Retconning the idea of Godzilla having a species in the MonsterVerse gets me fired up, such a dumb decision if this is indeed true. Tell me how you feel about this? -Jacob
Seriously one of the stupidest decisions/ideas I’ve ever heard. I don’t know what’s gotten into them with all these dumb rules , but I’m not gonna let them hold me back from telling good fanfiction Godzilla stories with these dumb restraints .
I feel like them forgetting about Dagon from the 2014 Godzilla feels like a slap in the face; especially since everything else(Ghidorah, Mothra, the Mutos, Serizawa, Mechagodzilla, etc.) remains intact. Delving more into Godzilla's past, other Gojiras, how he became the last of his species; all that could tell a much deeper, perhaps even a complex story about Godzilla himself.
Or how it was the Godzilla species that drove the kongs to skull island, how the mutos and gojiras had a war where most of each side was killed exept for our Godzilla and the queen muto who’s still alive.
@@WolfmanArt Yeah! That’d be an excellent solo Godzilla movie. Show how he grew up, how the war between the Kongs and Godzillas began, how Godzilla became the last of his kind, and how he became the most powerful of his species.
Nah, I love it. I'm tired of all this crap about monsters having societies, and culture, FOH. These monsters are supposed to be unique, singular, animalistic forces of nature.....not these anthropomorphic fucks we have now
@@Fixtionmaster101 For real Legendary was setting something awesome with teasing the Godzilla Kong Species War with that one flying Godzilla at the center and now it been retcon with only Godzilla fighting an entire ape army by himself and he being the monster that ate a star instead of the flying Godzilla. I do hope Legendary finds a way to change Tohos mind .
@@Fixtionmaster101 easy way to fix it we ignore it and say toho has no power over us fans cause we will boycott them if they say otherwise and we choose our own canon
@@robodude145 because that's the way the 1998 Godzilla/Zilla reproduced to make all its offspring, and Godzilla Earth from that subpar anime trilogy had a smaller plant Godzilla clone
@@justinruim5262 Godzilla phillius is sub-species and not the child of godzilla earth, so that doesn't count. And Zilla is female, the guy who designed zilla confirmed it, (roland emmerich is just salty) you can even see her ""equipment"" in some shots. do your research before commenting.
Just because it isnt allowed to be mentioned doesnt mean its been retconned, as far as we know, dagon is still canon, it just means toho doesnt want attention called to it
I find it funny how toho tries to enforce these rules but constantly has broken them themselfs, like GmK goji was activily hunting humans for fun and giggles, Zilla was seen eating, gojira 1954 was killed off, Gojira 2000 was also killed off from what I know atleast the black hole swallowed him whole.
I think they mean hunting for food, well Zilla is not Godzilla except you mean the 1998 movie toho didnt make this one maybe one of the things they get the rights so fast back, 1954 was the first movie ther it was not even a franchise and in 2000 with the black hole so you mean Godzilla X Megaguirus there is a post credit scene where Gofzilla survived you cant see it but you can hear it and the shock reaction from a character, in the beginning the movie they say something about earthquakes there is a theroy that godzilla after he got in the black hole he spawns under earths surface in the past. I liked that lore with a Godzilla species in the Monsterverse and in toho movie there a the Godzillasaurus species in heisei universe and showa has 2 godzillas
Yeah and Godzilla was also created from the inspiration of the 1953 american dinosaur movie "The Beast from 20'000 Fathoms" (Japan took inspiration from the Redhosaurus from that movie) and they also used King Kong 1933 as a source of inspiration as well... The Japanese charatcher "Godzilla" would not exist without those two american movies, so Toho can be angry all they want after Legendary is just giving fame and success to their beloved charatcher always winning, 2014 was an appreciated rebirth Japan loved and praised may i remember u all...
I don’t like this retcon. Godzilla belonging to a species of Godzilla makes Legendary’s version of the character different from Toho’s. You can easily compare the two and notice differences in their origins. Toho Godzilla is a mutation, while Legendary’s version is a natural animal. Legendary’s Godzilla is not a mutation but is still faithful to the Toho version: Prehistoric and connected to radiation. Not every Godzilla has to be a mutation. I know that’s a staple for the character, but I always thought MV Godzilla was still Godzilla without being a mutant creature. You can change things up a little bit, but it still has to look and feel like the original without copying it. Besides we have several Godzilla’s that are mutants, so it was nice for something new. Legendary needs to stop retconning their own established lore for the Monsterverse.
I'd say the only time I saw a mutated Godzilla was Heisei, shin, minus one and 1998, any other was just an actual legendary beast that woke up and the other just a ghost or an actual god like being but yeah agreed wholeheartedly
Shame that toho forced a retcon of godzilla having a multiple of species now I know toho has been under a lot of scrutiny but if this turns out to be true then it retcon's dagon and even Doug possible being related to the g-man.
And it’s hilarious because after the success of Minus One Toho producers and executives were complimenting on the versatility of Godzilla as a cinematic character and how he can tell many stories. But the higher ups are now saying Legendary can’t make a story about Godzilla being only a member of a whole race? Even if Godzilla DID have parents or siblings and he DIDN’T care about them that would’ve been much better than him being one of a kind.
@legittragiiczz5940 They fail to realize that the MonsterVerse is what SAVED the Godzilla franchise. If it wasn’t for 2014, Godzilla’s final movie would’ve been Final Wars. Toho should be thankful for that and ease their guidelines for Legendary. Nowadays, more people associate Godzilla as a whole with Legendary’s Godzilla.
@@WhyDoesItMatter-qu2qy Chances are, when Godzilla enters the public domain, it will be Legendary that'll take first dibs with the new creative freedom.
It’s a missed opportunity how the movies haven’t delved into how Godzilla is literally the last of his kind…Meanwhile Kong found his kind, Godzilla is alone and I think it’d make for a good story to explore how being alone effects him…He’s not a big dumb lizard he has so much more personality than people give him credit for.
You answer yourself why the whole monsterverse has become focused on Kong. Because Legendary's hands are tied with Godzilla, they can't do anything without the permission of those directly involved.
Unlike kong tho Godzilla had plenty of time get over his dpecies death Even then There was nothing really that suggested that the gojira species were social with each other outside of wars
I agree with you. Godzilla deserves better in the Monsterverse, so do the other titans. Kong is the only one who is properly fleshed out because he’s more accessible than Godzilla and his costars like Mothra, Rodan, Ghidorah & Mecha-G. Legendary has to pay a toll in order for them to use any of them. I get their Toho’s property but I find that Toho is so stingy when allowing them the rights to use their characters.
That's the thing, they don't even want Legendary to ADDRESS Godzilla's species, in ANY way. So we won't get explanation or anything. It really defeats the purpose of the Titans being natural animals.
All I can say is Toho pretty much ruined everything I ever learned about Godzilla’s history in this canon. I know Godzilla is their most important character, but the fact that they suddenly did this just seems like a straight up slap in the face due to all that lore basically being swept under the rug because of Toho’s strict guidelines.
the film 98 created the popularity in the West towards Godzilla, without that film there would be 70% fewer fans. Toho can criticize the film and the creature, but they cannot deny the commercial and cultural impact in the West thanks to that film... what Toho is doing with these rules is killing the potential of the Monsterverse.@@somedudewhodraws9377
@@destroyerzilla7634 That Movie is the reason I'm a Fan seeing Godzilla have Zilla his Son and then Zilla gain his Animated Series that made me a Fan no matter how much people hate it
Greg Keyes confirmed that to me over two years ago on Messenger. This isn’t anything new. He explained to me that despite it being hinted that Godzilla had a species, that he’s a “unique” individual and that the others (like Dagon) are stated as “Godzilla like creatures”, which with Dagon, even the Aftershock novel stated multiple times that Dagon was a “Godzilla like creature” and that Godzilla’s life cycle is a mystery and it’s up in the air on it Dagon was an ancestor. Even the 2014 film showed Serizawa said that “we found a fossil of a giant animal in the Philippines, like Godzilla”, so not directly stated to be “a Godzilla”. Also, same could be applied to Kong. His species is called the “great apes” and Kong himself is “Titanus Kong”.
So im fine with Goji being the last of his kind and not seeing another specimen ever again thats perfectly acceptable But its just dumb to remove the fact that hes part of a species from the canon Dagon deserves some justice
Toho is like a greedy kid saying that their toy wins all the time and doesn't allow other kids to play with it in any other way. The toy in question being godzilla. It's lame.
It's funny because the MonsterVerse movies was what put Godzilla back on the map in the first place. After Final Wars, the franchise lost its relevancy for nearly a decade until Legendary got its hands on the rights to make another remake of the original. If it wasn't for them, classics like Shin Godzilla and Godzilla Minus One wouldn't even have existed in the first place
That’s it. I officially hate TOHO now. They ruined the lore. All of this time I was just hoping that in a future monsterverse installment, we will see the Gman interact with another Godzilla survivor(possibly female). But, looks like that dream is out of the window. TOHO being as selfish as they are, decided to make Legendary Godzilla familyless, friendless and loveless. I will this ONE DAMN TIME: I am never gonna watch any new future monsterverse installments until TOHO behaves themselves because THIS IS BULLSHIT.
They could change it that Godzilla isn’t a species, but came from species and was mutated into being Godzilla. He swallowed a star and was nuke , which mutated him into Godzilla , this way they could still actually have the war between what Godzilla previously was and the Kong species.
nah man like i respect toho but if they keep doing this to MV Godzilla, i ain’t gonna be happy, i mean a lot of us are here for Titans lore and the fact that godzilla has his own species makes him so unique, and we haven’t even got to know how godzilla became the last of his kind yet, plus doing this just like saying nah a large portion of the lore doesn’t exist lmao. Please just stop messing with Mv Godzilla man.
Why is toho being so bad these days ? 1-taking down roblox godzilla games 2-adding more godzilla rules 3-changing the monstervers lore Whats wrong with toho ?
This wouldn’t have bothered me if it was a Toho at the beginning of the monsterverse. The fact also that there always has to be a Godzilla, like the son or kids, implies that Godzilla reproduces and can have multiple offspring - which is fundamentally different than Mothra’s reincarnation loop. The lore for reproduction and a species already exists in the Toho. I get they are worried with the popularity of the Monsterverse, the original origin story of Godzilla may be forgotten. But that also seems silly. This isn’t the first nor last nor only Godzilla.
Man I gotta say Toho is starting to piss me off they stop thing that make godzilla better especially in the US and are probably the reason we can't get a proper godzilla game
the worst thing is that Toho also wastes the Godzilla they made. GMK sequel? NO Kyriu 3? NO Shin 2? NO Minus 2? Maybe SP 2? NO In the last 25 years he has only made Godzilla reboots and rarely sequels. The only continuity we have with the Monsterverse and they're killing it.
@@Tyranid_Hive_Mind this, this may be fine once in a while, but not over and over again. I hope they actually make a sequel to Minus One, because if they change their mind and do another reboot it would be absurd.
Toho really needs to release their stranglehold on stuff and just let Legendary do this mythos. Because it kind of makes them look like a bunch of uptight, stick in the muds.
Sadly that will probably never happen, Japanese companies are infamously extremely restrictive and controlling of their IP. If anything they might just force legendary to scrap their original lore entirely
1) Toho want only 1 Godzilla because i guess they think that they would just replace Godzilla with other invidual and use it for free 2) we already have established war between Gojira and Kong SPECIES 3) like Minilla/Minya, Godzilla filius, Dagon and Godzilla jr doesnt exist already Somebody should stand up to Toho
Standing up to toho could very easily result Toho taking away the rights to Godzilla from legendary. I do agree that some should give some resistance but outright confronting them is a bad idea.
@@jag_rex2412 i didnt meant resistance like confronting them But stand your ground with your story ideas, try win them over, make compromises Godzilla is supposed to be tragic being, whats more tragic than being last of your whole species Especially if Kongs killed your species, another reason to be so rough on Kong for Godzilla
"There can only be one Godzilla". What about SpaceGodzilla? Or Godzilla Jr? Or Minila? The Kiryu saga had two Goji's. So TOHO has broke their rules more than once.
Not to mention that the 1954 Godzilla came from an entire community of Godzillas before the Nuke killed them all, which is the whole reason why he was so angry with humanity
I’m fine with Godzilla being a singular entity but give him a species cause like how does it hurt the brand name if there are more than one of creature like him within a universe?
Well Godzilla is supposed to be this unique force that we can’t understand. I think having this rule is a good way to show that. But it makes me mad that they inforced this rule on a universe that already set Godzilla up as a species.
Perhaps Legendary can find a loophole around this. Like maybe Godzilla is the only member of his species that survived into modern civilization with plenty of nuclear weapons being made and used. Godzilla would be tracking down and absorbing all of this radiation from nuclear testing sites for the past 20+ years in order to replenish the energy he lost during hibernation. And because of all of this radiation he’s been absorbing in such a short amount of time, he starts slowly mutating, eventually becoming a completely different species of kaiju all together (similar to Godzilla in 1954). Not only would this allow Godzilla to have stories about his ancient brothers, sisters, and cousins without them technically being members of his species, it would also give some backstory on how Godzilla was able to evolve so fast from absorbing Tiamat’s radiation.
I get that Toho wants to prevent Godzilla from being wrecked by incompitant hacks like with Star Trek and Star Wars, not to mention something like Zilla '98 from happening a second time. But I can't help but believe if Toho is playing things TOO safe for its own good.
I honestly believe that the reason Toho wants to get rid of the Godzilla as a species concept, is because there may be concern about what makes Godzilla unique and what makes him stand out, being taken away. Consider this perspective, if you have multiple individuals of the same being or a species, then the main member of that species that has been at the forefront of almost every story told in the Monsterverse thus far, is reduced to just another member of that species and as a result, the focus could be taken away from him and in Toho's mind, this may reduce his value and or significance. On the other hand, having Godzilla be a solitary, sole, single member of his kind removes a greater likelihood of that happening and focus is shifted on him and only him as far as his particular kind of Titan is concerned, greatly increasing his uniqueness, significance and overall value, at least again, this may be what Toho is thinking IMO, if them removing the Godzilla species concept is proven to be true.
Ok that may be so but consider this. Throughout all of human history you can pick out members of our species through their deeds without reducing them to just a member of xyz species. Take Alexander the great, Leonidas, Napoleon, Charlamayne, Attila the hun, Ghangis Khan to name a few. They all stand out by their deeds and that makes them wholly unquie. For all we know they could make godzilla the oldest of his species and yet he stilled outlived everyone else. Maybe he was the only one of his kind that stood a chance against Ghidorah when everyone else was being slaughtered. There's many ways to make him unique instead of the default nothing else is like him therefore he by right of existing. Toho is doing what all companies are doing in this age. They are sticking to what they know, picking the safe well travel routes, and very rarely taking risks. In a sense it's like how Bethesda released skyrim like 10 different times then release fallout 76 and went back to releasing skyrim cuz of how hard it bombed on launch. Or how Call of duty is the same every year.
@@thedarkrider987 @thedarkrider987 You make a good point and I agree 100%. I also agree with your reasoning as to why Toho removed the Godzilla species concept from the franchise, and a realization occured to me and it was that my suggestion fits perfectly within your reasoning. You stated that they are simply taking the safe route, sticking to what they know and not taking any risks etc, and what is more non-risk and a safe way to protect an I.P. than excluding all other related entities (Godzilla Species) that can be a possible distraction from it?
Let's remember, the same thing with these restrictions has happened before to another franchise that originated in Japan: Sonic the Hedgehog. Specifically, the one that really pissed a lot of people off was how Shadow's character has been semi-retconned to being like Cell Saga Vegeta (thankfully, it's being fixed with this "Year of Shadow" thing going). This isn't fully Legendary's fault. It's Toho being extremely overprotective with their precious I.P., as well as the expensive asking prices to use him and other Toho kaiju. At some point, there gonna have to realize that continuing with restrictions and semi-retcons like this are only going to hurt them financially down the line and alienate the audience they're catering to. But I doubt they'll care unless something changes. The next Monsterverse film is less than 3 years from now, so a lot can change in that time.
5:50 aside from it being less imaginative, it's also very difficult to believe even the mighty Godzilla could handle an entire species of Kong's😂 I mean you have about 5 of them all with those axes, jumping around the place, and that should do it. Idk how many of his species we see in GXK but I have to imagine back then there were quite a bit more, even if it's just 50, I do not see Goji walking out😂
These kinds of retcons made for no reason is ruining my investment. 2014 is still tied as my favorite incarnation of Godzilla (tied with minus one. Absolutely incredible). And with each passing film he looses more and more of what made him unique from that film. It sucks. He used to be the “old samurai called to duty one more time” now’s he’s just an angry lizard and other monsters doing anything he doesn’t like. It’s sad to watch it fall so much. Like Star Wars or marvel or many other cinematic giants that have fallen from grace. It’s a real feels bad.
my personal head canon that also works within Toho's rules. Godzilla is a break away from his base species. He swallowed the star. He developed the ability to project radiation and grow. I feel like the ancestors to Godzilla were all walking nukes. no way to properly shape or mold the radiation. That still allows the MUTO's to exist as a species that had a parasitic relationship to them. This also gives rise to a reason for the war. You cant have a species of walking atom bombs just wasting large swaths of land at every inconvenience. In order to create balance they needed to be culled. Godzilla then arose from that conflict as a greater entity that then eliminated BOTH sides. "The Star" perhaps referring to a food source. Some object that allowed the base specifies to grow and thrive. Godzilla then consumed this and integrated it becoming something more. Strong enough to end the conflict but having consumed the primary food of his brethren they died off leaving just him and Dagon until finally Dagon succumbed to an adapted species (MUTO) that was able to fell him. What do y 'all think?
Well I can understand why Toho did what they did. The reason was with the success of Godzilla minus one. And the possibility of a sequel to the film. They want it to be in no relation to the legendary version of Godzilla. To say that Godzilla is a species will put both Godzillas in relation to each other. And that would cause some confusion. Plus there would be a demand from Godzilla fans for these two versions of Godzilla to confront each other which would be a fantastic story but Toho is pretty much a primary a domestic company. That is it is japanese and doesn't have an international production team that will work internationally. Like they had once did with the legendary 1980 version of Shogun which I understand it wasn't received well by the Japanese public. I also think Toho is more so worried that the legendary monsterverse franchise would outshine their version of Godzilla. But it also boils down to this: The Japanese are good people. But they are very protective of their culture. And Godzilla is part of their culture. In other words they want to keep it Japanese. Doesn't matter how much money they get from the monsterverse franchise. They don't want their Godzilla to be identified with the monsterverse Godzilla. Which is sad. To me everything is related. And it was Shinto a very japanese spiritual path and religion that taught me that. Apparently some Japanese don't practice Shinto. Sorry for being blunt. It would be fantastic to see both Godzillas confront each other. Doesn't have to be the end of one or the other. They could have faced a greater threat. Both would of come on top and go their separate ways. Hear me Toho please give it a shot. 👍
You are not alone, my friend; from one Jacob to another. Have they lost their minds?! As a Fellow Godzilla fan, I find this… Unacceptable!!! I also found the multiple origin stories of Godzilla junior to be quite fascinating. It was like one greater generation of the G-man, after another. With constant and newly greater rivals, threatening him to keep evolving and grow; one Godzilla individual after another.
my favorite godzilla movie was the 2014. 1st Godzilla movie, titled "Godzilla". The feel of that movie, the detail, the way they filmed him to seem enormous and more accurately slower. Everything about that film completely outclasses the last 3 or 4 other movies America has made. I did like SHIN Godzilla and the most recent G movie made by toho. also But americas recent versions of Godzilla movies feel like brainless energy drinks.
I think what Toho did in the Heisei series can somewhat patch things up here; establish that Godzillasaurus was an existing dinosaur species, but Godzilla himself - and I suppose Dagon too - were the unique members of that species that mutated from changes in radiation over time. At least that's how I would write it.
Easy. Legendary licensed Godzilla from Toho. Who created him as a sole survivor from the atomic bomb after it killed his family & mutating him. The key here is sole surviving atomic mutation. A direct link to his atomic metaphor roots. That being said, Toho has broken their own 'rules' on Many occasions.
So what, did Godzilla just pop into existence or something? And how would they explain the war between Kong’s species and Godzilla’s species? This dumb rule makes no sense whatsoever. By putting it in place, it entirely screw’s up most of the Monsterverse’s established canon.
@@crownedintitanfire or we ignore it tell legendary to ignore it if toho tries anything us fans say they have no power and they then try bringing legendary to court and we tell legendary don't go cause toho has no control over America amd the governments will just ignore it completely and toho will just have to cry like the babies they are it's called boycott toho only watch legendary
@@SomethingZilla42 I am a legendary godzilla fan not a toho godzilla fan also I'm going to mute you because your getting annoying and starting an argument with someone who is saying there own opinion which last I checked isn't a crime and also this isn't X
Kong found more members of his kind so Godzilla should have at least 2 or 5 members of his kind alive somewhere on Earth or in the Hollow Earth. I wish we see that in a future Monsterverse movie. My fanfiction includes Godzilla and Doug as cousins.
Does anyone else think that our Godzilla is Godzilla Jr spiritually since Dagon was first and died and we get Godzilla for everything else? I've been having this thiught since 2020 and so much more with the species debate and Godzilla Jr. being introduced rumors. So, just thought i ask if anyone else thought about this before too or if it's just me?
If Toho didn't want Godzilla to have a species, they should've established that guideline a decade ago. I suspect they're feeling threatened by Legendary's success and may or may not be trying a little sabotage.
@@deanastephensosborne5604 I knew someone would say that eventually. Only fake Godzilla fans want Toho to hand over the rights permanently. Cmon man, TOHO LITERATELY MADE GODZILLA!! They gave us the best Godzilla movies we could ever have. Don’t judge a company for one stupid decision. A true Godzilla fan respects Toho, but still points out their flaws.
If it’s true, it's truly disappointing from Toho. I mean Legendary is the one who brought back Godzilla & made people interested in him once again after Toho shut down the Godzilla project in 2004, they are the one made Toho invest in Godzilla once again, and now they are forcing Legendary to not to develop Godzilla as a proper character only because they own the right, really disappointing, I grow up watching Godzilla as a cartoon character, I was really happy to see The Big G finally making a Comeback in 2014, I just don’t want to lose interest on my favourite fictional character.
It's a wasted opportunity and killed off so many storytelling potential To think that a member of Godzilla species ate a magical star and having a wing is sick af. I was dissapointed that it was our Godzilla and the wing is just Iwi's metaphore for his thermonuclear
I’m actually with Toho on this. Godzilla being part of a species doesn’t really inflict the “He’s this mutated creature that we cannot understand “ vibe. And there is an easy loophole to avoid recons. Simply have Godzilla be part of a species, but Godzilla was the only one who “ate a star” and evolved into an all new species. “What about the axes?” You may be asking. Easy, Godzilla lost his dorsal spines in the war, and overtime he regenerated them, and the dorsal plates he lost in the war were turned into the axes.
@@Man_Aslume then this version of Godzilla is a completely different character. Yeah I said it, if the mutated element doesn’t apply, then this version is very close to being a fake Godzilla.
@@blacksun6245 well, Godzilla’s character is that he is this god like mutated beast born from nuclear radiation. Him having a species doesn’t really show that.
I get where Toho is coming from,but I am too not sitting well with this new strict policy,it was such a new and unique take on the character letting him have a proper species to be part of. At the very least,take that decision earlier Toho,not after a comic has a literal other specimen in Dagon and GvK introducing the war between two,full-on species,with tangible proof in Hollow Earth with the fossils and the axes
i kind of like there could be only one godzilla. Just like Yoda in star wars. there is a mystery in godzilla's past that one can do anything if the story fits. And I like that he is still single and not a family person like the Kong species, but more of a samurai warrior. if anything, I would like a story about mothra and godzilla on how the alliance came to be, also the twin priestesses.
Indeed, I find dumb tthat Toho is trying to keep Godzilla as unique character for Monsterverse, specially when they already presented other members of his species in previous films like Minilla and Junior. This doesn't fully imply the previous work would be cut, but won't allow to develope that part of the lore, forcing Legendary to focus on their current version of Godzilla and nothing more beyond that. I feel Toho thinks if an external studio gets the freedom to work with Godzilla as species maybe they Will create a rip-off character for their own or simply they want to control EVERYTHING over the topic
So Dagon isn't Godzilla? I call bs. This retcon makes no sense whatsoever. If Godzilla doesn't have a species, then how did he come into existence in the first place? Doug proves that this change is stupid since he's a confirmed relative of Godzilla. It makes no sense.
Now how are they gonna explain manilla or Jr existence? Or the axe or Dagon bones? Such a dumb move from toho since they already established that godzilla already had a species before. 1:25 well godzilla never eaten anyone and never attacked a certain person. He sees humanity in general as a problem depending on the circumstances. 1:31 godzilla doesn't have to die for his offspring to take the mantle as king remember the showa era and final wars
I have a fury that since Godzilla is the monster who ate a star, I think that the other Godzilla atomic breath doesn’t last forever like Godzilla and they have to recharge it by the hollow earth energy but anyways, this is just a fury, but I think it’s Canon I can’t be the only one that thinks this and if you didn’t think this, this might change your mind
"Animals like Godzilla" Yeah, we already have a word for that, even you, Toho. "Godzillasaurus". Doug and the Skull the axe was found in are already theorized by Monarch to be part of the ancient evolutionary tree that lead to producing Godzilla, if Toho wants Godzilla to be one of a kind, they could just say that Dagon and the other Godzillasaurs from the War were simply part of that Evolutionary tree, still his ancestors, Godzilla was just the first and last to be born the peak of it, a once every million centuries thing, The Legendary Super Godzilla. Dagon just came close. Removing his ancestral relation to all who died in the war and got their fins turned into weapons just takes away from the personal involvement and makes us less engaged with his personal reactions through GvK and GxK. And like 10 Dorsal Fin weapons were in the temple if you look close enough, I refuse to believe 1 Godzilla let that happen over 10 times. And it takes away from the fact that The Mutos are evolved to be the living counter weapon to Godzilla.
My head canon was always that even the Titans we see only a single individual of there's more of their kind in The Hollow Earth, with only the strongest of each species being able to survive the surface world...
TOHO doesn't want other Godzilla like creatures because it doesn't want Legendary killing off Godzilla and replacing him with other Godzilla like creatures. This is also why they don't allow Godzilla to be killed off either. Its smart on TOHO's end but it also backs Legendary into a creative corner.
I don't care what the new director of the books has in mind for Godzilla, but him being the last of his kind will always be canon in my heart. It also makes more sense considering his sudden change in behaviour for the previous two films
i believe it makes sense for godzilla to be a one of specimen because most of the other titans seem to be alone without any other members of their species
7:35 well the last two movies have done that,not talk about anything already stablished so i'm sure that unless the new director truly cares for the lore of the monsterverse we'll not hear about it again any time soon
Well, even though Godzilla is the last of his kind (since Dagon & his species are canon but not shown in official CGI appearance, yet), I hope we'll see more of Godzilla's species in a MV prequel movie. And hopefully in the next MV GxK 3rd movie (2027) we'll see Godzilla find a baby (which will better be Minizilla/Gojira Junior) & maybe some of his kind survived. If Toho will not announce a new rule that "Godzilla will an individual", right👍😉🦖🌌
This is actually quite upsetting.. whenever I talk about the Monstersverse lore this is always a highpoint to those I introduce to it. My family and friends were enamored with the idea of seeing more about the ancient Godzilla vs Kong interspecies War. Plus, all the already established lore and story opportunities are just going to be meaningless? That just reminds me of Star Wars Expanded universe being Legends, and even worse how those Michael Bay Transformers movies suffered consistent continuity errors between movies for the characters and story. Retcons, kill offs and story repeats per movie. Really makes a comprehensive story suffer more; Might as well go the lengths of Games Workshop and start retconning things before telling us the fanbase we are the fools for not knowing established lore was never right in the first place. Man we cant have nothing good these days. ( Ref all the great fan animations made for love of an IP/source material, stripped down and away by companies and ego )
Most of the monsters in the toho line are seen as one-off creatures. There's still room for good story telling. Perhaps all of them come from a similar precambrian kaiju and all adapted and mutated to fit their environment. Like mew in the pokemon world
Frankly, I wouldn't take anything Keyes says as official lore. I mean how often has the monsterverse established things in their precious tie-in comics bit not reference them in in the movies? No, I will take his comments/head canons, the events of the comics and the lesser facts or events from the novelizations as beta-canon until they are mentioned or established in the movies or shows. Have they acknowledged in any of the movies or shows after 2014 that: - the EMP nature of the Mutos effected Godzilla's breath? (Novelization of 2014) - did they acknowledge that Godzilla fought Shinomura in any of the MonsterVerse movies? - did acknowledge the fight between Godzilla and Muto-Prime and his size and plates differences? - did any of the movies established that Ghidorah caused the storm around Skull Island to swallow the island or Kong facing Camataz (Kingdom Kong)? - there is even conflicting details between Godzilla Dominion and the title sequence of GvK. Dominion said Godzilla ordered the other titans to hibernate, whereas the GvK said each one was "defeated" by him as if he killed them - which is it? I mean, you can even look at the convoluted 'canon' tie-ins for Star Trek 2009 and Picard. Some of that Canon said B4/Data was captain of the Enterprise-E when Picard retired if I remember right (countdown to 2009) and some that said Worf was named captain of the Enterprise-E when Picard was promoted to Admiral (Picard "official" novels). Hell, even look to the interviews and panels of the recent Voltron series! Fans treated the headcanons of the voice-actors as canon when it they literally had nothing to do with the filmed series. So unless Legendary Studios and Toho collaborate and make an official compendium like the 98 Official Godzilla Compendium, then I recommend not taking any extended lore or what an author says in interviews as official canon
In some versions it makes sense why he is the only one, heisei being a mutated dino, Shin also being mutated, etc. but both the anime (trilogy and singularity) shows two Godzillas (one little and one dead). Toho needs to stop. Our Monsterverse Godzilla is above his other counterparts because it’s stated, he ate a “star” and hence more powerful which makes him a God. Why toho, WHY!
No way! This can't happen! Retconning Godzilla as a member of his species is awful, heartbreaking and we'll never forgive toho for that. Keyes needs to be backed up against toho for undemanding the MV Godzilla as the last living member of his species that was yet official. What do you say Jacob?
Funny thing is that the species itself isn't cut from the entirety of the Monsterverse per se. Just GxK as GvK straight up says that Godzilla's and Kong's had a rivalry that expanded on their respective races. So either Toho is being stingy on purpose or they really weren't paying attention to this lore that's been developing and fully established for 10 years now. Hopefully this retcon is just BS cuz that's what it smells like to me.
Retconning the idea of Godzilla having a species in the MonsterVerse gets me fired up, such a dumb decision if this is indeed true. Tell me how you feel about this?
-Jacob
Cool.
🎉
Bro was so disappointed he went back an hour early to write his comment
Im disappointed on this
Seriously one of the stupidest decisions/ideas I’ve ever heard.
I don’t know what’s gotten into them with all these dumb rules , but I’m not gonna let them hold me back from telling good fanfiction Godzilla stories with these dumb restraints .
I feel like them forgetting about Dagon from the 2014 Godzilla feels like a slap in the face; especially since everything else(Ghidorah, Mothra, the Mutos, Serizawa, Mechagodzilla, etc.) remains intact.
Delving more into Godzilla's past, other Gojiras, how he became the last of his species; all that could tell a much deeper, perhaps even a complex story about Godzilla himself.
Or how it was the Godzilla species that drove the kongs to skull island, how the mutos and gojiras had a war where most of each side was killed exept for our Godzilla and the queen muto who’s still alive.
Yeah
@@WolfmanArt
Yeah!
That’d be an excellent solo Godzilla movie.
Show how he grew up, how the war between the Kongs and Godzillas began, how Godzilla became the last of his kind, and how he became the most powerful of his species.
I can understand godzilla being the last of his kind, but removing the rest of his species from canon is a dumb move!
Agreed. It makes this Godzilla separate and unique from Toho’s Godzilla.
especially when there is dagon's skeleton and a painting with two godzillas
Aye. That’s dumb. Also…if Godzilla is the ONLY thing like him….then riddle me this TOHO: HOW DID HE COME THE BE
Они их вроде не удалили, но запретили впреть упоминать рассу Годзиллы, что все равно тупо и ужасно...
Nah, I love it. I'm tired of all this crap about monsters having societies, and culture, FOH. These monsters are supposed to be unique, singular, animalistic forces of nature.....not these anthropomorphic fucks we have now
Toho: No Godzilla species! He’s unique!
Also Toho: Minilla, Godzilla Junior.
Toho is really killing an important piece of lore in the Monsterverse that makes this Godzilla unique and awesome.
They really need to stop complaining about how Godzilla is being made in the US and just let Legendary Studios cook.
@@Fixtionmaster101 For real Legendary was setting something awesome with teasing the Godzilla Kong Species War with that one flying Godzilla at the center and now it been retcon with only Godzilla fighting an entire ape army by himself and he being the monster that ate a star instead of the flying Godzilla. I do hope Legendary finds a way to change Tohos mind .
@@AldreozPrime Me too. I also hope that we, the fans, can help.
@@Fixtionmaster101 easy way to fix it we ignore it and say toho has no power over us fans cause we will boycott them if they say otherwise and we choose our own canon
@@AldreozPrimeyeah but having godzilla fuck up a whole army on his own is actually kinda tough and eating a star like bro you cant lie
So Godzilla isn't allowed to have a species but can have a son? That just automatically contradicts itself even if you go the route of Parthenogenesis
Exactly!
shame on Toho
Why did you bring up parthenogenesis? Godzilla is pretty obviously a male and wouldn't be able to preform it.
@@robodude145 because that's the way the 1998 Godzilla/Zilla reproduced to make all its offspring, and Godzilla Earth from that subpar anime trilogy had a smaller plant Godzilla clone
@@justinruim5262 Godzilla phillius is sub-species and not the child of godzilla earth, so that doesn't count. And Zilla is female, the guy who designed zilla confirmed it, (roland emmerich is just salty) you can even see her ""equipment"" in some shots. do your research before commenting.
Just because it isnt allowed to be mentioned doesnt mean its been retconned, as far as we know, dagon is still canon, it just means toho doesnt want attention called to it
this comment makes more sense then the entire video
What about the skull that have kong axe to it that is a mega gojira and Doug is also part of Godzilla genus
Yeah
It's RETCONNED
@@申月営無営月無営有申can't RETCONNED what's already been shown because none gonna take it as such
my head canon was that dagon was godzilla's father which is why he hates the muto prime much more than the other two mutos
Same bro
Godzilla and any Titan like him in the MV hate everything that challenge them.
I find it funny how toho tries to enforce these rules but constantly has broken them themselfs, like GmK goji was activily hunting humans for fun and giggles, Zilla was seen eating, gojira 1954 was killed off, Gojira 2000 was also killed off from what I know atleast the black hole swallowed him whole.
He escaped from the black hole, so he wasn't killed off, but rather, he was temporarily halted.
I think they mean hunting for food, well Zilla is not Godzilla except you mean the 1998 movie toho didnt make this one maybe one of the things they get the rights so fast back, 1954 was the first movie ther it was not even a franchise and in 2000 with the black hole so you mean Godzilla X Megaguirus there is a post credit scene where Gofzilla survived you cant see it but you can hear it and the shock reaction from a character, in the beginning the movie they say something about earthquakes there is a theroy that godzilla after he got in the black hole he spawns under earths surface in the past. I liked that lore with a Godzilla species in the Monsterverse and in toho movie there a the Godzillasaurus species in heisei universe and showa has 2 godzillas
Yeah and Godzilla was also created from the inspiration of the 1953 american dinosaur movie "The Beast from 20'000 Fathoms" (Japan took inspiration from the Redhosaurus from that movie) and they also used King Kong 1933 as a source of inspiration as well...
The Japanese charatcher "Godzilla" would not exist without those two american movies, so Toho can be angry all they want after Legendary is just giving fame and success to their beloved charatcher always winning, 2014 was an appreciated rebirth Japan loved and praised may i remember u all...
@@ZillaSteve there was a comic panel of Godzilla eating a whale from rulers of the earth comic.
@@spider2598 you mean trie it or it look like so. The whale escaped i think... that there where godzilla see gaira and sanda and fight them right?
I don’t like this retcon. Godzilla belonging to a species of Godzilla makes Legendary’s version of the character different from Toho’s. You can easily compare the two and notice differences in their origins. Toho Godzilla is a mutation, while Legendary’s version is a natural animal. Legendary’s Godzilla is not a mutation but is still faithful to the Toho version: Prehistoric and connected to radiation. Not every Godzilla has to be a mutation. I know that’s a staple for the character, but I always thought MV Godzilla was still Godzilla without being a mutant creature. You can change things up a little bit, but it still has to look and feel like the original without copying it. Besides we have several Godzilla’s that are mutants, so it was nice for something new. Legendary needs to stop retconning their own established lore for the Monsterverse.
Toho forced Legendary to retcon.
@@destroyerzilla7634 Yeah, I know.
I'd say the only time I saw a mutated Godzilla was Heisei, shin, minus one and 1998, any other was just an actual legendary beast that woke up and the other just a ghost or an actual god like being but yeah agreed wholeheartedly
Shame that toho forced a retcon of godzilla having a multiple of species now I know toho has been under a lot of scrutiny but if this turns out to be true then it retcon's dagon and even Doug possible being related to the g-man.
A wasted opportunity
The Potential thrown down the hollow earth drain ):
Disney knows all about that.
Is.. is that why they tried to give Kong a new weapon instead of the Axe? Because it's literally the dorsal plate of another Godzilla..
Just wait till the next movie where Toho says the dorsal plate from that axe belongs to THE Godzilla.
@@GhostRose6500this why Toho sucks wtf is wrong with them? Scared that the American Godzilla would be better than there’s is what it probably is.🤦♂️
And it’s hilarious because after the success of Minus One Toho producers and executives were complimenting on the versatility of Godzilla as a cinematic character and how he can tell many stories. But the higher ups are now saying Legendary can’t make a story about Godzilla being only a member of a whole race? Even if Godzilla DID have parents or siblings and he DIDN’T care about them that would’ve been much better than him being one of a kind.
@legittragiiczz5940 They fail to realize that the MonsterVerse is what SAVED the Godzilla franchise. If it wasn’t for 2014, Godzilla’s final movie would’ve been Final Wars. Toho should be thankful for that and ease their guidelines for Legendary. Nowadays, more people associate Godzilla as a whole with Legendary’s Godzilla.
@@WhyDoesItMatter-qu2qy Chances are, when Godzilla enters the public domain, it will be Legendary that'll take first dibs with the new creative freedom.
It’s a missed opportunity how the movies haven’t delved into how Godzilla is literally the last of his kind…Meanwhile Kong found his kind, Godzilla is alone and I think it’d make for a good story to explore how being alone effects him…He’s not a big dumb lizard he has so much more personality than people give him credit for.
You answer yourself why the whole monsterverse has become focused on Kong.
Because Legendary's hands are tied with Godzilla, they can't do anything without the permission of those directly involved.
Unlike kong tho
Godzilla had plenty of time get over his dpecies death
Even then
There was nothing really that suggested that the gojira species were social with each other outside of wars
I agree with you. Godzilla deserves better in the Monsterverse, so do the other titans. Kong is the only one who is properly fleshed out because he’s more accessible than Godzilla and his costars like Mothra, Rodan, Ghidorah & Mecha-G. Legendary has to pay a toll in order for them to use any of them. I get their Toho’s property but I find that Toho is so stingy when allowing them the rights to use their characters.
Yeah
That's the thing, they don't even want Legendary to ADDRESS Godzilla's species, in ANY way. So we won't get explanation or anything. It really defeats the purpose of the Titans being natural animals.
All I can say is Toho pretty much ruined everything I ever learned about Godzilla’s history in this canon.
I know Godzilla is their most important character, but the fact that they suddenly did this just seems like a straight up slap in the face due to all that lore basically being swept under the rug because of Toho’s strict guidelines.
Well cuz they are terrified of a 1998 Situation all over again and how that ruined Godzilla reputation in the west at the time.
the film 98 created the popularity in the West towards Godzilla, without that film there would be 70% fewer fans.
Toho can criticize the film and the creature, but they cannot deny the commercial and cultural impact in the West thanks to that film... what Toho is doing with these rules is killing the potential of the Monsterverse.@@somedudewhodraws9377
@@somedudewhodraws9377 without the '98 film there would be 70% fewer fans in the West.
Many fans today started from that film.
@@destroyerzilla7634 That Movie is the reason I'm a Fan seeing Godzilla have Zilla his Son and then Zilla gain his Animated Series that made me a Fan no matter how much people hate it
They're just pissed because america made a better godzilla movie
Greg Keyes confirmed that to me over two years ago on Messenger. This isn’t anything new.
He explained to me that despite it being hinted that Godzilla had a species, that he’s a “unique” individual and that the others (like Dagon) are stated as “Godzilla like creatures”, which with Dagon, even the Aftershock novel stated multiple times that Dagon was a “Godzilla like creature” and that Godzilla’s life cycle is a mystery and it’s up in the air on it Dagon was an ancestor.
Even the 2014 film showed Serizawa said that “we found a fossil of a giant animal in the Philippines, like Godzilla”, so not directly stated to be “a Godzilla”.
Also, same could be applied to Kong. His species is called the “great apes” and Kong himself is “Titanus Kong”.
Fair enough 👌
This comment needs a pin.
So im fine with Goji being the last of his kind and not seeing another specimen ever again thats perfectly acceptable
But its just dumb to remove the fact that hes part of a species from the canon
Dagon deserves some justice
And people wonder why kong is more focused on because they can do whatever they want with him
Toho is like a greedy kid saying that their toy wins all the time and doesn't allow other kids to play with it in any other way. The toy in question being godzilla. It's lame.
We could just boycott them see how toho likes it when the American market stops caring for them
It's funny because the MonsterVerse movies was what put Godzilla back on the map in the first place. After Final Wars, the franchise lost its relevancy for nearly a decade until Legendary got its hands on the rights to make another remake of the original. If it wasn't for them, classics like Shin Godzilla and Godzilla Minus One wouldn't even have existed in the first place
I mean Toho is just trying to make the Godzilla character more consistent. But the recon is pretty stupid.
That’s it. I officially hate TOHO now. They ruined the lore. All of this time I was just hoping that in a future monsterverse installment, we will see the Gman interact with another Godzilla survivor(possibly female). But, looks like that dream is out of the window. TOHO being as selfish as they are, decided to make Legendary Godzilla familyless, friendless and loveless. I will this ONE DAMN TIME: I am never gonna watch any new future monsterverse installments until TOHO behaves themselves because THIS IS BULLSHIT.
Here's a thought... don't buy Toho's merchandise.
Seriously
I agree with you bro this is so stupid I was hoping to see more of the Gman spices
They could change it that Godzilla isn’t a species, but came from species and was mutated into being Godzilla. He swallowed a star and was nuke , which mutated him into Godzilla , this way they could still actually have the war between what Godzilla previously was and the Kong species.
Yeah that would stay true to Godzilla’s original 1954 origin story
Thats's... perfect for the lore
This is perfect, a good way of respecting Toho and their rules, while not breaking continuity
This is actually how I always saw it. Lol.
@@Mr.SteelinKeepIt lol, me too
I hope the rumor that Godzilla is being retconned to being the only one of his kind to have existed is just a rumor
nah man like i respect toho but if they keep doing this to MV Godzilla, i ain’t gonna be happy, i mean a lot of us are here for Titans lore and the fact that godzilla has his own species makes him so unique, and we haven’t even got to know how godzilla became the last of his kind yet, plus doing this just like saying nah a large portion of the lore doesn’t exist lmao. Please just stop messing with Mv Godzilla man.
I know! I mean I do like Toho’s rules, but sometimes they just gotta let legendary cook.
Why is toho being so bad these days ?
1-taking down roblox godzilla games
2-adding more godzilla rules
3-changing the monstervers lore
Whats wrong with toho ?
Guess we have to occupy again.
So is dagon... not real? We didn't see his skeleton of him in g14?
This wouldn’t have bothered me if it was a Toho at the beginning of the monsterverse. The fact also that there always has to be a Godzilla, like the son or kids, implies that Godzilla reproduces and can have multiple offspring - which is fundamentally different than Mothra’s reincarnation loop. The lore for reproduction and a species already exists in the Toho. I get they are worried with the popularity of the Monsterverse, the original origin story of Godzilla may be forgotten. But that also seems silly. This isn’t the first nor last nor only Godzilla.
Man I gotta say Toho is starting to piss me off they stop thing that make godzilla better especially in the US and are probably the reason we can't get a proper godzilla game
the worst thing is that Toho also wastes the Godzilla they made.
GMK sequel? NO
Kyriu 3? NO
Shin 2? NO
Minus 2? Maybe
SP 2? NO
In the last 25 years he has only made Godzilla reboots and rarely sequels.
The only continuity we have with the Monsterverse and they're killing it.
@@destroyerzilla7634What’s SP?
@@aydenbarrera-smith6316
Singular Point.
@destroyerzilla7634 all they're doing is basically a rehash of 1954 with a different coat of paint
@@Tyranid_Hive_Mind this, this may be fine once in a while, but not over and over again.
I hope they actually make a sequel to Minus One, because if they change their mind and do another reboot it would be absurd.
Toho really needs to release their stranglehold on stuff and just let Legendary do this mythos. Because it kind of makes them look like a bunch of uptight, stick in the muds.
Sadly that will probably never happen, Japanese companies are infamously extremely restrictive and controlling of their IP. If anything they might just force legendary to scrap their original lore entirely
@@godzilla9568 Well goodbye MonsterVerse and that trainload of money that it gave them.
@@Ezilla82 they probably wouldn't care, Japanese companies love money but they love controlling their property more
@@godzilla9568 A bunch of stubborn, uptight sticks in the mud or (insert cuss words here).
1) Toho want only 1 Godzilla because i guess they think that they would just replace Godzilla with other invidual and use it for free
2) we already have established war between Gojira and Kong SPECIES
3) like Minilla/Minya, Godzilla filius, Dagon and Godzilla jr doesnt exist already
Somebody should stand up to Toho
Standing up to toho could very easily result Toho taking away the rights to Godzilla from legendary.
I do agree that some should give some resistance but outright confronting them is a bad idea.
@@jag_rex2412 i didnt meant resistance like confronting them
But stand your ground with your story ideas, try win them over, make compromises
Godzilla is supposed to be tragic being, whats more tragic than being last of your whole species
Especially if Kongs killed your species, another reason to be so rough on Kong for Godzilla
@@jag_rex2412the only way to do that is to hurt the Company's financial statements 😂.
@@roguetheoutlander8800or mutos killing Godzilla’s species.
"There can only be one Godzilla". What about SpaceGodzilla? Or Godzilla Jr? Or Minila? The Kiryu saga had two Goji's. So TOHO has broke their rules more than once.
"Rules for thee, not for me"
-toho
Remember
Toho kept nerfing the oxygen destroyer from wiping out godzilla, to just being a mild nuisance or making skelezilla in a mech suit
Not to mention that the 1954 Godzilla came from an entire community of Godzillas before the Nuke killed them all, which is the whole reason why he was so angry with humanity
I wish we've gotten a monsterverse movie on Dagon.
Nah we should of gotten a movie or a tv series about the great titan war
@@gyasiblackman124 Right!!!
I’m fine with Godzilla being a singular entity but give him a species cause like how does it hurt the brand name if there are more than one of creature like him within a universe?
And aren’t 54goji and kiryugoji in the same universe? Wasn’t it his skeleton that kiryu was built around? lol
Well Godzilla is supposed to be this unique force that we can’t understand. I think having this rule is a good way to show that. But it makes me mad that they inforced this rule on a universe that already set Godzilla up as a species.
Perhaps Legendary can find a loophole around this. Like maybe Godzilla is the only member of his species that survived into modern civilization with plenty of nuclear weapons being made and used. Godzilla would be tracking down and absorbing all of this radiation from nuclear testing sites for the past 20+ years in order to replenish the energy he lost during hibernation. And because of all of this radiation he’s been absorbing in such a short amount of time, he starts slowly mutating, eventually becoming a completely different species of kaiju all together (similar to Godzilla in 1954). Not only would this allow Godzilla to have stories about his ancient brothers, sisters, and cousins without them technically being members of his species, it would also give some backstory on how Godzilla was able to evolve so fast from absorbing Tiamat’s radiation.
Gotta love these Videos man. Thanks again lol, just love these Godzilla and Jurassic videos!
I'm gonna be less nice and say this to Toho. You got your classic Godzilla with Minus One. Let us have this take on the character and just piss off
I get that Toho wants to prevent Godzilla from being wrecked by incompitant hacks like with Star Trek and Star Wars, not to mention something like Zilla '98 from happening a second time. But I can't help but believe if Toho is playing things TOO safe for its own good.
I honestly believe that the reason Toho wants to get rid of the Godzilla as a species concept, is because there may be concern about what makes Godzilla unique and what makes him stand out, being taken away. Consider this perspective, if you have multiple individuals of the same being or a species, then the main member of that species that has been at the forefront of almost every story told in the Monsterverse thus far, is reduced to just another member of that species and as a result, the focus could be taken away from him and in Toho's mind, this may reduce his value and or significance. On the other hand, having Godzilla be a solitary, sole, single member of his kind removes a greater likelihood of that happening and focus is shifted on him and only him as far as his particular kind of Titan is concerned, greatly increasing his uniqueness, significance and overall value, at least again, this may be what Toho is thinking IMO, if them removing the Godzilla species concept is proven to be true.
It's probably PTSD about the bombs.
Ok that may be so but consider this. Throughout all of human history you can pick out members of our species through their deeds without reducing them to just a member of xyz species. Take Alexander the great, Leonidas, Napoleon, Charlamayne, Attila the hun, Ghangis Khan to name a few. They all stand out by their deeds and that makes them wholly unquie. For all we know they could make godzilla the oldest of his species and yet he stilled outlived everyone else. Maybe he was the only one of his kind that stood a chance against Ghidorah when everyone else was being slaughtered. There's many ways to make him unique instead of the default nothing else is like him therefore he by right of existing. Toho is doing what all companies are doing in this age. They are sticking to what they know, picking the safe well travel routes, and very rarely taking risks. In a sense it's like how Bethesda released skyrim like 10 different times then release fallout 76 and went back to releasing skyrim cuz of how hard it bombed on launch. Or how Call of duty is the same every year.
@@thedarkrider987 @thedarkrider987 You make a good point and I agree 100%. I also agree with your reasoning as to why Toho removed the Godzilla species concept from the franchise, and a realization occured to me and it was that my suggestion fits perfectly within your reasoning. You stated that they are simply taking the safe route, sticking to what they know and not taking any risks etc, and what is more non-risk and a safe way to protect an I.P. than excluding all other related entities (Godzilla Species) that can be a possible distraction from it?
Let's remember, the same thing with these restrictions has happened before to another franchise that originated in Japan: Sonic the Hedgehog. Specifically, the one that really pissed a lot of people off was how Shadow's character has been semi-retconned to being like Cell Saga Vegeta (thankfully, it's being fixed with this "Year of Shadow" thing going). This isn't fully Legendary's fault. It's Toho being extremely overprotective with their precious I.P., as well as the expensive asking prices to use him and other Toho kaiju. At some point, there gonna have to realize that continuing with restrictions and semi-retcons like this are only going to hurt them financially down the line and alienate the audience they're catering to. But I doubt they'll care unless something changes. The next Monsterverse film is less than 3 years from now, so a lot can change in that time.
5:50 aside from it being less imaginative, it's also very difficult to believe even the mighty Godzilla could handle an entire species of Kong's😂 I mean you have about 5 of them all with those axes, jumping around the place, and that should do it. Idk how many of his species we see in GXK but I have to imagine back then there were quite a bit more, even if it's just 50, I do not see Goji walking out😂
These kinds of retcons made for no reason is ruining my investment. 2014 is still tied as my favorite incarnation of Godzilla (tied with minus one. Absolutely incredible). And with each passing film he looses more and more of what made him unique from that film. It sucks. He used to be the “old samurai called to duty one more time” now’s he’s just an angry lizard and other monsters doing anything he doesn’t like. It’s sad to watch it fall so much. Like Star Wars or marvel or many other cinematic giants that have fallen from grace. It’s a real feels bad.
my personal head canon that also works within Toho's rules. Godzilla is a break away from his base species. He swallowed the star. He developed the ability to project radiation and grow. I feel like the ancestors to Godzilla were all walking nukes. no way to properly shape or mold the radiation. That still allows the MUTO's to exist as a species that had a parasitic relationship to them. This also gives rise to a reason for the war. You cant have a species of walking atom bombs just wasting large swaths of land at every inconvenience. In order to create balance they needed to be culled. Godzilla then arose from that conflict as a greater entity that then eliminated BOTH sides. "The Star" perhaps referring to a food source. Some object that allowed the base specifies to grow and thrive. Godzilla then consumed this and integrated it becoming something more. Strong enough to end the conflict but having consumed the primary food of his brethren they died off leaving just him and Dagon until finally Dagon succumbed to an adapted species (MUTO) that was able to fell him.
What do y 'all think?
Man I’d love to see multiple Godzillas on screen. They better showcase them in the next film. Screw Toho!
Friggin' Toho mandates lol
So "the war" was just between Godzilla and ALL the Kongs?
Playing fast and loose with continuity is a recipe for disaster.
Well I can understand why Toho did what they did. The reason was with the success of Godzilla minus one. And the possibility of a sequel to the film. They want it to be in no relation to the legendary version of Godzilla. To say that Godzilla is a species will put both Godzillas in relation to each other. And that would cause some confusion. Plus there would be a demand from Godzilla fans for these two versions of Godzilla to confront each other which would be a fantastic story but Toho is pretty much a primary a domestic company. That is it is japanese and doesn't have an international production team that will work internationally. Like they had once did with the legendary 1980 version of Shogun which I understand it wasn't received well by the Japanese public.
I also think Toho is more so worried that the legendary monsterverse franchise would outshine their version of Godzilla. But it also boils down to this: The Japanese are good people. But they are very protective of their culture. And Godzilla is part of their culture. In other words they want to keep it Japanese. Doesn't matter how much money they get from the monsterverse franchise. They don't want their Godzilla to be identified with the monsterverse Godzilla. Which is sad. To me everything is related. And it was Shinto a very japanese spiritual path and religion that taught me that. Apparently some Japanese don't practice Shinto. Sorry for being blunt. It would be fantastic to see both Godzillas confront each other. Doesn't have to be the end of one or the other. They could have faced a greater threat. Both would of come on top and go their separate ways. Hear me Toho please give it a shot. 👍
You should make a video about what happened to the skullcrawlers that apex caught after gvk
You are not alone, my friend; from one Jacob to another. Have they lost their minds?! As a Fellow Godzilla fan, I find this… Unacceptable!!! I also found the multiple origin stories of Godzilla junior to be quite fascinating. It was like one greater generation of the G-man, after another. With constant and newly greater rivals, threatening him to keep evolving and grow; one Godzilla individual after another.
my favorite godzilla movie was the 2014. 1st Godzilla movie, titled "Godzilla". The feel of that movie, the detail, the way they filmed him to seem enormous and more accurately slower. Everything about that film completely outclasses the last 3 or 4 other movies America has made. I did like SHIN Godzilla and the most recent G movie made by toho. also But americas recent versions of Godzilla movies feel like brainless energy drinks.
Now that I know TOHO THEMSELVES stated Godzilla IS a species in one of their official hand books, this makes this situation a lot weirder.
I think what Toho did in the Heisei series can somewhat patch things up here; establish that Godzillasaurus was an existing dinosaur species, but Godzilla himself - and I suppose Dagon too - were the unique members of that species that mutated from changes in radiation over time. At least that's how I would write it.
With Godzilla being the only one in the monster verse, it’s hard to imagine the war between Godzilla and the Kong species
Then how kong species got godzilla spines for axe blades?
This is ridiculous who is in charge.? Come on fans! Give them that pressure like we did with Sonic!
Easy. Legendary licensed Godzilla from Toho. Who created him as a sole survivor from the atomic bomb after it killed his family & mutating him. The key here is sole surviving atomic mutation. A direct link to his atomic metaphor roots. That being said, Toho has broken their own 'rules' on Many occasions.
So what, did Godzilla just pop into existence or something?
And how would they explain the war between Kong’s species and Godzilla’s species?
This dumb rule makes no sense whatsoever.
By putting it in place, it entirely screw’s up most of the Monsterverse’s established canon.
Facts like an entire decade’s worth of lore gone just like that.
@@crownedintitanfire or we ignore it tell legendary to ignore it if toho tries anything us fans say they have no power and they then try bringing legendary to court and we tell legendary don't go cause toho has no control over America amd the governments will just ignore it completely and toho will just have to cry like the babies they are it's called boycott toho only watch legendary
@@deanastephensosborne5604geez, you are a fake fan.
@@SomethingZilla42 I am a legendary godzilla fan not a toho godzilla fan also I'm going to mute you because your getting annoying and starting an argument with someone who is saying there own opinion which last I checked isn't a crime and also this isn't X
@@deanastephensosborne5604 a true Godzilla fan likes Toho, a fake Godzilla fan does not like Toho
Kong found more members of his kind so Godzilla should have at least 2 or 5 members of his kind alive somewhere on Earth or in the Hollow Earth. I wish we see that in a future Monsterverse movie. My fanfiction includes Godzilla and Doug as cousins.
Does anyone else think that our Godzilla is Godzilla Jr spiritually since Dagon was first and died and we get Godzilla for everything else? I've been having this thiught since 2020 and so much more with the species debate and Godzilla Jr. being introduced rumors. So, just thought i ask if anyone else thought about this before too or if it's just me?
If Toho didn't want Godzilla to have a species, they should've established that guideline a decade ago. I suspect they're feeling threatened by Legendary's success and may or may not be trying a little sabotage.
They are and so we should just boycott toho till they give in and hand over the rights permanently
@@deanastephensosborne5604 I knew someone would say that eventually. Only fake Godzilla fans want Toho to hand over the rights permanently. Cmon man, TOHO LITERATELY MADE GODZILLA!! They gave us the best Godzilla movies we could ever have. Don’t judge a company for one stupid decision. A true Godzilla fan respects Toho, but still points out their flaws.
@@SomethingZilla42 I have a preference that doesn't make me a fake fan
@@deanastephensosborne5604 True Godzilla fans like Toho
@@SomethingZilla42I did like them until I see the shit they're doing.
If it’s true, it's truly disappointing from Toho. I mean Legendary is the one who brought back Godzilla & made people interested in him once again after Toho shut down the Godzilla project in 2004, they are the one made Toho invest in Godzilla once again, and now they are forcing Legendary to not to develop Godzilla as a proper character only because they own the right, really disappointing, I grow up watching Godzilla as a cartoon character, I was really happy to see The Big G finally making a Comeback in 2014, I just don’t want to lose interest on my favourite fictional character.
It's a wasted opportunity and killed off so many storytelling potential
To think that a member of Godzilla species ate a magical star and having a wing is sick af. I was dissapointed that it was our Godzilla and the wing is just Iwi's metaphore for his thermonuclear
I think this is the right time for us to have Godzilla Jr. In Monsterverse Explore more the depth characters of Godzilla
I like the idea of Godzilla being one of a kind. It makes him all that and a titan sized bag of chips.
I’m actually with Toho on this. Godzilla being part of a species doesn’t really inflict the “He’s this mutated creature that we cannot understand “ vibe. And there is an easy loophole to avoid recons. Simply have Godzilla be part of a species, but Godzilla was the only one who “ate a star” and evolved into an all new species. “What about the axes?” You may be asking. Easy, Godzilla lost his dorsal spines in the war, and overtime he regenerated them, and the dorsal plates he lost in the war were turned into the axes.
It's almost like this godzilla exists in a universe where the whole mutated element thing doesn't apply
HMMMMM
@@Man_Aslume then this version of Godzilla is a completely different character. Yeah I said it, if the mutated element doesn’t apply, then this version is very close to being a fake Godzilla.
@@SomethingZilla42 isn't that just heisei and og godzilla apply to that?
And with that logic, zilla is a real godzilla
@@Man_Aslume im pretty sure every version of Godzilla has that nuclear mutation.
We need to band together, and protest Toho to bring back Godzilla species!
Only in the Monsterverse though, cuz I actually like this rule.
@@SomethingZilla42 Why?
With all due respect,.
Why should the lore of a series that has been built carefully
It almost ruins the lore
@@SomethingZilla42Explain
@@blacksun6245 well, Godzilla’s character is that he is this god like mutated beast born from nuclear radiation. Him having a species doesn’t really show that.
I think what’s happening is that they just don’t want MONSTERVERSE to talk about Godzilla’s species but it doesn’t mean It’s not canon
Godzilla only one species remain
I get where Toho is coming from,but I am too not sitting well with this new strict policy,it was such a new and unique take on the character letting him have a proper species to be part of.
At the very least,take that decision earlier Toho,not after a comic has a literal other specimen in Dagon and GvK introducing the war between two,full-on species,with tangible proof in Hollow Earth with the fossils and the axes
i kind of like there could be only one godzilla. Just like Yoda in star wars. there is a mystery in godzilla's past that one can do anything if the story fits. And I like that he is still single and not a family person like the Kong species, but more of a samurai warrior. if anything, I would like a story about mothra and godzilla on how the alliance came to be, also the twin priestesses.
Indeed, I find dumb tthat Toho is trying to keep Godzilla as unique character for Monsterverse, specially when they already presented other members of his species in previous films like Minilla and Junior. This doesn't fully imply the previous work would be cut, but won't allow to develope that part of the lore, forcing Legendary to focus on their current version of Godzilla and nothing more beyond that. I feel Toho thinks if an external studio gets the freedom to work with Godzilla as species maybe they Will create a rip-off character for their own or simply they want to control EVERYTHING over the topic
If there are enough of fans talking about it then maybe Legendary will listen and change back Godzilla into a species but idk
So Dagon isn't Godzilla? I call bs. This retcon makes no sense whatsoever. If Godzilla doesn't have a species, then how did he come into existence in the first place? Doug proves that this change is stupid since he's a confirmed relative of Godzilla. It makes no sense.
Also the axe made of a godzilla dorsal plate 🤔
@@Snakey335and not just one, they showed multiple in Godzilla vs kong
@@oodaboos1339 yea true that
@@Snakey335 and the cave paintings, hmmmmmmmmmmmm
@@chadgorosaurus4898 fr
It's unfair that Kong can have more of his kind more than Godzilla does.
Now how are they gonna explain manilla or Jr existence? Or the axe or Dagon bones? Such a dumb move from toho since they already established that godzilla already had a species before. 1:25 well godzilla never eaten anyone and never attacked a certain person. He sees humanity in general as a problem depending on the circumstances. 1:31 godzilla doesn't have to die for his offspring to take the mantle as king remember the showa era and final wars
These rules are recent, this just means we won’t ever see minilla of Godzilla jr ever again.
I would love for some lore of the Godzilla specice in the monsterverse
I have a fury that since Godzilla is the monster who ate a star, I think that the other Godzilla atomic breath doesn’t last forever like Godzilla and they have to recharge it by the hollow earth energy but anyways, this is just a fury, but I think it’s Canon I can’t be the only one that thinks this and if you didn’t think this, this might change your mind
It’s actually messed up they cut them. It’s been in the movies, they need fix it.
"Animals like Godzilla" Yeah, we already have a word for that, even you, Toho. "Godzillasaurus".
Doug and the Skull the axe was found in are already theorized by Monarch to be part of the ancient evolutionary tree that lead to producing Godzilla, if Toho wants Godzilla to be one of a kind, they could just say that Dagon and the other Godzillasaurs from the War were simply part of that Evolutionary tree, still his ancestors, Godzilla was just the first and last to be born the peak of it, a once every million centuries thing, The Legendary Super Godzilla. Dagon just came close. Removing his ancestral relation to all who died in the war and got their fins turned into weapons just takes away from the personal involvement and makes us less engaged with his personal reactions through GvK and GxK. And like 10 Dorsal Fin weapons were in the temple if you look close enough, I refuse to believe 1 Godzilla let that happen over 10 times. And it takes away from the fact that The Mutos are evolved to be the living counter weapon to Godzilla.
Image if we see a evil Godzilla in the Monsterverse like GMK Godzilla
Space Godzilla.🤷
@@jurassicdominationI know but still it interesting
Or maybe godzilla just snaps
My head canon was always that even the Titans we see only a single individual of there's more of their kind in The Hollow Earth, with only the strongest of each species being able to survive the surface world...
TOHO doesn't want other Godzilla like creatures because it doesn't want Legendary killing off Godzilla and replacing him with other Godzilla like creatures. This is also why they don't allow Godzilla to be killed off either. Its smart on TOHO's end but it also backs Legendary into a creative corner.
I don't care what the new director of the books has in mind for Godzilla, but him being the last of his kind will always be canon in my heart. It also makes more sense considering his sudden change in behaviour for the previous two films
i believe it makes sense for godzilla to be a one of specimen because most of the other titans seem to be alone without any other members of their species
Imagine that his species is still thriving in deep hollow earth and Godzilla doesn’t know it
7:35 well the last two movies have done that,not talk about anything already stablished so i'm sure that unless the new director truly cares for the lore of the monsterverse we'll not hear about it again any time soon
Who knows if it’s true, but I really hope not for the sake of Godzilla’s story
If this is true that would be so stupid, I’m already upset that we’ve barely seen any other members of Goji’s species and they want to erase them!?
Well, even though Godzilla is the last of his kind (since Dagon & his species are canon but not shown in official CGI appearance, yet), I hope we'll see more of Godzilla's species in a MV prequel movie.
And hopefully in the next MV GxK 3rd movie (2027) we'll see Godzilla find a baby (which will better be Minizilla/Gojira Junior) & maybe some of his kind survived.
If Toho will not announce a new rule that "Godzilla will an individual", right👍😉🦖🌌
This is actually quite upsetting.. whenever I talk about the Monstersverse lore this is always a highpoint to those I introduce to it. My family and friends were enamored with the idea of seeing more about the ancient Godzilla vs Kong interspecies War.
Plus, all the already established lore and story opportunities are just going to be meaningless?
That just reminds me of Star Wars Expanded universe being Legends, and even worse how those Michael Bay Transformers movies suffered consistent continuity errors between movies for the characters and story. Retcons, kill offs and story repeats per movie. Really makes a comprehensive story suffer more; Might as well go the lengths of Games Workshop and start retconning things before telling us the fanbase we are the fools for not knowing established lore was never right in the first place.
Man we cant have nothing good these days. ( Ref all the great fan animations made for love of an IP/source material, stripped down and away by companies and ego )
no wonder they are using kong more
Toho better stop this bs ,or we as a community should stop supporting their projects.
Toho is right. There should be only ONE Godzilla.
*Coughs in Godzilla Junior and Minilla.*
Showa and Hesei Godzilla both had a son so I'm pretty sure Toho is telling them not to expand on the species rather than remove the concept entirely.
What about the damn Battle Axe? That was clearly from another Godzilla, and Toho must have forgotten Godzilla f**king JR!!
And Godzilla Filius
@@MrTriangle1954 Faxxxxxx
Godzilla filius is a sub species
Most of the monsters in the toho line are seen as one-off creatures. There's still room for good story telling. Perhaps all of them come from a similar precambrian kaiju and all adapted and mutated to fit their environment. Like mew in the pokemon world
Frankly, I wouldn't take anything Keyes says as official lore. I mean how often has the monsterverse established things in their precious tie-in comics bit not reference them in in the movies? No, I will take his comments/head canons, the events of the comics and the lesser facts or events from the novelizations as beta-canon until they are mentioned or established in the movies or shows.
Have they acknowledged in any of the movies or shows after 2014 that:
- the EMP nature of the Mutos effected Godzilla's breath? (Novelization of 2014)
- did they acknowledge that Godzilla fought Shinomura in any of the MonsterVerse movies?
- did acknowledge the fight between Godzilla and Muto-Prime and his size and plates differences?
- did any of the movies established that Ghidorah caused the storm around Skull Island to swallow the island or Kong facing Camataz (Kingdom Kong)?
- there is even conflicting details between Godzilla Dominion and the title sequence of GvK. Dominion said Godzilla ordered the other titans to hibernate, whereas the GvK said each one was "defeated" by him as if he killed them - which is it?
I mean, you can even look at the convoluted 'canon' tie-ins for Star Trek 2009 and Picard. Some of that Canon said B4/Data was captain of the Enterprise-E when Picard retired if I remember right (countdown to 2009) and some that said Worf was named captain of the Enterprise-E when Picard was promoted to Admiral (Picard "official" novels). Hell, even look to the interviews and panels of the recent Voltron series! Fans treated the headcanons of the voice-actors as canon when it they literally had nothing to do with the filmed series.
So unless Legendary Studios and Toho collaborate and make an official compendium like the 98 Official Godzilla Compendium, then I recommend not taking any extended lore or what an author says in interviews as official canon
So dagon and a good percent of the Titan war lore just gets wiped out?
In some versions it makes sense why he is the only one, heisei being a mutated dino, Shin also being mutated, etc. but both the anime (trilogy and singularity) shows two Godzillas (one little and one dead). Toho needs to stop. Our Monsterverse Godzilla is above his other counterparts because it’s stated, he ate a “star” and hence more powerful which makes him a God. Why toho, WHY!
No way! This can't happen! Retconning Godzilla as a member of his species is awful, heartbreaking and we'll never forgive toho for that. Keyes needs to be backed up against toho for undemanding the MV Godzilla as the last living member of his species that was yet official. What do you say Jacob?
Well if not then I’m hoping we can get Godzilla jr or SpaceGodzilla one day
Funny thing is that the species itself isn't cut from the entirety of the Monsterverse per se. Just GxK as GvK straight up says that Godzilla's and Kong's had a rivalry that expanded on their respective races. So either Toho is being stingy on purpose or they really weren't paying attention to this lore that's been developing and fully established for 10 years now. Hopefully this retcon is just BS cuz that's what it smells like to me.
I hate this idea. A single gojira just would be killed by army of apes with axes. No, there was dozens of gojiras