We made the mistake of calling M855 and M855A1 "AP rounds". Neither are specifically designated as AP, but have some AP like qualities. We spoke to this as people who frequently compete and shoot at steel targets, and while M855 and M855A1 are not *officially* AP rounds, they might as well be by our standards. So please note this correction - M855A1 is an "enhanced performance" round, and still considered ball ammunition by technical standards.
Maybe I missed it but what rating was that AR500 plate? I do definitely agree with the conclusions of this video. Thank you for helping share this information.
It's not armour-piercing. It just has enhanced performance against armour. I guess if you're living in a green suit and your idea of armour is Oddball and his friends rolling up in three Shermans, it's really not AP. It just has enhanced performance against armour that you could reasonably wear.
It is AP it’s just LAP. Meaning soft armor or pistol round safe armor. It is literally called Light Armor Piercing. You’re thinking of AP like we think in the movies and most Americans which would be black tip AP ammo or rounds with a tungsten bolt in the round
I wish someone would test varmit loads against these plates. It'd be interesting to see how light you'd have to go to get enough velocity to punch through. ~40 gr on an 18" barrel, ~30 gr on a 16"?¿ I don't need sleep... I need answers.
I used to have steel plates.. Cause sayings like "ceramics get hit multiple times they disintegrate!!!" Then, after years of shooting, I realized... If you're hit in the plate 5 times, you're hit everywhere and your armor is the LEAST of your worries!
What's funny, is that old Soviet 6b5 DID stop M855A1 from a 20 inch barrel in Oxide's test. A mass-produced, mass-issued ceramic armor from 1985 performed better than this.
And my experience in russian steel is that another identical plate might be soft as butter. The quality is just so varied you can never tell if it's hard or soft.. it's a toss of the dice.
i think it looks scarier. so that's a plus in my book. jk but i'm sure it does to idiots like that rep who said it was heavy like a box or some such lol.
Well the only reason people would be upset is 'cos they didn't prove jack or shit, using an III plate compared to a ceramic designed, specifically, to defeat steel penetrators.
It's AR500 That are the specs, AR500 is a type of steel alloy and the name of the company is AR500 Armor. You can look them up in this thing called internet.
I'd guess 3A. Kind of annoying they don't tell us. If their ceramic plate was level 4 and this steel plate was 3A, then they haven't really demonstrated anything.
@vertigo4236 "AR500 is a type of high-carbon steel alloy that's known for its hardness and durability. The "AR" stands for "Abrasion Resistant" and the "500" refers to its Brinell Hardness Number (BHN), which is a measure of its hardness and ability to resist deformation under high pressure."
They have like one or two actually nij certified plates and soft armour out of their whole selection, ar500 is trash do not buy anything that is not nij certified, not “nij standard” it has to specifically say certified, you should go read the certification process it’s great and makes me so much more confident in actually tested plates
I have seen videos of m855a1 stopping on ar500 steel with a 16 inch barrel, honestly crazy that a few extra inches is really making this much of a difference.
For everyone wondering, with the FragLock, the AR500 steel plate they tested is Level 3+ (up to m855), AR500 also sells level 4 plates, but they are Ceramic Multi-hit. As for why I dont use steel plates is the weight difference compared to ceramic. But at the same time, here in Vegas, im not going to keep a set of ceramic/poly plates in the car as the summer heat would compromise them in a few years with our summers, while the steel loses no rating at all. Each type has there place. And in case you were wondering if the Level 4 ceramic plates will stop M33 ball, nope, thats another step up to Level 4+ plates, something like an Adept Colossus IV+ (crazy how far armor has come in the past decade).
It’s not even III+, the heritage plates are just III tested. It wasn’t rated for M855A1 or the velocities produced by a 20” barrel. Karl knows this, but wanted to play meme police instead.
I’m wondering what type of steel plate that was because me and my brother shoot ar500 steel plates for fun and we have used m855a1 on them from 100 yards and it didn’t go threw so I’m curious
I doubt it. Velocity makes a huge difference. If you look on the internet you can find testing from the 50s/60s where they were shooting armor plate off an M3 half track and it stopped 30-06 AP and 8mm AP but regular old 22-250 fmj punched straight through with its much higher velocity than the other 2.
@@calebdean2440 On the other hand, the A1 is designed to be fired out of a 14.5" barrel, and gets the vast majority of its velocity within that amount of barrel, unlike the M855 which was made for 20" barrels.
@@wurfyyit still loses some performance. The original powerpoint of the A1 already showed that some barriers could only be pierced with a 20" barrel. But yeah, only testing can tell
@@humanbass Of course it loses some performance. And if you really try, you can tailor a barrier that requires a 20" barrel in order for the bullet to penetrate. The point, though, is that the M855A1 is designed to lose a lot less performance than the M855 when fired out of a short barrel.
Beside all the tongue and cheek from both sides, lots of context to consider: - Expiration date of ceramic/steel plates - durability of ceramic/steel plates, in regards to getting dropped/banged on while wearing - rating of the plates, lots of ceramic and steel plates are made to an exact standard needed to be met. - If your worried about M855-A1, buy a plate rated for it. Wear armor. Getting shot sucks more than having to work out to carry said protective armor.
@@Stand_watie Level 4 steel plates would be about 20 pounds per plate. You aren't realistically wearing that, and it's going to ruin almost any carrier out there.
@@Klovaneer That might work in videogames, but that's not how it works in real life. Titanium armor is more of a light flak vest rather than proper rifle rated armor, until you're dealing with something almost as ridiculous as steel.
Should also try hitting the plate with 55gr out of that 20in barrel. I was able to punch through 3/8 ar500 resting against some wood with 55gr out of a 20in barrel at about 25 yards
i would have never in a million years expected this result holy hell i had no idea those lil plinkers i was playing with downrange had that kind of penetration.
the exposed steel tip on A1 doesnt deform as easily as copper and lead so when it hits a hard but brittle steel plate it basically just breaks a small hole to pass thru
Is this level 3 or 3+ because there is quite a significant difference in protection levels between the two from the company “AR500”. Their 3+ is rated to stop black tip rounds up to 2700 fps
Want to know the same thing. If you are going to test something at least describe exactly what you are testing. I am assuming because he said ar500 by ar500 its just standard lvl 3 which isnt even rated for m855.
@@adamthompson626 my guess is it’s regular level 3 because the green tip even managed to dent the backside which it should not be able to do with any 3+ armor even from a 20”
@@user-oy9zy4ds9m Where is it listed that their 3+ plates can stop M2 AP at 2700 FPS? If it stopped that, it could easily stop M855A1, but their plates don't have that listed as a special threat.
III+ is not even a real NIJ rating. It's an overbuilt NIJ Level III which tends to keep out the 5.56 threats that regular III does not do reliably. It also pushes the weight up to 8 pounds a plate and beyond.
@@KeterMalkuth midway USA has them for sale description says rated for m61 at 2800 fps. M61 is black tip 7.62x51 . However m855a1 may still penetrate because of its higher velocity, and smaller diameter.
3+ lightweight is not rated for 855a1 and has a v 50 rating for all 5.56 of 3100fps. I have a set of plates advanced swimmers cut 3+ lightweight from about 8 years ago
Interesting, in the "worst case" scenario it fails the latest 855A1 from a 20" barrel, how would it hold up to the much more common 16" AR barrel? Either way it is affordable protection against many of the more common threats, and is better than nothing!
Straight Level III is dicey against any 5.56. It might stop it IF they have a mild enough round, a short enough barrel, a long enough distance etc. Given that 5.56 is the platform of choice in this country, it seems like a poor gamble to me. Level III is very good against 7.62 and that's still in use, but Level III would have been a much better go-to in 1960 than it is today.
Would be curious to see at what angle the ar500 eventually deflected the m855a1. I remember watching a video awhile ago (I think it was demoranch lol) where he tested shooting .308 ap at an ar500 plate set at either 25 or 30 degrees, and it deflected the bullet with no penetration.
Karl’s the meme police now. You used heritage plates which are the cheapest and most basic plates AR offers, NIJ tested at level 3 (~2750fps) at speeds likely exceeding ~3000fps, how does M855A1 stack up against their other steel rated at higher levels?
Honestly, not really. Level 3+ steel plates with a liner are around $100 a plate, level 4 ceramics from RMA are $150. They weigh about the same but the ceramic is significantly thicker.
Ar500 NIJ level 3 (80-110$) with built up liner (+25-50$) and/or anti-sphall cover (+50-75$) is about 105-235usd. You cant find level 4 steel armor because a single level 3 plate is already roughly 10lbs with the liner and cover and about 0.8in thick. Level 4 based on vehicle protection would be roughly 13lbs per plate or about 36lbs for a full plate carrier and no kevlar. Ceramic NIJ level 4 is about 150-250usd and about 7-8lbs per plate which is about 1in thick. So a full plate carrier would be about 19-22lbs with additional kevlar neck, arm, groin, and back protection being about 25lbs.
I’ve been shopping around for more armor. Steel seems to be the way to go for people who just want to have it in case and don’t wear it everyday as the shelf life and storage is easier but looks like I need lvl 3+. 20” 5.56 is the most common use round I could see needing protection from
We really have entered the point in time where the caliber argument is dead, as bullet type and selection matters far more than the cartridge you are using. The M855A1 is a fantastic example of what a 5.56 can really do, against both hard and soft targets. Expensive, but very worth it. Many people preach 308 superiority, but if I have plates, I'll take getting hit by an M80 FMJ over an M855A1.
@@madshad3351 For reference the level 3 steel plates are already about 7-10lb IIRC, depending on the size. That's as much as a cheap level 4 ceramic plate, just thinner. Also, IIRC the NIJ certifications require multiple hit with most ammo even for ceramic, although I think for the blacktip .30-06 at .300 Win Mag velocity it's just one hit.
Not that it matters in literally any way, but just out of curiosity, who manufactured your green tip? And more importantly: _Where can I get a pair of Karl's awesome glasses?_
@@ZennZennster I guess a person could be concerned about either. Getting splash fragments up under your chin and into the medial sides of your upper arms would suck, but getting pieces of plate between your ribs because a 1 oz slug spanked it would suck too.
@@Sableagle Ceramic generally crumbles upon impact, and with how the backing layer of PE reacts, it'll catch almost anything that could try to follow a bullet aside from fine particulate. All of that said, slugs don't penetrate any halfway decent ceramic armor in the first place, at least not without specialized AP ammo.
Question... LvL3 plate was suppose to be better than LVL4 ceramic? I am not aware of any Steel Plate rated at lvl4. Please correct me if I'm wrong. (Devils advicate? Is there a lvl3 ceramic? I really don't know. That's the only way semantically I could justify that meme. Marketting guy going to market.)
The fact that an M855 standard penetrator round did not penetrate the AR500 steel does NOT mean if you get hit by it you will just get up like nothing happened. Back in 2003 in Baghdad I got shot in the chest with an AK round. The SAPI plate indeed did stop it. However, the impact did knock me to the ground and broke 2 and cracked a third rib and badly bruised my left lung. I still spent 4 days in an Army hospital and was on light duty for another week.
Why didn’t you try m193 through that 20” tube. I have been told real m193 will poke a clean hole In body armor apparently the 55 grain ball going around 3000 fps defeats steel armor body armor as well.
0:34 A while back when you put 6B13 plate into 6B45 and wondered why it was so damn heavy :D Note that, 6B13's front plate is rated at Class 4 ~ Lvl 3 NIJ usually.
I wonder how much range effects these rounds. it would make sense that at 15 yards these rounds would penetrate, but how far till they dont? 500 yards? id love to get my hands on some and see!
Not far. I think a 20" barrel is equivalent to a 10" barrel 60 yards closer, so if it won't go through when shot from a 10" at 1 yard it won't go through when shot from a 20" at 61 yards. Air resistance being proportional to the square of the velocity can be a real bitch, huh? If you want this effect at range, you might have to cook up something special like a 111 grain 5.56 x 51 mm with 1 km/s at the muzzle, or go for the meme value with 6.66 x 66.6 mm and a 666 mm barrel length, 154 gr at 3281 fps, and scare the heck out of the Catholics and Evangelicals. That second one'd be 12% more kick and 26% more energy than a .30-06, by the way.
The velocity bleeds off very quickly, I wouldn't be surprised if it failed to penetrate at even 100 yards, and surely by 200 yards it would fail to penetrate.
Years ago, when I had only shot my grandad's H&R 999, a friend invited me to shoot his Marlin lever action carbine in .44 Mag. He took me through all the necessary safety instructions and then fired first. Our target was a gallon milk jug filled with water. He nicked the sides but did no significant damage. Three rounds. Reload and now my turn. I took aim, let out half a breath and BOOM! The milk jug flew a part. I had split the jug in two, including the body and handle. My friend was definitely irritated because he immediately announced game over. I KNOW this was beginner's luck but I still chuckle to this day about this match up. Thank you for the entertaining and informative content.CHEERS!
Since AR500 offers various levels of protection in their steel offerings, and since you didn’t address what level armor you are shooting at, I feel that this is possibly misleading. Was this their level 3 or level 3+ armor? Additionally, you said your plate is several years old so was it only designed for M855 and newer armor is rated for M855A1? Too much missing information to know whether this video is currently valid.
Not sure for that one, but thinness is generally one of the selling points of steel armor. I know a cop that insists on wearing it over ceramic because she says that when going to the ground with someone the extra 1/2" - 1" makes a significant difference in her center of gravity. Is that true? IDK, but she's impossible to argue with. I can't even convince her to not get the cheapest available JHPs.
I'm not sure it solves a lot. What makes more sense is the UHMWPE/Ceramic hybrids that are increasingly common. You get a plate that's much more effective against 5.56 than straight poly plates while still being much lighter than a Level IV ceramic.
Maybe I don't know about the topic and "AR500" itself already gives someone more educated enough information, but I missed hearing what armor class the steel and ceramic plates were (or at least their thickness) To me as a common idiot it was not clear if these two plate are even supposed to have the same level of protection on paper
5.56 is going to remain in use with the military for a long time yet. As far as the new Sig round is concerned, a Level III plate will be about the same as a fishnet shirt when it comes to stopping that beast.
![AR500 Armor [Review]: All Threat Levels + Armor Piercing Rounds!](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Fd7LeSaldIE/mqdefault.jpg)
We made the mistake of calling M855 and M855A1 "AP rounds". Neither are specifically designated as AP, but have some AP like qualities. We spoke to this as people who frequently compete and shoot at steel targets, and while M855 and M855A1 are not *officially* AP rounds, they might as well be by our standards. So please note this correction - M855A1 is an "enhanced performance" round, and still considered ball ammunition by technical standards.
Maybe I missed it but what rating was that AR500 plate? I do definitely agree with the conclusions of this video. Thank you for helping share this information.
“Uhm ahktually M855A1 isn’t AP” cries out the neckbeard as his AR500 plate is penetrated by it
It's not armour-piercing. It just has enhanced performance against armour.
I guess if you're living in a green suit and your idea of armour is Oddball and his friends rolling up in three Shermans, it's really not AP.
It just has enhanced performance against armour that you could reasonably wear.
It is AP it’s just LAP. Meaning soft armor or pistol round safe armor. It is literally called Light Armor Piercing. You’re thinking of AP like we think in the movies and most Americans which would be black tip AP ammo or rounds with a tungsten bolt in the round
I wish someone would test varmit loads against these plates. It'd be interesting to see how light you'd have to go to get enough velocity to punch through. ~40 gr on an 18" barrel, ~30 gr on a 16"?¿ I don't need sleep... I need answers.
Right bullet with the right barrel equals a bad day on the wrong side of a false belief.
Man, that's an eloquently stated, profoundly accurate sentence.
Awesome phrasing, neat imagery
I used to have steel plates.. Cause sayings like "ceramics get hit multiple times they disintegrate!!!"
Then, after years of shooting, I realized... If you're hit in the plate 5 times, you're hit everywhere and your armor is the LEAST of your worries!
What's funny, is that old Soviet 6b5 DID stop M855A1 from a 20 inch barrel in Oxide's test. A mass-produced, mass-issued ceramic armor from 1985 performed better than this.
also massed flogged on ebay, so a lot of russians only have emotional support armour left
And my experience in russian steel is that another identical plate might be soft as butter.
The quality is just so varied you can never tell if it's hard or soft.. it's a toss of the dice.
@@Skuggan84 one more point in favor of ceramic then?
@@ForOne814 if made in russia. Yes. If compared to russian steel plates.
@@Skuggan84 if compared to the plate in the video as well, lol.
Hot take: an AR with a 20" barrel is the best looking
The truth is the m16 had Drip.
Not to poo poo the beautiful 20” but
Imo, the shorter the better looking.
Performance aside obviously.
i think it looks scarier. so that's a plus in my book. jk but i'm sure it does to idiots like that rep who said it was heavy like a box or some such lol.
Bicth to carry
Prefer 16 inch
@@tomhenry897 if you think the rifle is bad try runnin and gunnin with a saw. it sure was fun though.
in today's episode of "karl makes people upsetti" karl will upsetti all the steel lords of metal superiority.
Yeah, all 3 of them.
Karl makes people upsetti spaghetti more often than not… with a side of Cheddar Bay biscuits
Only reason I use em is it's what I could afford, otherwise, ceramic all day. Lighter and better
That's three potential album covers in one sentence.😂
Well the only reason people would be upset is 'cos they didn't prove jack or shit, using an III plate compared to a ceramic designed, specifically, to defeat steel penetrators.
*Starts shopping internet for M855A1 and an A4 upper*
Be prepared to pay at least $2.50 per round.
you can get some at War Pig Armory!
@@aquablaster86 facts
@WarPigArmory already have🫡
Wish you described the level of armor. Was this just level 3? If so, it makes sense.
It's AR500
That are the specs, AR500 is a type of steel alloy and the name of the company is AR500 Armor.
You can look them up in this thing called internet.
@vertigo4236 You do realize they have different levels right? LOL. Yikes dude.
I'd guess 3A. Kind of annoying they don't tell us.
If their ceramic plate was level 4 and this steel plate was 3A, then they haven't really demonstrated anything.
@vertigo4236
"AR500 is a type of high-carbon steel alloy that's known for its hardness and durability. The "AR" stands for "Abrasion Resistant" and the "500" refers to its Brinell Hardness Number (BHN), which is a measure of its hardness and ability to resist deformation under high pressure."
They have like one or two actually nij certified plates and soft armour out of their whole selection, ar500 is trash do not buy anything that is not nij certified, not “nij standard” it has to specifically say certified, you should go read the certification process it’s great and makes me so much more confident in actually tested plates
3:28 Now you can use the left over water for a mud test.
I have seen videos of m855a1 stopping on ar500 steel with a 16 inch barrel, honestly crazy that a few extra inches is really making this much of a difference.
And yet they say "size doesn't matter"
Babe wake up, new InRange armor test just dropped
How many different videos are you going to comment this on?
@@thatguysky123 Yes.
Your girl is busy right now. Ill send her over when I'm done.
@@deusvult7947 Thanks bro you're a real one
Level 3 or 3+? This matters with the ar500 brand
For everyone wondering, with the FragLock, the AR500 steel plate they tested is Level 3+ (up to m855), AR500 also sells level 4 plates, but they are Ceramic Multi-hit.
As for why I dont use steel plates is the weight difference compared to ceramic. But at the same time, here in Vegas, im not going to keep a set of ceramic/poly plates in the car as the summer heat would compromise them in a few years with our summers, while the steel loses no rating at all. Each type has there place.
And in case you were wondering if the Level 4 ceramic plates will stop M33 ball, nope, thats another step up to Level 4+ plates, something like an Adept Colossus IV+ (crazy how far armor has come in the past decade).
It’s not even III+, the heritage plates are just III tested.
It wasn’t rated for M855A1 or the velocities produced by a 20” barrel. Karl knows this, but wanted to play meme police instead.
I’m wondering what type of steel plate that was because me and my brother shoot ar500 steel plates for fun and we have used m855a1 on them from 100 yards and it didn’t go threw so I’m curious
85 yard difference
I wonder how the A1 behaves out of a 14.5 M4 barrel. Will it still penetrate the AR500?
I doubt it. Velocity makes a huge difference. If you look on the internet you can find testing from the 50s/60s where they were shooting armor plate off an M3 half track and it stopped 30-06 AP and 8mm AP but regular old 22-250 fmj punched straight through with its much higher velocity than the other 2.
@@calebdean2440 On the other hand, the A1 is designed to be fired out of a 14.5" barrel, and gets the vast majority of its velocity within that amount of barrel, unlike the M855 which was made for 20" barrels.
@@wurfyyit still loses some performance. The original powerpoint of the A1 already showed that some barriers could only be pierced with a 20" barrel.
But yeah, only testing can tell
@@humanbass Of course it loses some performance. And if you really try, you can tailor a barrier that requires a 20" barrel in order for the bullet to penetrate. The point, though, is that the M855A1 is designed to lose a lot less performance than the M855 when fired out of a short barrel.
Watch buffman range's latest video on it
I remember an old Eastwood movie where he has a rough piece of train boiler plate slung across his chest. Looked pretty heavy!
There was an old west gunfighter and outlaw called "Deacon" Jim Miller who regularly wore such a thing under his frock coat.
Beside all the tongue and cheek from both sides, lots of context to consider:
- Expiration date of ceramic/steel plates
- durability of ceramic/steel plates, in regards to getting dropped/banged on while wearing
- rating of the plates, lots of ceramic and steel plates are made to an exact standard needed to be met.
- If your worried about M855-A1, buy a plate rated for it.
Wear armor. Getting shot sucks more than having to work out to carry said protective armor.
they should have tested a level 4 steel plate since the ceramic was also level 4 or maybe I'm wrong i dunno.
@@Stand_watie Do Level 4 steel plates even exist?
@@Stand_watie Level 4 steel plates would be about 20 pounds per plate. You aren't realistically wearing that, and it's going to ruin almost any carrier out there.
If you are worried about ceramic ruggedness there's titanium that's the best of both worlds. Expensive for military, might be okay for an individual.
@@Klovaneer That might work in videogames, but that's not how it works in real life. Titanium armor is more of a light flak vest rather than proper rifle rated armor, until you're dealing with something almost as ridiculous as steel.
Should also try hitting the plate with 55gr out of that 20in barrel. I was able to punch through 3/8 ar500 resting against some wood with 55gr out of a 20in barrel at about 25 yards
It can be said that the difference between M855 and M855A1 for overall penetration against harder material is quite impressive.
I like it when SinisterRifleman laughs in the videos, once in ten years; feels like a blessing and it's welcome
i would have never in a million years expected this result holy hell i had no idea those lil plinkers i was playing with downrange had that kind of penetration.
the exposed steel tip on A1 doesnt deform as easily as copper and lead so when it hits a hard but brittle steel plate it basically just breaks a small hole to pass thru
What lvl is the plate?
I'm curious about this same test against AR550 and AR600 plates.
Is this level 3 or 3+ because there is quite a significant difference in protection levels between the two from the company “AR500”. Their 3+ is rated to stop black tip rounds up to 2700 fps
Want to know the same thing. If you are going to test something at least describe exactly what you are testing. I am assuming because he said ar500 by ar500 its just standard lvl 3 which isnt even rated for m855.
@@adamthompson626 my guess is it’s regular level 3 because the green tip even managed to dent the backside which it should not be able to do with any 3+ armor even from a 20”
@@user-oy9zy4ds9m Where is it listed that their 3+ plates can stop M2 AP at 2700 FPS? If it stopped that, it could easily stop M855A1, but their plates don't have that listed as a special threat.
III+ is not even a real NIJ rating. It's an overbuilt NIJ Level III which tends to keep out the 5.56 threats that regular III does not do reliably.
It also pushes the weight up to 8 pounds a plate and beyond.
@@KeterMalkuth midway USA has them for sale description says rated for m61 at 2800 fps. M61 is black tip 7.62x51 . However m855a1 may still penetrate because of its higher velocity, and smaller diameter.
so at what length barrel does the M855A1 stop going through?
Wish you would have brought out a 16" to test after the 20" went thru! Maybe next time.
What level was the armor 3 or 3 plus?
Was it their 3 or 3+ level? Because as far as I remember 3+ stops 55a1
That's what I'm wondering. I use 3+ lightweight plates myself.
wondering same thing.
3+ lightweight is not rated for 855a1 and has a v 50 rating for all 5.56 of 3100fps. I have a set of plates advanced swimmers cut 3+ lightweight from about 8 years ago
I also was wondering. Pretty sure this isn't the 3+
The meme says ar500 is better than ceramic. Ceramic is level 4.
Interesting, in the "worst case" scenario it fails the latest 855A1 from a 20" barrel, how would it hold up to the much more common 16" AR barrel?
Either way it is affordable protection against many of the more common threats, and is better than nothing!
Straight Level III is dicey against any 5.56. It might stop it IF they have a mild enough round, a short enough barrel, a long enough distance etc. Given that 5.56 is the platform of choice in this country, it seems like a poor gamble to me. Level III is very good against 7.62 and that's still in use, but Level III would have been a much better go-to in 1960 than it is today.
isn't shooting steel with steel ammo at 15 yards dangerous...?
Not when it punches right through 😂
yes, don't do that.
I have a shoulder wound that agrees! Be careful!
Kinda:):)
@@InrangeTv damn so steel armor has thorns enchantment?
Would be curious to see at what angle the ar500 eventually deflected the m855a1. I remember watching a video awhile ago (I think it was demoranch lol) where he tested shooting .308 ap at an ar500 plate set at either 25 or 30 degrees, and it deflected the bullet with no penetration.
2 questions 1) How would that plate hold up against M193? 2) How would UHMWPE plate compare to the steel and ceramic?
M193 penetrates steel armor at like 30ish yards.
Since you didn’t explain what level this steel plate was, I’d call this test: invalid.
Would have been nice to know how thick that plate was as well
That is what i was thinking!
Ive been scrounging for m855a1 ammo and havent found anything. Just want a clip of the stuff for collection
Hi Scipio
@@Justin-rq6kf sah dude
@@_Scipio__Africanus_ You need a 20" barrel for your VHS, it's zased.
@@Justin-rq6kf idk I feel the 16in is perfect. Guns super compact with it
Karl’s the meme police now.
You used heritage plates which are the cheapest and most basic plates AR offers, NIJ tested at level 3 (~2750fps) at speeds likely exceeding ~3000fps, how does M855A1 stack up against their other steel rated at higher levels?
The US Army uses 14 inch barrels now. 16 inches is the most common civilian length. How do those rounds perform at those lengths?
I have a side plate that stopped 855A1 from 10 yards out of a 16" barrel. Cratered it really bad, very clear that a 20" would have gone through.
Is there a big price difference between ceramic and metal?
Oh yeah
@@diltzm in what direction?
Honestly, not really. Level 3+ steel plates with a liner are around $100 a plate, level 4 ceramics from RMA are $150. They weigh about the same but the ceramic is significantly thicker.
Ar500 NIJ level 3 (80-110$) with built up liner (+25-50$) and/or anti-sphall cover (+50-75$) is about 105-235usd. You cant find level 4 steel armor because a single level 3 plate is already roughly 10lbs with the liner and cover and about 0.8in thick. Level 4 based on vehicle protection would be roughly 13lbs per plate or about 36lbs for a full plate carrier and no kevlar.
Ceramic NIJ level 4 is about 150-250usd and about 7-8lbs per plate which is about 1in thick. So a full plate carrier would be about 19-22lbs with additional kevlar neck, arm, groin, and back protection being about 25lbs.
RMA Lvl 4 plates are the way.
How heavy would Tungsten M855A1 be?
77gr?
I’ve been shopping around for more armor. Steel seems to be the way to go for people who just want to have it in case and don’t wear it everyday as the shelf life and storage is easier but looks like I need lvl 3+. 20” 5.56 is the most common use round I could see needing protection from
Were both the ceramic and steel the same level plates?
The OD Green KP-15 Lower Receiver wears the BRN 601 upper (brownells Retro repro of Colt 601 from early Vietnam) like a match made in Heaven
And how many folks are running 20” barrels as their setup
How would this armor stand up to more common 55 grain fmj and 62 grain 855?
We really have entered the point in time where the caliber argument is dead, as bullet type and selection matters far more than the cartridge you are using. The M855A1 is a fantastic example of what a 5.56 can really do, against both hard and soft targets. Expensive, but very worth it. Many people preach 308 superiority, but if I have plates, I'll take getting hit by an M80 FMJ over an M855A1.
Just imagine a .308 sabot penetrator
Some of my favorite InRange content
With regards to the meme: it's wild how people who grew up during the console wars would evolve into other kinds of format/material wars now.
What level plate was that?
Level 3, because a level 4 steel plate would be absurdly heavy.
@@axmajpayne Ty👊
@@madshad3351 For reference the level 3 steel plates are already about 7-10lb IIRC, depending on the size. That's as much as a cheap level 4 ceramic plate, just thinner. Also, IIRC the NIJ certifications require multiple hit with most ammo even for ceramic, although I think for the blacktip .30-06 at .300 Win Mag velocity it's just one hit.
@@eargesplitten9876 thank you. 👊
Where can u get m855a1?
War Pig Armory!
Need to also do M193 55gr. alongside the M855 and M855A1.
Also, has anyone collected chrono data of M855A1 through a 20" vs 14.5"?
buffman range just did a detailed video of it. I would go check it out
@@WarPigArmory Yeah, I've been subscribed to his channel for a few years.
I'd like to see what M855A1 does from a 14.5" barrel or less as to my knowledge it was designed to get 20" performance from a short barrel.
I’d be interested to know the change in velocity from 20” to 18” Barrel. And if that reduction is enough to prevent the M855A1 from passing through.
Ar500 + soft balistik is ok?😅
Not that it matters in literally any way, but just out of curiosity, who manufactured your green tip? And more importantly: _Where can I get a pair of Karl's awesome glasses?_
The standard M855 in this video was Lake City. The glasses came from Amazon, tbh.
Which ar500 plate was used? Exact model is helpful.
I know it's not 2 or 4. Was this just lvl 3 or lvl 3 +?
Level IV ceramic....was the AR500 plate Level IV rated?
Link me to "Level IV" rated Ar500.
Which video is the one from 2018 which had the ceramic testing?
Question, what rating was the steel armor just out of curiosity
it would be great to see a video with various bbl lengths. How much barrel does it take to punch thru armor?
I'm not saying one is better than the other. But is that an actual rated plate? Or is that just a piece of steel that you put Rino liner on?
Was acquired from ar500.com
I used to have some of this armor in my carrier, but the spalling concern was enough for me to take it out. Ceramic all the way!
*frag
@@ZennZennster I guess a person could be concerned about either. Getting splash fragments up under your chin and into the medial sides of your upper arms would suck, but getting pieces of plate between your ribs because a 1 oz slug spanked it would suck too.
@@Sableagle Ceramic generally crumbles upon impact, and with how the backing layer of PE reacts, it'll catch almost anything that could try to follow a bullet aside from fine particulate. All of that said, slugs don't penetrate any halfway decent ceramic armor in the first place, at least not without specialized AP ammo.
Question... LvL3 plate was suppose to be better than LVL4 ceramic? I am not aware of any Steel Plate rated at lvl4. Please correct me if I'm wrong. (Devils advicate? Is there a lvl3 ceramic? I really don't know. That's the only way semantically I could justify that meme. Marketting guy going to market.)
That steel plat is lv 3 and not rated for rifle rounds while the lv 4 ceramic is.
The fact that an M855 standard penetrator round did not penetrate the AR500 steel does NOT mean if you get hit by it you will just get up like nothing happened. Back in 2003 in Baghdad I got shot in the chest with an AK round. The SAPI plate indeed did stop it. However, the impact did knock me to the ground and broke 2 and cracked a third rib and badly bruised my left lung. I still spent 4 days in an Army hospital and was on light duty for another week.
what level is that plate rated?
Why didn’t you try m193 through that 20” tube. I have been told real m193 will poke a clean hole In body armor apparently the 55 grain ball going around 3000 fps defeats steel armor body armor as well.
Never heard of this M855A1 so this is a cool thing to learn.
I'd choose ceramic every time, but I'm curious as to the thickness of the steel you used.
I’ve put m193 through ar500 armor at 15 yards still have pictures of the plate
Karl Bad Man.
Finally beat that other guy to it.
Ok, but what about two Ar500 plates?
I really wanna see the chrono on M855 A1 out of a 20 inch AR
buffman range did a pretty detailed video on it. You can also get some m855a1 at War Pig Armory just an FYI!
Should have tried 55 grain out of the 20" barrel. Sometimes that does punch through.
what about AR650?
I think a better test is two uppers 16" and 20" and a chronograph. The velocity difference might be interesting.
Try it against the AR600 plates with the heavy spall liner.
So wait my level four plates will let that pass??
Id be interested to see what it does against a2 ar500
What level was the plate? 3 or 4? Makes a big difference!
What effect on ceramic? Asking for a friend.
Ceramic is effective against m855a1.
Great video. Short sweet and to the point!
But ultimately, factually inconsistent so. Take it as a meme rather than a real world application.
Is this level 3?
Ok guys , what was the rating on the plate . Come on guys let's get this right .
0:34 A while back when you put 6B13 plate into 6B45 and wondered why it was so damn heavy :D
Note that, 6B13's front plate is rated at Class 4 ~ Lvl 3 NIJ usually.
The other test on ceramic was with a shorter barrel not that I doubt ceramic is better but wish it was the same test for science
No, it wasn't. I used my 20" NRA High Power A2.
I wonder how much range effects these rounds. it would make sense that at 15 yards these rounds would penetrate, but how far till they dont? 500 yards? id love to get my hands on some and see!
Not far. I think a 20" barrel is equivalent to a 10" barrel 60 yards closer, so if it won't go through when shot from a 10" at 1 yard it won't go through when shot from a 20" at 61 yards. Air resistance being proportional to the square of the velocity can be a real bitch, huh? If you want this effect at range, you might have to cook up something special like a 111 grain 5.56 x 51 mm with 1 km/s at the muzzle, or go for the meme value with 6.66 x 66.6 mm and a 666 mm barrel length, 154 gr at 3281 fps, and scare the heck out of the Catholics and Evangelicals. That second one'd be 12% more kick and 26% more energy than a .30-06, by the way.
The velocity bleeds off very quickly, I wouldn't be surprised if it failed to penetrate at even 100 yards, and surely by 200 yards it would fail to penetrate.
Buy karl a plate and request
What lv of armor was that? I take it it wasn't lv 4
855 isn't traditional AP m995 is...
What was the rating on the plate? 3, 3+, 4?
Better than ceramic
Ceramic+ if you will
level 3 plates aint gonna stop the 44pen 55a1
Years ago, when I had only shot my grandad's H&R 999, a friend invited me to shoot his Marlin lever action carbine in .44 Mag. He took me through all the necessary safety instructions and then fired first. Our target was a gallon milk jug filled with water. He nicked the sides but did no significant damage. Three rounds. Reload and now my turn. I took aim, let out half a breath and BOOM!
The milk jug flew a part. I had split the jug in two, including the body and handle. My friend was definitely irritated because he immediately announced game over. I KNOW this was beginner's luck but I still chuckle to this day about this match up. Thank you for the entertaining and informative content.CHEERS!
Since AR500 offers various levels of protection in their steel offerings, and since you didn’t address what level armor you are shooting at, I feel that this is possibly misleading. Was this their level 3 or level 3+ armor? Additionally, you said your plate is several years old so was it only designed for M855 and newer armor is rated for M855A1? Too much missing information to know whether this video is currently valid.
How thin is that steel plate.
Not sure for that one, but thinness is generally one of the selling points of steel armor. I know a cop that insists on wearing it over ceramic because she says that when going to the ground with someone the extra 1/2" - 1" makes a significant difference in her center of gravity. Is that true? IDK, but she's impossible to argue with. I can't even convince her to not get the cheapest available JHPs.
Now I'm wondering how well a hybrid plate (steel bonded to ceramic) would work. Maybe best of both worlds, but heavy AF.
I'm not sure it solves a lot. What makes more sense is the UHMWPE/Ceramic hybrids that are increasingly common. You get a plate that's much more effective against 5.56 than straight poly plates while still being much lighter than a Level IV ceramic.
XM193 out of a 20 inch barrel will go through AR500 plates. Also 52 grain GMX will makes nice holes as well.
As the M855A1 go though the chap-o-type AR500 plate what do an 995, know it's hard to find. But, yeah kind wanna see the test.
Kinda pointless since a 995 will glide right through it. It can pen IV ceramics, let alone III steel.
LOVE the keffiyeh!!! ♥🍉
Karl please tell me where I can get those glasses
Maybe I don't know about the topic and "AR500" itself already gives someone more educated enough information, but I missed hearing what armor class the steel and ceramic plates were (or at least their thickness)
To me as a common idiot it was not clear if these two plate are even supposed to have the same level of protection on paper
it didn't matter - AR500 implied steel was better than ceramic *period*
@@FurnishedIgloo most people would say a corvette is better than a corolla, but how do they compare when driving the same speed on town roads?
do one with the anti spall sleeve and one where you shoot it at a 45 deg angle
Well fortunately there won’t be any 855a1 around for long since there suiting to the .277 unless they make a .277A1
5.56 is going to remain in use with the military for a long time yet. As far as the new Sig round is concerned, a Level III plate will be about the same as a fishnet shirt when it comes to stopping that beast.
14.5 barrel?