That is so cool. I"m a retired certified millwright and wish I wasn't such an old man now (63). I would learn about CAD, CNC, and this Metal Printing. Very very cool. It would be so awesome to be resurrected from the grave in another 100 yrs to see what has developed out of this tech. One thing I would really liked to have seen you do in this video is some destructive testing to see how strong these prints are. Near future video on this ??????
Talked with these guys few years back. Wanted to use their stuff for stainless exhaust printing and engine parts. Still day dream about it now and then 😅
Internesting new solution for metal 3D printing. Will be interesting to see how it compares to selective laser sintering. That seems to be the leading technology in the industry.
So realistically, how far away is one of these from my desktop? Let's assume I have Bambulabs X1 money to invest in a metal printer, am I a decade away? A year? A month?
@@techpriest4787 I too would prefer for it to be a Hail Mary device, but in the grand scheme of things it's not that much of a hassle to own a kiln of some sort to produce metal on a whim.
3:53 - I wonder if this technology would be suitable for on demand parts for UHV systems. Rough internal surfaces might have too much gas adsorbtion maybe.
@@انا_ابراهيم_البناوي The day will come though when affordable desktop Metal 3D printers are available and I built a business on that belief. For now though high temp filaments are useful for making strong parts. I buy HTN CF25 from Vision Miner and I printed one of our 11/16 wrenches with it and it got up to 35 foot pounds of torque which is generally more than you would ever be using a wrench that size for.
@@3dprintedhardware Essentium's HTN-CF25 is the most incredible material I've ever printed with. It does need to be dry but damn, it's as easy to print as PLA and it'll easily replace aluminum machining in most of our fixtures.
I suppose shrinkage will never bee the same on the three XYZ axis, so this method will always produce warped/deformed parts depending on the object shape... Or I'm missing something?
Shrinkage along the Z axis is often higher than the XY, but once the process is dialed in, the difference is pretty constant. So, you can scale up the print (i.e., “green” part) in the slicer by one factor for XY and another factor for Z, and obtain the desired dimensions after sintering.
@@DRMH2016with the cost of material it sounds like it will be an expensive endeavor, but then again I doubt cost will be of concern for most buying this printer
He said ceramic supports, so I guess it has to be a material that survives the sintering process intact. I wonder how much of an issue it is to remove it, probably internal supports aren't feasible.
Much less waste, facility costs, handling costs, safety measures..... it's an entirely different beast, bringing the costs significantly lower compared to powders
I think it will work for bulk parts, and laser printing is better suited for precision work. From what I understand, laser printing can become messy when printing something as thick as 2cm, and the process is very slow (correct me if I'm mistaken). I'm also a bit concerned about material shrinking during curing in the kiln, but ability to machined after cure process impresive.
Our process... I independently came to the same idea approximately a year ago. I wanted to figure out a viable way to D.I.Y. a metal 3D printer and knew SLS Powder was too complicated/costly. Discovered M.I.M. and knew of ceramic paste printing and people printing freaking Nutella onto toast. No way I could afford to own a metal printer and unfortunately even having simultaneously realized this process on my own can't afford to even start build my own metal paste printer. But yeah great work RAPIDIA. Maybe you or vision minor would care to offer a little assistance to a skilled "visionary". I have at least two other ideas/inventions for the additive manufacturing space...
@@VisionMiner Have you tried AI based noise reduction? That usually is pretty good for this type of noise. Voices do sound a bit weird if you completly remove the noise, but with medium reduction and some quieter music beds it should come out way better than this.
UA-camrs claims that Superglue and Metalpowder is incredible strong. I tried with some powder left from grinding in steel, but it seems to be difficult to mix with the glue, but got a little piece that seems to be very hard. More testing is needed. One problem is that superglue is very expensive. But that mix should be possible to 3d print with. Now just make the machine for it, thanks.
Always cool to see stuff like this The only thing that really annoys me is the price of the machines, ok yeah you deserve some payback for your research and need to make a profit which I’m fine with but the over the top sintering chamber , controls and software detracts from the main concept. It’s the actual concept and process that will make it viable. Charging vast amounts for over the top bling to provide ‘sales marketing’ is irrelevant . Kinda hypocritical of me to say it does look a nice bit of kit though lol 😝
I'm always on the fence with this..... developing it in the first place takes lots of capital, manufacturing it takes raw material and labor, and then supporting it over time and scaling takes lots of labor/salaries -- and those salaries are not cheap, minimum wage labor, and then they still need to make it better -- this is why we actually see many of these companies not being profitable, or not for many years -- thus, the early-adopter phase always helps bring the technology to market, then as it develops, becomes cheaper over time -- but putting it out there cheap in the first place can be a recipe for disaster, for an underdeveloped technology -- if it doesn't work well yet, the consensus will be that it doesn't work, and it won't gain momentum and become it's potential.... alternatively, make it open and cheap, and watch it develop even faster, that sometimes works as well. Good times!
@@VisionMiner Yeah I know what you mean , it is a funny one . Developing new tech can be expensive mechanically though a lot of this tech is fairly basic and decades old . Bach in 2006 I purchased a powder 3D printer for castings delving around the cabinet would have been more expensive than the mechanics inside the vacuum / de powdering unit was an off the shelf vacuum and compressor in a fancy unit and the vibratory sieve I could have fabricated for a 1/4 of the price and made it out of stainless . Cost me aprox 27k . Seems sometimes their marketing dept focus on the looks to impress accountants , buyers and directors who know little about manufacturing . That said it’s still vital to any company to have pride in their products and looks so sell . 👍🇬🇧
"its better than a weld. Its closer to a braze" Its very concerning to hear those words leave the mouth of someone working with metal printing. You're basically screaming "this technology has no structural application whatsoever". I hope you got that backwards.
According to the internet, "Brazing is better than welding at joining dissimilar metals. It can form strong bonds while not significantly changing the properties of the two metals." -- that would make sense. But this is certainly an interesting point you bring up!
@@VisionMiner You're 100 percent right, its not just better at joining dissimilar metals. Brazing is the only option. Steel and aluminum is the obvious one. Here, we're talking about welding (sintering, actually) the same metal together. The exact same metal. The only time you would use brazing (aka soldering) is for convenience, where strength and high temperature function aren't issues and needing to take the pieces apart again is an issue. There are a lot of metal 3d printing techniques out there, from powder bed fusion for precision to additive MIG welding for strength and uniformity of the metal, to regular FDM with high metal content filament that requires sintering later, the only real advantage of which is cost. So cost is the real question here. Powder bed printers and additive welding machines are going to start very conservatively at 100k USD and shoot up from there. Unless these guys are bringing a whole system to the table for less than 10k USD, I don't see the point. Having a shrinkage factor of 10 percent (or similar) puts it in the same usefulness category as a Creality Ender using Utrafuse filament. Its great to see innovation, not so great to see gimmicks. I think all they've got here is removing the debinding step in FDM sintered metal 3D printing.
I think he means that the entire contact patch between the parts are joined together, like a braze would be when the material wets between the surfaces from capillary action. Also, similar to a oven braze, there isn't weakened surrounding area due to internal stress like there is in welding without post process.
@@neverwipe I already covered all this in another comment, but no. What you said would make a tiny shred of sense if he wasn't standing right next to a sintering furnace. There's too much to cover here, but I would suggest watching one of the many videos on Ultrafuse, but not a paid sponsorship. These parts come with some worse internal stresses than any welded parts. Thick parts crack and any change in thickness creates stresses that can't be annealed away like they can in a welded part. I sort of get what you're saying, but brazing is always bad unless welding literally isn't an option or strength doesn't matter, and brazing steel DEFINITELY gets the steel hot enough to ruin its temper and it can't be quenched again without cracking the braze. I mean lets put it this way: if you had a cracked engine block that you wanted to save (aluminum or steel), you would NEVER braze it and pretend it was going to work. Welding is the only option.
@@htomerif I agree that he could have worded it in a less confusing way. The joint that's created from water bonding is no different than the base material since, as he said, the solvent in the paste is water. It's still not considered welding, the bond created is just plain sintering, like the rest of the material. IMO, this is actually a very attractive property that you wouldn't get with the standard fdm/debind style methods. This company talks about this in other youtube content. Btw, I respectfully disagree with your view on brazing. In some joint applications, even where your bonding the same metal, it is stronger. Brazing an overlap for a shear joint is better than just welding the edges, for example, a sleeve over a round bar. They're especially strong if you use an alloy like saftey silv 45. This isnt true for tig brazing, which is weaker than tig welding. I think brazing is slept on since it makes less sense on larger structures, so its not popular. I am a fan of both welding and brazing. They each have their applications.
Eventually metal 3D printers will be simplified and be sold to household consumers for the same price of high temp printers in the next 10 or so years. I love technology!
this is an exciting innovation!
well done to the engineering team designing this process! 👏😎
That is so cool.
I"m a retired certified millwright and wish I wasn't such an old man now (63). I would learn about CAD, CNC, and this Metal Printing. Very very cool.
It would be so awesome to be resurrected from the grave in another 100 yrs to see what has developed out of this tech.
One thing I would really liked to have seen you do in this video is some destructive testing to see how strong these prints are.
Near future video on this ??????
Talked with these guys few years back. Wanted to use their stuff for stainless exhaust printing and engine parts. Still day dream about it now and then 😅
I love the concept of making assemblies with the paste. I think that's one of the best features.
This is a really promising tech, please keep us updated!
I can get behind any company with Dan Gelbart in the driving seat
And completely glossing over the incredible ceramic support material! So cool!
Internesting new solution for metal 3D printing. Will be interesting to see how it compares to selective laser sintering. That seems to be the leading technology in the industry.
We need to crowdsource access to the best of these designs for all.
He should include prices in the presentations so we don't have to search.
So realistically, how far away is one of these from my desktop? Let's assume I have Bambulabs X1 money to invest in a metal printer, am I a decade away? A year? A month?
Too bad that I have space issues. The sinter device kills it for me.
@@techpriest4787 I too would prefer for it to be a Hail Mary device, but in the grand scheme of things it's not that much of a hassle to own a kiln of some sort to produce metal on a whim.
The metal powder costs more than a bambulab right now.... so you're in for a bit of a wait :)
@@VisionMiner figures. I am still excited to be able to make bespoke parts for my projects in the future.
3:53 - I wonder if this technology would be suitable for on demand parts for UHV systems. Rough internal surfaces might have too much gas adsorbtion maybe.
Can it make bridges and overhangs with this paste? Up to what angle?
Up to 45º overhangs, and they use the support material for overhangs :)
Incredible machine. I want one.
Nice machine ! But i think is to small ! Where i can find more information like where to buy etc... ?
pretty cool
oh, its the printer LMG has in the labs
Cool to see you cover their machine! We're good friends with several people there 🙂
They're great, great people!
doesn't that water remain inside the parts?
One of those things is that if you need to know the price, it's probably out of reach.
I would absolutely love an affordable desktop Metal 3D printer but most are just too expensive and proprietary
@@انا_ابراهيم_البناوي The day will come though when affordable desktop Metal 3D printers are available and I built a business on that belief. For now though high temp filaments are useful for making strong parts. I buy HTN CF25 from Vision Miner and I printed one of our 11/16 wrenches with it and it got up to 35 foot pounds of torque which is generally more than you would ever be using a wrench that size for.
@@3dprintedhardware Essentium's HTN-CF25 is the most incredible material I've ever printed with. It does need to be dry but damn, it's as easy to print as PLA and it'll easily replace aluminum machining in most of our fixtures.
Epic! Send over pics/videos of parts, and we'll feature your company in a video! media@visionminer.com
@@circleofowls That's a new one I'll make sure to check it out might get one for my college they've been looking for filaments like that
oh shit this is the printer ltt just showed off in their labs video. cool stuff, but i wish youd let them show off more of the tech in their videos!
Oh no way! Where is that video??
@@VisionMiner ua-cam.com/video/MbSqSZevKo8/v-deo.html starts around 13:16
Awesome thank you!
I suppose shrinkage will never bee the same on the three XYZ axis, so this method will always produce warped/deformed parts depending on the object shape...
Or I'm missing something?
Shrinkage along the Z axis is often higher than the XY, but once the process is dialed in, the difference is pretty constant. So, you can scale up the print (i.e., “green” part) in the slicer by one factor for XY and another factor for Z, and obtain the desired dimensions after sintering.
@@DRMH2016with the cost of material it sounds like it will be an expensive endeavor, but then again I doubt cost will be of concern for most buying this printer
I would have liked to know a bit more about the support they were using.
Thanks for another really interesting video.
He said ceramic supports, so I guess it has to be a material that survives the sintering process intact. I wonder how much of an issue it is to remove it, probably internal supports aren't feasible.
Sounds like pretty expensive in comparison to powder especially if there is no competition in that system.
Still a interesting system.
Much less waste, facility costs, handling costs, safety measures..... it's an entirely different beast, bringing the costs significantly lower compared to powders
I think it will work for bulk parts, and laser printing is better suited for precision work. From what I understand, laser printing can become messy when printing something as thick as 2cm, and the process is very slow (correct me if I'm mistaken). I'm also a bit concerned about material shrinking during curing in the kiln, but ability to machined after cure process impresive.
tin sn99 solder filament 3d printing, then electroplating/forming directly
Is this the company that Dan gelbart is part of?
Our process... I independently came to the same idea approximately a year ago. I wanted to figure out a viable way to D.I.Y. a metal 3D printer and knew SLS Powder was too complicated/costly. Discovered M.I.M. and knew of ceramic paste printing and people printing freaking Nutella onto toast. No way I could afford to own a metal printer and unfortunately even having simultaneously realized this process on my own can't afford to even start build my own metal paste printer. But yeah great work RAPIDIA. Maybe you or vision minor would care to offer a little assistance to a skilled "visionary". I have at least two other ideas/inventions for the additive manufacturing space...
You could make epic heat exchangers with this
100%
the music bed is very distracting.
Thanks for letting us know! Finding a good middle ground for these type of videos, had to cover up some of the expo floor noise :)
@@VisionMiner understandable! Thanks for the consideration. It was taking away from the amazing tech displayed is all.
Agreed. The music wasn't awful but I think it would have been better without it.
@@VisionMiner the music rocks
@@VisionMiner Have you tried AI based noise reduction? That usually is pretty good for this type of noise. Voices do sound a bit weird if you completly remove the noise, but with medium reduction and some quieter music beds it should come out way better than this.
Excellent tech.....now if they could only do this process so that we could make parts at home rather than a huge oven like shown....
UA-camrs claims that Superglue and Metalpowder is incredible strong.
I tried with some powder left from grinding in steel, but it seems to be difficult to mix with the glue, but got a little piece that seems to be very hard. More testing is needed.
One problem is that superglue is very expensive. But that mix should be possible to 3d print with.
Now just make the machine for it, thanks.
I think this technology will make it's way to the public D.I.Y. market before SSS does at an affordable cost basis.
Always cool to see stuff like this
The only thing that really annoys me is the price of the machines, ok yeah you deserve some payback for your research and need to make a profit which I’m fine with but the over the top sintering chamber , controls and software detracts from the main concept.
It’s the actual concept and process that will make it viable. Charging vast amounts for over the top bling to provide ‘sales marketing’ is irrelevant .
Kinda hypocritical of me to say it does look a nice bit of kit though lol 😝
I'm always on the fence with this..... developing it in the first place takes lots of capital, manufacturing it takes raw material and labor, and then supporting it over time and scaling takes lots of labor/salaries -- and those salaries are not cheap, minimum wage labor, and then they still need to make it better -- this is why we actually see many of these companies not being profitable, or not for many years -- thus, the early-adopter phase always helps bring the technology to market, then as it develops, becomes cheaper over time -- but putting it out there cheap in the first place can be a recipe for disaster, for an underdeveloped technology -- if it doesn't work well yet, the consensus will be that it doesn't work, and it won't gain momentum and become it's potential.... alternatively, make it open and cheap, and watch it develop even faster, that sometimes works as well. Good times!
@@VisionMiner Yeah I know what you mean , it is a funny one . Developing new tech can be expensive mechanically though a lot of this tech is fairly basic and decades old .
Bach in 2006 I purchased a powder 3D printer for castings delving around the cabinet would have been more expensive than the mechanics inside the vacuum / de powdering unit was an off the shelf vacuum and compressor in a fancy unit and the vibratory sieve I could have fabricated for a 1/4 of the price and made it out of stainless .
Cost me aprox 27k .
Seems sometimes their marketing dept focus on the looks to impress accountants , buyers and directors who know little about manufacturing . That said it’s still vital to any company to have pride in their products and looks so sell . 👍🇬🇧
Pretty cool, but looks like you'd have to buy cartridges from them directly.
wonder if this method can be used to make 99% copper parts.
"its better than a weld. Its closer to a braze"
Its very concerning to hear those words leave the mouth of someone working with metal printing.
You're basically screaming "this technology has no structural application whatsoever".
I hope you got that backwards.
According to the internet, "Brazing is better than welding at joining dissimilar metals. It can form strong bonds while not significantly changing the properties of the two metals." -- that would make sense. But this is certainly an interesting point you bring up!
@@VisionMiner You're 100 percent right, its not just better at joining dissimilar metals. Brazing is the only option. Steel and aluminum is the obvious one.
Here, we're talking about welding (sintering, actually) the same metal together. The exact same metal. The only time you would use brazing (aka soldering) is for convenience, where strength and high temperature function aren't issues and needing to take the pieces apart again is an issue.
There are a lot of metal 3d printing techniques out there, from powder bed fusion for precision to additive MIG welding for strength and uniformity of the metal, to regular FDM with high metal content filament that requires sintering later, the only real advantage of which is cost.
So cost is the real question here. Powder bed printers and additive welding machines are going to start very conservatively at 100k USD and shoot up from there. Unless these guys are bringing a whole system to the table for less than 10k USD, I don't see the point. Having a shrinkage factor of 10 percent (or similar) puts it in the same usefulness category as a Creality Ender using Utrafuse filament.
Its great to see innovation, not so great to see gimmicks. I think all they've got here is removing the debinding step in FDM sintered metal 3D printing.
I think he means that the entire contact patch between the parts are joined together, like a braze would be when the material wets between the surfaces from capillary action. Also, similar to a oven braze, there isn't weakened surrounding area due to internal stress like there is in welding without post process.
@@neverwipe I already covered all this in another comment, but no. What you said would make a tiny shred of sense if he wasn't standing right next to a sintering furnace.
There's too much to cover here, but I would suggest watching one of the many videos on Ultrafuse, but not a paid sponsorship.
These parts come with some worse internal stresses than any welded parts. Thick parts crack and any change in thickness creates stresses that can't be annealed away like they can in a welded part.
I sort of get what you're saying, but brazing is always bad unless welding literally isn't an option or strength doesn't matter, and brazing steel DEFINITELY gets the steel hot enough to ruin its temper and it can't be quenched again without cracking the braze.
I mean lets put it this way: if you had a cracked engine block that you wanted to save (aluminum or steel), you would NEVER braze it and pretend it was going to work. Welding is the only option.
@@htomerif I agree that he could have worded it in a less confusing way. The joint that's created from water bonding is no different than the base material since, as he said, the solvent in the paste is water. It's still not considered welding, the bond created is just plain sintering, like the rest of the material. IMO, this is actually a very attractive property that you wouldn't get with the standard fdm/debind style methods. This company talks about this in other youtube content.
Btw, I respectfully disagree with your view on brazing. In some joint applications, even where your bonding the same metal, it is stronger. Brazing an overlap for a shear joint is better than just welding the edges, for example, a sleeve over a round bar. They're especially strong if you use an alloy like saftey silv 45. This isnt true for tig brazing, which is weaker than tig welding. I think brazing is slept on since it makes less sense on larger structures, so its not popular. I am a fan of both welding and brazing. They each have their applications.
BG music alert :(
$100,000 USD 🤣
Eventually metal 3D printers will be simplified and be sold to household consumers for the same price of high temp printers in the next 10 or so years. I love technology!