how they will develop adventures for the VTT in a timely manner. They showed the toolset being used and had to speed up the footage just to build a small inn . Try cranking out Queen of the spiders in less than a year.
Yeah it’s doomed to fail
I recall Disney infinity and marvel at the toy boxes they created and shared whilst it was active.
Now replace those with DMs using the vtt to create their own games and as they improve wotc and Hasbro look on eagerly thinking it’s only a matter of time before the ai learns to do the same.
Very unlikely but what will it take before they recognise that?
@@Darkwintre utter failure. That’s what it will take
8:12 "... nerdy and not getting laid..." No comment. :-P
Lol
Rather bleak mindset. I agree WOTC are terrible. But I'm also a new DM using a VTT to play a weekly game. I have two 'forever DMs' as players who 25 sessions in report they're having a great time.
I've played D&D for 2 years, and DMd for only 6 months.
The hobby isn't going to die. It'll thrive in spite of WOTC. The D&D movie just smashed it on Netflix. Stranger Things hasn't finished yet. Baldurs Gate 3 was incredible and I'm seeing swathes of people who want more of that joining groups I'm in online.
D&D is changing in our new digital landscape, but it isn't going anywhere
Which VTT are you using and how would you rate it?
WotC is in big trouble. The art in the PHB and on the new screen give me an idea of how much effort is being put into keeping this game alive.
Yeah they give no shits
4:54 PRECISELY. WotC figures the only way you can pry a young customer base from the screen in their hand is to glue them to the screen in their houses with all sorts of pixelated "Ooh, shinys!" that will bleed your wallet dry. All "run" by a sterile, clunky, and soulless AI "DM" that can't run a real adventure no matter how many CPU cycles you throw at it.
Good luck, WotC, you're gonna need it. And as I watch you flounder, I'll be ever-expanding on my 40+ year old homebrew setting.
At the moment DnD is the biggest fish in the pond. The problem that WotC are going to have is that once they go digital they will be a small fish in a big pond of other, bigger shinies.
Not sure why you’d exchange overwhelming market dominance for whatever the hell else they seem to doing but what do I know?
Amen!
Saw the Crown Royal dice bag. We all do this in our group. I knew i had to subscribe
Awesome! Those are my original dice too. And those are my books and boxed sets. 😎😎😎
@@Joethelawyer ive come to the right channel then. Myself and many in my DnD group share many of the sentiments youve laid out in this vid. I am our newest DM, and I feel like WotC is leaving us behind. Ive been seeking out old books and game systems since.
Most honest and raw take I’ve heard.
@@NotoriousGMD thanks man! Hope you subscribe!
I dont get why people rage so much against D&D, most players have found a system they like and stick to it. Nobody HAS to buy the new stuff Wizards releases, plenty of old school games or even older versions of D&D floating around.
Amen buddy!
The dogs bark, the caravan moves on... TTRPGs will survive, as long as civilization is not reset... Then we will have to rediscover it 🤔🤔
They already reset civilization.
We’re up to seven.
Civilization 7 incoming
"they would not recognized a creative, skilled or talented person if they dumbed an espresso on their head" THIS, exactly this. But this is not only a Hollywood or WOTC problem. It's a problem across all industries that go mainstream. One example is the IT industry. Talented, passionate developers with decades of experience get skipped over graduates from prestigious unis. That's another topic of course, but that happens when industry make it big. There is also the shitification-pipeline. Start good and then go over to monetization and shareholder-pipeline.
Shittification pipeline. Love it! Yore dead on with your analysis delta.
Spot on. The phenomenon is everywhere. In the CRPG realm, look what happened to BioWare. They were universally lauded for their work. They were successful. Then they got acquired by EA and had to expand the customer base to make more $$. In the process, in my opinion, they lost the things that made their games truly great. Now they're just another developer.
The mba’s took over and drove the good creative out so the mba’s could take all the credit. Even though they know jack shit about being a creative person.
Has any DnD edition had all 3 books published all at once?
4th edition
I think WotC makes the game more complicated so they can sell more books. What a headache. I left 5e long before the ogl debacle. Simpler games like Shadowdark are my jam now. Screw WotC.
Plus as we get older, simple is better lol
So, our group switched to basic fantasy years ago and isn't looking back because D&D became 1) way too complicated and 2) way too expensive. basic fantasy's price point is zero dollars and zero cents if you want PDF on your phone or cheap if you want physical copies. Folks, if you can't have fun with 4 races and 4 classes then having 50 of each won't help you.
Haha. Variety is fun but your basic point is very true
damn man you nailed it on every point, love the rant!
In my experience, gaming at stores has always sucked. The only way to play is to have a group of friends and family that has a set schedule, whether that be every week, every two weeks, or once a month. My kids, most are now adults, and they still play with me and my friends.
That’s awesome man. I don’t have kids but tried to get my brother’s kids into it. It never took.
Just curious - do you have a home game that you run ?
Yup! 2e game
@@Joethelawyer that's great, you shoukd do a campaign diary focus8ng on teachable DM moments
@@dimitrijemarjanovic5026 I have a lot of videos addressing these types of things that come up during the game. Check them out! 👍😎
Further capitalist enshittification.
Yup
Maybe learn the difference between capitalism and cronyism before saying something stupid.
I just lol the word enshittification. Adding that to my personal vocabulary
Capitalism is an economic system based on the private ownership of the means of production and their operation for profit.
Cronyism is a form of favoritism that rewards friends or allies with jobs, contracts, or advantages, especially in politics and business.
Unless there are extenuating details of which I am unaware, Capitalism appears to be, on balance, the more appropriate word in this particular case.
Am I doing this right?
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm Sounds right to me!
On point man.
And they could learn a thing or two from the big gyms. Even though most of them people don't stay there for very long as individual a lot of them manage to keep people going by investing on their coaches, and giving them space to work with "privet" clients there.
Epic rant. Not sure I 100% would have used your phraseology or comparisons to express the same concepts but valid points at their core all round.
One of the major problems that Wizards of the Coast have is their assumptions about player expectations.
Not expectations of how WotC will behave, which are rock bottom (see 5.1th edition), but expectations of the player’s game experience.
And this is where good GMs come in and why WotC hates them. Because a good GM provides a theatre of the imagination that transcends the rules mechanics of any particular RPG. The system is less important than the enjoyment of the participants involved, so rules are bent, broken, ignored, home-brewed and followed to the letter by the GM in pursuit of that enjoyment.
And once you’ve played with a good GM your expectations of your experience change. RPG is not multiplayer, on-line with less racial slurs. There is a fundamental difference in the interactions between the player and the game. You can only win an RPG in the narrowest sense. Mostly, the goal is survival with style, from moment to moment, session to session, campaign to campaign. The game mechanics provide the framework and a good GM provides everything else.
And once you realise that a good GM is more important than blind adherence to the combat bonuses from dual wielding against left-handed orcs in bright sunlight it slowly dawns that perhaps, none of the rules are set in stone. Perhaps worshipping at the alter of whatever power creep, class abilities your character gained from the latest edition of Gekko’s Cesspit of Nihilism is a distraction. Baubles and circuses.
Good GMs not only know what makes a good game but also educate their players by example. And that makes them dangerous. Martin Luther dangerous. Defenders of the true faith that expose the crumbling edifice of deceit and subterfuge that now serves no-one but Mammon.
WotC knows this. And hate GMs with every fibre of their bloated, corporate being because of it.
Excellent post David. Thanks for taking the time to write all that buddy.
Appreciate that. Sorry about the wall of text. Cut my teeth on Keep on the Borderlands. Played AD&D and 2nd ed. for years. Came back to standard 5E a few years ago. Different but OK I can work with this.
Everything since has been a deliberately crafted shit show of monumental proportions designed to appeal to ignorance and arrogance. Including, and possibly especially, the latest cynical, bland, absolute disaster of a reboot that seeks to codify and sanctify the official lobotomisation of the player base so that they never realise what’s actually missing.
I was actually mad and disappointed with how badly they dropped the ball for 5.1th edition. Until I realised it’s a feature, not a bug.
Stick a fork in ‘em, they’re done.
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm sad but true. No need to apologize for the wall of text. I do that too. 😂
Brother, what did you do to deserve so many blandnamefourdigit shilltrolls in your comments section?
I’ve been playing whackamole with them all day which is fun but exhausting.
It’s almost as if some of the commentariat lack even a rudimentary understanding of the salient points you discussed and instead focus on tangential inconsequentialities that seem to be informed by a fundamental misunderstanding of your basic premise and a lack of willingness to engage in anything that resembles a good faith argument.
Or something.
I figure every comment helps the algorithm to promote the video which in turn gets me views and new subs. 😎
Nicely done... Love people who tell it like it is. new sub. Can I order up a DM with a sexy voice that looks like Harley Quinn? haha!
lol. I bet many would do that. Or Ginny d lol
@@Joethelawyer HAHA! yes and YES!
She seems to be hero amongst DnD players who don’t get sex
And you know this how?
Because you haven’t been at any of the meetings in absolutely ages.
lol
I’m moving to Tales of the Valiant. I think Kobold Press makes a better version of 5e.
The OGL mess has splintered the 5e folks to many other RPGs.
Ever seen Monty Python’s ‘Upperclass Twit of the Year’ sketch?
My head canon is that’s exactly what every WotC board meeting looks like.
Spot on wotc is filled with some very wicked and demented people and does not really deserve to continue as a company and will not succeed the rot is too deep and set in in their company. OSR is the future of this hobby
Amen buddy!
The hobby has collectors and players. They have books and miniatures. You have to cater to all the audiences to make money. There is also the UA-camr content makers, and especially live play. Which caters to the section of the community that doesn't want to collect or play but just watch someone else play.
The corpos want to push it all online and then micro transactions the players to death without giving anyone any real value.
Support the hobby by supporting people making collectable content and then play with the books and the miniatures.
Re books. I’m actively ignoring anything produced in the last ten years. Modified 2014 PHB rules only. They’re goofy and a little unbalanced as written but they still have some heart and soul.
None of the modules or supplements produced since have the slightest appeal whatsoever. Cynically devised, uniformly awful content for the sake of content.
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm there has been some awful content around since the beginning. Journey to the Rock was dog shit and it was written in 1984
Oh I completely agree. There was one 2ed(?) module from the late 80’s that we spent five sessions playing before everyone agreeing to give it up.
Don’t remember its name but it was a classic railroad before any of us had ever heard of the term.
Green dragon encounter is the only detail that sticks out but otherwise a forgettable grind.
If anyone can remember its name I’d appreciate it if you kept it to yourself.
I predict we are going to see a lot more homebrewed systems, even simple ones, gain traction when wizard's virtual one comes out. As we seen it happen before when people became disillusioned with DND. 4th edition and later the ogl? Both times players and dms went to other systems, notably pathfinder.
The thing is some of us are very fond of the old girl. Sure, some of it was completely janky and we rarely played strictly rules as written but that was tacitly encouraged. DnD has long been a fun framework to build on/modify because one of its strengths is its customisability.
The problem is that WotC has spent the last ten years white-anting the framework of DnD by releasing a series of truly awful supplements, each one worse than the last, that add bloat at the expense of verisimilitude.
So the basic rules are now barely worth customising and once it goes on-line that will barely be an option.
So we get to play by their objectively awful rules, unmodified, or we don’t play at all.
What WotC doesn’t seem to understand is that’s not nearly as much of a threat as they seem to think it is.
Agreed goblin!
Wotc sucks so bad. They killed a hobby i have loved since the 80s
Totally agree man
The weird thing is that the dust had barely settled on the underaged, indentured servants hand-stitching the covers on the first run of the 2014 PHB before comments sections all over the internet were full of gnarly old grognards predicting more or less the situation we find ourselves in today. Warning us that WotC were suffering under a delusion that they were nurturing a raptor which, impressive as that seems, would slowly evolve the brightly coloured plumage of its Bird of Paradise final form.
And now, ten years later, that delusion has all but guaranteed the end of an era, the last of the pencil and paper, dining room table, clatter of dice and ice, stained character sheets with a small hole where the hit points total used to be, hard back DnD rules books.
For in the end it didn’t matter what type of dinosaur WotC actually had, only the dinosaur they thought they had. The rainforest goose that would lay a thousand eggs and a thousand more logs barely distinguishable from the eggs and lo, the inchoate and the exudate would together be worth a Magic the Gathering youtuber’s ransom.
Also, if you’re not publishing books you never have to finish writing one worth publishing. When the rules are all part of an on-line gaming ‘experience’ you can just patch them as you go using an underpaid, offshore workforce. I hear Kolkata’s lovely this time of year.
Also, also that whole ‘underaged hand stitching’ bit from the first paragraph may have been a bit out of line. The 2014 PHB was glued.
Love this pure, unvarnished and absolutely based take!
As Popeye famously said, I am what I am that’s all that I am.
I can’t be any other way.
Also, I hate spinach
You are a gem, JtL. Fantastic.
Thanks Jeff! Glad you enjoyed it. 😎
Keep preaching Reverend!
Long as UA-cam doesn’t ban me for being honest and real, I will! Lol
The game store where I got to play DnD for the first time at the age of 29 post covid only dose card games
I hate it when they dose card games with Covid.
Right on man liked the video
Thanks Bob!!
Hi! I've been running a "home brew" combining the best elements of AD&D(1st and 2nd) with Palladium that results in a very fast and tight game. But newer players in my group are taken aback by it cause most of them come from 5e and/or video games. They think that they're supposed to be super heros at level one!😅
lol I feel your pain 😂
it's on sight with Chris Cox
Thanks! Yeah he’s completely full of shit. I doubt he’s ever rolled a d20 in his life
The DnD community want Chris Cox’ head on a platter.
Chris Head is on indefinite leave.
@DavidAndrews-eb7gm haha
It was funnier in my head
Lol
old man yells out cloud.
theres lots of games that people play outside of dnd. lancer, shadowdark, dragonbane.
people run games online all the time. but offline people play with people they know mostly. just because you don't see alot of people playing random games in stores because dnd with randos sucks.
if you want to start pickup games start a local group.
if you build it they will come.
section at 8:00 is mad cringe.
" the hobby" is more than dungeons and dragons 5th edition.
The DnD hobby is DnD though
@Vast3394
Not sure you and I watched the same video.
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm yeah I was confused too
Wood. Trees.
Sometimes it can be difficult telling them apart.
@@Joethelawyer but much more than 5e. the droves of people playing 5e aren't going to stop because of some online vtt.
I feel lucky that I only recently got into the hobby via the OSR, and I’ve got no desire to play 5E or whatever they’re calling the new one.
One other thing about generating adventures using AI is it will just churn out bland porridge sludge because all it can do is mash together existing adventures. It won’t even truly understand the adventures it makes, it’ll just understand that one type of word usually follows another type so it puts them together, e.g. a [princess] has been kidnapped by a [wizard]. It doesn’t have any idea what a princess or a wizard is, it just regularly sees them put together in that way so it recreates that sentence.
It’ll never write anything like some of the wacky gonzo stories you get in a game like Dungeon Crawl Classics.
Yup. It’ll lack the true creative spark of genius that makes something great
A smart human can cut through the BS to the fun stuff. AI apes the worst influences to drown users in shlock.
It's gonna be just like 4e.
They wanna make a mmo out of it, just this time with phone games and gacha mechanics in a "free to play vtt"
Plus they’re going to have to appeal to a whole new cohort of players. Serious doubts there will be much uptake from current players unless there’s some brilliant twist to the plan we’ve all missed.
I'm about to spend a few years running Rifts. WOTC can get lost.
I’ve never tried that game. It’s on my rpg bucket list
Corporations are good at providing cheap widgets. They tend to destroy art.
Art makes you feel and contemplate.
And when that happens there is a very real danger that people might come to the slow realisation that they don’t need to consume our BRAND NEW AND EXCITING THING.
Well said!
Thanks man!
I think these rants miss two important things. Hasbro is big enough to put thousands of programmers onto a project. If they do it well, they can utilise that project for way more than D&D. It’s well within their remit to completely reinvent the RPG experience because of their size. Apple changed the phone. Microsoft changed computing. Size matters. And it’s OK for them to change it. They are going to lose their core market position doing it, but that’s their risk to take.
Second issue is that the game of D&D needs to create profit to justify local store time. The nature of the hobby is that card games make money. Selling food makes money. Selling drinks makes money. You’re running the equivalent of a Bible study in a local game shop. No profits if people don’t buy minis constantly (worthwhile business proposal?) etc. just like church. It’s a nonprofit task.
Maybe thirdly, you seem to have a thesis but don’t explain how D&D is actually antiDM. They are simply developing a product, and they can’t mentor people into loving the game. It’s like asking a boxing glove manufacturer to grow the sport of boxing. They run sewing machines, not sports clubs.
Hasbro is completely unrelated to the community. They sell books. They don’t run the cons. The shops. The game nights.
Perhaps it’s worth rethinking what the community needs. I don’t think it’s useful to blame Hasbro, because I don’t see them having anything to do with my TSR books. They are just as irrelevant to me as Warhammer 40k models. It’s somethi I see in the shop. That’s it.
Have you ever tasted chocolate made with corn syrup? It is objectively worse than chocolate made with sugar.
Have you ever noticed that the chocolate used to make Easter eggs is objectively worse than other chocolate? Cheaper ingredients and manufacturing processes are deliberately used to maximise profits because of what amounts to a captive market.
WotC has been aggressively marketing corn syrup Easter eggs for years and wants consumers to believe that this is the only chocolate that exists. And for consumers who have never tried anything else, it is.
Without wishing to appear rude, your post comes across as a little tangential to the point of the discussion and a little apologist regarding WotC’s motivation and role. If WotC was serious about chocolate they’d be trying to compete with Lindt by making a quality product rather than pretending they’re competing with Lindt but producing the bland, floury, cloying, uninspiring blocks of regret in shiny wrappers that are constantly disgorged in bulk quantities from their factory of sadness.
Problem is, I’ve tried Lindt and can tell the difference.
Deleted my original reply?
Because an analogy comparing WotC offerings to corn syrup Easter chocolate is hate speech?
I didn’t delete anything. It’s still there man.
I like chocolate 🍫
Sorry brother, not aimed at you. I thought OP had deleted it somehow.
But tell us what you really think.... OSR Old School Rant. Sounds like an American, talks like an Aussie. I played old school- Difficulty level- Tough but kept you on your toes. 3.5- Moderate challenge 5- Easy but accesable. . 2024 Watered down it down so much, they've missed the whole point of D&D. Hey, gain Inspiration for a having a long rest, halfings moving at 30, Screw Elrond, cant have half-races. AND they have mistook D&D for a computer game.
Thanks! I’ve been told I sound like Robert deniro before but never an Aussie lol.
WotC didn’t miss the point of DnD.
They tried to change it.
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm well said David
I mean, if the stuff is selling, and it seems that it is in digital format, I don't see how they have a problem
That was exactly my argument when Interpol sent me a cease and desist letter about my extreme animal cruelty videos.
I should add that I am not against your position, I think my point is that we still maintain some interest in the company and the brand despite it being completely irrelevant to the hobby for us. You play a game, you don’t owe anything to Hasbro. It’s like owing something to the NBA because you play pickup basketball. If you really don’t like any of the teams, you don’t have to care about anything the NBa does. 💡
It’s just sad. They’re caretakers of the game I love and they’re gonna destroy it
@@Joethelawyer they are caretakers of a brand name. Your investment isn’t like a car. You bought a basketball so go play with your friends rather than get upset about Ari’s Kobe joke or Le Bron’s travelling. Most parasocial relationships with a brand are not deeply negative like Hasbro. But this time you really get to realise that they have no power other than that which you give them.
I have Jenga and Monopoly. I don’t care about what Hasbro is doing with those brands. That relationship has concluded.
I get it. But that’s not a hobby. It’s that a game.
@@Joethelawyer if you play monopoly once a month for years, that’s a hobby. You are inserting the brand when it literally has no business being present. Does Penguin have any impact on you once you’ve bought the book?
D&D is just a game too. The hobby is getting together and playing it. It’s not purchasing WOTC products. (And in fairness, I think the card games are different. Purchases of cards IS part of the hobby)
@Xplora213 we have different definitions of hobby but that’s ok. I see your point. 👍
I will say as a new dm and my 3 players are all new as well. We knew of dnd, but my gf got me into critical role, we all played bg3 and liked the dnd movie and none of us are big stranger things people but I know that has gotten alot of people interesting as well. As newer players I think with the wide spread of media that is how people are getting into the game now, not people asking others and if that is the case most of the people doing that are online friends and the games are played online. I am running the starter kit for ice spire (since the other phandalin one isn't sold anymore) was 15 dollars on Amazon for me to help get into the game. From a perspective of a new dm/player I do like the book, it gives me a guide for the overall adventure story. I have changed drastically the entire story but I have a nice shell, made some npcs evil, it's now based around talos trying to do things, the dragon is secondary, the pcs are all based around their gods story wise and they are really enjoying the game. I will also say regarding dissing the magic school adventure is just saying it's not something for you rather than it's stupid. I do like Harry potter stuff I was in second grade when the first movie came out and I'm 32 now. I probably wouldn't play it however I know some super fans of Harry potter and the world there and that adventure wpuld probably get them into dnd honestly, and they'd have a good time. Saying as well that dnd players are all nerds that can't get laid is also a bit of an odd (to me atleast) ideology being stated, I have a gf and she is a player, my friends fiance is a player, and I know abd have seen alot of females play dnd. Having an AI be a dm I do find odd but for instance I'd like to be a player myself atleast once but my friends arnt really the best or into being a dm, they kind of have the idea of it being really stressful. So I can see how if someone wanted to play but every new player was afraid to dm instead of not ever playing they may feel more comfortable having an AI adventure atleast at first, maybe that gets them to say "it's not that hard I guess I can do that". I think it's better to just say "maybe this product isn't for me" and move on, new players need guidance for sure to some level and they want to try to entice new players so I get where they are coming from. The younger generation from me is all about technology, and will probably be alot more based online. I was interested in what you had to say at first but ypu just sort of went in a spiral of negativity and if I didn't know much or was newer and haven't watch alot of UA-cam dnd content I'd probably either just avoid the hobby entirely due to thinking players will be this negative in the game as well as real life, and also everything adventure wise to help me learn is terrible so I don't have the time or ability at first to create a whole world. Secondly I can tell you are very passionate about dnd and that's great but your mindset seems extremely narrow, basically stating zero women play the game is kind of an odd take, again it's not 1970 or 1980 anymore, that was 50 plus years ago. Segregation was only 20ish years before that time frame so kind of crazy to view it like that. I'd say maybe not be so brutal with your statements because you may chase new people off that find your videos. It's perfectly great to be critical and I like that, maybe talk specifically about some adventures and instead of say whatever the hell that is and trash something think of how popular said idea is and how it may actually sell dnd to new comers which should be a good thing. There is enough out there to pull in new players, but if I can only read the dms guide and then create 50 hours of lore for my homebrew world (this is kind of the idea I feel like you were saying should be the case? Again not entirely sure you just seemed annoyed ranting to me personally so wasn't sure of what other than 90 percent of things with dnd makes you mad). I don't have time for all that and wouldn't do that, changing some adventures to my own things sure, but I can't dedicate that much of my life to something new especially that idk if I'd even enjoy. Maybe just take a deep breath, you seem really stressed about things out of your control, it's ok to disagree or not like decisions but being so negative it may drive away new people. Not trying to be mean or anything and your entitled to your own opinions of course but just giving you a perspective of a new player, since it sounds like you don't really know new players but people who have played for a very long time. Best of luck to you and your channel
Thank you so much for your post and scaring your perspective. Lots to think about there
@@Joethelawyer no problem! Thanks for your reply being respectful! Best of luck!
@@20marzboy thank you! Check out the video I just dropped. My long one on the OSR. I think you might like it.
Metal. I love a good grognard rant. I see you, brother.
The weird thing is that the dust had barely settled on the underaged, indentured servants hand-stitching the covers on the first run of the 2014 PHB before comments sections all over the internet were full of gnarly old grognards predicting more or less the situation we find ourselves in today. Warning us that WotC were suffering under a delusion that they were nurturing a raptor which, impressive as that seems, would slowly evolve the brightly coloured plumage of its Bird of Paradise final form.
And now, ten years later, that delusion has all but guaranteed the end of an era, the last of the pencil and paper, dining room table, clatter of dice and ice, stained character sheets with a small hole where the hit points total used to be, hard back DnD rules books.
For in the end it didn’t matter what type of dinosaur WotC actually had, only the dinosaur they thought they had. The rainforest goose that would lay a thousand eggs and a thousand more logs barely distinguishable from the eggs and lo, the inchoate and the exudate would together be worth a Magic the Gathering youtuber’s ransom.
Also, if you’re not publishing books you never have to finish writing one worth publishing. When the rules are all part of an on-line gaming ‘experience’ you can just patch them as you go using an underpaid, offshore workforce. I hear Kolkata’s lovely this time of year.
Also, also that whole ‘underaged hand stitching’ bit from the first paragraph may have been a bit out of line. The 2014 PHB was glued.
Thanks Michael!
You bring up some solid concerns but I feel like a lot of this is kinda making assumptions on future decisions and products WotC is making. And like I get the company deserves to be looked at with a lot of criticism but this video comes off just kinda ranting on the idea that everything they're doing is and will be bad.
I'm also confused about the argument that the core books are published one at a time would be made just to make them more money. It's 3 big books with plenty to go through. There's no rush to get them out and publishing them all at once would just leave plenty of things unnoticed with it. Of course it's money wise smart too but it's not like they're bullying the players by releasing them a few months apart. Maybe it's just me personally but I've been glad to have time to go through the player's handbook with time and I'm really excited about the DMG next month. And I'm sure if I got them all at the same time I would have just rushed through them all. Maybe I'm just too optimistic.
They’re missing the Xmas sales season. So dumb.
You, Sir, have the patience of a saint.
👍
They’ll definitely get it launched. I agree that it won’t be a very fun experience. Cooperative role playing video games will be more fun.
Weird isn’t it? There will always be better alternatives than the thing they eventually want it to be.
I can't believe that so many people are laughing at WotC for trying to monetize the game to where an ethnic joke would be tame in comparison. Oy vey!
We may be laughing but it’s a hollow, bitter laugh laden with the bile-riddled spittle of broken dreams.
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm if the people who ran WotC, actually loved the game they bought, instead of trying to mutilate it in 1999 upon the third edition release, two decades later, we wouldn't be making snide jokes at something that a generation ago gave us much joy.
Instead, everyone in my age bracket went off to OSR-land and we won't be back. It offers nothing for us but trying to repackage our memories in the new shitty mechanics they try to shovel out on us. They have marketing, but their product is easily beaten by what innovation has been made by others who grew up on it.
The despair I can handle.
It’s the hope that gets me every time.
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm Have you heard of Adventurer Conquerer King System? It is fantastic, and Alex Macris, the designer, I feel is writing a real version of what should have been Third Edition.
Will check it out, thanks.
Right now I feel like 5e culture is rampant with really poor 'dm advice' they need to focus way more on how to run the game vs 'narrative and developing the world' 'how the characters fit in the world' etc. We need to present a simple to use steps in running a game, with an emphasis on respecting the player's time. I literally sat in sessions where just one player and the DM just ran a the character in a shop negotiating with the shop owner and detailing all the items available and the player wanting to get a customized staff for a his character. Like cmon get on with the adventure.
Jesus man. That’s terrible
My general opinion with D&D in particular is not bad DM advice. The problem is bad player advice. Optimisation of characters, power play builds. Builds that try to break the game and abilities (spells ect) that can nullify entire situations.
@TheNanoNinja certain game design choices lends itself to that nonsense. They try to pander to players who want more more more. The game suffers. The dm suffers having to run a game with all that nonsense. And DM’s stop DM’ing. Less games.
Great video.
Thanks!! Appreciate you taking the time to comment!
Yep welcome modern D&D folks to the club! We gots snacks, and just love games… good gaming.
lol. The oldest amongst us may not be able to drink as much booze. Or have as much salt or sugar. But we’re here with the best games and the best approach to gaming
Great rant!
Thanks! There wasn’t even any whisky involved this time 😂😂
Study the great tech moguls and you find one common theme: they were skilled at what they did and leveraged that skill into a thriving business. Long before there was a "Microsoft" or "Apple" or "Dell Computers" there were single men driving themselves to success by working in the tech industry every way they could. By working I mean programming, soldering circuits, actually hands-on-doing the things that led to their success.
They were building their business based on their skills long before they became a success. Long before they built their business or even went to college.
A big company - and it seems the bigger the worse - tends to attract "business" people whose only skill is in "business" itself. WOTC's and Hasbro's upper-level staff lacks any talent or knowledge of the hobby which in itself is based on fantasy role-playing gaming - having fun pretending to be adventurers and doing things your own way without a lot of rules to bog it all down - they just want to maneuver the titanic ship around in hopes of not hitting an iceberg. While being blindly ignorant of the actual business - fun gaming - they are supposed to be pursuing.
The one way WOTC might make it gangbusters would be if the management was forced to attend a six-month retreat where they designed and played a role-playing game of their own. Not gonna happen.
The success, small as it is, of various OSR ventures is in that the CREATORS are basing their WORK on how they PLAY and HAVE PLAYED and ENJOY PLAYING. Not basing it on a business plan that relies on riding the shoulders of the people playing (and designing) games and adventures.
If I want a weird ass custom sword for my character and visualise it, I will commission an artist to draw it. In the long run it will probably be cheaper also and I will have a truly unique piece of art. No need for bloody micro transactions that'll stealth kill your wallet (Most people use dice collecting for that)
Yup. And totally agree on the dice collecting. I have way to many to ever use in a lifetime
At least with dice collecting, you can bring them with you from game to game, group to group. And you don't need a server or subscription to keep hold of them.
@homebrewisthebestbrew5270 very true!
Less Wotc, more Hasbro
Perhaps
Same thing. Hasbro isn't this outside executive suite placing unwanted demands on WOTC, Hasbro takes its executives straight out of WOTC.
@@yurisei6732 nowadays they’re hiring from Microsoft it seems
So my take is that, at some point one of two things will happen.
Either the D&D brand will become unprofitable due to serious mismanagement then get bought by another company at bargain basement prices.
-OR-
Wizards/Hasbro will find a way to right the ship by putting out stuff that pushes creativity. You see little sparks of what it could be in some supplements like Curse of Strahd and The Deck/Book of Many Things.
Yeah but the latter are from another era just remade for today. They don’t have the talent there to make something like that now. The corporate environment there makes it impossible
The books always mention that these aren't hard rules, that you can and should change anything that you don't like. Some people prefer one edition over another but that doesn't mean that they are right, it's just their preference. No, not all adventure modules are good butthey never were all good. There are so many ttrpg's out there that no one has to ever make homebrew, considering how much time and effort it takes and people's lack of free time. I would suggest people look at what other ttrpg's exist other than D&D because if you can think of it then someone has probably already made it.❤
Im making my own. Fantasy heartbreaker ftw!
Honestly, VTTs are fantastic-just not the one Hasbro is making. I play on Roll20, and it's been great for me. I live in a small town where no one plays D&D anymore. Most of my friends either stopped playing or moved away, but through Roll20, I found a bunch of great people and some really good games.
How is the Roll20 backend for homebrew/rules exceptions/rules modifications?
I had a go at some of the modification mechanics on DnDbeyond (spells, a subclass, character stats) and it was more difficult and less reliable than corporate tax law.
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm Classes and subclasses can be easily modified on the character sheet. You can change damage values, spell descriptions, and other details right on the sheet. Essentially, the character sheet is fully editable, but you have to manually make those changes. I don’t really homebrew much beyond the setting itself.
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm Oh, that's simple. Just copy and paste the text, then set up the damage in the designated damage section on the spell card.
Sounds like a much more user-friendly system. It stable?
@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm Yeah
Here's the 2nd UA-camr that is truthful with his opinion( which is 💯 correct ). States the problem and what happened to the hobby(which was 💯 correct) not only with Hasbro/WOTC but at the gamestores as well. Thx for making this no bs video stating the real truth. I enjoyed this video alot thx again.
WOTC can do whatever they want with their IP. It will still get utilized and played the way we players and DM's want to play it, no matter how much WOTC stamps its feet.
Yup! I strip mined a lot of their stuff for my game. I found some gems I could use early on. As the years went on though I found less and less gems. More and more steaming hot piles of dogshit. I haven’t bought any of their stuff in a few years