Just a heads up you guys. I'm afraid that's not true. Your mix in mono is going to sound way different as soon as you start panning, especially channels 100% right or left, since they'll lose on average 6db. Best mixers in the game back this up. Try it yourselves. Listen to a sound or mix in mono, then pan a channel or the sound hard right or left. When it's panned all the way, it will lose db. Conclusion: a mix without panning, and the same mix with panning, different mono output. So be aware of that. Take care.
I actually use "25/25 panning": Stuff at the center, and other some at 25% in one side, 50%, 75% and 100%. I feel a good balance that way but it actually depends on the instrument and how "in your face" or "background" it is.
Me as well, but I'm now kind of thinking really there's nothing to stop us from using 1/4's (25% panning increments), 1/3's, 1/2's in separate parts of the song to add stereo contrasts between the appropriate corresponding phrases to help accentuate any phrase by designing less stereo contrast in the passage preceding it...
Its really really really a very helpful of me because last four to five days i m gonna stuch with my mind to pan my reel audio with stereo compatible mono mix and yes thats my solution.... I see yr all videos and all tutorials and also i've joined our skool community too.... So much love from INDIA....🇮🇳🖤😇 THANK YOU TO WHOLE TEAM .... LOVE LOVE LOVE
Very effective! Thanks. We can also "move" a guitar for example, 50 % left during the verse, then hard left during the chorus, when the 2nd enters. It "brings life" to the mix I think.
Pukka 👍🏼 I used techniques from another of your vids on subtractive/additional EQ, moved onto panning after watching this and applied a mix of hard and 50/50 panning and .... 💥 I finished my 1st ever, EVER mix, (well.. that I'm absolutely happy with anyway!) Like a real growing moment for me mate.... thanks again man 🙏🏼💯
Good video. I am currently struggling making that wide sound on my new electronic music track. But I've been reading and watching too many videos. Some people say use LCR panning, some say use Haas effect.. Some use expensive plugins. I guess in the end there is no right or wrong way doing things after all when it comes to music :) sometimes I notice I get completely lost when I compare my track to some super wide professionally engineered release and lose my hair because I cannot get the same sound. Music is fascinating because there is always something new to learn :)
This is totally helpful. I believe your decisions to pan should be based on what generally works for the style of music you are going for. I don't know why I didn't think of this technique when it is really basic. Thanks for bringing it to my attention. Earned a sub.
I just finished an album where I mostly did LCR panning. And the problem I had is that certain tracks would not translate well - particularly the ones where the Left and Right were especially different from each other. For instance my phone speakers are actually in stereo but my case muffles the left speaker a bit. And in the car you sit on one side of the car or the other. And when summing to mono, the hard side information can seem quieter than the centered information. So I ended up doing more 50/50 panning on certain tracks where the sides were especially different. So Ear candy bits like shakers and tambourines stayed hard panned. Guitars that were double tracked with a similar/equal-energy part on left and right were hard panned. But on parts where a rhythm instrument like a guitar or piano on the left was doing something significantly different than the one on the right, I found it better to bring them in to 50%. It kept those instruments focussed and audible in every situation without overpowering the lead, ie: Properly Balanced. And while I technically got less width out of this, that was a compromise that was well worth it for the translatability. To retain some width, I actually made sure the delay effects on those instruments were still 100% panned. Because if the subtle delay becomes more/less noticeable in different situations, it doesn't break the song or ruin the balance. People are used to hearing great classic songs in mono all the time. So it ocurred to me that Wide does not equal good. There's no reason to force a mix to be wider if it sacrifices the quality/balance/translatability of the mix. Width should only be used to enhance.
1:39 not ALWAYS. For example, when a song starts, and it starts with a full 100% left panned guitar, and then the right panned guitar enters playing the same thing, it sounds really good.
Great advice! My sound features a lot of lushness and layers, and my standard approach is to have pads, strings etc wide panned to L&R and no or v little C, with, say, perc or guitar licks at 50%, and then your drums and bass in the middle. Backing vox sound great hard L&R no C with the lead vox C. If you use a stereo enhancer on the hard L&R pads, your music will fill the room.
I have always pictured the sweep of the panning knob as the upper half of a clock with 12 obviously being the center. Then I fill in all the spaces between 9 and three.
LCR strikes me as a rule for people who don’t yet have the experience to make good panning decisions. There are absolutely situations where you want to pan somewhere in between and there absolutely are reasons why hard pans or center are often where things should go, only repetition can give someone the knowhow on when to do what.
it also depends on the genre... if you're making a punk or metal song panning something other than toms or maybe the cymbals in between can be a huge mistake. Rhythm guitars must go hard L and R, as well as harmonies and doubles, while lead guitars, lead vocals, bass, kick and snare must go center
So interesting to find this video. I have been doing this, and with the same types of instruments. I didn't know that there was a real breakdown for this. Just years of trial and error, but this meathod is quite effective. Thank for making sense of this. Now I don't feel weird for this. LoL
Also really there's nothing to stop us from using 1/4's (25% panning increments), 1/3's, 1/2's (50% as you demonstrated) in separate parts of the song to add stereo contrasts between the appropriate corresponding phrases to help accentuate any part of the song simply by designing in less stereo contrast in the passage preceding it - kind of like you might think of hitting a chorus after a bridge or verse with extra EQ or Compression.. (& I'd probably mix backwards with that panning idea much like the approach of mixing the loudest part of the song 1st; AFTER the static mix is complete, then mix the widest part of the song 1st and then go to the previous sections to design in contrastingly less spectral panning image contrast)...
I’m stuck been watching your videos for months. My biggest issue is making the mix for everything. In my 1 set of speakers everything sounds great. Then in my others set the bass is bad even with eq! Then in my car it’s close to both. Speakers good and back.
What got me thinking differently here was when you pointed out the fact that when something is exclusively in either L or R - in headphones or earbuds that only one ear is getting that information (as opposed to both in a stereo acoustic, real world listening environment); therefore, it seems that in headphones, the emotional response is being separated independently between hemispheres of the brain per L/R channels; then it begs the question 'does the brain's hemispheres distinguish separate tracks for their qualitative information whether it be mathematical or rhythmic elements vs. tracks that are more of a musical or melodic vibe to independently appease each hemisphere of the mind (math/art, logic/feeling, speaking/singing), and what exactly about that would change for the minds response (if any) when you switch over to the real world, stereo speakers in an acoustic environment scenario when those separate qualities are now being heard binaurally in both ears?).. & finally, If that logical extension for your point were in fact true, then would the same song when mixed panning for feel as you so eloquently demonstrated vs. a qualitatively methodological mix effectively sell itself better or worse to a sample audience of listeners?
Thanks Rob, your tips on audio production are fantastic and has really helped me improved. By the way I was working on a acoustic track with little percussions recently and when I was finished it sounded really empty. I now know why :-) Have a great day!
Good video. I am still learning but I had begun doing this ever since I started recording my own music and people have always liked my mixes. Hard left or right especially if the music is sparse sounds too empty. I usually do imcrements of 25, 50 and 75. Occasionally hard left and right but not often. I have found that moving cymbals to about a 10 - 25 offset opens up a lot of room.
Hullo. : ). How would you pan a sparse mix using LCR. What do you do when the instruments are not enough to go both ways - L/R? How would you pan delay and reverb tails to balance the mix?
Heres a secret mixing technique for you guys. If you pan most your instruments to the left, each instrument at a different degree 2%-60%. Whatever other sound that is mono or panned even the tiniest bit to the right will stand out from the rest.
Great video bro please answer this one,here is what beats me.When you pan perhaps 3 differnt instruments to the exact same spot 50% for example or hard left, dont they mask each other, i thought they should be on different percentages.
I rarely ever pan anything left or right. I use a pan effect sometimes with synths and instrument sounds, but never ever on kicks, snares, hi hats, etc. I think I used pan about 2 or 3 times ever. I'm looking more into this though, but my mixes do not sound bad at all.
.-. My issue is I can't get the instrument (Grandeur : Kontakt) to disable automatic panning. I'm not sure if it's just recorded this way to keep it realistic, which is neat I guess, however I realized if you play the lowest & highest note, the lowest plays about 25% louder in the left ear versus the right ear; playing the highest note will do the same in reverse, roughly 25% louder in the right ear versus the left ear. I'm sure it's intentional, but I want to do my own panning & I'm assuming that this might affect the panning process. Thing is, I feel like it might be stuck like that because of how the samples were possibly recorded?_?.... V_V life is hard
You know, it's really weird, but when I make my music, I usually never pan, and my beats sound really great, but if a singer or vocalist has to get on one of my beats, there isn't hardly going to be any room. This is one of the BIGGEST mistakes that I have been making for awhile now, and I'll tell you, it's not easy for me to get my beats to sound the way that I usually do, because when I pan my sounds, it kind of hallows them out and makes them sound thinner tgan before. This is what I don't like about panning. If you put the time and effort in like I do, you can get a pretty good mix with everything being in the middle, but if a singer or vocalist is going to get on o e of them, then it's going to be a little bit full and muddy, but I really think that it can work with alot of my beats. But yeah, to EVERYONE! Start getting used to and having an ear for panning...Don't forget it because it is one of the most important things in mixing if you are trying to have an artist/musician on them!
Thanks for the video. Please make a video on how to sound better in mono. Also my mix sounds good on normal monitors and headphones but while listening in Car speakers it sounds more Bassy and Boomy, How to correct that?
Rob - I have a related question wrt harmonies... Do you use any sort of rule for volume balancing harmonies, e.g., Hi Mid Low? Should one be louder than another, or all level?
The sound guy at our church pans all vocals hard left and all instruments hard right. Our system is a LCR mains system. My question is if this is the right way to run our system? Also how would I run a guitar in stereo in a system like this?
I think a mistake alot of people make is to start panning to early. Good to get your static mix in mono first and then pan. :)
Loopaxe Records agree 100%!
yup.
Agreed!!!! 100!!!
100% true.
Just a heads up you guys. I'm afraid that's not true. Your mix in mono is going to sound way different as soon as you start panning, especially channels 100% right or left, since they'll lose on average 6db. Best mixers in the game back this up. Try it yourselves. Listen to a sound or mix in mono, then pan a channel or the sound hard right or left. When it's panned all the way, it will lose db. Conclusion: a mix without panning, and the same mix with panning, different mono output. So be aware of that. Take care.
I actually use "25/25 panning": Stuff at the center, and other some at 25% in one side, 50%, 75% and 100%. I feel a good balance that way but it actually depends on the instrument and how "in your face" or "background" it is.
Me as well, but I'm now kind of thinking really there's nothing to stop us from using 1/4's (25% panning increments), 1/3's, 1/2's in separate parts of the song to add stereo contrasts between the appropriate corresponding phrases to help accentuate any phrase by designing less stereo contrast in the passage preceding it...
Your video confirmed what I've been doing lately. Reassuring. Thanks.
Its really really really a very helpful of me because last four to five days i m gonna stuch with my mind to pan my reel audio with stereo compatible mono mix and yes thats my solution....
I see yr all videos and all tutorials and also i've joined our skool community too....
So much love from INDIA....🇮🇳🖤😇
THANK YOU TO WHOLE TEAM ....
LOVE LOVE LOVE
Very effective! Thanks. We can also "move" a guitar for example, 50 % left during the verse, then hard left during the chorus, when the 2nd enters. It "brings life" to the mix I think.
personally I greatly dislike changing the pan in obvious parts. It's very unnatural and unpleasant sounding to me.
I already started doing this, because 100% panning left and right gave me so much emptiness in my mix...
Yep, that's what I find too!
I Find That When I Pan Hard Right, I Lose A Lot of Volume In The Sound, So Much So It’s Barely Audible.
I Use FL Studio As My DAW.
@@One_of_Many750 try using a third party plugin to pan. That might fix the problem
Pukka 👍🏼 I used techniques from another of your vids on subtractive/additional EQ, moved onto panning after watching this and applied a mix of hard and 50/50 panning and .... 💥 I finished my 1st ever, EVER mix, (well.. that I'm absolutely happy with anyway!) Like a real growing moment for me mate.... thanks again man 🙏🏼💯
Awesome!
there's so many tracks in this mix
Ryan Redtree sometimes you have a di signal or a bus...sometimes the same of some other track with a little flanger for example!
Good video. I am currently struggling making that wide sound on my new electronic music track. But I've been reading and watching too many videos. Some people say use LCR panning, some say use Haas effect.. Some use expensive plugins. I guess in the end there is no right or wrong way doing things after all when it comes to music :) sometimes I notice I get completely lost when I compare my track to some super wide professionally engineered release and lose my hair because I cannot get the same sound. Music is fascinating because there is always something new to learn :)
This is totally helpful. I believe your decisions to pan should be based on what generally works for the style of music you are going for. I don't know why I didn't think of this technique when it is really basic. Thanks for bringing it to my attention. Earned a sub.
I just finished an album where I mostly did LCR panning. And the problem I had is that certain tracks would not translate well - particularly the ones where the Left and Right were especially different from each other. For instance my phone speakers are actually in stereo but my case muffles the left speaker a bit. And in the car you sit on one side of the car or the other. And when summing to mono, the hard side information can seem quieter than the centered information.
So I ended up doing more 50/50 panning on certain tracks where the sides were especially different.
So Ear candy bits like shakers and tambourines stayed hard panned.
Guitars that were double tracked with a similar/equal-energy part on left and right were hard panned.
But on parts where a rhythm instrument like a guitar or piano on the left was doing something significantly different than the one on the right, I found it better to bring them in to 50%. It kept those instruments focussed and audible in every situation without overpowering the lead, ie: Properly Balanced. And while I technically got less width out of this, that was a compromise that was well worth it for the translatability.
To retain some width, I actually made sure the delay effects on those instruments were still 100% panned. Because if the subtle delay becomes more/less noticeable in different situations, it doesn't break the song or ruin the balance.
People are used to hearing great classic songs in mono all the time. So it ocurred to me that Wide does not equal good. There's no reason to force a mix to be wider if it sacrifices the quality/balance/translatability of the mix. Width should only be used to enhance.
After watching this video, I feel abit more confident in panning all the way to one side and undedtsnd the difference it can make!! Thanks mate
Sad thing Most Folks are Using The Cell phone to listen to Music and Sounds Bad with No Bass Thanks for the Video 🎸🎹🎻🎸
Been watching your videos all night, feels like I found a goldmine! Subbed and liked everything!
I really like this suggestion you made about making sure it sounds good in mono first, before we start planning. That makes a lot of sense.
Genius of Geniuses...THANK YOU! ☮️
1:39 not ALWAYS. For example, when a song starts, and it starts with a full 100% left panned guitar, and then the right panned guitar enters playing the same thing, it sounds really good.
What a quality video! Best one on this subject I’ve seen! 🤜🏻
Sometimes I’ll automate the pan on leads to where it goes from slightly right to 1/4 left then 1/4 right etc. really fun stuff to play with.
Damn, as if it wasn't enough that you make the best tutorials on YT but you're also such a bae. Stooop!
Brilliant video from Rob, as usual. Thank you.
Great advice! My sound features a lot of lushness and layers, and my standard approach is to have pads, strings etc wide panned to L&R and no or v little C, with, say, perc or guitar licks at 50%, and then your drums and bass in the middle. Backing vox sound great hard L&R no C with the lead vox C. If you use a stereo enhancer on the hard L&R pads, your music will fill the room.
A good lesson Sir.. easy to understand... Thank You...
awesome video - awesome e-book - thank you
Huge orchestration.
Bro I just had to check this now music is coming out well 🚀🚀🚀💥💥💧
ROB SIR YOU ARE EXCELLANT TEACHER WOW TODAY PANNING EXPLAINED WOW SPECIALLY YOUR LINE DIAGRAM ON PANNING .THANX SIR
I have always pictured the sweep of the panning knob as the upper half of a clock with 12 obviously being the center. Then I fill in all the spaces between 9 and three.
it's like you balance each side as a mix independently.
Thanks for this tutorial, it helps me a lot
LCR strikes me as a rule for people who don’t yet have the experience to make good panning decisions. There are absolutely situations where you want to pan somewhere in between and there absolutely are reasons why hard pans or center are often where things should go, only repetition can give someone the knowhow on when to do what.
it also depends on the genre... if you're making a punk or metal song panning something other than toms or maybe the cymbals in between can be a huge mistake. Rhythm guitars must go hard L and R, as well as harmonies and doubles, while lead guitars, lead vocals, bass, kick and snare must go center
Song is a banger man wow
Awesome tutorial! We'll definitely be applying this to our self recorded stuff :) Thanks!
So interesting to find this video. I have been doing this, and with the same types of instruments. I didn't know that there was a real breakdown for this. Just years of trial and error, but this meathod is quite effective. Thank for making sense of this. Now I don't feel weird for this. LoL
Great demo thanks food for thought
:)
No problem, thanks Charles!
what about mono compatibility and panning law issues ?
So so so helpful
GREAT advice, as always. Thanks Rob. =)
Hopefully this works out for me, cause I've been struggling with this a lot, thank you very much!
Best of luck!
Also really there's nothing to stop us from using 1/4's (25% panning increments), 1/3's, 1/2's (50% as you demonstrated) in separate parts of the song to add stereo contrasts between the appropriate corresponding phrases to help accentuate any part of the song simply by designing in less stereo contrast in the passage preceding it - kind of like you might think of hitting a chorus after a bridge or verse with extra EQ or Compression.. (& I'd probably mix backwards with that panning idea much like the approach of mixing the loudest part of the song 1st; AFTER the static mix is complete, then mix the widest part of the song 1st and then go to the previous sections to design in contrastingly less spectral panning image contrast)...
I’m stuck been watching your videos for months. My biggest issue is making the mix for everything. In my 1 set of speakers everything sounds great.
Then in my others set the bass is bad even with eq!
Then in my car it’s close to both. Speakers good and back.
Great tutorial, very helpful.. and I LOVE the song! Can I listen to it somewhere??
What got me thinking differently here was when you pointed out the fact that when something is exclusively in either L or R - in headphones or earbuds that only one ear is getting that information (as opposed to both in a stereo acoustic, real world listening environment); therefore, it seems that in headphones, the emotional response is being separated independently between hemispheres of the brain per L/R channels; then it begs the question 'does the brain's hemispheres distinguish separate tracks for their qualitative information whether it be mathematical or rhythmic elements vs. tracks that are more of a musical or melodic vibe to independently appease each hemisphere of the mind (math/art, logic/feeling, speaking/singing), and what exactly about that would change for the minds response (if any) when you switch over to the real world, stereo speakers in an acoustic environment scenario when those separate qualities are now being heard binaurally in both ears?).. & finally, If that logical extension for your point were in fact true, then would the same song when mixed panning for feel as you so eloquently demonstrated vs. a qualitatively methodological mix effectively sell itself better or worse to a sample audience of listeners?
that has help me a lot mixes sound a lot better . thank you .
If you were producing a 4/4 dance track (Hardstyle for example), which elements would you have panned Hard-Left and Hard Right?
tnx 4 tips...nice one
Works like a shot. Thanks!
Thanks Rob, your tips on audio production are fantastic and has really helped me improved. By the way I was working on a acoustic track with little percussions recently and when I was finished it sounded really empty. I now know why :-)
Have a great day!
Happy to help! Haha, yep, give this a try, should help.
Track sounds a lot better now. Thanks once again!
Good video. I am still learning but I had begun doing this ever since I started recording my own music and people have always liked my mixes. Hard left or right especially if the music is sparse sounds too empty. I usually do imcrements of 25, 50 and 75. Occasionally hard left and right but not often. I have found that moving cymbals to about a 10 - 25 offset opens up a lot of room.
Cool video. Thanks, bro! :)
No problem! Glad we could help.
Thanks so much!
Good topic and well explained, thanks
Thank you!
"Panning Center" = Essentially just leaving the panning knob in the middle?
yes
Very good advice..thnx ..
sorry for my lack of years of experience but damn that session is intimidating lol..just to think you have to mix ALL THAT!! lol
Thanks A lot Man! This is really helpful!
Thank you so much, you've set some foundation for me
Thanx for the vid ...iv learned something new ....
I like to pan my kick drum slightly left & snare slightly right. It just seems like a normal thing to do. LOL
subbed!! you have great communication skills, i'm a fan. keep them videos comin!!
Awesome! Check back every Monday for new videos :)
Just what i needed
Hullo. : ). How would you pan a sparse mix using LCR. What do you do when the instruments are not enough to go both ways - L/R? How would you pan delay and reverb tails to balance the mix?
Hi sir I keep on learning from u .I request you to make video on how to make sapce for all instruments.or cheat sheet
Heres a secret mixing technique for you guys. If you pan most your instruments to the left, each instrument at a different degree 2%-60%. Whatever other sound that is mono or panned even the tiniest bit to the right will stand out from the rest.
Smart!!! Thanks for the tip!!
Excellent video!
good video!
Good stuff .
This track reminds me of Foals
Great advice !!
thank you
I only do top down volume balancing. My faders are either on 0 or completely down
Well explained
Great video bro please answer this one,here is what beats me.When you pan perhaps 3 differnt instruments to the exact same spot 50% for example or hard left, dont they mask each other, i thought they should be on different percentages.
Thanks for the video.
What is this song?! And is it released? It’s a really really good tune
thanks for the insightful help
Great video! Learend a lot!
So glad we could help!
Where can I find the track you used in the video? Sounds really chill, Stone Roses vibes
thank u so much
I rarely ever pan anything left or right. I use a pan effect sometimes with synths and instrument sounds, but never ever on kicks, snares, hi hats, etc. I think I used pan about 2 or 3 times ever. I'm looking more into this though, but my mixes do not sound bad at all.
Then you just have a good mono mix. The most important to my mixes or what I try to pursue is the wide stereo image. Love to go from mono to stereo...
thank u
Good work Rob :-D
LCR panning. I often use this except for small fill or atmospheric parts.
Great method!
a.great help to me thank you so mutch
.-. My issue is I can't get the instrument (Grandeur : Kontakt) to disable automatic panning. I'm not sure if it's just recorded this way to keep it realistic, which is neat I guess, however I realized if you play the lowest & highest note, the lowest plays about 25% louder in the left ear versus the right ear; playing the highest note will do the same in reverse, roughly 25% louder in the right ear versus the left ear. I'm sure it's intentional, but I want to do my own panning & I'm assuming that this might affect the panning process. Thing is, I feel like it might be stuck like that because of how the samples were possibly recorded?_?.... V_V life is hard
Now sir if you have some time than explain me panning vs stereo balance , why we should do both on a same track or multi mix
Great thanx !!
You know, it's really weird, but when I make my music, I usually never pan, and my beats sound really great, but if a singer or vocalist has to get on one of my beats, there isn't hardly going to be any room.
This is one of the BIGGEST mistakes that I have been making for awhile now, and I'll tell you, it's not easy for me to get my beats to sound the way that I usually do, because when I pan my sounds, it kind of hallows them out and makes them sound thinner tgan before. This is what I don't like about panning.
If you put the time and effort in like I do, you can get a pretty good mix with everything being in the middle, but if a singer or vocalist is going to get on o e of them, then it's going to be a little bit full and muddy, but I really think that it can work with alot of my beats.
But yeah, to EVERYONE! Start getting used to and having an ear for panning...Don't forget it because it is one of the most important things in mixing if you are trying to have an artist/musician on them!
Thanks for the video. Please make a video on how to sound better in mono. Also my mix sounds good on normal monitors and headphones but while listening in Car speakers it sounds more Bassy and Boomy, How to correct that?
Does anybody know the name of the song?? Is it released? Great video btw 🙏🙌
is it normal at the best idea (no matter which genre) to trim every track?
Do some mix without even trim one single track?
thanks
WHAT ABOUT BINAURAL PANNING?
how about back up vocals? how many layers of the same part is good to use? and how to pan them
Please Can you help me get your How to EQ everything document as I can’t find it on your site
Rob - I have a related question wrt harmonies... Do you use any sort of rule for volume balancing harmonies, e.g., Hi Mid Low? Should one be louder than another, or all level?
Could you acheive something similar with say Ozone Imager?
great song
Thanks!
The sound guy at our church pans all vocals hard left and all instruments hard right. Our system is a LCR mains system. My question is if this is the right way to run our system? Also how would I run a guitar in stereo in a system like this?