Depends on where you drive. If it's the east coast between the Sunshine Coast and all the way to Sydney, it's probably not worth fitting a bullbar. If you go north without a bullbar you will total your car within a year of continuous driving. I can attest to hitting half a dozen roos in a 7 year period with my dmax. Had a tuff bullbar, didn't damage the ute at all. It's all context and the areas you drive.
You make some excellent points but I guess those that travel remotely will tell you if you hit a roo, no bullbar will leave you stranded. Passed a car last week with front end destroyed, dead roo in front of it. Occupants had left the vehicle and not in sight. At least a bullbar should protect the front end enough to continue or at least limp to a repair place. As for insurance, it’s there to be used I guess. Also agree on the Toyota alloy bullbar. May go that way myself👍
You are spot on. I have also had viewers comment on their trips around Australia in hatchbacks with no bars so it depends on a lot of factors and everyone’s situation is different. Thank you for your comment and for subscribing 👍
Firstly, great video mate… logical and informative! Personally, I think every add on or upgrade comes with its pros and cons. Like a roof rack, creates more wind resistance and drag, possibly noise, maybe uses more fuel. But creates additional storage. Large aggressive tyres, consumes more fuel and can be louder with decreased on road handling performance pending the type you select, but then off road provides better handling and less chance of punctures. For me, my 150 currently has no bar… but about to get one. It was I’ll be the full bar replacement by Hamer 4x4, I’ve opted for that so I can go back to the stock if needed. Also the bar is more slime line and doesn’t protrude from the car as much to hopefully prevent too much change in handling. Hopefully avoids costly smaller hits including more superficial scratches dings and bumps. I guess nothing is perfect, but it will probably come to how you intend to use the vehicle. Keeps the videos coming legend!
Spot on luke. Every mod has its cons. It just depends if it’s worth it. I like that you have chosen a bar that can return it back to stock. Thank you for your comment and for subscribing 👍
I understand that many people feel it is their prerogative to purchase whatever vehicle they want and use it in whichever circumstances they choose. However, a vehicle such as a Landcruiser Prado is a very capable off road vehicle with capabilities substantially beyond most in the sports utility vehicle class. It has a low range gear box and both centre and rear diff locks as standard along with a fuel capacity allowing a range of over 1000km. The Prado sits almost alone at its price point in terms of durability, serviceability and reliability. I would contend that, for a purchaser who is not going to genuinely use that capability, purchasing a Prado is just as much a vanity project as buying a Bugatti Veyron. If you regularly do night driving in rural Australia you will eventually hit a wallaby or a kangaroo. In the great majority of such circumstances a bull bar can make the difference between a disabling accident and continuing on to your destination, provided that you are driving to the conditions and have the appropriate levels of knowledge skill and expertise. If you are driving on a road with limited traffic and hit a roo without decent bar work it can be a long time before someone finds you. Sure, bull bars are not for everyone but metropolitan-based recreational off-roading is not likely to provide the personal experience that dictates a bull bar as a necessity of life.
Spot on mate. Very capable cars indeed. If people are taking risks at night and early morning, a bill bar would probably be the way to go. There are definitely ways around it but some people can’t avoid the risk so bar work should help minimise that. Thank you for your informative comment and for subscribing 👍
7th year owning mine. Always thought of having one but decided not to. Mainly because I do mostly highway Ks. I can see why some people need to get it if they spend most time in the bush or near wildlife. I just try my best to drive sensibly (less at night) etc. Plus if I go into town, much easier to park! 😂
Same here Aaron. It’s hard enough to park as it is (I don’t know how the ram boys do it haha). Most of my kms are highway too so the extra weight would destroy my economy
It's not true that bullbars keeps vehicle occupants safer. If it were true the manufactures of bullbars would use the evidence of their safety testing as a selling point... but they don't. Obviously they are great at assuaging vehicle damage from hitting wildlife ect. Though they are demonstrably NOT safer in serious collisions. BHP engaged an independent safety tester (Crash Lab) and the results showed that bullbars are less safe for the occupants, and thereafter BHP ceased fitting bullbars to their fleet. See here: ua-cam.com/video/6oHDJc5LFNY/v-deo.html
I would only recommend to install a bullbar to protect the truck not the occupants. Very important for people to understand the difference. I’ll check out that video. Thank you for the comment
I'd prefer a kangaroo through the front of my car over losing my crumple zone and having the impact of a head on go into my body (blood filled skin bag) rather than being absorbed by the crumple zone.
Great points, but if you hit a roo at 110km/h at least you'll be able to get to a town to fix your smashed up front, no bar and you'll be stranded. Great video though, unless you do a lot of remote driving its probably not worth it.
Spot on mate. I guess the idea would be not to hit one haha. But accidents do happen and bull bars have their place 👍 Thanks for commenting and subscribing
Exactly. I drove across the nullabor a few times in a hatchback. 1400kms a day, drove at 50km/h when the roos are out and they just watch you go by without trying to commit suicide. Sometimes I would get behind a truck/4wd to outsource my bull bar duties haha
Interesting comments by all. Thanks. Most Australians live in our capital cities, therefore so do most readers here - including myself. However I'd wonder if those living rurally are more likely to know someone who has died in a vehicle incident. Of those rural fatalities it would be interesting to know what percentage are from head-on, hittng a tree, or rolling a 4WD. In each instance I'd expect that not having a bull-bar would make fatality less likely. For myself, based on "keep-it-light" thinking my 120 is stock. When going remote if I have to drive at night I stick to 80kmh. My only fitted accessories are bash plates and rated recovery points on the front. NB: I'm happy to share my mount design for the sand-flag too - a challenge with no bull-bar and no roof-rack! Rather than a fitted second-battery I have a Bluetti power station. I haven't done a lift either. Last year I did Simpson Dessert via the Madigan Line with no problem. Prior to that Oodnatta Track in it and twice Strzlecki Track. The challenge of climbing the dunes on Madigan's was badly impacted by the carved out wombat holes. Being the lighter vehicle I handled the inevitable bounce of those climbs with more ease than our other vehicle even though I had much lower clearance. One vehicle we passed was a current model Land Cruiser 300 kitted out with everything and it's driver parked for a five day wait for a mechanic to arrive to replace a broken rear shock which had recently been upgraded to Old Man Emu extra HD shocks. He was not pleased. @NorthOz Have you done your remake or addendum yet? Plus one from me for comments of those srefuting your statement that a bull-bar adds to safety. I think there may though be a caveat in regards to factory-fitted bull-bars which have in fact had the engineered crumple zones, the protection shell, and airbag and seatbelt restraint actuator performance all incorporated into their design. I'm less clear if that extends beyond "factory-fitted" to also incorporate OEM...? Three more reasons for your list: (1) resist the marketing of the accessorizing product pushers; (2) #keep-it-light philosophy provides not just a more fuel-efficient vehicle, but also a more capable, reliable, and longterm more durable vehicle for both off-roading and for rough-roading; (3) for serious off-road recovery a hand winch is for more capable and versatile than a fixed bull-bar-mounted electric winch - and only needs to be caried when doing trips that might need recovery. The rest of the time it can sit happily in storage at home. #keep-it-light
If you are going off road you need it in case you hit a roo or you need a winch to pull you out, You can get a single loop bullbar or a nudge bar that doesn’t weight much or extend
You aren’t wrong. Depends where you live. In the tropics we don’t have many kangaroos so I don’t need one. The nudge bars aren’t particularly useful as they don’t protect high enough on the Prado’s. Depends on your situation. Thank you for commenting and subscribing. I look forward to your thoughts on today’s video 👍
I think fit for purpose. If you routinely use your vehicle on rough overgrown tracks and hard technical offroading and touring regions with very frequent wallaby strikes even early in the afternoons you need a bullbar. Pushing over small trees / ramming shrubbery out of the way is beyond the plastic bumpers. Same for rocksliders if you negotiate tough rocky tracks and frequently have to drag your vehicle over such terrain - our clearances are not that good. Same for 40kg underbody ARB protection plates. Mine are dented and damaged but vehicle is ok…. I have a Fortuner GX manual and really use it off road… your other points are great, I wish the SmartBar bullbar for my vehicle had a winch cradle but it doesn’t as it saves a lot of weight over the front. Its a great option and reduces pedestrian injuries in a vehicle strike. Def less dangerous. I think too many people fit off road hardware but don’t really need it. I think I use mine enough to need all components. I would remove ANYTHING not needed as I don’t have a GVM upgrade and weight is always an issue esp when carrying 5-6 jerry cans of diesel and water… at least the vehicle interior can be stripped out to save some weight for those longer remote trips…. Anyone claiming off road = beach / trails / moderate tracks prob won’t really need a bullbar for that but approach angles suck from factory and the new Mitsubishi Triton vertical headlights in the front bumper will prob make bullbars impossible to fit. Just my opinion - good video effort👍
Thanks mate. Absolutely. The purpose of this video is just to get people to think if they really need the equipment that companies and other influencers are pushing on us. Thanks for your comment and for subscribing
For me personally, bullbar is without question. I understand the insurance side of things, however for what I do, travelling a touch over 1000km every weekend, a lot of it through the night, I can’t afford to have my 200 in the crash repairers every weekend. Purely for efficiency reasons. I’ve hit probably 30 kangaroos total on it, and it’s never had any structural damage, only cosmetic damages have occurred. It’s served me super well. Also, this may not be the case for everyone but I’ve never had any engine damage from kangaroo strikes with the bull bar on. Most of them I’ve hit have been western red’s, at around 110-120kmph.
100% agree. It’s all about use case. For you it makes. If people can get by without one, that’s ideal. But in your case it absolutely makes sense and is a wise investment. Thank you for sharing your experience 👍
Hey Max, yours is the comment I’ve been searching for. Could you tell me what bar you’re using? I’m just about to buy a Prado, and although I agree with the no bar theory, I have to do a lot of night driving through western grey kangaroo area’s. Thanks
@@ciantheworld hey mate, yeah I’ve got a Toyota genuine bar for the 200s - steel one. It’s an older one though, 2015 the bar went on and they’ve updated to a lighter duty version now, no where as solid as previous. Held up really well, only complaint would be the plastic on it, that always gets fucked up. Get the bar mate, it’s a non negotiable for night driving remote. Anyone who says otherwise haven’t got an idea. Don’t want to end up stranded and plus - another thought, you never know how you’ll react when you get tired driving through night. Knowing you don’t need to swerve is really important I’ve found.
Thanks Mate, I will be definitely going for the bar just for that piece of mind. I am glad to hear from someone with the experience of hitting a roo at 110km. I am glad to hear that the bar will hold up. Once again, thanks for your help.@@maxxx229
These are very valid reasons, but i think they are coming from a very on paper perspective. I would argue most 4wds don't need a bullbar and these are decent reasons as to not get one without careful thought. Imo if the type of trips you do necessitates a bullbar, you've loaded up your car to with other accesories. You list off needing suspension as if you wouldn't need that anyway. You very quickly glanced over the fact that a minor animal collision can be a trip ender by saying that youll have to pay the same insurance excess. Yes that is true but opportunity cost is what you haven't factored. If you and your family have put aside leave from work and all other commitments, booked campsites having a trip ending collision doesn't cost you just the excess, It costs you all thats time and effort you've put towards the trip. You're now waiting hours for a tow truck, trying to organise rental cars and temporary accommodations. I've had 2 collisions with kangaroos driving in the early hours towards the snowfields in NSW (not particularly remote). Without the bullbar i'm certain these collisions would have ruined my trip. It was not unscathed, my bullbar is no longer in immaculate condition, have a few dings and rubber bumpers ripping off and a bit bent but thats the nature of a bullbar, they are made to get thrashed so im not wasting money on my excess and upping my premiums because of a few cosmetic blemishes on a sacrificial part. Alot of these damages are probably from all the bush bashing too.
Absolutely. It all depends on the use and it will be specific for everyone. Most people don’t need one but if the circumstance necessitates it like your situation, then it’s worthwhile. Too many people buying stuff they don’t need. They could save their money and travel more 😊 Thanks for commenting and subscribing
Thanks Mark for sharing your thoughts. I’m not a strong believer of a bull bar, I’m rather leaning to the side of what you’ve covered in this video - for the way I use my prado, I see a bull bar (+everything that comes with it) is purely a liability. Probably the positive is the look, but functionally it does not enable greater capability to my vehicle, with all the cons that come with it. Your view just concretes my thought and I think that’s great, more convinced I don’t need a bull bar!
Some good points raised, lots of money for a “just in case”, though sometimes it’s just unforeseen no matter how cautious you are. What’s your contingency if you did do reasonable damage and were in a remote area?
Just bought a new Triton. Had alloy bar on last for ten years, no problem. Beware on the Nullabor saw a camry hit by three suicidal roos, no bar in the middle of nowhere. Bar may or may not have helped.
Can still drive after hitting a kangaroo with steel bull bar, depending on its size. You don’t look like you drive much on remote roads like we do. You make valid points about the weight of bull bar which I’d never considered before.
Cheers mate. Yeah. Horses for courses. If you’ve seen my camping videos you’d know how remote I go. I travel when the Roos aren’t active. Have never had a near miss
0.25 yes, negative handling characteristics, you mention the weight hanging out the front quite a way, again at 1:25. If the centre of mass of the bullbar is, say, around 1.2m from the front axle, and the wheelbase of the Prado is 2.79m, this means every kilogram out in front puts 1.43kg on the front axle while lightening the rear axle by 0.43kg. Front axle load capacity is far less than the rear, and the loads on the front axle from the factory do not leave much capacity to start with. An ARB Summit Bar in steel weighs about 80kg. That would put an additional 114kg on the front axle. Add a winch, say a Warn Zeon 10 with steel cable (because that's what I have) at 47kg, the front load goes to 181kg (GVM is increased only 127kg because the rear axle is lighter by 54kg). As I've done with my 4WD (not a Prado) I find myself at maximum front axle load of 1,450kg when empty and not towing, meaning the factory axle load is about 1,274kg (different overhang and longer wheel base than the Prado). Once I hitch up the trailer my front axle weight comes down while the rear axle goes up.. So be careful hanging all the weight out front. Check the front axle load on a weighbridge before considering installing a bullbar (and maybe a winch, too), find out the weight of those items and add about 1.43x of that to the existing front axle load to assess if it leaves you any capacity at all. Good video.
Also where to put cans when drinking beer with mates on the beach lol. Jokes aside, valid points but, as mentioned below, bullbar is necessity when traveling in remote locations. And, insurance-wise, a scratch on the bullbar but without it could be a big job for panel beaters and $$$ paying excess and then higher premium.
Haha bullbar is a grey towel rack too. For sure with the insurance but it depends on the tracks. Boys like TJ and Mac don’t use bars on most of their rigs and they don’t have any issues but it depends. Doing gunshot without a bullbar would probably not be smart
I think your video and opinions are correct for the people that live in the city or urban areas. If a person lives in a bush or country area they really need to revaluate these points and see if they will benefit from running a bar on the vehicle. Indeed I agree with you and would not have one if I lived in these areas. I run a steel bull bar on my Prado and would not entertain any other material, as I have seen the lack of performance of alloy and plastic bars with respect to animal strike. I travel regularly for work in a very high animal strike rate area and the bull bar has saved me countless trips to the panel beaters, the insurance company not to mention the inconvenience and the excess costs of claiming. As with most things it is horses for courses. Good points raised in your video keep up the good work.
Congratulations on your new car. I feel a good bull bar will protect you and the vehicle in a high speed impact with animals so you are not getting stranded. Also in low speed impact it will reduce the damage caused to the car bumper, lights, etc. Forgot about stone / bug chips to the front, you are safe from those also. Saying this with my experience of interstate driving. Agree that it will increase fuel consumption so if someone is not driving long distances or night travelling much, I would not recommend a bull bar.
I am doing more research into how safe we are with bullbars as I have some information that bullbars disrupt the way crumple zones operate in high impact situations. I’ll be making a follow up video. Thanks for commenting and subscribing 👍
Bullbars are an insurance policy paid for up front. Just like recovery gear, spare tyres, spare parts etc etc. The major reason people run bullbars is because when remote travelling, hitting a roo head on with a factory plastic bumper equals, destroyed radiator, oil cooler, transmission cooler etc. Which means you are now stranded and will need to activate an EPIRB or get in radio contact with emergency services. But the vast majority of people just run them for aesthetics and the ability to mount spotlights, winches, comms etc etc.
Spot on. Depends on the use. I just don’t want people thinking they need to spend the money if they don’t have to. That way we can travel more with some extra cash in our pockets 👍 Thanks for commenting and subscribing
Thanks for your opinion. I hav no bullbar on my Prado and was considering replacing front bumper with some sort of bar after an incident where someone side swiped my vehicle taking out left door left front mudguard and plastic bumper. you just gave me some food for thought.
Good reasoning. Might add if you put a non genuine bullbar you may also affect engine cooling, especially by hanging accessories blocking air flow and heat soak on the front mount intercooler. You may also need a snorkel, as the factory bumper needs to be cut and dust may enter easier to the air intake which is located in the wheel well.
@@NorthOz I think the best mods for Prado and Hilux are A/T tyres and upgrade LED high beams. I think a heavily modified and heavy 4WD is not necessarily more capable in certain situations. You can easily save $500-1000 alone per year on fuel by having 2 sets of tyres/wheels. One for normal driving around town and one for touring/offroad.
I also don’t have a bull bar because I like the front end of my parade and also so it fits in my garage. Good to see some independent thought rather than being swayed by what the 4wd industry telling us what we should have.
You can always go with lighter material options like aluminum with steel mounting options that are still strong enough to winch off of. The style in the states is going towards lighter options as well with skeletonized or tubular bumper options to save weight.
Anthony from Fourby4diesel says u also need to fit a snorkel if u get a bullbar bcos the airflow to the air intake inside the wheel arch is altered when a bullbar is fitted. Also consider that BHP actually tested their mining vehicles with and without bullbars, rollcages etc. Conclusion, stock vehicles are the safest
Bull bars have a purpose - out in the middle of nowhere, where the chances of animal strikes, etc. are a real possibility. They have no place on cars in towns/cities.
Even so, I don’t have a bullbar and I don’t think I ever will. I travel remote (not desert) and I have always avoided animal strikes by travelling during the day and paying attention to my environment and adjusting speed accordingly. Even in my latest off-road video I had a kangaroo jump in front of my car but I avoided it by driving to the conditions. I agree with you in that some people may need a bullbar. But in general, almost everyone has or thinks they need a bullbar. When I’m reality only a very small number of people actually need them
Valid points but that can be said for majority of exterior mods. I do like how you said .. "why i have not put a bull bar on this vehicle YET". Hahhaha
Great analysis, well thought out and explained. However, your assumption that bullbars are better for safety is flawed, in my humble opinion. Bull bars might save damage to the vehicle and keep you going in an animal strike if your radiator survives, but I don’t think they improve safety. They are more likely to hinder it when it comes to the most precious cargo, you and your family. Modern cars have advanced safety systems which are based on very precise, down to split seconds scenarios. How does the bullbar affect this engineering? Have we ever seen the multi million dollar companies such as ARB etc ever do ANCAP type crash results? They have the money, why not do them to show us how much they improve safety? Anything after market that deviates from the researched engineered vehicle needs to be tested, not accepted!
Hi George. Excellent points. I have speaking to people in the comment section like yourself who have enlightened me. I will be making a follow up video to this in the coming weeks with more research. If what you and my other viewers are telling is true, the aftermarket needs to change. Thank you for watching and I hope you will subscribe to see my next bullbar video
That’s probably the nicest comment I have gotten on here. Thank you. Congratulations on your purchase. I am enjoying my Prado and I’m sure you will too. Any questions just ask 👍 Thanks for commenting and subscribing.
All good points though people living in high risk animal strike zones would / could argue a case for a bar. I’ve only ever had a factory bar on my 60 series but the 80 & 120 were stock. Did put a nudge bar with a light bar on my N80 hilux as was driving at night and early mornings on B roads. Now have the 200 which is stock. Touch wood have not had a animal strike (I did move a turtle off the middle of the road once)😬
iv hit atleast 10 roos with my ranger, iv slowed down to 50-80 as i hit them. and i have not replaced. the bullbar. there is a small dent at the bottom of the bullbar, if you hit a roo at just 50 without a bar its $5k plus damage. my bullbar has paid for its self 5x over
It's not a really a difficult decision. I kept my prado stock for 10 years. Recently started doing remote trips in the Kimberley so got the bar. I think you just know when you need it. If you're going places where normal cars without bars are going you probably don't need it
I agree, and I think this case needs to be made, given the number of vehicles with these fitted - a large chunk of which seem to come up from Sydney and never go further off road than the BWS carpark. Safety of others (pedestrians, cyclists, children pets etc.) in town is the biggest reason I don't have one. I don't want that on my conscience. I'm not convinced the safety benefit to the driver is significant, either - having a massive block of steel block the crumple zone and send all the impact force in chassis I'm sitting on doesn't seem like a win to me. Weight and the wear and tear it puts on the suspension as well as the fuel burn just doesn't make sense to me. I live in regional NSW right next to a national park, so we have a ton of wildlife around, and I've never hit a roo because I take it steady, and keep my vehicle light so it can easily stop, and be sure to keep an eye on the edges of the track at dawn and dusk. There's a ton of road kill around. That should be a warning, not a competition.
There’s a lot of comments here about winching or inner city driving, I can tell you just driving through the hunter valley where there’s anything from very large kangaroos, deer, wild pigs or even cattle at night wondering or bolting onto the road, that’s where it counts.
Exactly. It depends on where you live and if you are doing big drives at night. I don’t drive at night and around cairns and the suburbs there are very few wallabies around
A steel bull bar will protect the vehicle. Driver and passengers however will get crushed in a head on frontal collision (with another car, tree, wall etc). The crumble zone doesn’t crumble anymore, you’ll have a steel bar push right into the cabin. Also, pedestrians collisions are horrific for obvious reasons. Vehicle handling and aesthetics are all valid reasons too but secondary to the above IMO. The only bar I’d consider is an alloy one which would add about 30-40kg net. Not a huge impact on driving, fuel economy or suspension, while they are very strong but will crumble better than steel.
Thanks Mark. Just bought a 2013 2nd hand Prado and was looking at bullbars when I found your video. I think I'll save my money and leave the Prado as it is.
For me it is the winch, and protection from scratch’s and scuffs while 4wd. The bar i a, looking at is the ironman raid bar. Because I like the style of no loops
Interesting! And that’s adds function for you which is great 👍 But for most people who wouldn’t use a winch in their life, bullbars wouldn’t be my recommendation. They definitely have a purpose such as yours 🤙
@@NorthOz yeah, though In saying that, I do not have a winch on my current 4wd, that being an 05 hilux. So when I do purchase my new prado, the Bull bar won’t be going on first thing. Roof tray is what I am thinking. Though I was looking at the sports bar mounted system. What are you thoughts on those vs cross bars only?
Wouldn't a steel bar be more dangerous for the vehicle occupants in a collision because of a much quicker and sudden deceleration compared to the standard crumpling of the front end?
That’s a good point. A few people have commented about that and how Toyota has warnings about this. I will do some more research and make another video 👍 Thank you for commenting and subscribing
Adding a bullbar etc doesn’t change the handling much in my opinion. When travelling in remote locations and being able to continue on with your trip after hitting a roo and not broken down with a car that needs towing. That’s a good enough reason for me.
Yes I agree. I have owned 5 4wd and never bought a bullbar. Heavy, ugly, expensive. Have never needed one after 100,000+ km of off-road and remote driving. I like nudge bars for mounting lights and car park dings.
Great point. Same here mate. Thanks for the comment and subscribing. I never saw the sense in my 4x4 having the bullbar. Never used it and it cost a fortune
My biggest reason not to have a bullbar is the look. I love the front grill and design and no point to buy a bullbar and make the car look like a commercial vehicle, every time I see one on the street I just tell myself yuck how could people put that ugly thing on. The second reason is the safety of others as you mention, imagine t-boning other cars with a bullbar, it is like murdering people. A bit off topic if you dont mind, I really like the rhino backbone platform but from your experience, does it create much noise while travelling at high speed? I got some people say it does while some others say not
Great point mike. My thoughts exactly. We not only have to look out for ourselves, but others too. I made a video on my rhino rack platform experience. Let me know if you can’t find it. I made it about 1/2 months ago 👍 Thanks for commenting and subscribing
Thanks, man, in South Africa, I've noticed that most of the modern 'nudge bar - as we call it' doesn't cover much of the vehicle, it's like a small C-shaped only covering the very central part of the front grille, not even the corners of the bumper. I opted never to do it.
Same here. In my opinion they are useless. Only place they are good are in car parks if people don’t know where the front of their car is and they keep hitting poles and things. Thanks for commenting and subscribing 👍
What colour is your prado mate? pearl or glacier? Has nobody thought about the nudge bar? it's the best of both worlds I believe. That's what I am going for, its cheaper, lighter, looks great in my opinion and it provides SOME protection.... what do you think?
Pearl. Nudge bars are a waste of money in my opinion. It will only help protecting against trolleys in the supermarket car park. It will snap under any real force due to being made from thin aluminium. It won’t do anything in an animal strike in my opinion
Yes spot on, they should be banned, just drive more carefully and slow down especially at night in the country. Probably would do a lot for increased tyre wear. David
True! There is a reason why Europeans don’t allow them. Definitely a hazard and not recommended for those travelling around cities and densely populated areas. Thanks for commenting and subscribing
All valid point and agree there’s no point unless you really need it or I guess really just want one…I’ve got a 120 Prado with 2” lift, 32s and roof rack so already fuel efficiency is down(and it’s petrol😅)went all over Fraser Island no trouble but there weren’t many cars around so it got me thinking about a winch for the possible occasion of getting stuck with no one around, hoping for a Cape trip in the next couple of years to so I’m thinking of the ARB Sahara bar(single hoop) I’m upgrading my suspension anyway soon and getting a snorkel so at least that’s a cost I was doing anyway
Fair enough Lorenzo. Everyone has their different needs. I did a big sand driving adventure in my Prado 150 with nothing more than a can do attitude and 2 maxtrax. Everything went fine and I needed nothing else. Which is why my builds are low key and just the bare essentials 😊
was looking up videos on how they install bull bars to Prados as we were seriously thinking of getting one.. ( we also have a 2021 Prado) stumbled on to your video.. and now we changed our minds! 😂
I’m glad it did. Bullbars are considered “must have” by a lot of people but I don’t believe they are. It costs a lot for the bar and for the suspension correction. I’m glad it helped. Consider subscribing and telling your mates 👍 It would help me out a lot 😊
I haven't had a bull bar since the 90's. I do tough tracks and do a lot of remote travel. People with bull bars travel faster in low light conditions because they feel indestructable. Roos come out at dusk, during the night and early morning so I keep my speed down and drive really defensively during those times. I have a Bogout wheel winch that gets me out of bogs every now and then. If I wanted to winch up big rock steps then I'd get a bullbar but I don't want to do that anymore. Keep the car light and simple.
Yeah it all depends on how we use the truck. For me, I travel during day and normally behind someone who has a bar. In the meantime, I save a pile of money on fuel and it looks better in my opinion. Thanks for commenting and subscribing 👍
depends, if you are in the middle of bum nowhere with no phone reception and you hit an animal, you will realise the different between standing on the road with your radiator f..kd or manage at least to go back home
@@NorthOz you have a good point don't get me wrong, but it s better to have one if you live in the "outback" . If most of the driving is in the city, probably i wouldn't bother..
Waying up this decision for myself and im probably not going to get a bull bar because ill do serious off roading maybe once a year. Still they do look cool haha
inside the bonnet on the 2022 model Prado, there is a sticker ( in plain sight) regarding the fitting of bullbars. Toyota are very specific on the topic. hope this helps.
Living and playing in the Victorian High Country you need a bullbar if venturing solo. I had the factory alloy bull bar and now a Ironman with winch. The Ironman is better for the massive improvement in the spotlight performance alone. But I agree don’t fit any of the heavy accessories unless you need them, but you might only need them once to save you a lot of grief 🤷♂️ A workmate had everything he could bolt onto and fit in his, then had to upgrade the suspension due to weight, you just knew he was never going to get a scratch on that rig😂
Great video. I have been sitting on the fence about this for ages for my 2013 pre face lift prado 150 vx. the length iswhat gets me and the change in handeling. i still dont know what suspension to get as the KDSS is great but 9 year old shocks are starting to feel sloppy. im curious,. what suspension and bull bar would you get?
All good sensible arguments with only one flaw - if you travel out west or in the bush for any amount of time, your chance of hitting wildlife rises exponentially. In the past 8 years I have hit 3 kangaroos (2 during the day), 2 goats, 2 pigs, a couple of emus and a dog all of which would have caused damage (mostly significant) to my vehicle and potentially stranded me many kms from the nearest town (this is someone who hasn't had a vehicle to vehicle accident for 40 years). My $2k bar has saved me the cost of repairs and the problems of having to return to a more developed centre to fix the damage or get a tow. My insurer had no problems with the bar fitted (all I had to do was tell them) with no financial penalty (indeed they have benefited from my expense as I have had no claims). In the city, sure they are a waste and potentially fatal for other drivers but to those who live in the rest of Aust, they save us time, money and hassle.
Hi mate! Perfect example of the bar suiting your use case. I would say the same with other things like lift and tyres. Most don’t need it but there are people out there that actually do need the clearance to get where they need to go. The misconception is that hobbyists need this gear to enjoy themselves. Most do not. Thank you for your comment and I hope you will consider subscribing so we can have more of these discussions 😊
About to pick up a new Prado. Graphite flat back. I’m tempted get the Toyota nudge bar, in black. And mount a light bar to it. I doubt I’ll be getting a roof rack.
Very good points 👍 I'm pretty observant and the roos in my area are mostly wallabies. I'll wait until I hit one and THEN get a bullbar 😅 Thanks for the info.
Great video! I have been researching bullbars as well and pretty much at the same conclusion as you are. Theres also polymer bullbars, called smart bars, check them out as well they are significatly lighter and flexible. these things are ANCAP 5 star rated, they say. I dont know how much tprotection they provide for your vehicle. If anyone has any information about this i would really appreciate it. And yes ive seen it hit the calf but we dont know what the car looks like after that.
.what do you think about ARB smartbars? They seem to solve some of the issues with steel bull bars. Lighter, better for pedestrians and animals, deformable. I've written to them try to get crash test data at higher speed impacts (does cabin safety decrease like it can with steel bars) ?
I too would be interested in that. If they deform then is it even worth getting one if it damages the vehicle anyway? I’d like to know about the safety information for sure
@@NorthOz well I think, that for reasonable speeds, you might get some panel damage, but you won't be incapacitated (as you might be with no bar), There is a video on YT of someone hitting a calf at 100Km/h with a smart bar. The calf bounces off, runs away, and the car keeps going!
Yeah the suspension part is very true handles like a bucket of bolts with a bull bar running on a stock suspension setup it was that bad in Tasmania that I managed to get nauseous through the bends when I usually don’t,
I am surprised that one of your reasons is not crash testing. Despite ARB and TJM etc well and truly having the resources not one of them as evercraft tested of vehicle with a bullbar on
But I still think that the bullbar will not make you safer I think it will make you less safe, by interference with the extremely well-designed engineering tolerances. There has to be a reason that ARB etc will not perform those crash tests
I think you are right Matthew. Especially in high impact head on collisions. For Roos etc the barwork helps but for rolls and big collisions, I have yet to be convinced it’s a better option. Thank you for commenting and taking the time to subscribe. Let me know what you think of my snorkel video too 👍
I do like the off road animal steel, they care lighter than others, have better airflow. That Toyota one you posted looks good, you could get it powdercoated even though alloy?
Some vehicles run them behind the factory bar with a cradle like you speak of but unfortunately I would say it would disrupt crumple zones to an extent still. I’m no expert but that’s what stands out to me. Still a better option than a bullbar for pedestrian safety
Little bit of a rant, No great surprise that some modifications have a positive effect and or a negative effect to your vehicle, But your so adverse to getting a bullbar on your car In my opinion your choice of using a roof rack should be put under the same scrutiny and the negative effects they have like increasing fuel economy, reduction in handling, all just to carry an awning, light bar and some maxtraxs. You should actually have the conversation of why people in urban areas must have bullbars on their cars when they don’t have a need for them.
My point exactly. Scrutinise every decision you make. I can’t carry a swag without a roof rack and it weighs half of a bullbar with the weight between the axles. This was a decision I was happy with and some people are happy with a bullbar and it’s negatives. It’s all about the pros outweighing the cons 👍
BHP removed all bull bars from 10,000 vehicles because at 64kph car accident, the bull bar causes an intrusion into the footwell. In short, more damage caused on you!
There is one good reason to get a bull bar ...it will prevent radiator damage from an animal strike and will get you home! The other good reason is mounting of large round spotlights, which are much better than the long light bars.
Yeah good points. I have had spotties and a light bar and I prefer the light bar for a consistent beam. Depends on how much you spend on each of course. Cheap spotties do a good job. Thanks for commenting and subscribing
The only thing a bullbar protects in a high impact collision is the vehicle. It interferes with airbags and vital crumple zones and is a danger to every person involved.
Have a look at John Cadogan on UA-cam. He makes some excellent points as to why bullbars are a waste of money & actually make your vehicle LESS safe , not only for pedestrians but also the occupants of the vehicle. The only possible benefit is IF you hit a large animal the bullbar MIGHT save you from being stranded somewhere. Maybe it would be better to invest in a satellite phone instead & leave vehicle safety & design up to the experts.
All in all, the single reason you dont modify your 4wd is because you don`t have or not rich enough to willingly spend more money on a toy. Once you started modify it, its no longer just a tool for transportation, it becomes a toy, a hobby, a collection, a way to waste one`s money and time.
Sure have 👍 Have a look at my popular “Prado test video” where I take it to one of Australia’s toughest coastal tracks. Let me know if you can’t find it 😊
Ah! Interesting. What about a stone chip deflector on the bonnet? Or are you thinking of chips on the bumper. Thank you for commenting and subscribing 👍
It depends. Steel bars weigh a lot more than the aluminium but either way hanging 50+kgs needs a suspension upgrade as you’d be closer to bottoming out the shocks so the ride would suffer
Nothing is free. You are talking cost saving. Bull bar is not for everyone only for those with love off-road and overland. It’s an expensive hobby. I think bull bar is cool and additional protection over my life. You can’t compare money to happiness doing what you love and safety. Enjoy your Prado. I have arb bull bar on my Lexus GX460 with a winch for years now and love it. I use my bull bar as protection and rescue other cars got stuck.
It depends what you use it for. You may need it, I don’t. Recovery can be done with snatch straps and recovery points. Again, it just depends on what you need. The purpose of the video was to get the point across that not everyone needs it and there are ALOT of 4wd’ers not running bars for the reasons mentioned in the video. Bullbars also affect safety and crumple zones so when people say that “bullbars are safer”, they really aren’t. There is a lot of false information out there. The argument is “what happens if you get stranded from an animal strike”. Valid argument. For me, I use a sat phone anyway so although the trip would be over, I’ll still be alive as my crash systems can do the job. Also, don’t travel at dawn or dusk. Pretty simple.
Great video, that’s just what I need to know now. And in my opinion, another disadvantage of having a bull bar is that it will give you too much confidence, and too much confidence can put you in danger.
Are there options (like a front bumper) which you can replace with and I can have that carry knocks instead of the stock bumper? Cause I'd like to sell the car with the stock good as new bumper and probably get all the money back.
There are a number of bumper replacements such as off-road animal and AFN bars. You can always take them off when you are done and want to sell. But if you put a bar on, you need to upgrade the suspension. This means your car will sit too high when you take the bull bar off to sell. You’ll have to put the old suspension back in. Thanks for commenting and subscribing 👍
Hey Mark. All perfectly valid points you make in your video. I've also heard that fitment of many bullbar types require some cutting of the plastic inner guard which may also result in additional stuff (leaves, mud, dust etc.), getting into the engine bay area (and possibly around the air intake system short of the air filter) which otherwise wouldn't occur. For me, I plan to tour quite remote places with my family in the future (and towing a hybrid van) and hence, I wanted the added 'insurance' of having a winch to get me out of trouble if the need arose and of course, to do that you need to get a bullbar to mount the winch on. I went for the Off Road Animal Toro bullbar which I note you and one or two of your other followers quite like too. Sure, it was expensive but I believe its one of the lighter bullbars on the market noting also that 'some' mass is removed from the vehicle when installing a bullbar. Since I already had the pre-rego 3.5T GVM upgrade installed, my suspension was ready to go as far as bullbar/winch fitment goes. I agree with you that if you accidentally hit an animal on the road, chances are the bullbar and vehicle will still be worse for wear but I'm hoping the bullbar improves general survivability as opposed to experiencing a similar incident with no bullbar. The other thing is as I'm sure you're aware, you can get hoopless bullbars these days which are a lot less intrusive and imposing but still effective (winch & lights mount, added protection etc.).
Hi Rich. That will look nice. And perfectly good points to get a bar. I’m doing more research regarding the safety pros and cons regarding ancap and testing so I’ll update everyone on that. If you need a which there isn’t much you can do. You need to have one 🤷♂️
Depends on what you need it for. For protection against sign posts and other obstacles around town, it will work. Otherwise, not particularly useful. You could put lights and an antenna on it
Mate I’ve got a steel bullbar, I’ve hit 2 Roos. At relatively low speed but I’ve had no damage. Too the bar or lights or body or anything. If I had a stock front end I reckon my car would be fucked
Seems like it all comes down to the money in your mind and that’s fine if you have to save unfortunately you only get what you pay for in this world and if you look at the cost first your be governed by that. Try imagining what would be the best extras you would like then try to get the best price, at the end of the day it’s just something to get us from A to B unless you can find some extra pleasure in it 🤔😂😂
I don’t know who are insured with mate but with nrma it doesn’t matter what accessories you have if it gets Damaged they replace it, there isn’t any extra “costs “
Any time in remote locations you'll find a solid bullbar is priceless. Those people aren't on reddit and have seen outcomes A decent roo against a arb bar is usually a spotlight and scuffed paint. Not to mention wait time on bumper, headlights bonnet and paint?
Good points. It all depends on where you are and how you use it. I have spoken to viewers all over Australia who have built cars and hatchbacks with no bullbars. Both talking about the same roads and the hatchback still did it safely. Context plays an important part of the conversation (I.e what time of the day the driving is done etc.)
Mate another well thought out video well done. I think for a bull bar it simply comes down to the vehicle use… you want to do remote travel in Australia, you should take every precaution to protect the vehicle and keep it on the road.
@@NorthOz in my country, the prado is associated with the moderately wealthy and slightly older generation so seeing a young person own one is inspiring. Is facelifting a good idea or just let it remain as it is?
Depends on where you drive. If it's the east coast between the Sunshine Coast and all the way to Sydney, it's probably not worth fitting a bullbar. If you go north without a bullbar you will total your car within a year of continuous driving.
I can attest to hitting half a dozen roos in a 7 year period with my dmax. Had a tuff bullbar, didn't damage the ute at all. It's all context and the areas you drive.
You make some excellent points but I guess those that travel remotely will tell you if you hit a roo, no bullbar will leave you stranded. Passed a car last week with front end destroyed, dead roo in front of it. Occupants had left the vehicle and not in sight. At least a bullbar should protect the front end enough to continue or at least limp to a repair place. As for insurance, it’s there to be used I guess. Also agree on the Toyota alloy bullbar. May go that way myself👍
You are spot on. I have also had viewers comment on their trips around Australia in hatchbacks with no bars so it depends on a lot of factors and everyone’s situation is different. Thank you for your comment and for subscribing 👍
Alloy bull bar might be better option than steel due to weight issue
@@NorthOzjust like many don’t run insurance until it’s too late
Firstly, great video mate… logical and informative!
Personally, I think every add on or upgrade comes with its pros and cons.
Like a roof rack, creates more wind resistance and drag, possibly noise, maybe uses more fuel. But creates additional storage.
Large aggressive tyres, consumes more fuel and can be louder with decreased on road handling performance pending the type you select, but then off road provides better handling and less chance of punctures.
For me, my 150 currently has no bar… but about to get one. It was I’ll be the full bar replacement by Hamer 4x4, I’ve opted for that so I can go back to the stock if needed. Also the bar is more slime line and doesn’t protrude from the car as much to hopefully prevent too much change in handling.
Hopefully avoids costly smaller hits including more superficial scratches dings and bumps.
I guess nothing is perfect, but it will probably come to how you intend to use the vehicle.
Keeps the videos coming legend!
Spot on luke. Every mod has its cons. It just depends if it’s worth it. I like that you have chosen a bar that can return it back to stock. Thank you for your comment and for subscribing 👍
I understand that many people feel it is their prerogative to purchase whatever vehicle they want and use it in whichever circumstances they choose. However, a vehicle such as a Landcruiser Prado is a very capable off road vehicle with capabilities substantially beyond most in the sports utility vehicle class. It has a low range gear box and both centre and rear diff locks as standard along with a fuel capacity allowing a range of over 1000km. The Prado sits almost alone at its price point in terms of durability, serviceability and reliability. I would contend that, for a purchaser who is not going to genuinely use that capability, purchasing a Prado is just as much a vanity project as buying a Bugatti Veyron.
If you regularly do night driving in rural Australia you will eventually hit a wallaby or a kangaroo. In the great majority of such circumstances a bull bar can make the difference between a disabling accident and continuing on to your destination, provided that you are driving to the conditions and have the appropriate levels of knowledge skill and expertise.
If you are driving on a road with limited traffic and hit a roo without decent bar work it can be a long time before someone finds you. Sure, bull bars are not for everyone but metropolitan-based recreational off-roading is not likely to provide the personal experience that dictates a bull bar as a necessity of life.
Spot on mate. Very capable cars indeed. If people are taking risks at night and early morning, a bill bar would probably be the way to go. There are definitely ways around it but some people can’t avoid the risk so bar work should help minimise that. Thank you for your informative comment and for subscribing 👍
Finally a sensible 4WD owner. Thank you for making this video!
Thank you for the kind words! Thank you for commenting and subscribing. I have another similar video coming out today 👍
this is a bloody good video mate, very well presented. deserves a lot more views. 👌👌
Thanks Brian. What a nice thing to say 👍 Much appreciated. Thank you for commenting and subscribing.
7th year owning mine. Always thought of having one but decided not to. Mainly because I do mostly highway Ks. I can see why some people need to get it if they spend most time in the bush or near wildlife. I just try my best to drive sensibly (less at night) etc. Plus if I go into town, much easier to park! 😂
Same here Aaron. It’s hard enough to park as it is (I don’t know how the ram boys do it haha). Most of my kms are highway too so the extra weight would destroy my economy
It's not true that bullbars keeps vehicle occupants safer. If it were true the manufactures of bullbars would use the evidence of their safety testing as a selling point... but they don't. Obviously they are great at assuaging vehicle damage from hitting wildlife ect. Though they are demonstrably NOT safer in serious collisions. BHP engaged an independent safety tester (Crash Lab) and the results showed that bullbars are less safe for the occupants, and thereafter BHP ceased fitting bullbars to their fleet. See here: ua-cam.com/video/6oHDJc5LFNY/v-deo.html
I would only recommend to install a bullbar to protect the truck not the occupants. Very important for people to understand the difference. I’ll check out that video. Thank you for the comment
Bull bars are designed (Australian design regulations) to work with the crumple zones of modern vehicles.
Having a kangaroo through the front of your vehicle definitely ruins the handling
Might need a wheel alignment after that possibly
Australian problem don’t want to know 😂
I'd prefer a kangaroo through the front of my car over losing my crumple zone and having the impact of a head on go into my body (blood filled skin bag) rather than being absorbed by the crumple zone.
@@bravohotel This. I want my car to do the crumpling, not my body.
Probably can swerve better without a bullbar mate aye? 😂
Great points, but if you hit a roo at 110km/h at least you'll be able to get to a town to fix your smashed up front, no bar and you'll be stranded. Great video though, unless you do a lot of remote driving its probably not worth it.
Spot on mate. I guess the idea would be not to hit one haha. But accidents do happen and bull bars have their place 👍 Thanks for commenting and subscribing
Exactly. I drove across the nullabor a few times in a hatchback. 1400kms a day, drove at 50km/h when the roos are out and they just watch you go by without trying to commit suicide. Sometimes I would get behind a truck/4wd to outsource my bull bar duties haha
Smart man haha. And people are worried about driving it in a land cruiser. Give me a break 😆
Interesting comments by all. Thanks. Most Australians live in our capital cities, therefore so do most readers here - including myself. However I'd wonder if those living rurally are more likely to know someone who has died in a vehicle incident. Of those rural fatalities it would be interesting to know what percentage are from head-on, hittng a tree, or rolling a 4WD. In each instance I'd expect that not having a bull-bar would make fatality less likely.
For myself, based on "keep-it-light" thinking my 120 is stock. When going remote if I have to drive at night I stick to 80kmh. My only fitted accessories are bash plates and rated recovery points on the front. NB: I'm happy to share my mount design for the sand-flag too - a challenge with no bull-bar and no roof-rack! Rather than a fitted second-battery I have a Bluetti power station. I haven't done a lift either. Last year I did Simpson Dessert via the Madigan Line with no problem. Prior to that Oodnatta Track in it and twice Strzlecki Track. The challenge of climbing the dunes on Madigan's was badly impacted by the carved out wombat holes. Being the lighter vehicle I handled the inevitable bounce of those climbs with more ease than our other vehicle even though I had much lower clearance. One vehicle we passed was a current model Land Cruiser 300 kitted out with everything and it's driver parked for a five day wait for a mechanic to arrive to replace a broken rear shock which had recently been upgraded to Old Man Emu extra HD shocks. He was not pleased.
@NorthOz Have you done your remake or addendum yet? Plus one from me for comments of those srefuting your statement that a bull-bar adds to safety. I think there may though be a caveat in regards to factory-fitted bull-bars which have in fact had the engineered crumple zones, the protection shell, and airbag and seatbelt restraint actuator performance all incorporated into their design. I'm less clear if that extends beyond "factory-fitted" to also incorporate OEM...?
Three more reasons for your list: (1) resist the marketing of the accessorizing product pushers; (2) #keep-it-light philosophy provides not just a more fuel-efficient vehicle, but also a more capable, reliable, and longterm more durable vehicle for both off-roading and for rough-roading; (3) for serious off-road recovery a hand winch is for more capable and versatile than a fixed bull-bar-mounted electric winch - and only needs to be caried when doing trips that might need recovery. The rest of the time it can sit happily in storage at home.
#keep-it-light
If you are going off road you need it in case you hit a roo or you need a winch to pull you out, You can get a single loop bullbar or a nudge bar that doesn’t weight much or extend
You aren’t wrong. Depends where you live. In the tropics we don’t have many kangaroos so I don’t need one. The nudge bars aren’t particularly useful as they don’t protect high enough on the Prado’s. Depends on your situation. Thank you for commenting and subscribing. I look forward to your thoughts on today’s video 👍
I think fit for purpose. If you routinely use your vehicle on rough overgrown tracks and hard technical offroading and touring regions with very frequent wallaby strikes even early in the afternoons you need a bullbar. Pushing over small trees / ramming shrubbery out of the way is beyond the plastic bumpers. Same for rocksliders if you negotiate tough rocky tracks and frequently have to drag your vehicle over such terrain - our clearances are not that good. Same for 40kg underbody ARB protection plates. Mine are dented and damaged but vehicle is ok…. I have a Fortuner GX manual and really use it off road… your other points are great, I wish the SmartBar bullbar for my vehicle had a winch cradle but it doesn’t as it saves a lot of weight over the front. Its a great option and reduces pedestrian injuries in a vehicle strike. Def less dangerous. I think too many people fit off road hardware but don’t really need it. I think I use mine enough to need all components. I would remove ANYTHING not needed as I don’t have a GVM upgrade and weight is always an issue esp when carrying 5-6 jerry cans of diesel and water… at least the vehicle interior can be stripped out to save some weight for those longer remote trips…. Anyone claiming off road = beach / trails / moderate tracks prob won’t really need a bullbar for that but approach angles suck from factory and the new Mitsubishi Triton vertical headlights in the front bumper will prob make bullbars impossible to fit. Just my opinion - good video effort👍
Thanks mate. Absolutely. The purpose of this video is just to get people to think if they really need the equipment that companies and other influencers are pushing on us. Thanks for your comment and for subscribing
For me personally, bullbar is without question. I understand the insurance side of things, however for what I do, travelling a touch over 1000km every weekend, a lot of it through the night, I can’t afford to have my 200 in the crash repairers every weekend. Purely for efficiency reasons. I’ve hit probably 30 kangaroos total on it, and it’s never had any structural damage, only cosmetic damages have occurred. It’s served me super well. Also, this may not be the case for everyone but I’ve never had any engine damage from kangaroo strikes with the bull bar on. Most of them I’ve hit have been western red’s, at around 110-120kmph.
100% agree. It’s all about use case. For you it makes. If people can get by without one, that’s ideal. But in your case it absolutely makes sense and is a wise investment. Thank you for sharing your experience 👍
Hey Max, yours is the comment I’ve been searching for. Could you tell me what bar you’re using?
I’m just about to buy a Prado, and although I agree with the no bar theory, I have to do a lot of night driving through western grey kangaroo area’s.
Thanks
@@ciantheworld hey mate, yeah I’ve got a Toyota genuine bar for the 200s - steel one. It’s an older one though, 2015 the bar went on and they’ve updated to a lighter duty version now, no where as solid as previous. Held up really well, only complaint would be the plastic on it, that always gets fucked up. Get the bar mate, it’s a non negotiable for night driving remote. Anyone who says otherwise haven’t got an idea. Don’t want to end up stranded and plus - another thought, you never know how you’ll react when you get tired driving through night. Knowing you don’t need to swerve is really important I’ve found.
@@ciantheworld another thing, you’ll probably want to upgrade your suspension once you get the bar - for sure
Thanks Mate, I will be definitely going for the bar just for that piece of mind. I am glad to hear from someone with the experience of hitting a roo at 110km. I am glad to hear that the bar will hold up. Once again, thanks for your help.@@maxxx229
These are very valid reasons, but i think they are coming from a very on paper perspective. I would argue most 4wds don't need a bullbar and these are decent reasons as to not get one without careful thought.
Imo if the type of trips you do necessitates a bullbar, you've loaded up your car to with other accesories. You list off needing suspension as if you wouldn't need that anyway.
You very quickly glanced over the fact that a minor animal collision can be a trip ender by saying that youll have to pay the same insurance excess. Yes that is true but opportunity cost is what you haven't factored. If you and your family have put aside leave from work and all other commitments, booked campsites having a trip ending collision doesn't cost you just the excess, It costs you all thats time and effort you've put towards the trip. You're now waiting hours for a tow truck, trying to organise rental cars and temporary accommodations.
I've had 2 collisions with kangaroos driving in the early hours towards the snowfields in NSW (not particularly remote). Without the bullbar i'm certain these collisions would have ruined my trip. It was not unscathed, my bullbar is no longer in immaculate condition, have a few dings and rubber bumpers ripping off and a bit bent but thats the nature of a bullbar, they are made to get thrashed so im not wasting money on my excess and upping my premiums because of a few cosmetic blemishes on a sacrificial part. Alot of these damages are probably from all the bush bashing too.
Absolutely. It all depends on the use and it will be specific for everyone. Most people don’t need one but if the circumstance necessitates it like your situation, then it’s worthwhile. Too many people buying stuff they don’t need. They could save their money and travel more 😊 Thanks for commenting and subscribing
Thanks Mark for sharing your thoughts. I’m not a strong believer of a bull bar, I’m rather leaning to the side of what you’ve covered in this video - for the way I use my prado, I see a bull bar (+everything that comes with it) is purely a liability. Probably the positive is the look, but functionally it does not enable greater capability to my vehicle, with all the cons that come with it. Your view just concretes my thought and I think that’s great, more convinced I don’t need a bull bar!
I’m glad! Save your cash and spend it on travelling or things you will actually use 👍 Thanks for commenting and subscribing
Some good points raised, lots of money for a “just in case”, though sometimes it’s just unforeseen no matter how cautious you are.
What’s your contingency if you did do reasonable damage and were in a remote area?
Good point. Travel in convoy and get towed out 👍
Just bought a new Triton. Had alloy bar on last for ten years, no problem. Beware on the Nullabor saw a camry hit by three suicidal roos, no bar in the middle of nowhere. Bar may or may not have helped.
Yep, agree on cost too Mark, 3.5k bullbar, 1k on winch, 2k suspension
It’s so much money! Thanks for the comment Richard
Can still drive after hitting a kangaroo with steel bull bar, depending on its size. You don’t look like you drive much on remote roads like we do. You make valid points about the weight of bull bar which I’d never considered before.
Cheers mate. Yeah. Horses for courses. If you’ve seen my camping videos you’d know how remote I go. I travel when the Roos aren’t active. Have never had a near miss
0.25 yes, negative handling characteristics, you mention the weight hanging out the front quite a way, again at 1:25. If the centre of mass of the bullbar is, say, around 1.2m from the front axle, and the wheelbase of the Prado is 2.79m, this means every kilogram out in front puts 1.43kg on the front axle while lightening the rear axle by 0.43kg. Front axle load capacity is far less than the rear, and the loads on the front axle from the factory do not leave much capacity to start with. An ARB Summit Bar in steel weighs about 80kg. That would put an additional 114kg on the front axle. Add a winch, say a Warn Zeon 10 with steel cable (because that's what I have) at 47kg, the front load goes to 181kg (GVM is increased only 127kg because the rear axle is lighter by 54kg).
As I've done with my 4WD (not a Prado) I find myself at maximum front axle load of 1,450kg when empty and not towing, meaning the factory axle load is about 1,274kg (different overhang and longer wheel base than the Prado). Once I hitch up the trailer my front axle weight comes down while the rear axle goes up.. So be careful hanging all the weight out front. Check the front axle load on a weighbridge before considering installing a bullbar (and maybe a winch, too), find out the weight of those items and add about 1.43x of that to the existing front axle load to assess if it leaves you any capacity at all.
Good video.
Great point. A lot more scientific than mine of course but you hit the nail on the head 👍
Also where to put cans when drinking beer with mates on the beach lol. Jokes aside, valid points but, as mentioned below, bullbar is necessity when traveling in remote locations. And, insurance-wise, a scratch on the bullbar but without it could be a big job for panel beaters and $$$ paying excess and then higher premium.
Haha bullbar is a grey towel rack too. For sure with the insurance but it depends on the tracks. Boys like TJ and Mac don’t use bars on most of their rigs and they don’t have any issues but it depends. Doing gunshot without a bullbar would probably not be smart
I think your video and opinions are correct for the people that live in the city or urban areas. If a person lives in a bush or country area they really need to revaluate these points and see if they will benefit from running a bar on the vehicle. Indeed I agree with you and would not have one if I lived in these areas. I run a steel bull bar on my Prado and would not entertain any other material, as I have seen the lack of performance of alloy and plastic bars with respect to animal strike. I travel regularly for work in a very high animal strike rate area and the bull bar has saved me countless trips to the panel beaters, the insurance company not to mention the inconvenience and the excess costs of claiming. As with most things it is horses for courses. Good points raised in your video keep up the good work.
Thanks mate. Absolutely spot on 👍
Congratulations on your new car. I feel a good bull bar will protect you and the vehicle in a high speed impact with animals so you are not getting stranded. Also in low speed impact it will reduce the damage caused to the car bumper, lights, etc. Forgot about stone / bug chips to the front, you are safe from those also. Saying this with my experience of interstate driving.
Agree that it will increase fuel consumption so if someone is not driving long distances or night travelling much, I would not recommend a bull bar.
I am doing more research into how safe we are with bullbars as I have some information that bullbars disrupt the way crumple zones operate in high impact situations. I’ll be making a follow up video. Thanks for commenting and subscribing 👍
Bullbars are an insurance policy paid for up front. Just like recovery gear, spare tyres, spare parts etc etc.
The major reason people run bullbars is because when remote travelling, hitting a roo head on with a factory plastic bumper equals, destroyed radiator, oil cooler, transmission cooler etc. Which means you are now stranded and will need to activate an EPIRB or get in radio contact with emergency services.
But the vast majority of people just run them for aesthetics and the ability to mount spotlights, winches, comms etc etc.
Spot on. Depends on the use. I just don’t want people thinking they need to spend the money if they don’t have to. That way we can travel more with some extra cash in our pockets 👍 Thanks for commenting and subscribing
Thanks for your opinion. I hav no bullbar on my Prado and was considering replacing front bumper with some sort of bar after an incident where someone side swiped my vehicle taking out left door left front mudguard and plastic bumper. you just gave me some food for thought.
Glad I could help. If you have any questions let me know. Thanks for subscribing 👍
Good reasoning. Might add if you put a non genuine bullbar you may also affect engine cooling, especially by hanging accessories blocking air flow and heat soak on the front mount intercooler. You may also need a snorkel, as the factory bumper needs to be cut and dust may enter easier to the air intake which is located in the wheel well.
Great points Adrian. I will add them to my snorkel video too! Thanks for commenting and subscribing 👍
@@NorthOz I think the best mods for Prado and Hilux are A/T tyres and upgrade LED high beams. I think a heavily modified and heavy 4WD is not necessarily more capable in certain situations. You can easily save $500-1000 alone per year on fuel by having 2 sets of tyres/wheels. One for normal driving around town and one for touring/offroad.
I also don’t have a bull bar because I like the front end of my parade and also so it fits in my garage. Good to see some independent thought rather than being swayed by what the 4wd industry telling us what we should have.
Thank you for the kind words. I agree with you 👍 Thank you for commenting and subscribing
You can always go with lighter material options like aluminum with steel mounting options that are still strong enough to winch off of. The style in the states is going towards lighter options as well with skeletonized or tubular bumper options to save weight.
Yes. Great point. As long as it can winch that would solve the problem. The skeleton bars still weigh quite a bit though surprisingly
Anthony from Fourby4diesel says u also need to fit a snorkel if u get a bullbar bcos the airflow to the air intake inside the wheel arch is altered when a bullbar is fitted.
Also consider that BHP actually tested their mining vehicles with and without bullbars, rollcages etc. Conclusion, stock vehicles are the safest
Great point. Thanks for the info mate! We have to do everything we can to look after our vehicles
Lol anthony said no snorkel now in the latest videos 😂😂😂😂😂
Rio run plastic Smartbars on everything.
Yep my mate had a bull bar with no snorkel at Fraser Island and ended up literally with his air box full of sand…totally unexpected
Bull bars have a purpose - out in the middle of nowhere, where the chances of animal strikes, etc. are a real possibility. They have no place on cars in towns/cities.
Even so, I don’t have a bullbar and I don’t think I ever will. I travel remote (not desert) and I have always avoided animal strikes by travelling during the day and paying attention to my environment and adjusting speed accordingly. Even in my latest off-road video I had a kangaroo jump in front of my car but I avoided it by driving to the conditions. I agree with you in that some people may need a bullbar. But in general, almost everyone has or thinks they need a bullbar. When I’m reality only a very small number of people actually need them
Valid points but that can be said for majority of exterior mods. I do like how you said .. "why i have not put a bull bar on this vehicle YET". Hahhaha
Very true. Definitely a needs only situation 👍
Great analysis, well thought out and explained. However, your assumption that bullbars are better for safety is flawed, in my humble opinion. Bull bars might save damage to the vehicle and keep you going in an animal strike if your radiator survives, but I don’t think they improve safety. They are more likely to hinder it when it comes to the most precious cargo, you and your family.
Modern cars have advanced safety systems which are based on very precise, down to split seconds scenarios. How does the bullbar affect this engineering? Have we ever seen the multi million dollar companies such as ARB etc ever do ANCAP type crash results? They have the money, why not do them to show us how much they improve safety? Anything after market that deviates from the researched engineered vehicle needs to be tested, not accepted!
Hi George. Excellent points. I have speaking to people in the comment section like yourself who have enlightened me. I will be making a follow up video to this in the coming weeks with more research. If what you and my other viewers are telling is true, the aftermarket needs to change. Thank you for watching and I hope you will subscribe to see my next bullbar video
My Prado will arrive end of Spet. Your channel would be my reference book.
That’s probably the nicest comment I have gotten on here. Thank you. Congratulations on your purchase. I am enjoying my Prado and I’m sure you will too. Any questions just ask 👍 Thanks for commenting and subscribing.
All good points though people living in high risk animal strike zones would / could argue a case for a bar. I’ve only ever had a factory bar on my 60 series but the 80 & 120 were stock. Did put a nudge bar with a light bar on my N80 hilux as was driving at night and early mornings on B roads. Now have the 200 which is stock. Touch wood have not had a animal strike (I did move a turtle off the middle of the road once)😬
iv hit atleast 10 roos with my ranger, iv slowed down to 50-80 as i hit them. and i have not replaced. the bullbar. there is a small dent at the bottom of the bullbar, if you hit a roo at just 50 without a bar its $5k plus damage. my bullbar has paid for its self 5x over
It's not a really a difficult decision. I kept my prado stock for 10 years. Recently started doing remote trips in the Kimberley so got the bar. I think you just know when you need it. If you're going places where normal cars without bars are going you probably don't need it
Absolutely spot on 👍
I agree, and I think this case needs to be made, given the number of vehicles with these fitted - a large chunk of which seem to come up from Sydney and never go further off road than the BWS carpark. Safety of others (pedestrians, cyclists, children pets etc.) in town is the biggest reason I don't have one. I don't want that on my conscience. I'm not convinced the safety benefit to the driver is significant, either - having a massive block of steel block the crumple zone and send all the impact force in chassis I'm sitting on doesn't seem like a win to me. Weight and the wear and tear it puts on the suspension as well as the fuel burn just doesn't make sense to me. I live in regional NSW right next to a national park, so we have a ton of wildlife around, and I've never hit a roo because I take it steady, and keep my vehicle light so it can easily stop, and be sure to keep an eye on the edges of the track at dawn and dusk. There's a ton of road kill around. That should be a warning, not a competition.
There’s a lot of comments here about winching or inner city driving, I can tell you just driving through the hunter valley where there’s anything from very large kangaroos, deer, wild pigs or even cattle at night wondering or bolting onto the road, that’s where it counts.
Exactly. It depends on where you live and if you are doing big drives at night. I don’t drive at night and around cairns and the suburbs there are very few wallabies around
A steel bull bar will protect the vehicle. Driver and passengers however will get crushed in a head on frontal collision (with another car, tree, wall etc). The crumble zone doesn’t crumble anymore, you’ll have a steel bar push right into the cabin.
Also, pedestrians collisions are horrific for obvious reasons.
Vehicle handling and aesthetics are all valid reasons too but secondary to the above IMO.
The only bar I’d consider is an alloy one which would add about 30-40kg net. Not a huge impact on driving, fuel economy or suspension, while they are very strong but will crumble better than steel.
Agreed 👍 Also a reason why Europe don’t allow bill bars
Thanks Mark. Just bought a 2013 2nd hand Prado and was looking at bullbars when I found your video. I think I'll save my money and leave the Prado as it is.
I’m glad you didn’t because the expense and lack of stability is a big difference. If you don’t need it, don’t buy it 👍
For me it is the winch, and protection from scratch’s and scuffs while 4wd. The bar i a, looking at is the ironman raid bar. Because I like the style of no loops
Interesting! And that’s adds function for you which is great 👍 But for most people who wouldn’t use a winch in their life, bullbars wouldn’t be my recommendation. They definitely have a purpose such as yours 🤙
@@NorthOz yeah, though In saying that, I do not have a winch on my current 4wd, that being an 05 hilux. So when I do purchase my new prado, the Bull bar won’t be going on first thing.
Roof tray is what I am thinking. Though I was looking at the sports bar mounted system. What are you thoughts on those vs cross bars only?
Wouldn't a steel bar be more dangerous for the vehicle occupants in a collision because of a much quicker and sudden deceleration compared to the standard crumpling of the front end?
That’s a good point. A few people have commented about that and how Toyota has warnings about this. I will do some more research and make another video 👍 Thank you for commenting and subscribing
In the UK, they banned all bull bars due to the affect it may have on pedestrians during an accident
Interesting! I had no idea. Good to know. Thank you for the comment and for subscribing 👍
What are the percentages of roos/ cattle on the road VS pedestrians?
Adding a bullbar etc doesn’t change the handling much in my opinion.
When travelling in remote locations and being able to continue on with your trip after hitting a roo and not broken down with a car that needs towing.
That’s a good enough reason for me.
Fair enough graham. Personally problems require personal solutions 👍
Yes I agree. I have owned 5 4wd and never bought a bullbar. Heavy, ugly, expensive. Have never needed one after 100,000+ km of off-road and remote driving. I like nudge bars for mounting lights and car park dings.
Great point. Same here mate. Thanks for the comment and subscribing. I never saw the sense in my 4x4 having the bullbar. Never used it and it cost a fortune
My biggest reason not to have a bullbar is the look. I love the front grill and design and no point to buy a bullbar and make the car look like a commercial vehicle, every time I see one on the street I just tell myself yuck how could people put that ugly thing on. The second reason is the safety of others as you mention, imagine t-boning other cars with a bullbar, it is like murdering people.
A bit off topic if you dont mind, I really like the rhino backbone platform but from your experience, does it create much noise while travelling at high speed? I got some people say it does while some others say not
Great point mike. My thoughts exactly. We not only have to look out for ourselves, but others too. I made a video on my rhino rack platform experience. Let me know if you can’t find it. I made it about 1/2 months ago 👍 Thanks for commenting and subscribing
Thanks, man, in South Africa, I've noticed that most of the modern 'nudge bar - as we call it' doesn't cover much of the vehicle, it's like a small C-shaped only covering the very central part of the front grille, not even the corners of the bumper. I opted never to do it.
Same here. In my opinion they are useless. Only place they are good are in car parks if people don’t know where the front of their car is and they keep hitting poles and things. Thanks for commenting and subscribing 👍
What colour is your prado mate? pearl or glacier?
Has nobody thought about the nudge bar? it's the best of both worlds I believe. That's what I am going for, its cheaper, lighter, looks great in my opinion and it provides SOME protection.... what do you think?
Pearl. Nudge bars are a waste of money in my opinion. It will only help protecting against trolleys in the supermarket car park. It will snap under any real force due to being made from thin aluminium. It won’t do anything in an animal strike in my opinion
Nudge bars, convenient for putting your spotties on.
Yes spot on, they should be banned, just drive more carefully and slow down especially at night in the country.
Probably would do a lot for increased tyre wear.
David
True! There is a reason why Europeans don’t allow them. Definitely a hazard and not recommended for those travelling around cities and densely populated areas. Thanks for commenting and subscribing
All valid point and agree there’s no point unless you really need it or I guess really just want one…I’ve got a 120 Prado with 2” lift, 32s and roof rack so already fuel efficiency is down(and it’s petrol😅)went all over Fraser Island no trouble but there weren’t many cars around so it got me thinking about a winch for the possible occasion of getting stuck with no one around, hoping for a Cape trip in the next couple of years to so I’m thinking of the ARB Sahara bar(single hoop) I’m upgrading my suspension anyway soon and getting a snorkel so at least that’s a cost I was doing anyway
Fair enough Lorenzo. Everyone has their different needs. I did a big sand driving adventure in my Prado 150 with nothing more than a can do attitude and 2 maxtrax. Everything went fine and I needed nothing else. Which is why my builds are low key and just the bare essentials 😊
@@NorthOz maxtrax are a game changer
was looking up videos on how they install bull bars to Prados as we were seriously thinking of getting one.. ( we also have a 2021 Prado) stumbled on to your video.. and now we changed our minds! 😂
I’m glad it did. Bullbars are considered “must have” by a lot of people but I don’t believe they are. It costs a lot for the bar and for the suspension correction. I’m glad it helped. Consider subscribing and telling your mates 👍 It would help me out a lot 😊
@@NorthOz subscribed!
I haven't had a bull bar since the 90's. I do tough tracks and do a lot of remote travel. People with bull bars travel faster in low light conditions because they feel indestructable. Roos come out at dusk, during the night and early morning so I keep my speed down and drive really defensively during those times. I have a Bogout wheel winch that gets me out of bogs every now and then. If I wanted to winch up big rock steps then I'd get a bullbar but I don't want to do that anymore. Keep the car light and simple.
Yeah it all depends on how we use the truck. For me, I travel during day and normally behind someone who has a bar. In the meantime, I save a pile of money on fuel and it looks better in my opinion. Thanks for commenting and subscribing 👍
The only bar i like on the 150 is the offroad animal hoopless bar looks mint IMO
They do look good 👍
depends, if you are in the middle of bum nowhere with no phone reception and you hit an animal, you will realise the different between standing on the road with your radiator f..kd or manage at least to go back home
Yep! It depends on your situation and your needs. I keep an emergency beacon anyway so I wouldn’t be stranded but you make a good point
@@NorthOz you have a good point don't get me wrong, but it s better to have one if you live in the "outback" . If most of the driving is in the city, probably i wouldn't bother..
@@fabiocappuccini7178 Exactly! Everyone's different and I haven't needed one yet so I'll save the cash for sure
Waying up this decision for myself and im probably not going to get a bull bar because ill do serious off roading maybe once a year. Still they do look cool haha
inside the bonnet on the 2022 model Prado, there is a sticker ( in plain sight) regarding the fitting of bullbars. Toyota are very specific on the topic. hope this helps.
Hmmm interesting. I’ll look into that
Living and playing in the Victorian High Country you need a bullbar if venturing solo.
I had the factory alloy bull bar and now a Ironman with winch. The Ironman is better for the massive improvement in the spotlight performance alone. But I agree don’t fit any of the heavy accessories unless you need them, but you might only need them once to save you a lot of grief 🤷♂️
A workmate had everything he could bolt onto and fit in his, then had to upgrade the suspension due to weight, you just knew he was never going to get a scratch on that rig😂
Haha so true 😂 Wait till I upload what I’m doing in cape York at the moment. No bullbar. Completely stock hilux 🤙
Great video. I have been sitting on the fence about this for ages for my 2013 pre face lift prado 150 vx. the length iswhat gets me and the change in handeling. i still dont know what suspension to get as the KDSS is great but 9 year old shocks are starting to feel sloppy. im curious,. what suspension and bull bar would you get?
A lot of my subscribers swear by the dobinsons suspension. I would look into them for sure
All good sensible arguments with only one flaw - if you travel out west or in the bush for any amount of time, your chance of hitting wildlife rises exponentially. In the past 8 years I have hit 3 kangaroos (2 during the day), 2 goats, 2 pigs, a couple of emus and a dog all of which would have caused damage (mostly significant) to my vehicle and potentially stranded me many kms from the nearest town (this is someone who hasn't had a vehicle to vehicle accident for 40 years). My $2k bar has saved me the cost of repairs and the problems of having to return to a more developed centre to fix the damage or get a tow. My insurer had no problems with the bar fitted (all I had to do was tell them) with no financial penalty (indeed they have benefited from my expense as I have had no claims). In the city, sure they are a waste and potentially fatal for other drivers but to those who live in the rest of Aust, they save us time, money and hassle.
Hi mate! Perfect example of the bar suiting your use case. I would say the same with other things like lift and tyres. Most don’t need it but there are people out there that actually do need the clearance to get where they need to go. The misconception is that hobbyists need this gear to enjoy themselves. Most do not. Thank you for your comment and I hope you will consider subscribing so we can have more of these discussions 😊
About to pick up a new Prado. Graphite flat back.
I’m tempted get the Toyota nudge bar, in black. And mount a light bar to it. I doubt I’ll be getting a roof rack.
Congrats mate! Enjoy it 👍
Very good points 👍 I'm pretty observant and the roos in my area are mostly wallabies. I'll wait until I hit one and THEN get a bullbar 😅 Thanks for the info.
Thanks mate. Absolutely. It depends on your area and when you travel (night etc) but I haven’t had issues in my area 👍
Great video! I have been researching bullbars as well and pretty much at the same conclusion as you are. Theres also polymer bullbars, called smart bars, check them out as well they are significatly lighter and flexible. these things are ANCAP 5 star rated, they say. I dont know how much tprotection they provide for your vehicle. If anyone has any information about this i would really appreciate it. And yes ive seen it hit the calf but we dont know what the car looks like after that.
.what do you think about ARB smartbars? They seem to solve some of the issues with steel bull bars. Lighter, better for pedestrians and animals, deformable. I've written to them try to get crash test data at higher speed impacts (does cabin safety decrease like it can with steel bars) ?
I too would be interested in that. If they deform then is it even worth getting one if it damages the vehicle anyway? I’d like to know about the safety information for sure
@@NorthOz well I think, that for reasonable speeds, you might get some panel damage, but you won't be incapacitated (as you might be with no bar), There is a video on YT of someone hitting a calf at 100Km/h with a smart bar. The calf bounces off, runs away, and the car keeps going!
Yeah the suspension part is very true handles like a bucket of bolts with a bull bar running on a stock suspension setup it was that bad in Tasmania that I managed to get nauseous through the bends when I usually don’t,
I couldn’t imagine it with a bull bar. It’s already pretty lofty haha. Thanks for subscribing and commenting 👍
@@NorthOz all good mate the videos are great what suspension would be best for fixing the issue without making it ride like a horse and carriage.
I am surprised that one of your reasons is not crash testing.
Despite ARB and TJM etc well and truly having the resources not one of them as evercraft tested of vehicle with a bullbar on
But I still think that the bullbar will not make you safer I think it will make you less safe, by interference with the extremely well-designed engineering tolerances.
There has to be a reason that ARB etc will not perform those crash tests
I think you are right Matthew. Especially in high impact head on collisions. For Roos etc the barwork helps but for rolls and big collisions, I have yet to be convinced it’s a better option. Thank you for commenting and taking the time to subscribe. Let me know what you think of my snorkel video too 👍
I do like the off road animal steel, they care lighter than others, have better airflow. That Toyota one you posted looks good, you could get it powdercoated even though alloy?
Could powder coat that bar. I like the aluminium look. Very classy 👍
A mate went alloy bull bar and found it lighter and it's Australian made and ADR approved
Not a bad option. Lighter than a steel bar and would still crumple. That would be my choice too 👍
@@NorthOz he also found it was cheaper than steel he was never a fan of alloy but after talking to ECB that changed his mind
Any thoughts on winch cradles behind the factory bumper. Not requiring bill bars. I know nothing about this option other than airwave chat .
Some vehicles run them behind the factory bar with a cradle like you speak of but unfortunately I would say it would disrupt crumple zones to an extent still. I’m no expert but that’s what stands out to me. Still a better option than a bullbar for pedestrian safety
Little bit of a rant, No great surprise that some modifications have a positive effect and or a negative effect to your vehicle, But your so adverse to getting a bullbar on your car In my opinion your choice of using a roof rack should be put under the same scrutiny and the negative effects they have like increasing fuel economy, reduction in handling, all just to carry an awning, light bar and some maxtraxs. You should actually have the conversation of why people in urban areas must have bullbars on their cars when they don’t have a need for them.
My point exactly. Scrutinise every decision you make. I can’t carry a swag without a roof rack and it weighs half of a bullbar with the weight between the axles. This was a decision I was happy with and some people are happy with a bullbar and it’s negatives. It’s all about the pros outweighing the cons 👍
BHP removed all bull bars from 10,000 vehicles because at 64kph car accident, the bull bar causes an intrusion into the footwell. In short, more damage caused on you!
There is one good reason to get a bull bar ...it will prevent radiator damage from an animal strike and will get you home! The other good reason is mounting of large round spotlights, which are much better than the long light bars.
Yeah good points. I have had spotties and a light bar and I prefer the light bar for a consistent beam. Depends on how much you spend on each of course. Cheap spotties do a good job. Thanks for commenting and subscribing
The only thing a bullbar protects in a high impact collision is the vehicle. It interferes with airbags and vital crumple zones and is a danger to every person involved.
Correct. Consider subscribing. I would like to know your thoughts on my other videos 👍
@@NorthOz John Cadogan did a video on the truth about bullbars.
Yep
How about a smart bar? 37kgs. Not sure how good they are.
Me either. Good suggestion because of weight. But they are ugly haha
Agree bud negative influence from engineering ,aditional weight ,and price
👍
Not a bull bar where I from, they are much smaller coving just the grill and are only a couple of hundred dollars
Interesting 🧐
Didn't want a bar but ended up getting one for potential animal strikes on our big trip
Have a look at John Cadogan on UA-cam.
He makes some excellent points as to why bullbars are a waste of money & actually make your vehicle LESS safe , not only for pedestrians but also the occupants of the vehicle. The only possible benefit is IF you hit a large animal the bullbar MIGHT save you from being stranded somewhere. Maybe it would be better to invest in a satellite phone instead & leave vehicle safety & design up to the experts.
Completely agree Pete! A lot of people don’t think about the engineering and the impact that bullbars have on crash testing etc.
All in all, the single reason you dont modify your 4wd is because you don`t have or not rich enough to willingly spend more money on a toy. Once you started modify it, its no longer just a tool for transportation, it becomes a toy, a hobby, a collection, a way to waste one`s money and time.
Correct. If people enjoy it, then who am I to judge. The issue I have is people saying that we “need” these accessories to travel. Not the case at all
have you had to engage the rear diff yet in your travels at any point?
Sure have 👍 Have a look at my popular “Prado test video” where I take it to one of Australia’s toughest coastal tracks. Let me know if you can’t find it 😊
Like your video about bull bars, however my biggest want for having a bull is to minimise stone clips what is your throughs on that subject
Ah! Interesting. What about a stone chip deflector on the bonnet? Or are you thinking of chips on the bumper. Thank you for commenting and subscribing 👍
What’s a genuine Toyota bullbar weigh, maybe wouldn’t need suspension upgrade ?
It depends. Steel bars weigh a lot more than the aluminium but either way hanging 50+kgs needs a suspension upgrade as you’d be closer to bottoming out the shocks so the ride would suffer
Nothing is free. You are talking cost saving. Bull bar is not for everyone only for those with love off-road and overland. It’s an expensive hobby. I think bull bar is cool and additional protection over my life. You can’t compare money to happiness doing what you love and safety. Enjoy your Prado. I have arb bull bar on my Lexus GX460 with a winch for years now and love it. I use my bull bar as protection and rescue other cars got stuck.
It depends what you use it for. You may need it, I don’t. Recovery can be done with snatch straps and recovery points. Again, it just depends on what you need. The purpose of the video was to get the point across that not everyone needs it and there are ALOT of 4wd’ers not running bars for the reasons mentioned in the video. Bullbars also affect safety and crumple zones so when people say that “bullbars are safer”, they really aren’t. There is a lot of false information out there. The argument is “what happens if you get stranded from an animal strike”. Valid argument. For me, I use a sat phone anyway so although the trip would be over, I’ll still be alive as my crash systems can do the job. Also, don’t travel at dawn or dusk. Pretty simple.
Thanks for right information mark🙏
I’m glad it helped 👍
What are the best camping spots up the Tablelands?
Can’t go wrong with the national parks around tinaroo. Beautiful, good weather and you can kayak and boat all you want 👍
Great video, that’s just what I need to know now. And in my opinion, another disadvantage of having a bull bar is that it will give you too much confidence, and too much confidence can put you in danger.
Are there options (like a front bumper) which you can replace with and I can have that carry knocks instead of the stock bumper? Cause I'd like to sell the car with the stock good as new bumper and probably get all the money back.
There are a number of bumper replacements such as off-road animal and AFN bars. You can always take them off when you are done and want to sell. But if you put a bar on, you need to upgrade the suspension. This means your car will sit too high when you take the bull bar off to sell. You’ll have to put the old suspension back in. Thanks for commenting and subscribing 👍
Steel bullbar will destroy your front end, cracked chassis, broken shock mounts etc.
I ll stick to alloy.
Hey Mark. All perfectly valid points you make in your video. I've also heard that fitment of many bullbar types require some cutting of the plastic inner guard which may also result in additional stuff (leaves, mud, dust etc.), getting into the engine bay area (and possibly around the air intake system short of the air filter) which otherwise wouldn't occur.
For me, I plan to tour quite remote places with my family in the future (and towing a hybrid van) and hence, I wanted the added 'insurance' of having a winch to get me out of trouble if the need arose and of course, to do that you need to get a bullbar to mount the winch on. I went for the Off Road Animal Toro bullbar which I note you and one or two of your other followers quite like too. Sure, it was expensive but I believe its one of the lighter bullbars on the market noting also that 'some' mass is removed from the vehicle when installing a bullbar.
Since I already had the pre-rego 3.5T GVM upgrade installed, my suspension was ready to go as far as bullbar/winch fitment goes. I agree with you that if you accidentally hit an animal on the road, chances are the bullbar and vehicle will still be worse for wear but I'm hoping the bullbar improves general survivability as opposed to experiencing a similar incident with no bullbar. The other thing is as I'm sure you're aware, you can get hoopless bullbars these days which are a lot less intrusive and imposing but still effective (winch & lights mount, added protection etc.).
Hi Rich. That will look nice. And perfectly good points to get a bar. I’m doing more research regarding the safety pros and cons regarding ancap and testing so I’ll update everyone on that. If you need a which there isn’t much you can do. You need to have one 🤷♂️
What about just a nudge bar?
Depends on what you need it for. For protection against sign posts and other obstacles around town, it will work. Otherwise, not particularly useful. You could put lights and an antenna on it
Mate I’ve got a steel bullbar, I’ve hit 2 Roos. At relatively low speed but I’ve had no damage. Too the bar or lights or body or anything. If I had a stock front end I reckon my car would be fucked
Seems like it all comes down to the money in your mind and that’s fine if you have to save unfortunately you only get what you pay for in this world and if you look at the cost first your be governed by that.
Try imagining what would be the best extras you would like then try to get the best price, at the end of the day it’s just something to get us from A to B unless you can find some extra pleasure in it 🤔😂😂
Thank you for the advice. I will definitely take this on board :)
I don’t know who are insured with mate but with nrma it doesn’t matter what accessories you have if it gets Damaged they replace it, there isn’t any extra “costs “
Good to know. No, not all insurers do that so that’s a good thing for sure 👍
You need to watch John Cardogans reasoning for not to have a bull bar .
I’ll have a look for sure. Cheers 👍
Very well presented, keep it up!
Thanks mate 👍
Where do you find that OEM bull bar?
Oem bullbars can fitted at your local Toyota dealerships 🤙
@@NorthOz I live in the USa 🤭 looking for my Lexus GX 460 hahaha
Love my stock bumper
They look awesome!
Any time in remote locations you'll find a solid bullbar is priceless.
Those people aren't on reddit and have seen outcomes
A decent roo against a arb bar is usually a spotlight and scuffed paint.
Not to mention wait time on bumper, headlights bonnet and paint?
Good points. It all depends on where you are and how you use it. I have spoken to viewers all over Australia who have built cars and hatchbacks with no bullbars. Both talking about the same roads and the hatchback still did it safely. Context plays an important part of the conversation (I.e what time of the day the driving is done etc.)
Mate another well thought out video well done.
I think for a bull bar it simply comes down to the vehicle use… you want to do remote travel in Australia, you should take every precaution to protect the vehicle and keep it on the road.
Thanks mate. Exactly. Horses for courses 👍
My dream car. I wish I could afford it to even think of bull bars
They are very nice. Keep working hard. Anything is a possible. Happy to give advice if you want it 😊
@@NorthOz in my country, the prado is associated with the moderately wealthy and slightly older generation so seeing a young person own one is inspiring. Is facelifting a good idea or just let it remain as it is?