Tesla Still Makes No Money Selling Cars: Jim Chanos
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- Опубліковано 2 гру 2020
- Dec.03 -- Famed short-seller Jim Chanos has trimmed his five-year old short position on Tesla as the stock surged in 2020, but still takes issue with the company’s business model and valuation. He also says he’s never met Tesla Chief Executive Officer Elon Musk, but would give him credit for a “job well done.” He speaks exclusively with Scarlet Fu on “Bloomberg Front Row.”
'Trims short position after being down 700% on TSLA in about 15 months' - Cut your losses mate
Lol
So....you still think there is substantial upside? Really?
@@CorePathway yup. 5 trillion market cap coming
Too late too late
He shorted it 4 times, and made money the first 3, while waiting on the 4th.
Bloomberg, change the title of the video to “Chanos Still Makes No Money Shorting Tesla”
he probably lost billions of investors' money.
@@petecheng1 not his moooneys he doesnt care i guess 🤣
Not yet. Bubbles WILL burst!
Its just 5% of his overall portfolio.
His statement says it all: “Despite what everyone says, they are still an automative company.” You have to be stubborn as a mule and dumb to believe Tesla is like the other automotive companies.
No wonder he lost his shirt shorting Tesla. That’s like saying Amazon is just a retailer, Apple is just another mobile phone maker, Netflix is just another media company, Google/Facebook is an advertising agency, etc.
I question how this guy still has clients and is still in business. The only way is that he has stubborn clients with the same mindset.
Alternate video title : "Jim Chanos still makes no money shorting Tesla."
" ... yet"
@@MrHansBattle he will remain painfully “squeezed” by those red satin short shorts for the next 10 years at least...
@moophy So that we can make money by doing the opposite 😂
Bet he is making money now
@@thorbenreuter5937 I bet you he still isn't. He shorted a long time ago, TSLA is still up by a lot since he began shorting, even with these dips.
"They are still a car company. " because car companies sell software, solar roofs, home energy storage, electricity, insurance...
RIGHT !!!!!!!!!!!
Please tell us what percent of their revenue all those fantastic products are, and then also let us know the profitability of it. It IS a car company that sells other trinkets that don’t make much.
@@patroclus5102 400,000 solar roofs. Not sure how many power walls. 1.25 billion in energy sales in first 3 quarters of 2020. Rapidly growing. Software was 1.4billion in 2019. Is that enough data?
@@patroclus5102 your still missing the point !!!! why don't you go buy a ford car and let it break down in a year !
Yes, they do Joey. Take a look at Honda and how many products they sell. And they’re actually making profits on them.
Guys, whether you agree or disagree, be respectful. No need for the personal attacks, we're better than that. Just be happy we didn't listen to his opinion and instead made a lot of money.
So he is free to keep going on tv and spread lies, but I am not free to show disrespect in the UA-cam comment section?
Just curious...Is he some sort of business school mentor to you or what? lol
@@RotimiOrimoloye We're better than that. We made the big profits, he lost his business. I was just saying no need to attack him personally
@@nameerfleifel7779
I'm not attacking him personally.
There might be some comments on here doing that, but I haven't seen any yet.
What I do know is how many times I've heard people call him a "smart guy". If you have such a reputation, and then go on television 78 times a year actively campaigning against a company that is leading the world to sustainable energy with the media backing you, then you must equally own your big Ls publicly.
I can't imagine what would make anyone have sympathy for such a person. Unless you weren't paying attention during his malicious campaigning against Tesla.
@@RotimiOrimoloye Yeah that's fair. I was referring to other comments attacking him personally, instead of his horrible performance as an analyst thus far. I agree with what you're saying
Jim Chanos is awesome! His short positions has really propelled my Tesla stock gains, but I can't shake this feeling I'm taking advantage of a fool.
You will when the Tesla bubble bursts.
@@mycathoderay keep dreaming
I hope at least you have more money than him , coz telling him a fool and you are just a peasant , just doesn't make sense bro
@@Kostas1989 Well, I made thousands on the trade, he lost millions, does that makes sense to you now? And... money doesn't make the man, you fool.
@@mycathoderay let’s check back in a few years and see what you have to say 🥴
Never short a cult.
I love watching this now, after Q3 of 2021, and all the other developments... It shows old dogs are not learning new tricks in what new tech is doing... He's soooo lost....
Are you still following the herd?
Tesla Fanboys: *It's not a car company!*
Well it's not a money company either 😁
Trying to justify his blown call. Just admit you lost the bet, man.
He made the right call at the wrong time. Unfortunately the market does require timing of some sort for shorting to be profitable
@@Diplomastronaut shrug. In the end, it doesn’t matter if you’re “right” if you lose your shirt. I’d rather be wrong and rich than correct and poor.
@@ericp1139 well ya I agree. Dude just was too soon on his bet. Might be right in about 1 year and at latest if he did it in 3.
I love the way he justifies it by saying 'well in 4 out of 5 years it was okay'
Congratulated Elon ~2:10 mark:
“Job well done so far”
Please keep in mind that he, like all other professional investors, must trade around their positions.
He wouldn’t still be in business if he took a 100, 200, or 500% loss on that one
“Chanos is still losing money shorting Tesla”
Give the guy a break, this is a miserable time to be a short seller. And it's only going to get more miserable for him. His fund is going to underperform the S&P so badly it will be incredible.
Why sell cars when you can make money selling shares?
Exactly. Tesla is a stock company that sells cars. Not a car company that sells stock.
Here we are 3 years later.
And guess what the number one selling car in the world is?
His fund underperformed the sp what a joke
Why is it a joke? People don't invest in chanos' fund to expect to outperform the s&p each year. He offers you diversification in the form of downside protection
@@QuantPhilosopher89 he has lost billions, what a great way to help his client diversify. Shorting Tesla and betting against them is one of the biggest reason.
@@PhongNguyen-nz9kz Well he has also made his clients billions in the past, such as during the dot com bubble. Once the Fed's liquidity provisions are scaled back the current bubble will also be deflated and he will make a lot of money again. Not saying that shorting Tesla was smart though. Although I do think it's extremely overrated or at least years of pretty much perfect outcomes are priced into the stock currently.
@@QuantPhilosopher89 It takes years to build a reputation and seconds to destroy it. This guy took a massive L and is now the biggest joke on Wall Street. Go short Tesla and i'll send you another comment in a few months to check up on how your feeling.
@@hogarthtrista7089 I won't short Tesla, but I'm afraid your comment will age really badly. This will depend on when the fed ends its liquidity programs, which is difficult to time. Chanos isn't a joke, most of the Wall Street legends think we're in a bubble and Tesla is the poster child. You're part of the dumb money.
chanos is aging about as well as this video will.
I'm in total agreement but how do you time the downfall?
Tesla isn't a car company. It's a lottery ticket multiplying in price every few months or so.
Ponzi scheme.
He’s right. You’re all stating, and correctly, that the price of the stock keeps going up. Yeah, okay? The price is completely removed from reality, as have many before it.
Jim’s pride is really getting in the way.
What kinda idiotic question is have you had a tweet firestorm with him....is this what journalism has come to...
Bloomberg, please bring Jim Chanos back on December 2021
This guy let his hate of elon blind him imo
I think you might be right . although what did Elon do to him?
@@innercitadel3279 made him jealous, that’s what
OK boomer.
@@sillystuff6247 You seem to suffer from Scotoma, Sir. I know many facts. Good luck in the future.
@@shootermcgavin3077silly stuff is entirely correct. You're a bigot , "Shooter", and have a lot to learn.
@@daveriley6310 You are in fact a baby boomer? I just said OK boomer. Sorry that this hurts your feelings.
Your bigotry doesn't affect me, "Shooter." Your brief name-calling post doesn't make clear at whom you are slinging the intended slur. But like all childish name-calling, it only reflects on you, not the intended target.
@@daveriley6310 OK boomer.
and for the past several years, anyone that dared to short the stock, lost their shirt. :)
Did he concede?
Chanos still fails to see the bigger picture. Please do not trust your money with this man.
Elon is open for a merger which to me signals weakness to scale to mass market.. we where told Tesla 3 was the mass market car, now it's Tesla 2, I understand people who short the stock
We need man like Chanos to make sacrifice for the good of others.by the way Time to time he need to check his blood pressure
Chanos often says he has never seen a stock go to infinity. Considering how tsla has been performing lately, he might want to retract that.
Chanos not only lost money shorting Tesla but missed out on making a ton of money buying Tesla.
I want to start a company called Urist. Its short for futurist. I have no product but I believe in the future of alternative housing and communities in the desert. I think within a couple years we can catch TSLA. Anyone want to invest?
He would of made more money betting on Tesla.
At what point will Bloomberg stop giving this guy a voice? You can only be wrong for so long until one questions credibility. The interviewer does a disservice by not being tougher with questions, and probe into the actual fundamental (obvious) facts about how Tesla is scaling successfully.
If you drive an ICE car, you are loud, slow and you smell bad.
This video hasn't aged well. Poor "It's been painful" Chanos.
Steven Mark Ryan is somewhere laughing at this video rn
more content and more revenue from youtube for him to invest. 😁😁😁
Awesome!!
"It went sideways for 4-5 years, so not a bad short." I wonder how much he paid in borrow fees. Even before the run-up, he would've been better off sticking his money in an S&P 500 index fund, or simply keeping it in his bank account.
At the time he first started shorting, the price was $190. Stock was already over 260 in 2017.
That's not sideways. It was still up. It only came down to 174 for a month around July 2019, and raced back up to 300+ again.
They should fix the death trap door fault that traps your children in a collision or power failure.
it's painfully embarrassing watching this ignorant gibberish on Bloomberg
With car companies releasing EVs Tesla is going to have be competitive in their offerings. With Mercedes launching an actual EV the sheen of Tesla with start to tarnish and it won't be able to rely on its brand to sell cars anymore at inflated prices, which are the only way its scraping a profit together. Its actually going to have to spend money on customer service. Would you rather get your car serviced at Tesla or Lexus or Mercedes? Tesla isn't prepared to compete with car companies instead Musk will probably make another non sensical announcement like hyperloop, boring company, flame throwers etc to hide their shrinking market control.
But Elon is zee second most richest dude in zee vurld at dis moment. Surely zee company making a bit of money, right?
He's rich because of the stock price of the shares he owns, not because of the profits Tesla rakes in. His net worth is over $100 billion for owning a company that makes $30 billion in revenue. You really think Tesla is making money comparable to their market cap and don't think they are immensely overvalued?
Let me just end this argument right here. Short sellers like Jim lost over 39 Billion dollars in the last year and it's not over. Next argument.
Just because someone says something doesn't make it true. The title is verifiably false.
Shove that "Tesla Still Makes No Money Selling Cars" up yo a$$ Jim Chanos !!
Those emmision tax credits won't be bought much longer either
29% gross margin in latest quarter.
This guy is so out to lunch .....
How did Chanos get rich shorting companies?
ELON - Zeus
Chanos - Kronos 😁🤣
He was right, just early
Headline "Jim Chanos on financial assistance after trying to short Tesla".
I love Tesla cars. I do own one, and plan to buy another. I do see Telsa will take over Toyota in the future. But if you compare Toyota stock(TM) vs TSLA. TSLA is way over priced. Maybe my investment strategy is too outdated.
Delusional.
PE and other simple ratios don’t work for high growth companies. You have to do discounted cash flow (DCF) to estimate the net present value of future earnings. Plug in your estimates for revenues and cash flows over 5 or so years and pick a terminal growth rate. Get a finance text book or do an Internet search.
Companies value in the market are no longer due to prodution and selling with profits... Its base on fanatic techies wishfull irrationally investing on capital markets online, using debt.
That s why i m out.
Nothing to see here. Everything is normal folks.
Good luck
@@srantoniomatos, the ones who will pay are all the new Robinhood investors and S&P500 index fund holders that will take huge losses when Tesla is eventually held to some tangible valuation model.
Elon has done a great job turning $Trillions of government subsidies and investors cash into a company that is only worth (book value) $17/share (ironically the IPO price), that is currently selling for (market value) $641/share.
Elon is already sounding the alarm that the 💩 is about to hit the fan...again.
What TSLA cult members don’t understand is that just because many people bet huge amounts of money that Tesla stock price would fall from $$250/share ($50/share post split value), and the stock went up over 10x, doesn’t mean their logic was flawed.
Aside from the short sellers, lots of Tesla Executives sold tons of stock. JB Straubel sold so much stock that he would be filthy rich right now. Does it mean he bet wrong? Nope. He’s still filthy rich, just not as filthy.
The stock market is just a casino. The stock has virtual zero value, just like a plastic poker chip has outside the casino. Only the illusion that someone else will come along and pay more for that worthless piece of paper makes it go up in value.
One day these guys will realize owning 100 shares of Tesla, they didn’t own any of the company.
@@imho7250 it s casino funded on debt. Govermment and private debt( its the same thing now).
Tesla its one of the most comunnist companies in the world.
Jim Thanks still loses billions wearing SHORT SHORTS!!! Not max short on Tesla😂 Ark Invest has to sell because they can only have 10% of Tesla shares in their portfolio. I bet Chanos can't stand that Elon is the 2nd wealthiest person in the world.
Smart cars versus dumb cars. Tesla ecosystem will be money generator. There is also energy business.
Step 1: Tesla calculates it's energy credit revenue for the upcoming quarter.
Step 2: Tesla weighs that revenue into it's expansion plans and car pricing
Step 3: Tesla has 5 consecutive quarterly profits.
Elon musk is changing the world, while he’s trying to convince himself that he knows Tesla better than Elon.
👀 who’s short sighted!?!
Elon Musk is lining his pockets, name one thing he has done to change the world? He is also a shitty parent, who the hell calls their child such a ridiculous name.
@@Thyalwaysseek Things he does to change the world:
- accelerating the advent of sustainable energy
- massively reducing the cost of rocket launches
- working towards a human colony on mars
- pioneering autonomous vehicles
- working on scalable brain to machine interfaces to cure the disabled
- making a car that costs exactly 69420$ nice
@@jengawann
- 70% of the world's electricity is generated by fossil fuels.
- How do rocket launches help humanity?
- How does a colony of humans on Mars help humanity?
- Brain chip to help the disabled? Is that like the millions of robotaxis he promised would be on the roads by the end of 2020?
- $69420? How old are you? 15? Grow up.
@@Thyalwaysseekyou asked about things he has done to change the world, not about things that necessarily help humanity right now.
Also a question: you aren't very good at long-term thinking are you, because with Tesla he not only is manufacturing the best car of the decade, which is electric but also rapidly innovating in solar energy production and storage. Without Tesla everybody would laugh at the idea of electric car. Also do you think that to reach the status of somebody who changed the world he has to transform the entire energy grid by himself?
How do rocket launches and a mars colony help humanity? Well in the event of a planetary level disaster here on earth it could literally save the human species. I could go on with this forever but I hope you get my point: You're wrong
@@jengawann Stop being such a gullible fool, Musk is not colonizing Mars, humans are unable to survive the deadly radiation getting there let alone living there. Electric cars account for less than 2% of vehicles globally, EVs are a niche industry they will never go mainstream because the power grids would have to be completely rebuilt and governments are not going to spend money to do that.
This guy is trying so hard to be right
He is probably long on NKLA ?
None of the things tesla makes is affordable.. not even the stock. Im personally waiting for my own rocket ship.
Somebody that STILL doesn’t get it, yet continues to double/triple/quadruple down, smh.
It’s funny how he’s still talking, but took his money off the table, lol. To the shorts that follow him, that should tell you all you need to know about what he says.
Poor arguement. It's not Tesla's fault the other automakers can't sell enough EV's to generate their own credits. Don't hate the player hate the game.
Still waiting on ford and gm
they were dragging their feet and getting further behind. Ford Mach E looks promising but their after sale service will be the deciding factor.
Michael burry of the big short just shorted tesla
More like still losing money shorting Tesla
FUD master extraordinaire. Good luck with that. How many more $ mill down the drain?
$695
And how much do GigaFactories cost to build.....how blind do you choose to be, just like 'they're a car company'. Tesla is growing in all its facets, not just car manufacturing.
Get your head out of the sand dude
Musk is the only guy that can build a factory call it some meaningless name and get people excited about it.
Hes run out of short suckers to sell teska short positions to. So he does more interviews. Hes lost all credibility. Alas voom voomers smell gas and fall for it. Been a boom for tesla bulls
"Despite what everyone says...its still an automobile company " hahahahha. Word to the wise....don't short tesla!! Telsa will have down times of course where you could make money shorting it...but its one of the worst companies to short. Learn from this man's mistake
Musk will bankrupt Tesla by the end of 2021.
@@Thyalwaysseek thats funny
@@drj6041 It will be.
That guy is also not making money by shorting Tesla😂
Tesla is running out of cash and will issue more shares. It is probably also looking into a merger thus Musk visiting VW a few months back and VW reneging on a deal to make cars for Fisker. But Tesla is priced way out from acquisition. Expect some crazy tweets from Musk to drive down SP by 25% then follow that up with a merger agreement at a lower sp buyout.
1.6bln in quarterly profit Jim.
Its everything my guy. LOL!
bloomberg listens toJim Chanos??? wtf why would anyone listen to bloomberg? talk about not getting it
Obviously Tesla's value isn't in the past.
If a legacy auto makes $10Bn a year were to spend all that $10Bn last year to grow and make $15Bn this year should it's share price decrease as it made no money last year Jim????
This guy lost billions shorting Tesla lol.
All his arguments are poop. Definitely does not hold water. More pain for him today 10/25/21, Tesla reaching 975 per share, another short squeeze going on. Thank you Jim. 😝
What about the facts?
But Tesla definitely makes money selling stocks
Pretty sure I have heard multiple times now that subtracting the regulatory credits from Tesla’s balance sheet and they still made a profit.
dont bet against elon musk
This guy is too smart to be so foolish. "The market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent"
🤡
He should short Tesla. It’ll work out great for him. Oh wait... probably already did.
You are a funny guy and have not spent more than a hour to understand the trend.
(1:28) Chanos: "I will just point out, as I always do, that..." I'm always looking in the rear view mirror. We can't predict the future and I don't understand all these people who insist on investing in the future. I will continue with my Luddite broken-record sniping at Elon Musk until I can look IN THE MIRROR and see the third or fourth most valuable company in the universe named Tesla making 400 billion in annual profits WITHOUT selling those darned clean air credits. Until then, I will cling to my one remaining straw -- regulatory credits.
It was nice that the girl let me skate by on the fact that I've been short-covering.
@Obscure2099 I'm happy with Tesla's profits, with Tesla's profit growth, with Tesla's sales growth rate, with Tesla's rate of global expansion and with the growth of my wealth as a Tesla shareholder. Your unhappiness is evident in your retreating into name-calling as your primary mode of communication. You haters dwelling in the past are so sad. But I know you prefer the darkness of your self-defeatism and negativity and that nothing anyone else could say would motivate you to climb up into the light. So I will pass on trying to persuade you of anything.
Bye bye.
Chanos doesn't understand economies of scale. Tesla's "value" may have ballooned substantially, but it is a fundamentally stable company that would have made a profit without zev credits over the last quarter (during a global pandemic) and will continue to grow revenue and profits. The issue I have with Tesla stock today is that they already have growth baked into the stock price. I'm not sure if there is much room to go up from here until they can prove to have a successful robotaxi network and would make the majority of their profit from providing services rather than selling the vehicles.
Elon says the solar business could be a large as the auto business. Getting some traction for that and the storage business in recent quarters. Being able to charge $10K and even higher for autonomy (FSD) brings money at a software margin (70-90%). If it works and is permitted. We will soon see how the next generation FSD beta works out. It is looking good so far.
He would know about not making money 😁
Peepz still don't get how the stock price moves up and it's not by fundamentals or sales 🤣.. It's plain cash inflow and cash outflow.. If people want to put in money in something even poor fundamentals won't stop the stock from rising.. It may burst in near future but one can never time the bubble-burst by the time that happens, peepz declare bankrupcy 🤣...
Investing in crypto now should be in every wise individuals list, in some months time you'll be ecstatic with the decision you made today.
Most intelligent words I've heard.
Crypto is the new gold
I wanted to trade Crypto but got discouraged by the fluctuations in price
@@eugenejesse6462 That won't bother you if you trade with a professional like Mr harry noble
I heard that this strategies are really good
I don't think this gentleman is giving bad advice which maybe benefits his business .Tesla will knock out all other car manufacturers in the next two-three years let's wait and see.
Jim chani
Os, they guy without a clue.... and yes. He is factually and demonstrably wrong.
Lol it’s not an automobile company.
Jim Chanos is still loosing money.
markets can remain irrational a lot longer than you and I can remain solvent - a. gary shilling
It is selling software at $10,000 a piece and he still think it is JUST a car company. I totally see one day Tesla will have an APP store with thousands apps for its cars.
How much are you down, Jim? Divulge. You love free “ad time” to promote short positions. His justification for not being max short on a company he believes is a fraud is “other opportunities???....LOL.
Jim needs to keep his short position but I'll keep my long position for then next decade.
This guy is clueless
Despite what everyone says? LOL! This mans bias runs deep.
@Dick Bawls Lmaooo, that’s too accurate.
Any smart person would trim their position in TESLA before index inclusion. Been holding since $138 100
M M can you divulge WHY pray tell ?