I'm so happy that despite the VF+ under-performing in the election, the (sensible people in our) nation still has the deserved respect for Oom Groenewaldt and Oom Mulder.
The only politician who's words have currency in South Africa is Dr Corne Mulder. He does seem a lot more optimistic about the GNU than the rest of us. I agree with Mike. The dialogue is a waste of time and money. Great episode.
The political leadership in all the GNU parties need to now follow the people who have clearly voted their requirements. The country is expecting this to happen... we can move forward as a nation.
The DA only perform because they are measured against the low low bar of the ANC. The DA have enough skeletons in the closet, and they are not exempt from being held accountable. If you dont like the DA recieving justified criticism, you are no better than an anc supporter.
Anc is fractured organisation; too many chiefs and too few workers; a criminal organisation should step down; no more gravy train as railroads are looted
Back to Basics, Fix water, Roads, Rail and electricity , Scrap BEE, Appoint the best guy for the job, and the economy will grow and people will create jobs. It's not the government job to create jobs. They just need to make sure the infrastructure is there for people to trade.
The government is the one that has tp create jobs for people. Germany built factries and started BMW to give jobs to people. America financed its banks and airlines. It's not fair that there was a group of people that was helped by the government back then and now we want the government to sit back. Nationalising the mines will make our country richer because we would have control over the production and the price of the minerals. It's stupid to think that the private sector is the solution for jobs. There is a lot of greed in the private sector that is why all banks are sitting on 1 trillion rands and not pumping it back into the economy
Mike let me tell you a little story. I am a black man in my mid 40's, yes the colour of my skin matters. I am referred to as middle class in the South African context though as a black man am only 6 months of losing my income away from crawling back to my mother's back yard in Soweto along with my multiple cousins. Done relatively well financial wise and as a result live in a nice leafy suburb in the North of Johannesburg. I have a neighbour, a white neighbour who is really a nice gentleman. He actually lives three houses down the road but we do manage to have some genuine chats whenever we can find the time. Though we have been neighbours for more or less 6 years we only managed to chat about 6 times, definitely less than 10 times throughout the years. What i like about him is that when we chat, we really do have a chat and speak our minds without this awkward "we are being nice to each other" posture that typically defines interactions of this nature. So the other day after a long time we had a chat about the ongoing anti migration riots in the UK. So incidentally while we were having this chat one of our other neighbours, white as well whom i have never really had a chat with beyond just an occasional wave when we drive by joined us in the conversation. So interestingly they were both very very empathetic towards the plight of the English protesters who in the main express a defiance against immigration and the "desolution of English values" they say. I then turned around and asked them both about how they feel about legal or illegal immigration here in South Africa and surprisingly they were both indifferent about it. One of them told me his gardener is Zimbabwean and the domestic help is Malawian. When i asked if both these people are legal or not one of them told me he has been working with them for more than 10 years and has never had a problem, the deflection suggested they were not obviously (I thought in my head). The reason for my long attempt at laying the ground for my argument is that generally South Africans of all races are genuinely good people. We all want the same thing which is safety and prosperity for our families and in turn the neighbourhood and ultimately the entire nation. We may never reach the promised land however if carry on in the same trajectory of subliminal racism and selective outrage. The English protesters were saying precisely the complaints of BLACK SOUTH AFRICANS about illegal immigration but they are never heard by white South Africans because it doesn't affect them negatively at least at the moment. This is but one issue, there are many other issues that I can point towards including LAND. The land redistribution question has become like a swear word towards white South Africans which is confusing because not all of them own acres and acres of land in South Africa. Only a minority of white people control the means of production but zero to none of them think there really needs to be a fair discourse in South Africa about the thorny land question. I can also talk about the basic conditions of employment act which there is a push back against. Why are white South Africans against this? Why would you NOT want your fellow countrymen treated fairly at work? Even more importantly why would you NOT want them compensated fairly for their industry? We all want to live in a peaceful country right? Why would a well earning individual see the need to rob and comit crime? I am just wondering why black and white South Africans who generally want the same thing NOT unite against the same prominent issues I am raising. Then i remembered, it's racism. Racists are no longer riding up and down in kakhi uniform in Ventersdorp. They are wearing tailored suits in corporate South Africa and make all the decisions that keep this country in limp mode so they can benefit from the inevitable cracks that occur.
Thank you for taking the time to send such a long and detailed message. Your effort deserves a decent response. I am not sure that you can equate the situation in England to SA. The immigration situation in SA is about a fight for resources especially jobs and scarce opportunities. The problem in the UK is that many in the immigrant population have no desire to assimilate to the British way of life. In the past decade or two, this has resulted in violence and murder. The killing of toddlers in a dance class in working class neighborhoods will always bring out a bad response. Your point about parts of the population being oblivious to the complaints of the communities most effected by immigration is inexcusable, however, it is a universal and predictable response. This is happening ion the US - Mexico border and in SA. Rich people, who benefit from the cheap labour often can't see the problem. This transcends race and culture, I can assure you! The land issue is a very emotive reason for any person who owns land. I can assure you, if any government started to take land from its citizens, all land-owners would be up in arms, including you. If you watch the show regularly, I have said many times that the failure to deal with land is not the fault of the land owners, unless you have an expectation of people just driving off their farms in some kind of act of absolution. Remember that after 30 years of guaranteeing land ownership and property ownership to all citizens of the country, it will always make people edgy when these rights are being threatened. The problem is one of poor political leadership that the government hasn't sorted this out I would urge you not to confuse land with property. Land is an emotional catch all phrase, but what those EWC proponents want is to take away property rights. This is what the apartheid government did to black people and made it impossible to build generational wealth. Don't fall for this, you are way too smart. I fully agree with you on the basic condition of employment. I don't think that whites are against this even though it does have the effect of hampering economic growth. I disagree with your last point and I think that by and large white and black citizens are united and the lack of pushback to the GNU proves this. It has been our politicians who push at the fault lines in our country, not the population. i can promise you that a few years of economic growth and a less race obsessed government would achieve exactly what you and I both want.
@@mikesham3204 Thank you Mike, I am an ardent viewer of your podcast. One of my top 5 favourite actually, well depending who your guest is. I cannot stand both Hellen Zille and John steenhuizen with all due respect. In fact given a choice between voting for either the FF plus or the DA I would definitely choose the former. At least with them you know precisely where you stand which I personally prefer. I very much agree with most of what you have said. Let's start with the immigration issue, obviously the UK and SA are two different countries with different demographics and psychographics. The problems will obviously reflect this. Here are the similarities though: 1. The issue that you have raised about assimilation, black South Africans are complaining about exactly the same thing. It may not be easy for you as a white South African to pick up but as a black South African I can tell very easily what the difference is in terms of just basic conduct between a Zimbabwean or a Nigerian or a Malawian. Trust me these people in general are very very different from a typical black South African. Not sure if you are aware of the media storm brewing at the moment of a young lady with a Nigerian father and a Mozambican mother wanting to contest the Miss South Africa pageant? That in a way tells you about the discontentment that most black South Africans have about being misrepresented. You therefore cannot just simply dismiss it as a lack of resources issue, it's about self preservation. Very much laden with undertones of what is going on in the UK political zeitgeist in the past 10 years or so. 2. Coming to the corporate sector, I have noted more and more that huge corporates like Pick n Pay for an example are using Zimbabweans as their tellers. They will deflect and say that the staff is being supplied by labour brokers but all it would take is for Pick n Pay, if they cared to write 1 email to their brokers instructing them to strictly hire local and all would be sorted out in no time. The real reason why this is not happening is because of profits. The labour brokers pay below minimum wage so they can maximise on profits for themselves. Zimbabweans are vulnerable and are obviously not affiliated to unions which really is what the exploiters want at the expense of average South Africans. I can say the same about the construction industry, the hospitality industry including restaurants. I can tell you for instance that Nando's staff including middle to top management is 95% Zimbabwean. Some of them aren't even documented, if they are documented the paperwork is fake. So please don't tell me the big corporates are not part of the problem. With all due respect. 3. Let me cast your mind back to the presidency of Thabo Mbeki. Statistically the best economic period of the democratic era. At it's peak our economy was growing at 4,5 GDP, I don't ever recall it performing any better than that. Thabo Mbeki and his then minister of finance Trevor Manuel did exceedingly well. Ticked all the boxes. Dotted all the I's and crossed all the T's. Still the economy didn't grow to anything seismic. Experts were arguing that the economy needed to grow double figures for it to be transformative to an average man on the streets. This was the period towards the 2010 world cup. I remember South Africa being a huge construction site, in fact I personally was involved with the building of that gautrain tunnel in both Rosebank and Sandton. Still it wasn't enough to move the needle in any meaningful way. So Mike, what more do we need to do? Is it enough just to wait for investors who may or may not come? We need something different, not sure what it is but we need to be more assertive as a country to change course. This is why the EFF manifesto struck the right tone with me. Obviously with a few practical measured nips and tucks there and there but it was certainly very imaginative. Please go and read it Mike, try to keep an open mind. Just read the content of it and forget about Julius Malema. It might give you a different sense. 4. Lastly the land question. I listened very attentively to your conversation on this subject with Mustafa. I don't have any strong views about how it needs to be addressed but your guys' conversation left me feeling like if the right people sat around the table solutions could be found. As you suggested we need to start with the lowest hanging fruits and work our way up from there. Thank you once again for being so engaging, I imagine this must take a lot of your time. Thank you sir.
@@ronm4385 Hi Ron, I will pick up on some of your issues: 1. I agree with you that the immigration issue is a multi-faceted issue that is a global one. In many ways it is similar to the gun control issue in that bad people will have no problem getting guns, but law-abiding people will struggle through a set of laws. I do think that the government should be handling this issue with more respect for existing SA citizens. 2. I disagree with you about the corporate sector employing foreigners. They have massive regulatory hoops to jump through, so they are always unlikely to be found guilty of this. However, this won't stop labour brokers from employing foreigners and outsourcing them to the corporates. 3. Firstly, at the time I was unimpressed by the performance of the Mbeki era, because we could have always have done better. At the time, we had no idea that the ANC would usher in the Zuma era which would make the Mbeki era look brilliant by comparison! We cannot consume our way to wealth, we need to produce stuff which we can sell to the other countries. We have seen this for 300 years and things haven't changed. This is what Germany, the USA, Japan, South Korea and more recently, China has done. I could bore you with the many opportunities that we could do, but what is the point? 4. As I have said repeatedly, land is not the problem, it is property. This problem is very easy to solve but it may serve politicians to leave this issue to fester in order for those parties to benefit. In conclusion, you confuse me! You mention that the EFF appeals to you, yet they encourage untrammeled immigration. You point out that we need economic growth, yet the EFF only talk about taking stuff away from whites, not growing the economy. Do you think that the EFF would prefer to "redistribute the land" or to continue to use it as a political matter to campaign with?
@@mikesham3204 Thanks Mike. I was amazed myself when I realised that the likes of Pick n Pay, Shopritte and the security sector was hiring Zimbabweans myself. It's very easy for me as a black South African to pick it up through the dialect. Trust me Mike, our corporate sector is not as ethical as you would like to believe. They have learnt to cut corners and circumvent the system. 80% of our Uber drivers are foreign and the same goes with the food delivery services guys. The list is endless. About the EFF manifesto, I did say upfront that you don't have to take everything they say. There are however some green shots in their manifesto that articulate precisely what you have said about industrialisation. The fact that the EFF is on a downward spiral should tell you that black people in the main are not interested in the EFF's race baiting. They have said all they can say about race and seemingly only 9% of our voting population is giving them the time of day. Black South Africans are simply NOT racist and it cannot be forced down their throat. I am sure you have seen how receptive towards the GNU most are. I just wish the GNU can get on with the business of governing this country. You are absolutely right in your assertion that should the GNU get the economy right and bring the level of crime and corruption down, the rest is a sideshow really.
I'm happy VF is calling out DA for being bullies then again DA doesn't rate smaller parties . I'm happy that Mike does see that these government dialogues usually benefit big business instead of SMME that why every mall in this country has the same stores .
Good episode, thanks Mike. Dr Mulder has a very nice, clear way of putting things across & I can see his base growing. I must say that I was quite surprised about the things he said about the DA not being willing to work with the smaller opposition parties (obviously excluding the likes of MK, EFF, PAC, SACP), but with that kind of attitude from the DA, I may reassess my vote in the next election!
Ek is n baie groot ondersteuner van Dr Mulder, maar strategies maak dit nie sin om VF plus in sekere areas te stem nie. Verder voel ek hy is onnodig krities teenoor die DA en benadeel daardeer almal wat n beter toekoms vir die land nastreef.
I think Mr Mulder is being a bit unfair regarding the DA and it's attitude to the MPC. In the interests of fairness and I believe Dr Mulder is a fair man, if he visits DAs historical social media he will see how frequently the DA promoted the MPC.
Although the relationship between the FF+ and the DA is generally good, one should never forget that they are competing directly for the same pool of voters. This means that either party could never quite talk too positively about the other.
How is FF+ constituency different from MK constituency? MK is predominantly Ngunis and FF+ is afrikaners! Do we really need these type of formations in our country? How will we ever achieve unity required for the rainbow nation?
While ignoring his party's own arrogance as they are prepared to undermine the services of a municipality by aligning with the ANC in this sphere of governance.
Spring and summer is around the corner. One thing i know about our people, is that their focus will be on the festivities and crime not politics. So the GNU is definitely going to reach next year . Also i thought FFP and DA got along nicely, I thought FFP was an offshoot / a Branch from the DA... like ANC and EFF. I guess i was wrong.
I think that you may be wrong on both accounts; the FF+ and DA are very different parties with very different histories and backgrounds. I am not so sure that the EFF could or would ever "go back to the ANC', even if this is where there roots are.
@@mikesham3204 i agree. There's been little media coverage on FF+ , so most of us don't know anything about it. I didn't know it even existed after the elections. Thank you for your response
Dr Mulder just like Dr Groenewald are good people. However I still believe in the DA and that they are able to bring in the black vote - so we can run this country properly.
Hahahahha "bashing the DA" seems to be the fulcrum of this podcast - why on earth would the DA at 20% need to "assist" those at 1 to 2% who are all trying to take the DA 20% - MK is the only thing that or the ANC below 50 = no Herman the Ego, or the PA - enrichment via politics etc
I am not sure that you are analysing the State of the Nation fairly. We hold all parties to account and the bigger parties need greater scrutiny. I hope that you watched my recent interview with Helen Zille?
@@mikesham3204 In your latest interview with Frans Cronje he told you that the tie up between the ANC and the DA was the only outcome that did not collapse RSA - that neither side could compete for each others voters (unlike the Action SA, PA and the many tiny parties you prefer) - that RSA is in a far better place than it would otherwise have been and would remain if the more corrupt radical populist element do not gain the upper hand. Perhaps pragmatic acceptance of this reality by the media would go a long way to assisting to prevent this - I get that you and many other do not like the DA, you feel disrespected, ignored etc and perhaps the DA could humour people better - whatever they are or are not the current situation is far better than it could have been - the multi party initiative was always 80% DA votes and 20% all other combined yet they wanted an equal say while gunning for the DA voter - guess all is fair in love and politics
Don't lie to us, go look at the people that vote for that party. They are whites, majority white Afrikaaners and male. We as poor blacks, mostly students won't lie and say won't don't vote for the eff. If I say that to you I would be lying
@letlhogonoloaulstonmorwakg7379 There is no comparison between the FF+ and the EFF. The FF+ is a values driven party based on principles that have proven over time that they improve the wealth and prosperity of a nation. The EFF is a band of criminals, promoting failed ideologies to gullible people who give them power so they can enrich themselves at the countries expense. The EFF have absolute zero value offering to their voters.
@@letlhogonoloaulstonmorwakg7379 I have yet to see the FF chanting death to other races. They are not even on the same planet as the EFF. Just because they are on the opposite side of the spectrum, does not mean they are the same. It just means they are opposites.
Another good episode from State of the Nation. Dr Corné Mulder is a valuable source of information.
Thank you for your comment, we have a lot more to come!
I wish all our politicians had the same attitude as Corne Mulder. He really cares and works for our people. thank you for your service
I'm so happy that despite the VF+ under-performing in the election, the (sensible people in our) nation still has the deserved respect for Oom Groenewaldt and Oom Mulder.
Thank you. Dr Mulder, mature and informative, no BS.
I fully agree with you
Talk is cheap ... Domkop
You should know it by now..
Your beloved ANC is doing it for 30years....
@@truth-Hurts375 That's a bit rude!
The only politician who's words have currency in South Africa is Dr Corne Mulder. He does seem a lot more optimistic about the GNU than the rest of us. I agree with Mike. The dialogue is a waste of time and money. Great episode.
The political leadership in all the GNU parties need to now follow the people who have clearly voted their requirements. The country is expecting this to happen... we can move forward as a nation.
Good good good Dr Corne Mulder, cynics have no chance to win against South Africans united in diversity,
Thank you Corne for educating Mike, He gets too excited over what he wishes was true other than true reflection of what's happening.
You're correct, I get way too excited and I need educating!
Stop! Stop! Bashing the D.A.They are Amazing!! A Party that have Know How!! 🇿🇦 🥇🧢 Please work together the our Country..Thank you!
Agreed, I trust the DA far more than the FF.
I agree... they bashing the DA because it outperforms them. So it's a form of political jealous
The DA only perform because they are measured against the low low bar of the ANC. The DA have enough skeletons in the closet, and they are not exempt from being held accountable. If you dont like the DA recieving justified criticism, you are no better than an anc supporter.
Amazing for who?
Kak praat nie !!!
The DA are up the ANC'S asses since 1994 !!!!
Anc is fractured organisation; too many chiefs and too few workers; a criminal organisation should step down; no more gravy train as railroads are looted
Back to Basics, Fix water, Roads, Rail and electricity , Scrap BEE, Appoint the best guy for the job, and the economy will grow and people will create jobs. It's not the government job to create jobs. They just need to make sure the infrastructure is there for people to trade.
The government is the one that has tp create jobs for people. Germany built factries and started BMW to give jobs to people. America financed its banks and airlines. It's not fair that there was a group of people that was helped by the government back then and now we want the government to sit back. Nationalising the mines will make our country richer because we would have control over the production and the price of the minerals. It's stupid to think that the private sector is the solution for jobs. There is a lot of greed in the private sector that is why all banks are sitting on 1 trillion rands and not pumping it back into the economy
100%
For the Good of South Africa 🇿🇦
Dr Mulder is a genius and expertise in Politics. !!
Mike let me tell you a little story. I am a black man in my mid 40's, yes the colour of my skin matters. I am referred to as middle class in the South African context though as a black man am only 6 months of losing my income away from crawling back to my mother's back yard in Soweto along with my multiple cousins.
Done relatively well financial wise and as a result live in a nice leafy suburb in the North of Johannesburg. I have a neighbour, a white neighbour who is really a nice gentleman. He actually lives three houses down the road but we do manage to have some genuine chats whenever we can find the time. Though we have been neighbours for more or less 6 years we only managed to chat about 6 times, definitely less than 10 times throughout the years. What i like about him is that when we chat, we really do have a chat and speak our minds without this awkward "we are being nice to each other" posture that typically defines interactions of this nature.
So the other day after a long time we had a chat about the ongoing anti migration riots in the UK. So incidentally while we were having this chat one of our other neighbours, white as well whom i have never really had a chat with beyond just an occasional wave when we drive by joined us in the conversation. So interestingly they were both very very empathetic towards the plight of the English protesters who in the main express a defiance against immigration and the "desolution of English values" they say. I then turned around and asked them both about how they feel about legal or illegal immigration here in South Africa and surprisingly they were both indifferent about it. One of them told me his gardener is Zimbabwean and the domestic help is Malawian. When i asked if both these people are legal or not one of them told me he has been working with them for more than 10 years and has never had a problem, the deflection suggested they were not obviously (I thought in my head).
The reason for my long attempt at laying the ground for my argument is that generally South Africans of all races are genuinely good people. We all want the same thing which is safety and prosperity for our families and in turn the neighbourhood and ultimately the entire nation. We may never reach the promised land however if carry on in the same trajectory of subliminal racism and selective outrage.
The English protesters were saying precisely the complaints of BLACK SOUTH AFRICANS about illegal immigration but they are never heard by white South Africans because it doesn't affect them negatively at least at the moment. This is but one issue, there are many other issues that I can point towards including LAND. The land redistribution question has become like a swear word towards white South Africans which is confusing because not all of them own acres and acres of land in South Africa. Only a minority of white people control the means of production but zero to none of them think there really needs to be a fair discourse in South Africa about the thorny land question.
I can also talk about the basic conditions of employment act which there is a push back against. Why are white South Africans against this? Why would you NOT want your fellow countrymen treated fairly at work? Even more importantly why would you NOT want them compensated fairly for their industry?
We all want to live in a peaceful country right? Why would a well earning individual see the need to rob and comit crime?
I am just wondering why black and white South Africans who generally want the same thing NOT unite against the same prominent issues I am raising. Then i remembered, it's racism. Racists are no longer riding up and down in kakhi uniform in Ventersdorp. They are wearing tailored suits in corporate South Africa and make all the decisions that keep this country in limp mode so they can benefit from the inevitable cracks that occur.
Thank you for taking the time to send such a long and detailed message. Your effort deserves a decent response.
I am not sure that you can equate the situation in England to SA. The immigration situation in SA is about a fight for resources especially jobs and scarce opportunities. The problem in the UK is that many in the immigrant population have no desire to assimilate to the British way of life. In the past decade or two, this has resulted in violence and murder. The killing of toddlers in a dance class in working class neighborhoods will always bring out a bad response.
Your point about parts of the population being oblivious to the complaints of the communities most effected by immigration is inexcusable, however, it is a universal and predictable response. This is happening ion the US - Mexico border and in SA. Rich people, who benefit from the cheap labour often can't see the problem. This transcends race and culture, I can assure you!
The land issue is a very emotive reason for any person who owns land. I can assure you, if any government started to take land from its citizens, all land-owners would be up in arms, including you. If you watch the show regularly, I have said many times that the failure to deal with land is not the fault of the land owners, unless you have an expectation of people just driving off their farms in some kind of act of absolution. Remember that after 30 years of guaranteeing land ownership and property ownership to all citizens of the country, it will always make people edgy when these rights are being threatened. The problem is one of poor political leadership that the government hasn't sorted this out
I would urge you not to confuse land with property. Land is an emotional catch all phrase, but what those EWC proponents want is to take away property rights. This is what the apartheid government did to black people and made it impossible to build generational wealth. Don't fall for this, you are way too smart.
I fully agree with you on the basic condition of employment. I don't think that whites are against this even though it does have the effect of hampering economic growth.
I disagree with your last point and I think that by and large white and black citizens are united and the lack of pushback to the GNU proves this. It has been our politicians who push at the fault lines in our country, not the population. i can promise you that a few years of economic growth and a less race obsessed government would achieve exactly what you and I both want.
@@mikesham3204 Thank you Mike, I am an ardent viewer of your podcast. One of my top 5 favourite actually, well depending who your guest is. I cannot stand both Hellen Zille and John steenhuizen with all due respect. In fact given a choice between voting for either the FF plus or the DA I would definitely choose the former. At least with them you know precisely where you stand which I personally prefer.
I very much agree with most of what you have said. Let's start with the immigration issue, obviously the UK and SA are two different countries with different demographics and psychographics. The problems will obviously reflect this. Here are the similarities though:
1. The issue that you have raised about assimilation, black South Africans are complaining about exactly the same thing. It may not be easy for you as a white South African to pick up but as a black South African I can tell very easily what the difference is in terms of just basic conduct between a Zimbabwean or a Nigerian or a Malawian. Trust me these people in general are very very different from a typical black South African. Not sure if you are aware of the media storm brewing at the moment of a young lady with a Nigerian father and a Mozambican mother wanting to contest the Miss South Africa pageant? That in a way tells you about the discontentment that most black South Africans have about being misrepresented. You therefore cannot just simply dismiss it as a lack of resources issue, it's about self preservation. Very much laden with undertones of what is going on in the UK political zeitgeist in the past 10 years or so.
2. Coming to the corporate sector, I have noted more and more that huge corporates like Pick n Pay for an example are using Zimbabweans as their tellers. They will deflect and say that the staff is being supplied by labour brokers but all it would take is for Pick n Pay, if they cared to write 1 email to their brokers instructing them to strictly hire local and all would be sorted out in no time. The real reason why this is not happening is because of profits. The labour brokers pay below minimum wage so they can maximise on profits for themselves. Zimbabweans are vulnerable and are obviously not affiliated to unions which really is what the exploiters want at the expense of average South Africans. I can say the same about the construction industry, the hospitality industry including restaurants. I can tell you for instance that Nando's staff including middle to top management is 95% Zimbabwean. Some of them aren't even documented, if they are documented the paperwork is fake. So please don't tell me the big corporates are not part of the problem. With all due respect.
3. Let me cast your mind back to the presidency of Thabo Mbeki. Statistically the best economic period of the democratic era. At it's peak our economy was growing at 4,5 GDP, I don't ever recall it performing any better than that. Thabo Mbeki and his then minister of finance Trevor Manuel did exceedingly well. Ticked all the boxes. Dotted all the I's and crossed all the T's. Still the economy didn't grow to anything seismic. Experts were arguing that the economy needed to grow double figures for it to be transformative to an average man on the streets. This was the period towards the 2010 world cup. I remember South Africa being a huge construction site, in fact I personally was involved with the building of that gautrain tunnel in both Rosebank and Sandton. Still it wasn't enough to move the needle in any meaningful way. So Mike, what more do we need to do? Is it enough just to wait for investors who may or may not come? We need something different, not sure what it is but we need to be more assertive as a country to change course. This is why the EFF manifesto struck the right tone with me. Obviously with a few practical measured nips and tucks there and there but it was certainly very imaginative. Please go and read it Mike, try to keep an open mind. Just read the content of it and forget about Julius Malema. It might give you a different sense.
4. Lastly the land question. I listened very attentively to your conversation on this subject with Mustafa. I don't have any strong views about how it needs to be addressed but your guys' conversation left me feeling like if the right people sat around the table solutions could be found. As you suggested we need to start with the lowest hanging fruits and work our way up from there.
Thank you once again for being so engaging, I imagine this must take a lot of your time. Thank you sir.
@@ronm4385 Hi Ron, I will pick up on some of your issues:
1. I agree with you that the immigration issue is a multi-faceted issue that is a global one. In many ways it is similar to the gun control issue in that bad people will have no problem getting guns, but law-abiding people will struggle through a set of laws. I do think that the government should be handling this issue with more respect for existing SA citizens.
2. I disagree with you about the corporate sector employing foreigners. They have massive regulatory hoops to jump through, so they are always unlikely to be found guilty of this. However, this won't stop labour brokers from employing foreigners and outsourcing them to the corporates.
3. Firstly, at the time I was unimpressed by the performance of the Mbeki era, because we could have always have done better. At the time, we had no idea that the ANC would usher in the Zuma era which would make the Mbeki era look brilliant by comparison! We cannot consume our way to wealth, we need to produce stuff which we can sell to the other countries. We have seen this for 300 years and things haven't changed. This is what Germany, the USA, Japan, South Korea and more recently, China has done. I could bore you with the many opportunities that we could do, but what is the point?
4. As I have said repeatedly, land is not the problem, it is property. This problem is very easy to solve but it may serve politicians to leave this issue to fester in order for those parties to benefit.
In conclusion, you confuse me! You mention that the EFF appeals to you, yet they encourage untrammeled immigration. You point out that we need economic growth, yet the EFF only talk about taking stuff away from whites, not growing the economy. Do you think that the EFF would prefer to "redistribute the land" or to continue to use it as a political matter to campaign with?
@@mikesham3204 Thanks Mike. I was amazed myself when I realised that the likes of Pick n Pay, Shopritte and the security sector was hiring Zimbabweans myself. It's very easy for me as a black South African to pick it up through the dialect. Trust me Mike, our corporate sector is not as ethical as you would like to believe. They have learnt to cut corners and circumvent the system. 80% of our Uber drivers are foreign and the same goes with the food delivery services guys. The list is endless.
About the EFF manifesto, I did say upfront that you don't have to take everything they say. There are however some green shots in their manifesto that articulate precisely what you have said about industrialisation. The fact that the EFF is on a downward spiral should tell you that black people in the main are not interested in the EFF's race baiting. They have said all they can say about race and seemingly only 9% of our voting population is giving them the time of day. Black South Africans are simply NOT racist and it cannot be forced down their throat. I am sure you have seen how receptive towards the GNU most are. I just wish the GNU can get on with the business of governing this country. You are absolutely right in your assertion that should the GNU get the economy right and bring the level of crime and corruption down, the rest is a sideshow really.
I lived in my hose for 40 yrs and never been in my neighbours house .We used to speak over the wall .
Very good interview. Although some points I would disagree with but I enjoy listening to Corne Mulder.
Dr Mulder is a great guest with wonderful insights. He will always be welcome to contribute to the State of the Nation.
@@mikesham3204 wonderful! Keep up the good work Mike.
Awesome!! Thanks Mike, another brilliant interview!! Love listening to a Oom with lots of logic!! 🙏🏻
Thank you for your comments!. Corne Mulder has great insights to share with all of us and should be listened to.
Great perspective as always from Corne Mulder
Thank you Tony, Corne is a great guest.
He is going nowhere he should join the DA he is a good guy and experienced politician..
I'm happy VF is calling out DA for being bullies then again DA doesn't rate smaller parties .
I'm happy that Mike does see that these government dialogues usually benefit big business instead of SMME that why every mall in this country has the same stores .
I am seriously black and know that the FF+ is far far more credible than the ANC.
Corruption needs to stop ...
Really!
You are now part of the Grevy Train...
Domkop !!!
Great dialogue gentleman...
Ek het my respek verloor vir Corné Mulder.
Very informative.
Good episode, thanks Mike. Dr Mulder has a very nice, clear way of putting things across & I can see his base growing. I must say that I was quite surprised about the things he said about the DA not being willing to work with the smaller opposition parties (obviously excluding the likes of MK, EFF, PAC, SACP), but with that kind of attitude from the DA, I may reassess my vote in the next election!
Dr Mulder certainly uses his experience and knowledge to stay relevant. He is a great guest and the only person who drives a worse car than me.
@@mikesham3204 Ha ha 😂😂 Good to know!
No way .
MPC must continue working to form a different GNU for 2029.
Ek is n baie groot ondersteuner van Dr Mulder, maar strategies maak dit nie sin om VF plus in sekere areas te stem nie. Verder voel ek hy is onnodig krities teenoor die DA en benadeel daardeer almal wat n beter toekoms vir die land nastreef.
Pace are great. I have used them for several years in Cape Town.
Hi Rosemary, thank you for your feedback, I will pass it on to Pace.
Thank you Mike it's just getting better on your channel 👋👋
Thank you for saying so, we will continue to improve.
I think Mr Mulder is being a bit unfair regarding the DA and it's attitude to the MPC. In the interests of fairness and I believe Dr Mulder is a fair man, if he visits DAs historical social media he will see how frequently the DA promoted the MPC.
This oke speaks of the DA's stagnation, but simultaneously he says his party campaigned nationally in the WC; how's that for going nowhere fast? 😮
Although the relationship between the FF+ and the DA is generally good, one should never forget that they are competing directly for the same pool of voters. This means that either party could never quite talk too positively about the other.
Makes sense@@mikesham3204
Aag hene ou Corné. Jy vrek oor hoërskool debat. Begin 'n bietjie werk.
ANC could not go with MKP because MKP refused to work with ANC Ramaphosa and EFF refused to work with DA. Working with multiparties was/is open to all
How is FF+ constituency different from MK constituency? MK is predominantly Ngunis and FF+ is afrikaners! Do we really need these type of formations in our country? How will we ever achieve unity required for the rainbow nation?
I like how he is honest about the DA's self interest & arrogance.
While ignoring his party's own arrogance as they are prepared to undermine the services of a municipality by aligning with the ANC in this sphere of governance.
Lool@Govt of local unity at Oudsthorn😂😂😂
Spring and summer is around the corner. One thing i know about our people, is that their focus will be on the festivities and crime not politics. So the GNU is definitely going to reach next year .
Also i thought FFP and DA got along nicely, I thought FFP was an offshoot / a Branch from the DA... like ANC and EFF. I guess i was wrong.
I think that you may be wrong on both accounts; the FF+ and DA are very different parties with very different histories and backgrounds. I am not so sure that the EFF could or would ever "go back to the ANC', even if this is where there roots are.
@@mikesham3204 i agree. There's been little media coverage on FF+ , so most of us don't know anything about it. I didn't know it even existed after the elections.
Thank you for your response
Dr Mulder just like Dr Groenewald are good people. However I still believe in the DA and that they are able to bring in the black vote - so we can run this country properly.
Ag asseblief Corné 😂
Corné het nog steeds 'n grudge teen wat met sy pa Connie Mulder gebeur het. Wat het Corné nog vir hierdie land van ons gedoen?
Hahahahha "bashing the DA" seems to be the fulcrum of this podcast - why on earth would the DA at 20% need to "assist" those at 1 to 2% who are all trying to take the DA 20% - MK is the only thing that or the ANC below 50 = no Herman the Ego, or the PA - enrichment via politics etc
Get a life😂
I am not sure that you are analysing the State of the Nation fairly. We hold all parties to account and the bigger parties need greater scrutiny. I hope that you watched my recent interview with Helen Zille?
@@mikesham3204 In your latest interview with Frans Cronje he told you that the tie up between the ANC and the DA was the only outcome that did not collapse RSA - that neither side could compete for each others voters (unlike the Action SA, PA and the many tiny parties you prefer) - that RSA is in a far better place than it would otherwise have been and would remain if the more corrupt radical populist element do not gain the upper hand. Perhaps pragmatic acceptance of this reality by the media would go a long way to assisting to prevent this - I get that you and many other do not like the DA, you feel disrespected, ignored etc and perhaps the DA could humour people better - whatever they are or are not the current situation is far better than it could have been - the multi party initiative was always 80% DA votes and 20% all other combined yet they wanted an equal say while gunning for the DA voter - guess all is fair in love and politics
Blind allegiance to the DA is no better than blind allegiance to the ANC. Every party in parlaiment must be held accountable. The DA is not exempt.
Enemies of GNU 😂😂😂😂😂
What's the joke?
With arrogant Lesufi in Gauteng?? 😂😂
Mr.Groenewald it's sad your party wasn't well supported I believe your party may disappear..maybe move to Eff..you seem to have all the answers...
Mulders ruined FF
Vele we dont want this thing to work. Inclusive economic growth? Whose economy?
A talk show host, who "doesn't like Dialog"?😂
Conrne Mulder, a political genius.
FF +, the EFF of Afrikaaners 😂
Hardly, FF Plus is the party of true republicans.
Don't lie to us, go look at the people that vote for that party. They are whites, majority white Afrikaaners and male.
We as poor blacks, mostly students won't lie and say won't don't vote for the eff. If I say that to you I would be lying
Principles do not= votes
@letlhogonoloaulstonmorwakg7379 There is no comparison between the FF+ and the EFF. The FF+ is a values driven party based on principles that have proven over time that they improve the wealth and prosperity of a nation. The EFF is a band of criminals, promoting failed ideologies to gullible people who give them power so they can enrich themselves at the countries expense. The EFF have absolute zero value offering to their voters.
@@letlhogonoloaulstonmorwakg7379 I have yet to see the FF chanting death to other races. They are not even on the same planet as the EFF. Just because they are on the opposite side of the spectrum, does not mean they are the same. It just means they are opposites.