Hugh Cornwell about "I Feel Like a Wog" : HC: "I Feel Like a Wog" was one of the songs that was written after Rattus was released. It's really jazz pop with lots of major seventh chords. The four of us all contributed to this song, improving it by constantly playing around with it. The song came out of John's bass line and I came up with the chords and the idea for the melody. Dave provided some great music to complement the melody lines." interviewer: The use of the word 'wog' in a song title was controversial. HC: "A lot was made of that. The word 'wog' is used as a short form of 'gollywog', which was supposed to mean a black person, but in fact it stands for Western Oriental Gentleman. Our use of it in the title was synonymous with the idea of being made to feel alien or foreign. It was saying that you don't have to be black to be made to feel foreign." interviewer: But you'd recognised that some people would take offence at that title ? HC: "Yes, but titles are meant to catch people's attention so that they'll listen to the song. If people read the lyrics, then they'll understand what's it's about. Most Stranglers songs are subject to interpretation. The song is about my identification with immigrants. In the '50s, there was a shortage of bus crews and people to clean out toilets, so the idea was, 'Let's import a lot of West Indians because they're out of work'. It's all very well doing that, but you've got to be prepared to integrate those people into society. So what happened? The autorities put them all into Notting Hill and tried to forget about them. The Notting Hill Carnival is a celebration of black culture and was very nearly banned in the early days because the authorities didn't want the responsibility." interviewer: So the song is anti-racist? HC: "Yes. The song is saying, 'You brought me over here. Let me live here, but don't ask me to be your slave' This is a human rights issue."
I always thought WOG stood for "Wily Oriental Gentleman." Both in India and the Middle East there were plenty of practised courtiers, government functionaries and the like eager to ingratiate themselves with the colonizers and prove themselves indispensable to the orderly running of an unfamiliar nation and people. And yes, a look at a golliwog will certainly cement the view that it was largely about complexion.
"brought me over here" pretty sure your choices were move of your own choice to england where it's cold and the pay is shit, or stay in india and work in streets that also double as toilets the only thing I really dislike about us westerners is the arrogance of us assuming we're uniquely racist or expected to be better or help people just because they're from another country, hell, if we're bad because of immigration policies, how bad is some middle eastern shit hole with bad immigration policies, and bad everything else
Hey Justin, so glad you're back with these guys. To quote Hugh Cornwell: "The word wog stands for, Western Oriental Gentleman. Our use of it in the title was synonymous with the idea of being made to feel alien or foreign. You don't have to be black to be made to feel foreign". [As you rightly pointed out, JP!]. "It's about identifying with immigrants. In the 1950's, there was a shortage of bus crews and people to clean toilets, so the idea was, "Let's import a lot of West Indians because they're out of work." The authorities put them all into Northern Notting Hill [London] and tried to forget about them, instead of integrating them into British society. The Notting Hill Carnival is a celebration of black culture. This song is about a human rights issue". The rest of the song is about the band's experience in Hamburg one time. There were crossed wires with a local -Hugh told a surrealist joke that the person didn't get - this made the boys feel alienated in that particular moment and so inspired the song and it's theme of alienation. Once the theme is recognised, Justin, it's easy then to enjoy this song, coz, yeah, it's banging!!!. Glad you enjoyed. 😺
I had always assumed the term was a racist name for people of South Asian descent. I hadn't known that it stood for Western Oriental Gentleman. So is this term meant for the descendants of indentured Hindus from the Caribbean? I first leaned of them from the writings of V. S. Naipaul. NVM... Justin just read the wiki about it.
To be honest in the early 1970s where I was it was a derogatory term for black people. Never heard or knew of it's connotations with Asian people as there wasn't any where I lived.
I heard, long ago, that wog was originally W.O.G.S. for "workers on government service" (in I don't know what context) and hence South Asians in general. But neither this nor Cosmic Cat's version squares with the fact that for most of the 20th century British kids had toys called "golly-wogs" that were clearly characature africans. (maybe I'm just crediting racists with too good a grasp of geography!) BTW I think your source that included Mediterranean people is getting confused with the word "wop".
@@robertkeay9087 Please read my comment properly where it says, to quote Hugh Cornwell. Hence, not MY version, but Hugh's words taken from the Stranglers "Song By Song" book. Just passing on the info. Read A.K's comment where he puts the quote in full context, from the same book.
It's a kick back to all prejudice, not just race. Including how you dress, or look or if you're rich or poor. It's given a sledgehammer to crack a nut treatment to get the message through, in a 70's un pc style.
Great reaction and analysis as always Justin. I'm pretty sure that, although the word 'wog' is considered offensive, the song wasn't intended to be racially offensive.
Hey man, so a lot (if not all) tracks for No More Heroes were recorded at the same sessions as Rattus Norvegicus; I believe they just felt that putting all those tracks on one album wasn't something they wanted to do. Great album, Bitching is my fave. Black and White is also an awesome album.
There are only four tracks that come from the Rattus Norvegicus sessions ("Something Better Change", "Bitching", "Peasant in the Big Shitty" and "School Mam"). The rest was recorded specifically for the No More Heroes sessions in June-July 1977.
Wow … never thought I’d come across this gem on ANY reactor channel ! And YES in this country (uk) wog is a TERRIBLE and TABOO word , that having been said it’s of it’s time and was essential for putting the whole point if the track across . Love it ❤️ 👍🏴
Some of the tracks on this album were as someone previously mentioned, recorded in the same session as Rattus. You did hit the nail on the head though by realizing that it wasn’t a racist song but rather a feeling of alienation!! Still waiting for you to get to Walk on by though!!!! You will be blown away by that as you clearly love Dave Greenfields contributions👍🏻👍🏻
No More heroes a great album, they mixed the bass a little softer than on Rattus, mainly to let Hugh's guitar shine more. However Black and White returns with the floor shaking Bass again.
Thank you for reviewing this song. I was startled, and amused, when I first heard it when I bought the album way back in the 1970s. I''m really enjoying your walk through of non-North American album and single chart toppers of the recent past.
Good to see you reacting to No More Heroes album Justin. Looking forward to your reaction to Dave Greenfield vocals on Dead Ringer and Peasant In The Big Shitty
Great reaction mate, you nailed it. Try The Raven album. It follows Black and white. All the elements are still there but you'll really see the progression of the band.
I'm sure there alot of certain people who will deliberately misread the meaning of this song , but its one of tge Strangkers more true statement songs . Thanks for posting 👍
Thanks for reviewing the music of my youth! I don’t know whether you’ve reviewed Straighten Out by the band. It has a great keyboard arpeggio, one of the best in my humble opinion.
Half of the No More Heroes album is built from leftovers from the Rattus sessions. The other half is new material (you can hear it sometimes in the more modern keyboard sounds). I Feel Like A Wog is one of the new songs. In my opinion the album is a bit of a shadow of the debut, just because of the leftover feel in certain tracks. Black & White was a real step forward.
Four tracks come from the Rattus Norvegicus sessions ("Something Better Change", "Bitching", "Peasant in the Big Shitty" and "School Mam"). The other seven tracks were recorded during the No More Heroes sessions in June-July 1977.
For the pedants among us, there is no evidence that the word was an acronym. It seems to have come from the word Golliwog, which was the name of a blackface doll character in a children's book by the US writer Bertha Upton. Trivial fact: when I was a child I had such a doll, long before the dolls themselves came to be considered offensive. PS I suspect the Stranglers were trying to cause some offense (even if the overall message was anti-racist), in keeping with their bad boys image.
At the time no one would have thought it was anything but reference to golliwog, which was becoming and racist word on the progressive left front line in London and the UK in general at the time.
'I feel like a Wog' is an anti-racist song. It is written in the first person from the perspective of a repressed racial minority figure, who, from his point of view, is put upon, and put down, by the white majority. It was always intended as a lament to the privations of the racial minorities. A sympathy with their interminable adversity. There have been a few criticisms of the song over the past quarter of a century, but usually as a result of a misunderstanding of it's message. We feel that that message is as valid today as it ever was. There is a need for someone, who can, to speak up for those concomitant with their fortuity of birth.......Jet Black 2011
It is definitely them bringing attention to a horrible matter that plagues our society still. We need to evolve from this childish hating for no reason. I like who I like -- and I don't care where they come from, colour of their skin, how much money they haven't got, how they dress and speak, where they live, whether they're young, old, mentally disabled, disfigured, etc. If I like them I like the them! :0)
Wog is one of those words where Mom clobbers you if you use it (because nice people don't). I don't know if it was a wash your mouth out with soap word. Never pushed my luck with it. In old South Africa it was used as a kind of "mild intentioned" racist word - demeaning, but somehow not one of the "harsher" words. (I don't think that needs any more analysis.) I can't remember the last time I heard someone use it. People turning racist (or often just race-blaming-angry - which is a different thing, most of the time) will use the most extreme words (in our local context - begins with a K- , and even at this age I can't bring myself to mention it without a certain amount of discomfort ... but can tolerate eg family members or other people whose true hearts I know well enough, using it, all the same. Because stress breaks out differently in everyone, basically. Country is disintegrating. Some people are going to give up on trying to be reasonable. (The people who've given up on being decent, one avoids for that, not something like the language they use.) Anyway someone else's problem. It's also just a word. I've heard that it's supposedly meant to come from "worthy Oriental gentleman" - but meaning something insulting, I'd guess, given the context, in British imperial India. In Australia, it was used for Italians, Greeks, and maybe Lebanese. It was a bad word, but very much depending on context. I've heard someone talk mock-disparagingly about "you wogs" to his best mate before, for instance. And after all it's just a word. I don't think the Aussies have a common racist word for people with some detectable African ancestry. No real history of interaction in the days when so many people thought of almost everything in terms of "race". (Right down to the distinct Norman and Saxon races that could be distinguished by some imaginations, and made to mean something - just like all the other "theoretical races".) I think the average Aussie would feel the same discomfort the K-word gives me (and the N-word gives Americans - unless they're angry about something and think they've found out who to blame, and think that one you've found out who's to blame, you've solved your problems - sort of like most members of the South African government when the pretences slip) at saying the word, "Boong" - which is a word your mom needs to at very least give you a good clip on the ear if you use in that country, at least. It's the worst word for an Aboriginal (and there's less excuse for it than there is for the K-word - which is just the Muslim word for a "heathen" - and had a time where it was used in a simply descriptive term, with no mid-Victorian racist intent. Probably the best long time strategy with all these words is to defuse them. Don't allow them to be "spells". Easier said than done, though, I suppose. In practice maybe there's no alternative to giving them the power of taboo, as a side effect of forbidding them.
And then there's the emergence from hiding of *Katherine in a Cupboard* and their song *Sorry I (Breathed)* - featuring, i.a. Babba Leith, once a drummer of them Cardiacs. It's a weird song. Good. ua-cam.com/video/JCG1T84TMVI/v-deo.html
sickofthewest We had a Greek comedy sitcom in Australia, where they defused any controversy by embracing the term. It was about a Greek cafe in Melbourne called "Acropolis NOW!" All starred Greek actors who ran around calling each other wogs. Actually, it was only the female star (Mary Coustos) as "Effie" "Oooooh weally, sometimes you can be such a wog!". She was hilarious and quite hot in a strange way. The same gang had a stage production and movie called "The Wogboy". It was very popular in Aus amongst Aussies and "wogs" alike.
@@warrenbridges1891 If available as an option, just defusing the word like that is the best way to make it harmless. (Like I think it's now perhaps almost permissible for someone not queer to refer to gays as "queer" today.) Aussies can be quite sensible sometimes. :D I'm almost sure Joe Jackson had a song called Acropolis Now on Blaze of Glory. Maybe he saw the show, even. I do think it helps that the historical interactions between the people involved have not been demeaning/ dehumanizing, in general. If you have some who get away with being tin gods (and worse) toward others, it's less easy to just do things like "own the word". (But if you look at how gays were treated in the past, whilst being called queers as a hate word, and now it's pretty much defused, it's definitely possible.) In some parts of Aussie that kind of "owning the B- word" might be OK, just because the haters are now ostracized in most places, for Aboriginals, even. In South Africa the k-word is best just officially and unofficially banned. Equip mothers with good clobbering devices, and instructions to deliver a good sharp clip to offspring using it. It's definitely not nice to hate people or to align with that. Hmm ... I'm thinking now of the Indians in eg. the Durban area (they were the local majority at one point in time - when it was still the biggest Indian city in the world, outside of India). The potentially disparaging word (just depending on intent, really, since it could well be a neutral Hindi or Tamil word) was "charro". Lots of Indians just own that word, wherever it came from, and aren't sensitive about it. There's quite a lot of power in just being insensitive, in a good-humoured kind of way about these things. Ultimately, though, none of these words are necessary. Maybe that's the best approach to take. "Don't use it; it's redundant". That kills it dead enough in a nice, simple kind of way. (And sensitivity is probably the worst, most helpless approach. Like letting the bullies write "Kick Me" on the back of one's shirt.) When it comes to wogs, one of my favourite aunties is a wog - were it ever necessary to put it that way. And my uncle is a Dutchman (which is actually an insulting term in South Africa, if so intended). Or a Clutchplate. Or a Plank. Or a Rock Spider ... English South Africans built up a bit of a resentment to their Afrikaans compatriots at one stage. The hate ran in all directions back in the day. It wasn't as simple as the legislation one literal Dutchman made into a philosophy... better get away from there. My auntie is "woggable", just because she went back home to Aussie, though. Here, a lot of people would just be puzzled by such a naming. (They left because after what her dad went through in WW2, he vowed that no child of his would participate in a war. And then came Vietnam.) All of which is way, way off topic, now.
@@sicko_the_ew I agree wholeheartedly. BTW I have a 44 year old son. His mother is Anglo Indian (we drifted apart and divorced after 25 years of marriage). Sounds Aussie ocker over the phone. People are quite surprised when they first meet her.
@@warrenbridges1891 We're all much, much more products of our environment than we are of what are really quite slight variations in our genetic assembly instructions. I've met Durban Afrikaaners whose accent is so "English" that at first, I've switched to speaking English to them ("since we're both English") before realizing they just sound less Afrikaans, speaking that language, than I do. And then on the other end of that spectrum, I've politely switched to Afrikaans for English speakers from the Eastern Cape - who often have as much of an Afrikaans accent as an Afrikaaner would - and annoyed them by insisting when they switch back. (And as far as the Eastern Cape people go, the odds are we're distant relatives, since my mom's family come from there originally, and they had lots of kids - up to 15 per generation.)
My old dad said Wogs were Italians coz they had slightly tanned skin, the whole human race is critical of persons who do'n't define to a certain creed and that includes just about every culture, its not just a white or black thing (next albums black and white lol ), the Stranglers are certainly not racist in any way, even though Cornwell could be defined by some as middle class, the Stranglers always tried to speak for the masses in their fight against injustice caused by the ruling classes (the vermin, the rats in the sewer), carry on the good work
This is one of several early Stranglers songs that use racially charged language and lyrics to make various different anti-racist commentary against what might have been considered prevailing social attitudes. It also need to be taken in context of the racial tension (in London in particular) in the late 1970s, which went on into the 1980s. The 1970s, especially the side to late 1970s going on up to around 1985, were a period of very slow economic growth ands high inflation and interest rates with staggering job losses across the state nationalised economic sector (shipbuilding, steel manufacture cars, mining etc). The film, My Beautiful Launderette covers some of this and was made a few years after the peak (time of the Brixton Riots). At the time the anti-nazi league would frequently hold protest marches against the BNP and skin heads supporters who promoted racist positions against immigration. Much more can be said on this subject for sure.
Morning to all the 'square pegs'. Here's hoping that the word alienation comes to mean only a country of extraterrestrials!👽 I also am a Wog, but I'd rather "Be Your Dog". Peace & 'no tan line', Love.✌
It will be for later because "Who Wants The World" dates from 1979 and it seems that Justin wants to do the Stranglers discography chronologically, but that will come in due time.
Another great track that takes an offensive word and repurposes it as a positive is Niggalize It by 90s mixed-race French funk-rock fusion band FFF (French Funk Federation or Fédération Française de Fonck).
Really looking forward to this. There are some dodgy lyrics coming up so be careful on nubiles. By school ma'am is excellent and please include the b side for something better change, straighten out. Ta
Spot on analysis, it is exactly what the song is about, JJ was french and also felt like an outsider. It is in essence an anti racist song, same with peaches which has a feminist theme which people often miss.
Times changed in 60s 70s your average brit comedy full of racism, still about in Street just not on mainstream TV. With big waves of immigrants poor housing availability in UK a lot of resentment brewing once again. Not helped by economic state today. But every country in world has same problem just different reasons. ☮️✌️
Patrick Doake We had a '90s Greek comedy sitcom in Australia called "Acropolis NOW!" It was about a Melbourne, Greek cafe, where the "wogs" all ran around calling each other "wogs". It was hilarious and by taking the piss out of themselves, they actually seemed to remove the malicious intent of it's use (at the time).
Sorry but it’s a very bad word ( same as the N word maybe worse ? ) yep - it was acceptable in the olden days - doesn’t bother me so because this was the past - definitely unacceptable now - in uk Robinsons jam ( the biggest jam sellers probably on the planet at the time 40s/70s ) had an image on the jar called a gollywogg which now is a banned image which depicted a snazzily dressed black caricature . Chris.
Same as the n word wog has non derogatory uses like in Australia where it’s a form of humour and can just be used to refer to someone who is an Italian migrant or any country in the area of Italy while in the uk it used to be used as a derogatory term for people with darker skin
At the time this song was written, racists did call non-white Brits wogs. I always thought this song tried to highlight how wrong and unfair these attitudes were towards anyone who was in any way different. It was probably quite a brave thing to do at the time. Pleased to say attitudes here in the UK have changed enormously since then, and I haven’t heard that word used in many years. The song feels a bit awkward to listen to now though.
WOG stands for Western Oriented Gentleman (although that is disputed). It is a racist term for black people equivalent to the N word and I see it as derogatory and offensive.
Wog is a very derogatory term in the UK. And this was out so soon after their debut cos is was made up of leftover tracks that didn't make the cut. The first album, the wheat, and this was (for the most part), the chaff. And is shows. This's a poor, repetitive opener, and that doesn't bode well. Specially for this, an all too soon return to this bunch.
"I Feel Like a Wog" was not a leftover from the previous album. It was one of the new songs written specifically for the No More Heroes sessions which took place in June-July 1977. There were only four songs from Rattus Norvegicus' January-February 77 sessions on No More Heroes ( "Something Better Change", "Bitching", "Peasant in the Big Shitty" and "School Mam"). I really liked Rattus Norvegicus but actually I prefer the No More Heroes album due to its rawer nature and vocal diversity (Dave Greenfield sings on two tracks: "Dead Ringer" and my favorite "Peasant in the Big Shitty" ).
@@a.k.1740 Now i didn't specify this particularly as one of the leftovers, though i knew there were a few. That's why i threw in 'for the most part', re the album.
I did not realize until just a moment ago that "WOG" and "Golliwog" are synonyms for "N" So I looked it up... The song makes a lot more sense now! "I feel like a Wog, They give me the eye..." I always thought it was a version of "DOG" Still a great song! We are all "N"s sometimes... And it's a pisser for sure when a white guy get's call "My N" by a black guy!!! I just don't like it... Anyways, I have had No More Hero's in my collection since the 1980s, and I DID NOT KNOW!! IMHO en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golliwog
Hey man your not a wog iam a big stranglers fan and you made a lot sense! all White people are not the same ! I have allways be taught by my parents and my six sisters and my extended black relatives is to respect people iam Irish and I gladly respect your reaction to this song which is a song for oppressed people, keep it up.
Hugh Cornwell about "I Feel Like a Wog" :
HC: "I Feel Like a Wog" was one of the songs that was written after Rattus was released. It's really jazz pop with lots of major seventh chords. The four of us all contributed to this song, improving it by constantly playing around with it. The song came out of John's bass line and I came up with the chords and the idea for the melody. Dave provided some great music to complement the melody lines."
interviewer: The use of the word 'wog' in a song title was controversial.
HC: "A lot was made of that. The word 'wog' is used as a short form of 'gollywog', which was supposed to mean a black person, but in fact it stands for Western Oriental Gentleman. Our use of it in the title was synonymous with the idea of being made to feel alien or foreign. It was saying that you don't have to be black to be made to feel foreign."
interviewer: But you'd recognised that some people would take offence at that title ?
HC: "Yes, but titles are meant to catch people's attention so that they'll listen to the song. If people read the lyrics, then they'll understand what's it's about. Most Stranglers songs are subject to interpretation. The song is about my identification with immigrants. In the '50s, there was a shortage of bus crews and people to clean out toilets, so the idea was, 'Let's import a lot of West Indians because they're out of work'. It's all very well doing that, but you've got to be prepared to integrate those people into society. So what happened? The autorities put them all into Notting Hill and tried to forget about them. The Notting Hill Carnival is a celebration of black culture and was very nearly banned in the early days because the authorities didn't want the responsibility."
interviewer: So the song is anti-racist?
HC: "Yes. The song is saying, 'You brought me over here. Let me live here, but don't ask me to be your slave' This is a human rights issue."
Thanks. Great description.
I always thought WOG stood for "Wily Oriental Gentleman."
Both in India and the Middle East there were plenty of practised courtiers, government functionaries and the like eager to ingratiate themselves with the colonizers and prove themselves indispensable to the orderly running of an unfamiliar nation and people.
And yes, a look at a golliwog will certainly cement the view that it was largely about complexion.
"brought me over here"
pretty sure your choices were move of your own choice to england where it's cold and the pay is shit, or stay in india and work in streets that also double as toilets
the only thing I really dislike about us westerners is the arrogance of us assuming we're uniquely racist or expected to be better or help people just because they're from another country, hell, if we're bad because of immigration policies, how bad is some middle eastern shit hole with bad immigration policies, and bad everything else
W.O.G. is often thought to be an abbreviation sometimes of "Worthy Oriental Gentleman". Greenfield was a virtuoso & inspired talent. Brilliant
Hey Justin, so glad you're back with these guys. To quote Hugh Cornwell: "The word wog stands for, Western Oriental Gentleman. Our use of it in the title was synonymous with the idea of being made to feel alien or foreign. You don't have to be black to be made to feel foreign". [As you rightly pointed out, JP!]. "It's about identifying with immigrants. In the 1950's, there was a shortage of bus crews and people to clean toilets, so the idea was, "Let's import a lot of West Indians because they're out of work." The authorities put them all into Northern Notting Hill [London] and tried to forget about them, instead of integrating them into British society. The Notting Hill Carnival is a celebration of black culture. This song is about a human rights issue". The rest of the song is about the band's experience in Hamburg one time. There were crossed wires with a local -Hugh told a surrealist joke that the person didn't get - this made the boys feel alienated in that particular moment and so inspired the song and it's theme of alienation. Once the theme is recognised, Justin, it's easy then to enjoy this song, coz, yeah, it's banging!!!. Glad you enjoyed. 😺
I had always assumed the term was a racist name for people of South Asian descent. I hadn't known that it stood for Western Oriental Gentleman. So is this term meant for the descendants of indentured Hindus from the Caribbean? I first leaned of them from the writings of V. S. Naipaul. NVM... Justin just read the wiki about it.
To be honest in the early 1970s where I was it was a derogatory term for black people. Never heard or knew of it's connotations with Asian people as there wasn't any where I lived.
I heard, long ago, that wog was originally W.O.G.S. for "workers on government service" (in I don't know what context) and hence South Asians in general.
But neither this nor Cosmic Cat's version squares with the fact that for most of the 20th century British kids had toys called "golly-wogs" that were clearly characature africans. (maybe I'm just crediting racists with too good a grasp of geography!)
BTW I think your source that included Mediterranean people is getting confused with the word "wop".
@@robertkeay9087 Please read my comment properly where it says, to quote Hugh Cornwell. Hence, not MY version, but Hugh's words taken from the Stranglers "Song By Song" book. Just passing on the info. Read A.K's comment where he puts the quote in full context, from the same book.
It meant "Worthy Oriental Gentleman" I think
Oh that bass line. JJ Burnell has always impressed.
You can just imagine what would happen if this was released today. So glad I was there for it in the 70's
It's a kick back to all prejudice, not just race. Including how you dress, or look or if you're rich or poor. It's given a sledgehammer to crack a nut treatment to get the message through, in a 70's un pc style.
Wow - what an opening track. I think I should keep an eye on that album...
The black lads at school liked it, they said that was exactly how they felt.
haha oh dear
@@dave1secondago of course you might well disagree, but there you go. 😂
Great reaction and analysis as always Justin. I'm pretty sure that, although the word 'wog' is considered offensive, the song wasn't intended to be racially offensive.
Hey man, so a lot (if not all) tracks for No More Heroes were recorded at the same sessions as Rattus Norvegicus; I believe they just felt that putting all those tracks on one album wasn't something they wanted to do. Great album, Bitching is my fave. Black and White is also an awesome album.
There are only four tracks that come from the Rattus Norvegicus sessions ("Something Better Change", "Bitching", "Peasant in the Big Shitty" and "School Mam"). The rest was recorded specifically for the No More Heroes sessions in June-July 1977.
The Stranglers "Walk On By",, "Skin Deep",, "Strange Little Girl" & "...And If You Should See Dave"...R.I.P. Dave.
Wow … never thought I’d come across this gem on ANY reactor channel ! And YES in this country (uk) wog is a TERRIBLE and TABOO word , that having been said it’s of it’s time and was essential for putting the whole point if the track across . Love it ❤️
👍🏴
For some perverse reason the word and its racist meaning seems to have been forgotten.
Not by me , I’m 60 and it’s a BAD word as you know 👀
👍🏴
Some of the tracks on this album were as someone previously mentioned, recorded in the same session as Rattus. You did hit the nail on the head though by realizing that it wasn’t a racist song but rather a feeling of alienation!! Still waiting for you to get to Walk on by though!!!! You will be blown away by that as you clearly love Dave Greenfields contributions👍🏻👍🏻
No More heroes a great album, they mixed the bass a little softer than on Rattus, mainly to let Hugh's guitar shine more. However Black and White returns with the floor shaking Bass again.
Always enjoy the music, always enjoy your reaction, break-down and analysis. Great work.
Stranglers in their prime.... Peaches... No More Heroes... killer stuff.
Thank you for reviewing this song. I was startled, and amused, when I first heard it when I bought the album way back in the 1970s.
I''m really enjoying your walk through of non-North American album and single chart toppers of the recent past.
Great songs great live you see them live
Wog means worker of government
Good to see you reacting to No More Heroes album Justin. Looking forward to your reaction to Dave Greenfield vocals on Dead Ringer and Peasant In The Big Shitty
I really like those two, especially the second in which Dave Greenfield's vocals are snarky and menacing and Jet Black's drums all in syncopation !
AKA The Chiddingfold Chokers, The Guildford Stranglers, The Knob Stranglers and later with Celia Gollin, Celia and the Mutations.
Great you've returned to the Strangers,& especially you haven't jumped over 'No More Heroes' & leaped to 'Black and White'.
The comments below are so informative. I thought this opener was excellent, but after reading the explanations 'twas even better.
YESSS!!! No More heroes is a great album their next 6 albums just get better from here they’re a really great band which you will love
Its a great opening track
Great reaction mate, you nailed it. Try The Raven album. It follows Black and white. All the elements are still there but you'll really see the progression of the band.
They also did the song Daggenham Dave on this album. About a black guy who committed suicide , Dave was one of their friends whatl can remember
I'm sure there alot of certain people who will deliberately misread the meaning of this song , but its one of tge Strangkers more true statement songs . Thanks for posting 👍
Thanks for reviewing the music of my youth! I don’t know whether you’ve reviewed Straighten Out by the band. It has a great keyboard arpeggio, one of the best in my humble opinion.
Good analysis as per usual .👈
The Stranglers wrote some great lyrics 👍
Brilliant song
I'm not very familiar with the Stranglers. But I love two of their songs, La Folie and Golden Brown, both on their 1981 album, La Folie.
Half of the No More Heroes album is built from leftovers from the Rattus sessions. The other half is new material (you can hear it sometimes in the more modern keyboard sounds). I Feel Like A Wog is one of the new songs. In my opinion the album is a bit of a shadow of the debut, just because of the leftover feel in certain tracks. Black & White was a real step forward.
Four tracks come from the Rattus Norvegicus sessions ("Something Better Change", "Bitching", "Peasant in the Big Shitty" and "School Mam"). The other seven tracks were recorded during the No More Heroes sessions in June-July 1977.
Try their version of “ walk on by” a little piece of excellence.
For the pedants among us, there is no evidence that the word was an acronym. It seems to have come from the word Golliwog, which was the name of a blackface doll character in a children's book by the US writer Bertha Upton. Trivial fact: when I was a child I had such a doll, long before the dolls themselves came to be considered offensive.
PS I suspect the Stranglers were trying to cause some offense (even if the overall message was anti-racist), in keeping with their bad boys image.
At the time no one would have thought it was anything but reference to golliwog, which was becoming and racist word on the progressive left front line in London and the UK in general at the time.
wasnt it on the jam aswell
'I feel like a Wog' is an anti-racist song.
It is written in the first person from the perspective of a repressed racial minority figure, who, from his point of view, is put upon, and put down, by the white majority.
It was always intended as a lament to the privations of the racial minorities. A sympathy with their interminable adversity.
There have been a few criticisms of the song over the past quarter of a century, but usually as a result of a misunderstanding of it's message. We feel that that message is as valid today as it ever was. There is a need for someone, who can, to speak up for those concomitant with their fortuity of birth.......Jet Black 2011
It is an anti-racist song, but it isnt from the perspective of a racial minority figure but an alienated Londoner.
@@nickbrough8335 That's right. He only said he "feels like" a wog.
It is definitely them bringing attention to a horrible matter that plagues our society still. We need to evolve from this childish hating for no reason. I like who I like -- and I don't care where they come from, colour of their skin, how much money they haven't got, how they dress and speak, where they live, whether they're young, old, mentally disabled, disfigured, etc. If I like them I like the them! :0)
Robinsons jam product gollie wog
Wog is one of those words where Mom clobbers you if you use it (because nice people don't). I don't know if it was a wash your mouth out with soap word. Never pushed my luck with it. In old South Africa it was used as a kind of "mild intentioned" racist word - demeaning, but somehow not one of the "harsher" words. (I don't think that needs any more analysis.) I can't remember the last time I heard someone use it. People turning racist (or often just race-blaming-angry - which is a different thing, most of the time) will use the most extreme words (in our local context - begins with a K- , and even at this age I can't bring myself to mention it without a certain amount of discomfort ... but can tolerate eg family members or other people whose true hearts I know well enough, using it, all the same. Because stress breaks out differently in everyone, basically. Country is disintegrating. Some people are going to give up on trying to be reasonable. (The people who've given up on being decent, one avoids for that, not something like the language they use.) Anyway someone else's problem.
It's also just a word. I've heard that it's supposedly meant to come from "worthy Oriental gentleman" - but meaning something insulting, I'd guess, given the context, in British imperial India.
In Australia, it was used for Italians, Greeks, and maybe Lebanese. It was a bad word, but very much depending on context. I've heard someone talk mock-disparagingly about "you wogs" to his best mate before, for instance. And after all it's just a word. I don't think the Aussies have a common racist word for people with some detectable African ancestry. No real history of interaction in the days when so many people thought of almost everything in terms of "race". (Right down to the distinct Norman and Saxon races that could be distinguished by some imaginations, and made to mean something - just like all the other "theoretical races".)
I think the average Aussie would feel the same discomfort the K-word gives me (and the N-word gives Americans - unless they're angry about something and think they've found out who to blame, and think that one you've found out who's to blame, you've solved your problems - sort of like most members of the South African government when the pretences slip) at saying the word, "Boong" - which is a word your mom needs to at very least give you a good clip on the ear if you use in that country, at least. It's the worst word for an Aboriginal (and there's less excuse for it than there is for the K-word - which is just the Muslim word for a "heathen" - and had a time where it was used in a simply descriptive term, with no mid-Victorian racist intent.
Probably the best long time strategy with all these words is to defuse them. Don't allow them to be "spells". Easier said than done, though, I suppose. In practice maybe there's no alternative to giving them the power of taboo, as a side effect of forbidding them.
And then there's the emergence from hiding of *Katherine in a Cupboard* and their song *Sorry I (Breathed)* - featuring, i.a. Babba Leith, once a drummer of them Cardiacs. It's a weird song. Good. ua-cam.com/video/JCG1T84TMVI/v-deo.html
sickofthewest We had a Greek comedy sitcom in Australia, where they defused any controversy by embracing the term. It was about a Greek cafe in Melbourne called "Acropolis NOW!" All starred Greek actors who ran around calling each other wogs. Actually, it was only the female star (Mary Coustos) as "Effie" "Oooooh weally, sometimes you can be such a wog!". She was hilarious and quite hot in a strange way. The same gang had a stage production and movie called "The Wogboy". It was very popular in Aus amongst Aussies and "wogs" alike.
@@warrenbridges1891 If available as an option, just defusing the word like that is the best way to make it harmless. (Like I think it's now perhaps almost permissible for someone not queer to refer to gays as "queer" today.) Aussies can be quite sensible sometimes. :D
I'm almost sure Joe Jackson had a song called Acropolis Now on Blaze of Glory. Maybe he saw the show, even.
I do think it helps that the historical interactions between the people involved have not been demeaning/ dehumanizing, in general. If you have some who get away with being tin gods (and worse) toward others, it's less easy to just do things like "own the word". (But if you look at how gays were treated in the past, whilst being called queers as a hate word, and now it's pretty much defused, it's definitely possible.)
In some parts of Aussie that kind of "owning the B- word" might be OK, just because the haters are now ostracized in most places, for Aboriginals, even.
In South Africa the k-word is best just officially and unofficially banned. Equip mothers with good clobbering devices, and instructions to deliver a good sharp clip to offspring using it. It's definitely not nice to hate people or to align with that.
Hmm ... I'm thinking now of the Indians in eg. the Durban area (they were the local majority at one point in time - when it was still the biggest Indian city in the world, outside of India). The potentially disparaging word (just depending on intent, really, since it could well be a neutral Hindi or Tamil word) was "charro". Lots of Indians just own that word, wherever it came from, and aren't sensitive about it. There's quite a lot of power in just being insensitive, in a good-humoured kind of way about these things.
Ultimately, though, none of these words are necessary. Maybe that's the best approach to take. "Don't use it; it's redundant". That kills it dead enough in a nice, simple kind of way. (And sensitivity is probably the worst, most helpless approach. Like letting the bullies write "Kick Me" on the back of one's shirt.)
When it comes to wogs, one of my favourite aunties is a wog - were it ever necessary to put it that way. And my uncle is a Dutchman (which is actually an insulting term in South Africa, if so intended). Or a Clutchplate. Or a Plank. Or a Rock Spider ... English South Africans built up a bit of a resentment to their Afrikaans compatriots at one stage. The hate ran in all directions back in the day. It wasn't as simple as the legislation one literal Dutchman made into a philosophy... better get away from there.
My auntie is "woggable", just because she went back home to Aussie, though. Here, a lot of people would just be puzzled by such a naming. (They left because after what her dad went through in WW2, he vowed that no child of his would participate in a war. And then came Vietnam.) All of which is way, way off topic, now.
@@sicko_the_ew I agree wholeheartedly. BTW I have a 44 year old son. His mother is Anglo Indian (we drifted apart and divorced after 25 years of marriage). Sounds Aussie ocker over the phone. People are quite surprised when they first meet her.
@@warrenbridges1891 We're all much, much more products of our environment than we are of what are really quite slight variations in our genetic assembly instructions.
I've met Durban Afrikaaners whose accent is so "English" that at first, I've switched to speaking English to them ("since we're both English") before realizing they just sound less Afrikaans, speaking that language, than I do. And then on the other end of that spectrum, I've politely switched to Afrikaans for English speakers from the Eastern Cape - who often have as much of an Afrikaans accent as an Afrikaaner would - and annoyed them by insisting when they switch back. (And as far as the Eastern Cape people go, the odds are we're distant relatives, since my mom's family come from there originally, and they had lots of kids - up to 15 per generation.)
Banger!❤
My old dad said Wogs were Italians coz they had slightly tanned skin, the whole human race is critical of persons who do'n't define to a certain creed and that includes just about every culture, its not just a white or black thing (next albums black and white lol ), the Stranglers are certainly not racist in any way, even though Cornwell could be defined by some as middle class, the Stranglers always tried to speak for the masses in their fight against injustice caused by the ruling classes (the vermin, the rats in the sewer), carry on the good work
I've never heard of Italians being called wog, the term used offensively for Italians was wop.
@@mickr1448 Italians were called by the Americans during the early 1900 ‘s immigration …WOP…WithOut Passport
FWIW JJ was French and growing up he was picked on a lot for that. Not sure if that was a primary reason for him going into martial arts.
This is one of several early Stranglers songs that use racially charged language and lyrics to make various different anti-racist commentary against what might have been considered prevailing social attitudes. It also need to be taken in context of the racial tension (in London in particular) in the late 1970s, which went on into the 1980s. The 1970s, especially the side to late 1970s going on up to around 1985, were a period of very slow economic growth ands high inflation and interest rates with staggering job losses across the state nationalised economic sector (shipbuilding, steel manufacture cars, mining etc).
The film, My Beautiful Launderette covers some of this and was made a few years after the peak (time of the Brixton Riots). At the time the anti-nazi league would frequently hold protest marches against the BNP and skin heads supporters who promoted racist positions against immigration. Much more can be said on this subject for sure.
Morning to all the 'square pegs'. Here's hoping that the word alienation comes to mean only a country of extraterrestrials!👽 I also am a Wog, but I'd rather "Be Your Dog". Peace & 'no tan line', Love.✌
Check out the track Who Wants The World.
It will be for later because "Who Wants The World" dates from 1979 and it seems that Justin wants to do the Stranglers discography chronologically, but that will come in due time.
Another great track that takes an offensive word and repurposes it as a positive is Niggalize It by 90s mixed-race French funk-rock fusion band FFF (French Funk Federation or Fédération Française de Fonck).
Really looking forward to this. There are some dodgy lyrics coming up so be careful on nubiles. By school ma'am is excellent and please include the b side for something better change, straighten out. Ta
Funny to see someone doing a first listen on this, yes it is derogatory word :) western orientated gentleman
Your volume output needs up by at least 4dB
lol....most avoided reviewing this one
Spot on analysis, it is exactly what the song is about, JJ was french and also felt like an outsider. It is in essence an anti racist song, same with peaches which has a feminist theme which people often miss.
Times changed in 60s 70s your average brit comedy full of racism, still about in Street just not on mainstream TV. With big waves of immigrants poor housing availability in UK a lot of resentment brewing once again. Not helped by economic state today. But every country in world has same problem just different reasons. ☮️✌️
Patrick Doake We had a '90s Greek comedy sitcom in Australia called "Acropolis NOW!" It was about a Melbourne, Greek cafe, where the "wogs" all ran around calling each other "wogs". It was hilarious and by taking the piss out of themselves, they actually seemed to remove the malicious intent of it's use (at the time).
Sorry but it’s a very bad word ( same as the N word maybe worse ? ) yep - it was acceptable in the olden days - doesn’t bother me so because this was the past - definitely unacceptable now - in uk Robinsons jam ( the biggest jam sellers probably on the planet at the time 40s/70s ) had an image on the jar called a gollywogg which now is a banned image which depicted a snazzily dressed black caricature . Chris.
Same as the n word wog has non derogatory uses like in Australia where it’s a form of humour and can just be used to refer to someone who is an Italian migrant or any country in the area of Italy while in the uk it used to be used as a derogatory term for people with darker skin
I really dislike the descending trail of the lead vocals, once in awhile is ok
but it’s just too muccchhhh
hhhh
hhhh
Different times...
At the time this song was written, racists did call non-white Brits wogs. I always thought this song tried to highlight how wrong and unfair these attitudes were towards anyone who was in any way different. It was probably quite a brave thing to do at the time. Pleased to say attitudes here in the UK have changed enormously since then, and I haven’t heard that word used in many years. The song feels a bit awkward to listen to now though.
WOG stands for Western Oriented Gentleman (although that is disputed). It is a racist term for black people equivalent to the N word and I see it as derogatory and offensive.
Quite worst than his first album
Wog is a very derogatory term in the UK. And this was out so soon after their debut cos is was made up of leftover tracks that didn't make the cut. The first album, the wheat, and this was (for the most part), the chaff. And is shows. This's a poor, repetitive opener, and that doesn't bode well. Specially for this, an all too soon return to this bunch.
Jfergs so SOUR.✔
For me too.
"I Feel Like a Wog" was not a leftover from the previous album. It was one of the new songs written specifically for the No More Heroes sessions which took place in June-July 1977. There were only four songs from Rattus Norvegicus' January-February 77 sessions on No More Heroes ( "Something Better Change", "Bitching", "Peasant in the Big Shitty" and "School Mam"). I really liked Rattus Norvegicus but actually I prefer the No More Heroes album due to its rawer nature and vocal diversity (Dave Greenfield sings on two tracks: "Dead Ringer" and my favorite "Peasant in the Big Shitty" ).
@@a.k.1740 Now i didn't specify this particularly as one of the leftovers, though i knew there were a few. That's why i threw in 'for the most part', re the album.
You should review “ White noise “ by Stiff Little Fingers . I’d be fascinated by your opinion .
I did not realize until just a moment ago that "WOG" and "Golliwog" are synonyms for "N" So I looked it up...
The song makes a lot more sense now! "I feel like a Wog, They give me the eye..." I always thought it was a version of "DOG"
Still a great song! We are all "N"s sometimes...
And it's a pisser for sure when a white guy get's call "My N" by a black guy!!! I just don't like it...
Anyways, I have had No More Hero's in my collection since the 1980s, and I DID NOT KNOW!!
IMHO
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golliwog
Hey man your not a wog iam a big stranglers fan and you made a lot sense! all White people are not the same ! I have allways be taught by my parents and my six sisters and my extended black relatives is to respect people iam Irish and I gladly respect your reaction to this song which is a song for oppressed people, keep it up.
Thank you Ned :) Hope you're well!