Love that you offer a solid catalogue of sound advice to those starting out or trying something new Peter. Measuring all marks from the same reference edge is something I always try to pass on.👍
Cheers Bud! Yeah, I've been caught out a couple of times thinking that everything was perfect, only to find there was a slight discrepancy! TG for the Domino mid-setting! 👍
Am I wrong in thinking that, when using the Domino’s edge pins you’re effectively referencing from different edges? Which is fine if you’ve cut your pieces identically, but would fail in the melamine-faced example here, where you deliberately cut short the one piece? (I imagine if I used a Domino a few times, I’d understand how to manage that, but it’s an expensive tool I haven’t (yet?) been able to justify…)
@@MichaelAlderete you're right but, the domino allows you to cut a wider slot for the tenon so kinda negates any discrepancy. Dowels are a different story. They have to be bang on.
@@BischBaschBosch That's what I was figuring, based on Peter's comment about cutting tight on one piece, and loose on the other. Alas, what I have today are dowel jigs. I suppose the discipline of getting it bang on will serve me well, even if I progress to other tools later. :-) It's just that I am so damn slow with everything...
It’s great to return to basics. Face side and face edge was taught to me in year 7 woodwork at high school. That was 60 years ago. Good to be reminded so clearly of the problem with measuring from both ends. Also that you need more than one slide square .... at least two pairs!
And the extra little bit of good practice you did: pencil held almost flat to the MDF surface so it doesn't press in and make a groove that will show up when painted. Ah - you did go onto to mention how best to use pencils, tape, and markers
It’s been over 50 years since I last made a cabinet, currently they are on my work program. Thanks for reminding me of the stuff, I had forgotten (I remembered marking the facing surfaces, but no more 😮)
Nicely explained Peter as usual. Marking from one side makes sense for sure. Making four pieces of wood square with matching pairs is definitely a skill. Once mastered any cabinet is a possible
I use a dowel max jig so I started out doing the check marks. Then added a 1-1 2-2 3-3 4-4 marking all the joining edges so all the same corners end up together as it comes together. Then after drilling the dowels in the wrong spot a couple times. I’ve added the step of adding a D on the face or edge where the dowel holes are to be drilled. Since starting that never had an issue. Also add a P when I’m adding pocket hole screws to the same cabinet which in a lot of cases really speeds up assembly as no need for clamps and the dowels keep everything perfectly aligned.
I spent days as a youngster marking-up joinery for my dad and followed a very similar method that he'd been taught by his grandfather. Even though we're using machines these days, being organised is key. Great vid.
@@10MinuteWorkshop Ha Ha, yes but ironically the one of the two times I've featured making a cabinet on my channel the marking-out was all over the place.
Perfect timing. I'm going to try and make a bridging unit between two very tall kitchen cabinets this weekend and this is perfect. I find my biggest struggle is marking out consistently (and cutting to the mark/line) to end up with what I want and the tip about always measuring from the same edge may well explain some of my near misses. Thank you!
Can I say that I think there is a step before doing any marking (face, face edge) which is to decide which are those edges. I use mostly hardwood and my choice of face is usually governed by appearance ( most attractive, least defects etc.). I cut oversize to begin with (as I find this is less likely to result in errors due to boards moving on a table saw for instance) and then cut to exact size using the same edges (always top or always bottom or always face etc.) as the dictum. On a table saw, this might mean the edge that always goes against the fence or the face that is always facing up. With man made boards, it is rarer that aesthetics determine which is face or otherwise and I’m not sure as to the factors you used to decide which is face and face edge. Perhaps, the implication is that it doesn’t matter so long as you do mark it and stick to it.
Hi Peter,great video as always.Just wanted to add my two pence worth as regards to marking up side pieces.For me it’s sufficient enough to mark L & R and don’t bother marking T or top,because if you have the board the wrong way up the letters would be the wrong way up,I hope this helps others,keep up the great work.
It’s the belt and braces approach, but I agree - like I said at the start, I marked the L and R with a couple of arrows and crack on. But if you’re not building cabinets every day then the extra step takes no time at all and gives an easy visual reference. 👍
Just fabulous. Love seeing your detailed marking techniques. Have missed these how-to videos from you. Please do more and do one on domino assembly of these cabinets.
It only takes once of cutting dowels or domino's on the wrong side to learn you don't want to do that again. Great job. And I thought my story sticks for laying out cabinets was good. I use my small carpenters square for transferring lines to the side of tops and bottoms. Just bought one of those hing layout jigs. may have to try that next time I do a box.
This is really useful, thanks Peter. Especially appreciate the two different teaching methods and much prefer the latter. I’ve made a couple of cabinets, but my methods were much more Les Dawson and incomparable to your Nijinsky.
Just put a t on the upper top outside gable corner no arrows needed. O for out on fixed top and bottom. Its obvious its the top right vs top left and t or b on front outside face. Trim for back panel after your joints are done. By keeping all panels same depth you avoid needing to use pencil lines. In my shop I groove for back on three sides and trim one side off and slide back into box When panels are perfectly sized and square which is really difficult to do without a digital panel saw. You can predetermine doors sizes right down to 1/10 mm with perfect gaps. I have done what is backassward and made doors then made the cabinets all off a spreadsheet, as an experiment. Frame and panel doors as well. In my spreadsheet I have even accounted for the removal of material in the sanding process about .4mm Square is tantamount but the mft is difficult to keep perfectly aligned. Evan my panel saw will go out without dbl checking spec points. I have my saw setup to cut to within .2 mm on five cut squaring process on a 3ft square. Always rotate in the cut sequence do not flip the board. Rotating makes a parallelogram and flipping makes a trapezoid. You present very well on camera can you just wing it or are you writing a script. I have an ooh and awe when thinking and explaining, except for when in a conversation. I enjoy your presentation, even though I have been doing this for fifty years. I sometimes think of going back to a small shop where it does not require so much effort to cover overhead. Present shop is 5000 square foot, a mile from downtown Vancouver Canada. We also see you have the coveted pin domino, so do I but it will not zero out on both side it is just off a tad. Also the centerline of the clear see through gauge to the baseline are slightly off. Had to use a washer and longer screw to overcome the counterbore to adjust window gauge.
Lovely. May I suggest naming the top and bottom TF and BF instead. Makes more sense since it't the face you're tracking on those and not the top and bottom. : )
Learning correct, reliable, efficient methods of measuring and marking out are the hardest things to learn, when self-learning via UA-cam. I never learned this stuff in shop classes, and it’s rarely explained in depth in most woodworking videos. Really appreciate you going into detail here. And I think having a solid module in your basics course would be really valuable.
great video sir - have you ever considered offering in-person workshops / seminars ? you explain the "why" and for many of us (at least myself) that's when the learning happens best. The point where the layout lines on the melamine didn't match up is perfect example. Don't know if us North American folks would make the trip - but you never know. Good business reason for a trip to the UK?
Thanks Peter. Wouldnt it be useful to have a small saddle sqaure like device that went over the end of the combination square ruler, the part you mark with the pencil. That way you could mark the face and edge at the same time.
I was never taught that way. I can see the benefit when you have say, multiple horizontal components - top, many shelves, base - but if it’s just a top & base and two sides the triangles are tiny. This method gives clear visual indication as to where the fixings are going, and which edges you reference off. 👍
Could someone please tell the name of the material (or producer name) inside the melamine boards - it is 2 colored - more "orange" in the middle and somewhat brighter along the edges (see @1:56 for example). Thanks a lot in advance!
I knew you were a fan of the staedtler pencils but was thinking for precise marking why dont you don't use a mechanical pencil. The next thing I see is you using a mechanical pencil 😂 for fine jobs they are my favourite, never any line thickness variation and a quick tap against something they are "sharp" again after you inevitably drop it.
You can of course do whatever works for you. But having the 'T' tape folded over the top edge is one of those 'easy visual references' I mention in the video that can really help the folks who get a bit 'snow blind' when faced with a stack of cabinet parts. 👍
Back to basics. Brilliant. Never get bored Peter.
Thanks! 👍
Love that you offer a solid catalogue of sound advice to those starting out or trying something new Peter. Measuring all marks from the same reference edge is something I always try to pass on.👍
Cheers Bud! Yeah, I've been caught out a couple of times thinking that everything was perfect, only to find there was a slight discrepancy! TG for the Domino mid-setting! 👍
Am I wrong in thinking that, when using the Domino’s edge pins you’re effectively referencing from different edges? Which is fine if you’ve cut your pieces identically, but would fail in the melamine-faced example here, where you deliberately cut short the one piece?
(I imagine if I used a Domino a few times, I’d understand how to manage that, but it’s an expensive tool I haven’t (yet?) been able to justify…)
@@MichaelAlderete you're right but, the domino allows you to cut a wider slot for the tenon so kinda negates any discrepancy. Dowels are a different story. They have to be bang on.
@@BischBaschBosch That's what I was figuring, based on Peter's comment about cutting tight on one piece, and loose on the other.
Alas, what I have today are dowel jigs. I suppose the discipline of getting it bang on will serve me well, even if I progress to other tools later. :-) It's just that I am so damn slow with everything...
It’s great to return to basics. Face side and face edge was taught to me in year 7 woodwork at high school. That was 60 years ago. Good to be reminded so clearly of the problem with measuring from both ends. Also that you need more than one slide square .... at least two pairs!
I had ‘face side and edge’ drummed into me at school too! 👍
The consistent edge reference is so helpful. Thanks
Thank you for sharing your experience with us. I now finally know why I need three rulers 🙂
And the extra little bit of good practice you did: pencil held almost flat to the MDF surface so it doesn't press in and make a groove that will show up when painted. Ah - you did go onto to mention how best to use pencils, tape, and markers
It’s been over 50 years since I last made a cabinet, currently they are on my work program. Thanks for reminding me of the stuff, I had forgotten (I remembered marking the facing surfaces, but no more 😮)
Thank you for this great advice - currently making alcove cabinets, after watching this, the second one will be more straightforward than my first.
Thanks! 👍
Nicely explained Peter as usual. Marking from one side makes sense for sure. Making four pieces of wood square with matching pairs is definitely a skill. Once mastered any cabinet is a possible
Absolutely! 👍
I use a dowel max jig so I started out doing the check marks. Then added a 1-1 2-2 3-3 4-4 marking all the joining edges so all the same corners end up together as it comes together. Then after drilling the dowels in the wrong spot a couple times. I’ve added the step of adding a D on the face or edge where the dowel holes are to be drilled. Since starting that never had an issue. Also add a P when I’m adding pocket hole screws to the same cabinet which in a lot of cases really speeds up assembly as no need for clamps and the dowels keep everything perfectly aligned.
Watching the joinery master at work is pure bliss.....great video as always.😃
Thanks! 👍
SOLID advice!
I spent days as a youngster marking-up joinery for my dad and followed a very similar method that he'd been taught by his grandfather. Even though we're using machines these days, being organised is key. Great vid.
Cheers Karl! Once learned, never forgotten! 👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop Ha Ha, yes but ironically the one of the two times I've featured making a cabinet on my channel the marking-out was all over the place.
@@StrawbyteWorkshop 😂 I'm sure it turned out fine in the end! 👍
Hi Peter, Good advice on marking up boards and measuring up, I'm always open to good advice. As always a great video, take care
Cheers Shaun! 👍👍
Perfect timing. I'm going to try and make a bridging unit between two very tall kitchen cabinets this weekend and this is perfect. I find my biggest struggle is marking out consistently (and cutting to the mark/line) to end up with what I want and the tip about always measuring from the same edge may well explain some of my near misses. Thank you!
Sounds great! 👍
Can I say that I think there is a step before doing any marking (face, face edge) which is to decide which are those edges. I use mostly hardwood and my choice of face is usually governed by appearance ( most attractive, least defects etc.). I cut oversize to begin with (as I find this is less likely to result in errors due to boards moving on a table saw for instance) and then cut to exact size using the same edges (always top or always bottom or always face etc.) as the dictum. On a table saw, this might mean the edge that always goes against the fence or the face that is always facing up.
With man made boards, it is rarer that aesthetics determine which is face or otherwise and I’m not sure as to the factors you used to decide which is face and face edge. Perhaps, the implication is that it doesn’t matter so long as you do mark it and stick to it.
Hi Peter,great video as always.Just wanted to add my two pence worth as regards to marking up side pieces.For me it’s sufficient enough to mark L & R and don’t bother marking T or top,because if you have the board the wrong way up the letters would be the wrong way up,I hope this helps others,keep up the great work.
It’s the belt and braces approach, but I agree - like I said at the start, I marked the L and R with a couple of arrows and crack on. But if you’re not building cabinets every day then the extra step takes no time at all and gives an easy visual reference. 👍
Nicely done, Peter, an excellent master class in cabinetry! Very clear and simple system for us to practice. Thanks!
Thank you! 👍🙌
This video brought me to a realisation of how lazy and complacent the Domino has made me.
Great to be reminded of the crucial basics!
Thanks! Love my Domino, but not everyone has one. 🤷♂️👍
Just fabulous. Love seeing your detailed marking techniques. Have missed these how-to videos from you. Please do more and do one on domino assembly of these cabinets.
Thanks! There's a Domino Basics video coming along, and yes, I'll be using this cabinet as the example. 👍
Really excellent system, Peter! 😃
Thanks a bunch for the tutorial and all the info!
Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
Thanks, you too! 👍
It only takes once of cutting dowels or domino's on the wrong side to learn you don't want to do that again. Great job. And I thought my story sticks for laying out cabinets was good. I use my small carpenters square for transferring lines to the side of tops and bottoms. Just bought one of those hing layout jigs. may have to try that next time I do a box.
Thanks 👍
Great advice Peter, thank you for doing this video. I really like the tape idea
Thanks Doug! 👍
This is really useful, thanks Peter. Especially appreciate the two different teaching methods and much prefer the latter. I’ve made a couple of cabinets, but my methods were much more Les Dawson and incomparable to your Nijinsky.
Thanks Mandy! 😂👍
Sigh….I have so much to learn…..thanks for such a useful video
Thanks! Glad it was helpful! 👍
Just put a t on the upper top outside gable corner no arrows needed. O for out on fixed top and bottom. Its obvious its the top right vs top left and t or b on front outside face.
Trim for back panel after your joints are done. By keeping all panels same depth you avoid needing to use pencil lines. In my shop I groove for back on three sides and trim one side off and slide back into box
When panels are perfectly sized and square which is really difficult to do without a digital panel saw. You can predetermine doors sizes right down to 1/10 mm with perfect gaps. I have done what is backassward and made doors then made the cabinets all off a spreadsheet, as an experiment. Frame and panel doors as well. In my spreadsheet I have even accounted for the removal of material in the sanding process about .4mm
Square is tantamount but the mft is difficult to keep perfectly aligned. Evan my panel saw will go out without dbl checking spec points. I have my saw setup to cut to within .2 mm on five cut squaring process on a 3ft square.
Always rotate in the cut sequence do not flip the board. Rotating makes a parallelogram and flipping makes a trapezoid.
You present very well on camera can you just wing it or are you writing a script. I have an ooh and awe when thinking and explaining, except for when in a conversation. I enjoy your presentation, even though I have been doing this for fifty years. I sometimes think of going back to a small shop where it does not require so much effort to cover overhead. Present shop is 5000 square foot, a mile from downtown Vancouver Canada.
We also see you have the coveted pin domino, so do I but it will not zero out on both side it is just off a tad. Also the centerline of the clear see through gauge to the baseline are slightly off. Had to use a washer and longer screw to overcome the counterbore to adjust window gauge.
Lovely.
May I suggest naming the top and bottom TF and BF instead. Makes more sense since it't the face you're tracking on those and not the top and bottom.
: )
Hello Peter , Thumbs up and i am a new Follower . Plans for the Hinges are Great .
Thanks 👍
Thanks and welcome! 👍
Learning correct, reliable, efficient methods of measuring and marking out are the hardest things to learn, when self-learning via UA-cam. I never learned this stuff in shop classes, and it’s rarely explained in depth in most woodworking videos. Really appreciate you going into detail here. And I think having a solid module in your basics course would be really valuable.
Thanks Michael! 👍
great video sir - have you ever considered offering in-person workshops / seminars ? you explain the "why" and for many of us (at least myself) that's when the learning happens best. The point where the layout lines on the melamine didn't match up is perfect example. Don't know if us North American folks would make the trip - but you never know. Good business reason for a trip to the UK?
Thank you! It’s something I’ve considered yes, but I’d need a workshop with better facilities in order to comply with regulations! 🤷♂️👍
Thank you for this masterpiece😆😆
Really helpful tips, thank you 🙂
Thanks! 👍
nothing is EXACT, always, always, always measure off the shared face/edge-----life gets better and project gets better
thanx peter rick
Thanks! 👍
Brilliant
Thank you! 👍
Thanks Peter. Wouldnt it be useful to have a small saddle sqaure like device that went over the end of the combination square ruler, the part you mark with the pencil. That way you could mark the face and edge at the same time.
That's a nice idea, but I think it would be a challenge to make it work at both ends. 👍
Hi Peter, can you do a video on how to cut difficult pieces with a track saw? Such as angles or narrow pieces (narrower then your track).
Thanks!
👍 Tricky Tracksaw Cuts [video 460]
ua-cam.com/video/ybSSZ5R31aI/v-deo.html
Do you have a specific reason to not use the time proven carpenters triangle?
I was never taught that way. I can see the benefit when you have say, multiple horizontal components - top, many shelves, base - but if it’s just a top & base and two sides the triangles are tiny. This method gives clear visual indication as to where the fixings are going, and which edges you reference off. 👍
Could someone please tell the name of the material (or producer name) inside the melamine boards - it is 2 colored - more "orange" in the middle and somewhat brighter along the edges (see @1:56 for example). Thanks a lot in advance!
It’s melamine faced MDF. 👍
I knew you were a fan of the staedtler pencils but was thinking for precise marking why dont you don't use a mechanical pencil. The next thing I see is you using a mechanical pencil 😂 for fine jobs they are my favourite, never any line thickness variation and a quick tap against something they are "sharp" again after you inevitably drop it.
👍👍
Why wouldn't you just mark a "T" with an arrow on the piece of tape marking the "L" or "R"? One less piece of tape on every board.
You can of course do whatever works for you. But having the 'T' tape folded over the top edge is one of those 'easy visual references' I mention in the video that can really help the folks who get a bit 'snow blind' when faced with a stack of cabinet parts. 👍
Who else is here from Scott Brown Carpentry?
Welcome! Really appreciate Scott giving me a shout on his recent video. 👍
@joehart3826 I watch Scott Brown Carpentry...I have been watching him for a long time. When he was in Auckland before he moves to Nelson